high-table-msg

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high-table-msg - 7/21/07

Serving and setting up the high table in the SCA and period.

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From: Philip E Cutone <flip+ at andrew.cmu.edu>

Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 13:13:47 -0400 (EDT)

Subject: SC - High Table presentation

Michael Macchione <ghesmiz at UDel.Edu> writes:

> the High Table, an extra dish or something special for presentation. Now

> here comes the problem, since I hadn't planned on a High Table, I hadn't

Well, not being middle eastern in persona and not having studied it to

any degree, i don't think that i am going to try my hand at that

aspect. I will however give some personal feelings about serving high

table at *any* feast.

Provide servers for them if each table is supposed to have a server

volunteered or if it is buffet style. If you really want to

brown... umm, err.. honor them, have the head cook (a-yup, that'd be

you) serve them. (like you don't already have enough stuff to do)

Serve them first. (but not too far in advance)

Fixing the plates up extra nice for them (presentation) is nice.

(nice for *all*, but not always convenient.) Rather than a bowl of foo

thrown together, use a platter and garnish it nicely.

****************here is an important one****************

Do NOT serve them different dishes, unless that dish is, say something

that everyone may partake of, like a subtlety (sp?). I've been to a

few feasts where the cook splurged on lobster for the head table to

the detriment of the rest of the feast which was...to be

kind... somewhat edible. (burnt gruel, nasty fish, etc)

The impression overall was, pun not intended, in poor taste.

in service,

filip of the marche

From: "Sue Wensel" <swensel at brandegee.lm.com>

Date: 11 Jun 1997 13:39:19 -0500

Subject: Re: SC - Help with presentation

When we (BMDL) had the Ceilidh, we hadn't originally planned on having a High

Table as this was not going to be a RP. Their Highnesses decided otherwise.

Our host, Baron Charles and I (the head cook) brought the entrees to the High

Table as each was heralded in (the feast was buffet -- too many little tables

for 4-6). Little extras I did were:

- - made an oatcake in the shape of an escarbuncle ringed with apple slices --

High Table thought it was too ornamental to eat.

- - made sugared raisins to be given to the table.

- - marked the high table pies with saffron escarbuncles.

Everything that was presented was arranged especially carefully, but that

didn't really take too much time to do. Those little touches really help pull

off a nice feast.

Derdriu

From: Dottie Elliott <macdj at onr.com>

Date: Wed, 11 Jun 97 12:52:45 -0500

Subject: Re: SC - Help with presentation

Michael Macchione 6/11/97 11:29 AM

>So I was wondering, does anyone have any ideas about what might be a

>simple (i'm artistically challenged), inexpensive and mid-eastern way to

>spruce up a feast.

>Kael

I occasionally cook something different for high table, depending on what

I am cooking for the feast. For a baronial champions event, I cooked an

extra soup to make it a little more special. For a Queen's champion

event, I made savory toasted cheese for high table. For Candlemas, I had

someone who is a very good bread cook, make shaped bread to spruce up the

table. I didn't do any special dishes because I was doing special dishes

for everyone! It is not necessary to cook extra dishes for high table.

If you have a bread machine available, shaped bread isn't too hard. You

can use the machine to do all the kneading, then pull out the dough,

shape as desired (like a fish, braided into a circle, whatever), let rise

again and bake. Since Hais (see caridoc's miscellany) is sticky, it

would probably hold shape to make something with it. Or simple take the

extra time to setup and decorate the trays you are serving high table on.

Put some greenery under the roast meat and then serve, etc. Use silver

trays (if someone has some they got for their wedding). Have someone who

is good at being flowery present the food to high table. There are lots

of ways to make it special. If all else fails, just serve them good food

and don't worry about it!

Clarissa

From: kat <kat at kagan.com>

Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 11:02:34 -0700

Subject: RE: SC - High Table presentation

Greetings all. Since this is my first post to the List, spare me a moment

of your time:

I am Lady Caitlin O'Byrne, resident of the Canton of Montaigne du

Roi, Barony of Darkwood, Mists, West. Mundanely, Kat Griffith, editor. I

have been actively cooking in the SCA for 4 years and have mundane catering

experience as well. Am still working up the nerve to enter a cooking

competition.

Enough about me.

Michael Macchione <ghesmiz at UDel.Edu> writes:

> the High Table, an extra dish or something special for presentation. Now

> here comes the problem, since I hadn't planned on a High Table, I hadn't

and filip of the marche replied:

Well, not being middle eastern in persona and not having studied it to

any degree, i don't think that i am going to try my hand at that

aspect. I will however give some personal feelings about serving high

table at *any* feast.

Provide servers for them if each table is supposed to have a server

volunteered or if it is buffet style. If you really want to

brown... umm, err.. honor them, have the head cook (a-yup, that'd be

you) serve them. (like you don't already have enough stuff to do)

Serve them first. (but not too far in advance)

Fixing the plates up extra nice for them (presentation) is nice.

(nice for *all*, but not always convenient.) Rather than a bowl of foo

thrown together, use a platter and garnish it nicely.

****************here is an important one****************

Do NOT serve them different dishes, unless that dish is, say something

that everyone may partake of, like a subtlety (sp?). I've been to a

few feasts where the cook splurged on lobster for the head table to

the detriment of the rest of the feast which was...to be

kind... somewhat edible. (burnt gruel, nasty fish, etc)

The impression overall was, pun not intended, in poor taste.

I must agree with lord filip: unless it's a standard procedure in your

Kingdom, don't fix separate "special" dishes for the high table. Why

double your workload?

In our barony, where we are noted for our feasts (and Mistress Anastasia,

correct me if I'm wrong) it is custom to simply have nicer and/or more

period serving gear for the high table; and to garnish a little more

effusively. Purple kale is a great garnish (purple being the color of

royalty; some groups use it as a head table standard). Also, provide the

head table with two servers instead of one, and make sure those servers are

experienced.

Fret ye not! You'll do just fine.

- kat

From: nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt)

Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 14:10:50 -0500 (CDT)

Subject: RE: SC - High Table presentation

Something that is nice to do is to have some one with a bowl of

warm scented water and a fresh linen towel going around having the head

table people rinse their hands. It's nice to do before and after a meal or

between a messy finger food thing... I've done that before and it went over

well. You could get two people - one to hold the bowl and one to handle the

towel. Lemon, rose, mint, or lavender scents might work well.

Something I experienced one time in Meridies was after the meal, a

server came and cleared off our dirty plates and cleaned them for us.

Since we were not from that Kingdom, they asked a server to do it for as a

guest. I felt it was a very thoughtful gift.

Clare St. John

Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 20:01:12 -0600

From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>

Subject: Re: SC - Okay, my life just got interesting...

At 3:01 PM -0900 1/17/00, Kerri Canepa wrote:

>If any of you were to become Royalty and could influence the culinary sphere,

>what would you like to see happen?

Have suitable period nibbles available to give to people who are

visiting the royalty. Hospitality was an important period virtue, and

it is an opportunity to expose people to period cooking.

A different suggestion, not culinary but to do with royalty at feasts:

In my experience, places at high table are usually allocated to the

highest ranking people around. This is a mistake. From the standpoint

of the senior duke in the room, being at high table isn't a

particular honor, and he would probably prefer to eat with his

friends. From the standpoint of a relatively new person, it is a

stunning honor.

The policy I recommend is to keep a couple of places at high table

open. At some point during the event, someone you don't know will do

something that impresses you--fight beautifully even though he is

relatively new, go to a lot of trouble to help other people, tell a

moving period story, turn out to be a blacksmith who makes beautiful

period cooking equipment, ... . Invite him and his lady (or her and

her lord) to join you at high table.

David/Cariadoc

http://www.best.com/~ddfr/

Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2000 00:26:53 -0500

From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <harper at idt.net>

Subject: Re: SC - hand-washing and serving high table

De Nola (1529) has detailed instructions on how to do the ceremonial hand

washing -- and he also describes how to alter the procedures for royalty and other persons of very high rank.

On the Mode and Manner in Which One Must Offer Water for Washing the Hands

The servitor must give the hand-washing to his lord in this manner. Put a pitcher full of water upon a font or a large silver platter, and some very well folded towels upon the said pitcher which extend to the edges or brim of the font. And the steward goes before with a towel on his shoulder. Arriving in front of the lord's table, and making his reverence, the steward takes the towel which is upon the font, and spreads it upon the table in front of the lord, and sets the font from above upon the towels, and with the font from below, where the water comes, he gives hand-washing to his lord. And when he has washed, he then lifts the fonts, putting one upon the other, and the steward spreads upon the lord's hands the towel which hangs from his shoulder, and removes the others which were spread upon the table for the fonts.

And similarly the cupbearer can give the hand-washing, holding up a font or a wide-brimmed plate in his right hand, and the towel over the edge of the font or plate and upon the right shoulder, and the pitcher of water in the left hand. And the steward and the cupbearer, arriving at the table and making their reverences, do as is said above; this is understood to be for persons who are not of very high rank*.

Service to royalty, who are of very high rank*, must be made in this manner. The cupbearer must kneel, who carries the fonts one upon another, and in them the water which will suffice to wash the lord's hands. And uncover the fonts, first kissing the towel, and stretching it out upon the table before the lord. And cast a little water on the edge of the upper font. And the tasting* is done, first by the cupbearer and the steward afterwards. And put the font before the lord, and with the font below, where the water comes, cast water in the midst of the font which is upon the table. And after the lord has washed, the cupbearer lifts the fonts, as has been said; setting one font upon the other; he makes his reverence. After the steward has spread the towel upon the lord's hands, the cupbearer and the steward must always find out if the fonts contain water, and not to neglect that, because sometimes they are empty, and arrive at the table, and the steward and the cupbearer and the lord are mocked. And each time the steward gives the towel to his lord he should kiss it before he spreads it over the hands, and should also kiss the other which is spread upon the table at the time when it is placed, and he kneeling.

*Note: the word "salva" is used here. It denotes the act of tasting food or drink for poison, and is also used as a way of describing rank. Royalty and other persons with "salva" have their hand-washing performed in a particularly reverential manner.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain

Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)

From: "Elise Fleming" <alysk at ix.netcom.com>

To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 17:39:11 -0500

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Serving and High Table

Greetings. I wonder if we could start a discussion about the

"couth" way to serve High Table, especially with Royalty seated

there. What have folk done? Several areas to comment on would be

the following.

1) Who is served first, especially if all the Royals are present?

2) As a server, do you serve them or put the dish in front of them

for them to pass?

3) How many of each dishes is ideal? (One? Two, one for each side

of the table?)

4) Should the meats, chicken, etc., be presented whole or cut up?

If whole, who do you think should cut them up?

5) What about having one or two "servitors" standing behind High

Table to assist those Head Table folk in retrieving dishes that are

out of reach? (Would solve the dilemma of having to say "Your

Majesty, would you please have the Baron pass the pickled

mushrooms?")

6) For serving the populace, how many of your groups provide serving

utensils for each dish? (Or do we expect folk to dip in with the

spoon/fork they've already had in their mouth?!?)

7) Anything else?

Years ago I "specialized" in serving Head Table and partnered with a

young man who had flair for shtick. We either brought one bowl out

(the server led, the bowl holder followed) and served in order of

precedence, or we brought two bowls and each of us took one side of

the table, starting with the two highest guests and working down the

side we were assigned. We offered announced the food item and

offered to serve. (Your Majesty, pickled mushrooms with garlic and

anchovies. May I serve you some?)

At some events, the young man (whose knees worked better than mine),

knelt with raised bowl while I served. Sometimes we offered the

guests to serve themselves. We usually asked the end folk if they

wanted us to leave the dish there. We often found that the

decorations and place settings left little room for bowls to be

left.

As a soon-to-be regular at High Table, I'm wondering what others

have done to help with problems that came up when I used to be a

server.

Alys Katharine

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Serving and High Table

Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 19:23:27 -0500

>Greetings. I wonder if we could start a discussion about the

>"couth" way to serve High Table, especially with Royalty seated

>there. What have folk done? Several areas to comment on would be

>the following.

>1) Who is served first, especially if all the Royals are present?

The dish should be presented to the host, who then indicates where it is to

be served. Hosting Royalty may courteously direct the service to their

equals or may partake then direct the service to others at the table. A

baron hosting royalty should look at the dish to see that it is worthy, then

direct the service to the Royals.

>2) As a server, do you serve them or put the dish in front of them

>for them to pass?

>3) How many of each dishes is ideal? (One? Two, one for each side

>of the table?)

High Table is a very good place to serve en messe for two. This allows a

couple to select the dainties they want then direct the service to people

they wish to honor. The waiter should deliver the dish to the table, but

not try to serve. Having a waiter by the table to remove dishes as

requested is a good touch.

>4) Should the meats, chicken, etc., be presented whole or cut up?

>If whole, who do you think should cut them up?

Either way is fine. If whole small birds are delivered to the table, they

would normally be broken apart by the dining parties, then transferred to

their trenchers. Larger animals delivered whole should be carved before the

table for presentation. I would suggest being careful about carving at the

table. Presentation of whole animals is often disconcerting to some people.

>5) What about having one or two "servitors" standing behind High

>Table to assist those Head Table folk in retrieving dishes that are

>out of reach? (Would solve the dilemma of having to say "Your

>Majesty, would you please have the Baron pass the pickled

>mushrooms?")

A proper duty for a gentle waiter.

>6) For serving the populace, how many of your groups provide serving

>utensils for each dish? (Or do we expect folk to dip in with the

>spoon/fork they've already had in their mouth?!?)

I prefer to provide serving utensils if at all possible. Part of my duty is

to display the wealth and power of my patron.

>7) Anything else?

>Alys Katharine

Have an almoner and some waiters with voiders to clear at least the High

Table. It's a nice touch.

Bear

Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 17:37:24 -0700 (PDT)

From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Serving and High Table

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

--- Elise Fleming <alysk at ix.netcom.com> wrote:

> Greetings. I wonder if we could start a discussion about the

> "couth" way to serve High Table, especially with Royalty seated

> there. What have folk done? Several areas to comment on would be

> the following.

> 1) Who is served first, especially if all the Royals

> are present?

When you say "all the Royals", do you mean of that

Kingdom or of the Known World? Usually the current

King gets served first and then his Queen. Unless the

Queen is regnant. Then she is served first and then

her consort. If more than one pair of royals are

attending, then the K & Q of that kingdom get served

first, followed by their guest royals in order of

which kingdom is highest in prescedence. Then the

Royal Heirs [if there are any at that moment] then

followed by any Princes/Princesses. After that any

guests at the head table.

> 2) As a server, do you serve them or put the dish in

> front of them for them to pass?

Usually, the server offers the item to them and they

take what they wish. Passing dishs is really too

informal for such an august occasion. The only time

that the server offers portions is if it is an item

that needs carving or a soup. We here in Caid have

several Knights who have studied carving and love to

show off their skills to their monarchs.

> 3) How many of each dishes is ideal? (One? Two,

> one for each side of the table?)

Usually I make a special presentation of each dish for

the head table. This is the first dish out of kitchen

and is paraded around the hall. First for the head

table to see and then for everyone else to appreciate.

This will be served to the head table. Everyone else

will get a dressed down version of the same food.

> 4) Should the meats, chicken, etc., be presented whole or cut up?

> If whole, who do you think should cut them up?

That depends on if you have someone skilled in carving

or not. If you have someone skilled, then they should

be allowed to add to the presentation by showing off

their skills. But if you don't, then it might be

better to have the meat already cut for the head

table. The rest of the populace can fend for

themselves.

> 5) What about having one or two "servitors" standing behind High

> Table to assist those Head Table folk in retrieving dishes that are

> out of reach? (Would solve the dilemma of having to say "Your

> Majesty, would you please have the Baron pass the pickled

> mushrooms?")

The dishes for the head table should always be

available for the monarchs and their guests until the

end of the course. Usually the monarch is served from

the front and the leftovers should be put on a side

table so that the monarchs and their guests can have

more at will. More like "Lackey! Bring me more

pickled mushrooms. I think the Baron would like some

more chicken." No monarch should have to pass food.

That is for their minions to do.

> 6) For serving the populace, how many of your groups provide serving

> utensils for each dish? (Or do we expect folk to dip in with the

> spoon/fork they've already had in their mouth?!?)

I always provide serving utensils for all dishes, with

the exception of items that need carving. Most people

have sharp knives for carving, that usually don't

touch their mouths. It would be too expensive to

provide carving knives for each table. And the knives

you can buy from the 99Cents store aren't sharp enough

brand new to be worth anything. Their cheap spoons

are another matter.

Huette

Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 19:32:16 -0500

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

From: Ted Eisenstein <Alban at mail.socket.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Serving and High Table

>1) Who is served first, especially if all the Royals are present?

Their Majesties, of the realm in which the feast is being served, of

course, followed by TRM in order of the creation of the appropriate

kingdom. Then, lessee, Their Highnesses of the principality in

which the feast is being served, and Their Highnesses of other

principalities; followed by TRH (the heirs of the home Crown),

the other RH; visiting ambassadors; probably visiting principality

heirs; dukes by order of creation of their duchy; counts, ditto; and

so on down the home kingdom's OP, I guess.

>2) As a server, do you serve them or put the dish in front of them

>for them to pass?

The job of the Royalty present is to eat, and to enjoy, not to work.

Hence, they are served, they do not pass food along.

>3) How many of each dishes is ideal? (One? Two, one for each side

>of the table?)

Each dish should have as much food in it as it can hold, elegantly, and

without spillage; hence, your mileage will vary depending on dish size,

and type of food.

>4) Should the meats, chicken, etc., be presented whole or cut up?

Presented whole, and cut up at the table. For why else would there be

a Royal Carver?

>If whole, who do you think should cut them up?

See above.

>5) What about having one or two "servitors" standing behind High

>Table to assist those Head Table folk in retrieving dishes that are

>out of reach? (Would solve the dilemma of having to say "Your

>Majesty, would you please have the Baron pass the pickled

>mushrooms?")

There should be a sufficiency of servers that those at Head Table need

not ask for seconds; the food should magically appear in front of them

the second they are hungry for more. At least for those Royals that are

greedy enough for more, for all should know that greed is a sin, and

unworthy of a good Christian ruler. . .

>6) For serving the populace, how many of your groups provide serving

>utensils for each dish? (Or do we expect folk to dip in with the

>spoon/fork they've already had in their mouth?!?)

The populace, being the normal, grubby, working people, know not how

to eat properly; for they are the people, after all, not the nobility, and

therefore lack the education and proper upbringing normal to those

of the Royal Classes.

One can hope, however; and to start in on education, there should be

a sufficiency of serving implements so that no one person, nor table, may

be able to take more than their fair share, especially at the first go-round

of a particularly delicious dish. Especially in these times of the spreading of

mysterious plagues and foul diseases, having a set of common utensils

that have been pre-cleaned is most helpful and sanitary, so that the Plague,

and the Wasting Disease, and the Pox do not spread and decimate the

kingdom.

(Aren't there period serving manuals floating around somewhere? We could

mine them for good, period, and really spiff stuff. . .)

Alban

From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <rcmann4 at earthlink.net>

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 21:22:56 -0400

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Serving and High Table

On 23 Oct 2001, at 19:32, Ted Eisenstein wrote:

> (Aren't there period serving manuals floating around somewhere? We

> could mine them for good, period, and really spiff stuff. . .)

> Alban

There are several online. Links to them (and other neat medieval

cooking and household documents) are at:

http://www.uwm.edu/~carlin/

Brighid ni Chiarain *** mka Robin Carroll-Mann

Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom

Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 18:01:58 +0000

From: ekoogler1 at comcast.net

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

>>>

When your feasting halls have a head table, what are the seating arrangements of the head table? That is, who sits next to whom and when does this change under various circumstances? What size and shape are the tables?

My knowledge of table seating and the intricacies involved therein are based on surviving the hell of charm and poise school (modern high society protocol) and working on royal reigns in the Middle Kingdom. I'm quite aware that other kingdoms simply don't do things the same way. I'm curious to know how seating is treated in other kingdoms, but I'm especially interested in hearing *why* its done a particular way, or at least an opinion on why. Anyone willing to share?

Iasmin

<<<

In Atlantia, the highest ranking Royalty determines who sits with them

at high table. This would usually be either the Crowns or the Baronial

Coronets. These nobles sit in the middle, flanked on either side by

whomever they choose.

So far as table shape is concerned, it's usually one long rectangular

table with the occupants sitting on one side. However, I have seen

round or square tables used with occupants seated around 3/4 of the

edge/circumference.

Kiri

Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 13:50:57 -0700

From: "K C Francis" <katiracook at hotmail.com>

Subject: RE: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Here in the West, the hosting Royalty (K&Q or P&P) or the hosting landed

B&B take center stage on the long table with all facing the hall. All

other Royalty can expect to be seated in order of precedence sitting

left/right/left/right of the center. Same way they are seated in court as a

matter of fact. Simply a matter of 'precedence'. And you should see the

mad scramble to swap back and forth to reorder the table if an unexpected

Royal shows up. Oh, and this includes Heirs. Here in the West we have 2

local Principalities. So, there may be anywhere from 1 to 5 sets of Royalty

and we also often get visitors from out of Kingdom. We have had some very

large high tables!

FYI, here in the West, a landed B&B may hold court in their Barony and host

their feasts but are otherwise not considered included as 'royalty' in

other settings. I know that in Kingdoms where there are no Principalities,

they are considered minor Royalty and I believe they can give armigious

awards, which ours cannot (please correct me if I am wrong).

A single Royal may ask someone to accompany them (gives them someone to talk

to) as space is usually arranged for 2 people. When the table is sparsely

populated or there is room, others may be invited to sit with them. I have

sat with my Queen and with my Princess while a member of the court, when

they attended a feast solo. As Princess I have invited a member of my guard

to join me when the Prince attended another event. A courtesy to the Royal

and an honor to the guest.

In the Province of Golden Rivers (having no B&B), puts their Champion and

consort, the Lord and Lady of Golden Rivers in their copper 'coronets' at

the center of their feast head tables.

And, others may be normally included, such as the Bard of the Mists has the

right by law and custom to sit at the right of the Prince in court and at

feast table. Do not know when/why this came into law, but has been this

way since I joined in AS 19. No other bard in the West has this right.

FYI, the Bard of the West is relatively new.

At a Baronial feast in Vinhold, a Lord/Lady of Misrule is selected by the

Baron and seated at the high table. Sometimes one of the Royalty has an

S.O. that is also seated at the table, usually at one end but near enough to

chat.

So you see there are conventions and there are exceptions. In planning for

a feast and the head table, one usually checks to see which Royalty is

coming, 1 or 2, w/ or w/o guests, etc. and plans for at least that many

total. Bad form to scramble for an extra table at the last minute. But it

does happen of course. As for space, if They plan to use a throne instead

of a regular chair, the extra space needed must be considered.

I am sure there are things done differently in other Kingdoms and I am

curious to hear about them myself.

Katira

Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 23:14:56 +0200

From: Volker Bach <carlton_bach at yahoo.de>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Am Mittwoch, 13. Juli 2005 19:20 schrieb iasmin at comcast.net:

> Although I'm interested in the inter-kingdom anthopology of a much wider

> issue than this, I'm a bit afraid of the mountainous responses I could get

> asking this question too broadly....

> When your feasting halls have a head table, what are the seating

> arrangements of the head table? That is, who sits next to whom and when

> does this change under various circumstances? What size and shape are

> the tables?

I'm no protocol maven, but from what I gathered at our events in Drachenwald,

a high table is considered practically mandatory if royalty are present. They

are oblong and the guests are seated along the long side facing the gathered

diners - I've never seen it done any other way. Most high tables seat between

6 and 8. The royals are seated in the centre, with the highest ranking other

members filling the places to their right and left, proximity being governed

by rank. There have been some acrimonious debates within earshot whether a

representative of the hosting group (seneschal or marshal) should be seated

there, but I gather the answer is 'not unless s/he has the rank'.

Drachenwald has lots of local variety, though. This may just be the way

they do things where I happened to be at the time.

Giano

Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 22:50:10 -0500

From: "margaret" <m.p.decker at att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

> When your feasting halls have a head table, what are the seating

> arrangements of the head table? That is, who sits next to whom and when

> does this change under various circumstances? What size and shape are

> the tables?

snip

> Iasmin

Here in Namron in Ansteorra we seat the King & Queen in the center of a long

table that seats eight and faces the rest of the feasters. The prince and

princess go on either side if present. Then come the Baron & Baroness. The

other two or four seats are filled at the whim of their majesties, their

highnesses, or the baroness.

On those occasions when the crown is not present the prince & princess are

given the seats of honor. If neither is present the B&B go in the middle.

When on occasion only one of a couple is here we simply ask who the wish to

have for a dinner partner.

By the way, we comp K & Q, and P&P but the B&B pay their way.

We occasionally have regional events with a feast. When that happens we set

up three tables end to end and seat each B&B on either side of the crown by

date of the group becoming a barony.

Margarite

Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 22:21:08 -0800

From: Sharron Albert <morgana at gci.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

>> When your feasting halls have a head table, what are the seating

>> arrangements of the head table? That is, who sits next to whom and

>> when does this change under various circumstances? What size and

>> shape are the tables?

> snip

>> Iasmin

> Here in Namron in Ansteorra we seat the King & Queen in the center

> of a long table that seats eight and faces the rest of the feasters.

> The prince and princess go on either side if present. Then come the

> Baron & Baroness. The other two or four seats are filled at the whim

> of their majesties, their highnesses, or the baroness.

> On those occasions when the crown is not present the prince &

> princess are given the seats of honor. If neither is present the

> B&B go in the middle. When on occasion only one of a couple is here

> we simply ask who the wish to have for a dinner partner.

> By the way, we comp K & Q, and P&P but the B&B pay their way.

> We occasionally have regional events with a feast. When that happens

> we set up three tables end to end and seat each B&B on either side

> of the crown by date of the group becoming a barony.

> Margarite

Does that mean that even if the event is a baronial event and the K&Q

attend, they get the center of high table?

What you've shown above is what we'd expect at kingdom events

(although West doesn't do kingdom feasts, they're usually at

principality coronets or smaller groups). At principality coronet

feasts, it is usually the P&P in the middle, the K&Q directly to

their right (if in attendance, we do live in Alaska), and the rest

whoever the P&P want there.

At baronial events, the B&B sit center, K&Q to right, P&P to left. We

did that at baronial investiture in April, and then set the other two

territorial B&Bs at the ends of the long legs of the U on either side

of the high table. We also had a visiting Lord of the Mists (heir to

Prince of Mists), which made it interesting. We had the new B&B in

the middle, and as the stepping down B&B weren't a 'couple' they were

split: she (that is, me) sat with the Lord of the Mists to the right

of the K&Q (well, actually just the King came), and he sat at the

other end with his lady. It worked nicely. Of course, if the P&P or

K&Q were to protest the custom, we don't argue and re-arrange the

high table. Been there, done that.

We comp no one as a rule, except a few starving student scullery

workers (G). But neither will we dun the K&Q, or P&P for event fees.

They usually pay, however, in the West. At least that's been my

observation at constab and as autocrat.

Morgana, who loves IKA discussions, and will unlurk for them

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Morgana yr Oerfa, OP

Winter's Gate/Oertha/West

Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 07:02:12 -0500

From: "margaret" <m.p.decker at att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

> Does that mean that even if the event is a baronial event and the K&Q

> attend, they get the center of high table?

Since we Ansteorrans say the Baron & Baroness represent the King and

Queen, the King & Queen always have the seat of honor.

Margarite

Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 16:14:39 -0700

From: "K C Francis" <katiracook at hotmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table sating?

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

In the West, the high table is reserved for Royalty with the few exceptions

I have already noted. We do not normally fill out the table with the

"highest ranking other members" present at the event. Any unfilled seats

can be filled by invitation of the Royalty and can be anyone they choose

regardless of rank. This doesn't happen often, as we have so many Royals at

an given time, it is usually the problem of fitting in a large enough table

to hold them all.

Katira

Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 16:07:25 +0000

From: ekoogler1 at comcast.net

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] IKA - head table seating?

To: Barbara Benson <voxeight at gmail.com>, Cooks within the SCA

<sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

> This discussion dovetails nicely with an issue that I have been

> pondering regarding my upcoming feast.

> In reading Roy Strong's "Feast" to try and get an idea of format for

> the feast (12th Century Sicilian) I came across the discussion of the

> position of honor and how it changed over time. He pretty much says

> that during the time I am looking at the position of honor would be

> the far left and not the center.

> So my question is, how do you think people would react to setting up

> the head table with the King and Queen at the far left and descending

> order of precedence going towards the right. It kinda makes sense.

> With the King on th far left people could come up and speak to either

> Him or his Queen without standing in the middle of the feast hall with

> their tushines facing all of the feasters. I have had the need to go

> speak to their Majesties and found myself very uncomfortable and

> therefore crouching in front of the table so as not to block access.

> Glad Tidings,

> --Serena da Riva

I would first talk to TRM's about doing this...and make sure that the

Autocrat and local nobility are cool with it as well. I would also put

a brief note in your event program that you're following a style done

during the period in which your feast is set. Other than that, I think

it's a grand idea!

Kiri