toys-msg - 7/20/99
Period and SCA toys.
NOTE: See also the files: dolls-msg, child-gam-msg, child-gam-msg, teething-toys-msg, children-msg, babies-msg, Toys-in-th-MA-art, dollhouses-msg, chd-actvites-msg, 2-Hobbyhorses-art.
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NOTICE -
This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.
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Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).
Thank you,
Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: Maryanne.Bartlett at f56.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Maryanne Bartlett)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: kids/dolls/toys
Date: Tue, 03 Jun 1994 03:30:00 PDT
Organization: The Overworked Dragon BBS (503)256-8451 PDX
I'm hunting for pictures/photos/locations/books on period kids' toys.
I've run across a *lot* of tertiary sources, some of which seem to be
really unreliable, but very little of primary or secondary source
material. Can anybody out there help? Even hints of books or museums that
have this kind of stuff would be helpful! Just so you know, I have seen:
the Brueghel pictures of all kinds of kids and toys
all kinds of games, both board and dice
the late period portraits of Arbella Stuart,
Edward VI as a baby,
James VI's children,
and been told of several interesting ones that I haven't yet found photos
of, such as the one where a child is holding what appears to be a
mechanical bird.
I am indeed looking for pre-period things as well, and have
considered the Pompeii finds (although I've no line on good books, anybody?)
I am particularly interested in a rumoured Egyptian marble game, (polished
stones and small pillars,(for "marble arch"?) found wrapped in a small
girl's mummy. Anybody know where this one is?
If anybody can track down the references in Ovid to games, I would be
extremely grateful, as I've had no luck. Supposedly there are marble-type
games described, played with nuts and a variation on "Buck she" that
begins "bucca, bucca, quo sunt hic!"
(Hey, are dominos period?)
All you Norse out there, anybody have any of this info on toy
boats? Again, I've heard rumours, but...
Has anybody seen references to children playing with blocks? I could
swear I have, but haven't been able to track 'em down.
Of course, dolls! Anything? Arbella Stewart is holding a doll, but
what was it made of? Richard II's (?) wife was a child, so several were
ordered? (I keep seeing references to this one in books, but they never
give any documentation!) There is a terra cotta jointed doll described as
being Greek but when/where/how can I find out about it? How about wax
doll/religious figures like the Infant of Prague (not a toy, obviously, but
was the technique used on playthings?)
In other words, this search is far-ranging. Anything that you could
give me in the way of sources, references and locations would be much
appreciated. Yes, I'm planning to write it up, and yes, I will give credit
to all who help!
Thanks in advance!
In Service to the Dream,
Anja Snihova'
From: Maryanne Bartlett (6/8/94)
To: markh at sphinx
RE>kids/dolls/toys
Uu> I'll look and see what I may have found previously. I would appreciate
Uu> seeing any replys that you get with referances. Thanks for the works
Uu> that you did cite.
I'll post you a bit more when I've time, but there are several
pictures in "The History of Children's Costume", Ewing (don't remember the
first name!)
In a rush,
--Anja Snihova'--
--
uucp: uunet!m2xenix!puddle!180!1414!14!Maryanne.Bartlett
Internet: Maryanne.Bartlett at f14.n1414.z180.fidonet.org
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: kids/dolls/toys
From: jab2 at stl.stc.co.uk (Jennifer Ann Bray)
Date: 10 Jun 94 11:26:53
Organization: STC Technology Ltd., London Road, Harlow, UK.
> All you Norse out there, anybody have any of this info on toy
>boats? Again, I've heard rumours, but...
I've tried to reply via regular email and I don't seem to be getting
through, though Maryanne can write to me. the ways of email are
various and strange. Anyway I shall see if I can get a message as far
as the Rialto forgive the waste of bandwidth, hopefully someone else
might be interested in this info anyway.
Maryanne asked me for the British Museum's address, it's
The British Museum, Great Russel Street, London, WC1B 3DG
Their 'phone number is 071 636 1555 (from the USA you'll have to
delete the first 0 and put your international access code followed by
44 to get the U.K.)
Anyway here's a couple of references for the books with toy boats in,
I've got more info on other viking toys and games, if you're
reading this Maryanne perhaps you'd like to send me your snail mail
address and I'll try posting you the rest since our email connection
only seems to work one way at the moment.
**************************************************************
Title: Viking Age Decorated Wood
Author: James T. Lang
Publishers: Royal Irish Academy
Copyright: Royal Irish Academy 1988
ISBN 0 901714 68 2 hardback
0 901714 69 0 paperback
Page 33 fig 51 Toy wooden sword
"form reflects known viking-age sword types"
Page 34 fig 54 Toy wooden horse
rather crudely made, and it's lost it's front legs. Someone's carved
crude doodles into its sides.
Page 80 fig 94 Toy ship
"mid eleventh century" this has an elegant shape recognisably similar
to excavated viking ship hulls.
This is a great book if you're interested in Viking age carved wood,
there's lots of other stuff in it besides the toys: spinning and
weaving tools, bits of furniture and crosses, writing tablets, boxes,
stoppers etc. etc.
***********************************************
Title: Viking Artefacts
Author: James Graham-Campbell
Publishers: British Museum Publications Ltd
Copyright: 1980 The trustees of the British Museum
ISBN: 0 7141 1354 9
"92 Wooden Gaming Board
Balinderry, Co. Westmeath Ireland"...
"Rectangular gaming board carved from yew, with two projecting heads (one
human and one animal); the raised border is ornamented with eight panels
of interlace- and-fret-patterns. The playing surface is marked out with
a grid of forty nine peg holes (7x7). the central hole is surrounded by
a pair of concentric circles; the hole in each corner by an arc."
Probably a hnefltafl board. It has a carved gead sticking out from
the board at each end. the general opinion seems to be that this is
a travel board (possibly for use on ship?) and that these heads were
handles for the players to hold. The central panel of ornament on each
side is sunken suggesting that the board had a lid at some time which
was held in place by these sunken parts.
"93 Dice"...
"Three oblong dice of walrus tusk (?). All have the same arrangement of
ring-and-dot 'spots': 'one' on both ends (no 'two'); 'three' opposite
'four' and 'five' opposite 'six' on the sides. L 3.2;W 2.8x 2.5 cm."
These are some of the wierd dice I told you about.
94-101 are various playing pieces in Bone, Bronze, Ivory, Jet, Amber and
glass.
"104 Wooden model boat
Hedeby, Schleswig Holstein"...
Model boat carved from a single piece of wood, but now in fragments and
much damaged except for one end, consisting of a high squared stem
projecting beneath the curved lines of the hull. surviving L 30cm.
The squared stem of this toy boat, although not found on a Viking Period
Ship to date, is cxlosely paralleled by the prow of the ship incised on
the Loddekopinge whetstone [281]. there is another boat from hedeby (also
fragmentary) with a more conventional prow (Jamkuhn 1936 fig. 15). Viking
Period and medieval Toy boats are known also from Dublin [105], the faroes
and Greenland. miniature vanes, such as 285 may have been metal fittings
for mode; boats, as may also have been the dragon head produced in the
mould from Birka 'Black Earth' [443]."
(Numbers mostly refer to other exhibits in the catalogue.)
"105 Wooden Model boat
Dublin, Ireland"
"Model Boat carved from a single piece of wood, but damaged with one end
missing. the curved stem projects above the broad and shallow hull, which
has a pronounced keel. the stub of the mast survives, stepped centrally;
there is a hole through the gunwale on either side for stays, and another
pair of holes at the surviving end of the boat for further stays.
Surviving L 11.0; W 4.1 cm."
"106 model Duck
Birka, Uppland Sweden"
"Profile of a duck carved from elk antler. there is a vertical perforation
through its back. L(Body) 13.2; T 2.1 cm.
>From the 'black Earth'. Presumably a toy or mascot(attached to a stick?)
as, for instance, the toy horses of wood from Kvivik in the Faroes.
date E/MVP."
"107 model cat
Birka, Uppland Sweden"
"Profile of a cat carved from amber. L 3.0; T 1.0cm.
from the 'Black Earth'. Presumably a toy (as 106), although, being of
amber, it might possibly have been a talisman."
"Date E/MVP"
If you have a viking persona and you haven't seen this book try and
find it somewhere, It doesn't have a lot on costume, but all the other
bits and pieces are there from jewellery to ironing boards!
Each piece in teh catalogue is photographed and described with
references to further publications describing the piece.
*************************************
Jennifer/Rannveik
Vanaheim Vikings
email: J.A.Bray at bnr.co.uk
Warning: this email address will be disabled after June 14th when I
am moving jobs. Do not reply to this address after that date.
From: Raven <JSINGLE at MUSIC.LIB.MATC.EDU>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: RE: Toys?
Date: 26 JUL 94 08:01:57 EST
Organization: Milwaukee Area Technical College
b.woods6 at genie.geis.COM writes:
> I would be very grateful if anyone would suggest sources I can
>use in making period toys (wood or metal--does not matter).
I have no books to recommend, just a few general ideas for toys:
___
Tops (the kind that spin). ----> | |
| | <-- cylinder (for string)
Hoop-and-stick. ___| |___
\ / <-- cone
Dolls / poppets. \ /
\ /
Gameboards (9-man morris thru chess). \_/
And -- I don't know if this is period, but it'd be educational & fun --
wooden construction blocks suitable for building castles, cathedrals,...
depending on how ambitious you are, this could range from smooth
geometric shapes that vaguely suggest arches etc., to full building
components (barbican, keep) freely rearrangeable by the child.
"Raven" (JSingle at Music.Lib.MATC.Edu) Milwaukee, Wisconsin USA
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: rzex60 at email.sps.mot.com (Jason Magnus)
Subject: Re: Toys?
Organization: The Polyhedron Group
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 1994 18:36:14 GMT
In article <199407260431.AA200677083 at relay2.geis.com>,
b.woods6 at genie.geis.COM wrote:
> I would be very grateful if anyone would suggest sources I can
> use in making period toys (wood or metal--does not matter).
>
> There were children in period, and there were doting parents in
> period, so there *must* have been toys. Please, I would like to make
> some things to play with. ;-)
>
> Hmm...could the fact that I have a year-old niece who will be
> growing up all too fast have anything to do with this request?
> Surely not... ;-)
There's a variety of period board games for older kids - stuff like
nine-man-morris goes well.
For younger kids, one really neat idea I saw a while back was a wooden
knight and horse, with a stick attached to the horse. Kids could hold
'jousts' with them. Another was a horse and rider mounted over a board, and
when you tapped the board, the horse 'galloped'.
For really little kids, wooden rattles filled with dried beans are nice.
===========================
PLANS FOR A TOY FOLLOW
===========================
The favorite toy that I make for younger kids is the 'climbing bear'. It
can actually be done as a Knight, a Lady, a Lord, or any other four-limbed
anthropomorphic shape that can be represented in sort of a 'gingerbread
man' flat form. I rather like the bear, for some strange reason <grin> (see
the name of my shop, below). I'm fairly certain this is a period toy idea.
The climbing bear is a flat wooden doll that climbs a pair of cords. At the
top of the cords there is a stick with a hanging loop in it's middle. The
cord from this loop is several inches long. The loop is attached to a tree
branch, rafter, or other high point, anywhere from a few feet up to 20 feet
or more. The long cords hang from each end of the stick, go through holes
in the doll's hands, and end in a large wooden bead to keep the doll from
slipping off of the cords. They should be long enough to reach the floor.
The holes in the dolls hands angle inward, toward their head. This is
important! Without that angle, the doll won't climb. I usually make the
angle such that for an inch-diameter hand/paw, the top of the hole is 1/4
inch closer to the centerline than the bottom of the hole. The climbing
cord should slide freely through the hole. For cord, I use a cotton mason's
twine. It's easy on kids hands, and seems to work well.
An option is to hang a 'prize' or goal at the top, below the center of the
toggle stick. For a bear, the goal is usually a bee hive or honey pot. For
a lord or lady, it could be a crown, a gem, or a hat. Make it whatever you
like, so long as it's something the doll might want to climb to get to!
To make the doll, design a pattern that places the figure standing, like a
gingerbread man cookie, with legs slightly spread and arms to the sides or
raised upwards at a 30 degree to 45 degree angle. Size is relative. I
wouldn't make it too large, 'cause the toy slides down the cords when it's
done climbing. You wouldn't want to bonk the child on the head with
something heavy! I make mine about 6 inches tall head to toes, and 4 inches
wide at the outstreached arm tips. Trace the pattern onto a 3/4 inch thick
hardwood board, cut it out, and decorate it as your skills allow. Assemble
it as follows:
O <--------- Hanging loop
|
______|______
|_X____X____X_| <-- Toggle stick (string tied/glued at the 'X')
| | |
| GGG <-|------ A 'Prize' or goal (optional)
| |
| O___O | <---- Climbing cords (each side, actually much longer)
| (o o) |
| ( u ) |
_|___| |___|_
|/___ ___\| <-- Cord passing through hole in paw/hand (slip fit)
| ( ) |
| ( ) <|----- The climbing bear / doll
| ( _ ) |
| / / \ \ |
| /_/ \_\ |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
B B <--- Bead at end of cords (each side)
Well, hopefully my ASCII Picture gives you the idea.
To make the bear climb, hold both cords so the strings are tight and the
toggle stick is level. The doll starts with its hands/paws resting on your
hands, or you can hold both cords tight in one hand and slip the doll a bit
up the line with the other hand.
Pull the cord in your right hand. The string through the doll's right paw
will straighten out, lifting it's other paw. Draw the slack through that
paw, and then pull on the other cord. As you do this, maintain just enough
tension on each line so the doll moves smoothly. repeat, alternately
pulling on each cord. With a little practice, you can make the doll climb.
If you release the tension on the cords, the doll slides back down. If you
hold tension, it stops sliding.
For very small kids, an adult or older child runs the toy for the babe's
amusement. As the child gets more coordination, they will learn to make it
climb. It's a popular toy with children of all ages.
--
Regards, Jay Brandt --- Austin, Texas, USA --- <rzex60 at email.sps.mot.com>
In the SCA, HLS Jason of Rosaria, JdL, GdS, AoA --------- (Member # 3016)
Owner / Designer / Craftsman ------------------------- Bear Paw Woodworks
From: sandradodd at aol.com (SandraDodd)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Toys?
Date: 28 Jul 1994 09:28:04 -0400
Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364)
There's a 1560 painting by Pieter Brueghel the Elder which shows all kinds
of recognizable games, and some involve equipment--tops, knuckle bones,
hoops, a couple of different propeller toys (one to pull a string and have
it fly up, one on a stick, like a windmill, so that if the child runs
along it will turn in the wind (like a pinwheel, but only two vanes, and
the stick mounted straight on and held horizontally, rather than
perpendicular as our modern pinwheels). There are stilts, balls, baskets,
a sack of something hanging from a stick (you'd have to see the picture to
appreciate this one). They're playing with brooms (as horses, balancing
them on their fingers), there's a fancy stick horse with reins, dolls
(doll furniture is shown), masks, caps, blindfolds, they're tumbling and
doing handstands, swimming, climbing trees, playing on a pile of dirt
(king of the mountain), they're playing leap frog, buck-buck, they've
dressed one little girl like a queen and are having a processional with
smaller girls throwing petals from a basket out front... There's lots
more. It's worth trying to buy a large print of this painting if you're
intending to pursue this seriously.
My print says "Kunsthistoriches Museum, Wien" which I take to mean that's
where the painting is. Can anyone verify this?
As to copies, I ordered mine from a frame shop specializing in
African-American art in Albuquerque, which must mean it's not all that
hard to get.
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: orbons at fys.ruu.nl (Bart Orbons)
Subject: Re: Toys?
Organization: Physics Department, University of Utrecht, The Netherlan