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Period travel guides. Pilgrimage guides.

 

NOTE: See also the files: travel-msg, p-tourism-art, travel-foods-msg, ships-msg, p-backpacks-msg, horses-msg, med-ships-art, carts-msg, pilgrimages-msg.

 

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NOTICE -

 

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I  have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

 

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

 

I have done  a limited amount  of  editing. Messages having to do  with separate topics  were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the  message IDs  were removed to save space and remove clutter.

 

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make  no claims  as  to the accuracy  of  the information  given  by the individual authors.

 

Please respect the time  and  efforts of  those who have written  these messages. The copyright status  of these messages  is  unclear  at this time. If information  is  published  from  these  messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

 

Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org

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Subject: ANST - RE: period travel guides

Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 08:42:51 -0500

From: "C. L. Ward" <gunnora at vikinganswerlady.org>

To: <Ansteorra-Laurels at ansteorra.org>

 

Jovian asked:

>I assume that people wrote "travel guides"

>during the Middle Ages and Renaissance. Have

>any survived? Where can they be found? What

>do they cover?

 

Medieval "travel guides" aren't generally what you'd find today if you go to

the "Travel" section of a bookstore.  The accounts are much less factual in

many cases, and as far as I've seen never are the kind of document that

lists "what sights to see".

 

There are a number of more-or-less factual travellers' accounts, and then

you also get into medieval geography, which is often largely fictional or

based on hearsay.  And then there are the "fantastic travels" which I think

must descend from the common desire to astound and amaze those folks back

home.  At the edges of the world people always envisioned strange and often

dangerous creatures. For ancient peoples the earth's farthest perimeter was

a realm radically different from what they perceived as central and human.

The alien qualities of these "edges of the earth" became the basis of a

literary tradition that endured throughout antiquity and into the

Renaissance, despite the growing challenges of emerging scientific

perspectives. This phenomenon is so widespread that a number of books have

been written on the subject. In fact, the same phenomenon continues today,

providing us the many and varied aliens of science fiction and speculative

literature.

 

Some good ones to look at include:

 

VIKING TRAVELS TO BYZANTIUM

---------------------------

* Palsson, Hermann and Paul Edwards. Vikings in Russia: Yngvar's Saga and

Eymund's Saga.   Edinburgh: Edinburgh University Press. 1989. Out-of-print,

to have Amazon.com do a book  search for it go to:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0852246234/thevikinganswerl

 

ARABIC SOURCES DESCRIBING THE VIKING WORLD

------------------------------------------

* M. Reinaud, trans. Geography of Abu al-Fida'. Paris. 1848. Describes the

Norse ca. early 14th century under the heading "Northern Regions of the

World"

 

* Allen, W. E. D., trans. The Poet and the Spae-Wife: An Attempt to

Reconstruct Al-Ghazal's  Embassy to the Vikings. Dublin: Allen Figgis & Co.

1960.

[A translation of the Arabic text describing al-Ghazal's visit to Turgeis,

ruler of the  Vikings in Ireland ca. 845. This account dates to the early

1200's.]

 

* Al-Mas'udi. Meadows of Gold. trans. A. Sprenger. London. 1941.

[Describes the Rus market of Bulghur prior to 947.]

 

* Al-Mas'udi. The Meadows of Gold: The Abbasids. Paul Lunde and Caroline

Stone, trans and  eds. Kegan Paul International. 1989. To order from

Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0710302460/thevikinganswerl

 

* Ibn Battuta. The Travels of Ibn Battuta. trans. H.A.R. Gibb. Hakluyt

Society 2. Cambridge.  1962. To order from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/812150614X/thevikinganswerl

 

* S. Janicsek. "Ibn Battuta's Journey to Bulghar." Journal Royal Asiatic

Society. 1929. pp.  792-800.

 

* Smyser, H. M., trans. "Ibn-Fadlan's Account of the Rus with Some

Commentary and Some  Allusions to Beowulf." Franciplegius: Medieval and

Linguistic Studies in Honor of Francis Peabody Magoun Jr. eds. Jess B.

Bessinger and Robert P. Creed. New York: University Press.  1965. pp.

92-119.

[A translation of the Arabic text describing ibn-Fadlan's journey among the

Rus or Russian  Vikings ca. 921. This account dates to the early 1200's.]

See also the text, which I have on my webpage at:

http://www.vikinganswerlady.org/ibn_fdln.htm

 

FANTASTIC TRAVEL LITERATURE

---------------------------

Babcock, William Henry. Legendary Islands of the Atlantic: A Study in

Medieval Geography. New York: American Geographical Society. 1922.

Out-of-print, to have Amazon look for it:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0836969634/thevikinganswerl

 

Babcock, William Henry. "The So-Called Mythical Islands of the Atlantic in

Medieval Maps", Scottish Geographical Magazine 31/32 (1916).

 

Flint, Valerie I. J. The Imaginative Landscape of Christopher Columbus.

Princeton University Press. 1992. To buy from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0691056811/thevikinganswerl

 

Fuson, Robert H. Legendary Islands of the Ocean Sea. Pineapple Press. 1998.

To buy from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1561640786/thevikinganswerl

 

Harvey, P. D. A. Mappa Mundi: The Hereford World Map. British Library

Studies in Medieval Culture</CITE>. University of Toronto Press. 1996. To

buy from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0802009859/thevikinganswerl

[This map is a great example of medieval mythical geography and how it

intermixes with the knowledge of the real world.]

 

Jakobsen, Alfred. "Geographical Literature."  in: Medieval Scandinavia: An

Encyclopedia.  Phillip Pulsiano et al., eds.  Garland Reference Library of

the Humanities 934.  New York & London: Garland. 1993. pp. 224-225.

Out-of-print, to have Amazon search for it:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0824047877/thevikinganswerl

 

Romm, James S. The Edges of the Earth in Ancient Thought. Princeton:

Princeton University Press. 1992. To buy from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0691069336/thevikinganswerl

 

Simek, Rudolph.  "Elusive Elysia or Which Way to GlÊsisvellir."

Sagnaskemmtun: Studies in Honor of Hermann P·lsson on his 65th Birthday.

Rudolph Simek et al., eds.  Vienna, Cologne & Graz: Bˆhlau. 1986. pp.

247-275. Out-of-print, to have Amazon look for it:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/3205066006/thevikinganswerl

 

Tomasch, Sylvia and Sealy Gilles, eds. Text and Territory: Geographical

Imagination in the European Middle Ages. The Middle Ages Series. University

of Pennsylvania Press. 1997. To buy from Amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0812216350/thevikinganswerl

 

Westrem, Scott D., ed. Discovering New Worlds: Essays on Medieval

Exploration and Imagination. Garland Reference Library of the Humanities

1436. New York: Garland Publishing. 1991. Out-of-print, to have Amazon look

for it: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0815301022/thevikinganswerl

 

::GUNNORA::

 

 

Subject: Re: ANST - RE: period travel guides

Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:34:12

From: "Eric Jackson" <owenapaeddan at hotmail.com>

To: ansteorra at ansteorra.org

 

     Gerald of Wales wrote a excelent description of his travels through

Wales recruiting for one of the crusades. He also wrote about his travels in

ireland here are a few links. You can find his books on the web if you are

interested in them

 

    Ireland

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/geraldwales1.html

 

      Wales

http://www.llangynfelyn.dabsol.co.uk/dogfennau/disgrifiadau_gerallt.html

 

Owen ap Aeddan.......

 

 

Subject: ANST - Period Travel Guides

Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 19:40:42 -0400

From: fitzmorgan at cs.com

To: ansteorra at ansteorra.org

 

> I assume that people wrote "travel guides" during the Middle Ages and

> Renaissance. Have any survived? Where can they be found? What do they

> cover?

> Jovian

 

Look for "The Pilgrims Guide To Santiago De Compostela"   Written in , I

think, the 12th Century.  and translated by William Melczer.  Italica Press,

INC.  ISBN 0-934977-25-9 for $17.50 if it's still in print.  This is a travel

guide for pilgrims telling of dangers to avoid and sites to see on your

pilgrimage.

      It tells which rivers you can safely drink from and which are unsafe.

It says some rude things about the Basque.  And tells short stories about the

many Saints who's shrines you will see on the way.  It's well worth reading.

 

Robert Fitzmorgan

Barony of Northkeep

 

 

Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 20:37:10 -0400

From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Travel accounts to Turkey

 

I would mention that the English published a number of these travel  

Accounts in the 17th century. You might already find them translated.

 

Johnnae

 

Those with access to EEBO might look for such titles as follow:

 

A description of the grand signour's seraglio or Turkish emperours  

court [edited] by John Greaves.  Author: Bon, Ottaviano, 1552-1623.  

Publication Info: London : Printed for Jo. Ridley, 1653.

 

Headings to look for: [Harem] [Turkey -- Court and courtiers]  

[Istanbul (Turkey) -- Description]

 

----------

 

The four epistles of A.G. Busbequius concerning his embassy into  

Turkey being remarks upon the religion, customs, riches, strength and  

government of that people : as also a description of their chief  

cities, and places of trade and commerce : to which is added, his  

advice how to manage war against the Turks. Author: Busbecq, Ogier  

Ghislain de, 1522-1592. Publication Info: London : Printed for J.  

Taylor ... and J. Wyat ..., 1694.

 

The author died a century before publication in this case.

 

-----------

 

The six voyages of John Baptista Tavernier, Baron of Aubonne through  

Turky, into Persia and the East-Indies, for the space of forty years  

giving an account of the present state of those countries, viz. of the  

religion, government, customs, and commerce of every country, and the  

figures, weight, and value of the money currant all over Asia : to  

which is added A new description of the Seraglio

 

Tavernier, Jean-Baptiste, 1605-1689., Phillips, John, 1631-1706., Cox,  

Daniel,

 

London: Printed by William Godbid for Robert Littlebury ... and Moses  

Pitt ...1677.

 

 

Date: Sat, 19 Jun 2010 23:10:20 -0400

From: Sam Wallace <guillaumedep at gmail.com>

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

Subject: [Sca-cooks] 15th Century Travelogues

 

I found this set of travelogues while digging through Google Books. They

are of a pair of Italians who ventured to Persia, Poland, Russia and

other regions. There is some interesting mention of cuisine and culinary

customs, but not as many details as might be desired. It is worth

digging around in them as these areas did not produce many culinary

works until well after 1600.

 

Travels to Tana and Persia

http://books.google.com/books?id=RxgRAQAAIAAJ

 

Guillaume

 

 

Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2010 06:53:51 -0400

From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] The Adventures of Ibn Battula

 

I'm rereading "The Adventures of Ibn Battula" by Ross E. Dunn and came

across a description of a meal that might prove interesting.  Ibn Battula

was a Muslim traveler in the 14th century who is often referred to as "the

Muslim Marco Polo".  Dunn uses an account of his travels to recreate his

itinerary.  The meal, served in Mogadishu, is describes as follows:

 

... the party addressed themselves to a meal of local fare, compliments of

the palace: a stew of chicken, meat, fish, and vegetables poured over rice

cooked in ghee: unripe bananas in fresh milk: and a dish comprising of sour

milk, green ginger, mangoes, and pickled lemons and chilies.  The citizens

of Mogadishu, Ibn Battula observed, did justice to such meals as these: "A

single citizen... eats as much as a whole company of us would eat, as a

matter of habit, and they are corpulent and fat in the extreme."

 

I am puzzled at the inclusion of chilies in this description as I understand

them to have been introduced from the new world.  Perhaps the translation

from the original text is in error?

 

Dan

 

 

Date: Sat, 02 Oct 2010 08:52:32 -0400

From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Adventures of Ibn Battula

 

The adventures of Ibn Battuta, a Muslim traveler of the fourteenth  

century by Ross E. Dunn. Google books has it up. The quote is on page  

124.

 

The version The travels of Ibn Battuta: A.D. 1325 1354 by Ibn Batuta,  

B. R. Sanguinetti doesn't contain the word "chilies."

The question would be--- do other versions use the word or are certain  

versions using a modern word or term for Ibn Battuta's 14th century  

peppers? (Numerous texts point out that the region now uses a very hot  

chile pepper extensively. Was the modern pepper known as the African  

devil chile thought to be the traditional pepper of centuries past?)

 

Running a search on Ibn Battuta and the word chilies through Google  

Books leads to Ibn Battuta in Black Africa

By Ibn Batuta, Said Hamdun, No?l Quinton King.

A footnote in that book on page 78 reads

"The word translated 'chilies' is fulfil, compare Kiswahili pilipili."

 

 

Searching on pilipili

pilipili, pili-pili, piripiri n. from pilipili "pepper": red pepper,  

capsicum, bird's-eye chili; red-pepper sauce [< Swahili < Persian]

 

I suspect that what Ibn Battula was served was a variety of black  

pepper or even long pepper. Was it served fresh? Some of the texts  

call it chopped. One would think that it should have been ground.

 

http://www.fiery-foods.com/pepper-profiles/152-baccatum-pubescens-and-frutescens-species/107-pepper-profile-african-birdseye

 

profiles the African Birdseye pepper (another new world in origin  

capsicum pepper) and notes "pili-pili simply means "pepper-pepper" and  

is a generic term for any African chile."

 

I think it's safe to say he was served a hot pepper of old world origin.

 

http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/200801/

where.the.pepper.grows.htm  talks about Where the pepper grows in  

relation to its use in Arab history.

 

Johnnae

 

 

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2010 17:37:11 -0400

From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>

To: "cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Ibn Battula"s Meals

 

In Dunn's book, page 166, he translates the account of a meal at Azak (Tana, now Azov (at the mouth of the Don for those interested in geography) as follows:

 

"millet gruel, macaroni, boiled meat of horse and sheep, and fermented mare's milk, called qumizz."

 

The reference to macaroni puzzles.  It references some sort of pasta of that I'm reasonably sure.  I'm suspecting that he is likely talking about broad flat noodles.  Would they be made from wheat?

 

Dan

 

 

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2010 14:51:42 -0700

From: David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Adventures of Ibn Battula

 

<<< I'm rereading "The Adventures of Ibn Battula"  by Ross E. Dunn and

came across a description of a meal that might prove interesting.

Ibn Battula was a Muslim traveler in the 14th century who is often

referred to as "the Muslim Marco Polo".  Dunn uses an account of his

travels to recreate his itinerary.  The meal, served in Mogadishu,

is describes as follows:

 

... the party addressed themselves to a meal of local fare,

compliments of the palace: a stew of chicken, meat, fish, and

vegetables poured over rice cooked in ghee: unripe bananas in fresh

milk: and a dish comprising of sour milk, green ginger, mangoes, and

pickled lemons and chilies.  The citizens of Mogadishu, Ibn Battula

observed, did justice to such meals as these: "A singe citizen...

eats as much as a whole company of us would eat, as a matter of

habit, and they are corpulent and fat in the extreme."

 

I am puzzled at the inclusion of chilies in this description as I

understand them to have been introduced from the new world.  Perhaps

the translation from the original text is in error?

 

Dan >>>

 

The relevant passage is on page 376 of the Gibb translation of The

Travels. It isn't entirely clear if Ibn Battuta is describing the

food he was offered, or starting with that and then commenting on

what the local people eat.

 

"and in another dish they put curdled milk, on which they place

[pieces of] pickled lemon, bunches of pickled pepper steeped in

vinegar and salted, green ginger, and mangoes. "

 

That's clearly the passage he is referring to, and it sounds as

though Dunn has turned peppers into chilis. I haven't read his book,

but Ibn Battuta's own account of his travels, in the Gibb

translation, is a lot of fun. I like to describe Marco Polo as a 13th

c. Italian imitator of the 14th c. North African world traveler Ibn

Battuta.

--

David/Cariadoc

www.daviddfriedman.com

 

 

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2010 22:19:55 -0500

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Ibn Battula"s Meals

 

<<< The reference to macaroni puzzles.  It references some sort of pasta of

that I'm reasonably sure.  I'm suspecting that he is likely talking about

broad flat noodles.  Would they be made from wheat?

 

Dan >>>

 

Triticun durum (AKA T. turgidum), the wheat most commonly used in making

pasta, has been grown in North Africa since at least Roman times.  It would

have been a trade good in the Moslem world of the 14th Century, so there is

a good possibility that the pasta mentioned was made from T. durum.  Since

durum was being grown in Dhufar (west coast of the Arabian Peninsula), the

Horn of Africa would have had easy access to it.

 

Bear

 

 

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2010 02:33:59 -0400

From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Ibn Battula"s Meals

 

Was written:

<<< Since durum was being grown in Dhufar (west coast of the Arabian

Peninsula), the Horn of Africa would have had easy access to it. >>>

 

My reply:

 

Yes but we are talking about a meal served in Azov a city up the River Don.

Azov (Russian: ?????, pronounced [a'zof]) is a town in Rostov Oblast,

Russia, situated on the Don River just sixteen kilometers from the Sea of

Azov.  The River Don flows into the Sea of Azov from the north east.  The

Sea of Azov connects to the Black Sea on its north side.

 

I suspect that "macaroni" is used by Dunn generically for pasta.  All that

being said the grain used in making the pasta could have been grown locally?

We know that millet was also served at the meal.   The "macaroni" referenced

could have been made from wheat, buckwheat or millet.  Macaroni as we know

it is in the form of tubular noodles. Did tubular noodles exist in Azov at

the time?

 

Daniel

 

 

Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2010 11:24:54 -0400

From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] The Adventures of Ibn Battuta

 

Came across this 3 part article on Ibn Battuta that people might enjoy.

 

Again from Saudi Aramco World

 

The Longest Hajj: The Journeys of Ibn Battuta: Editor's Note

The Longest Hajj: The Journeys of Ibn Battuta, Part 1: From Pilgrim to  

Traveler?Tangier to Makkah

The Longest Hajj: The Journeys of Ibn Battuta, Part 2: From Riches to  

Rags?Makkah to India

The Longest Hajj: The Journeys of Ibn Battuta, Part 3: From Traveler  

to Memoirist?China, Mali and Home

 

http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/200004/the.longest.hajj.the.journeys.of.ibn.battuta-editor.s.note.htm

 

will get one started.

 

Johnna

 

<<< http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/200801/where.the.pepper.grows.htm

talks about Where the pepper grows in relation to its use in Arab  

history.

 

Johnnae >>>

 

 

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2010 11:17:02 -0500

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Ibn Battula"s Meals

 

I shouldn't try to follow a thread when I'm tired.

 

The area you are describing is in the grain growing region of Southeast

Europe.  While they might or might not have had durum, they would have had

wheat and I would generally assume that any pasta would be made from some

variety of wheat, except possibly in times of famine.  Neither buckwheat nor

millet have gluten and any pasta made from them would likely be extremely

friable.

 

The term macaroni derives from the Italian "maccaroni" meaning "dumpling."

In the original usage, the word can be used to refer to almost any form of

pasta.  IIRC, the first reference to tubular pasta shows up in early 15th

Century Italy (check for references before taking that as gospel), but I

don't remember that usage being outside of Italy.  In my view, tubular pasta

is a remote possibility.  It is much more likely that the pasta would be

flat noodles or dumplings.

 

Millet, BTW, makes a very decent polenta, either as a soft mush or a drier

loaf.  I suspect that this was probably served as mush.

 

Bear

 

<<< Yes but we are talking about a meal served in Azov a city up the River

Don. Azov (Russian: ?????, pronounced [a'zof]) is a town in Rostov Oblast,

Russia, situated on the Don River just sixteen kilometers from the Sea of

Azov.  The River Don flows into the Sea of Azov from the north east.  The

Sea of Azov connects to the Black Sea on its north side.

 

I suspect that "macaroni" is used by Dunn generically for pasta.  All that

being said the grain used in making the pasta could have been grown

locally? We know that millet was also served at the meal.   The "macaroni"

referenced could have been made from wheat, buckwheat or millet?  Macaroni

as we know it is in the form of tubular noodles.  Did tubular noodles

exist in Azov at the time?

 

Daniel >>>

 

 

Date: Tue, 05 Oct 2010 08:33:23 -0400

From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Ibn Battula"s Meals

 

And of course it may just be a mistranslation. Perhaps instead of

macaroni, the translator should have used the term noodles.

Would we have noticed if the phrase had been

 

"millet gruel, noodles, boiled meat of horse and sheep, and fermented  

mare's milk, called qumizz"?

 

Johnnae

 

On Oct 5, 2010, at 7:26 AM, Claire Clarke wrote:

<<< Maccaroni in fifteenth century Italian sources refers to at least  

two shapes - something that resembles modern fettucine and something that resembles modern penne. There may be more that I haven't seen. But my understanding is that macaroni was the name used for what we would call spaghetti until the 19th century.

Angharad >>>

 

<the end>



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Comments to the Editor: stefan at florilegium.org