melons-msg - 4/18/20
Period melons. References. Recipes. Watermelons, cantaloupe.
NOTE: See also the files: fruits-msg, watermelons-msg, fruit-pears-msg, fruit-quinces-msg, apples-msg, nuts-msg, drying-foods-msg, cider-msg, vinegar-msg.
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Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:37:26 -0800 (PST)
From: Huette von <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
- ---"Alderton, Philippa" <phlip at morganco.net> wrote:
> Anybody know if there were any melons available in Italy, about 15th to 16th
> centuries? If so, what sort? Am thinking there might have been some
> available fron Spain.
>
> Phlip
In "The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti" which
is a reprint of the "Tacuinum Sanitatis in Medicina"
which is a 14th century Italian/Latin health manual,
melons are depicted. Unfortunately, I don't have
the book in front of me at the moment. (I am at
work.) If you need more specifics, I will post them
here on Monday.
Huette
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 21:10:26 EST
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
phlip at morganco.net writes:
<< Anybody know if there were any melons available in Italy, about 15th to
16th centuries? If so, what sort? Am thinking there might have been some
available fron Spain.
Phlip >>
Both watermelons and musk melons are period.
Ras
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 02:54:34 -0000
From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nanna_R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir?=" <nannar at isholf.is>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
>Anybody know if there were any melons available in Italy, about 15th to 16th
>centuries? If so, what sort? Am thinking there might have been some
>available fron Spain.
As far as I know, melons were rather popular in Italy by the 15th century -
they seem to have disappeared for some time but there is speculation they
were brought back by the Crusaders. Platina has an entry on melons and
suggests it should be eaten at the beginning of the meal, followed by a
drink of good wine. Cantaloupes reached Italy from Armenina sometime in the
15th century and were first cultivated in the papal gardens at Cantalupo
near Rome. Watermelons were also available; not sure about other types.
Nanna
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:56:27 -0000
From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nanna_R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir?=" <nannar at isholf.is>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
From: Alderton, Philippa <phlip at morganco.net>
>Where's the entry in Platina? I'm using him for my main source. Am I missing
>something, are they called by another name?
My source for this is Gastronomy of Italy, by Anna del Conte. She says:
"Platina has a long entry in which he praises the tastiness of the fruit,
but warns against it being "cold and damp" and therefore indigestible. For
this reason he suggests that it should be eaten at the beginning of the meal
and followed by a drink of good wine, this being "an antidote to its rawness
and frigidity.""
Pepone is an alternative Italian name for melon, directly from Latin pepon
(ripe), also the source of English pumpkin.
Nanna
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:03:59 -0000
From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nanna_R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir?=" <nannar at isholf.is>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
>Where's the entry in Platina? I'm using him for my main source.
You might also check his Lives of the Popes - his comments on the demise of
Pope Paul II, admittedly no friend of Platina. The popeĀ“s official cause of
death was listed as "a stroke" - brought on by "eating a surfeit of melons."
Platina told quite another story, IIRC, involving the pointiffs sexual
preferences.
Nanna
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 23:49:29 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
At 5:37 PM -0800 2/26/99, Huette von wrote:
>In "The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti" which
>is a reprint of the "Tacuinum Sanitatis in Medicina"
>which is a 14th century Italian/Latin health manual,
>melons are depicted. Unfortunately, I don't have
>the book in front of me at the moment. (I am at
>work.) If you need more specifics, I will post them
>here on Monday.
The fact that something is in Tacuinum Sanitatis doesn't necessarily mean
it was available in 14th c. Italy, since the text is translated (I believe)
from the Arabic original. Some of the illustrations are pretty clearly by
artists who had never seen the originals.
I would check in Platina; I'm almost certain you will find melons.
David Friedman
Professor of Law
Santa Clara University
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:58:34 -0500
From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd at gate.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
Regarding the book referenced [previously] I just happened to have it handy. It
is "The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti" Translated by Judith Spencer,
complete revised translation, Facts on File Publications NY, NY, /Bicester,
England copyright 1983 by Arnoldo Mondadori Editore S.p.A. English
translation 1984 Arnoldo Mondadori Editore S.p.A. ISBN 0-8160-0138-3
This is a facsimile edition and translation of the 14th century Latin
manuscript known as the Tacuinum Sanitatis in Medicina.
Pages 34 and 35 depict three types of melons listed in the captions as
melon, watermelon and Watermelons from the east. The first, Melones
dulces, from the illustration and the test appears to be the elongated
ovidal alternating dark and light green stripped melons with red centers
that are one of the two related types of melons sold as water melons in the
States.
The second, Melones issipidi, appears to the second type of melon sold in
the States as water melons commonly referred to as cannon balls when I was a
child. From the illustration they are round or roundish and about twice the
size of a mans head. None were cut open in the illustration and the text
does not indicate the color of the flesh inside. In the illustration they
are dark green with perhaps a hint of thin stripping. The text repeats the
test for ripeness I heard as a child, "Always choose really ripe
watermelons, which are recognizable by the sound obtained by tapping the
outside.
The third, Molones indi et palestini are slightly smaller in the
illustration than the second and are descriped in the text as being large,
sweet. and yellow. The text suggests choosing large, very sweet watery
ones. From the illustration they look a lot like cantalopes and it shows
someone sniffing one.
Incidentally it also shows something which they call pumpkins which are
elongated green squashes which have the shape of streached and slightly bent
pears but from the illustration are about the length of a man's arm. They
call it a Cucurbite. It also shows dark purple aubergines (egeplant) which
they call Melongiana.
Daniel Raoul le Vascon du Navarre'
Shire of Sea March, Kingdom of Trimaris
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 17:13:50 -0500
From: Ian Gourdon <agincort at raex.com>
Subject: SC - Re: Melons 14th Cen
I did a little melon research for an event lunch a while back...
Melon is one of the dishes served in 1443 at the feast given by John
Stafford at his installation as Archbishop of Canterbury.
page 166 in A Feast of Fruits by Elizabeth Riely NY: MacMillan 1993
"...shows themelon's Near Eastern origin... Via Arabs and Moors the
fruit found its way to Spain... ; There are countless varieties of
melon, Cucumis melo, ... ; These members of the squash, or gourd, family
cross pollinate so promiscuously that farmers know they must plant them
well separated from each other... ; the musk melon ... includes what the
Americans call the cantaloupe...; The Persian melon is another larger
musk melon...; The skin can be ridged in segments, but always has the
characteristic raised netted pattern on the skin."
page 49 in Food in History by Reay Tannahill NY: Stein & Day 1973
"The (early) people of the Indus valley ate wheat and barley ... and
seasoned it with mustard, or possibly turmeric, or ginger...; Melons and
dates, and perhaps lemons and limes all figured in the diet."
from Plants of the Bible by Harold N. Moldenke Waltham, Mass. Chronica
Botanica Company 1952 " Numbers 11:5 - We remember the fish, which we
did eat in Egypt freely; the cucumbers, and the melons, and the leeks,
and the onions, and the garlick."
page 188 in Medieval Culture and Society edited by David Herlihy NY:
Harper and Row 1968 ( RE:Florence in 1336-38): " We have discovered by
the tax at the gates that every year Florence imported upwards of 55,000
cogna of wine...; The city required every year about 400 cows and
calves; 60,000 muttons and sheep; 20,000 she-goats and he-goats; and
30,000 pigs. In the month of July through the gate of San Frediano
there entered 4000 loads of melons, which were all distributed in the
city."
- --
Ian Gourdon of Glen Awe
- - Companion of the order of the Greenwood Company
Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:40:11 -0000
From: Christina Nevin <cnevin at caci.co.uk>
Subject: SC - Melons, thrushes and periodised lamb
A small addition to Ian Gourdon's list of melon references - Piero Aretino
(the famous Venetian poet and infamous gossip) in a letter of 3rd June 1537
thanking Mssr Francesco Marcolini for gifts of salads and fruits says;
"I can risk a wager against anyone wanting to claim that I was not the first
to see this year's figs, grown in your delightful garden. And I shall also
be the first to taste the pears, the apricots, the melons, the plums, the
grapes and the peaches."
Aretino obviously loved his food and dots wonderful little descriptions
throughout his letters. They're worth browsing for that alone almost
(they're also very witty). My favorite however must be his description of
eating a gift of thrushes;
"They were such that our Mssr Titian <yes, the painter> when he saw them on
the spit and sniffed them with his nose, glanced at the snow which was
falling relentlessly outside while the table was being set, and decided
there and then to disappoint a party of gentlemen who had asked him to
dinner. And altogether we heaped praises upon the long-beaked birds which,
boiled with a little dried meat, a couple of bay leaves and a good
sprinkling of pepper, we ate for the love of you, but also because they
delighted us..."
Lucretzia
Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 12:15:48 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Melons.
Phlip asks:
>Where's the entry in Platina? I'm using him for my main source.
It is in Platina's Book 1, in the old translation (Falconwood Press
edition) on page 16. It is headed "Longmelons" and mostly concern the
medical qualities of melons and what the ancients had to say about them.
Elizabeth/Betty Cook
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 16:31:07 -0500
From: Jenn/Yana <jdmiller2 at students.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: SC - pickled melon documentation
Jadwiga wrote:
>The pickled Melon _recipe_ in the Domostroi may be postperiod (I don't
>have my copy with me, but Yana will know) but mentioned of pickled melon
>and other fruit are in the period portion of the Domostroi.
Yep, it is in the "questionable" part of the Domostroi (the Long Version
that has parts that probably come from outside our period). The melons in
question were likely imported from Azerbaijan or another South Central
Asian country. For those who are wondering:
(Pouncy:199-200) Watermelons. Strain watermelon puree through a fine
sieve. Let it ripen in an alkaline solution. When it is ripe, do not cook
it, but let it purify itself.
Take a watermelon and cut it into layers. Take out the seeds. Cut about
two fingers width from the skin, leaving a little of the green flesh. Peel
off strips a little thicker than paper. Put the strips in the juice and
let them sit, changing the juice halfway through. Add honey and cook the
mixture over a slow flame. Skim off any foam that appears. When the
mixture is clear and no more foam appears, the syrup is ready. To the hot
mixture, add spices--pepper, ginger, cloves, cinnamon, mace, or nutmeg--and
simmer it. Put the syrup in a bowl so it will not burn. When it is ready,
put watermelon in a lime solution, then cool it will not burn. When it is
ready, put watermelon pieces in the syrup.
Other people say you should cook the watermelon in a lime solution, then
cool it before adding it to honey cooked with spices.
Melons. Peel melons thinly. Cut the body of the melon in half, then place
it in an alkaline solution for a day and a night. Put the pieces in a
spiced syrup like the one used for watermelons and let them sit. Stir the
pieces, turning them over, from time to time.
Others say that you should leave the melons in the syrup for a while, then
pour it off and replace it, leaving it there for a week altogether. When
the syrup has evaporated, add honey with spices--pepper, ginger, and cloves.
- --Yana
Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2001 16:40:55
From: "Vincent Cuenca" <bootkiller at hotmail.com>
Subject: SC - Torta de melones
orta de melones
Tomase el melon limpio de la corteza y de la semilla, y que no este muy
maduro, y cortese a bocadillos, y haganse freyr poco a poco con manteca
mezclandolo con la cuchara de contino, saquese y dexese enfriar, y passese
por el colador, y a cada dos libros de melon frito an~adansele seys onzas de
queso de Tronchon or Parmesano y seys onzas de requeson, or queso fresco
bien majado, seys onzas de queso de Pinto mantecoso una onza de canela,
media onza de pimienta, seys onzas de azucar, diez hiemas de hueuos frescos,
o a lo menos seys con las claras, y tengasa la cazuela tortera vntada con
manteca, con vn ojaldre de pasta algo gordo hecho de la flor de la harina,
agua rosada, hiemas de hueuos, manteca de vacas, y sal, y su tortillon
ojaldrado alrededor, y pongase dentro la composicion, y hagase cozer en el
horno con manteca derretida por encima, y en estando casi cozida hagase la
corteza de azucar, y canela, y en estando cozida siruase caliente. Desta
manera se puede hazer de los duraznos y aluaricoques, y ciruelas mal
maduras.
Melon Torte
Take melon cleaned of the rind and the seeds, and which should not be very
ripe, and cut it into bite-size pieces, and fry them bit by bit with lard
mixing them with a slotted spoon (?), take them out and let them cool, and
pass them through a strainer, and to each two pounds of fried melon add six
ounces of Tronchon or Parmesan cheese amd six ounces of curds, or well
mashed fresh cheese, six ounces of fatty Pinto cheese one ounce of cinnamon,
half an ounce of pepper, six ounces of sugar, ten fresh egg yolks, or at
least six with the whites, and have the torte pan greased with lard, with a
leaf of somewhat thick dough made with the best flour, rose water, egg
yolks, cow's lard, and salt, and its layered crust all around (?), and put
the mixture in, and let it cook in the oven with melted lard over it, and
when it is almost cooked make the crust with sugar, and cinnamon,* and when
it is cooked serve it hot. In this way you can make it with peaches and
apricots, and poorly ripened plums.
*This is similar to de Nola's recipe for Torta Genovesa, which instructs the
cook to sprinkle cinnamon and sugar over the torte as it is baking to form a
crisp layer.
Mind you, this is a quick and dirty translation. I'm totally faking
"cuchara de contino"; could also be "stir continuously with a spoon".
Sounds yummy, though. Maybe I'll try this for Queen's Prize next year! :)
Vicente
Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2004 17:07:22 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Watermelon
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
It was probably called melon (Middle English derived from Latin derived from
Greek), a term that covers both Cucumis melo and Citrullus vulgaris (or C.
lanatus, if you choose).
The Cucurbitaceae are more precisely fruit bearing vines rather than
vegetables, although the English word "vegetable" does not make a clear
distinction between the two. Cucumbers being from genus Cucumis are more
closely related to the other melons. Pumpkins and squash are in genus
Cucrbita. Other related plants are gourds (Lagenaria) and loofahs
(Luffa).
Bear
> This showed up in my mailbox today and thought it might be of interest.
> The last fact makes me wonder what the English called the watermelon
> prior to 1615. Does anyone know?
>
> Tara
>
> Fun Facts about Watermelon
<clipped>
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 19:42:27 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Melons in England
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
The Oxford Companion to Food says melons (Cucumis melo) were introduced into
England in the 16th Century where they were grown "under glass bells, in
greenhouses or 'steam-pits.'"
Melons have been cultivated on and off in southern Europe since Roman times
and were certainly reintroduced into the area by the Arabs. The first
medieval European reference seems to be Albertus Magnus in the 13th Century.
Bear
<<< Anybody have any info on people eating melons in England - whatever
period? Someone suggested that Watermelon & cantaloupe would be good
at my upcoming feast and I think it would go over well. But now I have
to figure out if it is period for the region.
Serena >>>
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 21:47:07 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Melons in England
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Artworks include
Cotan's Quince, Cabbage, Melon & Cucumber (1600) Credit: San Diego
Museum of Art
http://www.suite101.com/view_image.cfm/360562
Aertsen click on the small painting to enlarge. I think the one is a melon.
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/aertsen/vegetable-stall/
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/aertsen/vendor-vegetable.jpg
Then also take a look at The Four Elements: Earth. A Fruit and Vegetable
Market with the Flight into Egypt in the Background'
*1569 by Joachim Beuckelaer *Sixteen different varieties of vegetable
and fruit have been identified.
http://www.nationalgallery.org.uk/education/ITT/earth.html
Here's instructions for a tart of Roman melons
This is an excerpt from *Ouverture de Cuisine*
(France, 1604 - Daniel Myers, trans.)
The original source can be found at MedievalCookery.com
<http://www.medievalcookery.com/notes/ouverture.shtm>
To make a tart of Roman melons. Take a melon that is not at all
overripe, & wash it well within & without, & finely chop, then take four
ounces of good fat cheese, two ounces of sugar, a quarter ounce of
cinnamon, & a nutmeg, & make the tart like the others, when cooked,
sprinkle sugar thereon, & color with nutmeg.
Johnnae
Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 15:55:24 -0400
From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Melons in England
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Terry Decker wrote:
<<< The Oxford Companion to Food says melons (Cucumis melo) were introduced into England in the 16th Century where they were grown "under glass bells, in greenhouses or 'steam-pits.'"
Melons have been cultivated on and off in southern Europe since Roman times
and were certainly reintroduced into the area by the Arabs. The first
medieval European reference seems to be Albertus Magnus in the 13th Century.
Bear >>>
L.Cucumis melo, Ar. destbuya or betti-h, Fr. melon, Eng. melon. It is a native of Jordan, which was imported to other countries under Roman domination. In Spain, Arabs introduced it from Egypt around 825 and it was first cultivated in A?over del Tajo, an al-Andalus town, no longer existing, named for a village near Rome. It became a symbol in Muslim Spain for the excellent crops produced there in the Middle Ages. Melon was frequently eaten in Le?n during the 10th C. Villena (15th C)instructs to slice it lengthwise and remove the pits. He says it can be cut horizontally into rounds but it is better lengthwise. It has been said that Holy Roman Emperors Albert, Frederick III and Henry IV of Germany and Pope Paul II died as result of eating too much melon. Avenzoar explains that the melon may experience a noxious transformation generating a humor similar to poison if when eaten this occurs. The meal in the stomach prevents the melon from leaving it. The chances of this happening are less than one in 1,000. Luis Lobera de Avila, court physician of Charles V of Hapsburg wrote in his medical manual of 1530 that melon seeds are humid and were used to reduce fever and to expel kidney stones. [Bolens. 1990:34; ES: Carroll-Mann.Guisados 2-art. Jun 6, 01: ftn 74; ES: Chu. Oct 13, 02; Ibn Zuhr/Garc?a S?nchez. 1992:86-88; S?nchez-Albornoz. 2000:161 and Villena/Calero. 2002:23a:42b]
Villena also mentions watermelon but I have no reference to cantloupe through the 15th C. except for Columbus taking a variety a America (its a wonder his ships ever made it out of Huelva he took so much food) Actually cantaloupe really seems to take off during the 18th C from Italy.
Suey
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 20:25:39 -0500
From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Apicius canteloupe dish
I've "The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti" which shows an illustration
on page 35 of what is called watermelons from the east (melones indi et
palestini). They are described as "large and sweet and yellow." It looks
right and is differentiated from an illustration of melons (melones duces)
which are oblong, light and dark green stripped length wise and appear to be
red fleshed and watermelons (melones insipidi) which dark green and
spherical. To complicate things my copy of "The Medieval Health Handbook"
shows a round dark green melon labeled, indus or palestinian melons,
(melones indi idest palestini). Best I can do.
Daniel
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:51:14 -0600
From: "otsisto" <otsisto at socket.net>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Apicius cantaloupe dish
Cantaloupe is indigenous to India and Africa from there they spread to
Egypt, then to Greeks and Romans.
Cantaloupe is believed to have been introduced to NA in 1494, Columbus'
second voyage.
The question is the variety. I have come to understand but no docs. that
the warty rind cantaloupe was first and the netted rind which we are
familiar with came about in the 1200s Persia. Allegedly a hybrid of the
warty with a squash.
Cucumis melo var. reticulus (netted)used mainly in NA
Cucumis melo var. cantalupensis (ribbed) used mainly in Europe and Asia.
Some cantaloupe varieties
http://www.loghouseplants.com/lists/veglistbnveg.html
De
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 20:04:49 -0600
From: "otsisto" <otsisto at socket.net>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Apicius canteloupe dish
There is the casaba (or Persian?)and the crenshaw melons that have yellow
rinds
-----Original Message-----
<<< I've "The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti" which shows an illustration
on page 35 of what is called watermelons from the east (melones indi et
palestini). They are described as "large and sweet and yellow." It looks
right and is differentiated from an illustration of melons (melones duces)
which are oblong, light and dark green stripped length wise and appear to be
red fleshed and watermelons (melones insipidi) which dark green and
spherical. To complicate things my copy of "The Medieval Health Handbook"
shows a round dark green melon labeled, indus or palestinian melons,
(melones indi idest palestini). Best I can do.
Daniel >>>
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 21:37:39 -0500
From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Apicius canteloupe dish
> > They are described as "large and sweet and yellow."
> Is the yellow the flesh or the rind? There are yellow flesh watermelons.
It has a yellow rind in the picture.
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2015 21:26:41 +0000
From: Gretchen R Beck <cmupythia at cmu.edu>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] unsweet melons?
<< What other kinds of melons are there, than "sweet melons" >>>
Bitter melons -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momordica_charantia
Although I cannot speak to their history in North Africa or Europe.
toodles, margaret
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2015 17:43:27 -0400
From: Alec Story <avs38 at cornell.edu>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] unsweet melons?
There's also winter melon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_melon
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melon has a pretty good list of melons - it
looks like most species of *Cucumis* are sweet? I wonder if that's true of
historical cultivars of the same species, or of the wild types, if they
still exist.
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2015 16:47:19 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] unsweet melons?
Melons are found in four genera: Benincasa, Citrullus, Cucumis, and
Momordica. Sweet melons are specifically Cucumis melo. All other melons
are not "sweet melons" by definition. There are melons that are not very
edible and others that are used only in cooking.
For further info, you might look at Medieval Emergence of Sweet Melons,
Cucumis melo (Cucurbitaceae)
http://aob.oxfordjournals.org/content/110/1/23.short .
Bear
<the end>