quills-msg - 11/29/02
Making quill pens. Pen knives.
NOTE: See also the files: inks-msg, iwandpc-msg, parchment-msg, paper-msg, feathers-msg, fowls-a-birds-msg, p-archery-msg.
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This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
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Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: re: Making a QUILL?
Date: 14 Jun 1995 08:36:11 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
<Bruno vonBrunner<Doug Brunner <doug_brunner at hp-corvallis.om.hp.com>>>
> I feel this may be aimed at the Scribes, in our group. We sell various
>Plumes at Events. We have been asked about making Quills. Unfortunetly,
>the ones asking are mostly Mundanes that expect them to be Ostrich Quills
>from an old Errol Flynn movie. I don't really have enough information to
>give them a good answer. How doesa one make a Quill? And, is an
>Ostrich Plume adequate?
As I understand it, you take a feather (I assume an ostrich feather would
work although I would think you'd risk getting all that fluff and down into
your ink). Cut it off about pen length (so it will fit in your penner :) ).
Then strip away as much of the vanes as you need in order to hold the shaft.
Cut the base end at an angle (in forming the nib, you have a lot of leeway as
to what sort of pen you are making), and then slice *up* the shaft about a
quarter of an inch to make the reservoir of the pen.
It will look *something* like:
///////
=============================================
\\\\\\\\\
Now if I can just find a decent pen knife.
"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn
Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep
-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra
(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)
From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: re: Making a QUILL?
Date: 15 Jun 1995 18:53:22 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
In article <950614083605.208296fe at vax2.utulsa.edu>, IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson) writes:
|> <Bruno vonBrunner<Doug Brunner <doug_brunner at hp-corvallis.om.hp.com>>>
|> > I feel this may be aimed at the Scribes, in our group. We sell various
|> >Plumes at Events. We have been asked about making Quills. Unfortunetly,
|> >the ones asking are mostly Mundanes that expect them to be Ostrich Quills
|> >from an old Errol Flynn movie. I don't really have enough information to
|> >give them a good answer. How doesa one make a Quill? And, is an
|> >Ostrich Plume adequate?
|>
I don't make or use quills, but I've picked up a bit from people who do. As
I understand it, you can't use just any old feather. I've heard of goose and
turkey flight feathers being used. There must be some criteria which determine
whether a particular feather is acceptable or not. Obviously, it has to be
big enough to handle, and it must be able to hold ink, and it must be of a shape
and hardness that can be carved into a usable nib. I believe the following
reference has a chapter on quills:
The Calligrapher's Handbook, Editted by Heather Child. Taplinger Publishing.
Another possible source (don't know if it mentions quills):
Writing and Illumination and Lettering, Edward Johnston. Pittman.
ISBN -0-8008-8731-X
|>
|> Now if I can just find a decent pen knife.
|>
One I saw looked remarkably like a very unremarkable chip carving knife,
which should be available at any decent woodworking supply store. Maybe
there's some subtle difference between the two.
Cheers, Rick/Balderik
From: habura at rebecca.its.rpi.edu (Andrea Marie Habura)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Making a QUILL?
Date: 15 Jun 1995 20:38:31 GMT
Organization: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
Cc:
For Bruno: A good source is Edward Johnston's _Writing & Illuminating &
Lettering_ (Pitman, 1977, ISBN 0-8008-8731-X). The first chapter gives
information on cutting reed and quill pens, and I've followed the
directions with success.
However, I don't think that an ostrich plume will work. Those plumes I've
seen have solid shafts, and part of what makes a reed or quill pen work is
that the interior is hollow. (Yes, I've tried; can you tell? :) ) Johnston
recommends turkey quills for large writing, and goose or crow for fine
work.
I've used goose quills (I collect them from a flock of tame geese in a park
near me---after they're done with them, of course) and can attest to their
quality. I mostly use them for holding small lumps of white lead or
charcoal, which is a method for drawing on fabric for embroidery, but I've
also done a pen or two.
Alison MacDermot
*Ex Ungue Leonem*
From: iohannes at clubmet.metrobbs.com (d.hillers)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Making a QUILL?
Date: 20 Jun 1995 14:47:53 -0500
Organization: Metropolis BBS
gruess gott!
I know of several authorative technical articles on quill making,
supplies, etc. if you are interested.. I may have followed this string up
by e-mail elsewere, so i don't want to go overlong :>
best reference I know is Donald Jacksons definitive article in
"The Calligraphers Handbook" H.Child ed. Taplinger 1989. or if you are
into authority heavy... "Writing, Lettering, and Illuminating" by the
rescuer of the craft- Edward Johnston. I like the Arts & Crafts movement :>
If your interest is more serious-reply here...
HL Iohannes Weisswald, Calonlilly, etc...
Carlsby, Calontir
D.Hillers
POB 442249
Lawrence, KS 66044
From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: re: Making a QUILL?
Date: 16 Jun 1995 12:59:14 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
<Rick/Balderik<Rick Cavasin <cav at bnr.ca>>
>I don't make or use quills, but I've picked up a bit from people who do. As
>I understand it, you can't use just any old feather.
This is true. And you are correct that flight feathers are used, as
a rule. In some cases, tail feathers might be used, but (as Isabel MacDermot
mentioned) they need to be hollow.
OTOH, you can also take any large feather and and find a way to seat
a metal nib in it, which, as a merchant, you might want to do. Metal nibs,
however, are (I believe) post period (there's an article on that very subject
sitting around in these files SOMEplace...).
|> Now if I can just find a decent pen knife.
>One I saw looked remarkably like a very unremarkable chip carving knife,
>which should be available at any decent woodworking supply store. Maybe
>there's some subtle difference between the two.
After writing that, I tripped across a picture of an 18th century pen knife
in a book titled "Discovering Horn" (Which, as an aside, I'd suggest everyone
who intends on working with horn, take a peak at). There are certain
similarities between it and a chip-carving knife. Now to take a closer
look at my copy of _Knives and Scabbards_...
"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn
Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep
-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra
(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)
From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Hard Tack/Quill Nibs/Pen knives
Date: 16 Jun 1995 14:38:30 -0500
Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway
My comments on metal nibs in pens, for the remorselessly pedantic, can
stand up if you take into account that the first machine for making metal
pen nibs was not perfected until 1822 (According to:
Hunter, Steve Carl. "Half a century of pens". _British Heritage_
(Jun/Jul 1983). p. 70
However that does not preclude the possibility that, since the technology
to produce such metalwork DID exist in period (for which I cite the
HMSO's _Dress Accessories_ book, and its material on metal "points")
it is possible, though unlikely, that metal pen nibs existed in our Period.
>|> Now if I can just find a decent pen knife.
>One I saw looked remarkably like a very unremarkable chip carving knife,
I took a quick look in _Knives and Scabbards_ at the item I have earlier
suggested was a Penner (#457, BTW #432, 433 are likely to be as well). It
was found in conjunction with a knife (#96). The blade shape of knife
#96 has a relatively short blade, and the back "curves toward the edge",
or, in other words, looks "remarkably like a very unremarkable chip carving
knife".
Thank you Balderik, I had not, as yet, placed those two pieces of data together.
"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn
Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep
-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra
(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)
From: mhwag at aol.com (MHWag)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Hard Tack/Quill Nibs/Pen knives
Date: 19 Jun 1995 11:00:25 -0400
Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364)
There is a Tournaments Illuminated article on making Quill Nibs by Duke
Sir Badouin MacKenzie (Winter 1993, issue 109).
Aileen
From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Hard Tack/Quill Nibs/Pen knives
Date: 19 Jun 1995 16:10:30 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.
Diarmuit sez:
>I took a quick look in _Knives and Scabbards_ at the item I have earlier
>suggested was a Penner (#457, BTW #432, 433 are likely to be as well). It
>was found in conjunction with a knife (#96). The blade shape of knife
>#96 has a relatively short blade, and the back "curves toward the edge",
>or, in other words, looks "remarkably like a very unremarkable chip carving
>knife".
>Thank you Balderik, I had not, as yet, placed those two pieces of data >together.
No problem! It's what I do (finding stuff). The reason it stuck in my mind
is that I had heard of people spending fairly outrageous amounts of money
to buy/import these pen knives from far away. It just seems like such a shame
if/when even the most expensive chip carving knife can be had at a lower cost,
and much lower effort. I don't begrudge the people making the specialized
hand-made pen knives their fees, but people shouldn't have to hold off from
trying to use real quills for lack of a cheaper alternative. For those who
are curious, a decent chip carving knife can be had from Lee Valley Tools for
about $13 Canadian. I think you want the #8, which is the 'standard' knife.
Cheers, Rick C.
From: yahoudi at wedcraft.com (Jill S.)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.misc,rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Calligraphy: Writing with a quill
Date: 28 Dec 2001 14:40:49 -0800
acsenray at yahoo.com (Apurbva Chandra Senray) wrote
> I've gotten a couple of quills that were being sold as novelty items
> with an inkwell that I bought at a pen store. The thing is, I can't
> get them to work very well. The fountain pen ink I use tends to just
> rush out all at once. Anyone have any pointers? Thanks.
It could be that if the pen was prepared only as a novelty item, and
not as a working quill, it isn't cut well enough to actually be used
for writing.
Also, modern fountain pen ink is designed to flow without clogging up
modern fountain pens, so it probably is too runny to use with a quill.
I'm sure one of our resident calligraphers would be more than happy
to recommend a good ink to use with quill pens!
Some websites to peruse:
http://www.regia.org/quill2.htm (from the Regia Anglorum organization,
with links to some authentic ink recipes!)
http://www.flick.com/~liralen/quills/quills.html (by Liralen Li)
Ly. Giraude Benet
From: jrlatala at shell.golden.net
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.misc,rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Calligraphy: Writing with a quill
Date: 1 Jan 2002 13:13:54 -0500
Apurbva Chandra Senray <acsenray at yahoo.com> wrote:
>I've gotten a couple of quills that were being sold as novelty items
>with an inkwell that I bought at a pen store. The thing is, I can't
>get them to work very well. The fountain pen ink I use tends to just
>rush out all at once. Anyone have any pointers? Thanks.
Check your local library for a copy of "Writing & Illuminating &
Lettering" by Edward Johnston. He's acknowledged by many as the 'father'
of calligraphy. Chapter two, Tools, discusses how to prepare reed, cane
and quill pens for writing. Reed and cane pens were usually used when
writing large letters over half an inch or so. Quill pens were used for
smaller writing.
It sounds like you're missing the 'spring' in your quill pen. That's a
thin metal strip bent into a flat S shape that's pushed into the quill
so one flat end rests behind the writing end of the quill. It's hard to
explain it without restoring to pictures.
If you have trouble finding a copy get back to me and we can probably
work something out. I have a copy buried away in some boxes so it might
take a while to find my copy.
--
john R. Latala
jrlatala at golden.net
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