chairs-msg - 1/13/08
Medieval and SCA chairs.
NOTE: See also these files: furniture-msg, beds-msg, brooms-msg, wood-msg, woodworking-msg, tools-msg, tools-bib, candles-msg, candlesticks-msg.
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NOTICE -
This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.
The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.
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Thank you,
Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
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Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: mjc+ at cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio)
Subject: Re: "Viking" chairs
Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon
Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1993 14:56:28 GMT
odlin at reed.edu (Iain Odlin) writes:
> Could someone be so kind as to post instructions? I'd just go ahead and use
> "By-guess-and-by-God," but I don't know what these chairs look like... ;)
The chair consists of two pieces. One is a board with a rectangular hole
about a foot from one end; the other is a board that's full width at one end
and after about a foot or so narrows to a paddle that fits through the hole.
You put the paddle in the hole and stand the chair on the paddle end and the
bottom edge of the other board. From sideways-on it looks sort of like an
"X", but with the cross below center.
The exact measurements will depend on what's comfortable for your body. I
started with an 8' 2x10 and cut it into pieces roughly 4.5' and 3'5'. The
longer became the back (and was planned so that I could lean my head back on
it; I'm short). The hole is about a foot from the bottom and is about
1.75 (thickness of the other board plus a bit) x 4", as I recall. (The
chairs are put away at the moment.) You want the hole to be wide enough
to make the paddle stable but narrow enough to not weaken the wood to either
side in the back piece. The other piece has something like a 12" or 13"
long seat, and the rest is the paddle, cut just slightly smaller than the
hole.
Hints: The easiest way to cut the hole is to draw the rectangle on the
board, apply a drill to the corners, and then use the saw with the skinny
little blade (jig saw?) to cut the sides of the rectangle. I had the owner
of ths tools cut the paddle with a circular saw while I stood a good distance
away. :-) I cut across the diagonals on the front of the seat and the top
of the back, about an inch or two in, to avoid sharp corners. I then sanded
all the edges by hand and worked the aforementioned corners until they were
almost smooth curves using a hand-held tool that's something of a cross
between a plane and a cheese grater. (I can't remember what it's called.)
Note that you don't want to do more than minimal sanding on the hole; if you
remove too much wood from the hole and the paddle, the chair will be wobbly.
You want a tight fit.
I then stained the chair and applied a coat of non-glossy finish. This is
probably not strictly necessary (they don't do it on picnic tables, for
instance), but it made the thing look nicer.
Safety hint: if you work with green wood (the chemical-laden stuff, which
is what's commonly available), be sure to work outdoors and wear a mask to
prevent all the sawdust from getting into your lungs. And of course, you
should always wear safety goggles when doing the cutting.
By the way, this "pattern" is fairly easy to tinker with. I made two
chairs; the first was the pattern. To make the first one, I cut the hole
a little higher than I thought I'd need and the seat a little longer than
I thought I'd need, and then I put it together and adjusted by cutting from
the bottom of the back and the front of the seat until I was happy. Then
I made the second one to those specs. And the first one is perfectly usable;
it's just a little shorter.
Ellisif
mjc at cs.cmu.edu
To: Mark Harris
From: Monica Cellio
Date: 6/8/93
RE>"Viking" chairs
Greetings! I'm glad my second post helped you. Just want to clarify one
thing: I have seen no evidence that these chairs are earlier than the 1980s.
They could be SCA inventions for all I know. I have seen *no* documentation
for them. But random wooden furniture beats director's chairs any day, in
my opinion. :-)
Good luck!
Ellisif
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: whheydt at pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt)
Subject: Re: "Viking" chairs
Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA
Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1993 19:47:40 GMT
In article <mjc.739464988 at NL.CS.CMU.EDU> mjc+ at cs.cmu.edu (Monica Cellio) writes:
>of the back, about an inch or two in, to avoid sharp corners. I then sanded
>all the edges by hand and worked the aforementioned corners until they were
>almost smooth curves using a hand-held tool that's something of a cross
>between a plane and a cheese grater. (I can't remember what it's called.)
Sounds like a Stanely Surform tool. You could also use a plane, a
spokeshave or (for the brave) a drawknife.
>Note that you don't want to do more than minimal sanding on the hole; if you
>remove too much wood from the hole and the paddle, the chair will be wobbly.
>You want a tight fit.
Try using a chisel with the flat side to the wood.
In general, do not take a cutting tool ( plane, surform, spokeshave,
chisel.....) to a piece that has been sanded. Do all cutting *first*.
Sanding leaves bits of abrasive grit imbedded in the wood that are
very destructive to cutting edges.
--Hal
Hal Ravn, West Kingdom
Wilson H. Heydt, Jr., Albany, CA 94706, 510/524-8321 (home)
--
Hal Heydt |
Analyst, Pacific*Bell | If you think the system is working,
510-823-5447 | Ask someone who's waiting for a prompt.
whheydt at pbhya.PacBell.COM |
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: goobers at iastate.edu (Tom R Dennis)
Subject: Viking chairs ala Sot
Summary: basic construction
Keywords: pillage
Organization: Iowa State University, Ames IA
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 00:37:56 GMT
I have been hearing a people describing a 'viking' chair and it's
construction. I don't know if this is viking or not, but I first saw it at a
Buckskinner encampment and being any good Viking I borrowed the idea and made
one nice to sit in and easy to takedown and transport.
Some basic tools needed are a drill, saber saw (jig saw), sander (nice
but not absolutely necessary), and hand saw.
Materials needed are 1" x 12" x ... and 1" x 4" x ... oak or other
hardwood. Note: don't use pine unless it's at least 2" thick as narrower
widths bust like twigs.
Layout:
| 43" |
----------------------------------- --
| _ |
| Back |_| | 12"
| |
----------------------------------- --
| 10" |
This is the back piece of the chair. A slot is cutout 10" from the
bottom of the back to allow for the cross piece to go through Thus a 1"x 3
1/2" slot is cut (a 4" piece of wood is not really 4" but 3 1/2" and a 12"
piece is really 11 1/2"). Additonally, a 1" x 12" piece should be added
around the slot area to give the slot extra strength as this is a very high
stress area especially if you are large like me (run the grain 90 degrees to
the back so as to give maximum strength).
| 32" |
--------- --
| |
- -------------------------------------- |
4" | | | 16"
- -------------------------------------- |
| |
--------- --
For the cross piece, cut a 1" x 12" 16" long and a 1" x 4" 32" long.
Fasten the 1" x 12" x 16" piece to the 1" x 4" with glue and steel wood
screws.
Once the beast has been cut out, sand it and put what ever kind of
wood sealant that you like one the wood.
Assembly:
Insert the cross piece through the slot in the back piece. Also, some
minor adjustments might be necessary to make sure that the cross piece fits
into the slot of the back piece. Don't make the fit tight as it will be a
royal bitch to take appart after the wood expands a bit from being out in the
great out doors. Conversly, the slot should not be to loose, but a little
wobble doesn't hurt it any, especially after adding the reinforcement piece on
the back piece.
\ The assembly looks a bit like this exept that
\ the cross piece and the back piece form more of
\ a 90 degree angle than is shown (what do you
\ expect from crappy editors any way)
\
\
\ / The chair is real comfortable, i've passed er
\/ I mean fell asleep many a time in it at revels.
/\
/ \
Also, if your unsure of the design, make one using 2" x 12" and 2" x
4" pine and try it out. Changes can be made in the seat height and sitting
angle by changing the location of the slot in the back piece and the length of
the cross piece.
Hope that this is of some help and if anyone has any questions please
don't hesitate to ask via email.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
{ Tom R. Dennis (515) 292 - 0747 / Money, it's a gas. Grab that cash }
{ aka Alric the Sot / with both hands and make a dash. }
{ goobers at iastate.edu / P. Floyd }
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: rsmiley at netcom.com (Richard Smiley)
Subject: Re: Tournaments Illuminated #113 -- review and commentary
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 15:31:08 GMT
In article <3m3jr4$bi3 at newsbf02.news.aol.com>, CONNECT <connect at aol.com> wrote:
>Dani of the Seven Wells (dani at telerama.lm.com) says:
>
>>>>The (newly arrived) Winter, 1995 issue of TI was of mediocre quality --
>uninspiring, but not actively bad. It gave the impression of having
>been put together in a hurry.<<<
>
>>>>"Constructing a 15th Century Monastery Chair" is another how-to
>article.
>It's written for readers with above-average access to tools. I was not
>able to personally judge the quality of the instructions.<<<
>
>What would have been very helpful was a picture of the completed project.
>As it is, the impression I had was of a beach/lounge chair, and that's
>certaintly not hoopskirt-proof. :( There must be something flat across to
>sit on, but there is no picture describing it so. So, I don't know if I
>should have my father-in-law construct one or not.
>
The construction of this chair is very poor. The way that the author
describes it, the back will shear because of the angle crossing the
grain. If the chair were constructed using period methods this would not
be as big a problem and it would be much easier to put together. You
might look up a copy of "The Woodwrights Eclectic Workshop" by Roy
Underhill. He discusses a similar chair that give some insight into how
this chair could be made better.
Malcom MacPherson, OL
West Kingdom
From: uccxdem at okway.okstate.edu (David Mann)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Tournaments Illuminated #113 -- review and commentary
Date: 12 Apr 1995 19:50:21 GMT
Organization: OSU CIS
In article <rsmileyD6rxrw.649 at netcom.com>, rsmiley at netcom.com (Richard Smiley) says:
Greetings to all from Marke
>>Stuff from Dani deleted
>The construction of this chair is very poor. The way that the author
>describes it, the back will shear because of the angle crossing the
>grain. If the chair were constructed using period methods this would not
>be as big a problem and it would be much easier to put together. You
>might look up a copy of "The Woodwrights Eclectic Workshop" by Roy
>Underhill. He discusses a similar chair that give some insight into how
>this chair could be made better.
>
>Malcom MacPherson, OL
>West Kingdom
Master Malcom,
I beg to differ on this chair on several points. The shear tendency for
the woods recommended for the chair are fairly high. The oldest chair, ~2
years old, shows no signs of cracking, even after having almost 300 lbs
of knight and armor plopping into it multiple times. I don't understand
your reference to 'constructed using period methods'. The first chair was
built with hand saws, chisels, hand planes. A drill was used to make the
steel rod holes instead of a hot iron. If you are refering to bent wood
angle, the reference books gave no indication of the wood being bent, and
the pictures of the chairs were not fine enough to distinguish a grain
pattern or to be able to tell steel rods or wood dowels were used. The
article in the TI was to be looked at by someone with woodworking knowledge
before publication. Next time I'll just have my Laurel look over my
writings before sending them off. The particular reason I used steel rod
was: 1) my chairs are often barrowed by others to use. 2) if stood upon
I didn't the chair to fail and myself ending up with a broken neck. 3) A
directors chair hasn't been able to take the abuse. Bill McNutt has been
kind enough to offer to put the finished chair pictures on a web server.
I'll be emailing him the pictures tomorrow.
Marke
From: ansteorra at eden.com (7/13/95)
To: ansteorra at eden.com
Subj: chairs
>Btw, me and my Lady are already talking about how to improve our
>enjoyment of the SCA and what to get next to help this out. Looks like
>period chairs/table (any hints?) and feast gear.
I have always wondered why more people didn;t keep 3-legged stools around
their camp, they are period and raily easy to make/cheap to buy. No back
support and too easy to fall off of when your drunk but everything has a
drawback.
>Phelim Uhtred Gervas
-michael
From: ansteorra at eden.com (7/13/95)
To: ansteorra at eden.com
RE>Furniture
edited...
>Btw, me and my Lady are already talking about how to improve our
>enjoyment of the SCA and what to get next to help this out. Looks like
>period chairs/table (any hints?) and feast gear.
>
We found very nice folding chairs (wooden & stained) at Hobby Lobby for
around $25.00 They are actually quite comfortable and portable. They
have also added to the atmosphere of our encampments.
Gala Cunningham (a.k.a. lurker extraodinaire)
___
Donna Cunningham
University Duplicating Service
University of Texas at Austin
512/475-6731
From: ansteorra at eden.com (7/13/95)
To: ansteorra at eden.com
RE>Event Ideals (fighting)
Pug mentioned that the next thing they will aquire to help them play more authenticlly will be chairs and a table. If you are looking for late period, a folding director's chair with out the arms is fairly period looking. I suggest that you put a seat on it out of a tapestry
reinforced with canvas (so that it won't stretch out) If you keep the
arms and hence, the back, do the same, it is more comfortable that way
but not period looking. Throwing a cover over a chair does nothing to
make it look more period, unless perhaps it is a large, fur cloak. Then
it just looks like a cloak thrown into a chair. Just my two cents.
Clare
From: hrjones at uclink.berkeley.edu (Heather Rose Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Not X Chairs
Date: 14 Jul 1996 03:45:16 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Bryan J. Maloney (bjm10 at cornell.edu) wrote:
: Anybody know how far back folding cloth and wood "director"-style chairs
: go? I think they go at least as far back as the 18th century, but any
: further?
I once had my hands on a (fairly thick) book detail the history of chairs
that showed a photograph of a "director's chair" that had belonged to
Napoleon. I'm not talking about a vague, stylistic resemblence, the
construction was identical to modern director's chairs. (Fancier
materials, though.) For anything further back, you'd have to define what
you mean by "director" _style_ chair. Similar enough that if you saw a
real one you'd say, "Hey, but that's a modern diretor's chair!"? In that
case, the Napoleonic one is the earliest I've seen. However the basic
X-folding shape is a slow but steady development from at least Classical
Rome. There are some very early medieval chairs that take the basic
X-stool shape and extend the back legs upward to form a back (i.e., the
seat cross-bars anchoring the fabric go across under your knees and behind
your seat, rather than parallel to your legs) which is very similar in
_concept_ to some beach-chair designs (except the beach chairs are always
made of aluminum and nylon webbing). It's a wonderful book -- one I'd buy
if I ever ran into in a store.
Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn
From: Heather Rose Jones <hrjones at uclink.berkeley.edu>
To: Mark S. Harris
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 20:32:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Not X Chairs
> I've been looking for any books that show chairs back in the medieval
> times. Does this one cover medieval chairs? Do you remember the name of
> this book?
My recollection was slightly off -- the book wasn't about chairs in
general, but rather was specifically about the history of folding chairs.
The info is:
Wanscher, Ole. "Sella Curulis - The Folding Stool, an Ancient Symbol of
Dignity." Copenhagen: Rosenkilde and Bagger, 1980. ISBN 87-423-0337-0
Despite the Danish publisher, the book is entirely in English. It includes
lots of plates, both of depictions of chairs and of actual surviving
chairs themselves. If you have trouble finding it, try interlibrary loan
from the UC Berkeley library. The call number there is GT 450 W36 -- which
may or may not be helpful in the process.
Tangwystl
From: bjm10 at cornell.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Not X Chairs
Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 11:41:38 -0400
Organization: Cornell University
In article <4s90r8$mit at thrush.sover.net>, celtic at sover.net (Stuart Joseph)
wrote:
> (Bryan J.
> >Maloney) writes:
> >>PS: Those two-piecer low "camp chairs" that a lot of folks sell date
> >back
> >>to a 1930s Boy Scout Jamboree...
> They may date back to the 30's but they have been accepted by a lot of
> re-enactor groups with very high authenticity standards, so I would
They are being phased out of these groups even as we speak...
From: dickeney at access1.digex.net (Dick Eney)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Not X Chairs
Date: 15 Jul 1996 12:46:35 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA
In article <bjm10-1507961140330001 at potato.cit.cornell.edu>,
Bryan J. Maloney <bjm10 at cornell.edu> wrote:
>In article <4s6m2o$14o4 at uni.library.ucla.edu>,
>liversen at physiology.medsch.ucla.edu (Lori Iversen) wrote:
>
>> I can buy a folding canvas-seated director's chair on sale at Target for
>> less than $20. Can you do me better?
>
>Right! Now, how far do they go back? I was stating that they went AT
>LEAST as far back as the 18th century, as far as I knew. I was ASKING if
>anybody could document them FARTHER back, which I would consider to be a