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Lochac-hist-msg – 9/3/11

 

History and descriptions of the SCA kingdom of Lochac. (Australia)

 

NOTE: See also the files: SCA-hist3-msg, placenames-msg, child-stories-msg, SCA-stories3-msg, Hst-SCA-Fence-art, border-stories-msg, you-know-msg, border-stories-msg, sprd-out-grps-msg.

 

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NOTICE -

 

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

 

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

 

I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.

 

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.

 

Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

 

Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: ansteorra at eden.com (7/14/95)

To: ansteorra at eden.com

Subject: Lochac

 

| I'm glad you stopped lurking, Etienne. Tell us all about Lochac.

|

| Kein MacEwan

 

Well Kein, you asked for it.  As some of you know, I moved down here about

1 1/2 years ago and promptly found the local SCA dance practice (surprise,

surprise).

 

The SCA in Lochac began about 15 years ago when a lady went to the States on

vacation and went to an event.  She fell in love with the idea and promptly

got people involved upon her return, armed with a copy of the Known World

Handbook and an incredible amount of energy.  They started up the Society

for the Current Middle Ages and formed the Kingdom of Cumberland, since that

is what one did, they thought.  After a while, the group joined the SCA and

became a barony of the society, rather than any kingdom, with the proviso that

a kingdom would be chosen at some point.

 

At this time, our heroine, now named Rowan Peregrynne, travels to the U.S. to

go kingdom shopping.  She visited I believe 4 kingdoms, including Ansteorra

and the West, and still remembers the people in Ansteorra from that trip.  She

decided against Ansteorra because it was still too young a kingdom at the time,

and one of the others (which shall remain mercifully nameless) because the

king decided to parade around in his neon biker shorts.  She chose the West

and Lochac has been a part of it ever since.  I don't know when it became

a Principality, but it probably has been for at least 10 years, since there

are a lot more people who are Viscounts and Viscountesses than who used to

be Viceroys.

 

A brief interlude in the history, for those of you who are still awake.  

Rowan herself is a very interesting character (maybe there is something in

the name).  Her first award from anyone in the SCA was a Pelican, which I

believe is unmatched.

 

The first group started out in Sydney, which is currently the Barony of Rowany,

cunningly named after Rowan, and there are now Baronies in the capital city

of every state (Adelaide, Brisbane, Hobart, Perth, Melbourne) and in Canberra.

This means that the Prince & Princess get to travel around quite a bit in

their reign, since they feel it is their duty to get to events for some reason

(For those of you that don't have a feel for the size, Australia is as big

as the lower 48 states).  

 

There are a few consequences of this size.  If one wants to go to many events,

one travels an awful lot.  We are lucky in Rowany to have 3 other groups within

3 hours drive, but most have about 1 other group in 6-8 hours drive.

 

This leads to the question that I am sure everyone is interested in:

 

               What is the SCA like in Lochac?  

 

There is of course more than one answer.  Several people from the West have

come over here and gone back saying that they do it correctly in Lochac.  In

many ways, I think they are correct.  Because of its origin, it never went

through the "growing pains" of the rest of the society, trying to identify

what the goals are.  The KWH says that it is historical recreation, so that's

what was done.  I haven't seen any chain mail bikinis, bunny fur, elf ears,

or vampire teeth that are seen in many places (although Ansteorra is also

largely free of that).  The level of interest in accurate historical recreation

for the average person is quite impressive, and the West Kingdom has complained

several times that the standard for Laurels is too high.  To give an example,

I thought I actually knew a bit about dance in the European Renaissance before

I came here.  At one of my first events I meet 5 people who have done serious

research in the subject, including learning Italian to translate the 15th and

16th century masters, and sit around and have very heated scholarly discussions

on all sorts of details.  They lost me in the first couple of minutes, but

I am slowly learning.

 

Looking at it from another perspective, it's not as good.  This view is

mainly in the martial arts.  To take the armoured combat (was that the

agreed term?) first, there are few knights here that would be able to match

up against the average squire in Ansteorra on the list field, and none

who would be top contenders in a crown tournament (although there is the

knight which went over to vacation in Europe and became Drachenwald's first

king, but he decided to stay there - Sir Elfin, who I am sure some of you

have met).  In fact, all the best fighters have trained at one point or

another in the States.  I have a couple theories about this.  First is the

population density.  I would guess that a fighter in Ansteorra could go

to about 30 tournaments a year if he wanted to travel a bit.  Here it is

more like 10.  At these 10 tournaments you would meet a much smaller number

of different fighters, so new ideas and techniques aren't generated as quickly.

Also, the oldest fighters here have been fighting for only about half as

long as in the States, so there simply hasn't been the time for all the

techniques to develop.

 

If Ansteorra is known for its fencers, then Lochac is known for the archers.

About the same proportion of people here do combat archery as do fencing there,

which makes for very different tactics in wars from what I understand,

especially since the arrows are real, with blunts on the end, so that they

are actually shot with some speed and accuracy.  There are many archers here

that want to go to Pennsic just to take on the Calontir shield wall, and may

just do that at Thirtieth Year next year.

 

Fencing is just getting started here.  We use fibreglass rapiers instead

of foils and epees and are still struggling for recognition from the general

populace for a number of reasons.  Luckily D'Gaunt and Muirghein, our current

P&P are all in favour of the sport and have chosen the Princess' Guard

from the fencers and have created an award similar in intent to the Queen's

Rapier. So, we are getting there.  I have also been getting people interested

in using the theatrical rapier blades when and if they are approved by the

powers that be (possibly when Lochac becomes a kingdom), but nobody is very

interested in the lighter blades because it doesn't engender authentic

recreation, as the argument goes (ideas and thoughts on the matter welcome).

 

So the real answer is that it's recognisably the same game that you know and

love but with a few differences.  They still have the oath of fealty lifted

straight out of Lord of the Rings (To do and to let be, to speak and to be

silent... until my lord release me, death take me, or the world end) that I

would like to see go away and the regalia all looks reasonably similar, but

they say Huzzah instead of Vivat and all the peers swear fealty to the crown.

 

Rowany Festival.  I mentioned it before, but I have to mention it again.  The

2 festivals I have been to are simply the best events I have attended.

Anywhere. I have been to events in 4 different kingdoms now and nothing can

compare to it (although I have to support Kein's endorsement of the Gulf

Wars - way cool event).  It is held on a private farm, and the owners let us

have permanent use of the site in exchange for a minimal fee (I think about

$2 per person) plus keeping the tea tree at bay, which we do clearing out

campsites each year.  We have built showers (army style showers with hot

water), privies and a tavern, although the tavern blew down last year during

a major storm and needs to be replaced (we are still trying to get the

manufacturers to reimuburse us, but it wasn't during festival).  The entire

site is forest and meadows, which provides lots of shade for camping and lots

of space for battles.  Parking is across the creek from the actual site, right

by the entrance and no cars are allowed on site for the event.  There is a

market day, a fighter auction tournament (the King of the West went for over

$300 this year - he thought everyone was crazy), lots of classes, 2 restaurants,

a baker who delivers bread to the campsites every morning (and has a laurel in

it!), and a few other artisans who set up shop for the duration of the event.

Mistress Rowan organises a period encampment every year (those of you who

are trying to come up with medieval names for things can give suggestions

since they don't like Enchanted Ground since it doesn't sound medieval) which

is a great place to go visit and has some 20 people camping there, right off

the list field.  A couple of problems: dancing has to be held outdoors, there

being no hall, and it isn't long enough.  I have been trying to convince

the baroness that it should be a week long event, just like Pennsic, and it

may yet become one.  Oh yeah, no fire ants, although the event has been

known to get, shall we say, wet on occasion, which makes the tavernkeeper

very happy since people drink lots more cider.

 

One last thing about Rowany Festival.  Every year they have a Sunshade Lounging

Competition. Last year it was won by 4 ladies who researched and built a

16th century wooden bathtub for 4 and lounged in it in their chemises under

the sunshade.  To complete the decadence, they had a minstrel serenading them,

culinary treats, rose petals in the bath water, and they were playing cards.

Sir John Theophilus (sp?) from the West came over to ask the ladies for a

drink of the water to inspire him to victory in the Fighter Auction Tournament

that day.

 

Anyone still paying attention?  Like I said, come down and see for yourself,

everyone is most welcome.

 

In service, somewhat verbosely,

 

Etienne d'Yverdon

member of the Princess' Escort

 

 

Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 08:40:14 +1100

From: "Phillippa Venn-Brown" <p.vbrown at tsc.nsw.edu.au>

Subject: Re: SC - Re: Customs

 

Lochac is quite heavy/strong on "theatre" (by this I do not mean

Shakespeare, although we enjoy plays and drama and farce just as much as

anybody). The "theatre" I refer to is overall presentation, the total feel

of the event.

 

Many local groups do themed feasts in our principality e.g. Manzikert (A

Byzantine feast hosted by Dismal Fogs which is a predominantly Varangian

and Byzantine flavoured shire), William Marshall (a 12th century

event/feast by the Barony of Stormhold) etc.

 

All our major events such as Principality Investitures have a theme, be it

15th German, mid-16th century Italian, Viking etc. Often the theme reflects

the interests of the hosting group or the personae of the Lord and Lady of

Lochac who will be invested at the event, as a mark of respect. This allows

for consistency through food, hall decoration, entertainment, presentation

etc. It also allows the participants to experience as fully as they wish, a

total feasting experience of a high court event of that period. Often the

colours chosen are part of the hosting group's device and as such are

usually destined to be reused as part of group gear (wall hangings, hospit.

gear, etc.). This also puts on a good dispaly for newcomers and visitors.

 

While people might be encouraged to come garbed to match, there is no

coercion to match, No one is refused the right to hang personal banners

"because they don't match the theme" nor to add to the table decorations to

suit their own playing of the game. However some enjoy the chance to try

out a new style which is different from their normal persona and I know

many gentles here who have one or more outfits which are not of their

regular wardrobe. My persona is late fifteenth/early sixteenth century

northern Italian but my wardrobe also contains 16th c. German, 15th c.

Swiss, Saxon, late Norman, Turkish and (dare I say) Cavalier. All of these

pieces were trial outfits when I was toying with persona change or just

wanted to try a new style. A themed feastis a great excuse when your

wardrobe is already brimming with your usual garb.

 

Some events, like Manzikert, exact a forfeit if you choose not to wear

Byzantine or Varangian, you are asked to entertain, but it is all in good

fun and people who are truly uncomfortable with the idea of entertaining

are not forced to do so.

 

Speaking personally, I have never been forced to attend an event in theme

nor ostracised or made uncomfortable because I don't have, or choose not to

have, garb that matches the theme of the event. However, having been on the

stewarding team for several principality events in charge of subtleties or

entertainment or both, I find it much easier if there is a theme to match

it to.

 

Filippa Ginevra

 

 

From: zebee at zip.com.au (Zebee Johnstone)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Kingdom of Lochac? Re: Principality to Kingdom transitions

Date: 31 May 2000 10:39:35 GMT

Organization: Pacific Internet (Australia)

 

In rec.org.sca on Tue, 30 May 2000 21:44:12 -0800

Mike Adams <abrigon at yahoo.com> wrote:

>I wonder if the vote for Kingdom was a reason for the changes in rules

>on fencing in the west? I know one of the bones of contension for Lochac

>was that West was not into Fencing, while Lochac is a hot bed of

>Fencers.

 

Well... the anger in Lochac over the West's attitude to combat

archery got the Kingdom push really going a couple of years ago.  Afer

that got sorted it simmered some, then the fencing ban got people

angry again.

 

Various people all over the Kingdom worked to get rules sorted that

were acceptable, Central, Lochac, Oertha.

 

What the various contrmps did I think was get people in Lochac into the

mood to make their own decisions rather than be dictated to by people

a very long way away who just don't do things the way we do.

 

Silfren

 

 

Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2001 05:45:22 -0000

From: "Susan Laing" <gleep001 at hotmail.com>

Subject: SC - Re: Serving Game at Feasts...

 

Don't know if this bears relevance on your question, but some parts here

(Lochac : Australia) we have a tradition of courtesy when planning to serve

Vension at feasts - a communiation requesting permission to serve "The Royal

Game" is sent to the Reigning Prince & Princess (I haven't heard of *any*

instance where they've refused permission)

 

It probably developed from the Royal Game Preserve perogatives from the

English Middle ages and while not universally followed it's a tradition in

the Barony of River Haven and a few other areas across Australia

 

Could your local group have heard some garbled tale of this (either occuring

now OR in history) and decided that "ALL GAME" are therefore forbidden to

the rank and file members??

 

Mari

 

 

From: Burke McCrory [burkemc at cox.net]

Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 11:51 PM

To: ansteorra at ansteorra.org

Subject: [Ansteorra] Kingdom of Lochac

 

This was posted to the SCA wide Pelicans list and I thought all would like

to see it.

 

Sir Burke

 

>Good Gentles All -

>I take pride in telling you that the Kingdom of Lochac came into existence

>this weekend past (July 6th) and the King Alfar and Queen Elspeth proudly

>lead us as we join the other Laurel Kingdoms of the Known World.

>An emotional (and long) Court saw King Jade and Queen Megan of the West

>release the Peerages from their oaths of fealty, take back the coronets of

>the landed Barons and Baroness of Lochac, and finally Prince Gawain and

>Princess Yve, last of their lineage, handed back to Their Majesties the

>lands of Lochac. Then Jade and Megan, King and Queen of the West, Prince

>and Princess of Lochac and holders of all the lands of Lochac made Their

>way from the hall for the final time as our undoubted King and Queen in an

>emotion filled procession.

>Later that day Jade and Megan proclaimed the Kingdom of Lochac, witnessed

>by Their Majesties of Ansteorra and the Society Seneschal and Crown Sir Alfar

>of Attica as first King of Lochac. King Alfar then Crowned his lady Elspeth

>as Queen of Lochac, gave back the coronets and lands to the Barons and

>Baroness, and took fealty form the Peers of the new Kingdom. As well,

>those of us Peers of Lochac who so wished we able to swear fealty and

>friendship back to the West Kingdom. A wonderful touch as many of us had

>been in a great dilemma over this. The oath is in all ways subservient to

>our fealty to Lochac and in no way sets up any form of conflict.

>The next day the first Peer of Lochac was created - a Laurel, Master

>Llewellyn(sp) formally of Caid (New Zealand, unsure which group). The first

>Pelican of Lochac will be created in several months in his home group.

>ciaran faolchara

>Barony of Ynys Fawr

>Kingdom of Lochac!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: Zebee Johnstone <zebee at zip.com.au>

Subject: Re: Do sheet walls still make Westerners boggle?

Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 22:19:46 GMT

Organization: Pacific Internet (Australia)

 

In rec.org.sca on Thu, 5 Aug 2004 21:51:01 GMT

Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt at kithrup.com> wrote:

> There is also nothing like the land allocation before the fact

> that Pennsic does, because we camp at many different sites and

> the tourneymasters generally get access to it only a few hours

> before the populace starts arriving (e.g., Friday noon and 3 pm

> respectively).

 

IN Lochac, the camping camping events (as distinct from boyscout camps

with dorms) I've been to have been sometimes one and sometimes the other.

 

At Festival, it's a bit like Pennsic, in that you join a camping group

and that group's allocated an area.  It's usually the same place year to

year, although it's fluid at the moment because the new site is still

being sorted.  Walls are uncommon, but the way things are laid out at

each site sometimes means people don't *realise* they are walking through

someone's site.  Mostly it's obvious because the roads are marked with

tape on poles, and it's clear where to go.

 

At other events, it's usually "camping's over there" and a wave of the

hand. That's cos they are small enough that it really doesn't matter.

terrain leads to natural groupings or lanes as it does at Mt Crawford,

If the then that's what happens.  Otherwise you sit where it looks good,

and as there's probably only 10-20 tents, then there's probably no

"campsites". Especially true of Innilgard events where it's all done

communally and the main social area's the Baronial marquee, the main

cooking area's the Baronial cooking tent with all it's kit and so on.

 

Most camping events are held in the same place year to year because

those places are good to hold such events at.  So once you find a good

one, you stick to it.  Festival's a special case, it has contracts.

Others just have tradition...

 

Silfren

 

 

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 10:40:02 +1000

From: Paul Sleigh <bat at flurf.net>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Detailed History of Lochac

To: condotierri_au at yahoo.com.au,    "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing

        list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

<<< I was wondeing, does anyone have access to a detailed history of Lochac? >>>

 

Baron Hrolf is/was Lochac Historian, and can recite most of it from

memory. Especially the rude bits.

 

<<< I need something with dates, names, significant events, when peerages were made and the dates of reigns. >>>

 

Canon Lore has a lot of that: http://www.sca.org.au/canon/.

 

 

: Bat :

 

 

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 09:39:48 +0800 (WST)

From: lenehan at our.net.au

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Detailed History of Lochac

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

> I was wondeing, does anyone have access to a detailed history of Lochac?

 

<< Baron Hrolf is/was Lochac Historian, and can recite most of it from

memory. Especially the rude bits. >>

 

> I need something with dates, names, significant events, when peerages

> were made and the dates of reigns.

 

<< Canon Lore has a lot of that: http://www.sca.org.au/canon/.

 

: Bat : >>

 

Tut tut Bat, really :)

 

Truth to tell Hrolf is difficult to pin down long enough to get that stuff

these days. Rarely emails even! Work hours are abominable but at least we

have work! I will draw his attention to the request, we may get a bite.

 

However, there IS a history written, and it was handed off to the

Historian after Hrolf, but I forget who that was, sorry. We had a copy of

almost every newsletter that was published and we sent that off too I

think. For really early stuff, you need to refer to the newsletter called

Runes. Maybe the office of Kingdom Chronicler might have an idea where all

that is stored?

 

I agree with Bat, that Canon Lore is the main place for Peerage dates etc.

You will find Rowan's and my Laurels were same day dates. It was 1984, I

was heavily pregnant with our first, and King William and Queen Joanne

gave me my medallion passing it across the loungeroom at our house in

Numeralla (a tiny country town 10 mins out of Cooma in NSW)! The feast

where it was announced in Court (the following weekend) was the Harvest

Feast held in Rowany two weeks before Festival. I think Canon Lore will

also be good for Crown & Coronet dates too.

 

Our Sarah was the second child born into Lochac. The first was Mehitabel

du Chat's and Warren Nichols (Sorry, I forget his SCA name) and he is

Jamie Nichols. I doubt you will find that in our Histories, so there's a

snippet previously unpublished, to my knowledge.

 

Dates are harder to do than rude stories.

 

Cheers,

Maddie

 

 

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 15:21:06 +0800

From: "D'gaunt" <pfryer at iinet.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Detailed History of Lochac

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

The New groups package has a basic timeline of Lochac history eg

 

ASXV -XVII November, 1980-January, 1983: The first event of the SCMA

(Society of the Current Middle Ages)

in the then, Kingdom of Cumberland, is held. As the Kingdom of Cumberland the local groups of the Barony

 

of Rowany, Aneala and Innilgard are established. During this time, the group decides to join with the SCA

 

and Cumberland is renamed Lochac. While establishing links with the SCA, Rowan Peregrinne, (after whom the Barony of Rowany is named) is inducted into the Order of the Pelican, as Lochac's first Peer. Festival is established at the rural property "Fairholme Park", belonging to the parents of Balrog (Peter Bismire).

 

ASXVII January 1983: Lochac becomes a Crown Principality in the Kingdom of the West. Rowan Peregrinne continues as Baroness of Rowany.

 

April 1984: Madelaine de Bourgogne is inducted as the first Laurel in

Lochac. Later that month Rowan is

 

also inducted into the Order of the Laurel, becoming Lochac's first double Peer.

 

Peter

 

 

Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 14:40:03 +0930

From: Margareta Nicholas <viscountess at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] How did crown tourneys and titles given

        therewith work before we were a kingdom?

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

This is a good place for facts and figures on the Principality.

http://www.calliglorify.com/scaroyalty/lineage.cgi?TYPE=line&;VALUE=Lochac&SPEC=Principality

 

This is a good place to get a sense of the history of Lochac

http://www.sca.org.au/seneschal/d.php/SCA+2+History+of+Lochac.pdf

 

Ingerith, former Princess

 

 

Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 14:13:32 +1000

From: Paul Sleigh <bat at flurf.net>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Crown Principality?

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

For all practical purposes, a Crown Principality is just like a

Principality, except it's ruled by a Viceroy and Vicereine, who by

tradition are given court baronies when they step down rather than

Viscounties. The V&V have fewer powers as regards the giving out of

awards and making of laws.

 

From memory (this is before my time somewhat) Lochac grew out of the

West, which has three four-month reigns a year, but initially decided to

have two six-month reigns a year.  I believe the investitures were

Midwinter and Twelfth Night, and the viceregal (later coronet) tourneys

were held at Rowany Festival and Spring Coronet (also called September

Coronet). After a while -- we were only a Crown Principality for a

couple of years, I believe; Canon Lore will have the exact dates -- we

became a principality, and also went over to a system with three

principality events a year, called Twelfth Night, May Coronet and

September (or Spring) Coronet.  These had investitures on the Saturday

and the tourney to choose the heirs on the Sunday.  Eventually we went

to the current system of two coronets and two tourneys, spaced three

months or so apart, which we kept when we went Kingdom.

 

Surely there are old farts around who can remember in more detail!

 

: Bat :

 

 

Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:38:17 +0800 (WST)

From: lenehan at our.net.au

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Crown Principality?

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

Ahh geez Batty there's a lot of water's gone under the bridge since then!!

 

I tend to get the V&V and P&P names mixed up; to me they were always P&P

because that's the way we treated Them most of the time. Maybe if Hrolf

has a bit of time he can respond to this, but it should be all listed in

the Lochac History files. After all, Hrolf was the first Lochac Historian

and he would have had that info nicely detailed when he handed it on. So I

suggest that's the place to start, in the Historian's earliest files.

 

Hehe I do recall that the West gave Lochac a proclaimation which had to be

read out aloud at EVERY Viceregal tourney. It was awfully long, and

scrolled in a roll which when fully opened was about 6xA4 sheets (not sure

if typed or calligraphed) glued end to end. They did it to us purposefully

so we would have a desire to ditch the thing, and to do that we had to

become a full Principality.

 

I think Catherine and Brusi might have been V&V but that would have been

close to the end of that period. I also think Hugh and (Tina Bean) were

V&V after James and Olwyn. We were busy with babies and living in Cooma so

not in the thick of everything that happened in the baronies, and it gets

a bit fuzzy remembering 28 years ago, so my meanderings here could be very

wrong. Poor old me.....

 

Maddie

 

 

Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:50:52 +1000

From: "Melina Hall" <melinahall at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Crown Principality?

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

For our first coronation, we had written a history of the Rulers of Lochac

in the style of a Norse poem, which was read aloud as we processed, & which

I believe has been added to for each reign.

 

I think Katherine Kerr is the caretaker of the saga? It listed all V&Vs,

P&Ps & K&Qs in order, & said something about them.

 

It must be on a website somewhere?

 

Asa

 

 

Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 19:49:01 +1200

From: Clare Baldock <clare at orcon.net.nz>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Grant and Census Committees

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

On 13/08/2009, at 13:11 , Katherine Davies wrote:

<<< Kingdoms not derived from the West don't tend to

use "Eric" for "list field". (Was it ever used in the Crescent Isles?

Anyone?) >>>

 

Yes it was but it wasn't difficult to replace it with lists field  

(although I still find myself slipping occasionally). But of course  

the Crescent Isles were derived from the West.

 

Eleyne

 

 

Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 21:12:14 +1200

From: Al Muckart <silver at where.else.net.nz>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Grant and Census Committees

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

On 13/08/2009, at 7:49 PM, Clare Baldock wrote:

<<< Yes it was but it wasn't difficult to replace it with lists field

(although I still find myself slipping occasionally). But of course

the Crescent Isles were derived from the West. >>>

 

I'm assuming that last sentence is a typo. The Crescent Isles were  

grandchildren of the West, having been under the wing of Caid.

 

"Eric" was pretty widespread here when I first started, but has  

steadily been replaced with "list field" or "lists" (which is my  

personal preference).

--

Alasdair Muckart | William de Wyke | http://wherearetheelves.blogspot.com

 

 

Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 22:20:00 +1200

From: Clare Baldock <clare at orcon.net.nz>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Grant and Census Committees

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

On 13/08/2009, at 21:12 , Al Muckart wrote:

 

On 13/08/2009, at 7:49 PM, Clare Baldock wrote:

Yes it was but it wasn't difficult to replace it with lists field

(although I still find myself slipping occasionally). But of course

the Crescent Isles were derived from the West.

 

<<< I'm assuming that last sentence is a typo. The Crescent Isles were

grandchildren of the West, having been under the wing of Caid. >>>

 

Well it wasn't a typo, but obviously my take on "derived" and yours  

differ. NZ was a part of Caid. Caid was a child of the West therefore  

we were a part of a child of the West. Therefore we were derived from  

the West.

 

Eleyne

 

 

Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2009 09:11:37 +1000

From: "M. Lenehan" <lenehan at our.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Kingdom/regional differences

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

Hmm Kingdom of word v book; I think this is a neat simplification, however,

our information about the SCA in the first year of Rowany (from which the

rest of Australia-Lochac sprang) was almost entirely out of the Known World

Handbook. You know - no web, no PCs beyond a simple thing run off a cassett

tape, no centralisation of information, and Tournaments Illuminated became

available much later! In as much as Caid derived from the West, their

cultural difference -as I understood it- is about the Peerage and

relationship with their Crown; that the Peers ratified any decision from

Crown before it became law, as opposed to the Western rite, King's word is

law.

 

Even though Caid is West Coast, I always thought that their methodology on

decision making had been followed by the East Coast Kingdoms (I'm probably

over-simplifying here) as they wanted to be different from the West. I have

not personally visited these Kingdoms to ask or to look up their history, so

I could be wrongly informed.

 

A lot of our decision making was about getting to the 'nub' of what the SCA

meant to us, and being as close to the original intent (as we understood it

from the KWH) as possible. When Artos and Rowan and Christia went Kingdom

shopping, that was close to their mandate, as well as to look for friendship

and ease of association. The West seemed to have what we wanted, was the

most responsive at the time, and some genuine people were inspired by the

thought of the SCA springing up all by itself in Australia. The Known World

Handbook was our first inspiration.

 

I have copies of several editions of the KWH, including a copy of the

edition we had in 1980, and I don't remember ever getting the impression of

the cultural 'by committee' emphasis from it at all. So I would be cautious

about attributing the difference between the Western and Eastern rites to

the KWH. If we really want to understand the differences in the Kingdoms,

looking at their history of derivation would be informative. I do believe

that one or two SF conventions had a lot to do with the spread of the SCA,

more so than the Kingdom of the West. Kingdom creation seems to have a

domino history (A begat B begat C etc) with each new Kingdom doing it a bit

differently, sometimes out of disillusionment, sometimes just because.

 

Oh, and Stephan, NZ and Australia are separated by a bit of water and

Kingdom of origin, but you could attribute NZ to being a region

geographically, and Aust. being made of several regional areas. None of

which are Principalities, and none of which are formally recognised as

'regions'.

 

Cheers,

Maddie

 

----- Original Message -----

From: "Stefan li Rous" <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>

 

What do you see as meaningful differences between Caid and the West?

Between Lochac and either of them? Between Australia and New Zealand?

(Sorry I don't know if these last two are different principalities/

regions or not).

 

Stefan

 

 

Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2009 21:02:14 +1100

From: Paul Sleigh <bat at flurf.net>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] The Shambles - in the stone!

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

Estel Talroval wrote:

<<< So is that how these Shambles got their name? >>>

 

Yes. Balrog, aka Peter Bismire (son of the owners of the original

Festival site), came up with the name. The rec.org.sca newsgroup, which

served a similar purpose for the SCA as a whole back when people knew

what Usenet was, used to be called The Rialto, after a bridge in Italy

that was a meeting place for people all over that part of the world.

The Shambles in York was similar, although more rowdy and involving more

raw meat and shouting, so Balrog reckoned it was a good name.  It hung

around as a running gag for a long time, but when I was List Boss I

promoted the name pretty widely, and other people took it up and now

it's pretty ubiquitous.

 

History: it's not just for Laurels!

 

: Bat :

 

 

Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2009 21:10:42 +1100

From: "Bruce S. R. Lee" <bsrlee2 at pacific.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] The Shambles - in the stone!

To: "The Shambles, the SCA Lochac mailing list" <lochac at sca.org.au>

 

<<< So is that how these Shambles got their name?

Estel / Theophilus >>>

 

A 'shambles' is a slaughter house, so a street called ' The Shambles'

was probably where the slaughter houses & whole carcass butchers were

situated - most Medieval cities had restrictions on where various

noxious trades could be carried on, such as tanneries, horn work, pig

(and other animal) farming. More with a view to reducing the

olfactory & visual pollution for the 'better class' of resident than

any real concept of hygiene, and for trades like blacksmithing &

pottery firing - managing fire risks.

 

Brusi of Orkney

Rowany

 

 

Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 13:02:23 +1300

From: Massaria da Cortona <massaria at gmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] Order of the Cross of Lochac

To: lochac at sca.org.au

 

Oswyn asked:

"But may I ask in ignorance and curiosity, is this a new Order of the

Cross of Lochac, given for something different, or has the one we've

been giving out to people for some time just got the green light?"

 

This was formerly known as the Order of the Southern Cross. That name

was unregisterable and so it was changed to the Order of the Cross of

Lochac several years agao and then we made several attempts at

registeration each time getting knocked back for conflict. I finally

sorted that out and got all the permissions in January this year and

but this through.

 

There has been some confusion over this in the last law revision to

include the GoA level awards as this was put in as one of the new

awards. This situation will need to be clarified but my present

understanding is that this will continue to be what was formerly the

Order of the Southern Cross and new names will be registered for the

new GoA level orders.

 

Massaria Crux

 

 

Date: Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:45:22 +1300

From: Antonia Calvo <ladyadele at paradise.net.nz>

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] An Event Without a Feast,  was Cookery book at Longleat House?

 

Johnnae replied:

<<< You must understand that major events, even events like Crowns

and Coronations, routinely run without feasts in this kingdom.

Some offer hotel catered banquets that don't sell out and get canceled.

Others never plan a feast to start with.

Even the 40th ran with just lunch taverns. >>>

 

lilinah at earthlink.net wrote:

<<< Well, out here in The West, there are NO Kingdom level events

guaranteed to have a feast. >>>

 

Wow.

 

Here in Lochac, we usually have four Kingdom feasts per year (ie 2x

Crowns + 2x Coronations).  They don't strictly speaking *have* to have

feasts, but having no feast would be quite unusual (and I'm not sure

it's been done in recent years).

--

Antonia di Benedetto Calvo

 

 

Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 15:37:45 +1100

From: Catherine Connor <paladin_c55 at hotmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] Romance

To: <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

Silfren wrote:-

<<< I'm still a believer in the Romantic. >>>

 

Here Here!!

 

If you have read much by some of our Founders- Marian Zimmer Bradley, Poul Anderson et al, I think you will agree that they had Romantic ideals, and that's why they started the SCA.

 

Here in Australia the SCA was born out of a group of Tolkein Society, Science Fiction Foundation and War Gaming bods. We certainly were inspired by Romantic ideals- the history came later. I had actually studied "Medieval History " at Sydney Uni, but JRR Tolkein was by FAR a bigger influence. I wanted to live in his world.

 

To me a Knight is a person of high ideals, well rounded and educated, able to fight well, dance beautifully, converse on a variety of topics, and defend those who are unable to defend themselves. I would like to dream that one day all our knights will aspire to those ideals.

 

Dream the Dream

Catherine

 

 

Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 22:22:21 +1100

From: Donald Campbell <actrealdon at hotmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] Google Map of Lochac

To: Lochac Mailing List <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

I have created a Google Map of Lochac, for fun, interest and to give the populace a better grasp of where each branch is within the Kingdom. It shows all the territorial branches within the Kingdom (i.e. Baronies, Shires and Cantons) based on the official borders as set by the Kingdom Seneschal in accordance with Corpora.

 

On the Continent, branch borders are determined by postcode and I have used the latest publicly available postcode maps from Australia Post.

 

In the Crescent Isles, branch borders are determined by telephone area code. I have made my best attempt at mapping the extent of each area code, but I would be happy to receive more accurate data.

 

This map is not an official Kingdom document. It is purely for interest and displays official branch borders for membership purposes. As always, gentles may attend events and meetings anywhere in the Kingdom and be officers for any branch, regardless of their "official" branch.

 

To access the Google Map of Lochac:

1. Go to http://maps.google.com

2. Enter into the search box

http://sites.google.com/site/actreal/files/Lochac-BaroniesandShires.kml

(on one line, no spaces) and press Enter.

3. The entire map of Lochac with baronies and shires marked should be displayed.

 

Frequently Asked Questions

 

Q: I think my residence is marked in the wrong branch?

A: Please contact me offlist to discuss.

 

Q: Why is there a blank area in the North Island of New Zealand?

A: The blank area, corresponding to telephone area code (06), is Crown land and is not allocated to any branch. As to the history of this, please contact a friendly Crescent Islander for a more accurate story than you'll get from me.

 

Q: Why aren't Colleges shown?

A: Because they don't have official territory and because I didn't think to include them until I wrote this question. Stay tuned for the next release which will have pretty coloured drawing pins marking each College.

 

Q: Why is my branch coloured in *that* colour?

A: Because I chose that colour at random/from the branch arms/to be different to other nearby branches.

 

Any other comments, suggestions, queries or corrections can be sent to me offlist.

 

Feel free to share this message on local lists.

 

Domhnall na Moicheirghe

 

 

Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 12:06:58 +1100

From: Tina Bean <tinofbeans001 at gmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] [announce] Changes to the Current AoA system

To: announce at lochac.sca.org

 

Over the last few years a new system was introduced to Lochac for those who

receive their AoA. Unfortunately this has proved a strain on the College of

Scribes due to the number of ?Instant AoA's? that have needed to be painted,

and it has meant a large increase in the backlog of other scrolls being done

by the College. At this stage it is difficult for the College to continue to

provide the same ?Instant AoA? scrolls that we are producing and also

continue to complete some of the many scrolls that are on the current

backlog. So we would like to look at possible changes to the system that

would still give AoA recipients a quality document when they first receive

their AoA but will also decrease the workload for the College of Scribes.

This will enable us to continue to give people the wonderful scrolls they

still receive for other awards and something effective, period and memorable

when they receive their AoA.

 

The proposed new system we would like to introduce is one of an AoA Writ.

The Writ will be done in a period document style that will be tailored for

each Reign, similar to the current instant AoA scrolls. However these Writs

will have no additional illumination that will need to be done on them. Each

of the Writs will be signed by the King and Queen and sealed with the

College of Scribes Seal. They will also have the Recipients name on them.

 

The Writ will be done on good quality paper, similar or better than the

paper the current ?Instant AoA's? are done on. They will be researched and

will come in the form of a folded document that can be unfolded and read in

Court. Each document will have a seal in green wax, again a period practise.

These documents are meant to be part of the theatre of court and can be

opened and read out loud as they often were done in period.

 

In the Writ the recipient will be charged with the responsibility of

getting their name and device Registered. Once this is done the recipient

will be able to request to go onto the College of Scribes Backlog and

receive a full AoA with their name and device. This will be done through an

online database through which the recipient will also be able to ask for a

specific period or style of AoA if they have a preference.

 

We hope that this proposed system will give recipients the best of both

worlds, something special and original from each reign, a document that is

more period than the current system and also the option of getting a full

AoA with their name and device when they register their name and device.

 

With the introduction of this proposed new system the college will be able

to free up scribes for painting more scrolls and we hope to be able to speed

up getting other scrolls on the backlog out to other recipients.

 

The College of Scribes would like to encourage comments and discussion

about the proposed new system.

 

Depending on comment from the Populace of Lochac we hope to introduce the

proposed system during the Reign after the current one.

 

If you have an interest in the scribal arts and would like to help decrease

the current backlog of scrolls. Please contact me.

 

Caristiona nic Beathain

Provost of Scribes

provost at lochac.sca.org

 

 

Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 16:17:02 +1000

From: Braddon Giles <braddongiles at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] [announce] Changes to the Current AoA system

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

2010/1/25 Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>:

<<< One question though. Why is this sealed with the seal of the College of

Scribes rather than an (the?) official kingdom seal? Is there no official

seal? Or is there some protocol reason to use a guild rather than a kingdom

seal for what I thought was an official/(legal?) award.

 

Stefan >>>

 

I'm guessing that Mistress Caristiona actually means the Great Seal of

Lochac. While technically the property of the Crown and entrusted by

Them into the hands of the Crux Australis Herald, in reality the Great

Seal usually resides with the Scribes who need to use it for their

work.

 

The Great Seal itself is a beautiful piece of metalwork, and it was

donated to us from the West Kingdom College of Heralds on the

occaision of our going Kingdom. A lovely thing to have a look at, if

you get the chance.

 

Giles Leabrook

 

 

Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 18:24:04 +1100

From: Tina Bean <tinofbeans001 at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] [announce] Changes to the Current AoA system

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

Actually no, I don't mean the Great Seal of Lochac. We decided that as this

is a totally different document we should do the period practise of using

different seals for different departments and also using the different

coloured wax, in this case a common colour that was used in period- green.

We wanted to differentiate as much as possible between the Writ and the

eventual AoA document a person gets if they decide to register their name

and device, but we wanted to use period practise for as many aspects of the

Writ as possible So this was one effective way of doing that.

 

In addition we made this decision for purely practical reasons to. We need

to have a situation where we can have seals held by all the Wardens and by

the King and Queen so that if Writs are needed in different area's and can

not be obtained in a hurry from the Provost everyone can still get their

Writ. They can be printed locally with a local scribe doing the calligraphy

and the King and Queen or the local Warden can make the seals if need be.

This is also a period practise. One of the failings of the current system is

if the K&Q run out of seals or AoA's then the recipient gets nothing and in

many cases they have been lost in the system and never received their

scroll. By having multiple people able to make seals and print the Writ's

but with a local person who can over see quality we can minimise the chances

of this happening.

 

Caristiona

 

2010/1/25 Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>:

<<< One question though. Why is this sealed with the seal of the College of

Scribes rather than an (the?) official kingdom seal? Is there no official

seal? Or is there some protocol reason to use a guild rather than a

kingdom seal for what I thought was an official/(legal?) award. >>>

 

 

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 2010 11:15:00 +1100

From: Donald Campbell <actrealdon at hotmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Crown events - proposed Law change

To: Lochac Mailing List <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

<<< Events sited more than 1,000km from the Crown Tournament or

Coronation event site are granted automatic permission to conflict

with the event. >>>

 

To give everyone an idea of what the 1,000km radius means in practice, assuming the 1,000kms is measured as the crow flies. I'm considering baronies here, as the answers are almost entirely the same for nearby shires.

 

- Aneala is 1,000km from all other baronies

 

- Innilgard is 1,000km from all other baronies, except Stormhold and Politarchopolis

 

- The Crescent Isles groups are all within 1,000km of each other, but are all over 1,000km from the Continent

 

- The North is 1,000km from the South but not from Central Lochac (Rowany, Mordenvale, Politarchopolis)

 

- Stormhold is not 1,000km from Central Lochac

 

- Ynys Fawr is only just over 1,000km from Rowany, so it and Mordenvale are clear but Polit is not

 

By the looks of that list, setting the distance at 1,000km seems about right to me, although it would change slightly, if it used road distances instead. I humbly suggest the Crown consider whether it is appropriate to specify how the distance is measured in the Laws.

 

Domhnall na Moicheirghe

Cartography Deputy

 

 

Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2010 18:55:19 +1100

From: "Yseult de Lacy (Chris Robertson)"

        <yseult_de_lacy at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Has Lochac list gone down?

To: The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 5:50 PM, Braddon Giles <braddongiles at gmail.com>wrote:

>> Festival is (as it always is) 2 weeks away.

 

Marie M wrote:

< Am I mistaken? I thought Festival was in April- not March.

 

Thyri. >

 

Ah, I get to explain the "2 weeks away" thing.  Many years ago, I

commented that no matter how far in advance one knew about an event,

somehow there only ever seemed to be two days to prepare for it:  the

day when you've planned to do something for it, and the day when you

wake up and suddenly realise that the event is TOMORROW. This concept

circulated around the Barony of Rowany and elsewhere.

 

I don't know who first applied the concept  to Festival (though I'm sure

we'll all know very soon ;-) ), but it was soon accepted  that no matter

what time of year it is, next Festival is Only Two Weeks Away (being a

big event, obviously it had to have more than two days).  This appllies

until Festival is *really* only two weeks away, whereupon there are

instantly Only Two Days to Festival.

 

--Yseult the bereaved

 

 

Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 19:16:48 +1000

From: "Brett Hollindale" <agro at powerup.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Banned From Lochac

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

With respect to archery neither of you has it quite right and as this is a

very touchy subject in Lochac I'll try to give the accurate info...

 

Lochac archery rules do indeed differ from the rest of the known world in a

couple of very fundamental respects.

 

1. We (Lochac) allow non contact participants.  Plumed combatants are a

Lochac only phenomenon.  This really has to be stressed with any visitors

from overseas because it is SO different and potentially quite dangerous.

 

2. We (Lochac) allow wooden arrows and require mesh.  Wooden shafted arrows

are banned in the Marshal's Handbook.  With arrows other than those used in

Lochac, blunts are of sufficient diameter that they cannot penetrate a legal

visor and arrows are equipped with Anti Bounce Devices (ABD's) that prevent

the nock end of the arrow from entering legal visors.

 

 

We have (perhaps *had*) a couple of exemptions for certain siege weapons - I

am not up to date in this area...

 

As I understand it, our armour standards are now consistant with Society

minimums world wide.

 

Agro

 

 

Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:36:17 +1100

From: "Sheridon Glenn" <huscarl98 at yahoo.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] May Crown - Letter of Intent

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

A couple of thoughts and one minor correction to Agro's email.

 

Berengar and Bethan were the first crowns to require prior notification to the crown. Siban and I formalized it a bit with more published date and stated formats that were acceptable.  That format has subsequently been followed.  We were the first to publish the list of combatants prior to crown so the populous would know who was contending for the Crown of Lochac.

 

Thoughts about why:  At least from my perspective

a.. Gets folks to ponder and think about it as opposed to being a last min whim.  Not as big a deal for some US based kingdoms as they can easily drive to most events...Lochac requires a bit more planning.  If someone can not get a letter to the crown it could well be an indicator that they are not organized enough :)

b.. Gives an idea of numbers expected and if they are looking low the Crown can "drum up support"

c.. Gave the crown/seneschal time to verify passports for combatant and consort...as not all of consorts attend crown and avoids potential issues.  We were able to check all but 1 passport before the tourney and verified that one on the Friday night.

d.. Up front verification of membership...and enough time to sort out any issues ahead of time with the registrar.

e.. Ask any questions the crown think might be relevant; like, what events have you been to in the past 12 months....if they say just 2 local events then you might want to consider not allowing them to fight in crown.  We did not bar anyone from entering crown.  I did however in my first reign when one of the people wanting to fight was being shipped off to basic training for the military 3 weeks after crown tourney.

f.. We were able to have all data verified and the list tree drawn up by 10am (we used a double elimination tree structure with a blind draw for the pairings)

g.. Since it gets all the potential issues out of the way it avoids any unfortunate circumstances where someone make an effort to drive several hours or fly hundreds (or thousands) of kilometers only to be disappointed when they get to the list table on the day.

h.. Ability to publish the combat and consort list to the populace prior to the tournament.

It is not perfect, but in my opinion it has merit and I recommend it to all Crowns. Since B&B 5 crowns have agreed....but probably not for all the same reasons.  :)  

 

Siridean

 

 

Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 23:15:58 +1100

From: "C Lenehan" <lenehan at our.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Banned From Lochac

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

Antarctica, well yes.  I had to get it back for Lochac from another Kingdom

who (briefly) stole it after I had appropriated it in the first place.

 

Incorporation - why we needed it, why rules made in the USA did not apply

under Australian law - why we needed a different membership structure.  That

was second time I was Chancellor I think.

 

We never had elves as a part of the game in Lochac (except for a certain

Baron who may now kill me - and officially he isn't one).  We started well

after they had been killed off.

 

There was always The Modest Proposal and its wide-ranging effects

(non-heralds may ignore the preceeding sentence).

 

You do all realise that we started out as the 'Kingdom of Cumberland' before

we were SCA don't you?

 

At one stage, back in the dim past of the Cambrian period, all Peerage

meetings were done with all three Peerages present and commenting on each

other's candidates.  The knights stopped that one eventually.

 

When we thought that we going to join Caid we used their shield standard of

the time (1lb per some number of square inches).  Made for shields that are

still alive today.

 

I never actually authorised as a fighter.  When we started one person had to

authorise everyone else and it was decided that we could not boot-strap.  So

mine was 'endorsed from afar'.

 

To tell you the truth, I think most things are over-regulated.  This is done

because litigation lawyers have forced people to have common sense

legislated for (think: 'this packet of peanuts may contain nuts').

However, making something idiot proof simply breeds a better idiot, in which

case the lawyers come in again and there are more regulations.

 

Mind you, some of these are fair enough.  Who can remember the unarmoured

box-bearers in the Little Rock War?  In that one, our common sense

(eventually) prevailed.  We started fighting with fencing masks and

broomsticks and then (when we had rattan) moved on to motor cyle helms.

Think of it as evolution in action.

 

Hrolf

You know you are ancient in Lochac terms (I say that for those from the West

who are much more venerable) when your 5 figure membership number starts

with a '1' and you have been in the SCA for more than 2/3 of the time if has

existed. It is even better when your first filk you wrote is sung back to

you at West Crown and you are told it is 'SCA Traditional'.

 

 

Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 08:36:58 +1100

From: Shayne Lynch <maindroit at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Banned

To: lochac at lochac.sca.org

 

Re Juanna and the Fencing Ban.

 

That particular ban (one of many) was primarily due to the large range

of fencing rules throughout the West Kingdom (Oertha, Lochac, Mists).

That is was Jade said at the time, and I have no reason to doubt him.

The problem was fixed by the fencers of the kingdom pulling together

to formulate an agreed standard set of rules.

 

AT THE SAME TIME, Queen Juanna detailled her dislike of rapier, and it

became the focus of discontent.  She is a nice person, she is my

friend, and she doesn't like SCA fencing.  I visited the Central West

shortly after and I didn't really like what I saw of the fencing (and

the fencing attitude) displayed over there at times.

 

If you want to get bent out of shape about fencing, I suggest the

original ban circa 1987 which described metal fencing swords as "live

steel" and deplored the (ficticious) dozens of people killed in US

high school fencing incidents.

 

Francois Guyon.

 

 

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2010 00:42:31 +1000

From: Mark Calderwood <giles at sca.org.au>

Subject: [Lochac] e-Cockatrice

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>,      althing at sca.org.nz

 

It's so rewarding to see the first issue of Cockatrice reborn coming  

together, thanks to those generous and creative gentles who have  

contributing engaging and well-presented articles to the magazine.

 

Of course, there is always room for more articles on any subject  

pertaining to life in the SCA or the Middle Ages- and obviously, the  

wider the range, the better. Articles can be from any and every  

field, and even written 'in persona' to convey period literature,  

styles, thought or attitudes. They don't have to be ponderous  

scholarly papers (although they should, naturally, be factual and  

referenced) or lengthy treatises- short two or three page articles  

are every bit as welcome as longer articles, and ideal to present  

that interesting sidebar to your research or share that fascinating  

historical titbit.

 

News of Cockatrice's return is generating some excitement about the  

Kingdom, so why not be part of its relaunch? Brush off that half-

written article or rework those class notes, and encourage and  

inspire your friends and local artisans to do likewise. The Arts and  

Sciences aren't a spectator sport, so what are you waiting for?

 

Articles can be sent to me on this email or on cockatrice at sca.org.au  

(or by post- email for address) by 1st June, 2010.

 

Please feel free to distribute to other regional or special-interest  

lists you many be on to get the word out to everyone.

 

It has been enormously gratifying to have received such an  

enthusiastic response to the resurrection of our beloved monster:  

given the a wealth of knowledge and talent in the Arts in this  

Kingdom, your support will help make Cockatrice a real standout among  

SCA publications and a readily accessible resource for the Arts and  

Sciences in Lochac.

 

your servant,

Giles

 

 

Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2010 22:09:59 +1100

From: Somhairle Mac Nicail <sorle.sca at gmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] Happy Birthday Lochac

To: shambles at lochac.sca.org

 

Greetings unto the Populace.

 

I have not seen this posted online, so I want to take this opportunity

to wish all that we now know as the Kingdom of Lochac a Happy 30th Birthday.

 

Among the information that good members of the populace have provided

me, I have a timeline that records the following: "November, 1980: The

first event of the SCMA (Society of the Current Middle Ages) in their

Kingdom of Cumberland." It was not until June 1982 that 'Lochac' was so

named, however, but I could not let this milestone pass unobserved.

 

For the (now) Kingdom of Lochac, all that came before, and the people

that made it possible: three cheers.

 

Hip hip HUZZAH!

Hip hip HUZZAH!

Hip hip HUZZAH!

 

Yours in Service

 

Somhairle Mac Nicail

Lochac Historian

 

 

Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 00:34:31 +1100

From: Paddy Neumann <pneu4425 at mail.usyd.edu.au>

Subject: [Lochac] Legality and paperwork.

To: lochac at lochac.sca.org

 

It's great having heraldic archives on your landing.

 

I have in front of me one of the original submission sheets for the  

arms of the "Crown Principality of or Region of Lochac" (sic).  There  

is no date on it, nor is a consulting herald listed, but the address  

is listed as "Box N113, Grosvenor St Sydney, 2065", if that helps  

anyone assign a date to it.  There is also "Anthony" written in the  

top left corner, if that helps anyone.

 

A quick trawl in the online Ordinary and Armorial index shows that  

"Lochac, Principality of" was registered in May 1983, with the  

principality arms being registered at the same time.  The name "was  

updated to Lochac, Kingdom of in October of 2002."  The principality  

arms were retained as the ancient arms of Locahc when the vote was  

held to become a Kingdom (June 2001).  The principality arms are the  

those shown on the submission form in front of me, to wit Quarterly  

azure and argent, on a cross gules fours mullets of six points and in  

canton a laurel wreath argent."  This implies that the form was sent  

some time in late '82?

 

As an interesting sidenote, "Lochac, Region of" was registered in  

November of 1985, and to quote the index, "It appears to have been a  

mis-spelling of Lochac, Kingdom of."

 

So, Oblio, it seems that Lochac was never officially a "Crown  

Principality," so long as one counts entries in the official index of  

the College of Heralds as a measure of what exists and when (2 bloody  

months, Blessed Herman!).  Since the name "Lochac, Region of" has not  

been released, changed or updated, it implies that Lochac was a poorly  

spelled kingdom for ~15 years, and possibly still is, with no-one  

noticing.

 

This is why proof-reading and spell-checkers are awesome.

 

Yours in Service,

 

Padraig Lowther

Cinquefoil Pursuivant.

 

 

Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 00:16:31 +0800

From: Oblio of Abertwidr <oblio.of.abertwidr at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Legality and paperwork.

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

Message-ID:

        <AANLkTik3d8BSmPN5P5sfnsmD3Woy9==3EZY_4jOdYeTZ at mail.gmail.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

 

On 16/02/2011, Paddy Neumann <pneu4425 at mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote:

It's great having heraldic archives on your landing.

 

I have in front of me one of the original submission sheets for the

arms of the "Crown Principality of or Region of Lochac" (sic).  There

is no date on it, nor is a consulting herald listed, but the address

is listed as "Box N113, Grosvenor St Sydney, 2065", if that helps

anyone assign a date to it.  There is also "Anthony" written in the

top left corner, if that helps anyone.

 

A quick trawl in the online Ordinary and Armorial index shows that

"Lochac, Principality of" was registered in May 1983, with the

principality arms being registered at the same time.  The name "was

updated to Lochac, Kingdom of in October of 2002."  The principality

arms were retained as the ancient arms of Locahc when the vote was

held to become a Kingdom (June 2001).  The principality arms are the

those shown on the submission form in front of me, to wit Quarterly

azure and argent, on a cross gules fours mullets of six points and in

canton a laurel wreath argent."  This implies that the form was sent

some time in late '82?

 

As an interesting sidenote, "Lochac, Region of" was registered in

November of 1985, and to quote the index, "It appears to have been a

mis-spelling of Lochac, Kingdom of."

 

So, Oblio, it seems that Lochac was never officially a "Crown

Principality," so long as one counts entries in the official index of

the College of Heralds as a measure of what exists and when (2 bloody

months, Blessed Herman!).  Since the name "Lochac, Region of" has not

been released, changed or updated, it implies that Lochac was a poorly

spelled kingdom for ~15 years, and possibly still is, with no-one

noticing.

 

This is why proof-reading and spell-checkers are awesome.

 

Yours in Service,

 

Padraig Lowther

Cinquefoil Pursuivant.

 

 

Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 00:16:31 +0800

From: Oblio of Abertwidr <oblio.of.abertwidr at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Legality and paperwork.

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

On 16/02/2011, Paddy Neumann <pneu4425 at mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote:

<<< It's great having heraldic archives on your landing.

 

<snip>

So, Oblio, it seems that Lochac was never officially a "Crown

Principality," so long as one counts entries in the official index of

the College of Heralds as a measure of what exists and when (2 bloody

months, Blessed Herman!).  Since the name "Lochac, Region of" has not

been released, changed or updated, it implies that Lochac was a poorly

spelled kingdom for ~15 years, and possibly still is, with no-one

noticing.

 

Padraig Lowther

Cinquefoil Pursuivant. >>>

 

Ah.

 

This is an interesting development.

 

Putting all other things aside, as Webmonster for the Canton of

Abertridwr, I have published on the Abertridwr web site, at

http://www.lochac.sca.org/abertridwr/history-Lochac.html , the

following;

 

"

1. History of Lochac

 

The following information in this section is from the web page at

http://history.westkingdom.org/Branches/Lochac.htm .

 

The Principality of Lochac started in what is now the Barony of Rowany.

 

Lochac was named a Crown Principality of the West at West at 12th

Night Coronation, January 8, A.S. XVII (1983), by Paul and Rowena.

 

King James and Queen Verena signed the charter of Lochac at October

Crown, A.S. XIX 1984, at which time the rods of state were presented

to a representative of Lochac.

 

The first Viceroy and Vicereine of Lochac were named in January, A.S.

XIX (1985) -- James the Sinister and Olwyn Gwallt Coch.

 

Lochac became a full Principality of the West July 11, A.S. XXII

(1987), by the hands of Jade and Anastacia.

 

Lochac became a Kingdom in July of A.S. XXXVII (2002).

"

 

and

 

"

The above content from the web site of the Kingdom of the West, is

"

Published with the permission of the West Kingdom Historian and Golem Herald,

and the West Kingdom Webminister.

For original content, please see:

http://history.westkingdom.org/RoyaltyArms/index.htm .

For further publication rights, please email: West Kingdom Webminister

".

Consent to publish the above content, was granted 16 February 2011, WST.

"

 

So, it appears, for the sake of accuracy, that I am now going to have

to raise this with the Historian, Golem Herald, and, Webminister of

the Kingdom of the West, as what you have said, apparently conflicts

with their official information.

 

I do not know whether it is appropriate for a Webmonster of a Canton

in one Kingdom, to institute a dispute with the Kingdom from which my

Kingdom originated, as to the validity of the records of the parent

Kingdom, but, I suppose, as the Webmonster responsible for

republishing the information, I am now required to ascertain the

validity of the information that I have published in good faith.

 

I hope that this does not start an Inter-Kingdom War...

People in the SCA, don't like wars, do they?

 

:)

 

As the List Administrator of this mailing list, is both the Lochac

Historian, and, from memory, a Kingdom Herald of pretty high standing

(as opposed to the ultimate Kingdom Herald - the Crux Herald), I

request advice on this matter, as to what I should do, with the

information from Lochac, apparently conflicting (and, no, I do not

mean this as a pun on the College of Heralds meaning of conflict) with

the official records of the Kingdom of the West, which is our parent

Kingdom.

--

Oblio of Abertwidr

 

 

Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 09:21:25 +1200 (NZST)

From: Alasdair Muckart <silver at where.else.net.nz>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Fw: [Announcements] International Membership

        Rate Increase

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

<<< At the April 16th 2011 quarterly Board meeting, a decision was made to raise International Membership Rates to USD $56 effective July 1, 2011.  

 

This decision was very difficult, but was based upon the reality that all of our International mailings are at US First Class Postage rates, and the current International  Membership Rate has been insufficient to cover the costs of the mailing for quite some time.  To keep current with the recent announcement of new US postal rates, the  International Membership Rate will, as of July 1, now be the same as the Sustaining US First Class postage Membership Rate. While not sufficient to cover the full cost of production and mailings, this does allow us to make significant strides toward cost recovery.  

 

As the SCA continues progress towards publication of e-newsletters, the Board and Corporate Officers are committed to re-evaluating all Membership Rates to ensure that SCA, Inc. remains fiscally responsible as well as responsive to the needs of the Membership.  We thank you for your patience as we move forward in this endeavor.

 

Board of Directors, SCA, Inc. >>>

 

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011, JTStewart wrote:

<<< Interesting news from the US. Prior to the Australian Committee

organizing a separate deal with the USABOD our membership fees had to be

at this sort of level.

 

Yay for our own deal! Also Yay for the New Zealanders who had to pay the

International rate before they linked up with Lochac! >>>

 

Yay indeed! The formation of SCANZ happened independently of the NZ groups

joining Lochac though :) Coincidentally they happened at approximately the

same timethe incorporation drive had nothing to do with the change of

kingdom, and would have gone ahead either way.

 

The original driver that got Mistress Rohesia looking into incorporation

was liability insurance, but the cost of membership was a major secondary

factor and the more we looked into it idea the better the idea seemed.

 

The last membership I bought before SCANZ incorporated cost me NZ$75

(which was more than a week's rent back then) for a single year. The last

membership I purchased cost NZ$30 for three years.

 

Interestingly, with the exchange rate being what it is right now, the

increased International Membership rate is still less than it was in 2003.

--

Alasdair Muckart | William de Wyke | http://wherearetheelves.net

 

 

Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 07:39:39 +1000

From: Andrew Ross-Gowan <andrew.rossgowan at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Fw: [Announcements] International Membership

        Rate   Increase

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

As Yvonne de Plumetot correctly stated the price increase for International

Members of SCA Inc does not affect SCA Ltd or SCANZ Inc members as we have

our separate membership structures

 

Andrew Ross-Gowan

Chair SCA Ltd

 

On 26 April 2011 13:28, Michele Le Bas <mlebas at alphalink.com.au> wrote:

<<< Our fees used to be based on the US model and much more expensive

than now.  Since an Australian deal was negotiated a few years back, we

have been on a separate system.  We don't get anything mailed from the US as

part of our memberships, unless you personally choose to make an individual

subscription to a US publication.

 

Yvonne de Plumetot

Shire of Krae Glas (SE Melb/Vic) >>>

 

 

Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 18:34:03 +1000

From: Yseult de Lacy / Chris Robertson

        <yseult_de_lacy at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Useful ideas (I hope)

To: The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

On 4/05/2011 5:11 PM, Stefan li Rous wrote:

<<< Huh? Maybe I missed a message or two on this list. This "Martyr"

auction sounds interesting, but the name seems like it would be a bit

off-putting to those thinking of volunteering. I know there is

something similar done at other events such as Pennsic, although it is

more of a household thing there. >>>

 

The Martyr Auction gets its title from the College of St Ursula and the

11,000 Virgins (Univ of Sydney) -- a long-ago scribe read 11 M&V as 11M

& V, turning St Ursula's 11 Virgin and Martyr companions into 11,000

Virgins. It's the members of this college who auction themselves off

for 2 hours' work to raise funds for the college.

 

--Yseult

 

 

Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:56:05 +0930

From: "Anwyn Davies" <anwyn at internode.on.net>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Baronial term limits

To: "'The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list'"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

<<< Just as an aside, do we consider the Court Barony a societywide award like a

peerage or a kingdom specific one? Ie. a knight who moves to Lochac will not

be awarded another knighthood but might receive a Lily despite having a

Dolphin from Caid for his service.

Is it inappropriate to style someone "Baron of the Court of Lochac"

Callum >>>

 

Society wide.

 

Master Drake tried this one when we went to Kingdom; he had a Court Barony

from the West and wanted one from Lochac as well (so he could have a

collection.) It was made clear to him that a Court Barony is a Court Barony,

and Western Court Baronies issued to subjects of the Principality of Lochac

would become Court Baronies to the Kingdom of Lochac.

 

Blod.

 

 

Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 14:20:33 +1000

From: Donyale Harrison <donyale.harrison at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Baronial court baronies and Grants

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

Gui said:

<<< Another thing to throw into the mix; in 2006, an amendment to the Law

wrought by AEdwarde and Yolande included the following law change:

"2. Upon retiring from their office a territorial Baron or Baroness may be

offered the title of Court Baron or Baroness and/or a Grant of Arms, at the

discretion of the Crown." >>>

 

The reasoning behind the law change from AEdward and I that Gui referred to

was that a great many people who serve as B&B have been in the Society for a

not insubstantial period of time and have often done astonishing things. It

is not uncommon for people to already hold a Court Barony upon stepping up

to a Landed Baronial position, and so when they step down, one has a lovely

piece of court admitting them to the Court Baronage while the other is a

little neglected, or in some cases, both could be.

 

Additionally, some Barons and Baronesses do work that is worthy of greater

reward. For those souls, it is pleasant to have a title that one can use in

the tavern to grand comedic effect, but a Grant of Arms carries more weight

within the Society and is a more accurate measure of their worth to the

Kingdom.

 

The reason that it was put into law by us was because even though it seemed

obvious that the Crown was always at liberty to bestow a Grant upon those

stepping down from their positions as B&B, it was almost never done. Rather,

the Court Barony was seen as the default reward, and also where one stopped.

 

 

I would argue that it was not redundant to have such a line in the laws,

rather, that it acted like the signs at pedestrian crossings to look right,

to remind those who know, and to flag something useful for those who do not.

 

Grants are loosely defined within Lochac and have historically been most

often given to Greater Kingdom Officers (aside from those attached to the

Orders of Distinction, which are a somewhat separate beast). Since the

addition of the formerly Caidan territories to the Kingdom, Grants have had

a stronger place within our traditions, but are still the wee timorous

beasties of our award structure on the whole.

 

The significant and lengthy service of so many Barons and Baronesses is what

we sought to highlight. Though there is a valid argument to say that the

Crown can always give a Grant, Lochac has lacked the tradition. Lacking

custom, we mentioned it in law until the Kingdom should become accustomed to

it. I am a little sad that the law has gone without the custom being

altered.

 

Gui wrote:

<<< I can't recall why it was repealed, but I think it happened during the

review of the Laws under Berenger and Bethan. >>>

 

Well, obviously, they're both dropped. :-P

 

Yolande

 

 

Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 20:06:09 +1000

From: Alexander a la Fontayne <alexanderalafontayne at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] Court Baroncy

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

<<< Sorry for not trying to look this up, but is that where a Court Baron lies

in the Order of Precedence in Lochac? Only a GoA level? >>>

 

It carries an Award of Arms, but is taken to reside above other Award-level

awards (but below a Grant of Arms) in the Order of Precedence, much like the

Order of the White Scarves of Lochac and the Lochac Company of Archers

reside above but within the Grant of Arms.

--

Alexander a la Fontayne,

Seneschal of the College of St Aldhelm

Cordon Rouge Herald

 

 

Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2011 16:45:03 +1000

From: "Domhnall na Moicheirghe" <domhnall at fastmail.com.au>

Subject: [Lochac] History question: who brought the SCA to Melbourne

        and    when?

To: "The Shambles Mailing List" <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

From various sources online, it is easily determined that the SCA in

Australia started in Sydney. From here

(http://history.westkingdom.org/Branches/Lochac.htm), I found that the

SCA spread to Perth and Adelaide next, before the other capital cities

followed suit over a number of years. For early SCA history in New

Zealand, the Southron Gaard website has a good summary:

http://sg.lochac.sca.org/barony/

 

What I couldn't find were details of the SCA coming to Melbourne, so

perhaps the collective memory of the Shambles can assist me? I'd also be

interested if gentles wanted to share stories of the SCA spreading to

the rest of Lochac.

 

Domhnall na Moicheirghe

 

 

Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2011 17:01:55 +1000

From: Corinna <umbra at iinet.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] History question: who brought the SCA to

        Melbourne and when?

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

From Styvyn Longshanks (1st Baron of Stormhold) - don't know if it helps.

 

<<< In '82 or '83, James the Sinister and Olwyn Yrgoch Moved from Sydney  

down to Melbourne - They met up with Sean Ronin the Wayfarer, got >on  

like a house on fire (ultimately, not well) & had the first feast in the  

Lounge room of James & Olwyn's new house

This is a very sparse history, & possibly slightly inaccurate >>>

 

Elysant

 

 

Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2011 17:17:47 +1000

From: "Cary" <lenehan at our.net.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] History question: who brought the SCA to

        Melbourne     andwhen?

To: "'The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list'"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>

 

Maddie and I started Cyrradd Uchel (Snowy Mtns) and it gave birth to Polit.

Contact me via Facebook (which I look at more regularly and I will try and

give more info.  I have it all, but need to dig it out and am on FB more

actively than here.

 

I have a history of Lochac from the start (when groups happened, events,

some awards etc) until I stopped being Historian in Jan XXV.

 

Hrolf

On FB under my mundane name Cary Lenehan

 

<the end>



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