iwandpc-msg - 5/16/05 Ink wells and pencases. NOTE: See also the files: calligraphy-msg, callig-suppl-msg, inks-msg, paper-msg, parchment-msg, pasteboard-msg, gold-leaf-msg, quills-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ Newsgroups: rec.org.sca From: aliskye at netcom.com (Laura F. Jenkins) Subject: Ink Wells and Pencases? Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest) Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 16:29:54 GMT I am trying to figure out how to construct (or acquire) a period-looking traveling inkwell and pencase (a penner?). The only drawing I have (from the Rouen Book of Hours) is very unclear but seems to show a inkpot and pencase attached to one another by a cord. The book the illumination is from (Medieval Craftsmen -- Scribes and Illuminators) by Christopher de Hamel says "This is an open-air scene and so the pot is portable, presumably with a screw lid and it is attached by a cord to an oblong pencase. Not dissimilar pen and ink sets are used by Islamic scribes today......". Any suggestions where I could enough information to actually make such a thing? Or where I might purchase something that will pass reasonably? Thank you all for any advice you can render. Cheers, Aliskye ************************************************************************* Legal: Laura F. Jenkins Los Angeles, CA SCA: Aliskye MacKyven Raizel Lyondemere, Caid Internet: aliskye at netcom.com Motto: "Timing Is Everything" From: bbrisbane at aol.com (BBrisbane) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Ink Wells and Pencases? Date: 7 Jul 1996 00:07:33 -0400 Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Milady, St Jerome is often depicted, in Frescoes and other Italian Ren Art, as having such a Pencase. There is a statue of a priest (St Jerome again) in the Walters Art Gallery in Baltimore with such a Pencase worn looped over the Saint's belt and I have made such an item personally. They are way cool and useful. Those i have seen, read of etc., are cardboard/paper cores wrapped in leather. They can be found round, square, and rectangular in cross section, and are generally the length of a standard writing implement (8 inches). I have seen longer ones for instruments such as compasses and my own is 10 inches long for -- brushes. My inkbottle was constructed of handcarved soapstone with a broad lip. It was the lip which allowed mine to fasten via leather cord to the case proper, while my stopper was a simple well fitting cork. I fashioned mine by creating a cylinder out of a cardboard Xmas wrapping paper tube. I took 10 inches of the cardboard tube, cut it very cleanly where I wanted the case to separate, and then using glue made a smaller diameter tube to fit tightly into the base tube by cutting down left over tubing. The result was a male base with a female top. I then dressed it all in billfold leather and stitched into its bottom and its top ends a disk of the same leather. The ends were convex with the leather being cupped into the cylinders top and bottom. I left the top alone, but pushed a plug of thick sole leather inside the bottom half. this pushed the sewn in disk out flat and provided a thick interior surface for the points of pens, stylus', and compasses, etc.. The same could be done for the top. The loops were made by sewing loops into a strip of leather that was then glued and sewn to the body of the case. I am cnot sure how clear this is, but you can call me for further clarification. Lord Brendan brisbane AEthelmearc MOAS (814) 684-1232 From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.EDU (Marc Carlson) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: re: Ink Wells and Pencases? Date: 8 Jul 1996 12:07:18 -0400 Organization: The Internet > >I am trying to figure out how to construct (or acquire) a period-looking >traveling inkwell and pencase (a penner?). The only drawing I have (from >the Rouen Book of Hours) is very unclear but seems to show a inkpot and >pencase attached to one another by a cord.... They show up more, the more you wind up looking. Some of what you are wanting will depend on WHAT period you are looking for. To the best of my knowledge, there is no "definitive" work on the subject of penners, much less inkpots and inkhorns (if anyone *does* know of such a work, please feel free to correct me). In the earlier era the predominant form of ink container was an "inkhorn", which was, quite literally, the end of a cow's horn, with a lid on the wide end that opened to reveal the ink. The Horn was set into a hole specifically cut into the desk or writing table to hold it. Or else was held in the hand, while the other held the pen. According to the illustrations, Ink horns were often connected to the penner by some sort of cord, although this was by no means a universal thing. For that matter, it may well be that some ink horns were flat bottomed, or other shapes. I have found that carving a wooden stopper that fits snuggly works well enough to keep the ink from drying when I carry wet ink. ________ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | || I realize this seems like a pretty stupid way to carry ink, but it's what the illustrations say. It may be that the ink was carried dry and only enough was made up to carry in the horn for each specific purpose. (BTW, I have seen a picture of a Roman era bronze Ink bottle found in Britain that actually is made to look like this sort of horn). By the 15th century (and I have no clue when the switchover took place, or how long it was, or even if it was a true "change" from one type to the other), ink horns (possibly some were still made FROM horn) were also made flat bottomed, and carved into a variety of bottle shapes, and more easily set down wherever was needed. I'm not sure about making any solid statements about making a threaded cap for your bottle, since I have no idea when that might have been done (I have some personal doubts about it being done in the Middle Ages, although perhaps by the later 16th century), other than to suggest that if you really want to do so, there are some very good instructions for Buckskinners Powder Horns that might be very useful for this purpose, since they describe making threaded ends in horn. There are a number of heraldic depications of "Penner and Ink Horn" that might give you something to look at (you might try the various heraldic dictionaries first), for ideas of bottles, and how they might be threaded. For that matter, there are a number of later period portrayals of scribes and limners that show both bottle an penner. If you look at the pictures, find a black tube on the desk near where they write -- THAT is their penner. > >...way cool and useful. Those i have seen, read of etc., are cardboard/paper >cores wrapped in leather. Some of the Persian ones I have heard of (post period, unfortunately, are Paper Mache). > They can be found round, square, and >rectangular in cross section, and are generally the length of a standard >writing implement (8 inches). It does seem to be the case that there is no standard whatsoever, other than that they are often depicted in pictures as being black. I have a theory, with no proof of course, that one of the scabbards in the "Knives and Scabbards" book actually portrays a variety of Penner, since the "secondary scabbard" clearly held a pen-knife when it was found. It is square bottomed, rectangular in cross section, and has a set of holes to run leather or a cord through on either side (so that it will hang vertically). It has no lid, although clearly should have one, and is covered in heraldic devices, as though being used as a "heraldic resume" (I'm told it was not an unknown practice for Heralds to maintain such a collection of blazons of previous employers). Without the lid, it is about six inches long, which, by itself is long enough to hold several short pens (since that's what I keep in the replica I made). I have made other sorts of penners that were similar, but round. I make no claims about the accuracy of the following, but currently, my preferred method is to start with a rawhide lining, soaked and sewn around a core or mold. This is covered after in calfskin, which has been soaked (and eventually scalded to stiffen it). There is no reason NOT to use regular (thin) leather as the liner (much less paper, cardboard or whatever) other than the fact that I've been known to forget what I'm doing and set heavy boxes on whatever's lying around :) The cording or strapping appears (from the "knives and scabbards" thing) to be threaded through a set of cuts on the sides, that penetrate the outer layer of leather, but not the inner lining. I can only assume that the cap would be similar. || || ||___________|| |/| |\| | | | | |\| |/| || || | | | | | | |___________| "Fides res non pecunniae, Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn sed temporis" University of Northkeep/Company of St. Jude -- Unknown Recreator Northkeepshire, Ansteorra (I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca From: bq676 at torfree.net (Kristine E. Maitland) Subject: Re: Ink Wells and Pencases? Organization: Toronto Free-Net Date: Wed, 10 Jul 1996 04:26:28 GMT I don't know about period European pencases BUT one can find several full colour plates of late 16th Ottoman pencases (two gold, on porcelain) in: _Suleyman the Magnificent_ by J.M. Rogers and R.M. Ward (Wellfleet Press, 1988.) This book is also good for garb/textile info formerly Ihsan al-Kilwiyya Ines Carmen Maria de Freitas From: moireasdac at aol.com (Moireasdac) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Ink Wells and Pencases? Date: 14 Jul 1996 18:21:31 -0400 Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) I am a horner, if anyone really wants to know how to thread a horn, and the proper way to prepare a horn prior to the threading etc. I will be happy to help them out. Beware though processing a horn the first time or two will take several hours. The next few do go quickly, after you learn the skills. A few tips though, scrap do not sand or buff the horn smooth, neither work right or when you do get it smooth, results in the wrong looking finish. Scap, single edge razorblades work fine if you don't have small cabinet scrapers. For final polishing use loose grit and a scrap of leather with water as a carrier. Work slowly and with the grain. For canteens, cups and inkwells and inkhorns use pitch or beeswax as a liner, pitch is best and use except for canteens and cups softwoods unless the period piece used hardwood. To insert the end plugs heat the horn in an oven at 300 degrees coat the plug and insert it. Tamp it in tightly and drill and insert plugs (round toothpicks work great) fill any voids with beeswax or pitch. If you all need to know how to tread let me know. I will tell you the basics just be sure to use a leather washer to keep the ink in and off your alls cloathing. Kirk From: Moireasdac at aol.com (7/19/96) To: markh at risc.sps.mot.com Date: Fri, 19 Jul 1996 22:11:51 -0400 Subject: Re: Ink Wells and Pencases? Sorry I typed a head of myself you thread the horn and then you match the threads to the tap and matching dies. The small holes and toothpicks go for the bottom plug, in the case of a cup or a inkwell or powderhorn. The screw tip is at the top the plug, for the bottom is held by pegs and sealed to prevent leakage similar possible problems. If you have any more questions please let me know. Kirk Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 18:38:38 -0500 From: To: sca-arts at UKANS.EDU Subject: Re: Islamic traveling pen cases/inkwells >Hi, Barthelemy here, >I am curious about Islamic calligraphy and scribal arts but haven't delved >too deeply into research yet. What I want to know is if there are any >vendors or suppliers where a cast brass or bronze inkwell pencase can be >purchased and for how much. I don't even know how far back these cases go, >but it fits my desire to have something portable and secure for my reeds and >ink as well as fit in with my persona. While it was not Islamic that I know of, this example is certainly portable: Years ago at SCA 25th year anniversary, a Laurel from Caid, I believe it was Aeowyn Amberdrake (sp?) who carried a portable 'kit' for calligraphy. She had gotten a wooden or metal cigar case and had it outfitted with either a screw with a loop through it, or with some sort of holder, and she carried her pens inside with a cord around the case, and tied to her belt. For ink in the field, she used stick ink and and ink stone, held in some case, perhaps leather. As she needed ink, she would get some water and grind an amount fresh for each project. When done, dry out the stone, pack it away and no problems with carrying wet ink that can leak or spill. Again, this leather pouch was tied to the belt. I don't know how 'period' this was, but it seemed really practical to me. You could also outfit the metal cigar case with a small ruler, pencil and pencil style eraser, as space allowed. This may not be the optimum ink or quill that you would use for commissioned projects, but would work in a pinch when the Crown called on you to fill in someone's name on an award scroll to be presented that evening. I thought it was pretty cool. Baroness Hillary Greenslade/Ansteorra Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 00:53:23 EDT From: To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu Subject: Re: Islamic traveling pen cases/inkwells haku-jin at ns.net writes: << don't even know how far back these cases go, but it fits my desire to have something portable and secure for my reeds and ink as well as fit in with my persona. >> Pen cases date back to at least the time of Sullen the Magnificent and are common in illustrations of household goods from that period of the Ottoman empire with specimens in several museums. They resemble the boxes currently available that hold incense....that is long and mostly rectangular, sometimes with rounded ends with ivory inlay work and a top that slides along groves. Ras Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 23:36:07 -0500 From: "Helen Schultz" To: Subject: Re: Islamic traveling pen cases/inkwells Hello Barthelemy, I don't know where you could purchase such an item -- you just might have to make one on your own. However, I have a book called "Letters In gold" that is from a museum exhibit on the book arts of Turkey (I bought my copy from Amazon.com) -- it shows two items like you mention. (For those who want some really nice examples of Turkish book arts, this is a wonderful book -- but keep in mind that most of it is out of the SCA period... but enough of it is inside our period to be worthwhile.) The most ornate of the two is actually out of our period -- it is from 1779 (sorry) -- but it is absolutely fantastic. It looks to be made of silver, gold (or brass?), and perhaps ivory. It consists of a bar that looks to be about 10" long with very ornate ends (I would guess that pens were kept inside it, but the photo doesn't show it). Attached to this bar is an ornate silver and gilt (again, can't say if it is gold or brass) ink well with a snap in place lid. The other one they show looks like it just might be from an earlier, less ostentatious period. It is basically a tube shape piece brass (this one says it is brass), that has several parts that all screw into each other. It held the pens, cotton, a shaker of what I would assume is "pounce" (but is a rose color in the photo), and an ink well with a screw lid. They show it all unassembled, but I think they all screw into each other for easy carrying. For a portable, period style of pen case and ink well you could do like Mistress Megan ni Liaine (?sp), Baroness Stonemarche, did for an A&S one year (long before she was Laureled for her Limning). She took a metal cigar case and covered it with leather, and attached the top and bottom with a long rawhide cord. To the other end of the cord she had taken a regular ink bottle (the kind with a screw lid) and covered it in the same leather. These then hang off a belt. It is almost exactly like some of the drawings of scribes in manuscripts. Too cool for words!! You might also consider joining the SCA Scribes list -- to do so, send an e-mail to: majordomo at castle.org with no subject. In the body put "subscribe SCA Scribes" and your name. This list is a great place to ask any scribal type question and get 20 or 30 different answers (or all the same ones, too). It is for beginners and for some of us "old pharts" of the scribal arena. Meisterin Katarina Helene von Schoenborn, OL Shire of Narrental, Middle Kingdom (that's Peru, Indiana, folks) From: Elizabeth Young Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Islamic inkwells/pen sets Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 18:51:38 -0800 JBaker wrote: > There was some discussion earlier about what period Islamic travelling > inkwell/pencase combinations started cropping up. I have a small collection > and remember some interest in seeing examples and possibly selling them since > I don't do calligraphy at this time. > > In the meantime, I'm wondering how many of you have seen other SCAdians or do > you yourself carry one of these? Also if there has been much research done on > such items, I can't find a bit of documentation on the internet or the local > library. some documentation: Islamic Metalwork by Rachel Ward 1993 Thames and Hudson $16 US, paperback penboxes: p. 107 mid 14th century, brass inlaid with silver and gold, Damascus or Cairo, 30.7 cm p. 83 13th century, brass, Mosul, 36.8 cm p. 90 1281AD, brass inlaid with silver and gold, West Iran, 19.7 cm There are a number of books in this series, all quite good, inexpensive, and lots of photos. Elizabeth Young 'A'isha bint Khalil al-Herati Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 13:38:43 -0500 (CDT) From: "Pixel, Queen of Cats" To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu Subject: Re: Penners? On the west front of Wells Cathedral there is a statue of a woman who has a number of things hanging off her belt. One is very obviously a pouch. There are two other things hanging beside/behind it that are less obvious as to what they are. One of the two looks very like a small container of some sort, and the other one could be a penner, or a knife, a large needlecase, or any number of other things which are longish and narrowish and might be hanging off a woman's belt. I was planning on taking a closer look at the photo this weekend--my love has been scanning them and printing them out, and I only saw the b/w printout--and seeing if I could figure out what the mystery objects might be. If you like, I could probably convince him to email you a copy of the jpeg. Margaret From: mary_m_haselbauer at yahoo.com (Slaine) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Period Writing Implements? Date: 5 Jan 2004 12:22:34 -0800 > In my slow progress towards an authentic persona, I am looking for more > information and I am hoping someone here can help. I enjoy journaling a > great deal, and enjoy keeping a journal / diary at events. However, I am > wondering what writing tool I should use to do this, if I want to keep my > tools period. Hi Julie, There are period recipes for a travelling ink. All of my ink research is at this site: http://www.geocities.com/mary_m_haselbauer/Ink.html I haven't made the travel ink and only make passing reference to it on my site. However, the bibliography may be of use to you. You would grind the oak galls into a very very fine powder and mix the recipe dry. Then reconstitute the ink as needed and dump what you don't use. At least this way you wouldn't have to carry a potentially leaky bottle of ink. You could also use silver point. You'd need thicker wire than is usually used for drawings. You would also need paper with a hard texture or coating. However, I do like the idea of a fountain pen with a meerly decorative bottle of ink nearby. Good luck! That's a very cool yet subtle way to make your persona more authentic. Slaine Barony of Three Rivers, Calontir St. Louis, Missouri Edited by Mark S. Harris iwandpc-msg Page 9 of 9