ginger-msg - 4/29/07
Period use of the spice ginger. Period documentation. Sources.
NOTE: See also the files: herbs-msg, herbs-cooking-msg, p-herbals-msg, seeds-msg, rue-msg, saffron-msg, garlic-msg, merch-spices-msg, spices-msg, gums-resins-msg.
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From: nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt)
Date: Mon, 21 Apr 1997 08:24:26 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: SC - SC: Candied Ginger
Concerning ginger:
I tried making candied ginger with the result that it was tough and fibrous and nasty. I told one of my friends who make it all the time andshe offered this information. The ginger you buy in the store is normallytoo old to candy well. You need to look for or obtain what is called greenginger, or very young ginger that has not become woody. It is the sameshape as ginger but is whiyish rather than brown and the shoots at the endsof the rhizome are pink and greenish (It really is pretty) It is also muchmilder. If you use the older ginger peel the outer brown skin and thin usethe thin layer between the surface and the woodier center area, before itgets woody. You will have thin pieces but less woodiness.
Ginger is relatively easy to grow. Buy a nice rhizome and plant it in a pot with sandy soil. Water. It should send up shoots and may flower.At any rate, any time you want ginger just dig down and snap off asection. It will overwinter on a windowsill in some areas. I recentlybought a cinnamon ginger from a herb nursery and when I looked up gingerin Mrs. Grieves, it stated that all ginger is edible, just varying degreesof heat and flavor.
I'm curious to see whether or not the ginger has a cinnamon flavor.
Clare
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 21:59:01 EDT
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: SC - Re: Ginger
<< This is something I have wondered about a long time. ...<snip>....But
where would a 15th-century Englishman get fresh ginger root? >>
Possibly as a potted plant? That's were mine came from. :-) In "The Medieval
Kitchen" the author suggests letting fresh ginger lay around at room
temperature for a few days to dry out a little but does not give a period
source for this practise. I agree that candied ginger is probably the best bet
although I also have no infornmation indicating the use of candied ginger in
15th century England. <sigh>
There is also a possibility that the ginger was minced and dried before being
imported and was available from the spice merchant in this form.
<<Elizabeth/Betty Cook >>
Ras (Who always finds the hard questions undocumentable. ;-()
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 22:23:00 -0400
From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow)
Subject: Re: Ginger (was: SC - Will's- Recipe 1)
<snip>>
>This is something I have wondered about a long time. Minced ginger sounds
>like fresh ginger root; I have found that if I try to mince ginger that has
>dried out, it just falls apart to powdered ginger. But where would a
>15th-century Englishman get fresh ginger root? I am pretty sure it wasn't
>being grown locally. I have wondered if candied ginger might have been
>available-- that will keep a long time and retains its structure. Does
>anyone know of any references to candied ginger being available in the
>14th-15th century or before?
>
>Elizabeth/Betty Cook
Hello! Gerard (1633 edition) says "Ginger is most impatient of the
coldnesse of these our Northerne Regions, as my selfe haue found by proofe,
for that there haue beene brought vnto me at seuerall times sundry plants
thereof, fresh, greene, and full of juyce, as well from the West Indies, as
from Barbary and other places; which haue sprouted and budded forth greene
leaues in my garden in the heate of Sommer, but as soone as it hath been
but touched with the first sharp blast of Winter, it hath presently
perished both blade and root...
Ginger groweth in Spaine, Barbary, in the Canary Islands, and the Azores..."
Nevertheless, there are recipes in the Harleian MSS., for example, which
call for parings of ginger. The recipe for Peris in compost, Harl. MS.
4016, #97, says "...And then pare clene rasinges of ginger, & temper hem
ij. or iij. daies, in wyne, And after, ley hem in clarefied hony colde, all
a day or a night; And [th]en take the rasons [parings] oute of the hony,
And caste hem to the peres in composte..."
I'm wondering if there was a climatic change between the time the Harleian
MS. was written (c. 1450), and the time Gerard wrote his book, which would
have allowed ginger to be cultivated in England in the 15th c.?
Cindy/Sincgiefu
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 22:33:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: Sharon Gordon <gordonse at one.net>
Subject: Re: Ginger (was: SC - Will's- Recipe 1)
>Cindy wrote:
> I'm wondering if there was a climatic change between the time the Harleian
> MS. was written (c. 1450), and the time Gerard wrote his book, which would
> have allowed ginger to be cultivated in England in the 15th c.?
I have read of major climate changes, but don't remember when they
were. I have confidence that someone on the list will
remember :-). However, it's quite easy to grow ginger indoors in a pot
in the winter. It's impressive to see the whole pot fill up with
ginger root until there is practically no dirt left. It's also
possible to hold it for long periods of time in root cellar type
conditions such as you might dig up and hold over carrots. It's
more inclined to mold than carrots though. So possibly some
people dug it up and stored it and then put it back out in the
late spring after frosts were over.
Sharon
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 1998 12:57:40 +1000
From: Robyn Probert <robyn.probert at lawpoint.com.au>
Subject: Re: SC - Re: Ginger (
Elizabeth/Betty Cook wrote:
><< This is something I have wondered about a long time. ...<snip>....But
>where would a 15th-century Englishman get fresh ginger root? >>
Ras wrote:
<snip>
>There is also a possibility that the ginger was minced and dried before being
>imported and was available from the spice merchant in this form.
and Cindy/Sincgiefu wrote:
<snip>
>Nevertheless, there are recipes in the Harleian MSS., for example, which
>call for parings of ginger. The recipe for Peris in compost, Harl. MS.
>4016, #97, says "...And then pare clene rasinges of ginger, & temper hem
>ij. or iij. daies, in wyne, And after, ley hem in clarefied hony colde, all
>a day or a night; And [th]en take the rasons [parings] oute of the hony,
>And caste hem to the peres in composte..."
I think it is more likely that the ginger was imported dried in slices - you
can still buy both it and galingale this way. Grinding it up before drying
and transport would reduce the potency of the spice, as it exposes more to
air. It is also possible that in the Harlieian MSS recipie above, soaking
the ginger strips in wine for 2 or 3 days would reconstitute it as well as
mellow the flavour.
IMO fresh ginger was possible, but dried seems more probable!
Rowan
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 1998 10:19:31 +0100
From: "Yeldham, Caroline S" <csy20688 at GlaxoWellcome.co.uk>
Subject: SC - RE: Ginger
Isn't there another possible interpretation? If fresh ginger
could have been brought to Gerard from the West Indies, then it could
survive a lengthy sea voyage, so it could have been imported from the
Canarys, Azores or other parts of the Mediterranean in the 15th century
(possibly even further afield); so the question is when it was being
grown in those areas. I have a memory of being told it was imported in
sand to keep it fresh and free from mould.
On climate, this has been extensively discussed on h-costume.
The evidence seems to be for a small change of maybe a degree or two
(which seems to have affected Spain badly) for the 16th to early 20th
centuries. The effect of this on clothes, crops, economic prosperity or
the role of Western Europe in world history is very debatable!
Caroline
Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 09:42:12 -0400
From: waks at world.std.com (Jane Waks)
Subject: Re: SC - ginger
Phillipa wrote:
>Can someone on the list advise me about fresh ginger. How does one store the
>left over piece? Mine always goes moldy. What methods do you use to store
>the left over bit?
I peel it, cut it into moderate chunks (about the size of my thumb),
and store it in a jar full of sherry.
- --Caitlin Davies
Carolingia, East
Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 15:45:51 -0400
From: waks at world.std.com (Jane Waks)
Subject: Re: SC - ginger
>Does that have to be good sherry or will cooking sherry do? And how long
>will it, so preserved, keep?
><<
> I peel it, cut it into moderate chunks (about the size of my thumb),
> and store it in a jar full of sherry. >>
I used cheap sherry that was intended for drinking (not "cooking wine"),
but still was only a couple dollars a bottle.
I don't know how long it will keep: I've been using and replenishing
regularly. The oldest piece in the jar has probably been there a
year, maybe eighteen months. Except that the older pieces are a
little darker in color, and smell more of wine, there doesn't
seem to be any adverse effect of leaving them there.
By the way, it's not in the fridge, just on a shelf in the kitchen.
(The garlic in vinegar *is* in the fridge.)
- --Caitlin D.
Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 10:56:42 EDT
From: WOLFMOMSCA at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - ginger
<< Phillipa wrote:
>Can someone on the list advise me about fresh ginger. How does one store the
>left over piece? >>
I toss mine into the freezer. It keeps well, and grates better frozen.
Wolfmom
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:01:58 EDT
From: WOLFMOMSCA at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - ginger
I just put it in a zip-loc and freeze it. No other prep. It keeps for about
six months.
Wolfmom
Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:37:24 -0500
From: Daniel Myers <edouard at medievalcookery.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] white ginger
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
On Mar 4, 2005, at 4:11 PM, Samrah wrote:
> I have a friend not on this list who had a question about "white
> ginger" as mentioned in the Platina. Apparently the recipe said
> something to the order of "use as much as you can afford". The
> translation said "white ginger", but her take on the Latin (she's had
> a bit) is that it might have been the white parts of the ginger.
>
> Anybody have any ideas on this one? Is there a white ginger plant as
> opposed to a regular ginger plant?
There is a separate variety (species?) of ginger called "white ginger".
It seems to grow more in the Asia-pacific region, and is regulated for
import into the US because it's an invasive plant. I tried finding
some to sell and had a hard time getting anyone to even send dried
samples to Ohio.
I have no idea how period modern white ginger is - it may not be the
same plant that Platina is referring to.
- Doc
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Edouard Halidai (Daniel Myers)
http://www.medievalcookery.com/
Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:20:52 -0600
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] white ginger
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
White ginger is peeled ginger. Black or gray ginger is unpeeled ginger.
Green ginger is the undried rhizome. White ginger is modernly used to refer
to peeled Jamaican ginger which may also be bleached. That may not be what
Platina is referring to as "gingiberis albi," but it is a good possibility
the term white ginger is older than the modern usage.
Bear
<the end>