tattoos-msg - 10/21/99

Period tattoos and body and face decoration. Early Celtic tattoos. Medieval 
bans. Crusader tattoos. Book referances.

NOTE: See also the files: woad-msg, dyeing-msg.

KEYWORDS: tattoo woad henna substitute

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From: folo at prairienet.org (F.L. Watkins)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Tats in Period
Date: 26 May 1994 01:46:01 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

I just picked up TOTAL TATTOO BOOK by Amy Krakow (Warner Books,
ISBN 0-446-67001-4; $11.95; highly recommended for people
interested in getting ink). The following is from the chapter
on "The Tattoo in History":

	In Western Europe, pre-Celtic Iberians in
the British Isles tattooed ceremonially and so did
the Gauls. Teutonic peoples tattooed. The Danes, Norse
and Saxons, being more cultured and artistic peoples,
tattooed their family symbols and crests. Scots and
other Anglo-Saxons still tattoo family crests--tattooist
Lyle Tuttle is a well-known example of this practice!
	The early history of Western tattooing ended in
AD 787, when Pope Hadrian banned the art form. Tattooing
survived in Britain until the Norman invasion of 1066.
Normans scorned tattoos, but "like Anglo-Saxon kings
before him, King Harold was heavily tattooed. When
his body was recovered from the battlefield of Hastings,
it was identified by the word 'Edith' tattooed over his
heart." (George Burchett, _Memoirs of a Tattooist_) After
the Norman invasion, there's little mention of tattooing
in Western culture from the twelfth to the sixteenth
centuries.

So, okay, you early-period types may not have cannon,
but you do have tats...

Anyway, look up this book (it's just out) if you're
thinking of getting some ink. Nice photos, nice articles
and a list of shops state by state, city by city.

Yrs, Folo (and please note: all Folos got tats)
-- 
Damin de Folo - F.L.Watkins - folo at prairienet.org
Baron Wurm Wald (MK) - Commander Baldwin's Reg't (NWTA)


From: folo at prairienet.org (F.L. Watkins)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: What Did They Call Tattoos Before Captain Cook
Date: 18 Jan 1995 04:08:10 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana

This snuck up on me while I was reading a tat book I had just
purchased.

The word "tattoo" appears to be Polynesian in origin and was
introduced into Europe in the 18th century.

Tattoos were known in Europe for thousands of years before
that (although the Church forbade them after about the
millenium, and they were essentially reintroduced in the
18th century).

What were they called in period?

I cannot find any citations that does not use the oop term
"tattoo" to describe bodyart prior to the 18th century. I've
posted on rec.arts.bodyart but figured that the Rialto has
an eclectic enough of a following that someone--historian or
linguist or someone who just picked up an odd piece of
trivia--might know.

Yrs, Folo
-- 
Damin de Folo - F.L.Watkins - folo at prairienet.org
Baron Wurm Wald (MidRealm) - Commander Baldwin's (NWTA)


From: dnb105 at psu.edu (Ferret)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: What Did They Call Tattoos Before Captain Cook
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:03:37 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

folo at prairienet.org (F.L. Watkins) writes:

>I cannot find any citations that does not use the oop term
>"tattoo" to describe bodyart prior to the 18th century. I've
>posted on rec.arts.bodyart but figured that the Rialto has
>an eclectic enough of a following that someone--historian or
>linguist or someone who just picked up an odd piece of
>trivia--might know.

The Latin term is compungo and _possibly_ inficio or pictum. the first two 
are verbs the last a noun.I have been researching ancient tatooing in 
Europe for a couple years. The illumination of the subject is very vague and 
questionable esp. in translations. There is new forensic evidence however in 
the 5000 year old body recently recovered in the Oetzval region of the Italo-
Austrian Alps. This body had tattoos of stripes and a (+) cross.

Ferret


From: dnb105 at psu.edu (Ferret)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: What Did They Call Tattoos Before Captain Cook
Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:23:31 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

andrixos at aol.com (Andrixos) writes:
>From: andrixos at aol.com (Andrixos)
>Subject: Re: What Did They Call Tattoos Before Captain Cook
>Date: 18 Jan 1995 21:55:44 -0500

>Ferret wrote about Tatooing terminology

>>The Latin term is compungo and _possibly_ inficio or pictum. the first
>two 
>>are verbs the last a noun.

>Latin teacher here,
>   "pictum" is actually a perfect passive participle from "pingo".  It
>means painted.  My lexicon emphasizes the needle as a tool immediately
>after a brush.  However I b elieve they are referring in general to
>embroidery.

I agree whole heartedly, It is the translators and historians who believe 
these terms are indicative of tatooing although they often get liberal 
with the original works. As for "blue" folks in the north, they were 
neither "blue" nor in the north. The sole source for this was Caesars 
description of the Brittani south of the Thames. Althought the common 
translation is " All the Brittani, indeed, dye themselves with woad, which 
produces a dark blue coloring." the latin reads," Omnes vero se Britanni 
vitro inficiunt, quod caeruleum efficit colorem."First there is no mention 
of woad as the causative agent and second a better rendering would be "dye 
themselves with glazes." There is also the possibility that it read "infect 
themselves with glass" which could have been a description of a 
scarification ritual which left dark blue scars.

These 1st century southern practices have been placed upon the northern 
peoples in an attempt to explain the name Picti which came into use only in 
the 3rd century. The comments on the Picts are that they have "designs 
carved into their faces by iron", sorry I don't have the latin at hand.

There are however many comments by early authors describing such practices 
among the continental peoples. I think Livy, Strabo and Herotodus mention it.

>Picti is the Latin term for those wonderful blue folks to the north. 
>Whether it refers to the wonderful shade of blue they use or tattos fits
>into this question, though I lean toward the  first, without any
>references to fall back on.  Pictophiles?

The name Picti may also refer to their system of writing an large monoliths 
with pictograms (as yet undecipherable) this practice is the forerunner of 
the stone crosses. Rather than meaning "Painted people" it could mean "
people who make pictures".

Ferret


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Henna
From: rowan at isaac.stonemarche.org (Rowan)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 10:51:22 EDT
Organization: Stonemarche CoOperative

Does anyone know how to mix henna for dyeing skin?  I tried it two years 
ago and it left light red marks that went away the day after. I am told 
the original recipe involved camel pee, which I do not relish putting on 
my body even if I could find some.  The henna I used was the Rainbow 
Henna sold to dye hair with and I mixed it with hot water and did my 
hands in patterns and feet solid.  Actually, it did take well on the 
fett, which got me little response from fellow middle-easterners but 
plenty from those who had read Clan of the Cave bear... (wg)

                              Damiana Tryphaena Caecilia Violetta di Caprona
                                              (Heraldsbane)
                                     

From: moreta at prostar.com (Moreta)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Henna
Date: 16 May 95 12:06:59 PDT
Organization: ProStar Internet Gateway

out of curiosity why are you trying to die your skin with henna (maybe 
thats a dumb question.. but.. I have to ask it). From what I know of henna, 
and the dyeing process, it should be warm, but it shouldnt burn your skin. 
I am not sure with the rainbow whether or not its pure henna or if its a 
mixture. also how thick are you making it?  
 Part of the problem with it staying on or around more than likely has to 
do with the oils on your skin. Rather than the strength of the henna or 
heat of the paste made. From what I remember of its ussages on the skin, 
have been in the dyeing of the palms of the hands and the bottoms of the 
feet.. the reason or purpose totally escapes me right now.  (ornamentation 
I believe is the primary reason.. hmm maybe the brain does function) 
 You could try adding other herbs to see if you can get a stronger dye, 
alkanet (which is a red/orange to my eye) or add some red food dye to the 
whole mixture. You also might try using some vinegar in the mixture. 

Mo


From: Lassman at BldgDafoe.Lan1.UManitoba.CA (Linda Lassman)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Henna
Date: Sun, 21 May 1995 23:49:12 GMT
Organization: University of Manitoba

In article <0000054A000021B2 at prostar.com> moreta at prostar.com (Moreta) 
writes:
>From: moreta at prostar.com (Moreta)
>Subject: Henna
>Date: 16 May 95 12:06:59 PDT

>out of curiosity why are you trying to die your skin with henna (maybe 
>thats a dumb question.. but.. I have to ask it). From what I know of henna, 
>and the dyeing process, it should be warm, but it shouldnt burn your skin. 
>I am not sure with the rainbow whether or not its pure henna or if its a 
>mixture. also how thick are you making it? 

The autocrats at an Arabic event we did in July a couple of years ago provided 
henna in the harem for the ladies at the even to use to dye patterns on their 
hands and feet because it was an Arabic sort of thing to do.  The henna 
started out warm, but cooled off during the day, and was made according to the 
directions on the package.  The pattern was painted on as thickly as possible 
(mostly using sticks rather than brushes) and then left to dry until it 
started to flake (about 15-20 min.), then washed off.

While I managed to get my hands scrubbed clean in a few days (except for my 
nails), my feet were patterned for about 3 weeks!

- Gabriela dei Clementini d'Orvieto
  Barony of Castel Rouge, Midrealm
  Winnipeg, Manitoba


From: dnb105 at psu.edu (Ferret)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Anyone seen Braveheart yet?
Date: Thu, 25 May 1995 20:57:56 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

rhonaapfin at aol.com (RhonaapFin) writes:
>From: rhonaapfin at aol.com (RhonaapFin)
>Subject: Re: Anyone seen Braveheart yet?
>Date: 25 May 1995 13:50:07 -0400

>The blue paint is probably intended to simulate woad, which warriors did
>wear in battle.  The Picts were known, I believe, for their practice of
>covering themselves with it and running into battle wearing *only* the
>woad and their weapons. But how a Scot ended up with woad I am not
>certain.    --Arianrhod

I wonder if the person who came up with the idea of blue paint was a 
wargamer ? The old-timers (1960-70s) used to paint celts and picts sky-blue. 
I think they never saw anyone painted with woad. Of course there is no 
documentation concerning woad per se, Caeser said they were _dark_ blue but 
not really how they got that way. Oh well, this is an old rant of mine from 
wargaming days. Anyway, that is a far cry from late medieval Scots.

Ferret 


From: dnb105 at psu.edu (Ferret)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Anyone seen Braveheart yet?
Date: Sat, 27 May 1995 01:58:36 GMT
Organization: Penn State University

cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin) writes:
>What is the bluish pigment used in tatooing?  Might it be that rather than
>being *painted* or *dyed* with woad, people were tatooed with woad pigment?
>That seems like just as plausible a theory as any to me.

Well, the whole woad premise is based on an error in translating Caesar in 
Gallic Wars. No translation I have seen has corrected it. What Caesar says 
is that all the Britons vitro infectunt which is stained themselves with 
glazes (painted) or infected themsleves with glass (tattooing). Since he was 
familiar with the tattoos he may have commented on the brittons either 
because they used painted rather than tatooed, used glass picks to tattoo or 
performed scarification practices. All of these could have left the dark 
blue color that Caesar describes. Later classical and medieval authors refer 
to the "designs cut by iron". Caesar's account is the only non-tattooing 
description (maybe he was in error) so they might have been tattoos. In any 
case none of the authors mention the coloring agents, "woad" was inserted 
by the modern translations.

See Gallic Wars book V page 14

Ferret


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: woad in tattoos
From: una at bregeuf.stonemarche.org (Honour Horne-Jaruk)
Date: Sun, 04 Jun 95 09:21:11 EDT

Jan.Wagner at f56.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Jan Wagner) writes:
> Dear friend,
>    Saw your posting on tatoo and woad. Thought I have no concrete 
> evidence to back me up, I really don't believe woad was used for 
> tatoos. Ink would be the most likely material for tatoos and is made 
> from:water, oak or apple gall (tannic acid), some type of pigment, and 
> a binder(gum arabic). I have the feeling woad would break down in the 
> skin and eventually fade. The blue-black could have been derived from 
> indigo as opposed to woad.
>                                         humbly,
>                          Companion Gytha Anora ni Keran
>                           (who has 2 tatoos made with India ink!)
	Respected Friend:
	The active dye matter in both indigo and woad is the chemical
complex _Indigin_. If indigo remains stable in a tattoo, so will woad;
and if not, not. (Many people have the idea that woad is a paler blue
than indigo. This isn't correct. It just takes more raw woad to produce
a given shade of blue, because pound-for-pound it has less indigin than
Indigo does.)

                                Yours in service to the Society-
                                (Friend) Honour Horne-Jaruk R.S.F. 
                                Alizaunde, Demoiselle de Bregeuf C.O.L. SCA
                                Una Wicca (That Pict)


From: Malcolm Grandis <Malcolm at celtic.demon.co.uk>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: woad in tattoos
Date: 5 Jun 1995 23:05:35 +0100
Organization: None

Woad was certainly used as a tattooing medium in Dark Age Scandinavia 
as well as in Iron Age Britain. The earlier ink recipe given would not 
work as a tattooing medium anyway. I will e-mail a cookie to anybody 
who can work out why! 
         _     _
Try Our /     /   Web Page  http://ifu.net/html/culture/celts/thecelts.htm
        \_ELTI\_


From: Vince Whitmore <rowan at grnf.org>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Woad Page
Date: 17 Jan 1996 18:21:55 GMT
Organization: Grand Rapids Free-Net

I have a Web page I am putting together about woad: the plant, the dye, 
the body paint.  I have some of it put together, come and check it out 
and give me any ideas that you would like to share about it.
Thanks!
Rowan of Wind-tree Tower

Woad Page
http://www.grfn.org/~rowan/woad.html


From: zaphod at zoology.ubc.ca (Lance R. Bailey)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Facial Tattoos
Date: 5 Feb 1997 17:01:39 GMT
Organization: The University of British Columbia

Dennis C. Featherstone (cedar7 at netcom.ca) wrote:
> I am trying to document facial tattoos for 1285 along the Silk Road
> close to Persia & Turkey area.

I teach an ithra class on period body modification. I don't have much in
your geographic/temporal time period, but you might start with

        The use and function of tattooing on Moroccan women
        Searight, Susan

which is a little removed from your area but would make a starting
point.
--
devin o raudh
Barony of Lions Gate, An Tir
http://www.lydia.org/~zaphod/sca


From: "Michael Logue" <mplogue at SPAMLESS.mindless.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 22:34:37 -0400

 Ghazallah wrote:
..
>My persona is North African and I really enjoy wearing my patterns of
>facial tatoos.  The only problem is, if I draw them in with eyeliner, they
>either smear (even with translucent powder) or fade after a couple hours.
>What can I do for a tatoo that lasts on my face for the whole day?
>Ghazallah al-Qamar

I have recently heard of a semi-permanant ink that can be removed by either
alchohol/facial cream (I don't remember precicly).  It was being used for
actors who had the same problem.  I beleive it is also used at some tatoo
palours so the customers can "test" drive their tatoo before they have it
permanently affixed.  It aparently won't wash of with regular soap or
sweat, but can be readily removed by other means.  I would suggest checking
with your local tatooists and ask if they have anything like this.

Michael Logue 
mplogue at mindless.com


From: dughall at imap2.asu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 09:27:57 -0700
Organization: Arizona State University

On 9 Aug 1997, Ghazallah wrote:
> My persona is North African and I really enjoy wearing my patterns of
> facial tatoos.  The only problem is, if I draw them in with eyeliner, they
> either smear (even with translucent powder) or fade after a couple hours. 
> What can I do for a tatoo that lasts on my face for the whole day? 
> Ghazallah al-Qamar

The easiest thing to do is get grease paint... Mehron (brand) grease 
paint goes on with a paintbrush (I use it as a clown) powder well and is 
very solid for 8-10 hours (yes I have had it on that long)  It comes off 
with baby oil very easily.

Grrwffwyrr ap Chwith ap Ysoilhaig
Dughall at IMAP2.asu.edu


From: ghazallah at aol.com (Ghazallah)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: 9 Aug 1997 17:15:26 GMT

thanks, everyone!  I just wanted to say a bit about Henna.  I use it on my
 hair and it makes it very strong and shiny.  At Pennsic, I put it on my
hands and feet.  It lasts on me about a week and is very graceful-looking.
 I recommend using different types, though.  For hair, I use Rainbow
brand, which is consistent in the color from application to application
and lasts at least until my roots start showing.  Mix it with yogurt and
it's easier to wash out, and leaves the hair silky.  For hands, go to an
Indian grocery store and buy it pre-mixed in tubes with very fine nozzles.
 You can also buy stencils and just slather it on.  I love the stuff.

Ghazallah al-Qamar


From: zaphod at zoology.ubc.ca (Lance R. Bailey)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: 9 Aug 1997 20:30:31 GMT
Organization: The University of British Columbia

Jason C Kolton (kolton at kitts.u.arizona.edu) wrote:
> :  Ghazallah wrote in article <19970809005501.UAA08364 at 
ladder01.news.aol.com>.
> : >My persona is North African and I really enjoy wearing my patterns of
> : >facial tatoos.  The only problem is, if I draw them in with eyeliner,
> : they either smear (even with translucent powder) or fade

see below

> Would anybody know where I could find sources on this topic.  While my
> persona does not wear the tatoos I do love arabic history and never heard

One of the definitive source books is:

        Searight, Susan. 1984. The Use and Function of Tattooing on Moroccan
        Women (Vol. 1 - 3). New Haven: Human Relations Area Files.

Whose three volume set goes into great detail about tattoos, henna and
herquas. I use it extensively in my ithra class on Period bodyart.

herquas is the practice of drawing on your skin with ink (mixed with a
few things). and is accurate to the morrocan area. it will last at
least a day.
--
damhi/n o/ ruaidh                       Gold Key, Barony of Lions Gate, An Tir
(i pronounce it "devin o roah")               http://www.lydia.org/~zaphod/sca


From: georg hawks <thegeorg at servtech.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 09:40:55 -0400
Organization: IBM Microelectronics Division

dughall at imap2.asu.edu wrote:
> On 9 Aug 1997, Ghazallah wrote:
> > My persona is North African and I really enjoy wearing my patterns of
> > facial tatoos.  The only problem is, if I draw them in with eyeliner, they
> > either smear (even with translucent powder) or fade after a couple hours.
> > What can I do for a tatoo that lasts on my face for the whole day?
> > Ghazallah al-Qamar
>
> The easiest thing to do is get grease paint... Mehron (brand) grease
> paint goes on with a paintbrush (I use it as a clown) powder well and is
> very solid for 8-10 hours (yes I have had it on that long)  It comes off
> with baby oil very easily.

Another tip I learned from a clown, and have used successfully onstage
with heavy makeup under hot lights:

Keep a washcloth soaked in astringent in a cooler- Sea Breeze works very
well. BEFORE putting on any makeup, rub the cold astringent all over
your face. This closes your pores, and it takes longer for your face to
start sweating. This definitely works for a few hours in extreme heat.

georg
non ani sunt permittendi


From: XSimmons <"jls9" at  MSG.TI.COM>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 11:23:00 -0500

Ghazallah wrote:
> My persona is North African and I really enjoy wearing my patterns of
> facial tatoos. <SNIP>
> What can I do for a tatoo that lasts on my face for the whole day?
> Ghazallah al-Qamar

   Okay, it isn't Period, or a native concoction, but it works.  My
Persian personna had the same problem with patterned hands and
feet--hand/finger skin flexes a lot, and you have to handle so many
different items during the day that makeup stuff isn't terribly
practical.  Imagine my surprise when a lady suggested washable marker
pens (e.g., "Crayola" brand, which I now use).  Black, brown and red are
available to cover all henna/ink needs, and the stuff comes off with
facial scrub.  (Stuff with almond shells works great.  Soap and a
teaspoon of sugar would possibly also work.)

The slender pen shape draws a fine line with good control for
spectacularly intricate patterns that last at least a day, but come off
at your command.  I use brown for hands and fingers, black for first
joints and toes.  But that's Persian.  (Solid red soles and toes also
Persian.)

Regards, Ly Meara al-Isfahani


From: hrjones at uclink.berkeley.edu (Heather Rose Jones)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca,alt.fairs.renaissance
Subject: Re: Tattoos
Date: 7 Aug 1997 02:08:10 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

Joe Della-Fera (jgandalf at mindspring.com) wrote:
: Since tattooing has been in existance in Europe for a few thousand
: years (witness the "Ice Man" mummy), I've got to ask: What were
: tattoos called during the Medieval and Renaissance periods in Europe?
: (Remember, tattoo is taken from the Polynesian word "tatu".)

There is a flaw in the above logic. We have evidence that tattooing was
done in Europe several thousand years ago; we have evidence that tattooing
is done in Europe today. But that does not prove continuous existence. 
_Is_ there any evidence that people were doing tattooing during the
Medieval and Renaissance periods in Europe. After all, people tend to have
words for things they do, and why would the word "tattoo"  have been
borrowed for the practice if it were a practice that European people were
already familiar with and had a word for? 

To answer my own question about "is there any evidence", I'll note that
when I was researching early references to the Picts, I found that, while
the Classical references use the root "pictum" meaning "painted" to
describe their characteristic feature, by the time we get to the 7th
century writings of Isidore of Seville, he has changed this description to
"their bodies bear designs pricked into their skins by needles" -- I
believe using the word "punctum" (I don't have the original reference
handy, but this seems the obvious origin of the translation). Now, the
difference between "pictum" and "punctum" _could_ be a matter of a bad
copyist or two in the intervening centuries, but the specific description
of "pricked ... by needles" strongly argues a familiarity with a
tattoo-like procedure -- at least on the part of Isidore. (Note that since
the change in the description from "pictum" to "punctum" first shows up in
the 7th century, its use says absolutely _nothing_ about what the Picts
may or may not have done.) On the other hand, Isidore's presumed
familiarity seems to have been at a cultural remove -- i.e., he describes
the process but does not have a distinctive "name" for it (at least in
Latin). But there's a place to start, at least. A 7th century Spaniard was
familiar at some level with a process involving marking designs on the
body by pricking with needles. A useful path to pursue from there would be
to find a library that has a comprehensive dictionary or concordence of
medieval Latin and see if any other writers were useing the verb "pungo"
or the participle "punctum" to describe a tattoo-like process. Keep in
mind that given the location of Seville, he may have been familiar with
the process via contacts with northern Africa, rather than from its use in
Europe, per se.

(If you want to track down the exact citation from Isidore, I took it from
F.T. Wainwright's "The Problem of the Picts" p.1.)

Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn


From: Rachel Ward <ez064559 at mailbox.ucdavis.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca,alt.fairs.renaissance
Subject: Re: Tattoos
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 00:07:16 -0700
Organization: University of California, Davis

On 7 Aug 1997, Heather Rose Jones wrote:
> A useful path to pursue from there would be
> to find a library that has a comprehensive dictionary or concordence of
> medieval Latin and see if any other writers were useing the verb "pungo"
> or the participle "punctum" to describe a tattoo-like process. 

Latham's _Revised Medieval Latin Word List_ lists "puncto" as
tentatively (i.e., they have a question mark before the meaning) meaning
"to tattoo"--but the dates are way after Isidore, in the 12th century.

"Now is nat that of God a ful fair grace  |Rachel Ward
That swich a lewed mannes wit shal pace   |Department of English
The wisdom of an heep of lerned men?"     |U.C. Davis
Chaucer, _Canterbury Tales_, I 573-575    |rhward at ucdavis.edu


From: dongiulio at aol.com (DonGIULIO)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Tattoos
Date: 8 Aug 1997 01:39:05 GMT

I don't know what they called Tattooing in Europe during the Middle and
Renaissance Periods but, it seems there is evidence that they did Tattoo
in the Middle ages during the crusades to be exact.

 Just finished watching A&E's : Ancient Mysteries and they just ran a
program on Tattoos, I highly recommend it if you can catch it. Essentially
gives the History of Tattooing from the "Ice Man" to Modern times quite
fascinating!

Don Giulio d" Medici
G.M. Cavalieri Dell'Ordine de Santo Stefano
"Onore et Onere"


From: Merouda the True of Bornover <keltia at serv.net>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Tattoos
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 11:08:26 -0700

DonGIULIO wrote:
> I don't know what they called Tattooing in Europe during the Middle and
> Renaissance Periods but, it seems there is evidence that they did Tattoo
> in the Middle ages during the crusades to be exact.

What they said about tattooing during the Crusades was that the crusaders
themselves had crosses tattooed on their bodies so that if they died they
would be recognized and given a Christian burial.  But I don't remember a
mention them during that time for other reasons.

It *was* a good show but oh so short.

Merouda, or she who is 12th century and has a tattoo that gets shown during
hot weather and doesn't really care if it's period or not *grin*


From: Lou Stewart <lhs at ctwok.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Tattoos
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 18:14:34 -0500

Steven Jerkins wrote: 
> Now when WAS that papal bull issued that forbade all good christians
> from "adorning their bodies with inks and needles"??
> 
> Stefan
> 
> On Thu, 07 Aug 1997 00:30:19 GMT, jgandalf at mindspring.com (Joe
> Della-Fera) wrote:
> 
> >Since tattooing has been in existance in Europe for a few thousand
> >years (witness the "Ice Man" mummy), I've got to ask: What were
> >tattoos called during the Medieval and Renaissance periods in Europe?
> >(Remember, tattoo is taken from the Polynesian word "tatu".)
> >
> >Joe

In Roman times,the Tracians were well known to the Romans for their
decorative tattooing; Cicero called the marks "punctum notis Thraeciis,"
meaning pricked with Thracian marks.  Tertullian, in the 3rd century,
implied that tattooing was the custom of the Britons, Picts and Scots,
and called the marks "Stigmata Britonum."  In the 16th century, it
became the custom of pilgrims to Jerusalem to have crosses or other
Christian symbols pricked onto their arms.  The practice has been called
"pricking," "marking" or "painting," in English and in equivalent words
in other languages.
I didn't find a reference to a Papal Bull against tattooing, but
Leviticus 19:28 and 21:5, as well as Deuteronomy 14:1 carried
prohibitions against it.  At the Synod of Calcuth in Northumberland in
787, all forms of tattooing were forbidden, probably because of pagan
associations.  
Hope this helps.  Luigsech


From: Glenda Robinson <glendar at antispam.compassnet.com.au>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Arabic Facial Tatoos
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 09:51:36 +1000
Organization: Flamberge Computer Services

XSimmons wrote:
>  Imagine my surprise when a lady suggested washable marker
> pens (e.g., "Crayola" brand, which I now use).  Black, brown and red are
> available to cover all henna/ink needs, and the stuff comes off with
> facial scrub.  (Stuff with almond shells works great.  Soap and a
> teaspoon of sugar would possibly also work.)
> 
> The slender pen shape draws a fine line with good control for
> spectacularly intricate patterns that last at least a day, but come off
> at your command.  I use brown for hands and fingers, black for first
> joints and toes.  But that's Persian.  (Solid red soles and toes also
> Persian.)
> 
> Regards, Ly Meara al-Isfahani

When one of my groups do ancient celtic reenactment, we use "Woadline".
Blue "Artline" brand. Works wonderfully.

However, a word of warning... Use pens that are Xylene free. One of our
mob had a Xylene allergy, which built up with time. This was before they
produced Xylene free ones.
Also, don't use white board markers. They run really quickly.

The only problem with Woadline is that some extremely small bits may get
stick in the hair follicles (not much though) for a few days.

Happy painting

Glenda.


From: SiFiFem at aol.com
Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 03:27:47 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Sources for Woad

Stefan-

Please add these people to your source list of period herbs, spices and those
hard to find historical feast items.  They also carry woad and henna as used
for body tattoo and henna painting.  They have been doing SCA on the west
coast for 12 years.    Their store is :  Dragonmarsh - 3744 Main St .-
Riverside, Ca 92501
- Phone is (909) 276-1116.     Thanks


Subject: ANST - Re: Tattoos
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 99 15:48:19 MST
From: Gunnora Hallakarva <gunnora at bga.com>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

'wolf said:
> question ... how many work their tattoo work into their
> personas / realities ???  know a couple from the "old
> days", but haven't run into any in the current
> days ... any good references on ancient tattoo
> practices ???

Judging by the number of times I get Viking Answer Lady questions on this
topic, a LOT of Norse types out there want authentic Viking tattoos.

The Arabic observer Ibn Fadlan tells us of the Rus Vikings:

"¤ 81.  Each man has an axe, a sword, and a knife and keeps each by him at
all times.   The swords are broad and grooved, of Frankish sort.  Every man
is tatooed from finger nails to neck with dark green (or green or
blue-black) trees, figures, etc."

Probably what Ibn Fadlan is describing here is some sort of knotwork or
tendril design.

Of course, the only way we actually will ever have ANY record of period
tattoo designs is from the occasional hapless person who got themselves
frozen or freeze-dried. Under  the "frozen" category, we have Otzi the
Iceman.  As far as freeze-dried, we have several examples of Scythians
buried in kurgans where the burial chamber was below the level of the
permafrost, which preserved their bodies perfectly.

You can ge some info on both  (including pictures of the Scythian tattoos)
at http://www.tattoo.dk/engelske/history-english/oldest.htm

I also have one good book on the Scythians by Renate Rolle that has better
line drawings of the Scythian tatoos as well.

::GUNNORA::


Subject: ANST - More on Tattoos, Scythians, and Celts
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 99 19:47:19 MST
From: Gunnora Hallakarva <gunnora at bga.com>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

'wolf asked:
> is this a decent resource?  have a particular fondness for
> the "horse barbarian" ciltures, especially the scythian and
> was thinking of incorporating something with scythian /
> pictish iconography into the master plan.

Your fondness is perhaps more Celto-tribal than you know.  The Romans
fetched with them to Britain fairly large numbers of... you guessed it,
Sarmatian auxiliaries (a people very closely related to the Scythians).
Some very well-researched scholarship beginning with Georges Dumezil, has
gone into quite a lot of detail proving that the origin of the entire Grail
Cycle was these auxiliaries.  (For instance,
see http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~tomgreen/arthur.htm)

But even before then, the Celts originally migrated from the area that the
Scythians and Sarmatians called their home, so it is also very possible that
the Celts brought these legends (and art and other cultural baggage) with
them in their migrations north and west.

Here are some sources:

I believe that the first report of Scythian tattoos surviving in
freeze-dried kurgan occupants was in the May 1965 Scientific American.

Rolle, Renate.  The World of the Scythians.  London: B.T. Batsford.  1980.
ISBN 0520068645. [Contains some very incorrect information, but also has
some of the best pictures of horse trappings, tattoos, and line-art of
Scythian artifacts I've ever seen.  Get the book for the pictures.  Get
better sources for the real meat of the subject.]

Rudenko, Sergei I. Frozen Tombs of Siberia: the Pazyryk Burials of Iron Age
Horsemen. Berkeley: The University of California Press. 1970.
[Probably the best over-all source on the kurgans and their frozen
inhabitants.]

"Nyt om gammelt m, artikel af S¿ren Nanche-Krogh om hans tatoveringer".
Skalk No 4, 1969.
[Magazine with article on Scythian tattooing, in Danish.]

Cernenko, E.V.  The Scythians: 700 - 300 B.C.  Men-at-Arms Series 137.
London: Osprey.  1983. [Very good book -- nice reconstructions of Scythian
costume, arms and armor. No tattoos.]

M. I. Artamonov. Treasures from Scythian tombs in the Hermitage Museum,
Leningrad.  ISBN 0500231125.[Contains some of the most famous and most
beautiful photos of Scythian artifacts, particularly the gold belongings of
chieftains.]

Glusker Irwin, Christian von Rosenvinge and Lilly Hollander, eds.  From the
Lands of the Scythians: Ancient Treasures from the Museums of the U.S.S.R.,
3000 B.C.-100 B.C.  New York:  (Museum Catalog)  Metropolitan Museum of Art
in conjunction with the Los Angeles County Museum of Art.  1975. [This book
has many gorgeous photos of the most spectacular Scythian art and artifacts
known today.  No tattoos, but
lots of very worthwhile art and art design.]

Michael Vickers. Scythian Treasures in Oxford (Ashmolean Museum Archaeology,
History & Classical Studies) Oxford: Ashmolean. 1979.  ISBN 0900090618. [I
have a copy of this one.  This contains info only on the Scythian artifacts
held at the Ashmolean Museum, and this is a fairly small collection.  None
the less, the information is very interesting and there's some nice jewellry
pictured. No tattoos.]

Minns, Ellis H.  Scythians and Greeks:  A Survey of Ancient History and
Archaeology on the North Coast of the Euxine from the Danube to the
Caucasus.  Cambridge: Cambridge Univ. P.  1913.  [Very dry, but also very
informative. Predates the frozen kurgan finds.]

Herodotus.  Selections from the Persian Wars, Book IV. from The Greek
Historian.  ed. Francis R. B. Gondolphin.  New York: Random House.  1942.
[This is the famous description of the Scythians and the Sarmatians.]

Here's another website that shows more of the Scythian tattoos... too bad
the book being advertised is $108 -- you might, however, ask Sir Corey or
Lady Jan if they own a copy.  The tattoo shop in San Marcos isn't too far to
go to loook at it:
http://www.zapcom.net/~phoenix/TriBible.html

see also

Mummified Scythians and their Tattoos
http://tattoos.com/jane/steve/mummies.htm

Scientists work to preserve 3,000-year-old mummy found in Siberia
http://detnews.com/menu/stories/14161.htm

Scythian Archaeology of the Middle Don River Basin
http://www.upenn.edu/museum/News/CentralAsiaArchy/Scythians.html

A HairRaising Report of A Modern Archaeological Excavation of a Kurgan
http://www.asianart.com/forum/golden.html

The Center for the Study of the Eurasian Nomads
http://garnet.berkeley.edu/~jkimball/table.contents.html

Ukrainian Museum of Historical Treasures (Scythian Gold) in the Monastary of
the Caves-Pecherska-Lavra
http://mat.hut.fi/Ukraine/Kiev_Historical.html

This should get you started!

::GUNNORA::


Subject: henna
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 01:26:37 MST
From: "karinac" <karinac at wizzards.net>
To: "Mark.S Harris (rsve60)" <rsve60 at email.sps.mot.com>

I do henna designs on my body on a regular basis. this is what works for me
1.Make some black or green tea
2. sift henna through a fine mesh kitchen filter(found eisily at your local
grocery store)
3. mix henna with black or green tea until it is the consistency of tempera
paint, (the ready made paint you used in school that smelled like wet chalk)
4. add a bit of lemon juice.(one must experiment with this becase of varying
degrees of skin acididty.....that is why henna works well on some and not at
all on others, the lemon adds necessary acids)
5. use a thin detail paint brush and paint the desired design....
6. wait for it to dry, then pat some lemon juice on with a cotton ball or a
wedge of lemon.... be careful not to smear your design..
7. repaint your design on the cracks in the henna (use a bobby pin and a
papertowel to fix the inevitable mistakes)
8.repeat steps 6 and 7 until you are sick and tired of it ...

    the longer the henna is on your skin and being doused with lemon juice
the darker your designs will be ...

there is a teqnique i heard one time that you SCAers might be able to try.
While waiting for the henna to dry hold hands and feet in campfire smoke...
this is supposed to turn the henna black or dark brown

have fun painting

<the end>
Edited by Mark S. Harris	tattoos-msg