eggs-msg - 1/17/08 Medieval eggs. Recipes. Substitutions for eggs in medieval recipes. NOTE: See also the files: egg-storage-msg, eggs-stuffed-msg, fowls-a-birds-msg, chicken-msg, birds-recipes-msg, breakfast-msg, frittours-msg, Scotch-Eggs-msg, caviar-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ From: allilyn at juno.com (LYN M PARKINSON) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:03:41 EDT Subject: SC - Re: Arme Ritter The name comes from modern German cookbooks, but the practice was taught me by my son's German in-laws. The families became close--that's how the kids met and married. They are supportive of my desire to trace down the history of some of the foods, and to find and translate receiptes. They use thick, handcut slices of good bread, and dip them into finely grated crumbs before frying them. They are served with fried apple slices, or with the apfelmuss. (That double s should be a German character) They are more likely to sprinkle with cinnamon and sugar before serving, I frequently put nutmeg into the egg mixture, because that's the way I like it. The idea was that the poorest knights might be able to eat an egg--stretched--but couldn't afford to kill the chicken! I suppose, if your were a poor knight out on campaign, you could find an egg, some bread, and whatever the local orchard had on the tree. It can also be found in _Wie man eyn teutsches Mannsbild bey Krafften halt_. by H. Jurgen Fahrenkamp. This is a book that's probably something like To A King's Taste--I forget. It has modern redactions, in German, by an author who has taken them from a variety of sources. He doesn't give the originals. This dish he gives another name, saying it's a fantasy name of something that was formerly known as 'Arme Ritter'. 8 Scheiben Weissbrot 8 slices white bread 1/4 l Milch 1 C. milk 3 Eier 3 eggs Paniermehl bread crumbs Zimt cinnamon Zucker sugar 50 g Schmalz lard (or other frying substance) Dazu passt ein fruchtiger Obstsalat, (he calls for a 'fruit salad' rather than the apple slices or apple sauce) You could use a hot fruit compote, or any fruit that was in season. Enjoy... Allison From: "Philip W. Troy" <troy at asan.com> Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 22:02:43 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - Yolks vs whites linneah at erols.com wrote: > Pardon my ignorance, as you all have many times before, but what does an egg > yolk do (other than fat and taste) that egg white doesn't? I'm trying to keep the > fat content down as much as possible and was wondering if substituting would > effect anything seriously. I know that the taste will be different, but what > else? > > Linneah There are some dishes in which the substitution of egg whites for whole eggs or yolks would make a big difference. While the yolk contains virtually all of the fat of the egg, the white contains most of the protein. Albumen in the white tends to curdle when cooked, so it isn't as good for things like custards as yolks or whole eggs would be. Also, without the fat, baked goods tend to be a bit tougher. Conversely, egg yolks generally tenderize baked goods, since they contribute some shortening fat. I suspect the thing to do is to find some recipes that use egg whites, so as eliminate at least some of the less effective experimentation. Off the top of my head, I think I recall that there are various biscuit recipes that call for egg whites (certainly things like the white bisket bread found in Elinor Fettiplace, which is essentially meringue, and quite period, no matter what you may have read). Ditto macaroons. Also the cheesecake called sambucade in the Forme of Cury uses egg whites and a curd cheese, which could easily be of the low-fat variety. I'm sure there are several others, but would have to check into this a bit deeper. Happy hunting! Adamantius From: Uduido at aol.com Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 09:15:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SC - Yolks and Copyright << what does an egg yolk do (other than fat and taste) that egg white doesn't? >> Egg yolks tend to thicken the recipes they are used in while egg whites (e.g. cakes, souffles ) add a "lightening" effect. Recipes which specifically call for the use of yolks (e.g. sauces, soups) cannot (and , indeed, should not) be substituted. Lord Ras (Uduido at aol.com) From: Lasairina at aol.com Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 19:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - Yolks vs whites One thing it does is give the whites some body...if you have ever tried to make an egg white omlete, or just scrambled egg whites, they come out a bit like styrafoam. Absolutely no body. But adding just one yolk to 3 or 4 whites seems to work okay. Lassar Fhina From: Mark Schuldenfrei <schuldy at abel.MATH.HARVARD.EDU> Date: Fri, 2 May 1997 14:52:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - Yolks vs whites Pardon my ignorance, as you all have many times before, but what does an egg yolk do (other than fat and taste) that egg white doesn't? I'm trying to keep the fat content down as much as possible and was wondering if substituting would effect anything seriously. I know that the taste will be different, but what else? Welcome to my little hell. (I follow the Ornish Heart Disease Reversal diet, which is a fat free vegetarian diet...) Eggs are fats, proteins and flavors, in a tidy package. The fats (and many of the nutritional components) live in the yolk only. As you have guessed, two whites can be substituted for a whole egg in most recipes, without a problem. Many coronary diets will substitute a tablespoon of poly-unsaturated fats, such as canola/rapeseed oil, for a yolk in recipes where fats are required. I have used many of the fat free egg substitutes in my cooking, and have found that Egg Beaters brand tastes and cooks closest to an egg. Unspiced and scrambled, it is a little off... but with the merest hint of spices, it feels just like a regular egg. It is, primarily, egg whites with coloring and some stabilizers. Tibor (or his modern counterpart) From: Uduido at aol.com Date: Sun, 15 Jun 1997 08:55:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SC - eggs << What do you think this "draw them through a strainer" means? >> IMO, this means exactly that. The reason being to strain out the less tasty parts of the egg such as blood. In todays world of supermarket infertle eggs we frequently forget or, in some case are not aware of the particularly less desirable bits that are found floating about in fertilized eggs. Even tho' I do not strain eggs per se, having lived on a farm for most of my life, I am still in the habit of breaking eggs into a little dish to check for blood and beginning embyos. I would most certainly agree that a strained egg bears not the remotest ressemblance to a "beaten" egg. IMHO, if we take the time to stand back and think about the way things were before the technology of today, many curiousities of the past become glaringly understandable. Lord Ras From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Date: Sun, 15 Jun 1997 09:15:38 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - meringue Mark Harris wrote: > mar-Joshua ibn-Eleazar ha-Shalib declared today on June 14, > > > we know that medieval people separated > >eggs, we know that they beat eggs (sorta -- it's usually described as > >"draw them through a strainer") > > What do you think this "draw them through a strainer" means? If they > meant to beat the egg, then it would seem much easier to beat it in > a bowl and say so. I imagine someone pushing an egg through a strainer > but that doesn't end up with a similar result as beating, unless I've > got a mistaken idea of what beating an egg is supposed to do. So how > do we get from "draw them through a strainer" to "beat the eggs"? > > Stefan li Rous Well, the acts of drawing the eggs through a strainer and beating them are only similar inasmuch as they produce a similar effect. Both break the egg "fibers" (Goo?) up into smaller pieces and mix them together, until reaching the point where a homogeneous mass is produced. Taking it still further, both processes introduce tiny air bubbles into the mass, and when enough air bubbles are introduced, the characteristics of the eggs change, generally getting lighter in color and going from what is clearly a foam with visible bubbles, on to a sort of cream. This works on egg whites, on yolks, and on whole eggs, although the phenomenon is easiest to produce in whites in most cases. Putting it another way, take apart your "balloon" wire egg whip. Weave those wires into a sort of basket: you know, a strainer. Fix it so that the basket passes through the eggs (or vice versa) repeatedly, and the phenomenon described above will usually occur, barring certain variables like high humidity, the presence of too much fat, the wrong pH, etc. Let's just say for practical purposes it always happens. Probably the easiest thing to do is to try it. It works. Ideally you want a conical sieve (called, erroneously and shockingly non-PC in the food service industry, a "China cap"). Pour in your eggs -- whites work best for a simple demonstration -- and use some implement like a small 1- or 2-ounce ladel like a plunger to pump the eggs through the strainer, catching them in a bowl underneath. When the bowl is full and the strainer empty, switch the eggs back into the strainer and repeat the process. Depending on the variables mentioned previously, it usually takes three or four passes to produce a meringue-like foam. Adamantius From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 15:03:54 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - eggs Mark Harris wrote: > My question about how the recipe redactors get from "draw them through > a strainer" to "beat the egg" is still unanswered. Is this a reasonable > redaction? Why? As I said earlier, it depends on which particular effect of "drawing the eggs through a strainer" you are referring to. Straining them will A) remove any bits of shell, fertilized embryos, and white stringy stuff whose Greek-sounding name eludes me at the moment, B) aerate them to some extent, and C) mix them to some extent. SO, effects B) and C) are also accomplished by beating. A) generally is not. If effects B) and C) appear to be what the original recipe's author is looking for -- if, for instance, he says that the eggs should be drawn through a strainer til they be chergeaunt, or stondyng, or whatever -- then it is pretty clear that that can be accomplished with beating. Since several period recipes specify drawing the eggs through a strainer to remove the "films" or white threads, then I would just strain them. A great deal of the medieval cookery game seems to require discretion. That's why I like it ; ). Adamantius Lotsa discretion, no tact... From: "Marisa Herzog" <marisa_herzog at macmail.ucsc.edu> Date: 16 Jun 1997 12:04:14 -0700 Subject: Re: SC - eggs << What do you think this "draw them through a strainer" means? >> >IMO, this means exactly that. The reason being to strain out the >less tasty parts of the egg such as blood. While that might be part of it, I don't believe that this is really a practicle take. Yes, hens with a rooster produce developing eggs, but you can't "strain" blood out- and I'll just leave that at that to not get nasty. Breaking eggs into a separate container from the rest of the mix to check them for bits one wouldn't want to cook with, would I am sure be explained as just that. Putting raw eggs through some sort of mesh would mix them together quickly without the labor of beating, and putting cooked (say hard boiled) eggs through a mesh would make them into a nicely mixed crumbly substance easily mixed into whatever else. From: Uduido at aol.com Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 23:06:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - eggs << My question about how the recipe redactors get from "draw them through a strainer" to "beat the egg" is still unanswered. Is this a reasonable redaction? Why? >> I do not feel that this is a reasonable redaction, personally, for the reasons I stated before. However, by a stretch of the imagination , I suppose one could get this impression from the resulting product of such straining. IMHO, the straining was meant to be a practical method of removing extraneous material, be it straw, manure, egg shell bits,or embryo, etc. Lord Ras Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 20:09:10 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - non-chicken eggs Mark Harris wrote: > Where would you get duck or goose eggs? Do some groceries carry them? Yes. Probably the best place to get them is on a farm, but I've seen them many times in Asian markets. > I've never had them. Are they bigger? richer? or what compared to > chicken eggs? Duck eggs are a bit larger than a standard jumbo hen's egg, and a goose egg larger still, sometimes with a volume roughly equal to that of a billiard ball. They are richer than hen's eggs, with a higher fat content in the yolk. > Any medieval recipes for things like turtle eggs? Or were there no > big turtles in Europe? There may have occasionally been some kind of sea turtles going ashore on the Atlantic coasts, but I'm not aware of any period recipes for them. There IS a subtlety mentioned in one of the late-period or post-period sources, which calls for making a giant artifical hard-boiled egg out of a dozen hen's eggs. That's about the closest I can think of, offhand. If I remember correctly, the eggs of reptiles have no albumen in them, so there is no "white" to speak of. If you boil an alligator egg, I understand that the yolk cooks as you might expect, but the clear liquid remains just that. Adamantius Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 20:37:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu> Subject: Re: SC - non-chicken eggs Excerpts from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 21-Aug-97 Re: SC - non-chicken eggs by Philip & Susan Troy at asan > There IS a subtlety mentioned in one of the late-period or post-period > sources, which calls for making a giant artifical hard-boiled egg out of > a dozen hen's eggs. That's about the closest I can think of, offhand. If > I remember correctly, the eggs of reptiles have no albumen in them, so > there is no "white" to speak of. If you boil an alligator egg, I > understand that the yolk cooks as you might expect, but the clear liquid > remains just that. I believe it's the Book of Good Spice (whose German Name I don't remember at the moment), so end of the 15th C. toodles, margaret Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 23:00:27 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - non-chicken eggs Gretchen M Beck wrote: > > There IS a subtlety mentioned in one of the late-period or post-period > > sources, which calls for making a giant artifical hard-boiled egg out of > > a dozen hen's eggs. > I believe it's the Book of Good Spice (whose German Name I don't > remember at the moment), so end of the 15th C. That would be Das Buoch Von Guter Speiss you're thinking of, but I could swear this was a late 16th- or early 17th-century English source. I'll have to check on this. I think it's the Second Part of the Good Housewife's Jewell. Adamantius Date: Fri, 22 Aug 1997 05:59:14 EDT From: tuckers323 at juno.com (Carla S. Tucker) Subject: Re: SC - non-chicken eggs On Thu, 21 Aug 1997 20:09:10 -0400 Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> writes: >Mark Harris wrote: >> I've never had them. Are they bigger? richer? or what compared to >> chicken eggs? > >Duck eggs are a bit larger than a standard jumbo hen's egg, and a goose >egg larger still, sometimes with a volume roughly equal to that of a >billiard ball. They are richer than hen's eggs, with a higher fat >content in the yolk. My grandmother who ate goose eggs frequently as a child on a farm in Canada claims they are bitter and leave an unpleasant aftertaste. Could it be that whatever they fed the birds made their eggs taste bad? Carla tuckers323 at juno.com From: yumitori at marsweb.com (Ron Martino Jr) Date: Sun, 29 Jun 1997 20:25:05 -0600 Subject: Re: SC - eggs > << My question about how the recipe redactors get from "draw them through > a strainer" to "beat the egg" is still unanswered. Is this a reasonable > redaction? Why? >> > > I do not feel that this is a reasonable redaction, personally, for the > reasons I stated before. However, by a stretch of the imagination , I suppose > one could get this impression from the resulting product of such straining. > IMHO, the straining was meant to be a practical method of removing extraneous > material, be it straw, manure, egg shell bits,or embryo, etc. > > Lord Ras My (farm-raised) two cents - between washing the eggs and using a separate bowl to crack them into, you can deal most every problem except egg shells. That doesn't seem to be a sufficent reason for the common directive to strain the eggs... Yumitori Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 22:49:19 -0800 From: charding at nwlink.com (Cathy Harding) Subject: Re: SC - Small Feasts >Maeve said: >>The day of the contest, I cooked leeks in almond milk, a dish of beans and >>peas( peas cooked in ale and caraway), hard boiled quails eggs, Hens of >>greece, ruzzge cakes and a clever dish of plums. > >Where did you get quails eggs? Are these something that you find in your >grocery store? I assume you hard boil them like chicken eggs. Do they >taste different or are they just smaller or colored differently? A friend found them in the food coop in Eugene on the way back from an event in southern Oregon. I just boiled them like chicken eggs. they taste very good, better than chicken eggs. They are much smaller and the shells are mottled. Inside they look much like chicken eggs. >What are Hens of greece? recipe? It is a recipe from ein guter spise. I forget which one. I took eggs beaten up with spices (caraway and ginger come to mind) and put this in the bottom of a greased springform pan. Then I took bread (w/o crusts) and dipped in milk and them eggs and them semmel (which I took to mean semolina - - I used semolina flour) and fried them, them placed that in the egg mixture, then chopped up chicken which had been roasted with bacon, then apple rounds also fried and kept layering till the pan was full. I put an oven proof pie pan with pie weights on the top to weigh it down and then baked till the egg was cooked. Turn it out and serve with a wine ginger sauce. It was good. > Stefan li Rous Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 12:01:01 -0700 From: kat <kat at kagan.com> Subject: SC - re: eggs brid asks: > along the lines of the versions of pickled eggs and tea eggs: > Isn't there a recipe somewhere that calls for hardboiling eggs over a very low > heat for a number of hours in a bath of onion broth or something of the like- > for the flavor as well as the color? Yes! It's a Jewish recipe; I helped Merrin (Na'Arah) make them for the Feast of Jewish Holidays. (I think I'm STILL full from all that food... ) You can do them on stovetop or in the oven; we used the oven at about 250*, overnight in a turkey roaster. One hundred fifty eggs, the skin of a half dozen onions, cover with water, done the next morning. Gorgeous things... - kat Date: Sun, 19 Oct 1997 23:25:53 -0400 From: Ceridwen <ceridwen at commnections.com> Subject: Re: SC - eggs > Do quail eggs really taste that much differnet from chicken eggs? If > not, they sound like a lot more work. For that matter, do eggs from > chickens, geese, quail, ducks etc taste different, if they are all > farm raised? I have heard that there is a differance between farm- > raised and free-range chickens but I'm asking about just farm-raised > eggs since that is likely to be all I'm going to be able to get. > > Stefan li Rous Quail eggs are somewhat different than chicken eggs, being slightly milder and creamier in texture. The difference would only be important to me if the recipe featured the eggs as flavoring. They are a lot more work, as there are about 8 quail eggs to 1 chicken egg. The first week that I got eggs from my quail, I made fried quail eggs and silver dollar pancakes for Saturday brunch... about a dozen each was a good serving size. They are just too cute! Free range chicken eggs are somewhat stronger flavored and have a yellower yolk due to the variations in diet, but there is no discernible difference in nutritional value. Duck and goose eggs are much different, with their own flavors, not easily described..... I can remember their tastes, even after 25 years, but simply can't put it into words. Ceridwen Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 09:11:53 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - eggs Mark Harris wrote: > Do quail eggs really taste that much differnet from chicken eggs? If > not, they sound like a lot more work. As I put on my Devil's advocate hat: my experience has been that they taste almost identical to hen's eggs. They are also somewhat more work, since their size affects the surface-area:mass ratio, meaning more square inches of shell per ounce of egg. So, six ounces of quail eggs will have more shell to remove than six ounces of hen's eggs. That being said, they do have a major advantage for the type of thing we use them for: their appearance and size. This isn't something I would ever say lightly, but they do have major cute factor at work. Normally I don't do cute food. I am more proud of a fine sauce than of any number of subtleties I have made, so normally something like the cute factor of a little egg wouldn't matter to me. But quail eggs are cool nonetheless. > For that matter, do eggs from > chickens, geese, quail, ducks etc taste different, if they are all > farm raised? I have heard that there is a differance between farm- > raised and free-range chickens but I'm asking about just farm-raised > eggs since that is likely to be all I'm going to be able to get. Hen's eggs do, however, taste different from the eggs of ducks and geese. Never tasted a turkey egg, so I wouldn't be able to address that one, but duck and goose eggs, either just because they are different birds from chickens, or perhaps because they are waterfowl, are much richer than hen's eggs, with a slight tang of sulfur to the yolk, which means it's a bad move to seriously overcook them, or to eat them when they aren't fresh. Mrs. Beeton swears by them for custards,though, and a couple of New York pastry chefs have been getting them in for that purpose, as a matter of fact. See? You CAN learn something from old cookbooks! Adamantius Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 08:27:52 EDT From: "Chanda Shaffer" <leanche at hotmail.com> Subject: Pickled egg recipes >RUBY EGGS > Hard boil & peel about a dozen eggs. Open 2 cans of pickled, sliced >beets. Heat liquid from beets with dill, garlic, peppercorns, bayleaf, <snip> >Angelique Mi'lady Angelique, Your pickeled eggs sound wonderful. I have never tried them with dill and garlic. I will try it in the next batch I make. I make a similar recipe but I make my own pickling liquid. I use equal amounts of regular canned sliced beets-pour in the juice, sugar and cider vinegar. heat in a saucepan with a sliced red onion and a handful of whole cloves and a cinnamon stick. In a gallon glass jar, layer the beets and peeled hard boiled eggs. Pour the hot liquid over the eggs and cover. keep in the fridge for a few days to let the liquid seep into the eggs. A gallon sized jar will hold about 1 1/2 doz. eggs and three cans of beets with pickling liquid. BTW if the eggs aren't gone in about a week they get kind of rubbery but will still make wonderful deviled eggs Ivy~ Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 10:30:52 -0400 From: Woeller D <angeliq1 at erols.com> Subject: Re: SC - eggs My favorite Oriental market didn't have fresh quail eggs. The owner suggested trying the canned variety that she said are commonly available, even when fresh aren't. There were about 30, hardboiled, peeled eggs in a can, for $1.39. They come packed in either water or 'brine', tasting almost identical (like the very slight saltiness of the brined ones better) but both were delicious. I don't know how this cost measures up to fresh, but I didn't have to cook or peel them, so they definately fit my no-hassle prerequisite. I'm making ruby eggs with a batch, and a can is going into the 'just in case basket', too. Angelique Date: Tue, 21 Oct 1997 11:19:23 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: SC - Re: eggs Brid wrote: (imagining somehow putting together all the various egg recipes and subtilties >into one feast- tho' no one would probably ever want to see another egg >eggain) We have come across two different stuffed egg recipes: one Italian, one Andalusian. You hard-boil eggs, cut in half, take out the yolk and mix with stuff, refill and fasten back together. We haven't got a final worked-up version for either but I can post the original recipes if anyone is interested. Elizabeth/Betty Cook Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 12:25:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu> Subject: Re: SC - Re: eggs Excerpts from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 21-Oct-97 SC - Re: eggs david friedman at best.com (804*) > We have come across two different stuffed egg recipes: one Italian, one > Andalusian. You hard-boil eggs, cut in half, take out the yolk and mix > with stuff, refill and fasten back together. We haven't got a final > worked-up version for either but I can post the original recipes if anyone > is interested. There is a like recipe in one of of the Elizabethan Cookbooks--The Good Huswifes Jewel, I think. I served them at a feast and they were quite well received. toodles, margaret Gretchen Beck Computing Services Carnegie Mellon University Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 15:49:32 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: SC - Re: eggs The Making of Stuffed Eggs Andalusian p. A-24 Take as many eggs as you like, and boil them whole in hot water; put them in cold water and split them in half with a thread. Take the yolks aside and pound cilantro and put in onion juice, pepper and coriander, and beat all this together with murri, oil and salt and knead the yolks with this until it forms a dough. Then stuff the whites with this and fasten it together, insert a small stick into each egg, and sprinkle them with pepper, God willing. Stuffed eggs Platina book 9 Cook fresh eggs for a long time so that they are hard, then take the egg from the shell and split it through the middle, so as not to lose any of the white. After you have taken out the yolk, grind up part of it with good cheese, aged as well as fresh, and raisins; save the other part to color the dish. Likewise add a little finely chopped parsley, marjoram and mint. There are those who also put in two or more egg whites, along with some spices. With this mixture fill the whites of the eggs and when they are stuffed, fry them over a gentle flame, in oil. When they are fried, make a sauce from the rest of the yolks and raisins ground together, and when you have moistened them in verjuice and must, add ginger, clove, and cinnamon and pour over the eggs and let them boil a little together. The first is out of the anonymous 13th c. Andalusian cookbook (tr. Charles Perry) in Cariadoc's cookbook collection v. 2, the second from Platina's _De Honesta Voluptate_, 1475. Elizabeth/Betty Cook Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:23:05 -0800 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net> Subject: Re: SC - quail eggs Hi all from Anne-Marie Meadhbh asks about late period uses for quail eggs. My favorite type of egg involved fingerfood is from la Varenne, 1651, French. Hardboiled eggs are stuffed with a mixture of their own yolks, butter, vinegar and sauteed herbs. Deviled Eggs a la 17th century. There is a similar recipe in Epilario including a dressing of vinegar, etc. If you don't want to fuss (ie want to spend your energies on other things), I've been known to slice them in half, and sprinkle with a good quality dark balsamic vinegar. Looks good, tastes great. No documentation, alas, but there you go. The reconstruction for the Stuffed Eggs....oh and if you use my recipe, please let me know. I'm sure to give permission, I just like the grins I get from knowing my food is being eaten thousands of miles away! :) Sorry, but my cut and paste doesn't work so good, so the citation footnotes didn't make it into this message. Let me know if you need them. Enjoy! STUFFED EGGS: This version tastes very similar to the familiar modern deviled egg (sans paprika, of course). There is an earlier version in Epilario , but la Varenne updates it by omitting the very medieval sauce of vinegar and spices and using instead fresh herbs to flavor. These eggs travel well and are an easy and elegant potluck or tourney dish. Prepare the egg yolks and put into a zip lock bag, and put the halved egg whites into another. When you're ready to serve, snip off one corner of the bag with the yolk stuffing in it and fill the egg halves by squeezing the plastic bag like a pastry bag. 1. Eggs farced [la Varenne #1 p294] Take sorrell, alone if you will, or with other herbs, wash and swing them, then mince them very small, and put between two dishes with fresh butter, or passe them in the panne; after they are passed, soak and season them; after your farce is sod, take some hard eggs, cut them into halfs, a crosse, or in length, and take out the yolks, and mince them with your farce, and after all is well mixed, stew them over the fire, and put to it a little nutmeg, and serve garnished with the whites of your eggs which you may make brown in the pan with brown butter. Our version: 2T butter 1 T dill, minced 6 hardboiled eggs 2 green onions, minced 1 pinch salt 1 tsp fresh savory, minced 1 tsp fresh sorrell, minced 1 T balsamic vinegar pinch nutmeg Cut eggs in half longwise, and remove yolk. Sautee savory, sorell, green onion and dill in 1 T of the butter. Add the vinegar, salt, nutmeg and rest of the butter. Mix the egg yolks with the sauteed herb stuff, and stir over low heat till smooth and thick. Fill the egg white halves and serve. If you wish, you may fry the egg white halves in brown butter before filling, but we found that this makes them rubbery. Makes 12 filled egg halves, with some leftover stuffing goop. Oh darn. Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:53:04 EST From: DianaFiona at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Scrambled Eggs << I find it pretty hard to imagine that scrambled eggs were not period. Where did you run across this bit of info? Since scrambled eggs are my very favorite form of eggs and so basic in construction, I had automatically tho't them "period". OTOH, Both omelettes and French toast , which are more elaborite ways of serving eggs , are both documentably period. Would it be possible for anyone who has information either proving or disproving the use of scrambled eggs in the MA please post the information and source material to me? Thanks in advance. Ras ============================================================ >> For what it's worth, I just ran across a recipe in Cariadoc's Miscellany that I marked to show to the breakfast cook for our next event that might be interpeted as scrambled eggs or as an omlette, depending on your mood........ It doesn't seem to be in the on-line version, just the hard copy (7th edition) that a friend picked up for me at Pennsic last year. SAWGEAT (Curye on Inglysch p. 135 [Form of Cury no. 169]) Take sawge; grynde it and temper it vp with ayren. Take a sausege & kerf hym to gobetes, cast it in a possynet, and do [th]erwi[th] grece & frye it. Whan it is fryed ynowgh, cast [th]erto sawge with ayren; make it not hard. Cast [th]erto powdour douce & messe it forth. If it be in ymbre day; take sauge, buttur, & ayren, and lat stonde wel by [th]e sauge, and serue forth. I don't do eggy things often, and tend to preffer quiche when I do, but this looked pretty good to my eyes. Of course, being a big fan of strong herbs doesn't hurt--I'd probably put more sage in than anyone else could stand! ;-) A question, though, for those who know more about period sausage than I do; would they have been likely to have the soft, fresh sausages that we usually cook for breakfast, or would this more likely have been a harder, smoked sausage? (Which is what the "kerf hym to gobetes" suggested to me.) As to the original question, the recipe doesn't say how to cook the eggs other than not to let them get too hard, so to my mind it could be dealt with as an omlette or scrambled eggs as the cook chose. Not absolute documentation, Ras, but at least not forbiding the practice, either........... ;-) Ldy Diana Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:19:07 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - Scrambled Eggs Hello! I've got 2 recipes at hand - Meselade and Tansey (each listed in both Harleian MS 279 and 4016): Harleian MS. 279 - Leche Vyaundez xliiij. Meselade. Take Eyroun, [th]e [3]olkys an [th]e whyte to-gedere, & draw hem [th]orw a straynoure; & [th]an take a litil Botere, & caste in a fayre frying panne; & whan [th]e boter is hot, take [th]e drawyn Eyroun, & caste [th]er-to; [th]an take a Sawcere, an gadre [th]e Eyroun to-gedere in [th]e panne, as it were [th]e brede of a pewter dysshe; & [th]an take fayre pece[3] of Brede, [th]e mountance of a mosselle of Brede, vppe-on [th]e Eyroun, & turne [th]an [thy] brede downward in [th]e panne; [th]anne take it of [th]e panne, & caste fayre whyte Sugre [th]er-to, & serue forth; an to euery good meslade take a [th]owsand Eyroun or mo. Harleian MS. 4016 92 Tansey. Take faire Tansey, and grinde it in a morter; And take eyren, yolkes and white, And drawe hem thorgh a streynour, and streyne also [th]e Iuse of [th]e Tansey thorgh a streynour; and medle the egges and the Iuse togidre; And take faire grece, and cast hit in a pan, and sette ouer [th]e fyre til hit mylte; and caste [th]e stuffe thereon, and gader hit togidre with a sawcer or a dissh, as [th]ou wilt haue hit more or lasse; And turne hit in [th]e panne onys or twies, And so serue it forth hote, yleched. Cindy/Sincgiefu renfrow at skylands.net Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:50:53 -0500 (EST) From: Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu> Subject: Re: SC - Scrambled Eggs There is also a recipe in the 2 15th century cookery books called Hanony, which is a fairly standard recipe for an omelet. toodles, margaret Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:55:05 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: SC - Scrambled eggs not period? > Would it be possible for anyone who has information either proving or > disproving the use of scrambled eggs in the MA please post the information and > source material to me? Thanks in advance. > > Ras Sorry to write and run, but I couldn't pass this one up. See "Curye On Inglysch" for recipes for hanoney and sawgeat, being scrambled eggs with fried onions, and sage-flavored scrambled eggs with fried smoked sausage, respectively. Two of my favorite simple period dishes. Adamantius Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:06:54 -0800 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net> Subject: Re: SC - Fw: [Mid] Is camping without a cooler out of period? I remember from my misspent youth an article (in Mother Earth News? Can't remember) where they did side by sides on eggs. Washed some, froze some, chilled some, left some at room temp. The chilled, UNWASHED eggs lasted the longest, the room temp unwashed eggs were second. Freezing eggs is nasty, I guess (unless you dont care what they look like, ie mix 'em up first). Eggs are by nature sterile (which is why in the old days we used them to grow viral cultures, etc). Its the outside of the egg that isnt. Coming out of the chicken, the egg is coated with a thin layer of protein that renders the shell impermiable to air (dont think about it too hard, its kinda nasty). Makes sense...after laying, the egg isn't refrigerated and yet doesn't spoil, right? It stays fresh enough to grow a baby chicken, in fact. The down side of this is that unwashed eggs will often have other......materials....on them, and these are rife with cooties, especially in this day and age of antibiotic resistant nasty bacteria. I think I'd go ahead and wash them, so as not to contaminate everything in site with chicken feces, but realize that you might not be getting the freshest eggs in town after a week or so. Please realize, too, that this means only that your egg may be a bit dried out. That shell is pretty much impervious to bacteria, so unless the integrity of the shell is breached in some way (and believe me, you'll know it!!!) you should be fine. - --AM, who wouldn't refridgerate her eggs, except that the door has those neat egg shaped holes in it... Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 17:11:06 EDT From: LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com> Subject: SC - Egg peeling tip o' the day CorwynWdwd at aol.com writes: << Peeling fresh eggs that have been hard boiled (The way we usually carry them to events) is an exercise in frustration. >> To avoid pulling a hard boiled egg apart the following steps will help. First pierce the large end of the egg with a needle. Place eggs in cold tap water. Add 1 tblsp salt to water. Bring to a boil. Reduce heat to simmer and boil for the appropriate length of time. IMMEDIATELY remove eggs from heat. Pour off hot water. Slightly crack each egg with the round side of a spoon. IMMEDIATELY cover with COLD water and leave until room temperature. Always start peeling from the BIG end of the egg. The shell should literally slip off easily with little or no clinging. This works with fresh or older eggs although I would not generally use fresh eggs for hard boiling unless it were absolutely necessary. Ras Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 10:47:01 -0400 From: Stephanie Rothgeb <onebyte at 99main.com> Subject: Re: SC - Fw: [Mid] So you wanna peel hard boiled eggs Don't let them sit for a week before boiling them, boil them with a lot of salt. Trust me works great, the shells just peel away without effort or small cracks. Beileag PS my daughter learned it in cooking school. Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 12:51:58 -0700 From: cassie <cassie at sally.nas.nasa.gov> Subject: e: SC -Gentle education, was Help thinking up a class... <snip> So here is my documentation on the Andalusian Stuffed Eggs: - -- Cassandra Baldassano cassie at nas.nasa.gov Sterling Software (650) 604-6007 or (800) 331-8737 x6007 Supporting: M/S 258-6 Systems Control NASA Ames Research Center Database Administration Moffett Field, CA 94305-1000 *********************************************************************** Stuffed Eggs This recipe for stuffed Eggs comes from An Anonymous Andalusian Cookbook of the Thirteenth Century, which has only the english translation of the recipes;. They taste very similar to a deviled egg. I entered this recipe for the Silver Spoon, Spring Investiture A.S. XXXII. The amount of herbs and spices I use make this recipe mild, increase these ingredients according to your own taste. Translation of Original Recipe: Take as many eggs as you like, and boil them whole in hot water; put them in cold water and split them in half with a thread. Take the yolks aside and pound cilantro and put in onion juice, pepper and coriander, and beat all this together with Murri, oil and salt and knead the yolks with this until it forms a dough. Then stuff the whites with this and fasten it together, insert a small stick into each egg, and sprinkle them with pepper, God Willing. Redaction: 8 eggs 1/4 tsp. cilantro 2 tsp. onion juice 1/8 tsp. pepper 1/4 tsp. Murri and pinch of salt or 1/4 tsp. salt 2.5 Tbs. oil Cook eggs, split and remove yolks. Combine yolks with remaining ingredients. Stuff egg white with yolk mixture. Place egg whites together, secure with toothpick, sprinkle with pepper. Special Notes: Although the original recipe give no number of eggs to cook, I choose to redact the recipe for 8 eggs because the measurements for the other ingredients are common. Murri is a salty sauce that is brewed, not unlike soy sauce or Worcestershire sauce. From the recipes noted in the An Anonymous Andalusian Cookbook of the 13th Century, it appears that Murri is nearly as commonly used as soy sauce is in Chinese cuisine. A quick recipe for Murri can be found in A Miscelleny (6th edition), by David Friedman and Elizabeth Cook. This recipe calls for quinces, which are sometimes difficult to find depending on the time of year. If you have a chance to make murri, you should have plenty of it for several other recipes. However, if you are not able are inclined to make the murri, I recommend to substitute a 1/4 tsp. salt for the 1/4 tsp. Murri and pinch of salt. I don't find the substitution detracts from the dish due to the strong flavors of the onion juice and cilantro. Source: An Anonymous Andalusian Cookbook of the 13th Century, a translation by Charles Perry found in A Collection of Medieval and Renaissance Recipes, edited by David Friedman and Elisabeth Cook. Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 22:44:40 -0700 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: e: SC -Gentle education, was Help thinking up a class... At 12:51 PM -0700 5/6/98, cassie wrote: >Stuffed Eggs > >This recipe for stuffed Eggs comes from An Anonymous Andalusian Cookbook >of the >Thirteenth Century, which has only the english translation of the >recipes;. They taste very >similar to a deviled egg. I entered this recipe for the Silver Spoon, >Spring Investiture A.S. >XXXII. The amount of herbs and spices I use make this recipe mild, >increase these >ingredients according to your own taste. > >Translation of Original Recipe: > >Take as many eggs as you like, and boil them whole in hot water; put them >in cold water >and split them in half with a thread. Take the yolks aside and pound >cilantro and put in >onion juice, pepper and coriander, and beat all this together with Murri, >oil and salt and >knead the yolks with this until it forms a dough. Then stuff the whites >with this and fasten >it together, insert a small stick into each egg, and sprinkle them with >pepper, God Willing. > >Redaction: > >8 eggs >1/4 tsp. cilantro >2 tsp. onion juice >1/8 tsp. pepper >1/4 tsp. Murri and pinch of salt > or 1/4 tsp. salt >2.5 Tbs. oil I would take issue with your redaction on only one detail. The Andalusian cookbook distinguishes between cilantro and coriander, apparently representing the leaves and the ground seed of the coriander plant. This recipes uses both. You only use one. Comparing your worked out version to ours, I conclude that you are less fond of cilantro than I am. David/Cariadoc http://www.best.com/~ddfr/ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 22:24:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Stephen Bloch <sbloch at adl15.adelphi.edu> Subject: Re: SC - Piperfarces - a query > The question is - Cariadoc's version uses 8 egg yolks to 2 T flour, where > Pleyn Delit uses 2 egg yolks to slightly more flour than Cariadoc ... > Are there parallel period examples which suggest a high yolk content? I haven't done the "pipefarces" recipe. But on the subject of high yolk content,.... Filled Muqawwara from the 13th-century Arabo-Andalusian Manuscrito An-nimo, my translation Sift a pound and a half of wheat flour in a good sifter, mix it with the yolks of fifteen eggs and as much fresh milk as necessary. Put in a little leavening and the dough will be firmer, make a loaf like a raguif [patty] of this, and leave it to ferment. Then put sweet oil in a frying pan and take it to the fire, and when it has heated, put in the raguif, turn it little by little, and watch that it not stick. Then turn it and when it has browned a little, take it out and put it in a dish and cut it out like a muqawwara. Take out all the crumbs that are in it and crumble it by hand until it thickens a little. Then take sufficient peeled nuts and almonds and sugar, pound them well and put a handful of this, then another of crumbs, into the muqawwara until it is full; and scatter, again between the two hands, ground sugar, and after this sprinkle it with rosewater. Then boil sweet butter and good honey, pour into the muqawwara and when it makes a boiling sound, go back to putting the topping on top, and pour the rest of the honey and butter over the topping, sprinkle with sugar, and present it. This recipe, with my redaction thereof, appeared in a T.I. article entitled "Some Recipes of al-Andalus" about eight years ago; the article has been Webbed by Greg Lindahl, and is on his cookery page. mar-Joshua ibn-Eleazar ha-Shalib Stephen Bloch Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 08:10:55 -0700 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net> Subject: Re: SC - deviled eggs info source HI all from Anne-Marie I know theres a version in Epilario, as well as one in la Varenne. Both are very reminicent of devilled eggs. - --AM Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:27:25 -0400 From: dy018 at freenet.carleton.ca (Micaylah) Subject: Re: SC - Pine nuts Corwyn said... >Okay... I'll bite... should I NOT put them in the door? > >(I do btw...) I just found this out. This part of your fridge is the warmest part. Given that you don't know how long your eggs were on the shelf at the store, (even though eggs have a fairly long shelf life) they half their life by being stored at this temperature. I would hate to eat an egg that was slightly off. Can you say yuck? Anyway this is what the fridge sales person said when we went shopping recently. I checked with AgCan and they agreed. Micaylah Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 06:08:00 -0700 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net> Subject: Re: SC - Pennsic Menu -- LONG Might I recommend for breakfasts Herbolade? mince an onion and clarify in good olive oil. Throw in a bag of that irradiated pre-washed spinach. Let sweat down. Break and beat a dozen eggs. Throw in and stir. Stir occasionally until the eggs are almost set. Sprinkle with grated cheese of choice (we used pre-grated provolone and cheddar we can get in bags). Cover and let burble till cheese melts. there are several versions of this in the English/French corpus, some with cheese some without. We've done it with spinache, and also with bags of fancy salad greens. In my experience, eggs transport just fine without a cooler, assuming you buy them right before you leave and keep them in the shade under a wet cloth, in the carton you bought them in to protect them. have fun! - --Anne-Marie, working on her own menu for Coronation...to be cooked Date: Sun, 21 Jun 1998 19:53:47 -0700 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net> Subject: Re: SC - Herbolade Hi all from Anne-Marie Stephan asks about Herbolade: "Was this dish mentioned in the period cookbooks as a breakfast dish? Or do you just think it would make a good breakfast dish in the modern idea of breakfast?" It was most definately NOT mentioned as a breakfast dish, and in fact has nothing to do with any of my reserach on appropriate breakfast foods. I was feeding a campful of "but you gotta have sausage and eggs for breakfast!!! (preferrably with a hashbrown thang)", and thught this would satisfy my need for period cooking, plus make their little modnern palates happy. Me, I do the medieval thing of breaking my fast on bread, small beer (when my buddy makes it) and maybe some leftovers. ">mince an onion and clarify in good olive oil. Throw in a bag of that >irradiated pre-washed spinach. Let sweat down. Break and beat a dozen eggs. Clarified butter has been mentioned here before. How do you clarify olive oil? I believe clarified butter has the solids removed. But olive oil doesn't have any solids that I've noted." oops! I mean "mince an onion and sautee till clear in good olive oil". What, you dont automatically understand my shorthand??? :) "I've never seen irradiated spinach here in the U.S. What would you do to use standard fresh spinach? Do you tear the leaves into small pieces or use as whole leaves? What do you mean by "let sweat down"?" Those yuppie salad in a bags that you get at the grocery stores around here are often irradiated (egads! :)). Means they dont go all soggy and icky as fast. If you were to use standard fresh spinach, wash well, and remove the stems. Tear into pieces. "to sweat down" means (to me) to let cook gently till the water is released and suddenly you have WAY less volume than you did before. You know when this has happened cuz the greens arent raw looking anymore. re: references.... Here are two. There are more. In one, its a simple mix of eggs, butter and herbs, baked in a shell. The other is an omelet gizmo with cheese, with the addition of ginger. We chose to omit the ginger (sometimes..its tasty too), and do it as a crustless pie or egg bake thing, depending on your point of view. Considering our infant level abilities with the fire we're attempting to learn to cook on, I think we did pretty good :) We have done it with a more complex mix of salad greens, fresh herbs, etc, but you can't beat the already bagged greens for ease of use and hygeine when camping in primitive conditions. Please note that while neither mentions onions, they were classified as an herb in the garden lists and like of the time. If it offends, you can certainly leave them out. Herbolat: (Forme of Curye 180) Take persel, myntes, saverey and sauge, tansey, vervayn, clarry, rewe, ditayn, fenel, southernwode; hewe hem and grinde hem smale. Medle hem up with aryen. Do buttur in a trap and do the fars thereto and bake it and mess forth. One Herbolace Or Two of Eggs (Menagier de Paris, p. 274) Take of dittany two leaves only, and of rue less than the half or naught, for know that it is strong and bitter; of smallage, tansey, mint, and sage, of each some four leaves or less, for each is strong; marjoram a little more, fennel more, parsley more still, but of porray, beets, violet leaves, spinach, lettuces and clary, as much of the one as of the others, until you have two large handfuls. Pick them over and wash them in cold water, then dry them of all the water, and bray two heads of ginger, then put your herbs into the mortar two or three times and bray them with the ginger. And then have sixteen eggs well beaten together, yolks and whites, and bray and mix them in the mortar with the things abovesaid, then divide it in two and make two thick omelettes, which you shall fry as followeth. First you shall heat your frying pan very well with oil, butter or such other fat as you will, and when it is very hot all over and especially towards the handle, mingle and spread your eggs over the pan and turn them often over and over with a flat palette, then cast good grated cheese on the top, and know that it is so done, because if you grate cheese with the herbs and eggs, when you come to fry your omelette, the cheese at the bottom will stick to the pan, and thus it befals with an egg omelette if you mix the eggs with the cheese. Wherefore you should first put the eggs in the pan, and put the cheese on the top, and then cover the edges with eggs, and otherwise it will cling to the pan. And when your herbs be cooked in the pan, cut your herbolace into a round or square and eat it not too hot nor too cold. Date: Mon, 22 Jun 1998 02:55:03 -0500 From: allilyn at juno.com (LYN M PARKINSON) Subject: Re: SC - Herbolade/Leche lardys Just read that recipe this afternoon, in An Ordinance of Pottage. There, it is called 'leche lardys', recipe #19. The traditional way was, apparently, to divide it and color it, serving slices of the different colors in the same dish. To make leche lardys of iii colors Take clene cow mylke and put hit in iii pottys. Breke to everych a quantyte of eyron as thu seist best is to do. Coloure one rede colour with saundres & anothyr with saveryn, the iii with grene herbys. Puit to everych a porcyon of clene larde of fat of bacon well sodyn & pertyd in iii pottys; put to salt. Boyle hem all at ones; stere hem well for brennyng yn the boyling. Take hem downe. Cast hem into a cloth, everych above other, and wynd the cloth togedyr & presse out all the juse. Than take hem out all hole and make leches of hem, and do iii or iiii leches in a dysch, and serve hem forth. Constance Hiett's Redaction: Milk and egg curd, with bacon 4 eggs for green colouring: a handful of parsley and/or spinach, plus and other herbs 2 cups milk which appeal, e.g. summer savory 4 slices bacon 1/2 tsp. salt for yellow: a pinch of saffron For green coloring, grind the herbs as finely as you can, or boil them for a minute or so and grind with a spoonful of the cooking water, so they will be reduced to juice. For yellow, you can either steep the saffron in a small amount of boiling water or grind it. Cover the bacon with cold water and bring to a boil; then drain and cut the bacon into small pieces. If you prefer bacon slightly crisp, fry these lightly. Beat eggs and milk thoroughly, and stir in the bacon. Colour as desired. Cook over low to medium heat, stirring constantly, until the milk is thickly curdled. This is one 'custard' which should actually curdle. When the mixture is very thick, pour it into a cloth and set this in a colander to let the whey run out; then fold the cloth and press down firmly to get out more whey and to press the curd together. Place a heavy weight on top for a few minutes while the curd cools enough to be handled; then wring it again in its cloth, pressing it firmly together, before laying it on a board and slicing it. Hieatt, Constance B. AN ORDINANCE OF POTTAGE. Prospect Book. 1988. p. 132. I'm including her recipe so that some of our newer members can see how a professional redacts a recipe. This is the culinary section of a 15th C. manuscript, now owned by Yale University. Allison Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1998 16:12:23 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: SC - A couple of questions At 9:54 PM -0500 8/30/98, Diamond wrote: >Does anyone know if deviled eggs are period ? I suppose it depends how you define deviled eggs; here are two period recipes for stuffed eggs: The Making of Stuffed Eggs Andalusian A-24 (13th century Islamic Spain) Take as many eggs as you like, and boil them whole in hot water; put them in cold water and split them in half with a thread. Take the yolks aside and pound cilantro and put in onion juice, pepper and coriander, and beat all this together with murri, oil and salt and knead the yolks with this until it forms a dough. Then stuff the whites with this and fasten it together, insert a small stick into each egg, and sprinkle them with pepper, God willing. Stuffed eggs Platina book 9 (15th c. Italian) Cook fresh eggs for a long time so that they are hard, then take the egg from the shell and split it through the middle, so as not to lose any of the white. After you have taken out the yolk, grind up part of it with good cheese, aged as well as fresh, and raisins; save the other part to color the dish. Likewise add a little finely chopped parsley, marjoram and mint. There are those who also put in two or more egg whites, along with some spices. With this mixture fill the whites of the eggs and when they are stuffed, fry them over a gentle flame, in oil. When they are fried, make a sauce from the rest of the yolks and raisins ground together, and when you have moistened them in verjuice and must, add ginger, clove, and cinnamon and pour over the eggs and let them boil a little together. Elizabeth/Betty Cook Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:10:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu> Subject: Re: SC - FW: Poaching Eggs Excerpts from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 5-May-99 SC - FW: Poaching Eggs "Decker, Margaret" at Healt (474) > Is the poaching method of preparing eggs Period? I would appreciate > recipes. I couldn't find anything on this in the Floregium. Yup. I don't have any recipes at my fingertips, but remember seeing several in the various cookery books. I think there's a couple in the two 15th century cookery books, for example. toodles, margaret Gretchen Beck Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:09:58 -0700 From: lilinah at grin.net Subject: Re: SC - FW: Poaching Eggs Margarite asks: > Is the poaching method of preparing eggs Period? I would appreciate > recipes. According to "The Medieval Kitchen" by Redon, Sabban, Serventi, poached eggs are period, appearing in "Le Menagier de Paris" and "Le Viandier de Taillevent". Two recipes call for poaching in oil, one for poaching in water. I'm not including the redactions, although if anyone asks, i can send them... **p. 179 - Civet of Eggs (Civ d'oeufs, from "Le Menagier de Paris", recipe 174) Poach some eggs in oil, then take onions, cut into circles and cooked, and fry them in oil, then boil them in wine, verjus, and vinegar, and boil everything together; then put three or four eggs in each bowl and pour the brouet over; it should not be thick. [The complete redaction considers the eggs to be fried sunnyside up and the topping to be "ruby-red onion 'jam'"] **p. 180 - Sippets in mustard (Soup en moustarde, from "Le Viandier de Taillevent", Bibliotque Nationale de France, ed. Scully, recipe 150) Take eggs, poached whole in oil without their shells, then take some of that oil, wine, water, and onions fried in oil, all boiled together; take slices of bread browned on the grill, then cut them into square pieces and put them to boil with the other ingredients; then remove the broth and dry your sippets of bread, then put it on a platter; then add mustard to your broth and boil; then put the sippets into your bowls and pour it over. [what happens to the eggs isn't exactly clear from the above. The redaction sets an egg fried sunnyside up on each slice of bread and tops with mustard sauce] **p. 182 - Thickened cow's milk (Lait de vache ly, from "Le Menagier de Paris", recipe 175) Take best-quality milk...;bring it to the boil then remove from the fire; then put through a sieve many egg yolks, their filaments removed, and then crush a knob of ginger and some saffron and add them; and keep warm near the fire; then take eggs poached in water and put two ro three poached eggs in each bowl and pour the milk over them. [i edited out a comment that referred the reader to another recipe for comments on milk] "The Medieval Kitchen" includes the original recipes in French - if anyone wants, i can send them too. Happy poaching, Anahita Gaouri bint-Karim al-Fassi Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:25:23 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - FW: Poaching Eggs > Is the poaching method of preparing eggs Period? I would appreciate > recipes. > Margarite Yes. There's a recipe for Potage de egges in Harleian Ms. 4016, #120: "Take faire water and cast in a faire frying pan, or elle[3] in an o[th]er vessell, til hit boyle, and skeme it well; And then breke faire rawe egges, and caste hem in [th]e water, And lete [th]e water stonde stil ouer [th]e fire, and lete the egges boyle harder or nessher as [th]ou wilt." Cindy Renfrow/Sincgiefu renfrow at skylands.net Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 00:50:11 -0500 From: Stefan li Rous <stefan at texas.net> Subject: SC - FW: Poaching Eggs This did make me curious so I looked eggs up in Waverly Root's "Food". Not much there on cooking of eggs or info for our period I'm afraid. However, he does mention: "The first chickens in the West seem to have appeared in Central Europe about 1500 BC. They probably reached the Mediterranean area in Greece sometime between 1100 BC and 720 BC". "During the Renaissance, eggs were the chief food (and in some places almost the only one) eaten in addition to meat. [wonder what he bases this on???] "The historian Benedetto Varchi produced a treatise on boiled eggs early in the sixteenth century." [Wonder if this would make a good translation project for someone who knows Latin (or Italian?) ?] "...and in the seventeenth the renowned French cook Pierre Francois de la Varenne wrote a cookbook containing sixty different recipes for eggs." [Maybe another interesting translation project, but perhaps a bit late unless there is some proof that some of these recipes might date from earlier times.] - -- Lord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas stefan at texas.net Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:13:41 +0100 From: Christina Nevin <cnevin at caci.co.uk> Subject: SC - Poached eggs Margarite enquired: > Is the poaching method of preparing eggs Period? I would appreciate > recipes. There is a rather nice poached egg in custard dish in the Menagier: Le Menagier de Paris, Translated by Janet Hinson http://www.best.com/~ddfr/Medieval/Cookbooks/Menagier/Menagier.html Thickened Cow' Milk. Let the milk be carefully chosen, as is told above in the chapter on thickened meat soups, and let it be boiled to a simmer, then remove from the fire: then pour slowly into it through a sieve a great quantity of egg yolks, and then grind a handful of ginger and saffron, and put them in, and keep it hot by the fire; then have eggs poached in water and put two or three poached eggs in each bowl, and the milk over them. The "Medieval Kitchen" translation of this recipe is virtually the same. There are also these two poached egg soup recipes from the Menagier. The Green Broth is a popular dish at feasts: Green Broth of Eggs and Cheese. Take parsley and a little cheese and sage and a very small amount of saffron, moistened bread, and mix with water left from cooking peas, or stock, grind and strain: and have ground ginger mixed with wine, and put on to boil; then add cheese and eggs poached in water, and let it be a bright green. Item, some do not add bread, but instead of bread use bacon. German Broth of Eggs Poached in Oil.[66] Then take almonds and peel them, grind and sieve: slice up onions, and let them be cooked in water, then fry in oil, and put all to boil; then grind ginger, cinnamon, clove and a little saffron mixed with verjuice, and finally add your spices to the soup, and boil till it bubbles, and let it be very thick and not too yellow. [66]There is without a doubt missing here "poach eggs in oil". (JP) Al Vostro e al Servizio del Sogno Lucretzia Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 11:22:43 +0100 From: Christina Nevin <cnevin at caci.co.uk> Subject: SC - RE: Poached eggs Saluti! Forgot to mention, the popular Green Broth is in Cariadoc's Miscelleny http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cariadoc/miscellany.html as follows: "3 T parsley 1/2 (15 g) oz cheese, grated 3 small leaves fresh sage 5 threads saffron 2 thin slices = 1.5 oz white bread (or bacon) 2 c pea stock or dilute vegetable or chicken stock 1/8 t ginger 1 T white wine 1 3/4 oz cheese, grated 3 eggs Soak bread in stock (either water left from cooking peas or 1/2 c canned chicken broth + 1 1/2 c water). Grind parsley, sage, and saffron in a mortar thoroughly; add 1/2 oz cheese and soaked bread and grind together. Strain through a strainer; if necessary, put back in mortar what didn't go through, grind again, and strain again. Mix wine and ginger, add to mixture, and bring to a boil over moderate heat; be careful that it does not stick to the bottom. Stir in the rest of the cheese; break eggs in