dumplings-msg - 3/28/20

Period dumplings and recipes using dumplings. Spetzle.

NOTE: See also the files: pasta-msg, bread-msg, breadmaking-msg, soup-msg,  stews-bruets-msg, pierogies-msg.

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    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 14:01:52
To: "Mark Harris" <mark_harris at quickmail>
From: Luznicky <we4 at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: sca-cooks no potatoes!!!

>Clare said:
>>Try dumplings, herbed dumplings...onion dumplings.....sage
>>dumplings....when good they are very good in stews....they are pretty
>>tasty.  
>
>Recipes? How do you make sure they are "good"? 
>
>Or is this one of those things that most cooks just know how to do?
>Do I just drop biscuit dough into the soup or stew? As I said in the
>introduction, I'm still figuring out how to cook mundanely.
>
>These sound like they could be very tasty though I'm not sure about
>the texture.
>
>  Stefan li Rous

2 c.  all  purpose flour
4 t.   baking powder
1 c.  milk

Mix together until it looks stretchy. Drop by teaspoons into your boiling broth.
Cover.  Leave at a boil for 20 min.  This also thickens your broth.

This is my simplest recipe.  It can get more complicated, but not always
better.

Mikhail the Armorer
Tarkhan Khanate Bright Hawk
Great Household of the Dark Horde
we4 at widomaker.com


Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 12:46:49
To: "Mark Harris" <mark_harris at quickmail>
From: Luznicky <we4 at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: sca-cooks no potatoes!!

>>2 c.  all  purpose flour
>>4 t.   baking powder
>>1 c.  milk
>
>>mix together until it looks strechy.  drop by teaspoons into your boiling
>>broth. cover.  leave at a boil for 20 min.  this also thickens your broth.

>>Mikhail the Armorer

>Thanks. This is pretty much what I was looking for. What kind of
>texture should the final product be? Gooey? Like a soggy bisquit?
>Like firm dough?
>
>To get herbed dumplings, onion dumpings, sage dumplings etc, do I
>just add herbs, cooked onions, dried sage etc to the dough?
>
>Stefan li Rous

When cooked the outside will have a gluey, transparent look and the inside will be dry and biscuity.  To flavor, start by adding a teaspoon of dry herb.  Increase until it tastes right to you or yours.  I tend to season the food itself and not the dumplings.  I have no idea how this
recipe will adapt to the addition of onions (I might try freeze dried if
fresh didn't work.)

Kyna


Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 19:59:21 -0400
From: "Philip W. Troy" <troy at asan.com>
To: sca-cooks at eden.com
Subject: Re: sca-cooks no potatoes!!!

Try dropping bread dough rolled into balls, or shortcrust pastry. The
Scots had (and have) a thing called hodgils, where the balls are made
of, essentially, an oatcake mixture. Served with salt (corned) beef,
nowadays. Also check some of the modern Italian gnocchi recipes; some of
them are pretty close to what would have been made in period. Also there
are some period "bag puddings" that are made from an herbed batter,
sometimes very lightly sweetened, cooked in a cloth in with the stew,
and opened on the side of the serving platter. I've had great success
with these.

Adamantius


Date: Tue, 13 Oct 98 00:26:26 -0500
From: Dottie Elliott <difirenze at usa.net>
Subject: SC - German Dumplings

I thought you all might enjoy these redactions. ...clarissa

In October, Bryn Gwlad's cooks guild redacted several dumpling recipes
from a new cookbook Clarissa picked up at Pennsic. All the recipes in
quotes are from "Sabina Welser's Cookbook" translated from "Das Kochbuch
der Sabina Welserin" (C. 1553) by Valoise Armstrong.

Chicken Dumplings

"193 How to make chicken dumplings
Take the meat from two chickens. After it is cooked chop it finely, mix
grated Parmesan cheese in with it and color it yellow and stir it
together. You should also put mace and pepper into it. After that prepare
a dough. Make a thin flat cake and put the above described filling on it
and form it into a dumpling and join the two ends together. Cook it in
broth as long as for hard boiled eggs and serve it warm."

6 oz cooked chicken
3/8 cup grated parmesan cheese
1/4 tsp mace
1/2 tsp pepper
pinch saffron in 1/4 cup hot water

Chop the chicken fine. Mix with the cheese and spices. Take saffron and
soak in hot water. Then add to chicken mix to color yellow. Mix well.
Place a little on a piece of dough and fold over to seal. Cook in boiling
chicken broth for 15 minutes. Drain and serve. (Mistress Meadbhb)

Notes: Good. Adding some salt would fit well.

Herb Dumplings

"119 If you would make boiled dumplings
Then take chard, as much as you like, some sage, marjoram and rosemary,
chop it together, also put grated cheese into it and beat eggs therein
until you think that it is right. Take also cinnamon, cloves, pepper and
raisins and put them into the dumpling batter. Let the dumplings cook, as
one cooks a hard-boiled egg, then they are ready."

2 1/2 cup chard
1 Tbsp sage
1 Tbsp marjoram
3/4 cup grated Parmesan cheese
1 Tbsp rosemary
1 cup raisins
1/2 tsp cloves
1/2 tsp cinnamon
2 eggs, beaten

Chop the chard, sage, marjoram, and rosemary and then mix in the cheese.
 Then add in the spices and raisins. Place a small amount on a piece of
dough and fold over and seal. Cook in boiling vegetable broth for 15
minutes. Drain and serve. (Lady Tabitha)

Notes: Good. Needs more cheese and more cinnamon.

Spinach Ravioli

"31 To make ravioli
Take  spinach and blanch it as if you were making cooked spinach, and
chop it small. Take approximately one handful, when it is chopped, cheese
or meat from a chicken or capon that was boiled or roasted. Then take
twice as much cheese as herb, or of chicken an equal amount and beat two
or three eggs into it and make a good dough, put salt and pepper into it
and make a dough with good flour, as if you would make a tart, and when
you have made little flat cakes of dough then put a small ball of filling
on the edge of the flat cake and form it into a dumpling. And press it
together well along the edges and place it in broth and let it cook about
as long as for a soft-boiled egg. The meat should be finely chopped and
the cheese finely grated."

1/2 cup spinach
1 cup grated Parmesan cheese
1 egg
1/2 tsp salt
3/8 tsp pepper

Blanch the spinach and drain. Chop fine and squeeze out excess water. Mix
spinach with cheese, eggs and spices. Place a little bit on a piece of
dough and fold over to seal. Cook in boiling chicken broth for 15
minutes. Drain and serve. (Baroness Clarissa)

Notes: Good but plain from lack of spices. Needs more cheese. Nutmeg
would go well with this.

Dumpling Dough

Since the Ravioli recipe said to "make a dough with good flour, as if you
would make a tart", we used this tart recipe's dough for all the
dumplings:

"70 A tart with plums which can be dried or fresh (also how to make tart dough)
Let them cook beforehand in wine and strain them and take eggs, cinnamon
and sugar.  Bake the dough for the tart. That is made like so: take two
eggs and beat them. Afterwards stir flour therein until it becomes a
thick dough. Pour it on the table and work it well, until it is ready.
After that take somewhat more than half the dough and roll it into a flat
cake as wide as you would have your tart. Afterwards pour the plums on it
and roll out after that the other crust and cut it up, however you would
like it, and put it on top over the tart and press it together well and
let it bake. So one makes the dough for a tart."

1 1/4 cup all-purpose flour
3 eggs

Place the flour on a flat surface and make a hole in the center. Break
the eggs in the center and start mixing the eggs, slowly bringing in
flour until it all is incorporated. Add more flour if necessary so that
it is not sticky. Do not overwork the dough. Roll as thinly as possible!
Make small squares or rounds as you wish for the dumplings.

Notes: Thin, Thinner, Thinnest! The thinner the dough and the fuller the
dumpling the better!


Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 11:04:48 EDT
From: Varju at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Seeking wheat illumination -  OOP

snowfire at mail.snet.net writes:
<< Are spaetzle made in the same way as Italian pasta is?   >>

Well, the spatzle my mother makes is out of a sticky dough of flour, salt and
eggs.  It is placed into a spatzle press and about an inch is squeezed out,
then cut off into a  pot of boiling water.  Boil until the spatzle rises to
the top of the pot.  I have also seen it done without the spatzle press,
just having the dough on a cutting board where you are cutting short, thin
pieces off and pushing them into the water.

Major disclaimer, my mother is not German, but did learn how to make spatzle
in germany from my aunt and Omi.

Noemi
Windkeep Outlands
Cheyenne, Wyoming


Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 12:50:13 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Seeking wheat illumination -  OOP

Varju at aol.com wrote:
> Well, the spatzle my mother makes is out of a sticky dough of flour, salt and
> eggs.  It is placed into a spatzle press and about an inch is squeezed out,
> then cut off into a  pot of boiling water.

I gather you're describing a tool kinda like a potato ricer, but with
larger openings. Another one I've seen, which seems at least as common,
is a stainless-steel device which sits on top of the pot of water, with
a sort of hopper which you fill with the thick batter/dough, while
gravity and the odd push from a spoon form the spaetzel as they go
through holes in the bottom of the hopper. The hopper then slides
against a blade, cutting the spaetzeln off to the length you choose.

>  Boil until the spatzle rises to
> the top of the pot.  I have also seen it done with out the spatzle press,
> just having the dough on a cutting board where you are cutting short, thin
> pieces off and pushing them into the water.

That's a good way too, if slower. I think the non-uniform look you get
doing them by hand enhances the whole rustic-y spaetzel experience.

I confess some of the best, if really unorthodox, spaetzeln I've ever
had were made as part of a warm duck breast / red cabbage salad, and
they had a small amount of some kind of coarse-ground mustard mixed into
the batter.

Adamantius


Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 12:20:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Seeking wheat illumination -  OOP

My grandmother was born in Prussia and made spatzle
more like dumplings, by just taking spoonfuls of dough
and dropping them into the boiling water.  From all
of the German cookbooks that I have, the method of
making spatzle varies from region to region, so
therefore, all are correct, whether you put them
thru a ricer, or a spatzle press, cut off lumps or
use a spoon.

Huette


Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 23:53:53 -0500
From: LYN M PARKINSON <allilyn at juno.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Seeking wheat illumination -  OOP

>>Are spaetzle made in the same way as Italian pasta is?  And what are
all those different flours they have in Germany?  <<

I don't know, Elysant, what are the flours are, but I think they are
different kinds of milling.  We have bread flour, all-purpose, and cake
flour, which is very fine.  They have a lot more.

The spaetzle are not made the same way as pasta.  There are now little
machines that squeeze the dough out into little worms of noodles, but my
son's father-in-law taught me to cut them, as has been done for hundreds
of years.  You mix up a sort of gloppy dough, and with a knife that is
about 1" broad scoop some from the bowl onto the board, dip the knife in
the pot of boiling water, scoop up a little, sort of swirl it into the
dough/batter, making it gloppier, then cut rapidly, sort of shaving off
bits that the knife edge pushes into the boiling water.  When the
spaetzle cook, they float up, and every so often, you transfer them from
the cooking pot to a warm pottery dish with butter in it, and swish to
coat with the melted butter.

I taught a small class at one of the Cooks' Collegiums that Alys
Katherine sponsored in Ohio.  Much mess and fun, and they disappeared
fast at the pot luck.  Last time I cooked them for a feast, I was staying
with friends who had a 3 month old baby.  She wanted to be held up to
look around, and the spaetzle had to get done.  On the theory that
mothers had been minding the baby and cooking for a few centuries, we
worked out a way that held Malinda in the crook of the arm, fairly far
from boiling noodle steam, with the board handle in the left hand, knife
in the right, and she had her first cooking lesson.

Allison
allilyn at juno.com, Barony Marche of the Debatable Lands, Pittsburgh, PA
Kingdom of Aethelmearc


Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 16:07:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - spaetzle

The cookbook that I have "The Cuisines of Germany", by
Horst Scharfenberg, mentions a book called
"Spätzle-Breviary" by Dr. Karl Lerch and published in
1966.  That is all the information that I have been
able to find.  Unfortunately, Mr. Scharfenberg has no
bibliography in his cookbook.  Mr. Scharfenberg quotes
Dr. Lerch in saying that spätzle probably was from a
medieval monestary.

Huette


Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 01:31:33 +0100
From: Thomas Gloning <Thomas.Gloning at germanistik.uni-giessen.de>
Subject: Re: SC - spaetzle

Thanks a lot for the publication data. I will look and see if my local
libraries in Tuebingen have the Lerch book. The dictionaries I used up
to now are of not much help, even the "Schwaebisches Woerterbuch" with
its seven volumes! Strange. The suebian Cotta cookery book of 1764 has
no Spaetzle (as far as I can see, screening the almost 700 pages), only
several kinds of "Knoepflein". But whereas todays "Knoepfle" are quite
similar to Spaetzle, the Cotta-recipes for "Knoepflein" have little
resemblance to Spaetzle. Vollmer, in her "Sprachliches aus
altschwaebischen Kochbuechern" does not mention Spaetzle. I still
believe that Spaetzle are a 'late' dish, but I would be glad to find out
that the view of 'medieval spaetzle' is correct.

Thomas


Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 01:33:29 +0100
From: Thomas Gloning <Thomas.Gloning at germanistik.uni-giessen.de>
Subject: SC - Lerch on spaetzle

I found the two editions of Karl Lerch's Spaetzle-Brevier. The first
edition was published in 1962 in Tuebingen (where I live), the second
edition was published in 1966 in Reutlingen (not far from Tuebingen).
The University library has the first edition. Thanks to my antiquarian
booksellers, I now have a copy of the second edition. A funny book.

The upshot is that neither the etymology of the word "spaetzle" nor the
culinary history of the dish spaetzle is clear.

Someone asked about the etymology of the word "spaetzle". According to
Lerch, there are three possible explanations, roughly: (1) dumplings
were called "Spatzen" because of some kind of similarity in form with
sparrows, from there the "spaetzle" ('little sparrows') were derived;
(2) the word is derived from italian _spezzare; spezzato_ 'to cut to
pieces', because the dough is cut to pieces before it is boiled; (3)
there might be some connection to italian _pasta_ or french _pa^te_.
Lerch concludes that up to now nobody knows about the correct etymology
("Woher die Spaetzle ihre Namen haben? Nix Genaues weiß man nicht!" (p.
37)). -- If I had to place a bet, I would choose option (1), because the
use of "Spatzen" 'dumplings' is often attested in texts and the
development to _spaetzle_ seems possible to me.

Now, the culinary history of spaetzle is difficult to track down for two
reasons.

First, because the words "spatzen", "spaetzle", "knoepfle" etc. were
often used for quite different things. There are clear examples from the
18th century that "Spatzen" or "Knoepfle" denoted dumplings or little
dumplings. It is not clear how, when and if at all the development from
_Spatzen_ 'dumplings' to _spaetzle_ 'the special type of noodles'
happended.

Second, there is the problem of the interpretation of pictorial
representations one has to rely on. Lerch tells us that a 19th century
professor (Sachsse) concluded from a picture in a
'Sachsenspiegel'-manuscript (a very important juridical text), that the
suebian duke was represented with a utensil for making _Knoepfle_ or
_Spaetzle_ and thus was an example for an early _Spaetzlesschwab_ (a
suebian who likes spaetzle). -- Now, the utensil looks like sort of a
shovel which is hardly a typical utensil for preparing spaetzle. Anyway:
according to Lerch, Prof. Sachse made up the myth of the suebian eating
spaetzle since the middle ages ("... so war doch von Professor Sachsse
der Mythos der seit dem frühesten Mittelalter Spaetzle essenden Schwaben
begründet worden"; p. 30).

To conclude: Lerch quotes no evidence that there were spaetzle in the
Middle Ages. To the contrary: he describes how the myth of the medieval
'spaetzlesschwab' could arise. -- Thus, I still believe that spaetzle
with their specific preparation are a 'late' dish from the 18th or even
19th century. _If_ spaetzle were a characteristic dish for the suebians
since the middle ages, it would be strange to me that they are not
mentioned or described more clearly and more often. -- But I will keep
my eyes open!

I am happy to have the 'Spaetzle-Brevier' on my shelfes now! Thanks
again, Huette, for mentioning this funny book.

Thomas


Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 23:29:17 -0500
From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <harper at idt.net>
Subject: SC - Recipes: Dumplings

Recipe for grater-made dumplings, as promised.

Source: Ruperto de Nola, _Libro de Guisados_, Spanish, 1529
Translation: Lady Brighid ni Chiarain (Robin Carroll-Mann)
XINXANELLA A LA VENECIANA - Venetian Xinxanella

Take fat cheese; and grate a good handful of it; and grated bread from a
small loaf worth three blancas, and three maravedis worth of fine spice
and one maravedi of saffron and eight eggs; and let all be well mixed,
and kneaded all together; and when all is well mashed, take the cheese
grater turned back to front; and put this paste on it and when the broth
is boiling vigorously and is fatty you must make this paste pass through
the holes of the grater above the pot in such a manner that what passes
through goes into the pot and when everything has been passed through
let it cook like fideos or like morteruelo [hog's liver paté]; and when it is
cooked prepare dishes, but let it be thin, mixed with a little of the broth,
so that it is not as thick as fideos, however let the broth be fatty; and if
it is fatty beef broth, it will be a very good dish, amongst the best in the
world and with the quantities mentioned above you can make about
eight dishes.

Notes: I have not been able to find a definition of "xinxanella".  Blancas
and maravedis are period Spanish coins.  Checking my files, I find that I
previous posted a recipe from Granado for fideos made with a grater, so
below is a repost.

Para hazer macarrones, vulgarmente llamados fideos -- To make
macaroni, vulgarly called "fideos"
Source: Diego Granado, _Libro del Arte de Cozina_, Spainish, 1599
Translation: Brighid ni Chiarain (Robin Carroll-Mann)

Take two pounds of flour, and one pound of grated white bread passed
through the colander, and knead it with fat broth that is boiling, or with
water, adding four beaten egg yolks to mix with the dough, and when the
dough is made, in such a manner that it is not very hard, nor too soft,
but that it has its perfection, and sprinkle both [sides of] the cheese
grater with the best of the flour, and put the paste upon the grater, and
make the fideos, and not having a grater make them upon a board,
drawing the fideos [the length of] three fingers thinly, and put the least
flour that you can, so that they remain more tender, and have a care
that you do not feed it again, in such a manner that it becomes too soft
or liquid, and when they are made let them rest a little while, and then
make them cook in fat broth that boils, or in water in a wide vessel, and
when they are cooked, fit them on plates with grated cheese, and with
fresh buffalo cheese (which in Italy is called probatura) which is not very
salty, also grated, and with sugar, and cinnamon, and morsels of fresh
cow's butter upon the plates, in turn, the one and the other, and let it
baste on the plate over the hot ashes.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)


Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:24:27 -0800
From: Valoise <varmstro at zipcon.net>
Subject: Re: SC - quenelles?

Anne Marie said:
> anyone who can think of an example in a medieval cookbook of minced meat
> mixed with dough to make fritters and boiled in water? I know its too much
> to ask for the sauce mournay...:)

Hmm, this got me to thinking. There are so many dumpling-like recipes
that there must surely be some. So, since I was sitting at home groggy
from cold medicine, I thought I might as well try and do something
useful. I plowed through a number if German cookbooks and came almost
empty handed. Part of the problem might have been that in my medicated
haze I forgot that you asked about meat dumplings and I concentrated
only on fish dumplings. But I did come up with one.

I didn't think this would be that hard to find. But after looking
through a large number of German sources I only found 1 fish
dumpling-type thing that wasn't fried. This one is simmered in broth.
It's from Philippine Welserin - the Welser book that isn't translated yet.

wil du fisch krepla machen

so nim hausen oder hecht last jn
syedenn hacks dar nach klain mim [nim] ain zwyfel
vnd greinen kreytter hacks klain nim pfeffer vnd
jmber vnd ain wenig wech halter ber riers
als durch ain ander geuß dan ein hays
schmaltz  dar an vnd nim zucker waser mach ain
dayglin gilbs schlag dise fyl dar ein machss
auch jn ainem kielen schmaltz oder
gubenn jn ainem bryelin vnd sieden gutten
guotten wein met zucker
vnd dem selben brielin an richten

So take sturgeon or pike and let it boil. Chop it small. Take an onion
and green herbs, chop small. Take pepper and genger and a few juniper
berries, stir it together and pour melted fat into it. And take sugar,
water and make a dough. Color it yellow, beat it well therein. Or [you
can] also make it with cold fat. Gubenn (give it?) to some broth and
boil good wine with sugar and serve it with the same broth.

No eggs to bind it together and no flour or crumbs to make up the
dough, either. I'm not sure if that is an omission or scribal error.

But that is as close as I could come to quenelles in the German
sources.

Valoise


Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 00:57:22 EST
From: allilyn at juno.com
Subject: Re: SC - German Spa:etzle,

I believe it is period.  There are no recipes for any ordinary noodles or
dumplings in the Rheinfranisches Kochbuch, but it's like the other cooks
in other countries say:  these are things every cook or housewife knows
how to make.

There are recipes in a book I have that wasn't published until 1709, but
the material came from a 16thC. manuscript.  There is, however, some
'updating' to some of the recipes, IMO.

I'm trying to remember which source I've used for documentation.  Thomas
can give us a better idea as to when the word appears.  Spaetzle is
especially a Bavarian noodle, but I don't know its history in other
regions.  You can get it everywhere, and have been able to for a long
time, but I don't know the speed of travel of regional favorites.

OK, found the documentation from a class I taught in the Midrealm. 
Fahrenkamp gives his source as the 14th C. Tegernsee Cloister, but does
not give the original, and I don't have a copy of this, although I would
love to.

The Stuttgarter Kochkolleg gives the possible origin as 13th C., derived
from Italian workers who brought their favorite pasta recipes with them
to Germany.  The Italian word, _spezzatina_, refers to little cuttings of
noodle dough.  Niccolo, does this go along with your Italian research?

Allison,     allilyn at juno.com


Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 00:57:22 EST
From: allilyn at juno.com
Subject: Re: SC - German Spa:etzle,

Flour, eggs, a little milk, shake of nutmeg, warm, melted butter in the
hot dish.  Make a gloppy dough/batter.  You need a hand-held cutting
board and a sharp knife with a flat edge, not curved as a French chopping
knife is.  Biiiig pan of boiling water.  The more eggs to the rest of the
batter, the more tender the spa:etzle.  Most cookbook recipes will call
for 1-2 eggs to over 2 cups of flour.  We will do better!  I start with
around 3 cups of flour for home use, add 1/2 C. milk, around 1/4 t.
nutmeg, 1/2 t. salt (sometimes--I usually salt the cooking water) and
start breaking in eggs and stirring thoroughly.  

When it is the 'right' consistency, I pull a stool over by the stove,
rest the cutting board on the edge of the pan of boiling water, put a
glop of batter (really, it's thicker than batter, but not as firm as
dough) on the edge of the board.  With the knife, flip some boiling water
onto the batter, use a back and forth motion to 'thin' the batter a bit
with the water.  Use rapid motions to repeatedly shave small pieces of
the stuff into the boiling water.  A splash of oil in the water helps to
keep it from boiling over.  When the spaetzle float back up to the
surface they are usually nearly done.  You develop an eye for it.  Use a
slotted spoon to remove them and place in a large stoneware oval dish
that has been in the family for a century or so, or any other heat-proof,
low sided container, in which you have a stick or two of melted butter. 
You can put in more nutmeg if you like.  Toss the spaetzle with the
butter, so they are coated with flavor and don't stick together.  

Make more.  Keep doing this, not letting the boiling pan get crowded,
until all the batter is gone.  Keep your spaetzle warm.

For feasts, it's a little more liquidy than I usually make at home, which
is nearly all egg.  For 50, I've used 5 C. flour to 6 eggs, 3 C. milk. 
For 200, 18-20 C. flour to 26 eggs, 12 C. milk.    This is
approximate--if I don't need all the milk, I don't add it.  These are
extremely labor intensive.  Make them at home and freeze, if you want to
do for a feast.  They freeze very well.

Allison,     allilyn at juno.com


Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 01:38:13 -0800 (PST)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - German Spa:etzle,

This is one method of make Spaetzle.  Another is to
put the glob of dough in a Spaetzle press or a ricer
and squeeze it over a pot of boiling water.  Another
method is to take spoonfuls of dough and plop them
into boiling water.  The last method is the way my Oma
[grandmother] made spaetzle, and to me tastes the
best. But all methods are correct and all are German.

Huette


Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 22:00:21 +0200
From: Thomas Gloning <gloning at Mailer.Uni-Marburg.DE>
Subject: SC - German Sp‰tzle & good ale (15thC)

Allison said way back in digest 2041:
<< The Stuttgarter Kochkolleg gives the possible origin as 13th C.,
derived from Italian workers who brought their favorite pasta recipes
with them to Germany.  The Italian word, _spezzatina_, refers to little
cuttings of noodle dough. >>

and more recently asked:
<< Is the Cooking College wrong, too? >>

I do not know what evidence they have, but if I should place a bet, I
would say they are wrong, for two reasons:

- -- true, there were many Italian workers in Germany in the 20th century,
but, as far as I can say, in earlier centuries, it was the other way
round: the Germans went to Italy, in most cases to do business or to
learn business stuff from the Italians, some went there for cultural
reasons, too (Goethe, D¸rer, ...). From the 14th century onwards,
several German trade companies from Ravensburg, Nuremberg or Augsburg
had close connections with Italy, and there was even a 'German center'
(Fondaco dei Tedeschi) in Venice.

- -- I did a limited search in the dictionaries and the cookbooks, but I
did not find any evidence that there is an Italian word _spezzatina_,
refering to a sort of noodle.
+ I looked up the word in a small italian dictionary, then in the Bulle/
Rigutini dictionary (that usually also mentions earlier meanings) and in
the etymological dictionary of Italian by Cortelazzo & Zolli. There is
only _spezzatino_ in the sense of 'Gulasch' (pieces of meat ...).
+ In addition, I looked up some old Italian cookbooks and foodbooks: the
Anonimo Veneziano text, the Anonimo meridionale B, Martino, the
Manoscritto Lucano, the work of Catrical‡ on Messi Sbugo, the work of
Frosini on the food of the "Priori" of Florence for words beginning with
"spe". There were NO spezzatine and no spezzatini.

Please note: I am not saying that Sp‰tzle are not period, but I must say
that up to now I know of no evidence that they are. Certainly, I will be
happy if we finally find a recipe... Let's keep our eyes open.

Thomas


Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 20:43:22 EDT
From: allilyn at juno.com
Subject: SC - Re: =20SC=20-=20German=20Sp=E4tzle?=

>>What is a kloster.  a general pasta or a specific type?<<

Well, Frederich, it's a late-night glitch!  Meant to type 'klosse' .  The
double s is actually that special character.  It's a meat filled
dumpling.  According to one of my modern cook books, it always has meat,
but I'm not sure that is true.  I have a modern recipe for a
Serviettenkloss [dumpling cooked in a napkin] that has no meat, although
it does have parsley and onion, as well as the eggs and milk that hold
the bread crumbs together.  And nutmeg.  Can be called Serviettenknodel.

These are usually pretty big--you slice them.  There is also the knopfe,
sometimes made much the same way. Hefeknopf is a yeast dumpling. 
Maultaschen is the German version of raviole--meat and spinach filled
pockets (ox-noses) in a clear broth.  There are lots of forms of cooked
dough: we like our carbs!

 Another of my books says that the eminent culinary historian, Thaddaus
Troll, also credits spaetzle to an Italian import in the 13th century.

Allison,     allilyn at juno.com


Date: Thu, 21 Sep 2000 22:33:07 EDT
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: SC - quenelle

stefan at texas.net writes:
<< What is a "quenelle"? >>

que*nelle (noun)
[French, from German Knodel dumpling, from Middle High German; akin to Old 
High German knoto knot -- more at KNOT]
First appeared 1845
 : a poached oval dumpling of pureed forcemeat (as of pike) often served in a 
cream sauce

Ras


Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 10:12:36 -0500
From: Jane Boyko <jboyko at magma.ca>
Subject: Re: Pierogies vs pirozhki (was Re: SC - Northkeep's Winterkingdom)

Yana is correct that pierogies is the term used by modern folks for
"dumplings".  However the dough is more of a noodle dough (can be quite
stretchy) as opposed to a pastry dough (usually flour, egg, water and
salt). Dumplings is the English translation that my Ukrainain family, and
many Polish friends, applies to them.  
see:  Lemnis, Maria and Henryk Vitry. Old Polish Traditions In the Kitchen
and at the Table. New York:  Hippocrene Books, 1981.
The Ukrainains refer to these as Varenyky.  The Ukrainians also offer a
dish similar to varenyky called Pyrohy which is made with a yeast-raised
dough or shortning like pastry dough.  The varenyky are not used in the
traditional sense of dumplings (cooked on top of soup or stew) but rather,
quite often, as a meal on their own, first boiled to cook the dough and
then served hot with sour cream.  Depending on the filling these are really
yummy served as leftovers fried in butter.
see: Stechishin, Savella. Traditional Ukrainian Cookery.  Winnipeg, Canada:
 Trident Press Ltd., 1982.  (out of print I believe).
As to the Pirozhok The Art of Russian Cuisine lists three different types
of pies and fillings.

Pirog: large rectangular pie made with a yeast dough and compared to Brioche

Kurnik:  "one of the oldest pirog recipes.  It is round with a cone-shaped
top, about 5 inches high and contains several layers of filling--chicken,
fresh mushroom, and chopped hard cooked eggs.  Crepes separate the fillings
and asorb the juices"

Kulebiaka:  narrow rectangular pie (4 X 12 X 4 inches) (w x l x h) with 2
full crusts and filled with different layers or each corner contains a
diferent filling.

These are classified as the large pies.

Small pies are called Pirozhki
Pirozhok:  small (2.5 to 5 inch long) oval pie or turnover and stuffed with
a meat filling.
Rasstegai:  similar to Pirozhok but open in middle to reveal filling
Vatrushka:  small round open face pie, usually a soup accompianment.

All of these types of pies are baked.
It seems that the Russians used piroghi to refer to all pies of the above
nature as opposed to the the Polish Perogie and the Ukrainain Varenyky.  It
is interesting to note that the Russians also use the term Varenyky to
refer to that special type of dumpling that the mundane world refers to as
perogie.  
book reference:  Volokh, Anne.  The Art of Russian Cuisine.  USA:
MacMillan, 1983.

I have found a refence in "Old Polish Traditions" refering to perogi under
the Lithuanian name of kolduny.  These are described as meat filled perogi
(ravioli to which perogi are very similar).  This reference appears to come
out of the Jagiellon dynasty which started in late 1300's.

Thought I would add to the conversation.  Hope it helps, not confound.

Marina/Jane


>Stefan li Rous wrote:
>>Okay, what is the differance between a pierogie and a piroshki?
>
>In the modern sense, pierogies (Polish origin) are pastry dough stuffed
>with or wrapped around a filling and boiled (sometimes pan-fried
>afterwards). Pirozhkis (Russian origin) are shortcrust (pie) dough or bread
>dough stuffed with or wrapped around a filling and baked, pan-fried, or
>deep-fried (and for the liguistically-minded, the singular is "pirozhok",
>the plural is "pirozhki", and it is spelled with a "zh", not a "sh").
>
>>Did anyone find any definative evidence that these were period? Period
>>recipes would be even better, but I doubt we have that.
>
>I only know about pirozhkis.  Yes, they are period, no, we don't have a
>"recipe."  But, we do know what types of fillings were used in pies, and
>pirozhki means "little pie."  The Domostroi (in the definitely period
>section) lists pie fillings: "For meat days stuff them with whichever meat
>is at hand.  For fast days use kasha, peas, broth [I presume mixed with a
>drier ingredient], turnips, mushrooms, cabbage, or whatever God provides."
>[Pouncy:125].  On page 151 and 161, "turnovers" are mentioned.  In Pouncy's
>footnote of the latter entry, she calls them "pirozhki."  
>
>No mention of the cooking technique, but I would guess they were probably
>baked, like the bigger pies, if only because they would be slightly easier
>to bake for an entire household instead of frying them in batches.
>Although if you set up some sort of assembly-line type of service (fry a
>few, rush them to the diners, fry a few, rush them to the next batch of
>diners, etc.) it might work.  Or maybe keeping them warm in the
>oven...okay, I'm reaching here.  I don't know how they were cooked.  :-)
>
>--Yana


Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:32:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Chris Stanifer <jugglethis at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Wontons

- --- Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> wrote:
> Many of the larger dumplings will call for boiling them in
> peculiar (but workable) methods such as bringing the water back to a
> boil, then adding a glass of cold water, then bringing it to a boil
> again, with or without repeating the process, depending on size. 

This is the same method for cooking certain buckwheat
noodles.  Judging from experience alone, I believe the
method allows the noodle to cook through, without
swelling so much.  It sounds reasonable to apply the
same method to a filled dumpling, as well, or any item
which requires the inside to be fully cooked without
over cooking the outside.  I'll have to look into this
further.

Balthazar of Blackmoor


From: Beatrix zumDunklenturm [beazumd_cook at yahoo.com]
Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 9:10 AM
To: Harris Mark.S-rsve60
Subject: Re: German food contest

Greetings, Stefan.
Here is the documentation I did for the West Kingdom
Wooden Spoon competition for March Crown, AS XXXVI.

German Food - Chicken Dumplings
By Lady Beatrix zum Dunklenturm

193 - Das Kochbuch der Sabina Welserin (c. 1553)
Wie man kaponerkrapfen machen soll
Nempt das bret von 2 hennen, wens gesoten jst, hackt
es fein, nempt ain barmisankesß geriben darúnder vnnd
gilbts vnnd rierts dúrchainander/ jr solt aúch
múscatblie vnnd pfeffer dareinthon, macht darnach ain
taig an/ macht ain tinnen blatz vnnd thiet die
obgeschribne fille daraúff vnnd formierts zú ainem
krapfen vnnd dient die 2 zipffel zúsamen/ siedts jn
ainer fleschbrie wie hert gesottne air vnnd gebts
warm.

My Translation:
How you shall make coney crullers
Take the breasts(bret) from two hens, whom is boiled,
chop it fine, take a Parmesan cheese grated combine
and egg yolks(gilbts/eigelb) and stir mixing up /
little salt(solt) also mace(múscatblie) and
pepper(pfeffer) _ (dareinthon), make after that a
dough / make thin(tinnen) sheets(blatz/blatt) and _
(thiet) the above described filling on it and form it
closed into a cruller and conduct the two points
(zipffel/pfeil) together / boil in a broth like hard
boiled egg and serve hot.

My Redaction:
Chicken Dumplings
Filling:
4 oz	Chicken Breast, boiled
1.5 oz	Parmesan Cheese, grated
2	Egg Yolks
1/16 tsp 	salt
1/8 tsp 	mace
1/8 tsp 	pepper
	
Dough:
2 eggs
1 cup flour + 1/8 cup

for boiling:Chicken Broth

Once the chicken has been cooked, chop it finely.
Mix in the Parmesan cheese. Mix in the egg yolks to
moisten and yellow the filling. Mix in the spices (you
can add more spice to taste). Set aside.
In a small bowl, beat the eggs for the dough. Mix in
the flour 1/4 cup at a time. This should be a slightly
sticky thick dough. Knead the remaining flour into
dough. Roll the dough into thin sheets.
Put a small amount of filling onto each dumpling
wrapper and press the edges together to close. You can
bring around the two points and press together to form
a "diaper" shape.
Boil in chicken broth for approximately 15 minutes.
Serve hot.

This recipe has been previously translated by Valoise
Armstrong in 1998. I differed in my translation in two
major respects. The first was her translation of the
word 'gilbts' was to "make yellow" the filling. Other
cooks have interepreted this to mean add saffron, or
some other type of coloring. I felt that translating
it as "egg yolk" would make more sense. The modern
word for egg yolk is eigelb (yellow egg). I feel this
is a valid interpretation, as the yolk would make the
filling a little yellow, as well as give it a softer
consistancy. My second difference is that in her
translation, she doesn't mention salt at all. Since
the word 'solt' appears with the mace and pepper, I
deduced that salt was indeed added to the filling.
The original recipe does not say how the dough is
made, so I had to do a little detective work to see
how they would have made it. First I looked for
recipes that were similar in that it was a stuffed
dumpling boiled in broth. In the same book, there is a
recipe for ravioli (#31) which is prepared similarly.
In that recipe, it specifies to make "a dough with
good flour, as if you would make a tart" (vund macht
ain taig mit ainem shcenen mel, als welt ain torta
machen). Unfortunately, that's all it says about the
dough. So, looking for a tart dough recipe led me to A
tart with plums (#70) which specifies "...bake the dough
for the tart, that is made like so: take two eggs and
beat them, afterwards stir flour therein until it
becomes a thick dough. Pour afterwards on the table
and work it well, until it is ready. ... so every man
makes tart dough" (...bachen den taig zu der torten,
hept man also an, man nimpt 2 air vnnd erklopffts,
darnach riert ain mel daran, bis es dich wirt, schit
in darnach auff den disch vnnd arbait in woll, bis er
recht wirt...also macht man all tortentaig.)

Das Kochbuch der Sabina Welserin (c. 1553) webbed at
http://staff-www.uni-marburg.de/~gloning/sawe.htm


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 13:42:17 -0400
From: "amanda sears" <kissesmomof4 at msn.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] re:dumplings
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

  I am looking in a book I am reading now and the first RECORDED recipe  
in a recipe book is from 1653. The dumplings were made of flour,  
pepper, salt, yeast and water, made into tiny manchets and boiled in  
water for an hour. These were served buttered. Earlier dumplings it  
says would have been cooked in a broth in the stew pot.

~Amanda~


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 16:55:09 -0400
From: "amanda sears" <kissesmomof4 at msn.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: Sca-cooks Digest, Vol 16, Issue 64
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

  Oops sorry when I told about the dumplings I forgot to tell you which 
book I got the info from (I have a nasty head ache and am not thinking 
clearly) The book is Food and Drink in Britain by C. Anne Wilson. The 
book covers what they call prehistory up to more modern periods and 
they cover other areas such as Ireland, Scotland and beyond. There are 
recipes and such through out. It's a very good book and if I can find 
it I would like to buy it but it looks like it is a rather old book (I 
got it through inter-library loan from a college library)

~Amanda~


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 15:00:38 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Robin Carroll-Mann <rcmann4 at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Period or no?
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Ruperto de Nola has a recipe for spaetzle-like cheese dumplings:

VENETIAN XINXANELLA
XINXANELLA A LA VENECIANA

Take fat cheese, and grate a good handful of it, and grated bread from  
a small loaf of three blancas, and three maravedis of fine spice, and  
one maravedi of saffron, and eight eggs, and let all be well-mixed, and  
kneaded all together; and when all is well-mashed, take the cheese  
grater turned back to front, and put this paste on it; and when the  
broth is boiling vigorously and is fatty you must make this paste pass  
through the holes of the grater above the pot in such a manner that  
what passes through goes into the pot; and when everything has been  
passed through, let it cook like fideos or like morteruelo; and when it  
is cooked, prepare dishes.  But let it be thin, mixed with a little of  
the broth, so that it is not as thick as fideos.  However, let the  
broth be fatty, and if it is fatty beef broth, it will be a very good  
dish, amongst the best in the world; and with the quantities mentioned  
above you can make about eight dishes.

Ruperto de Nola, "Libro de Guisados" 1529 (recipe also appears in 1520  
Catalan edition)
http://www.florilegium.org/files/FOOD-MANUSCRIPTS/Guisados1-art.text

Although the recipe says it is particularly good with beef broth, it  
would also be appropriate to use chicken broth.  Since the dough is to  
be thinned with broth, I think the xinxanellas would be closer in shape  
to a drop dumpling than the rope-like spaetzle.  I'm not completely  
sure about the etymology of the term, but "xinxa" is the Catalan word  
for a roach or a bedbug.  (Don't freak out -- after all, "vermicelli"  
means "little worms".)  Since it's allegedly a Venetian recipe, would  
any of our Italian scholars care to weigh in?

Robin Carroll-Mann
rcmann4 at earthlink.net


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 12:07:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louise Smithson <helewyse at yahoo.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: Period or no: drop dumplings
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

  How well can drop dumplings be documented?

I have something similar to a drop dumpling from 16th C Italy, however  
the pasta is not served in a soup, but drained and dressed.  Nor is  
there any leavening.

Per fare & cuocere Maccaroni in piu modi per giorno quadregesimale. Cap  
CCLV.  Terzo libro.
Piglisi una libra di fior di farina, & una libra di pangrattato,  
passato per lo foratoro minuto, impastisi ogni cosa con acqua che bolla  
& oglio d'olive mescolato con un poco di zafferano, e faccia la pasta  
che non sia troppo soda, ma ben mescolata sopra una tavola, e come  
havera preso il caldo, faccianosi i gnocchi cioe maccaroni sopra la  
grattacascio, e poganosi a cuocere in acque che bolla con un poco di  
sale, & come saranno cotti, cavinosi e ponganosi in un vaso di terra o  
di legno, e mettavisi sopra una agliata fatta di noci peste, spigoli  
d'aglioi, pepe, & polpa di pane ammogliata nell'acqua calda, mescolisi  
ogni cosa insieme, & servanosi con pepe & cannella sopra.  Ma volendo  
farsi maccaroni tirali ad basta, facciasi la pasta piu sodetto, &  
lascisi un  pochetto riposare lo sfoglio sopra la tavola, e taglisi con  
lo sperone a liste quadre o in altro modo, a beneplacito, & faccianosi  
cuocere all'acqua e sale, e servanosi come i soprascritti.  Et chi  
vorra potra ancho cop!
  rirli di
  salza verde.
To make and cook maccaroni in many ways for lenten days.
Take a pound of flour and a pound of grated bread passed through the  
finest sieve.  Bind everything together with boiling water and olive  
oil mixed with a little saffron. Make pasta that is not too firm, but  
well mixed on the table (knead well) and when it has lost its heat make  
the gnocchi that is maccaroni above the cheese grater (*1) and put them  
to cook in boiling water with a little salt.  When they are cooked  
strain and put them in a dish of clay or wood and put above a garlic  
sauce made of walnuts ground, garlic cloves, pepper and crumb of bread  
that has been soaked in hot water.  Mix everything together and serve  
them with pepper and cinnamon above.  But if one wants to make macaroni  
drawn out enough, make the pasta more firm and leave it to rest as a  
sheet on the table and cut it with a sperone (*2) into square (four  
cornered) strips and cook them in water and salt and serve them as it  
is written above.  And if you want they can also be served covered with  
green sau!
  ce.
(*1) - The noodles are made in the first instance the way that noodles  
for paprikash are often made.  A soft dough is grated into boiling  
water.  This would yield small dumpling style pasta shapes.
(*2) - The noodles can also be made like tagliatelle.  The pasta is  
made more firm, rolled out into a sheet and cut with a Sperone.  Scappi  
carries a picture of a "Sperone da pasticiero" - literal translation  
spur of the pasta chef.  It has a curved knife on one end, a handle in  
the middle and what looks like a fluted cutting wheel on the other end.  
  It would therefore allow you to make very fancy cut pasta.


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 12:38:11 -0700
From: Ruth Frey <ruthf at uidaho.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: dumplings
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

> "amanda sears" <kissesmomof4 at msn.com> wrote:
> I am looking in a book I am reading now and the first RECORDED
> recipe in a recipe book is from 1653. The dumplings were made of
> flour, pepper, salt, yeast and water, made into tiny manchets and
> boiled in water for an hour. These were served buttered. Earlier
> dumplings it says would have been cooked in a broth in the stew
> pot.

      Doesn't Platina have some dumpling-y recipes, simmered in
broth?  They probably aren't called dumplings, but I'd be inclined
to consider them along the lines of at least spatzle.

      Of course, I'm working from memory, and don't have my copy of
Platina in front of me at work, so I might be hallucinating it
all, but I *was* going through the book recently, with beginning
thoughts of a Platina-based 12th Night feast.

                     -- Ruth


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 13:32:09 -0700
From: Ruth Frey <ruthf at uidaho.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: Spatzle
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

      I do love spatzle; don't have the recipe in front of me, but I 
make them with a stiff egg dough (pretty much along the lines of 
recipes already given).  I don't bother with grating them or rolling 
out the dough, I just make it into a ball and then pinch off little 
bits of it (about marble to grape sized) and toss them in the pot a few 
at a time.  They're done when they float, then you skim them off with a 
slotted spoon and toss in more.

      I like flavoring them with a little nutmeg and pepper, something a 
picked up from a friend of mine who said he read about that seasoning 
in a German cookbook.  Never saw his source, but it's tasty -- and at 
least sorta-Period.  ;)

      FWIW about using just egg yolks in spatzle and dumplings -- it 
probably helps keep them tender, since you don't have the 
albumin/protein from the white to toughen up when it cooks.

                -- Ruth


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 20:45:04 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Robin Carroll-Mann <rcmann4 at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Period or no?
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com> wrote:
[re: VENETIAN XINXANELLA]

> I'm not sure exactly what "drop dumplings" are,

A batter or soft dough which is dropped by spoonfuls into boiling soup  
or stew.  It tends to form irregular balls.
http://www.cooks.com/rec/doc/0,1637,145181-245203,00.html
http://www.cooks.com/rec/doc/0,164,155176-243196,00.html

> but this sounds as though the dough is going into the liquid in thin  
> strings or bits--whatever you get after passing it through a grater and  
> immediately into the pot.

I think it would be bits.  The recipe does say that the paste should  
not be as thick as that for fideos, which are a kind of noodle.

> Have you tried it? Sounds interesting.

No, I haven't, but it's on my list of want-to-try recipes.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 21:14:05 -0400
From: Brett McNamara <brettmc at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Period or no?
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

<lilinah at earthlink.net> wrote:
> But do matzoh balls qualify as dumplings?

Absolutely!

The most basic of dough, just flour and water, can define a bread like
substance (well, paste, really).  If you throw it in an oven, it wont
rise but you'd call the product bread.  If you take that paste and
cook it on hot liquid, but get a basic dumpling.

I found this article that enumerates the many dumpling styles, a few I
hadn't heard of:
http://newtimes.rway.com/1999/020399/eats.shtml


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 14:39:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Period or no?
To: jenne at fiedlerfamily.net, Cooks within the SCA
	<sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

> Pardon me for asking a question that may seem
> ignorant.. but is not chicken and dumplings period?

Not for chicken _and_ dumplings.  Sabina
Welserin has recipes for dumplings and chicken
dumplings.

193 How to make chicken dumplings

Take the meat from two chickens. After it is
cooked chop it finely, mix grated Parmesan cheese
in with it and color it yellow and stir it
together. You should also put mace and pepper
into it. After that prepare a dough. Make a thin
flat cake and put the above described filling on
it and form it into a dumpling and join the two
ends together. Cook it in broth as long as for
hard- boiled eggs and serve it warm.

119 If you would make boiled dumplings

Then take chard, as much as you like, some sage,
marjoram and rosemary, chop it together, also put
grated cheese into it and beat eggs therein until
you think that it is right. Take also cinnamon,
cloves, pepper and raisins and put them into the
dumpling batter. Let the dumplings cook, as one
cooks a hard-boiled egg, then they are ready.

Huette


Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 15:05:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] re:dumplings
To: ysabeau at mail.ev1.net, Cooks within the SCA
	<sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

I have found three different ways of making
spaetzle.  One is like you mention, rolling it
into finger widths and cutting it before boiling.
Another is to rice it with a special spaetlze
mandolin.  The third is to make it like my
Prussian grandmother did, by dropping
teaspoonfulls of dough directely into the boiling
water.  All are correct, just regional variations.

But, as I said before, Dr. Thomas Gloning hasn't
found any period spaetzle recipes, as of a
conversation several years ago and he has access
to all these manuscripts.

Huette


Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:02:58 -0500
From: "Martha Oser" <osermart at msu.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: Sca-cooks Digest, Vol 20, Issue 112
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Vitha wrote:

> Whooo Whhoooo!!!  My grand plot to turn the known world German is
> working!!!  Yes, my dear, lovely....Just a little more spaetzle and 
> you will feel MUCH better....

Yes, more spaetzle always makes you feel better, especially with the sauce
from the rouladen poured over them...

Two weeks ago, I made spaetzle for 60.  I made them the night before the
event, shocked them with ice water to stop the cooking, laid them out on
pans to dry somewhat, then tossed with a little oil to keep them from
sticking together.  They were transported to the event in a 5 gallon bucket
(about 2/3 to 3/4 full) and reheated in an electric roaster.  None of them
came back from the tables (she said modestly)...

  -Helena


Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2005 07:59:56 -0500
From: "Martha Oser" <osermart at msu.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Re: Sca-cooks Digest, Vol 20, Issue 114
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Ru asked:
> I like the roaster idea though - did you heat them with butter or just  
> with the oil that was on them?

We just used the oil that was on them.  After they were heated, we did add a
panful of onions sauteed in butter, so that brought some butter flavor as
well.  I'm not sure that applying the oil was entirely necessary in the
first place.  Once they were shocked and cooled, they didn't seem to be
sticking to each other, but I didn't want to take the chance of getting up
the next morning and finding a massive, solidified block of dough in my
bucket...

In hindsight, I think we could have used 2 roasters.  The amount I made
pretty much filled the entire roaster, which made for some careful stirring
on my part so they didn't go flying all over the kitchen!  Plus, I think it
probably took longer for them to heat since the roaster was so full.

My mother had suggested reheating them with butter in a roasting pan in the
oven - it just worked out that the ovens were in use and we used the roaster
instead.  I'd think either way would work just fine.  You do have to be
careful of temperature so they don't burn or brown, unless that's what
you're going for (mmm, spaetzle sauteed in butter...)

I think it's a good idea to make them ahead, especially for large quantities
like this.  I can't imagine wanting to spend several hours over a boiling
pot of water in the kitchen on feast day.

  -Helena


Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 23:17:13 -0400
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: cooking_rumpolt at yahoogroups.com, sca-cooks at ansteorra.org,
	mk-cooks at midrealm.org, mmcooks at googlegroups.com

We did a test cook today, to settle the side dishes for the upcoming  
Red Dragon feast.  I picked the dumpling recipe because our baroness  
is celiac, and it was an interesting side dish that didn't use flour.

Of all the recipes, this is the only one I hadn't tried at all. They  
were VERY good.

However in test cooking we found that they fell apart without at  
least a little flour.  I know  that sometimes recipes assume things  
that aren't mentioned.  Could this be true here?    I may try rice  
flour, but apparently there is some new anti-gluten med that may make  
it unnecessary.

The recipe didn't specify the cheese, I used parmesan because it is  
mentioned by name in other German recipes.  I should have used   
marjoram not thyme, but I bought a poultry blend package that had  
sage, rosemary, and thyme.

The first batch was chopped by hand and rather coarse.  The finely  
chopped ones had a much better texture.

The first time I read this recipe, I had the idea that it would use  
cottage cheese, and we tried a batch with parmesan and cottage  
cheese.  They tasted ok, but not nearly as good, and the texture was  
not as good either.

We also tested cherry sauce.  Rumpolt has an uncooked sauce with  
sugar and cinnamon, and a cooked sauce with wine and sugar.  The  
verdict was to combine them and add cinnamon to the cooked sauce.

I did a second test for rice with almond milk.  I did the first batch  
with arborio rice, because I had this idea that it was likely to be  
the type available.  It tasted good, but had a rather gluey texture.   
Maybe I'm not Italian enough.  Tonight we made a batch with long  
grain rice, and the texture was much better.

And they weren't meant to be served together, but the cherry sauce  
was quite amazing with the almond rice.

Ranvaig


Welserin 119   If you would make boiled dumplings.

Then take chard, as much as you like, some sage, marjoram and  
rosemary, chop it together, also put grated cheese into it and beat  
eggs therein until you think that it is right. Take also cinnamon,  
cloves, pepper and raisins and put them into the dumpling batter. Let  
the dumplings cook, as one cooks a hard-boiled egg, then they are ready.

1 bunch chard, chopped and blanched, a little over a cup
4 oz parmesan, grated
2 T raisins, plumped in hot water and drained
1 tsp fresh sage
1/2 tsp fresh rosemary
1/2 tsp fresh marjoram (I used thyme)
3/4 tsp ground cinnamon
3/8 tsp ground black pepper
1/8 tsp ground cloves
2 eggs
about 3/8 c flour

Chop the chard, herbs, and cheese in a food processor to a fine  
texture.  Add the eggs, spices, and raisins, mix well.  Add the  
flour, starting with a 1/4 c at first, adding by spoonfuls as necessary.

Drop by tablespoons into  simmering water and cook until they float  
and the middle is cooked, about 5 mins.  It made about 16 dumplings.


Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 21:49:43 -0400
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: cooking_rumpolt at yahoogroups.com, sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

I finally looked at the original German for this, and am kicking  
myself.  These aren't dumplings at all.  The dictionaries translate  
"Krapfen" as "donut" now, but means more like ravoili or pierogi.   
"zumachen" means to close a pastry.  I think  "vnnd machs jn den taig  
z? krapffen" should be translated as "and close in the dough into  
ravioli".    This is just the filling, that is why there isn't any  
flour in it.

Ranvaig

Welserin 119 Wilt? gesotten krepfflen machen/ So nim ain mangoldt,  
als vill d? wilt, ain wenig ain sal?a, ain maseron, ain rosmarin,  
hacks vnnderainander, th? ain geriben kes? a?ch darein, schlag air  
darein, bis d? mainst, das es recht sey/ rerlach, negellach, pfeffer,  
weinber nim a?ch darein vnnd machs jn den taig z? krapffen, las?  
sieden, wie man herte air seudt, so send sy gemacht.

If you would make boiled dumplings/ Then take chard, as much as you  
like, some sage, marjoram and rosemary, chop it together, also put  
grated cheese into it and beat eggs therein until you think that it  
is right. Take also cinnamon, cloves, pepper and raisins and put them  
into the dumpling batter. Let the dumplings cook, as one cooks a hard- 
boiled egg, then they are ready.


Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 23:15:05 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

I would point out Krapfen has regional variations.  What we call filled
doughnuts are considered Krapfen in Northern Germany, while in Southern
Germany, Krapfen mostly refers to turnovers or fried pies.  The dictionary
definition also equates them to fritters, but I think this the French style
of fritter with the filling folded into a ball of dough rather than dipped
into a batter.  I would therefore tend to translate "taig" (Tieg) as dough
rather than batter.

Welserin gives a recipe for an egg dough in A Tart with Plums (70), and
calls for it's use in the Shrove-Tuesday Doughnuts (173).  This would
probably be a good dough to use in this recipe.

Bear

----- Original Message -----

I finally looked at the original German for this, and am kicking myself.
These aren't dumplings at all.  The dictionaries translate "Krapfen" as
"donut" now, but means more like ravoili or pierogi.  "zumachen" means to
close a pastry.  I think  "vnnd machs jn den taig z? krapffen" should be
translated as "and close in the dough into ravioli".    This is just the
filling, that is why there isn't any flour in it.

Ranvaig


Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 00:40:49 -0400
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

> I would point out Krapfen has regional variations.  What we call filled
> doughnuts are considered Krapfen in Northern Germany, while in Southern
> Germany, Krapfen mostly refers to turnovers or fried pies.

I thought I had looked that the German when I picked the recipe.  If  
I did, I was still new enough not to notice the translation problem.   
I only noticed now because I was putting together the recipe book.

The redaction I worked on is entirely wrong.  Now I have to decide if  
I can make them this way, or need to pick a different dish. Ten days  
to the feast.  Filling ravoili will be a lot more work than making  
dropped dumplings.  Any suggestions on how big a boiled krapfen would  
be?

Ranvaig


Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 01:30:07 -0400
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

> Welserin gives a recipe for an egg dough in A Tart with Plums (70), and
> calls for it's use in the Shrove-Tuesday Doughnuts (173).  This would
> probably be a good dough to use in this recipe.

Welserin 70. ...That is made like so: take two eggs and beat them.  
Afterwards stir flour therein until it becomes a thick dough. Pour it  
on the table and work it well, until it is ready....

Rumpolt Vom Kalb  14.  ...nimm Mehl/ und thu darunter drei oder vier  
Eier/ und ein wenig Salz/ und mach ein Teig darau?/ und mach jhn  
fest/ da? du jn kanst mit einem Walger au?treiben/ schlag die F?ll  
darein/ und mach Krapfen darau?/ nicht gro?/ sondern klein/ und wann  
du es gemacht hast/ so schneidt es mit einem R?dtlein ab/ Nimm in  
einem saubern uberzinten Fischkessel ein gute Rindtfleischbr?he/ oder  
ein Hennenbr?he / die nicht versalzen ist/ wann sie sehr gesalzen  
ist/ so nimm Wasser darunter/ setz es auf Kolen mit dem Kessel/ und  
wenn die Br?he seudt/ so wirf ein Krapfen nach dem andern hinein/ und  
schaw/ da? du sie nit zerwirffst/ la? sie gar gemach sieden/ da? sie  
nicht voneinander fahren/...

Take flour/ and put into it three or four eggs/ and a little salt/  
and make a dough from it/ and make it firm/ that you can drive (roll)  
it out with a roller/ wrap the filling in it/ and make krapfen from  
it/ not big or small/ and when you have made them/ then cut them up  
with a roller take in a clean tinned fish kettle a good beef broth/  
or a chicken broth/ that is not oversalted/ When it is oversalted/  
then add water/ set on the coals with the kettle/ and when the broth  
boils/ then throw the krapfen in one after another/ and look that you  
dont drop them too hard/ let it come completely to a boil/ that they  
don't stick together.

24. ... und mach jhn nicht gar zu dick/ da? du es kanst gar d?nn au? 
treiben/ wie ein sch?nes d?nnes Papier/ je d?nners ist/
... and make it not too thick/ that you can roll it completely thin/  
like a fair thin paper/  it is so thin...

Both these are meat filled and served in the broth.

Ranvaig


Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 06:35:59 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

>> I would point out Krapfen has regional variations.  What we call filled
>> doughnuts are considered Krapfen in Northern Germany, while in  
>> Southern Germany, Krapfen mostly refers to turnovers or fried pies.
>
> I thought I had looked that the German when I picked the recipe.  If I
> did, I was still new enough not to notice the translation problem. I only
> noticed now because I was putting together the recipe book.
>
> The redaction I worked on is entirely wrong.  Now I have to decide if I
> can make them this way, or need to pick a different dish. Ten days to the
> feast.  Filling ravoili will be a lot more work than making dropped
> dumplings.  Any suggestions on how big a boiled krapfen would be?
>
> Ranvaig

I'd make them an inch or slightly more in diameter.  Large enough to  
make a good bite, small enough to cook thoroughly.

Frankly, we don't know what these Krapfen looked like or precisely how they
were made.  I'm basing my interpretation on the years I spent in Germany and
Herr Rehwald's (high school German instructor, who spoke seven languages)
discussions on regional and colloquial German.  Given the limited
instructions, these might be a batter dipped filling.

Bear


Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 07:22:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Cat ." <tgrcat2001 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Chard and cheese dumplings
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

Um almost correct, but the corrections will make a BIG
difference.
first" nicht gro?/ sondern klein/"
means Not large/ BUT small

next the really important one:
"und schaw/ da? du sie nit
  zerwirffst/ la? sie gar gemach sieden/ da? sie nicht
voneinander fahren/..."

should be: see/ that you dont break them/ let them
simmer gently/ they they do not fall appart
(technically it is that they not frome one-another drive)

If you boil them hard the dough will separate from the
filling and you will have tatters in
cloudy/filling mushy broth. (ask how I know ;-)

Gwen Cat
thinking they sound rather tasty

---original message---
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com

> Welserin gives a recipe for an egg dough in A Tart with Plums (70),
> and calls for it's use in the Shrove-Tuesday Doughnuts
> (173).  This would probably be a good dough to use in this recipe.


Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 16:55:16 -0500
From: "Phil Troy / G. Tacitus Adamantius" <adamantius1 at verizon.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] al-Hafla breakdown ...
To: Christiane <christianetrue at earthlink.net>,	Cooks within the SCA
	<sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

On Feb 12, 2009, at 3:50 PM, Christiane wrote:
<<< Things I would do differently: not freezing the manti (it was very  
difficult to get them out of the layers of waxed paper and several  
opened up when boiling, disgorging their meaty insides) >>>

For future reference...

Something I've learned over the years regarding filled dumplings of  
various kinds, including mantee: you can freeze them on parchment- 
lined cookie sheets until they're completely, rock-hard frozen -- you  
may have to freeze them in several batches -- and then transfer them  
to ziplock bags to save space, and since they keep their shape and  
don't stick together to any appreciable extent, and those that do  
separate easily in the pot, they're pretty easy to handle.

In boiling them, I find that you can reduce the tendency to burst open  
by having _lots_ of boiling water; the more water, and the faster you  
can bring it back to a boil, the better; dropping 20 pounds of frozen  
dumplings into a 20-quart pot is a bad idea, tempting though it may be  
to get them all cooked at once.

Once the water comes back to a boil (after you've cooled it by adding  
frozen dumplings to it), you break with the traditional pasta wisdom  
and lower the heat to a simmer. Once the dumplings float, give them  
about five more minutes for the filling to cook through (an instant- 
read thermometer is helpful here), they're done. Since they're just  
done, and not heated to the boiling point, there's no steam buildup  
inside, and no internal pressure, so little to no bursting.

Adamantius


Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 13:18:01 -0600
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Pelmeni

<<< Still working on my Russian collegium.   I have come across those lovely
obtuse references to Pelmeni being available "in period" .  Is there
another word discription for them I should be looking for?

Aldyth >>>

Try "pel'n'an'" (pel = ear   n'an=bread).  The Oxford Companion to Food 
gives this as a Finnic form derived from the Persian that has been changed 
by usage to pel'meni in the modern period.

Since they are a basic dumpling and we have recipes from neighboring 
cultures within period, it is accepted by most food historians that pelmeni 
are being produced "within period."  The big argument is whether they were 
introduced from China by the invading Mongols or introduced from the Middle 
East.

Bear


From the fb "medieval & renaissance cooking and recipes" group:

Christa Schwab shared a link.
12/28/19
Crimped dumplings/pasties/Krapfen/ravioli. The earliest depiction of this technique that I've seen so far. (1st half of 12th c) They even have this tiny "tail" you get when crimping! <3

BL.UK
Image of an item from the British Library Catalogue of Illuminated Manuscripts
This page describes and shows an image of an item in the Catalogue of…

Christa Schwab 
There seems to be a problem with the link and I can't change the existing one so here is a screen shot.



<the end>
Edited by Mark S. Harris	dumplings-msg	Page 2 of 30