beets-msg - 2/8/08 Period beet roots and beet greens. Recipes. NOTE: See also the files: vegetables-msg, greens-msg, sugar-msg, root-veg-msg, salads-msg, cabbages-msg, root-veg-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 10:31:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christina M. Krupp" <ckrupp at zoo.uvm.edu> Subject: SC - Re: Pickled egg recipes -- BEETS? I've been observing this flurry of pickled-egg recipes with interest. Most of the recipes offered recently include beet root or beet juice. My understanding is that beet greens were eaten in period, but the root of the period beet was an unremarkable thing. The glorious ruby root that we are all familiar with, and the sugar-beet root which is a different variant, were post-period developments. Beet juice makes an excellent food-coloring agent, giving shades of dark red that are unavailable from other natural sources. If beets were available in the Middle Ages, wouldn't we see beet juice listed among other medieval food colorings such as saunders, saffron, and parlsey juice? It seems notable in its absence. I am very fond of cooked beet-roots and I'd love to be able to use them at feasts with a clear conscience. Can anybody offer evidence of their use in medieval recipes? - -- Marieke Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 17:52:37 -0400 From: John and Barbara Enloe <jbenloe at mindspring.com> Subject: Re: SC - Re: Pickled egg recipes -- BEETS? I think that the sugar beet is actually period. There is a European Castle that I saw on A&E that was from the 1400's that has sugar beets as part of the Device of the owners, a baron something or other. I will try to find the particulars. Lord Jonathus Fitche d'Abercrombie Date: Mon, 1 Dec 1997 21:09:42 -0500 From: dangilsp at intrepid.net (Dan Gillespie) Subject: SC - beets Elizabeth wrote: "(Did people eat beetroot?). As far as I can tell, no. Every time I find a reference to beets, it seems to mean greens. Maybe beetroot got developed into something big enough to be useful after our period?" There is a mention of both white & red, or Roman beets, clearly as a root vegetable in the 1633 edition of Gerard's Herbal; he says they're boiled & eaten with oil, vinegar & pepper. I haven't had a chance to look at the earlier 1598 edition to see if this entry was included there as well. His description makes it sound like eating beet roots was not yet a strongly established practice at the time the information was published. They are likely very late period at best. Hope this helps, Antoine de Bayonne Dan Gillespie dangilsp at intrepid.net Dan_Gillespie at usgs.gov Martinsburg, West Virginia, USA Date: Tue, 2 Dec 1997 18:04:33 -0500 (EST) From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - beets << There is a mention of both white & red, or Roman beets, clearly as a root vegetable in the 1633 edition of Gerard's Herbal; he says they're boiled & eaten with oil, vinegar & pepper. >> Does he SPECIFICALLY mention bulbs or roots? Swiss Chard is the much older form of beets dating back to pre-Roman times. It comes in a white stalked and a red stalked variety. And, surprisingly, bears the exact same scientific name as bulbous beets. I have always used chard when beets are called for in early recipes and was under the impression that these are what is meant by the word "betas". If the use of bulbous beets before 1500 can be documented as consumed by humans, it would be great. I would then have several redactions that I could rework and a source for another relatively inexpensive vegetable. Ras Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 18:52:28 EST From: melc2newton at juno.com (Michael P Newton) Subject: Re: SC - beets >Elizabeth wrote: "(Did people eat beetroot?). According to _Medieval English Gardens_ byn Teresa McLean (one of my current library books, you all need to check this one out - its got lots of stuff on who grew what for what reason. it is however a very bad spoon tease! ANYWAYS) In the chapter on the vegatable patch, McLean states that most vegatables were grown for the 'porray' pot and mostly the leaves were used. In fact, she states that root vegetables weren't grown unless its leaves were useful in the pot as well. The one root she claims was popular was the radish - all of the others were just to bland! Lady Beatrix (wondering now just how period borsht really is?) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 11:51:56 -0500 (EST) From: DianaFiona at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - beets << Does he SPECIFICALLY mention bulbs or roots? Swiss Chard is the much older form of beets dating back to pre-Roman times. It comes in a white stalked and a red stalked variety. And, surprisingly, bears the exact same scientific name as bulbous beets. >> Yes, he does! Both red roots and perhaps white, but the quote that you were replying to seems to refer to the leaves to me, since after suggesting serving the boiled red beets with oil, vinegar, and pepper as a salad, he says: "....but what might be made of the red and beautifull root (which is to be preferred before the leaves, as well in beautie as in goodnesse) I refer unto the curious and cunning cooke, who no doubt when hee had the view thereof, and is assured that it is both good and wholesome, will make thereof many and divers dishes, both faire and good." He also says, if I understand him right, that this red variety was given to him from "beyond the seas" by a merchant, and that it grew for him in 1596 to a height of 8 cubits.(!!! Isn't a cubit about 18 inches? That's HUGE!) That it sounds like the red beets were not common in England at the time, although if we could discover where the seeds Gerard was given came from we could reasonably assume that they were used in that country. However, when discussing the white beets, he doesn't specifically say that the roots were eaten, but refers to them as "thicke, hard and great.", which sounds to me like they might be large enough to eat. So it might be possible that the *white* roots were consumed in England--they seemed to eat just about anything else that wasn't posionous! ;-) Ldy Diana, who also wants to find documentation for a veggie she really likes! Date: Tue, 11 Aug 1998 08:01:05 EDT From: Balano1 at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - beets & cabbage (= polish borsch) As far as I know, Borsch is Russian-Polish in nature. Quite yummy though! Have 2 recipes: Simple Borsch Wash, peel and coarsely grate 8 young beets. Simmer the beets in 4 cups water for 20 minutes or until they are tender. Stir in the juice of 1 lemon and add sugar, salt, and pepper to taste. Continue to cook for 5 minutes longer and either strain and remove the beets or process them in (for a more textured borsch). Chill and serve with a dollop od sour cream. Polish Borsch Simmer 2 quarts good beef bouillion with 1 large onion, chopped, for 2 hours. Strain the stock and remove any fat. Wash, chop and soak in hot water, 4 large dried mushrooms, add them to the hot soup and boil for 15 minutes. Toss 1 teaspoon sugar with 3 cups grated beets, 1 cup diced carrots, 1 teaspoon chopped parsley, and 2 cups shredded cabbage. Let stand until the sugar is dissolved. Add the mixture to the soup and continue to cook for 15 to 20 minutes, until the vegetables are tender. Strain out (or process in) the vegetables and add 1 cup sour cream and 1 teaspoon lemon juice to the soup. Reheat without boiling and add salt if needed. Serve with a mealy, fresh boiled potato in each soup plate. - - Sister Mary Endoline Date: Tue, 11 Aug 1998 14:02:15 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - beets & cabbage Gerard (1633 ed. of the 1597 work) writes of beets in his Herball, pages 318-319: "Beta alba. White Beets....the white Beete is a cold and moist pot-herbe...Being eaten when it is boyled, it quickly descendeth... especially being taken with the broth wherein it is sodden... Beta rubra, Beta rubra Romana. Red Beets, Red Roman Beets. ...The great and beautiful Beet last described may be vsed in winter for a salad herbe, with vinegar, oyle, and salt, and is not onely pleasant to the taste, but also delightfull to the eye. The greater red Beet or Roman Beet, boyled and eaten with oyle, vineger and pepper, is a most excellent and delicate sallad: but what might be made of the red and beautifull root (which is to be preferred before the leaues, as well in beauty as in goodnesse) I refer vnto the curious and cunning cooke, who no doubt when he hath had the view thereof, and is assured that it is both good and wholesome, will make thereof many and diuers dishes, both faire and good." His illustration of the Red Roman Beet shows a plant with a skinny taproot. That bit about "who no doubt when he hath had the view thereof, and is assured that it is both good and wholesome, will make thereof many and diuers dishes, both faire and good" suggests that the red beet was not well known in England at that time. Waverly Root, in his book "Food", p. 30, says that early Romans ate only the greens, but by the beginning of the Christian era they were eating the leaves & roots. He says root beet appears in Charlemagne's garden list, but that the root beet had to be re-introduced into Renaissance France. Parkinson, "Paradisi in Sole...", p. 490, says "The great red Beete that Master Lete a Merchant of London gaue vnto Master Gerard, as he setteth it downe in his Herball, seemeth to bee the red kind of the last remembred Beete [Red Roman Beet], whose great ribbes as he saith, are as great as the middle ribbe of the Cabbage leafe, and as good to bee eaten, whose stalke rose with him to the height of eight cubits, and bore plenty of seede... The roote of the common red Beete with some, but more especially the Romane red Beete, is of much vse among Cookes to trimme or set out their dishes of meate, being cut out into diuers formes and fashions, and is grown of late dayes into a great custome of seruice, both for fish and flesh. The rootes of the Romane red Beete being boyled, are eaten of diuers while they are hot with a little oyle and vinegar, and is accounted a delicate sallet for the winter; and being cold they are so vsed and eaten likewise." (Note: The beet grown in Gerard's garden must have caused quite a sensation at the time. 8 cubits tall! What's the tallest beet you've ever grown?) <snip> is borscht appropriate for 12th c ireland? <snip> >=== > Conchobar Mac Muirchertaig Based on the above, my guess is 'no'. Cindy Renfrow/Sincgiefu renfrow at skylands.net Date: Tue, 11 Aug 1998 17:15:16 EDT From: melc2newton at juno.com Subject: Re: SC - beets & cabbage Here is the Ukrainian Borsch I used at my Russian inn last winter (no, it has no documentation to it, sorry :( Pisnyi Borsch 2 lbs. beets 1 carrot 1 parsnip 1 turnip 2 celery ribs 2 medium onions 1 bay leaf 3-4 peppercorns 3 dried boletus or 1\2 chopped mushrooms Liquid from mushrooms (optional) 1 teaspoon sour salt 2 teaspoons salt 1 teaspoon ground pepper or to taste 2 teaspoons fresh chopped dill Soak boletus overnight. Cook in a little water until tender. Cool, reserve liquid, and chop fine. Scrub beets and cut into quarters. Cover with water and cook over low heat until tender, about 1 to 2 hours. Cool, pour off and reserve liquid. Slip off peels. This may be done a day in advance. Peel and cut up the other vegetables, Add bay leaf, peppercorns, and mushrooms to vegetables, with enough water to cover and cook in a large non-aluminum pot over low heat until tender. Strain beets liquid into vegetables. Shred beets in a processor or on a medium frater, and add.Simmer for ten minutes, and strain into a large pot. To keep broth clear, do not press vegetables. Add sour salt , mushroom liquid, pepper and salt. Bring to a gentle boil, then turn heat on low. Taste, the flavor should be tart mellow, and full. For more tartness, add fresh lemon juice or sour salt. Keeps well in refrigerator. Reheat gently; do not overcook, or the color will turn brown. To serve pour over 3-4 small potato dumpling (to which if you want the recipe, I'll dig the book out of the public library) in soup plates, and garnish with chopped dill. The reason I didn't copy the dumpling recipe is that I was going to serve it in cups so people could walk around without spilling any. It may be more complicated than the other recipes you've gotten, but the taste is unbelievably good! Beatrix Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:30:19 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: SC - Spinach Tarte from Menagier-Recipe to follow later At 11:25 AM -0400 9/11/98, Nick Sasso wrote: >I do apologize for sucha 'spoon-teaseism'. I will, with much haste post >said recipe for all. I am at work, and may not have access until later in >the weekend, but it will be pposted in its original and redacted entirety. While you're waiting, here's our redaction (and the original) from the Miscellany: - -- Spinach Tart Goodman p. 278/23 -"A Tart" (GOOD) To make a tart, take four handfuls of beet leaves, two handfuls of parsley, a handful of chervil, a sprig of fennel and two handful of spinach, and pick them over and wash them in cold water, then cut them up very small; then bray with two sorts of cheese, to wit a hard and a medium, and then add eggs thereto, yolks and whites, and bray them in the cheese; then put the herbs into the mortar and bray all together and also put therein some fine powder. Or instead of this have ready brayed in the mortar two heads of ginger and onto this bray your cheese, eggs and herbs and then cast old cheese scraped or grated onto the herbs and take it to the oven and then have your tart made and eat it hot. 1/3 lb spinach and/or beet greens, chopped 2 T dried or 1/4 c fresh chervil 1/2 t ginger 1/2 cup fresh parsley, chopped 5 eggs 1/2 t salt 1 or 2 leaves fresh fennel, or 6 oz mozzarella cheese 9" pie crust 1 t fennel seed, ground in a mortar 6 oz cheddar Chop or grate greens and cheese and mix filling in a bowl. Make pie crust and bake at 400 for about 10 minutes. Put filling in crust and bake about 40 minutes at 350. We usually substitute spinach for beet leaves, dried chervil for fresh, and fennel seed for fresh fennel leaves because of availability. David/Cariadoc http://www.best.com/~ddfr/ Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 14:27:57 +0000 From: Erin Kenny <Erin.Kenny at sofkin.ca> Subject: Re: SC - Spinach Tarte from Menagier- Cariadoc wrote: > While you're waiting, here's our redaction (and the original) from the > Miscellany: > -- > Spinach Tart > Goodman p. 278/23 -"A Tart" (GOOD) <snip> > We usually substitute spinach for beet leaves, dried > chervil for fresh, and fennel seed for fresh fennel leaves because of > availability. GO FOR THE BEET GREENS!!! (not a criticism -- I understand the difficulties in procuring them) Beet greens have a much milder flavour than spinach, and usually you can get them for a song at a market (I have yet to pay for any of mine -- the farmers just ask if I have any rabbits and then scratch their heads). Claricia not a great spinach fan Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 21:58:55 EDT From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: SC - Beets- A recipe Erin.Kenny at sofkin.ca writes: << GO FOR THE BEET GREENS!!! (not a criticism -- I understand the difficulties in procuring them) Beet greens have a much milder flavor than spinach, >> Agreed. However, I use Swiss chard in this recipe. Swiss chard has the same scientific name as beets and is in fact a bulbless beet. Swiss chard is readily available at most supermarkets year around. It is easily grown in the home garden. The stalks can be used in any recipe that calls for asparagus. It also has the amazing property of not going all mushy when you can it. (<sigh> 15 quarts today and twice that many to can on Sunday)! Since there is some confusion about the exact time beets with bulbs were introduced in period, I almost always use Swiss chard when redacting most of the beet recipes from period cookery manuals. They are one of my favorite foods. :-) Betes (A Recipe for Swiss Chard) (Period-like) Copyright L. J. Spencer, Jr. 2 pounds Swiss Chard 1/2 cup liquid (your choice of water, beef or chicken broth) 1/2 tsp. salt 1 tsp. sugar 1/4 tsp. ground cubebs A pinch of ground ginger 2 strips bacon, fried crisp Red wine, Cider or balsamic vinegar Cut stalks of chard into 1 inch pieces. Slice chard leaves into 1 inch wide strips crosswise. Bring liquid to a boil in a medium saucepan. Drop Swiss chard stalks and leaves into boiling liquid. Add salt, sugar, cubebs and ginger. Cover. Reduce heat to a simmer. Continue cooking for 15 mins. Remove from heat and drain. Place chard on a serving dish. Sprinkle with bacon then sprinkle a small amount of vinegar over the top. Serves 4. Ras Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 13:08:02 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: SC - Spinach Tarte from Menagier- Cariadoc sent our version of Menagier's spinach and other greens tart, including the comment: >> We usually substitute spinach for beet leaves, dried >> chervil for fresh, and fennel seed for fresh fennel leaves because of >> availability. and Claricia/Erin Kenny wrote: >GO FOR THE BEET GREENS!!! (not a criticism -- I understand the >difficulties in procuring them) Beet greens have a much milder >flavour than spinach, and usually you can get them for a song at a >market (I have yet to pay for any of mine -- the farmers just ask if >I have any rabbits and then scratch their heads). We have done it with the mixture of beet greens, spinach and other herbs called for in the original; by the time you have all the other greens, seasonings, and the cheese in there, it doesn't make a large difference in taste whether you have just spinach or both spinach and beet greens. Part of the reason we use spinach as a substitute is that Menagier considers spinach to be one sort of beet greens. Elizabeth/Betty Cook From: <LrdRas at aol.com> To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu Subject: beets and sugar... niadro at yahoo.com writes: << Can anyone familiar with these roots confirm or go into detail what to look for in a beet? I'm deprived of practical information....maybe because I've lived in the central-midwest US all my life. >> The beet you described is ideal. Young, with leaves that are fresh and turgid with little wilting. This advice is also good for any vegetable whether it be beets, carrots, parsnips, peas or anyother sort. Buy then as young as possible. Young vegetables contain more sugars than older ones and freshly harvested more than those even a couple of hours old. If you cannot get fresh and young, the addition of 1 scant tsp of sugar to every 2 cups of vegetable at the beginning of the cooking process will 'freshen' them somewhat. This holds true for most foods that can't be cooked immediately after purchase/harvest. We have evidence of this practise throughout the the corpus of medieval recipes where sugar is a common ingredient. When we think 'sugar' in the current middle ages, we seem to think 'sweet' rather than 'mellow'. This is a mistake, IMO. If sugar is used in spice quantites rather than dessert quantities if becomes a wonderful flavor enhancer easily on a par with MSG or any of the other equally obnoxious modern ingredients used for that purpose. Many people who redact recipes automatically dump masses of sugar into any period recipe that calls for it. This is an error. Think of sugar like we now think of salt and pepper and your period recipes will then take on more depth and become automatically tastier. :-) Ras Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 08:17:20 EDT From: <LrdRas at aol.com> To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu Subject: Re: beets jkrissw at earthling.net writes: << Must be one of those different-sides-of-the-Atlantic things. :-) Are those given to animals over there, or are we talking about two different plants? >> The term beetroot is generically applied to any bulbous like root of the Beta sp. It is specifically used in the cattle industry to mean the root of the sugar beet and is most often marketed as 'beet pulp' (e.g. by product of sugar production) in the Northeast USA. Sugar beets were known and grown in the middle ages and only used for animal feed. Red beets were also known and grown but the root was long and rather small so the tops would not have been discarded. The nice round red beets we are familiar with were not created until very , very late in period (or possibly the Italian Renaissance). Swiss chard and red beets were not differentiated in any period beet recipes that I have seen and work better with tops than bottoms. You can buy seed that produces cylindrical beets but for the space, Swiss Chard would be a better choice. Ras Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1999 20:58:23 -0700 From: "Tracy Ryan" <caireach at idmail.com> To: <sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu> Subject: Re: beets Beets (tops and roots) are used in many traditional recipes in Eastern Europe. I can place the use of beet in dishes around the 14th century there. Ukrainian/Slavic cookbooks like to give the history of their traditional dishes. I've even discovered, in a Russian cookbook, that cheesecake is period. Caireach Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 09:19:39 EDT From: WOLFMOMSCA at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) >From the Good Huswives Handmaid, 1588 How to make Lumbardy Tarts Take beets, chop them small, and to them put grated bread and cheese, and mingle them wel in the chopping. Take a few corrans, and a dishe of sweet butter, and melt it. Then stir al these in the butter, together with three yolkes of egges, sinamon, ginger, and sugar, and make your tart as large as you will, and fill it with the stuffe, bake it, and serve it in. I tried this once with canned beets and it was, well, not so good. There was a bitter after taste from the canned beets. I haven't got around to trying it with fresh beets, but it might taste better with them. Good luck. Wolfmother Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 18:19:50 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) From Robert May, The Accomplisht Cook, or the Art and Mystery of Cookery. Printed by N. Brooke for T. Archer, 1660: A Grand Sallet of Beets, Currants and Greens Take the youngest and smallest leaves of spinage, the smallest also of sorrel, well washed currans, and red beets round the center being finely carved, oyl and vinegar, and the dish garnished with lemon and beets. Cindy Renfrow/Sincgiefu cindy at thousandeggs.com Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:41:11 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) LrdRas at aol.com wrote: > stefan at texas.net writes: > << Is there any particular reason you think this is to be done with beet roots > instead of beet leaves? >> > > This is the same question I asked myself. So off to the kitchen I went. The > resulting product is definitely more tasty using greens instead of beetroot. > This doesn't mean that greens were used but it does mean that my version of > this recipe will specify the greens. :-) > > Ras The 15th-century Rouen Tacuinum has an illustration for "bletes" or beets, showing a lady cutting the greens off close to the ground and gathering them in a basket. This may not have been universal practice, but it at least indicates pretty clearly that it was done. Adamantius Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:12:23 EDT From: WOLFMOMSCA at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) stefan at texas.net writes: << Is there any particular reason you think this is to be done with beet roots instead of beet leaves? This sounds very much like some of the tarts I think I've seen that were done with various herbs. >> Actually, there are a couple of reasons I think this is done with the root, not the greenery. It's really late period, for one. If it was from an earlier period, say 15th, as opposed to 16th century, then it would fit with the greenery tart theory. But by Elizabethan times, folks were using the root as well. Another reason comes from Gerard. Gerard's Herbal, admittedly published in 1597, but obviously a work which did not spring full-blown from John Gerard's forehead in that year, mentions the root part of the red beet as being both good and wholesome, and left it up to "cunning" cooks to devise "many and divers dishes". He states the "red and beautifull root (which is preferred before the leaves, as well in beautie as in goodnesses). The Roman beet is different from the white & green beets previously grown as potherbs. Having made up some of these, the visual effect is actually quite stunning. It makes a pretty tart. Fresh beets are a winter crop here in Florida, so I'll grab some fresh ones later in the season and try it again. The dish is actually a bit on the sweet side, and the bitter back-bite of the canned beets was more than I liked. Others may find the startling change of taste from the front of the mouth to the back very piquant and pleasing, but I didn't. It's probably just my own taste biases which made this less than appealing as a feast food for me, but it is quite in keeping with Elizabethan tastes for opposing tastes in the same dish. Wolfmother Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:53:36 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) Actually, what Gerard said was: "Beta alba. White Beets. ...the white Beete is a cold and moist pot-herbe...Being eaten when it is boyled, it quickly descendeth... especially being taken with the broth wherein it is sodden... Beta rubra, Beta rubra Romana. Red Beets, Red Roman Beets... ...The great and beautiful Beet last described may be vsed in winter for a salad herbe, with vinegar, oyle, and salt, and is not onely pleasant to the taste, but also delightfull to the eye. The greater red Beet or Roman Beet, boyled and eaten with oyle, vineger and pepper, is a most excellent and delicate sallad: but what might be made of the red and beautifull root (which is to be preferred before the leaues, as well in beauty as in goodnesse) I refer vnto the curious and cunning cooke, who no doubt when he hath had the view thereof, and is assured that it is both good and wholesome, will make thereof many and diuers dishes, both faire and good." In other words, in England, they were well acquainted with using the beet greens as pot herbs or salad, but the variety with the big red root was fairly new, & not yet well known by cooks. Hence the need to assure them that it is good & wholesome to eat. By the time Robert May wrote his CB, the red beet root had been accepted. Cindy Renfrow/Sincgiefu cindy at thousandeggs.com Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:05:20 -0500 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) > hey all from Anne-Marie > isnt there a German medieval recipe for beets ("ein condimente" comes to > mind)? George Fugger's recipe for smoked tongue found in Sabina Welserin uses red beet root as part of the pickling process, before smoking the tongue. So it wouldn't surprise me to find it used in other late German recipes. Bear Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:15:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com> Subject: SC - Period Beet Recipe & period quote about beets - --- LrdRas at aol.com wrote: > stefan at texas.net writes: > << Is there any particular reason you think this is > to be done with beet roots instead of beet leaves? >> > > This is the same question I asked myself. So off to the kitchen I went. The > resulting product is definitely more tasty using greens instead of beetroot. > This doesn't mean that greens were used but it does mean that my version of > this recipe will specify the greens. :-) > > Ras However, here is Madge Lorwin's version of this recipe, from Dining With William Shakespeare, pg. 238-239. I have made this recipe many times and have had lots of good comments from both SCA friends and from my mundane family. 1 lb. fresh yound beets 2 tbsp. brown sugar 1 tsp. grated bread crumbs 3/4 cup grated mild Cheddar cheese 1/4 cup currants, parboiled 1/4 tsp. cinnamon 1/4 tsp. ginger 3 egg yolks 4 tbsp. butter melted. Peel the beets--this is best done with a potato peeler--and grate them into a mixing bowl. Add the sugar and stir until it melts. Mix in the bread crumbs, grated cheese, currants, spices, and egg yolks. Then stir in melted butter. [Using your favorite pie crust recipe] spread the filling evenly [over bottom pie crust] and cover it with the top crust. Seal the edges with the tines of a wet fork and trim off the surplus pastry. Punch fork holes in the crust and brush it with egg white. Bake at 450 degrees for twenty min., then lower the heat to 350 degrees and bake 25 min. longer. Serve slightly warm. I eliminated the pastry recipe, due to time constraints. Ms. Lorwin goes on to quote John Gerard in his "Herball" [1597] which talks about eating both the greens and the beet root. However, John Gerard says this, "But what might be made of the red and beautiful root (which is prefered before the leaves, as well in beautie as in goodnesse) I refer unto the curious and cunning cooke, who no doubt when hee had the view there, and is assured that it is both good and wholesome, will make thereof many and divers dishes, both faire and good." This, to my mind, kind of tells me, as it did to Ms. Lorwin, that the beet root was prefered. Huette Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:18:05 -0700 From: varmstro at zipcon.net (Valoise Armstrong) Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) >hey all from Anne-Marie >isnt there a German medieval recipe for beets ("ein condimente" comes to >mind)? > >Oh, German Girl, are you listening? :) Well, here's one German Girl replying for another <g>. Gwen-Kat has her translation and redaction from Rumpolt for pickled beets on her web page. Here it is. Valoise ******* From Marx Rumpolt, Ein New Kochbuch, the chapter on accompaniments to fried meat 3.Rote Ruben eyngemacht mit klein geschnittenen Merrettich/ Aniss/ Coriander/ und ein wenig Kuemel/ sonderlich wenn die Ruben geschnitten/ gesotten mit halb Wein und halb Essig. My translation: Red beets preserved with small cut horseradish/ anise/ coriander/ and a little caraway/ special if the beets are cut/ marinated in half wine and half vinegar. My version: 3 cans (16 oz) small whole beets, cut into chunks 1 cup wine 1 cup vinegar 1 *' long piece of fresh horseradish root, peeled and cut into slivers * t anise seed 1 t coriander seed * t caraway seed Combine all ingredients except beets in a pot. Bring to a boil, simmer 5 minutes, add the beets and heat through. Place in jar or crock and let mellow for at least 24 hours. The vinegar will preserve your beets; in period they would have been stored in the cellar. In modern times I would suggest the fridge or canning in a sterilized container. Comments: I used canned beets for the convenience and lower cost. This recipe was very well received, it will become part of my regular repertoire. Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:42:47 EDT From: ChannonM at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) varmstro at zipcon.net writes: << In modern times I would suggest the fridge or canning in a sterilized container. >> This is an excellent example of a "cannable" recipe. Start with fresh beets, boil in water until the skin begins to peel back a little. You can test this by taking one out (use a hotmit ) and just rub the beet with your thumb, if it's ready the skin will just give way. Cut off the hard stem bump and if small enough just set it aside if the beets are larger than 2" I suggest quatering them or slicing even (up to cook, but be careful not to overdo the step with the liquid and spices, you may have beet mush if the pieces are too small). Make your liquid ingredient, add beets to it bring to a boil. Spoon beets into sterilized jars, pour juice over and seal. The seals will pop down to show the escape of air and the seal being complete, often this is a loud pop and has been known to scare people who weren't expecting it, sometimes you don't even notice. Always use sterilized lids and new seals. They will most likely keep 2 years. If any colour changes occur, any mold, if the seal pops or is not flat discard the contents in the garbage, do not throw into the toilet or down the sink. I have chosen to toss the whole jar as a precaution. I was taught by my grandmother to dig up a section of your back yard to dispose of "bad" can's but feel this may jeopardize animals or ground water. Hauviette Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:18:18 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipe & period quote about beets Huette von Ahrens wrote: > --- LrdRas at aol.com wrote: > > ahrenshav at yahoo.com writes: > > << This, to my mind, kind of tells me, as it did to Ms. Lorwin, that the > > beet root was prefered. > > > > Huette >> > > > > Possibly. It merely tells me that Gerard himself was partial to beetroots. I'm with Ras on this one. Lorwin quotes Gerard as saying (caps are mine, for emphasis), "But what might be made of the red and beautiful root (which is to be preferred before the leaves, as well in beautie as in goodnesse) I refer unto the CURIOUS and cunning cooke, WHO NO DOUBT WHEN HE HAD THE VIEW THERE, AND IS ASSURED THAT IT IS BOTH GOOD AND WHOLESOME, will make thereof many and divers dishes, both faire and good." This kind of phrasing is right out of Schwabe's "Unmentionable Cuisine": through education and an open mind, people all over the world will begin to understand and fully utilize the delectable culinary possibilities of the garden slug. Or whatever. The implication seems to be that Gerard knows they're good, and is waiting for the adventurous and skilled cooks of the world to catch up to him. They seem, eventually, to have done so, but _perhaps_ not until after 1589. Adamantius Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:36:46 EDT From: ChannonM at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) WOLFMOMSCA at aol.com writes: << bitter back-bite of the canned beets >> I find this is true using beets canned in aluminum. If you can get your hands on glass canned beets you might have a winner. Or you could can them yourself and have them at other times of the year! :) Hauviette Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:39:47 -0400 From: "Nick Sasso" <njs at mccalla.com> Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) In a message dated 10/19/99, Hauviette writes: <<<SNIP>>> The seals will pop down to show the escape of air and the seal being complete, often this is a loud pop and has been known to scare people who weren't expecting it, sometimes you don't even notice. Always use sterilized lids and new seals. They will most likely keep 2 years. If any colour changes occur, any mold, if the seal pops or is not flat discard the contents in the garbage, do not throw into the toilet or down the sink. I have chosen to toss the whole jar as a precaution. I was taught by my grandmother to dig up a section of your back yard to dispose of "bad" can's but feel this may jeopardize animals or ground water. Greetings and many thanks for sharing the beet preservation techniques here. I just wanted to add two things for your and anyone else's use: 1) The pop is from the hot air cooling and contracting, creating a vacuum to pull the dome lid down. If air ran in, it would add spoiling agents to the yummies inside. The 'whoosh' you here when you open the canned food is the rush of air inside to fill the now vacuum sealed jar. 2) I'm thinking that spoiled food put in the yard will not harm water and our fauna so much as you might first think. 'Food' rots all the time in the environs and makes nutrients for other species like muchrooms and plants 9agter becoming humous. . not hummus). Also, those bacteria harmful to our digestiuve tract are not always so to other critters who may happen upon your discarded stash. Dump the food and let nature take it's course as long as you are using ingredients relatively close to their original state, e.g. no preservative chemicals or things like dioxins. niccolo difrancesco Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:36:24 EDT From: ChannonM at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - summer feast I'm sorry that I missed this email, I don't know how but I skipped it. The recipe is for beet roots and it originates from Apicius. Here is some background and the recipe; The recipe I chose to create is based on two recipes from Apicius: this is from Flower's & Rosenbaums edition. Book III Section II-4 Beetroot, another method, from Varro. Varro writes:" Take beetroot, rub clean and cook in mulsum with a little salt and oil, or boil in water and oil with salt; make a broth, and drink it. It is even better if a chicken has been cooked in it first." and Section XI-2 Boiled beets, another method- They are good served with a dressing of mustard, al little oil and vinegar. I chose to preserve the beets using a modern pickling method in order to take advantage of the early preparation and availability of fresh beets at a good price. To make the recipe without canning, simply leave out the last step. Some variation was used in the recipe presented, for example ; honey was used in place of mulsum in the preserving process. Honey is one of the chief ingredients in mulsum according to Flower & Rosenbaum. Adapted Recipe My recipe is based on the ingredients of the Apicius recipes and the pickling recipes that my grandmother used. 1 * lbs fresh beets 1 * cups white vinegar * cup water * cup honey 1 TB mustard seed Boil the beets until the skins begin to fall off. Rinse and remove skins. Chop into quarters or leave whole if small enough. Combine remaining ingredients and boil for 5 minutes. Add beets and heat through. In prepared canning jars spoon beets to shoulder of the jar, pour over juice to within * inch of lip and seal. Makes 2-3 pints Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:36:22 EDT From: ChannonM at aol.com Subject: SC - canning beets "If any colour changes occur, any mold, if the seal pops or is not flat discard the contents in the garbage" clarification:IF THE SEAL POPS UP, it indicates air going in and that's not good. If this happens prior to opening the jar, then I would discard it. Hauviette Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 17:18:30 -0700 From: varmstro at zipcon.net (Valoise Armstrong) Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) A couple of months ago I found a copy of Hildegard von Bingen's Naturkunde translated into modern German by Peter Riethe. He doesn't give the original, only his translations of her natural history work. I checked to see of there was an entry for beets and this is what I found (English translation is mine): De Ruba. Die Weie Rbe ist mehr als kalt, liegt zwar etwas schwer im Magen, ist aber leicht verdaulich. Vor dem Genusse werde sie geschlt; roh ist sie weniger zutrglich als gekocht. De Ruba. The white Beet is more than cold, lays somewhat hard in the stomach; it is however easy to digest. Before consumption it should be peeled; raw is less beneficial than cooked. This is 12th century stuff here. Until I read this I was convinced that until very late in period the leaves and not the roots were what was eaten. But peeling before eating sort of implies using the roots. Valoise Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:28:05 -0400 From: "Nick Sasso" <njs at mccalla.com> Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) Remember that Hildegart was somewhat of a fringist in her time. Her practices were, by no means, universally accepted, though not exactly banished by the Church either. Her practices of singing sacred music, herbal/natural healing, reading gospels alound in public and some Sophiaistic teachings were all rather radical at the time. . . if not borderline 'heretical' or pagan. I suggest that her description of beets as foodstuff would not imply that beets were commonly eaten, but that they could be eaten in some fashion . . . similar to Master Adamantius' assertion about Gerard on beets in the herbal. Even that fact that a woman wrote about health (or anything for that matter) in the 12th century is radical and inspiring to women today. niccolo difrancesco Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:03:15 -0600 (MDT) From: grasse at mscd.edu (Martina Grasse) Subject: SC - Digest 1696 Sorry, have been on digest, and the last missive I sent never posted. I have webbed a pickled beet root recipe from Rumpolt. (the transliteration may not be totaly up to snuff (I have learned some things since writing this, but have not had the time to update and insert the characters I have been taught.) but the translation is accurate. The pickled beets are quite good, and yes I really did use that much horseradish... it adds a nice zip to things. http://clem.mscd.edu/~grasse/GK_ASsp99_beet.htm Gwen Catrin von Berlin Caerthe Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 02:51:38 +0100 From: Thomas Gloning <Thomas.Gloning at germanistik.uni-giessen.de> Subject: SC - period beet recipes (?) I am not a native speaker of English, so translating and identifying plant names is quite dangerous for me. Anyway: Here are two recipes from the "Rheinfraenkisches Kochbuch" (about 1445), that might have something to do with beets. Both the leaves and the roots are used here. This in a somewhat simplified transcription: ||30|| Wiltu einen behenden guden kappus machen so grab mangolt usz mit den worczelen vnd wesche daz gar suberlich vnde sude isz n gesalczem wasser in eime kessel bisz daz isz genuch sij So czuge isz usz vnd lege isz von ein ander uff ein schone bret adir duch vnd lasz isz wol kalten So du yme die ubirhut abe vnd lege isz dan in eine geschiere vnd du senff eszig honig vnd saffran darczu so hastu einen guden kappusz ||31|| den selben kappus magistu auch machen mit suszem puluer vnd vigen da in sieden vnd win eszig vnd winber vnd mandelkerne dar uff strauwen vnd du magist auch mispelen beren vnd allerhande dar in dune beide ruben snydde vnd kappusz *** Lady Allison Poinvillars de Tours/Lyn Parkinson sent me an English translation of these two recipes several weeks ago. Cheers, Thomas Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 22:04:07 MST To: "Mark.S Harris (rsve60)" <rsve60 at email.sps.mot.com> From: LYN M PARKINSON <allilyn at juno.com> Subject: Re: Thomas' beets 30. Willst du ein wohlschmeckendes und gutes Kraut zubereiten, dann grabe Mangold samt den Wurzeln aus und reinige alles sauber, siede es in gesalzenem Wasser in einem Kessel, bis es genug gekocht hat. Dann ziehe die einzelnen Bl 0tter heraus und lege sie gesondert auf ein sauberes Brett oder Tuch und la? es vllig erkalten. Entferne ihm dann die 0u?eren Bl 0tter und lege is dann in eine Schssel. Mache es mit Senf, Essig, Honig und Safran an, dann wird es ein wohlschmeckendes Kraut. If you wish to prepare a savory and good cabbage, then dig beets together with the roots and wash all clean, simmer it in salted water in a kettle, until it is cooked enough. Then take the individual leaves out and lay them separately on a clean board or cloth and let them cool completely. Remove from it the outer leaves and lay it then in a bowl. Make it with mustard, vinegar, honey and saffron, then it is a savory cabbage. 31. Dasselbe Kraut kannst du auch zubereiten, indem du es mit s?em Gewrzpulver und Feigen im Kochwasser siedest. Gib danach Weinessig hinzu und streue Rosinen und Mandelkerne darber. Du kannst auch Mispeln, Birnen und allerlei andere Zutaten mit hinein tun und nicht nur das Mangold-Kraut, sondern auch Schnitze von der Runkelrbe verwenden (von welcher Mangold der Blatt-Teil ist). The same cabbage you can also prepare, when you cook it with sweet herb powder and figs in simmering water. Add wine vinegar to it and strew raisins and almond kernels over it. You can also use medlars, pears, and all other similar ingredients with it and not only the beet greens, separate also slices of the beet root (from which beet the leaf is). In number 30, I believe only the beet leaves are used, whereas both root and leaf are used in #31. Allison allilyn at juno.com, Barony Marche of the Debatable Lands, Pittsburgh, PA Kingdom of Aethelmearc Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 03:52:14 GMT From: kerric at pobox.alaska.net (Kerri Canepa) Subject: Re: SC - Period Beet Recipes (was: summer feast) >The only recipe I've seen with beets (and even then it isn't clear if the root >or the leaves are used) is Hare in Wortys where the beets are part of the >sauce. And now that I've taken a closer look at it, I've changed my mind. I think the greens were used in the sauce as everything else in it includes greens and other plant matter. Worts, after all, do mean greens. Drat. I think I'm going to have to use a modern recipe (grit teeth) that simply prepares the beets. A modern Burgundian beet salad is just roasted, diced beets, wine vinegar, olive oil, and a bit of sugar. Mix the last three ingredients together, pour over the warm beets, and let marinate for an hour or so. Can't get much easier than that. Kerri Cedrin Etainnighean, OL Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:09:29 +0100From: Christina Nevin <cnevin at caci.co.uk>Subject: RE: SC - Another Chard Name The answer to the Latin name question from my father (Mr Green Thumb himself- - a trait I unfortunately didn't inherit);===================================Dear TinaSurely you knew that no matter what the colour of the stems of Silver Beet(Swiss Chard) its real name is :--Beta Vulgaris var CiclaBeet root on the other hand is :--Beta Vulgaris.5930 BEET - (RED STEMS) (Bie) [A]Beta vulgaris var cicla 1.2.3.Rhubarb Chard, Swiss Chard, or Silver Beet, is a member of the beet family andwithstands heat and droughts better than most other greens,The leaves are rich in vitamins and can be served raw, boiled or steamed.The leaf stems can be cut into Lengths and used as a substitute forAsparagus and also for Celery.Harvest by using the outer leaves and it will continue to produce.Adds some much needed colour to the vegetable patch, or is even worthyof a place in the flower garden. Approximately 55 days to maturity.5945 BEET - BRIGHT LIGHTS (Bie) [B]Beta vulgaris var cicla 1.2.3.Bright Lights, a vibrant new Swiss Chard - 1998 All American Winner.Distinguished by stems of many different colours, it is dazzlinglyattractive in all stages of growth.Vigorous and widely adopted, "Bright Lights" will be the star in any garden.The stems vary greatly in colour, the main colours are yellow gold, pinkand crimson with secondary colours including pink and white stripped,orange, scarlet, purple, white and green with intermediate pastels.Each colour is present in subtle variation.Maturity in 3-5 weeks, for young salad greens, 7-10 weeks for mature sizeplants.Note we suggest brief cooking, since the colour fades with lengthy cooking.Beginning in 1977 with the parent plants, a red one and a yellow one andafter crossing these to the standard green and white 5946 BEET - FIVE COLOUR MIX (Bie) [B]Beta vulgaris var cicla 1.2.3.An Australian developed mix of coloured Silver Beet or Chard in amixture of many colour variations from the basic red, yellow, orange,cream or white.Next you will want to know how to cook it. Try it sprinkled with celeryseeds===================================(paternal joke - I don't much care for silverbeet, but absolutely loathecelery)Al Vostro e al Servizio del SognoLucretzia++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Lady Lucrezia-Isabella di Freccia | mka Tina NevinThamesreach Shire, The Isles, Drachenwald | London, UK Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 10:18:34 -0000 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nanna_R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir?=" <nannar at isholf.is> Subject: Re: SC - Nanna's Danish Cookbook Huette wrote: > If you >have any information about the eating of beetroots >during period, whether or not they were eaten, I >would love to see what you have. Thanks. Here is the recipe from the Koge Bog, with my translation. Rde Beder at indsalte. Frst skal leggis i en Brendevijnspande 2. Tegelsteene paa Kanten / der paa lagt nogle stycker Tr / oc siden gufuis vand paa / dog saa at det icke naer trerne: Offuen paa samme trer skulle Bederne leggis / oc siden Hielmen paast. Leg der under en god ild / saa bederne aff jemen kunde kogis / dog icke forblde. Naar de saa er sdne / reengiorde oc kolde / skulle de skris vdi tnde skiffuer / der til Peberrod vdi smaa stycker (som hacket speck) oc skal aff fornffnde skaarne Beder frst et law vdi en ny glasseret Potte nedleggis: Derpaa stres aff samme Peberrod / Danske Kommen / smaa sttte Peber /oc ringe salt: Siden leggis huert andet law Beder / oc huert andet fornffnde Vrter stres der offuer. Siden giffues offuer god ledicke / eller helten ledicke / oc helten Vijnedicke / saa megit Bedin kand betcke. Siden leggis et Log offuer med et reent tyngsel / oc offuerbindis med et reent Klde /oc hensttis paa en bequemme sted.Nogle faa Dage der effter kunde de brugis: Dog rr icke der i met bare Fingre. How to pickle beetrots. First take a distilling pan an place two bricks in it. Then arrange some wooden sticks on top of them and add water to the pan, but not so much that it reaches the sticks. Arrange the beetrots on top of the sticks and place the lid on top of the pan. Put on a good fire so the beetrots will be cooked in the steam, but without bleeding. When they are cooked, cleaned and cold, they should be cut into thin slices, and some horseradish should be cut into small pieces (as when lardons are chopped up). Take an new glazed jar and first place a layer of the aforementioned sliced beetrots in it; then sprinkle some horseradish, caraway, finely crushed pepper and a small amount of salt over this. Add more layers of beetrots and the aforementioned spices. Then good ale vinegar is poured over, or half ale vinegar, half wine vinegar, as much as needed to cover the beetrots. Then place a lid with a clean weight on top on the jar, tie a clean cloth over it and store in a convenient place. The beetrots can be used in a few days; but do not stir them with bare fingers. Nanna Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 07:52:11 EDT From: ChannonM at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Nanna's Danish Cookbook-beets again? :) We had this discussion on the Apicius list, here are some exerpts, I apologize ahead for posting info from another list, but I thought this would be helpful. I posted my Roman beet recipe a while back, the Rosenbaum translation indicates roots used (yes this is at the latest 4thC but it is in period) Discussion; Q> For all of those who have used beets, which part of the vegetable do you > use. The book where I was able to find the original Latin and direct > translation along with the adaptation recipe suggested that maybe the > 'greens' were the main part used. Any ideas? A>>Anthimus (writing a bit later, in the 6th century, but fairly clearly in the same culinary tradition) includes beets in a list with mallows and leeks as "suitable both in summer and winter". The winter use strongly suggests roots, although that doesn't preclude the summer use as including greens. Heather Rose Jones Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 01:34:00 EDT From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Beets redux... Since this beet discussion has come up, I have been doing a little reading and have revised my opinion about whether beetroots were used in the MA's. I now think they were used BUT were still not all that commonly. Platina does mention beets as a root in the third chapter of De Honesta but the only recipe he has using beets is in the sixth chapter where it is included as am ingredient in 'Green Sauce.' That example clearly indicates the leaves and/or stems are meant by the term 'beta' since the use or the red beetroot would result in a brown sauce and not a green sauce. Other than the isolated case of the possible use of the root in the late period recipe for the tarts posted earlier this week, I found no tart recipes including beets as an ingredient that would suggest an interpretation of their use in tarts in a form other than greens. There are several isolated recipes which might be interpreted as the root but they were rare and in some cases very ambiguous. A phone call to a horticuluralist that I know is interested in historical horticulture offered the intriguing opinion that medieval beets were rounded at the top and then tapered to a point resembling an over sized squat carrot rather than the ball-like form we normally associate a beet with in the current middle ages. He has promised to try to find me the source of this info if he can. If he is accurate in his interpretation and you have garden space or access to a good green grocer, the variety Cylindra would be a good modern substitute for beetroots in period recipe when their use clearly indicated, IMO. Ras Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 10:32:35 -0000 From: nanna at idunn.is (Nanna Rognvaldardottir) Subject: Re: SC - re: chard, AGAIN Kylie wrote: >I recieved a copy of "The New Oxford Book of Food >Plants" last Friday (feel free everyone to tell me if this is known to be a >dodgy reference; I've not come across it before) and it has this to say: >SEAKALE-BEET or CHARD (Beta Vulgaris). This is very closely aligned to >spinach-beet and is used in the same way. It differs mainly in having a >broad, white leaf-stalk, up to several centimetres across, which is often >eaten as a seperate vegetable, while the green blade is used like spinach. >Some cultivars have reddish-purple leaf-stalks and blades. And I received a copy of Alan Davidsons long awaited The Oxford Companion to Food just this morning (and shall be buried deep in it for weeks to come, it is simply immense, Im just thankful it wasnt published a few years earlier, or I would never have written my own book) - anyway, here is most of the chard entry. But no mention of silverbeet here either - that seems to be purely an Australian term. "Chard. Beta vulgaris ssp circla. Also called Swiss chard, leaf beet, seakale beet, white beet, and spinach beet. It is related to sugar beet, but it produces large leaves and fleshy stalks, rather than a bulbous root. Its leaves taste something like spinach, but are coarser. The stalks may be a pale celadon colour or vivid scarlet (rhubarb or ruby chard). The stalks and leaves are generally cooked separately in different ways. The history of chard has been tracked back to the famous hanging gardens of ancient Babylonia, and the vegetable evidently has a long history in the Arab world. From the Arabic name silq came the Spanish acelga. However, the name "chard" derives from the Latin and French words for thistle, although chard is not related to the thistle, and eventually came to mean the stalk or ribs of some vegetables such as chard or cardoon which is related to the thistle. By the 19th century seed catalogues were adding "Swiss" to the name. This was presumably to distinguish it from cardoon, but it is not clear why the term "Swiss" was chosen, although Jane Grigson (1978) evidently believed that the epithet originated in Dutch. Evelyn (1699) had not used it; he referred to the "Rib of the White Beet (by the French calld the Chard)" with approval and made the interesting comment that it "melts, and eats like Marrow". The circla in the vegetables scientific name derives from sicula, which refers to Sicily, one of the places where chard first grew. Chard is popular around the Mediterranean especially in Provence and Nice, and in Catalonia, including the Balearic Islands, where the leaves are often prepared with pine nuts and raisins, a dish with Arabic origins." Nanna Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 13:09:33 -0000 From: nanna at idunn.is (Nanna Rognvaldardottir) Subject: Re: SC - Beets redux... Ras wrote: >A phone call to a >horticuluralist that I know is interested in historical horticulture offered >the intriguing opinion that medieval beets were rounded at the top and then >tapered to a point resembling an over sized squat carrot rather than the >ball-like form we normally associate a beet with in the current middle ages. >He has promised to try to find me the source of this info if he can. To quote Davidsons Oxford Companion to Food again: "Red beet, known as Roman beet, and yellow-rooted varieties spread through Europe and Asia in succeeding centuries. In Europe a yellow kind developed into fodder beet. In Germany it was known as Mangoldwurzel (beet root), which was corrupted to Mangelwurzel (root for time of need) because it would only be eaten when nothing else was available. However, until well after medieval times, beet roots remained long and relatively thin. The first mention of a swollen root seems to have been in a botanical work of the 1550s and what is recognized as the prototype of the modern beetroot, the "Beta Roman" of Daleschamp, dates back only to 1587. In Britain the common beets were originally all light in colour. The red beet, when introduced in the 17th century, was described by Gerard (1633) with some enthusiasm ..." Nanna Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 21:57:19 EDT From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: SC - Beets raghead at liripipe.com writes: << I have one off subject question: re the "white beets", are these a member of the beet family or some other vegetable? >> Beets come in many forms. Gold, burgundy, red/white striped, orange and white. There are also bulbless varieties such as Swiss Chard and varieties that have long roots like a carrot or radish. Some beets get grossly huge roots such as sugar beets and those grown to feed livestock. I would assume that white beets are meant or possibly Swiss chard. Ras Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 09:53:01 -0400 From: Elaine Koogler <ekoogler at chesapeake.net> To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] beet juice dye (last) Jennifer Thompson wrote: > Anyone have any ideas on what to do with two cans worth of beets? Sans juice? > The baby and I ate them all last time, so we are beeted out and the hubby > won't touch them. > > Lann Shred them, add cheese, and other goodies and make Lombardy tarts. These things are so great that even folks who HATE beets like these. The recipe I use is a redaction from "Dining with William Shakespeare": Lumbardy Tarts 1 lb fresh young beets 2 tbsp. Brown sugar 1 tsp. grated bread crumbs 3/4 cup grated mild Cheddar cheese 1/4 cup currants, parboiled 1/4 tsp. cinnamon 1/4 tsp. ginger 3 egg yolks 4 tbsp. Butter, melted. Peel the beets and grate them into a mixing bowl. Add the sugar and stir until it melts. Mix in the bread crumbs, grated cheese, currants, spices and egg yolks. Then stir in the melted butter. Spread the filling evenly in the dish and cover it with the top crust. Seal the edges with the tines of a wet fork and trim off the surplus pastry. Punch fork holes in the crust and brush it with egg white. Bake at 450=B0 for 20 minutes, then lower the heat to 350=B0. Bake for 25 minutes longer. Serve slightly warm. It's actually best served warm, but I usually take several to Pennsic where we eat them cold, and they're still very good! Kiri Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 14:50:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] beet juice dye (last) To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org I have made Lombardy tarts many times, but always using fresh beets, never cooked beets. I am wondering if cooked beets wouldn't be too mushy for this pie. Also, don't use cheddar cheese. Even mild cheddar cheese is too strong for the pie. Besides, cheddar isn't period. I usually use mozzarella, with very good results. Huette --- Elaine Koogler <ekoogler at chesapeake.net> wrote: > Shred them, add cheese, and other goodies and make > Lombardy tarts. These things > are so great that even folks who HATE beets like > these. The recipe I use is a > redaction from "Dining with William Shakespeare": > > Lumbardy Tarts > > 1 lb fresh young beets > 2 tbsp. Brown sugar > 1 tsp. grated bread crumbs > 3/4 cup grated mild Cheddar cheese > 1/4 cup currants, parboiled > 1/4 tsp. cinnamon > 1/4 tsp. ginger > 3 egg yolks > 4 tbsp. Butter, melted. Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 09:46:18 -0400 From: Elaine Koogler <ekoogler at chesapeake.net> To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] beet juice dye (last) Interesting. I've been using canned beets for many years, as well as cheddar cheese, and have had good success with both. I'll have to try it as you suggest and see what the differences are. I began using canned beets as the fresh were not available when I wanted to make the pies. Kiri Huette von Ahrens wrote: > I have made Lombardy tarts many times, but always > using fresh beets, never cooked beets. I am wondering > if cooked beets wouldn't be too mushy for this pie. > > Also, don't use cheddar cheese. Even mild cheddar > cheese is too strong for the pie. Besides, cheddar > isn't period. I usually use mozzarella, with very > good results. > > Huette From: Elaine Koogler <ekoogler at chesapeake.net> To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] beet juice dye (last) Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:56:35 -0400 I suspect the trick may be that I drain them very thoroughly. And I don't think that they are quite as "mushy" as they'd be if they were cooked. Also, I don't try to grate them. I simply chop them fairly finely. Kiri (looking forward to trying the recipe with Mozzarella!!) Huette von Ahrens wrote: > It is good to know that canned beets are okay to use. > I am lucky to live in Los Angeles and we usually > always have fresh beets available, with grown here or > from foreign parts. Just not a cheap as canned beets. > > Huette From: "Olwen the Odd" <olwentheodd at hotmail.com> To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] pickled beets? Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 15:15:57 +0000 >Ok, I keep coming across references to pickled beets in German sources. I >know that most SCA cooks believe that beet root was seldom eaten in >period. Have people tried pickling beet greens? What do they taste like? > >-- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa I make the pickled beets and occasionally toss in the greens if I can get nice fresh ones on the beets. They add to the colour as well as the texture so it is very attractive in the bowl. The greens are somewhat bitter, which I like, but not as bitey as mustard greens and not as tough as kale. Olwen Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 10:58:48 -0700 To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org From: lilinah at earthlink.net Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] pickled beets? Jadwiga Zajaczkowa wrote: >Ok, I keep coming across references to pickled beets in German sources. >I know that most SCA cooks believe that beet root was seldom eaten in >period. There are German recipes for beets and for pickled beets and since they are referred to as red roots i assume they actually ate the roots :-) I made pickled beets for the German feast at the Province of the Mists Boar Hunt 2001. The recipe and my redaction are on my website... http://witch.drak.net/lilinah/2001Menu.html but i guess i will post it here... Marinated Beets with horseradish Marx Rumpolt, Ein New Kochbuch,