beans-msg
- 12/3/11
Medieval
beans. Fava beans. Garbanzo beans. Recipes.
NOTE:
See also the files: fava-beans-msg, peas-msg, vegetables-msg,
vegetarian-msg, salads-msg,
seeds-msg,
soup-msg, grains-msg, bread-msg.
************************************************************************
NOTICE
-
This
file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that
I
have collected from my reading of the various computer networks.
Some
messages
date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This
file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium.
These
files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I
have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do
with
seperate
topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes
extraneous
information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were
removed
to save space and remove clutter.
The
comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I
make
no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the
individual
authors.
Please
respect the time and efforts of those who have written these
messages.
The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this
time.
If information is published from these messages, please give
credit
to the orignator(s).
Thank
you,
Mark
S. Harris AKA: Lord Stefan li Rous
mark.s.harris at
motorola.com stefan at florilegium.org
************************************************************************
From
Jeff.Peck at hubert.rain.comMon Feb 26 12:21:04 1996
Date:
Thu, 22 Feb 1996 01:23:00 -0800
From:
Jeff Peck <Jeff.Peck at hubert.rain.com>
To:
antir at mail.orst.edu
Subject:
Re: Hummos recipe<musical fruit>
I
have found in the past that if you use dried beans , and soak
overnight
in water with 1tbs of baking soda (rinse before cooking)
it
takes away a LARGE portion of the gassiness.
Lyulf
Date:
Sun, 4 May 1997 18:06:24 -0700 (PDT)
From:
Catherine deSteele <desteele at netcom.com>
To:
sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject:
Re: Beans are period...sort of.
Based
on our research, there were a couple of period beans - fava
beans,
which were known in Roman times and are still eaten in the
Meditteranean
today. The other period bean was a now-extinct version of
the
broad bean - you can substitute the Italian broad bean for it. Be
careful
serving fava beans - some people have adverse reactions to it.
They
also consumed the pods of fenugreek, known in period as "greek
hay",
and
still used extensively in Meditteranean and Afghani cooking today.
Vewgetarianism
in the Middle Ages was a risky practice - few beans or
legumes,
no corn, so options for protein were seriously limited - mainly
nuts,
eggs, and dairy products. With lack of refrigeration, not a good
lifestyle
choice...then.
Catherine deSteele
From:
nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt)
Date:
Tue, 3 Jun 1997 16:29:58 -0500 (CDT)
Subject:
Re: SC - Mediterranean Feast
I
grew them as a project this year to see how they would do in our
somewhat
warm
and humid climate (Central Ansteorra) but got them into the ground
late
for a heavy crop. They are still producing so I will have a small
but
hearty
seed crop for next year, since I started with just a few. There is
not
as much information on growing them as regular dry beans or green
beans.
Most of what I found were British publications. They are a very
pretty
plant -- the flowers are white and purplish black. I have a couple
of
catalogs at home that sell seeds if you want to try them. Taste wise
the
dry beans have a floury texture, I like. There are several Roman
recipes
featuring favas that are very good so you might check them out.
You
can get fava beans at health food stores as well as specialty
and
eastern markets.
Clare
St. John
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Date:
Sat, 7 Jun 1997 01:36:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: SC - Period Recipes
At
2:59 PM -0500 6/6/97, Peters, Rise J. wrote:
>What
other sorts of beans were available in Europe? (I don't guess I
could
>possibly
be lucky enough that pinto beans were .... or any kind of "brown
>beans"?)
Fava
beans, garbanzos, lentils. I don't think any of our standard
beans--pinto,
lima, kidney, etc.--are old world.
David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Date:
Sat, 7 Jun 1997 01:36:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: SC - Period Recipes
>There
is a good recipe out of 700 Years of English Cooking. Since I don't
>have
it here and you need it now, I'll summarize and you can experiment if
>you
want to. Its Fried Beans and Onions. Saute onions in oil, add kidney
>beans,
ginger, cinnamon and another sweet spice. Heat. The onions, beans
>and
sweet spices make a tastey mix and the dish is good hot or cold.
1.
Kidney beans are from the new world.
2.
I don't know 700 years of English Cooking well enough to identify the
recipe,
but here are some somewhat similar things; the last of the three is
the
closest to what you describe. All three recipes are from the
_Miscellany_,
available online.
Makke
Form
of Cury p. 41/A21
Take
drawn beans and sethe them well. Take them up of the water and cast
them
in a mortar. Grind them all to doust till they be white as any milk,
chawf
a little red wine, cast thereamong in the grinding, do thereto salt,
leshe
it in dishes, then take onions and mince them small and sethe them in
oil
till they be all brown. And flourish the dish therewith. And serve it
forth.
1
cup pea beans, dry 2 large onions
1/2
c red wine enough oil to fry the onions
1
t salt
Soak
the beans overnight then simmer 4-6 hours until tender. Chop up the
onions
fairly fine. Drain the beans, use a food processor to puree. Heat
the
wine and add it. Put the beans in each dish, put the fried onions
over
them.
Broad beans (fava beans) would be more authentic than pea beans, but
we
have not yet tried them in this recipe.
-
------
Fried
Broad Beans
Platina
p. 115 (book 7)
Put
broad beans that have been cooked and softened into a frying pan with
soft
fat, onions, figs, sage, and several pot herbs, or else fry them well
rubbed
with oil and, on a wooden tablet or a flat surface, spread this into
the
form of a cake and sprinkle spices over it.
1
c dried fava beans 2/3 c figs (cut in pot herbs: 1 1/2 c
spinach,
packed
6-8
T lard about 8 pieces) 1 1/2 c parsley, packed
1/2
c+ onions 1/2 t sage 1 1/2 c mustard greens, packed
1/2
t salt 1 1/2 c turnip greens
Spices
for sprinkling on top: 1/4 t ginger, 1/2 t cinnamon, 1/4 t pepper
Bring
beans to a boil in 2 1/2 c water, leave to soak about 1/2 hour, then
simmer
another hour, until soft. Drain the beans, mix the whole mess
together
and fry it in the lard for 10 minutes, then serve it forth with
spices
sprinkled on it. This is also good with substantially less greens.
-
------
Benes
yfryed
Curye
on Inglysch p. 141 (Forme of Cury no. 189)
Take
benes and seeth hem almost til they bersten. Take and wryng out the
water
clene. Do =DDerto oynouns ysode and ymynced, and garlec therwith;
frye
hem
in oile o=DDer in grece, & do =DDerto powdour douce, & serue
it forth.
2
15 oz cans fava beans 3 T olive oil
1
small onion chopped poudre douce (2 t sugar, 3/8 t cinnamon, 3/8 t
ginger)
3
cloves garlic (1 oz), smashed & minced
Drain
and wash the beans well, draining thoroughly. Chop onions, crush and
mince
garlic. Simmer onions and garlic in 1/2 c water for 3 minutes,
drain.
Heat the frying pan with oil on a medium heat, add onions and garlic
and
beans (will splatter--be careful), cook, stirring frequently, 10
minutes.
Then add pouder douce, mix well, cook 2 more minutes, and serve.
Remember
to keep stirring.
David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
From:
Uduido at aol.com
Date:
Sun, 8 Jun 1997 16:33:57 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:
Re: SC - Period Recipes
<<
What is a pea bean? >>
Acording
to my currently limited resources pea beans are navy beans. It also
says
"have been grown in Europe and elsewhere since the discovery of
America.".
I would suspect that these were one of the 1st beans introduced to
Europe
after America's dicovery although I do not have verification of that
hypothesis.
Lord
Ras (Uduido at aol.com)
From:
zarlor at acm.org (Lenny Zimmermann)
Date:
Mon, 09 Jun 1997 16:26:52 GMT
Subject:
Re: SC - Period Recipes
On
Fri, 6 Jun 1997 2:59 PM -0500, Peters, Rise J wrote:
>What
other sorts of beans were available in Europe? (I don't guess I
could
>possibly
be lucky enough that pinto beans were .... or any kind of "brown
>beans"?)
I
believe it has already been mentioned that the beans known to have
existed
throughout most of out studied time period are fava, garbanzo
and
lentils. In the 16th century there are a few more that were added
by
import from the New World, so you'll have to decide when and where
your
recipe is used from.
he
best source I have on what was available in beans is (again)
Castelvetro's
"The Fruit, Herbs and Vegetables of Italy". Here he
lists
Broad Beans (or Fava/Faba), Turkish beans (these are not from
Turkey,
but Castelvetro terms them such to mean they are "foreign",
mainly
New World in origin) which are described as "white or flecked
with
pink and tan." They also "grow very tall" and "
have [a]...lovely
green
foliage". The translator, Gillian Riley, proclaims in he
glossary
that these are Runner Beans, which we also call French
Beans".
He
also lists another kind of bean, unnamed, that are "smaller,
white
or
faintly pinkish with a black spot in the middle." Kind of like a
black-eyed
pea, apparently. Then he lists Dwarf Beans, which are he
states
are native or domestic to Italy and are sown in large
quantities
in wheat-fields after the harvest. "They do not grow high"
and
he states they eat "the cooked tender green pods as a salad, and
do
the same with the shelled fresh beans."
Chickpeas
are mentioned and are mentioned as being seen in white and
red
forms, the red being considered the better variety. Lentils are
also
mentioned and he proclaims them as "one of the most, if not the
most,
unhealthy vegetables one can eat, except for the broth, which,
they
say, is a miraculous drink for children with smallpox. In general
lentils
are only eaten by the lowest of the low." Those Italians sure
have
a way with words, eh? ;-)
As
a side note he also mentions peas (no further explanation as to any
particular
kind or description of pea) and the Grass Pea, or vetch,
which,
he says, tastes rather like Chickpeas. He dos state of theses
that
"they are considered a rather common food, for they generate
wind,
bad blood and considerable melancholy." Gillian Riley notes of
Grass
peas that the "grew wild in Italy and were eaten a lot by the
Romans,
but have fallen out of use, which is just as well, as they are
poisonous,
even after a preliminary roasting, which is no doubt why
they
were said to generate 'wind, bad blood and considerable
melancholy'."
Also
of note is that Castelvetro discusses Lupin beans, but I do not
know
if this is an actual bean or not. He mainly talks about
sweetening
the bean by putting it in clear running water for 2 or 3
days.
They are then "peeled and salted and nibbled more as a snack
than
anything else, the sort of thing that appeals to pregnant women
or
silly children. Dried lupins are used to fatten pigs and other
animals."
Gillian Riley states these have been grown in Italy and the
Middle
East since the times of the Romans.
So
runner beans could probably be used, at least after the mid-late
16th
Century. I'm not sure what the black-eyed pea looking bean is. It
could
be a black-eyed pea, for all I know. (Not like I have this great
horticultural
knowledge, or anything. I know diddley about such
things).
Honos
Servio,
Lionardo
Acquistapace, Barony of Bjornsborg, Ansteorra
(mka
Lenny Zimmermann, San Antonio, TX)
zarlor
at acm.org
Date:
Mon, 4 Aug 1997 00:22:30 -0400 (EDT)
From:
"Sharon L. Harrett" <afn24101 at afn.org>
Subject:
Re: SC - Green Beans
On
Sun, 3 Aug 1997, Terry Nutter wrote:
>
Hi, Katerine here. Ceridwen quotes John Gerard on kidney beans.
Sounds
>
interesting! I haven't tripped over any references to them in 13th
to 15th
>
Century cuisine, but maybe I'm looking too early. Can you tell us
what his
>
dates are?
>
>
-- Katerine/Terry
Hi
Katerine,
Geradrd's
Herbal was first published in 1597, late for us but still
within
the realm of Renaissance cookery , by my standards anyway. I have the
facsimile
edition published by Dover, and have spent hours trying to figure
out
some of his sources and see if I can get any time frame as to the
import
or common use of the plants he describes. Those from the New World he
usually
specifies when and where they came from, but not always. There is an
introductory
chapter in which he describes many Herbals preceding this one,
by
date and author, but no indication if he quotes from these.
I
won't be so bold as to hold up this book as documentation for
anything
before the lifetime of Gerard,whose book was based on the Dodoens
herbal
of 1583, and was updated and revised by Thomas Johnson in 1633. I do
not
have to hand any horticultural encyclopedia which would tell me
definitively
whether the beans he refers to were actually favas, or kidney,
or
some other .
I
have seen mention in Le Menagier and a couple others of preparing
beans
in their "cods", though and deduce from that , that the
people of the
Late
Middle Ages ate beans fresh from the plant at times, and not always
ripe
or dried. Though this does not allow me to assume those beans are the
same
as our "green beans", they may have been similar.
My
gardening experience and the seed catalogs I recieve lead me to
believe
that even what we know as "heirloom" vegetables,
(open-pollinated,
old
varieties) cannot be traced back more than 75-100 years. Our modern
varieties
have been bred for tenderness, appearance, selective harvest
times,
tolerance to adverse weather, resistance to disease and insects, etc.
For
a definate answer I suppose we would have to look to archaeology, or
plant
historians.
OOHHH!...
Just looked in "medieval English Gardens" In a treatise on
necessities
for the country man, he says that one needs a small table on
which
to mince or cut up vegetables, including beans in the pod! (12th
c)along
with shelled beans, cabbage, leeks, onoins,lentils, peas, and
millet.
(Neckham) Hmmmmmmmm......
Comments,
anyone?
Ceridwen
Date:
Sun, 3 Aug 1997 02:01:05 -0400 (EDT)
From:
"Sharon L. Harrett" <afn24101 at afn.org>
Subject:
Re: SC - Green Beans
Greetings
All from Ceridwen
First
I'd like to tell you all how much I have enjoyed this past
week's
postings! The challenges, whether they be simple or complex, have
something
for all of us! They have been wonderful!!!!.
Comment
on the Green Bean thing... John Gerard mentions 11 different
types
of "Kidney Beans", with different characteristics of
growing and
flowering,
Friuting, etc. He says that 9 of those are common in English
gardens
and are eaten both shelled (ripe) and " the friut and cods of
Kidney
Beans
boiled together before they be ripe, and buttered, and so eaten with
their
cods, are exceeding delicate meat, and do not engender winde as the
other
Pulses do" In the next paragraph, he goes on to describe the
praparation
of the unripe beans, including de-stringing them after being
parboiled.
As
for the Botanical evidence, I'm not entirely sure when and by
whom
Latin classification was standardized, but Gerard names those beansas
follows;
1.
Phaseolus Albus - Garden or White kidney bean
2.
Phaseolus Niger - Black Kidney bean
3.
Smilax hortensus rubra - Red Kidney bean
4.
Smilax hortensus flava - Pale yellow Kidney Bean
5.
Phaseolus peregrinus fructu minore alba - Indian Kidney Bean with
a
small white fruit
6.Phaseolus
peregrinus fructa minore frutescens - Indian Kidney Bean
with
a small red fruit
7.
Phaseolus prergrinus augustifolius - Narrow leafed Kidnay bean
(with
a small red fruit)
8.Phaseolus
Brasilianus - Kidney Bean of Brazil
9.
Phaseolus Egyptanicus - Parti-coloured bean of Egypt.
As
an aside, he says that there is a bean called the "scarlet bean"
which is
grown
in a garden he knows of, that the pods have little hairs on them that
sting
like nettles, possibly from the East Indies, but not eaten.
He
also discusses Lupines (boiles till the bitterness is gone, and
eaten
with pickle), peas and lentils, garden beans (fava major hortensis)
and
black beans (not eaten)
Anyone
care to take a stab at comparing Gerard's beans to ours,
horticulturally
or otherwise?
Ceridwen
Date:
Thu, 09 Oct 1997 13:11:49 -0400
From:
"Sharon L. Harrett" <ceridwen at commnections.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Cassoulet
Yep,
I have Gerard's... and we did discuss this a few months back, but
anyway,
here goes.
Gerard
states that there are 9 kinds of "kidney bean" known to him
(and
quotes
from other sources as well). These include some from India,
Egypt,
and Brazil, as well as those grown in earlier times in the
Mediterranean.
His illustrations resemble our lima bean far more than a
kidney
bean, being flat ovals, and the pods are flat also with a
distinct
string along the straight side. He says they come in several
colors,
white, black, red, purple, and orange. The plants and flowers
resemble
our lima bean much more than a string or shell bean, having
narrow
leaves well apart on the stalks.
Among
the other legumes, he has lentils(2 kinds) garden peas (6 kinds)
several
edible vetches, and the "garden bean" or fava, with 3 kinds
being
known (white, yellow, and black)- the black being grown
ornamentally
only, not eaten.
There
are no references to what we have now... string beans, although
he
says that the favas and "kidney" beans may be cooked
immature, in
their
pods, and dressed with vinegar and salt as a "daintie meat"
Ceridwen
Date:
Thu, 09 Oct 1997 16:06:55 -0400
From:
Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Cassoulet
Certainly
there must have been beans of various kinds imported from
places
like India and China to the Middle East, other than the chick
pea,
the lentil, and the fava. The soy bean certainly was cultivated in
Asia
very early in our period, and sooner. Other candidates are things
like
mung beans (more or less a tiny variety of soybean) and several
varieties
of chick pea that appear to have been more or less unknown to
most
Europeans.
However,
we don't really know that the kidney beans Gerard refers to,
are
the String Bean Group from South America. Kidney bean is a perfectly
natural
nomenclature based on shape, and it would be perfectly
acceptable
to call even favas by that name.
As
is often the case, the more you dig, the more confusing things
become...
Adamantius
Date:
Sat, 8 Nov 1997 00:35:22 -0800
From:
"Melinda Shoop" <mediknit at nwinfo.net>
To:
"SCA Arts" <SCA-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu>
Subject:
Beans in a Period Recipe
I
am looking at recreating a recipe from Thomas Dawson's "The Good
Huswife's
Jewell", published in London in 1596.
In
a recipe titled, "To Defend Humors" the reader is
instructed:
"Take
beanes, the rinde or the upper skin being pulled of, & bruse them
and
mingle
them with the white of an Egge, and make it sticke to the Temples,
it
keepeth backe humors flowing to the eyes."
I
want to know what type of bean available to the shooper today would
match
the
bean spoken of in the recipe, or, if this is not available, what
could
be
used instead. Any other comments about this recipe, the humor
theory,
or
the role of the ingredients in the recipe would be welcome, if you
are
familar
with this work.
Thank
you in advance for your help!
In
Gratitude,
Lady
Fiametta La Ghianda/Melinda Shoop
Date:
Sat, 8 Nov 1997 11:54:37 -0500 (EST)
From:
DianaFiona at aol.com
To:
sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject:
Re: Beans in a Period Recipe
<<
I
want to know what type of bean available to the shoper today would
match
the
bean spoken of in the recipe, or, if this is not available, what
could
be
used instead. Any other comments about this recipe, the humor
theory,
or
the role of the ingredients in the recipe would be welcome, if you
are
familar
with this work.
>>
Well
the bean part is easy---they were using fava beans. These are one
of
the few old-world bean varieties, along with lentils and garbanzos
(chickpeas),
plus the peas that our modern green peas descended from. Favas
look
rather like limas, and tend to have a rather thick, tough skin that
fastidious
cooks will often remove. It's not hard, just rather tedious---you
cook
the beans lightly, cool them enough to handle, and squirt them out of
the
skins. Then finish cooking and seasoning. This process is for the
fresh
ones,
if you can find them (Look in gourmet markets and stores that cater
to
a
Middle Eastern or Mediteranian community.), but with the dried ones
the
pre-cooking
soak will often loosen the skins enough to let you remove them.
That
said, I rarely bother, since the skins don't usually offend my
tastes.
The
exception was some fresh ones that I helped prepare for a feast last
summer.
The feastcrat had managed to find a source for frozen fresh favas,
that
we used to make the Benes Yfryed from Forme of Cury (Boil the beans,
drain,
fry with chopped onions and garlic, sprinkle with powder douce [sweet
spices]).
But either the variety was particularly tough or the frying caused
the
problem, but they were a bit much even for me. And microwaving the
leftovers
I got to take home *really* didn't help............ ;-)
I
can find several varieties of canned or dried favas in my local
Indian
market,
so I don't imagine they are *too* hard to get these days if you live
in
a large enough place to have ethnic groceries. Now, if I can just
manage
to
get across town soon---I running low on several things from there!
;-)
Ldy
Diana Fiona O'Shera
Vulpine
Reach, Meridies
(Chattanooga,
TN)
Date:
Tue, 18 Nov 1997 09:36:06 -0600 (CST)
From:
Todd Lewis <telewis at comp.uark.edu>
To:
SCA-ARTS list <sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu>
Subject:
Re: Re- Beans in a Period Recip
I
came across an interesting passage in a chronicle entitled
L'Estoire
de la Guerre Sainte, printed in Edward Noble Stone, trans.,
Three
Old French Chronicles of the Crusades (Seattle: University of
Washington,
1939). The chronicle details the campaign of King Richard in
Third
Crusade. Describing a period of famine, the passage reads,
"Back
he came and they ate beans, being well-nigh mad with
hunger
. . . A certain thing was sold in the host of God which they called
carob-beans.
These were sweet to the taste, and a man could get a mess of
them
for one silver penny; and they were well worth the seeking. With
these
and with little nuts were many folk kept alive. . ." (p.65)
A
note in the text describes "carob-beans" as "Saint
John's bread,
Ceratonia
Siliqua." I don't have much experience in medieval cooking, but
perhaps
this is what is referred to in medieval recipes calling for beans.
Lord
Henry Percivale Kempe
Shire-March
of Grimfells
Calontir
Date:
Wed, 19 Nov 1997 09:56:11 -0500 (EST)
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - green beans
<<
why would you say green beans were one of the items quickly
and
extensively used after discovery? >>
First,
I would refer you to the posts from this list a while back when we
were
having the great bean debate. ;-)
Secondly,
we have a date, according to Toussaint-Samat of 1528, when seeds
were
given to Canon Piero Valeriano by Pope Clement VII, who recieved tas
a
gift
from the New World.
The
Canon planted the beans in pots and carefully noted germination
rates,
growth
patterns, etc. He commented speciffically on how productive they
were.
Some
of the resulting crop was used to prepare a dish which usually used
favas.
The result was pronounced delicious and the beans were called
fagioli.
The
use of these beans swept throughout N. Italy,
At
this time the Canon persuaded Catherine de Medici to include a bag of
bean
seed
in her dowry. The bean was loved by all and due to it's productivity
was
only
a fleeting "exotic" soon being grown all over Provence and
other regions
where
it ultimately (My Note: probably within 10 years) was known as "poor
man's
food". Quote: "It's reputation as a cheap stomach filler
guarenteed its
popularity".
IMHO,
other sources and conjecture from eating habits support the
supposition
supports
the idea that green beans as opposed to dried beans per se were
eaten
rather extensively because a handful of green beans is one serving.
Those
same beans shelled as dry would amount to a mere taste. As
researchers
into
food history we, as moderns, must be ever vigilant to remember that
until
recently in history man's society was agricultural. Thusly, the quick
dispersal
of a food product that was prolific and good for eating in several
stages
of growth would have been, and indeed was, quickly accomplished.
Ras
Date:
Wed, 19 Nov 1997 10:14:53 -0500 (EST)
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - green beans
<<
Pineapple, I can see. They are sweet which was craved. They are
unusual
which makes them ideal for gardens of exotics.
Same
goes for peppers and perhaps for Turkeys. They fill a percieved
need.
But
green beans?>>
As
noted in my previous post, the percieved need was filling bellies.
The
planting
of a single seed and harvest mutiple seeds only a few weeks later
would
have assured it's place in the garden. With an average household
(including
servants) of 20 mouths to feed this shouldn't be too hard to
grasp.
:-)
To
add to the green bean post> Jane Grigsom in her "Vegetable
Book" (as does
Toussaint-Samat
clearly staes that the word "haricot" as used by the
English
meant
dried beans while SAME word in France denoted "green beans".
Such
a dual purpose food which had the advantage of looking very similar
to
an
already known product, favas, would not have had the problem of
exceptance
that
such foods as tomatoes or potatoes would have (and did).
In
storage dried beans keep very well while dried favas loose their
flavor
and
become rather insipid. As green beans they could have been eaten
throughtout
the growing season and yet would have provided a crop of seed for
next
year.
Add
the ability to be substituted for favas in any recipe and thereby
producing
a far more palatable product, it is not at all surprising that it
rapidly
gained acceptance. When climate is taken into account, the use of
dried
beans by the English and green beans by the French is readily
apparent
as
it would have been easy for the French to produce two or even three
crops
a
year where England would have produced one.
<<
Stefan li Rous >>
Ras
Subject
Re: SC - green beans
Date:
Wed, 19 Nov 97 18:03:24 MST
From:
DUNHAM Patricia R <Patricia.R.DUNHAM at ci.eugene.or.us>
To:
"Mark.S Harris" <rsve60 at msgphx1>, sca-cooks at
Ansteorra.ORG
Having
grown pole beans last summer and favas and Jacob's cattle beans
(one
of the kinds you dry and make soup from) this summer...
The
seeds you plant pole beans from look about a quarter the size, but
the
same general bean-shape as a fava... (about 1.5 times the size of a
seed
pea-- we also had regular peas and sugar pods, both years). I
don't
think pole-bean seeds are sold for anything besides growing more
pole
beans, to eat the flesh of, but that's a very casual opinion. The
seeds
you would see in frozen or canned green beans would be of an
immature
size. I think the kinds of beans you use for baked beans and
chili
and so forth are not mature green-bean seeds, but types that are
grown
specifically for the dried seeds, like the Jacob's cattle (an old
variety,
name comes from they're brown and white speckled). (Yeah, I
got
inspired by John Thorne's latest book; I MAY have enough for one
batch
of baked beans 8-).)
To
a casual observer (me), green beans and favas appear quite similar
when
growing. We didn't stake the favas because we didn't understand
they'd
try to grow to 6 feet! I think the leaves are generally similar
and
the favas and pole beans both have climbing tendrils... the pole
beans'
tendrils seem to be much sturdier and more active than the favas.
The
fava pods are about twice the size of a green bean, same length,
but,
well, --broader-- , and flatter rather than green-bean round...
they
-look- like there'd be lima-shaped beans in them... And before the
fava
pods mature and start to dry, they're green.
The
foliage of the pole beans as I recall stay brighter green for
longer.
The favas started to fade (paler and paler green) sooner,
didn't
seem nearly as vibrant as the other two types. The real
difference
is in harvesting... you pick the pole beans whole and eat
them
out of hand clear thru the growing season 8-), or can or freeze or
whatever.
The drying beans stay on the bush while the pod goes tan and
papery
as it and the beans dry. (Then you pick and shell and winnow
the
pod scraps out...) And the Fava pods dry BLACK and withered looking
around
the beans... a very odd effect. And you sort of pry the pod off
in
hard solid chunks.
So
there's a lot of visual similarity between favas and green beans when
young
and growing, and by the time you get the big harvest difference,
you've
already eaten enough green beans to know a good thing!
Especially
cause there is edible produce there from an early stage, on
the
pole/green beans, which isn't available with the favas or
drying-beans
(well, I didn't try either of those when they were little,
'cause
I was pre-programmed to go for the storage end-product...)
Chimene
Date:
Thu, 20 Nov 1997 23:19:58 -0500 (EST)
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - green beans
<<
But do favas and green beans look alike? >>
No.
They look similar. They are both legumes and have the basic
characteristics
of all legumes. This includes but is not restricted to
flower
structure, podded seeds, root nodules and, in the case of favas and
New
World beans, SIMILAR l;eaf structure.. As noted in a previous post
the
growing
season is longer in New World types. Favas generally require cooler
growing
temperatures and finish producing before hot weather sets in.
<<I
thought favas were big, tan colored things similar to lima beans. In
that
case,
I don't think they look like or would be substituted for fava beans.
But
I may not be right on what fava beans look like and will look for
some.>>
You
are right for the most part except you are forgetting that the fava
is
surrounded
by a darker colored sheath which is usually removed. The resulting
bean
is SIMILAR in shape to N.W. beans, that is more or less kidney
shaped.
Cooking
times and techniques are almost identical for dried beans of both
families
and mouth feel and texture are almost identical
<<The
only green beans I know have seeds a bit smaller than green peas and
are
encased in a little green sack or tube, fresh, canned or frozen. >>
There
are many varieties of beans> Red kidney beans, Great Northeren,
Lima,
Black
beans, white kidney beans and my absolute favorite "horticultural"
beans
which are white with burgundy markings, just to name a few. All of
these
varieties vary in size and to a lesser extent shape. All can be
consumed
in the green, immature state pod and all. All can be grown until
mature
and used as a dried bean. Most are definitely NOT smaller than peas
with
the notible exception of black eyed peas, black beans and the
miniature
form
of Great Northern (a name I can't recall) which is used in the
Current
Middle
Ages for the making of real Boston Baked Beans. And, yes, the beans
you
are to that come in a "small" green tube including the tube
is
collectively
called a "green bean". The tiny seeds you notice are
embryonic
forms
of what would have matured into the familiar dry bean you are
familiar
with.
<<If
this is the immature seed, are the more mature seeds sold today?
Perhaps
under
a different name?>>
Generally,
yes. See the above varities mentioned. For the most part, whether
beans
are grown for eating when immature and encased in green tube-like
structures
or whether they will be allowed to mature into seeds and shelled
out
is a decision of the gardener depending on whether food needs are
immediate
or not.
Ras
Date:
Thu, 12 Mar 1998 12:24:50 -0800
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Hummus and falafel
At
9:32 AM -0600 3/12/98, Decker, Terry D. wrote:
>I
took note of a comment in an earlier message that there is no period
>documentation
for hummus.
>
>I
am considered serving hummus and falafel as vegetable dishes in a
future
>feast.
I would appreciate any input about the history of these two dishes.
>
>Bear
"Hummus"
means "chickpeas," and is a period ingredient. Hummus bi
Tahini is
the
familiar chickpea dip, and I have not found it in any period
cookbook.
Sesame
seeds are common in period Islamic cooking, but I don't think I have
seen
anything that looks like tahini.
There
are, however, period dips, or things that work as dips, of which my
favorite
(also vegetarian) is badinjan muhassa; the recipe is in the
(webbed)
_Miscellany_.
Is
falafel made from chickpea flour? If so, you might want to consider
"counterfeit
Isfiriya of Garbanzos" in _Manuscrito Anonimo_ as the closest
period
equivalent, and try working on that instead. The recipe is:
Counterfeit
(Vegetarian) Isfîriyâ of Garbanzos
Pound
some garbanzos, take out the skins and grind them into flour. And
take
some of the flour and put into a bowl with a bit of sourdough and
some
egg,
and beat with spices until it's all mixed. Fry it as before in thin
cakes,
and make a sauce for them.
David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
Date:
Thu, 12 Mar 1998 22:32:47 -0800
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Hummus and falafel
At
3:45 PM -0600 3/12/98, jeffrey stewart heilveil wrote:
>On
Thu, 12 Mar 1998, david friedman wrote:
>
>>
Counterfeit (Vegetarian) IsfÓriy’ of Garbanzos
>>
>>
Pound some garbanzos, take out the skins and grind them into flour.
And
>>
take some of the flour and put into a bowl with a bit of sourdough
and
some
>>
egg, and beat with spices until it's all mixed. Fry it as before in
thin
>>
cakes, and make a sauce for them.
>>
>>
David/Cariadoc
>>
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
>
>Cariadoc,
>I
was wondering what spices might have been used at the time, as this
does
>not
sound far from what I generally use to make falafel.
-
---
This
is the recipe used by Sayyid Abu al-Hasan and others in Morocco, and
they
called it isfîriyâ. Take red lamb, pound it vigorously and season
it
with
some murri naqî', vinegar, oil, pounded garlic, pepper, saffron,
cumin,
coriander, lavender, cinnamon, ginger, cloves, chopped lard, and
meat
with all the gristle removed and pounded and divided, and enough egg
to
envelop the whole.
-
---
A
Recipe of Isfîriyâ
Take
some red meat and pound as before. Put it in some water and add some
sour
dough dissolved with as much egg as the meat will take, and salt,
pepper,
saffron, cumin, and coriander seed, and knead it all together. Then
put
a pan with fresh oil on the fire, and when the oil has boiled, add a
spoon
of isfîriya and pour it in the frying pan carefully so that it forms
thin
cakes. Then make a sauce for it.
Simple
Isfîriyâ
Break
however many eggs you like into a big plate and add some sourdough,
dissolved
with a commensurate number of eggs, and also pepper, coriander,
saffron,
cumin, and cinnamon. Beat it all together, then put it in a frying
pan
with oil over a moderate fire and make thin cakes out of it, as
before.
-
--
The
last two appear just before the counterfeit isfiriya recipe. So it
looks
as though pepper, coriander, saffron, cumin, plus maybe cinnamon,
lavender,
ginger, cloves, garlic and murri, would be the appropriate
spicing.
David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
Date:
Tue, 31 Mar 1998 15:55:31 -0800
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - European Grain/Legume combo?
At
12:56 PM -0800 3/28/98, Konstanza von Brunnenburg wrote:
>
>I
am searching for any documented European dish that combined a grain
(i.e.
>cereal
grass) product with a legume (e.g. beans, peas) product -- the
>trusty
vegetarian "complete protein" combo. So far I've only
found this in
>a
couple of Arabic recipes -- Caradoc's translations of "Khichri"
and
>"Counterfeit
(Vegetarian) Isfî riyâ of Garbanzos". I'd like to try
>substituting
a grain/legume combo for meat in appropriate European recipes,
>and
it would be great to be able to somehow *document* that a
grain/legume
>combination
was at least actually used in Period in (for example) England
>or
Germany. (Extra points for grain/legume documented as a Lenten
>substitute!)
As
far as I can tell, they did not substitute grain/legume combinations
for
meat
in order to do meatless meals. Fish is the usual substitute--which
probably
isn't much help to you. They did have pea and bean dishes, but
they
aren't versions of meat dishes. Note also that bread would have been
served
with every meal--so you are getting a grain along with whatever else
is
part of the meal. Here are some bean dishes (original only;
references
below).
The funny letter is meant to be a thorn: single letter for th.
Longe
Wortes de Pesone
Two
Fifteenth Century p. 89
Take
grene pesyn, and wassh hem clene, And cast hem in a potte, and boyle
hem
til they breke; and then take hem vppe fro the fire, and putte hem in
the
broth in an other vessell; And lete hem kele; And drawe hem thorgh a
Streynour
into a faire potte. And then take oynones in ij. or iij. peces;
And
take hole wortes, and boyle hem in fayre water; And then take hem
vppe,
And
ley hem on the faire borde, And kutte hem in .iij. or in .iiij.
peces;
And
caste hem and the oynons into †at potte with the drawen pesen, and
late
hem
boile togidre til they be all tendur, And then take faire oile and
fray,
or elles fressh broth of some maner fissh, (if †ou maist, oyle a
quantite),
And caste thereto saffron, and salt a quantite. And lete hem
boyle
wel togidre til they ben ynogh; and stere hem well euermore, And
serue
hem forthe.
Fried
Broad Beans
Platina
p. 115 (book 7)
Put
broad beans that have been cooked and softened into a frying pan with
soft
fat, onions, figs, sage, and several pot herbs, or else fry them well
rubbed
with oil and, on a wooden tablet or a flat surface, spread this into
the
form of a cake and sprinkle spices over it.
Benes
yfryed
Curye
on Inglysch p. 141 (Forme of Cury no. 189)
Take
benes and see†hem almost til †ey bersten. Take and wryng out
the
water
clene. Do †erto oynouns ysode and ymynced, and garlec †erwith;
frye
hem
in oile o†er in grece, & do †erto powdour douce, & serue
it forth.
Two
Fifteenth Century Cookery Books (1430-1450), Thomas Austin Ed., Early
English
Text Society, Oxford University Press, 1964.
Platina,
De Honesta Voluptate, Venice, L. De Aguila, 1475. Translated by E.
B.
Andrews, Mallinkrodt 1967. (Both Platina and Kenelm Digby were
published
as
part of the "Mallinkrodt Collection of Food Classics."
Reprinted by
Falconwood
Press, 1989.) Page numbers given herein are from the Falconwood
edition.
Curye
on Inglysch: English Culinary Manuscripts of the Fourteenth Century
(Including
the Forme of Cury), edited by Constance B. Hieatt and Sharon
Butler,
published for the Early English Text Society by the Oxford
University
Press, 1985.
Elizabeth
of Dendermonde/Betty Cook
Date:
Tue, 31 Mar 1998 21:36:47 -0800
From:
"Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net>
Subject:
SC - SC-reconstructions of medieval grain and legume dishes
Hi
all from Anne-Marie
as
promised, here's my reconstructions for medieval dishes that can be
used
to
combine grains and legumes. As Cariadoc has pointed out, this is not
a
medieval
concept, but these are reconstructions of medieval dishes, so I
guess
its better than sneaking in your Veggie burger cuz there's nothing
else
to eat.
Once
again, formatting didn't transfer over well, and so if you need
citations,
etc, let me know. And, of course, as always, if you choose to
use
my recipes, that's great, just let me know and please cite me
appropriately.
Thanks,
and enjoy!
-
--AM
<snip
of pea recipes. See the file peas-msg>
BENES
YFRYED from Forme of Curye.
189
Benes yfryed. Take benes and Seeth hem almost til they bersten. Take
and
wryng out the water clene. Do thereto oynouns ysode and ymynced, and
garlec
therwith; frye hem in oile other in grece, and do therto powdour
douce,
and serve it forth.
8T
butter
2
large onions, chopped
4
cloves garlic.
Caramelize.
Divide into two.
27
oz can Fava beans or 2x15oz cans garbanzos. Drain and rinse.
Fry
the benes in 2T melted, bubbling hot butter or olive oil over medium
hi
heat until crunchy looking, about 10 minutes. Sprinkle with * tsp.
poudre
douce.
Reconstruction
notes: YUM!!!! Fava way tastier than garbanzos. Definitely
need
to serve hot. Way to go Celeste!
Date:
Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:53:42 -0800
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Need recipe ?beans?
Niamh
of Wyvern Cliffes gave a recipe for pinto bean pie and wrote:
>Okay
so its OOP thought you might like to try it. It is actually
>surprisingly
good.
>PINTO
BEAN PIE:
>1/2
c hot mashed beans
>1/2
stick oleo
>1
1/2 c sugar
>2
whole eggs
>1
c coconut
>1
c pecans
>1
(9-inch) unbaked crust...
Well,
the pinto beans, coconut, and pecans are OOP but the basic idea, as
it
happens, is period.
To
Make a Tarte of Beans
A
Proper Newe Book of Cookery p. 37/C11 (16th c. English)
Take
beanes and boyle them tender in fayre water, then take theym oute and
breake
them in a morter and strayne them with the yolckes of foure egges,
curde
made of mylke, then ceason it up with suger and halfe a dysche of
butter
and a lytle synamon and bake it.
To
make short paest for tarte
A
Proper Newe Book p. 37/C10
Take
fyne floure and a curscy of fayre water and a dysche of swete butter
and
a lyttel saffron, and the yolkes of two egges and make it thynne and
as
tender
as ye maye.
1/2
lb (1 1/4 c) dry fava beans 1/2 c curds (cottage cheese) 6 T
butter
4
egg yolks 4 T sugar 4 t cinnamon
Crust:
6
threads saffron crushed in 1 t cool water 5-6 T very soft butter
1
c flour 2 egg yolks
Put
beans in 2 1/2 c of water, bring to boil and let sit, covered, 70
minutes.
Add another cup of water, boil about 50 minutes, until soft. Drain
beans
and mush in food processor. Cool bean paste so it won't cook the
yolks.
Mix in yolks; add cottage cheese (do not drain); add sugar, butter
(soft
or in small bits), and cinnamon and mush. Will be a thick liquid.
To
make crust, mix saffron water into flour; add egg yolks and mix well
(will
be crumbly). Add 4 T butter and mix well; add enough of remaining
butter
to make a smooth paste. (Amount used depends upon softness of butter
and
warmth of kitchen.) Roll smooth and place in 9" pie plate. Crimp
edge.
Pour
into raw crust and bake at 350° for about 50 minutes (top cracks).
Cool
before eating.
Elizabeth/Betty
Cook
Date:
Thu, 21 May 1998 21:17:58 EDT
From:
LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Wanted: recipes for Jacob's cattle beans
rsve60
at email.sps.mot.com writes:
<<
like the
Jacob's
cattle (an old variety, name comes from they're brown and white
speckled).
(Yeah, I got inspired by John Thorne's latest book; I MAY have
enough
for one batch of baked beans 8-).)
>>
Jacob's
Cattle beans are identical to "horticultural beans" which
is what
they
are. When cooked they loose the speckles and are all white. They can
be
used
in any bean recipe that calls for Great Northerns or Navy Beans. They
are
New
World. Hope this helps.
Ras
Date:
Tue, 16 Jun 1998 15:43:33 -0400
From:
mermayde at juno.com (Christine A Seelye-King)
Subject:
SC - Fave dei Morti (Beans of the Dead)
Ok,
here you go, a recipie and everything. This is from the book
"Feast-Day
Cakes From Many Lands" by Dorothy Gladys Spicer
copyrite
1960, Holt, Rinehart and Winston, NY
'Fave
die Morti (Beans of the Dead) - Italy
Fave
dei Morti, beans of the dead, are the little bean-shaped
cakes
that Italians eat on November 2, Il Giorno dei Morti, or All Soul's
Day.
These small cakes, made of ground almonds and sugar combined with
egg,
butter, flour, and subtle flavorings, are traditionally eaten
throughout
Italy on the day that everyone decorates the graves with
flowers
and says masses for departed souls.
<snip
explaination of church decorations, graveside florals>
In
spite of the somber beginning of Il Giorno dei Morti, the day
is
far from gloomy. To young men in and about Rome, the Day of the Dead
is
the proper time to send engagement rings to sweethearts. And to
young
couples
this 'festa' is the occasion to announce betrothals. Fave dei
Morti,
sometimes white, or tinted delicate pink, or chocolate color, play
an
important part in these rites. For the man sends the ring to his
fiancee
in a conventional small square white box that is packed in an
oval
container, full of the bean-shaped cakes.
<snip
explaination of other holiday observances>
Fave
dei Morti, beans of the dead, are rich and delicate little
cakes.
Despite their macabre origin, you will want them often. Color
them
orange and serve them at Halloween or Thanksgiving parties with ice
cream
goblin or pumpkin molds. Or leave them white and store in tightly
closed
tins, to serve with coffee or tea to unexpected guests.
FAVE
DEI MORTI
1/2
cup sugar
3
tablespoons butter
1/2
cup finely ground almonds (unblanched)
1
egg
2
tablespoons all purpose flour
1
tablespoon grated lemon rind
Vegetable
coloring, if desired
Combine
sugar, butter, and ground almonds. Beat egg and add to other
ingredients,
mixing thoroughly. Add flour and flavoring. Work dough
until
smooth and make into a roll about 1 1/2 inches in diameter. Wrap
in
waxed paper and refrigerate 2-3 hours. Then cut off bits of dough
and
mold
them into kidney-shaped pieces about as large as lima beans.
Bake
on greased cookie sheet in moderate oven (350 degrees) about 15-20
minutes,
or until golden brown. Cool 5 minutes before removing them from
pan
with spatula. Yield: about 2 dozen small cakes. '
I
would infer from the "Add flour and flavoring" line that
you should add
whatever
flavor you wish at this stage, such as cocoa powder, lemon, etc.
Hope
this is what your autocrat had in mind!
Good
Luck,
Mistress
Christianna MacGrain
Date:
Tue, 16 Jun 1998 16:12:35 -0400 (EDT)
From:
Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject:
Re: SC - Fave dei Morti (Beans of the Dead)
Excerpts
from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 16-Jun-98 SC - Fave dei Morti
(Beans
.. by C. Seelye-King at juno.com
>
Ok, here you go, a recipie and everything. This is from the book
>
"Feast-Day Cakes From Many Lands" by Dorothy Gladys Spicer
>
copyrite 1960, Holt, Rinehart and Winston, NY
Looks
like the name has transferred since 1614 -- in Castelvetti, Fava
del
Morte is actually a sort of fava bean paste.
toodles,
margaret
Date:
Thu, 18 Jun 1998 00:52:05 -0400
From:
"Robert Newmyer" <rnewmyer at epix.net>
Subject:
Re: SC - Fave dei Morti (Beans of the Dead)
I
found the following recipe thru a friend. Pretty basic but tasty. I
have
no
idea of the origin of this version but I thought a Fave de Morti
recipe
that
actually contains beans would be of interest.
Fava
de Morti
(Fava
Beans)
1
lb. broad beans, dried
5
large garlic cloves, mashed
2
bay leaves
salt
pepper
olive
oil, extra virgin
Soak
the beans in water overnight. Next morning drain and put in pot with
fresh
water, the garlic, and the bay leaves, and simmer until tender. This
may
take two to three hours, depending on the age of the beans. Add
water,
if
necessary, but aim for a thick rather than runny sauce at the end.
Season
with salt, pepper, and plenty of really good olive oil. Serve with
lemon
and parsley. This dish is good tepid or at room temperature, and is
even
better the next day.
from
"Painters & Food - Renaissance Recipes" by Gillian
Riley
Griffith Allt y Genlli
Bob Newmyer
Date:
Thu, 18 Jun 1998 21:17:44 EDT
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
SC - Fava alert
In
a message dated 6/18/98 2:41:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, allilyn at
juno.com
writes:
<<
Does that mean the dried seeds inside the fava case, or does it mean
food
processing
cooked fava beans, as we usually eat them--green? >>
I
know that I have said this before but people of European descent can
have
severe
allergic reactions to fava beans. Please be cautious if you are of
European
descent, espicially Mediterranean ancestry. The offending part of
trhe
bean is the gelatinous stuff between the pod and the bean in green
fava
beans
for the most part.
Ras
Subject:
RE: ANST --..Historical references to beans...
Date:
Tue, 08 Sep 98 16:54:25 MST
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
To:
"'ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG'" <ansteorra at
Ansteorra.ORG>
>
Okay Bear, it's renaissence...but heres what you
requested...Reference
>
for your beans: fourteenth century.
>
>
154. D'autres menuz potaiges...: Other Lesser Pottages, such as
stewed
>
chard, cabbage, turnip greens, leeks, veal in Yellow Sauce, and plain
>
shallot pottage, peas, frenched beans, mashed beans, sieved beans or
>
beans in their shell, pork offal, brewet of pork tripe -- women are
>
experts with these and anyone knows how to do them; as for tripe,
which
>
I have not put in my recipe book, it is common knowledge how it is to
be
>
eaten.
>
>
The Viandier of Taillevent
>
>
Rayah
Thank
you for the information. I don't have the Viander in my library, but
I
will probably add it. The reference is almost certainly to favas and
I
have
never come across it. Wonder if his unstated recipe for tripe is
similar
to modern menudo?
Bear
Subject:
Re: ANST --..Historical references to beans...
Date:
Tue, 08 Sep 98 12:03:17 MST
From:
peerage1 <peerage1 at flash.net>
To:
ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG
More
windy talk *grin*
>
Phaseolus vulgaris, the New World string bean.
Yes
and no, that particular name that covers a very broad
category...please
go and read this site:
http://www.hort.purdue.edu/rhodcv/hort410/peas/pe00003.htm
and
http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/Indices/index_ab.html
>
To my knowledge, there is no record of these having been consumed in
>Europe
within the SCA period.
In
answer to that from that site:
The
four major cultivated species of Phaseolus bean all originated in
central
and S. America. Ancient seeds of cultivated forms
have
been found in Peru (dated to 6000 BC) and Mexico (dated to 4000
BC).
Bean cultivation spread into N. America; finds
in
New Mexico have been dated to around 300 BC. French beans were
brought
to Europe in the early 16th century. Early varieties were all
climbers,
and dwarf French beans were not commonly grown until the 18th
century.
another
similar reference:
Distribution
Common
beans are native to the New World, probably Central Mexico and
Guatemala.
They were taken to Europe by the
Spaniards
and Portuguese who also took them to Africa and other parts of
the
Old World. Now they are widely cultivated in
the
tropics, subtropics and temperate regions.
Herando
Cortes is guilty of bringing "green" beans to europe. Date
of
Cortes
is 1485-1547
Now
the beans which immediately were called "fagioli" then a
century
later
(1653) recieve the name of haricot beans. Pope Clement VII
Clement
VII, Pope c.1475-1534, pope (1523-34), recieves several and
gives
some to Canon Piero Valeriano who culivates them in Italy, as well
as
passing on some beans to Catherine de' Merdici in 1533 who brings
them
to France.
Main
Entry: har·i·cot
Pronunciation:
'(h)ar-i-"kO
Function:
noun
Etymology:
French
Date:
1653
:
the ripe seed or the unripe pod of any of several beans (genus
Phaseolus
and especially P. vulgaris)
>
The later is the seed pod of Vicia faba, the fava or broad bean. The
edible
seed looks a little like a white lima bean. This is the bean that
would
be appropriate for a period feast.
Yepper,
on the bean, BUT, Now, the ten dollar question: at what stage of
growth
was the bean pod also used in medieval cookery preparation and
the
color of the pod?
*grin*....
rayah
Subject:
RE: ANST --..Historical references to beans...
Date:
Tue, 08 Sep 98 13:10:49 MST
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
To:
"'ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG'" <ansteorra at
Ansteorra.ORG>
>
> To my knowledge, there is no record of these having been
consumed in
>
>Europe within the SCA period.
>
>
Herando Cortes is guilty of bringing "green" beans to
europe. Date of
>
Cortes is 1485-1547
To
be precise, I know of no use of unshelled New World beans in period
(which
is what the menu that kicked this off suggested).
Introduction
and cultivation does not equate to culinary use. Tomatoes were
brought
back to the Old World early on and known to be in Italy in 1534 and
in
England by 1596, but they were used as ornamentals rather than food
plants.
Sweet potatoes were in common use early on, but the white potato
was
generally ignored. There is evidence that the white was imported
into
Spain
in 1573 as some form of emergency food and there is a German recipe
from
the very late 16th Century for a potato dish, but as a general food
stuff
white potatos didn't take off until the 18th Century.
>
Now the beans which immediately were called "fagioli" then
a century
>
later (1653) recieve the name of haricot beans. Pope Clement VII
>
Clement VII, Pope c.1475-1534, pope (1523-34), recieves several and
>
gives some to Canon Piero Valeriano who culivates them in Italy, as
well
>
as passing on some beans to Catherine de' Merdici in 1533 who brings
>
them to France.
To
my knowledge, this is apocryphal. Catherine was 14 in 1533, her
family
was
in dire straits financially having been on the wrong side of a bad
civil
war,
and her Uncle, Pope Clement, used her to cement a political alliance
with
the French. Her retinue belonged to the Pope and all those wonderous
Italian
cooks went back to Italy with him. She was a very small player in
French
history until 1560, when she became Regent for her son. She spent
the
next 29 years making up for lost time, changing France's culinary
tastes
in
the process. Unless there is primary evidence that she did receive
haricots
from Canon Piero Valeriano, I would consider the story
questionable.
>
Main Entry: har·i·cot
>
Pronunciation: '(h)ar-i-"kO
>
Function: noun
>
Etymology: French
>
Date: 1653
>
: the ripe seed or the unripe pod of any of several beans (genus
>
Phaseolus and especially P. vulgaris)
Yes,
and how were they served? The best evidence I've seen is a late 16th
Century
painting called "The Bean Eater," shows a peasant eating a
bowl of
shelled
beans. The recipes I've seen would not work well with unshelled
beans.
>
> The later is the seed pod of Vicia faba, the fava or broad bean.
The
>
edible seed looks a little like a white lima bean. This is the bean
that
>
would be appropriate for a period feast.
>
>
Yepper, on the bean, BUT, Now, the ten dollar question: at what stage
of
>
growth was the bean pod also used in medieval cookery preparation and
>
the color of the pod?
>
*grin*....
>
>
rayah
The
dried pod is green around the edges and brown on the sides. I
haven't
seen
a fresh pod or the growing plant.
To
my knowledge, the pod is not used in medieval cooking, at least, I
haven't
seen primary source recipe or description to that effect. If you
have
one, I would be interested in the source.
One
of the reasons for not using the pod (in fact for not serving favas
at a
feast)
is that a number of people, usually of Southern European extraction,
display
an allergic reaction to the fava. This is commonly very mild , but
there
is a small percentage who have an anaphylactic reaction. Some
authorities
believe Pythagoras died from an anaphylactic reaction to fava
beans
after avoiding arrest by hiding in a bean field.
At
any rate, I would not serve what we in the U.S. call "green
beans" at an
"authentic"
Medieval feast. They would be Renaissance at best.
Bear
Subject:
Re: ANST --..Historical references to beans...
Date:
Tue, 08 Sep 98 22:27:44 MST
From:
RAISYA at aol.com
To:
ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG
I've
been listening in on the discussion of period beans with interest. I
have
an interest in plants, not as much as a cook but as a gardener. New
world
shell beans were available before 1600 in Europe, whether or not they
were
common, they were known in Europe within our period. I haven't found
a
description
of snap beans, I'd be interested in that.
Fava
or broad beans, however, were not the only period bean.
Charlemagne's
CAPITULARE
DE VILLIS (ca. 800 AD) refers to a "kidney" bean as well as
a fava.
The
14th century TACUINUM SANITATIS IN MEDICINA includes illuminations of
both
favas
and another quite different plant called a bean. There are several
obscure
Old World candidates, the Asian dolichos or lab-lab bean seems to fit
the
illumination and descriptions the best. Additionally, in the
TACUINUM
there
are illuminations of a chickpea and a plant I haven't yet identified
called
a vetchling that seems to have pods and was cooked much like the
beans.
>peas,
frenched beans, mashed beans, sieved beans or beans in their shell
In
the TACUINUM, the author recommends eating favas cooked in water and
vinegar
and eaten unshelled to treat dysentary. I generally get an
impression
that
the pods aren't considered too tasty, though, so this reference
interests
me
<G>.
I
don't really care one way or another about the inclusion of New World
foods,
that's
the discretion of the cooks, or should be. I just found this part of
the
discussion intriguing. It's amazing what we can learn when we share
information.
However,
my husband is deathly allergic to all legumes, and we had a bad scare
a
while back when someone used the same spoon to stir several pots,
accidentally
adding some peas to a dish that wasn't supposed to have any.
Luckily,
he spotted a pea in his bowl. Now, we rarely eat feasts that include
legumes,
which means we won't be eating this one. We don't eat pot-luck
feasts
for the same reason.
BTW,
one of the reasons for the importance of favas as a food had to do
with
WHEN
they were grown. Favas don't tolerate warm weather and were planted
after
other crops were harvested, getting extended use out of the same
space.
New
World beans are a tender warm weather crop. Also, the fava seed I
have
is
flat, brown and large, larger than a quarter.
Raisya
Khorivovna
Subject:
RE: ANST --..Historical references to beans...
Date:
Wed, 09 Sep 98 07:02:06 MST
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
To:
"'ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG'" <ansteorra at
Ansteorra.ORG>
>
Fava or broad beans, however, were not the only period bean.
Charlemagne's
>
CAPITULARE DE VILLIS (ca. 800 AD) refers to a "kidney" bean
as well as a fava.
>
The 14th century TACUINUM SANITATIS IN MEDICINA includes
illuminations of both
>
favas and another quite different plant called a bean. There are
several
>
obscure Old World candidates, the Asian dolichos or lab-lab bean
seems to fit
>
the illumination and descriptions the best. Additionally, in the
TACUINUM
>
there are illuminations of a chickpea and a plant I haven't yet
identified
>
called a vetchling that seems to have pods and was cooked much like
the
>
beans.
You
also have fasoles, which are an African variety of Vigna sinensis and
are
the ancestor of the modern black-eyed pea. Another variety commonly
called
the cowpea has its origins in India.
Vetchlings
are members of genus Lathyrus, but I haven't taken the time to
chase
down the appropriate species.
>
BTW, one of the reasons for the importance of favas as a food had to
do with
>
WHEN they were grown. Favas don't tolerate warm weather and were
planted
>
after other crops were harvested, getting extended use out of the
same space.
>
New World beans are a tender warm weather crop. Also, the fava seed
I have is
>
flat, brown and large, larger than a quarter.
>
>
Raisya Khorivovna
A
little casual reading last night suggests that there a couple
varieties of
fava.
The chief difference appears to be the size of the seed. There were
no
comments on the difference in taste. I think the seed you are
describing
is
the large seed variety.
Bear
Date:
Sat, 5 Dec 1998 08:22:15 -0600
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
RE: SC - Fava beans?? (and thanks)
>
All the stuff
>
I have on period beans tells me that favas are the most period
variety,
>
which isn't helping much... :>
>
>
Melisant
Take
a look at cowpeas and black-eyed peas. My understanding is that
these
are
variants of the same species which originated in India was brought to
Africa
and entered Europe from Africa in the late Medieval period.
The
black-eyed pea was presumably imported into the US as part of the
slave
trade.
Bear
Date:
Fri, 04 Dec 1998 17:43:06 -0800
From:
Anne-Marie Rousseau <acrouss at gte.net>
Subject:
RE: SC - Fava beans?? (and thanks)
Hey
all from Anne-Marie
re:
nom de plums for fava beans....
see
also broad beans, and "horse beans" of all things. The bins
at our
middle
eastern market show them to come in a wide variety of colors and
shapes
and sizes, but the most common is either like a large browny green
lima
bean with a thick leathery skin, or else the canned variety, which
resembles
a brownish garbanzo bean with a thick skin.
As
far as I know, "black eyed peas" and "cowpeas"
are new world beans. They
may
have been introduced to colonial america by the slave trade, but
several
other new world foods like sweet potatoes and peanuts were as well
(amazing
how things move so quickly, no? The porteugese see 'em here, and
bring
'em home and use them and next thing you know, the Africans are using
them,
and then they come back home...) Anything with the genus Phaseolus
is.
Fava, garbanzos and lentils are in the pea family. If you get a
chance
to
look at the plants, you can eaily tell the difference, and if you
wanna
do
a bit of dissection, the way the seed is assembled can tell the
difference
too. Kidney beans are Phaseolus, and they have a "belly button"
in
a certain place. Fava and friends have their "belly buttons"
in a
different
place.
-
--AM, who is very angry with Mr Vehling for interpreting Apicius as
being
for
"french beans". Sheesh!
Date:
Sat, 5 Dec 1998 17:49:31 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Fava beans?? (and thanks)
TerryD
at Health.State.OK.US writes:
<<
Cowpeas are Vigna unguiculata and are of Old World origin.
Bear
>>
Correct.
The Chinese yard long bean is also a Vigna. The unique thing about
CYL
bean is that we have what is apparently an very close to life-like
illumination
of it in a manuscript dating before discovery of the New World
Using
that illumination as a reference point I planted these beans in my
garden
this year. They work in all the period recipes we have for beans that
do
not specify fava specifically. Oh, one other interesting thing about
them
is
that they come from the area that most of the Oriental spices (e.g.
cinnamon,
etc. come from and the dried bean looks like a miniature red
kidney
bean which are mentioned in period sources, IIRC.
Mind
you, I'm not saying that these were known in Europe but all the
circumstantial
evidence adds up to the probability that they were known. If
they
were known it would explain a lot about why Europeans accepted
Phaseolus
beans
so extraordinarily quickly. CYL beans a long and green, have kidney
shaped
beans and most importantly they taste like Phaseolus beans in both
the
green state and mature dried form.
Considering
that CYK beans yield sporadically and present their harvest over a
long
period of time, it is a small step to realize that they would have
been
supplanted
almost immediately by newly discovered beans from the New World
that
had a flavor almost exact flavor, superior yield, grew rapidly and
enjoyed
a relatively short total harvest season.
All
of this does not add up to the fact that they were known but the
evidence
available adds up to a likely possiblility.
Ras
Date:
Sat, 5 Dec 1998 15:25:49 -0800
From:
david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject:
Re: SC - Fava beans?? (and thanks)
At
9:40 AM +0200 12/5/98, Jessica Tiffin wrote:
>Please,
can one of you American cooks give me an alternative name for fava
>beans?
Broad
beans. I think I've also seen them labelled "fabiolo" or
something
similiar
in Italian or Spanish.
David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/
Date:
Sat, 5 Dec 1998 18:36:12 -0600
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
RE: SC - Fava beans?? (and thanks)
>
Considering that CYK beans yield sporadically and present their
harvest over a
>
long period of time, it is a small step to realize that they would
have been
>
supplanted almost immediately by newly discovered beans from the New
World
>
that had a flavor almost exact flavor, superior yield, grew rapidly
and
>
enjoyed a relatively short total harvest season.
>
>
All of this does not add up to the fact that they were known but the
>
evidence available adds up to a likely possiblility.
>
>
Ras
There
is a 16th Century (IIRC) painting entitled The Bean Eater which shows
what
appears to be a farmer eating a bowl of beans. The beans are kidney
shaped,
white with a black spot at the inside of the bend. I haven't been
able
to identify them, but I think they are some form of Phaseolus. The
painting
may support your contention of early adoption.
Bear
Date:
Sun, 6 Dec 1998 01:15:51 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
SC - Broad (fava) beans more info
Bean,
Broad -- Vicia faba L.
James
M. Stephens
Broad
bean is also known as horse bean, Windsor bean, English bean, tick
bean,
fava
bean, field bean, and pigeon bean. Broad
beans
are sometimes classified into subspecies according to varieties and
their
uses in various countries. Thus, subspecies faba
var.
minor is the beck, tick, or pigeon bean, greatly used for human
consumption
in the Arabic world, but also used for animal
forage,
like the horse bean (var. equina ) specifically fed to horses. The
broad
bean proper, also known as Windsor or straight
bean,
is var. major . Indian varieties, generally dried and eaten as
pulses,
are
classified as subspecies paucyuga .
The
origin of broad beans is obscure, but the best information indicates
the
Mediterranean
area. Remains are reported to have
been
found in Egyptian tombs.
DESCRIPTION
Broad
beans get their name from the seeds which are large and flat. Seeds
are
variable in size and shape, but usually are nearly
round
and white, green, buff, brown, purple, or black. Pods are large and
thick,
but vary from 2-12 inches in length. The plant is an
erect,
stiff-stemmed, leafy legume reaching 2-5 feet when mature. They are
quite
different from common beans in appearance
because
the leaves look more like those of English peas than bean leaves.
Small
white flowers are borne in spikelets.
CULTURE
Broad
bean is a long, cool season crop, requiring 4-5 months from planting
to
harvest. In most of Florida it is best to plant from
September
through March. It is grown as a summer annual in northern climates
and
as a winter annual in warmer climates. In the
tropics
it is adapted only at higher altitudes. Flowering is adversely
affected
by dry, hot weather.
USE
The
parts of the plants used are the seeds as a cooked vegetable. Pick
the
beans
when they are full-sized, but before the pods dry,
since
they are a green-shell bean. They may also be used as a dry bean for
food
and livestock feed. Broad beans are very
nutritious,
containing 23% protein.
A
word of caution is necessary because where these beans are eaten
regularly
as
the main diet, as in certain tropical countries, a
paralytic
condition known as favaism has occurred.
Seeds
are not as widely available as those of other types of beans. Most
local
garden supply stores in the USA do not carry them.
The
varieties `Long Pod' and `Giant Three-seeded' are often advertised.
Other
Varieties Fava Beans.
Aquadulce
Ipro
Banner
Ite
Bell
Masterpiece
Bonnie
Lad
Minica
Broad
Windsor
Primo
Brunette
Relon
Bunyard's
Exhibition
Suprifin
Colossal
Tezieroma
Express
Toto
Fava
Windsor
Hava
Witkiem
Major
Date:
Sun, 6 Dec 1998 10:12:59 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Fava beans??
melisant
at iafrica.com writes:
<<
We do also get the little red kidney beans, which Ras suggested are
also
mentioned
in period sources - which ones? Could you post some recipes?? :>
>>
The
'little red kidney beans' I mentioned are the dried seeds of Chinese
Yard
Long
beans. These beans are very small averaging only about 1/3 of an inch
long.
The product labeled 'kidney beans' in the supermarket are 2 to 3 plus
times
larger and, SFAIK, are a species of Phaseolus therefore New World.
Chinese
Yard Long Beans are not Phaseolus. And as indicated in my previous
post,
their use in the Middle Ages is merely conjecture on my part. Until I
can
find some evidence that clearly shows their use in medieval times, I
would
be very hesitant about serving them at feast or claiming them as
'period'
for
western cultures.
Ras
Date:
Sun, 6 Dec 1998 11:14:55 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Black-eyed peas
phlip
at bright.net writes:
<<
Are you sure about that, Ras? I was always told that it was the other
way
around,
that black-eyed peas were actually beans. >>
Sorry
for the confusion. Black-eyed peas are a member of the Vigna spp.
They
are
all commonly referred to as cowpeas. Technically they are , in fact,
beans.
The legumes have many terms used for their several categories
including
beans, cowpeas, peas, lupines and other terms depending on the
individual
chacteristics.
While
black-eyed peas are in fact a bean, they are more accurately cowpeas
when
a descriptive term is applied to them. My apologies for the
confusion
but
I was trying to distinguish them from Phaseolus and specific other
Vigna
spp.at
the time.
My
error :-(.
Ras
Date:
Sun, 6 Dec 1998 11:15:55 -0600
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
RE: SC - Black-eyed peas
>
TerryD at Health.State.OK.US writes:
>
<< Since there are more varieties of beans than I have
encountered, I
>
leave the question of precise identification open for further
research.
>
>
Bear >>
>
>
Was there any accompanying text with the illustration that you cited
which
>
could shed any light on the matter? My possible illumination of a
long
>
green bean was merely a decorative element on the page and completely
>
unrelated to the text. :-(
>
>
Ras
It
was being used as a decorative illustration. The particular piece is
The
Bean
Eater by Annibale Carracci (1560-1609).
Looking
at a better reproduction from the wife's collection, the colors run
more
toward tan, so it could be black-eyed peas which are being eaten.
I
think the Italian title may be Mangafagioli. If so, according to
Root,
the
fagioli refers specifically to haricot beans. Unfortunately, we
still
have
the problem of artistic license.
Thanks
for passing on the information about the coloration of cowpeas.
While
rooting around in my stacks, I came across the information that your
Yard
Long Beans are Vigna unguiclata sesquipedalis and are also commonly
named
asparagus beans or Goa beans.
Bear
Date:
Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:43:29 -0600
From:
allilyn at juno.com (LYN M PARKINSON)
Subject:
Re: SC - Bean experiments
Tonight's
Play in the Kitchen dealt with some bean experiments. I don't
have
any Fava beans, so the experiments still have a great gap, but
having
washed, soaked, rinsed and cooked pea beans, pinto beans, great
northern
beans, navy beans, chick peas and lentils I don't find much
taste
difference in any of them. What little there might be would be
covered
with the onions and garlic that seem ubiquitous to period
preparations.
Once brayed, they'd look almost the same, too, except for
a
bit of color difference, and that could be changed with the
recommended
saffron.
Now,
all that being so, what is the point of driving for a hour or two to
find
Fava beans just because they were the ones we know were grown?
There
may be a moral imperative here, as to being totally period (of
course,
I'm cooking these on an electric stove and storing in a frig) but
when
the resulting bean mush is all the same, I feel that the dangers of
serving
Fava beans to people with a variety of unknown health
problems--ancestry,
medications, etc.--are not worth the doing.
Allison
allilyn
at juno.com, Barony Marche of the Debatable Lands, Pittsburgh, PA
Kingdom
of Aethelmearc
Date:
Sat, 19 Dec 1998 16:10:27 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Bean experiments
allilyn
at juno.com writes:
<<
Now, all that being so, what is the point of driving for a hour or
two to
find
Fava beans just because they were the ones we know were grown?
There
may be a moral imperative here, as to being totally period (of
course,
I'm cooking these on an electric stove and storing in a frig) but
when
the resulting bean mush is all the same, I feel that the dangers of
serving
Fava beans to people with a variety of unknown health
problems--ancestry,
medications, etc.--are not worth the doing.
>>
Please
don't take this personally but I find there is a very great
difference
in
flavor between all the varieties that you mentioned especailly favas
and
the
other beans. Also there is circumstantial evidence that suggests
that
several
other beans may have been grown in period besides favas, such as
yard
long beans and black-eyed peas.
The
gist of your post, if I read it correctly, is that you feel the
similarities
warrant their use. You also feel that supposed difficulty in
obtaining
them coupled with a rare allergic reaction to favas also warrant
their
exclusion. These insignificant factors alone then warrant the
substitution
of Phaseolus species for known Old World species. Am I correct?
If
so, my position is that ease of attaining ingredients should not be a
factor.
Simply use other recipes which do not call for the product, grow
your
own or, most significantly, have your grocer order them for you.
Similarities
with New World products sounds like a reasonable reason. However,
this
observation is based on your personal taste. I can tell the
difference
between
different varieties of green beans, potatoes and tomatoes among other
things.
To my palette those differences are real enough to cause me to not
prepare
certain dishes if the variety necessary for the dish is not
available.
The
flavor diffierence between favas, lentils, chickpeas and New World
beans
is
so glaring to a trained palatte that they are as different as
licorice,
oranges,
walnuts and grapes.
In
addressing the allergy angle, the reaction to favas is EXTREMELY rare
and
is
limited to persons descended from ancestors that come from a very
narrow
Mediteranian
region. If we were to use this argument we would have to leave every
known food out of feasts, especially since allergies to nuts,
assorted
fruits,
alliums, dairy products, seafood, fish and wheat are more wisespread
than
fava allergies.
When
we come across rare or unusual ingredients in recipes the far better
route,
IMO, would be to try to obtain the ingredient or forego using the
recipe
rather than compromise the truth by degrading cookery from a
respected
art/science to the level of 'slopping the hogs'.
Ras
Date:
Fri, 22 Jan 1999 23:02:57 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Lupini Beans??
TerryD
at Health.State.OK.US writes:
<<
I can't place them, but it is possible that you are talking about
lupine
seeds.
Lupine or lupin is a generic name for members of the genus Lupinus
in
the pea family. Lupines have been cultivated since the Bronze Age,
so it
is
very likely they were known in period.
Bear
>>
Lupini
are EXTREMELY poisonous if eaten raw and must be thoroughly cooked
which
removes the poisons.
Ras
Date:
Sat, 23 Jan 1999 21:52:04 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
SC - Lupini Beans-update
CONRAD3
at prodigy.net writes:
<<
Yes these do look similar to what I saw, but the ones I saw were
dried
beans.
>>
In
my previous post I said that lupines were poisonous and must be
cooked
before
eating to render the poison harmless. This is only partially correct.
Of
the 100+ species of lupines, the white lupine has been bred to
produce a
few
non-poisonous
varieties.
The others are still grown, however, so caution would be the best
route
when using these beans because variety is not usually listed on the
package.
Historical
additions:
Although
these legumes grew wild in Italy and Greece and were collected and
used
by both cultures, they were not cultivated until the Roman empire.
They
were
considered a food for the poor and great cauldrons of them were
prepared
for
the poor on certain festival days. By the beginning of the Italian
Renaissance,
they disappear from culinary tomes and are not mentioned
again
until after that period.
Toussant-Samat
in History of Food talks about them a little. Poisonous
properties
and a minor amount of history was mentioned in The Visual Food
Encyclopedia.
Although
considered by many in the Current Middle Ages to be at best an
Italian
ethnic food, the vast majority of gardeners today grow them for there
beautiful
white, mauve and pink flowers, for which they have been known
throughout
history.
Ras
Date:
Sun, 24 Jan 1999 12:30:13 -0500 (EST)
From:
Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject:
Re: SC - Lupini Beans-update
Excerpts
from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 23-Jan-99 SC - Lupini
Beans-update
by LrdRas at aol.com
>
for the poor on certain festival days. By the beginning of the
Italian
>
Renaissance , they disappear from culinary tomes and are not
mentioned
>
again until after that period.
That
is not entirely correct -- both Platina and Castelvetro discuss
lupines.
Castelvetro says :Our womenfolk and little children nibble at
lupin
beans between meals during the hottest summer days. They are very
bitter
but can easily be sweetened by putting them in a canal or deep
stream
of clear running water, in a thightly fastened bag securd to a
pole
or hook, so that the current flows right through them. The lupins
are
left there for two or three whole days, until they have lost their
bitterness
and become sweet. Them they are peeled and salted and
nibbled
more as a snack than anything else, the sort of thing that only
appeals
to pregnant women or silly children. Dried lupins are used to
fatten
pigs and other animals. (He also mentions that lupin beans can
be
used to drive away moles and enrich poor soil)
Platina
doesn't talk about the beans, but does advise cooking and eating
the
stalks like you would asparagus. From the description, "harsh"
and
"they
are very bitter", it is likely the same plant.
toodles,
margaret
Date:
Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:43:56 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Lab Rat Redux (cooking exper.)
Alia
Atlas writes:
<<
Boil green beans (This probably refers to something like fava beans.
These
are
no string beans. String beans are a New World food.) >>
Correct
about the phaseolus green beans. But as I posted sometime ago, using
a
picture of an illuminated manuscript I found in a book (source
unknown now
but
when found will be posted), I still am of the opinion that either
Chinese
yard
long beans or, possible young black-eyed peas were the actual 'green
beans
' referred to during period. The yard long beans look EXACTLY like
the
illustration
when a photo is placed side by side and in real life. Also the
dried
beans of the yard long beans is a perfect miniature of what we know
of
as
'kidney' beans. So there is a possibility that when 'kidney bean' is
mentioned
in period manuscripts the yard long in a dried state is also meant.
I
know that this is all circumstantial evidence but I would bet my
money that
yard
longs are the evasive period 'green' and 'kidney' beans.
Ras
Date:
Thu, 02 Dec 1999 17:30:43 -0800
From:
"Laura C. Minnick" <lcm at efn.org>
Subject:
Re: SC - Lab Rat Redux (cooking exper.)
Valoise
Armstrong wrote:
>
Just one quick note. I believe gruene can refer to fresh beans as
well
>
as green beans.
>
Instead of dried beans, you might try this with fresh ones.
The
Middle English 'grene' also means 'new', 'untested/untried', even
'raw'.
And holds hints of the supernatural.
'Lainie
Date:
Thu, 2 Dec 1999 22:09:08 EST
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Period green beans
ringofkings
at mindspring.com writes:
<<
Could the asparagus pea or winged lotus (Tetragonorobus purpureus)
have been
what
was described as 'green beans? You eat them pod and all and they do
look
more
like beans than peapods. It is listed in Gerard as the four square
velvet
pea.
Akim
>>
Absolutely.
I only references yard long beans because I grew them a couple of
years
in a row and they look so much like the 13th century illumination
that
is
down right eerie :-) The period recipes for 'green beans' and
'kidney'
beans
also work extremely well with this variety in my experience. Is a
there
are
source for a picture of the beans that you mention? I looked in my
seed
catalogs
and can't find them . :-(
Ras
Date:
Tue, 22 Feb 2000 17:40:18 -0500 (EST)
From:
Gretchen M Beck <grm+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject:
Re: SC - Suggestions for a mushroom dish?
Excerpts
from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 22-Feb-100 Re: SC -
Suggestions
for a .. by Bronwynmgn at aol.com
>
Did I miss something? I can't see anything in the original that
suggests
the
>
bean paste should be put into pastry and fried. It looks to me like
you
>
should serve the pureed beans hot with olive oil, pepper or cinnamon,
and
>
raisins. More like refried beans.
No,
you didn't, I think I did. I've loaned out my copy of the
manuscript,
but somewhere in the recipe for favetta it says that wrap
them
in paste and fry them, and that ladies keep these in little boxes
for
delicate nibbling.
Sorry
about that.
toodles,
margaret
Date:
Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:31:59 -0500
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
RE: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
>
I used dried chickpeas at a feast I did a couple years ago. They
never
>
completely softened up and I soaked them overnight and then cooked
them for
>
several hours. I've been reluctant to use them ever since.
>
>
Mercedes
I've
had this problem with dried legumes which have been stored for
extended
periods
and have not discovered a satisfactory answer. It may be they need
to
be soaked longer or be cooked for an extended period or both. I have
not
had
the problem with dried legumes purchased shortly before use from my
local
health food store which sells them in bulk and has a high turnover.
Bear
Date:
Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:41:04 +1000
From:
"Lee-Gwen Booth" <piglet006 at globalfreeway.com.au>
Subject:
Re: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
From:
Mercedes
>
I used dried chickpeas at a feast I did a couple years ago. They
never
>
completely softened up and I soaked them overnight and then cooked
them
>
for several hours. I've been reluctant to use them ever since.
Simple
solution! Invest in a pressure cooker - I would not be without mine.
It
does amazing things to dry beans and makes the most wonderful brown
rice
imaginable
(what is more, do it properly and you don't even have to drain
it.
Ready, cooked, soft and delicious, and in its own serving dish in
about
20
minutes!
Gwynydd
of Culloden
Date:
Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:09:11 -0400
From:
"Alderton, Philippa" <phlip at morganco.net>
Subject:
Re: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
Mercedes
skrev:
>I
used dried chickpeas at a feast I did a couple years ago. They never
completely
softened up and I soaked them overnight and then cooked them for
several
hours. I've been reluctant to use them ever since. <
I
ran into the same problem a few years ago with black beans- I boiled
them
off
and on for almost a week before they were soft enough to eat. It
turned
out
that they were from a very old batch, and they'd just dried far more
than
we're used to dealing with from the store. I suspect this might be
what
had
happened to your chick peas, as I've had it happen to a lesser degree
with
other dried beans.
The
trouble with moderately exotic dried beans is that their shelf life
is
indefinite,
and if you combine very slow rotation of stock, with an impulse
buy,
where you get them and keep them around for an extended period of
time,
looking
for a recipe, you'll get that extra drying problem.
My
suggestion would be to try another package from a store where you're
reasonably
sure that they have a good turnover- either a ME store, or a
chain
in an area where you have either a lot of Mediterranean ethnic groups
or
upscale Yuppie types, and see how they work. Another alternative is
to
buy
the canned variety- just keep in mind, that they're already
well-salted,
and
you don't need to add more.
Phlip
Philippa
Farrour
Caer
Frig
Southeastern
Ohio
Date:
Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:12:12 +1000
From:
"Lee-Gwen Booth" <piglet006 at globalfreeway.com.au>
Subject:
Re: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
One
other hint - do not add salt to the cooking water - it means tough
beans!
Gwynydd
Date:
Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:44:55 EDT
From:
Etain1263 at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
phlip
at morganco.net writes:
<<
The
trouble with moderately exotic dried beans is that their shelf life
is
indefinite,
and if you combine very slow rotation of stock, with an impulse
buy,
where you get them and keep them around for an extended period of
time,
looking
for a recipe, you'll get that extra drying problem.
>>
Even
"normal" dried beans are several years old! I learned this
when I lived
in
Michigan..where they grow a great many of the "navy" and
"great northern"
beans
for market! someone gave me a large bag of "fresh" dried
beans...from
that
year - and they cooked up almost immediately! Wow! What a
difference!
The
farmers sell to the grain elevators...who store until they have
enough to
transport
to the packagers....who package and store until the prices are
"right"...sometimes
it's a year or more.
Etain
Date:
Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:08:27 -0400
From:
Christine A Seelye-King <mermayde at juno.com>
Subject:
SC - Tough Beans?
>
One other hint - do not add salt to the cooking water - it means
>
tough beans!
>
Gwynydd
This
was something my late husband used to say, and I never understood
it.
If your beans are 'tough', then they aren't cooked enough. If you
don't
salt the water as the beans are soaking it up, you will never get
the
salt into the beans, just in the fluid surrounding it. So, how do
you
end up with tough beans? Sounds more like "tough noogies"
to me.
Christianna
Date:
Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:04:53 EDT
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
SC - Chickpeas
mercedes
at geotec.net writes:
<<
I used dried chickpeas at a feast I did a couple years ago. They
never
completely
softened up and I soaked them overnight and then cooked them for
several
hours. I've been reluctant to use them ever since.
Mercedes
>>
Dried
chickpeas take longer to cook the older they are. I made the Brodo
using
canned chickpeas and it was fantastic. The difference between canned
and
dried is that you don't have to precook them. They are done. Before
the
fresh/unprocessed
crowd chimes in, there is little if any difference between
canned
chickpeas and those made from scratch. The ingredients listed were
chickpeas,
water and salt. I used the broth as part of the recipe and used
additional
salt to taste.
Ras
Date:
Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:04:23 EDT
From:
CBlackwill at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Lamb recipe and vegetable stew recipe request
piglet006
at globalfreeway.com.au writes:
>
One other hint - do not add salt to the cooking water - it means
tough
>
beans!
>
Gwynydd
Actually,
this is little more than a wide spread myth, I'm happy to say.
Adding
salt to beans while they are cooking does not affect their tenderness
in
any appreciable way. There may be some tiny chemical reaction, but
it is
unnoticeable
in the finished product. Salt away, and eat the beans when they
are
tender.
Balthazar
of Blackmoor
Date:
Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:50:13 -0500
From:
"catwho at bellsouth.net" <catwho at bellsouth.net>
Subject:
Re: SC - Chickpeas
>
Dried chickpeas take longer to cook the older they are. I made the
Brodo
>
using canned chickpeas and it was fantastic. The difference between
canned
>
and dried is that you don't have to precook them. They are done.
Before the
>
fresh/unprocessed crowd chimes in, there is little if any difference
between
>
canned chickpeas and those made from scratch. The ingredients listed
were
>
chickpeas, water and salt. I used the broth as part of the recipe and
used
>
additional salt to taste.
Actually
the difference is cost. I can buy a pound of dry chick
peas
for less than a dollar and when cooked I have my large crock pot
full.
I can buy a 10-1/2 oz can of cooked chickpeas for around $1.29
When
weighing the two options for making a meal for a large group, I
would
prefer to go with dry just for pure cost effectiveness.
Melbrigda
Date:
Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:32:26 EDT
From:
LrdRas at aol.com
Subject:
Re: SC - Chickpeas
catwho
at bellsouth.net writes:
<<
Actually the difference is cost. I can buy a pound of dry chick
peas
for less than a dollar and when cooked I have my large crock pot
full.
I can buy a 10-1/2 oz can of cooked chickpeas for around $1.29
When
weighing the two options for making a meal for a large group, I
would
prefer to go with dry just for pure cost effectiveness.
Melbrigda
>>
I
can buy #10 cans for $2.29 (a gallon). I would say that in view of
quantity
and
fuel costs that is a pretty good deal. :-)
Ras
Date:
Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:38:56 -0700
From:
lilinah at earthlink.net
Subject:
SC - Three Easy Pieces, or Verjus Redux
The
Shire of Crosston, with whom i camp, has a period pot-luck feast
at
every Crown Tournament (3 per year in the West). There are always
guests,
so there are around 2 dozen diners or so, and frequently
other
folks show up looking for food and we feed them, as well.
Generally,
there's plenty. At The West Kingdom March Crown Tourney
just
passed, I made three dishes from Barbara Santich's "The Original
Mediterranean
Cuisine" for the Saturday night feast. I didn't use her
"redactions"
for any of them, just referred to the originals and the
translations.
VERJUS
REDUX
I
have now used the Fusion brand Napa Valley Verjus that i bought
from
Whole Foods and i thought it was quite nice. I tasted a spoonful
of
it before pouring some into the dish i was cooking - i'm weird, i
probably
could have drunk a juice glass of it - it was tart and
fruity,
but not bitter. I used it in a recipe for garbanzo beans
cooked
in almond milk.
This
was not the unpleasant white grape Fusion brand verjus that
Niccolo
di Francesco wrote about. I used the Fusion red verjus, which
was
a lovely purplish red color and was neither unpleasantly tart nor
at
all bitter, as Niccolo says the Fusion white was. I don't have the
recommended
Navarro brand to compare it with, but the Fusion red was
quite
good.
PIECE
ONE
Ciurons
Tendres Ab Let de Melles
(from
Sent Sovi)
ORGINAL:
Si vols apperellar ciurons tendres ab let de amelles, se ffa
axi:
Prin los ciurons, e leva'ls be. E ages let de amelles, e mit-los
a
coura ab la let e ab holi e ab sal; e met-hi seba escaldade ab
aygua
bulent. E quant deuran esser cuyt, met-hi jurvert e alfabegua
e
moradux e d'altres bones epicies [should be 'erbes'] e un poc de
gingebre
e de gras. E quant hi metras los ciurons, sien levats ab
aygua
calda, que tentost son cuyts.
TRANS:
If you want to prepare tender chickpeas with almond milk, do
it
thus: take the chickpeas and wash them well. And take almond milk
and
set them to cook with the milk and with oil and with salt; and
put
in it onion scalded with boiling water. And when they should be
cooked,
put in them parsley and basil and marjoram and other good
spices
[should be 'herbs'] and a little ginger and verjus. And when
you
add the chick peas, wash them with hot water that they should
cook
more quickly.
[NOTE:
the insert "should be 'herbs' is from Santich's book, i didn't
add
it. I cooked the recipe with herbs and no additional spices.]
WHAT
IT DID:
(1)
I used canned garbanzos, rather than soaking and boiling my own.
I've
cooked garbanzos from scratch, and while they are, hmmm, mealier
(a
good quality) than canned, which are sometimes a bit slimy (i
usually
rinse them), i haven't noticed a vast difference in the
quality
of a dish made with one or the other.
(2)
I bought organic, whole, unroasted almonds to make almond milk,
but
i didn't have time to make it. I was going to make it Thursday
night
and bring it in a bottle, but I was appliqueing and
embroidering
my consort's fighting surcote as well as hand-sewing a
couple
wool tunics for myself, so i didn't get around to it. When it
was
time to cook, i used boxed organic almond milk that i'd bought to
drink
- it has a little, very little brown rice sweetener and some
vegetable
thickeners (guar, xanthan, carageenen, and locust bean
gums).
But not so much that it is a vastly different creature from
homemade
almond milk, which I would have preferred, but i don't think
the
dish suffered greatly.
I
dumped the drained garbanzos into my kettle, then poured in enough
almond
milk to cover (i wasn't trying to make soup) and added some
salt
and a little olive oil. While it was beginning to heat, i finely
chopped
a small onion and added it without first scalding, as i
didn't
bring enough pans.
After
warming and stirring, i began to add other seasonings. I added
white
pepper (for personal reasons i don't use black pepper) and
dried
ginger powder. It's an amazingly good dried ginger powder that
i
bought at the health food store. When i tasted the liquid it seemed
as
if i'd used too much ginger and white pepper - it was quite "hot"
-
- and while that doesn't bother me, i know some people at the feast
don't
like food that's too "piquant". But after i let it cook a
bit,
then
tasted again with chickpeas in my tasting spoon, it was fine. I
cooked
it until the onion was tender and mild.
I
had bought fresh organic herbs. At this point i added lots of
chopped
flat-leaf parsley and fresh basil. I didn't see fresh
marjoram
at the store, so i tossed in fresh thyme and oregano, going
easy
on the oregano so it wouldn't take over. When the herbs were
cooked
and the broth was well flavored, i added the verjus, stirred
to
distribute, then left it to warm for a minute, and removed the pot
from
the fire. Personally, i'd like to have added more verjus, as i
like
strong flavors. But it was fine, adding a bit of tang to the
dish.
PIECE
TWO
Cauli
Verdi con Carne
(from
Libro della Cocina)
<snip
of cabbage recipe. See vegetables-msg>
PIECE
THREE
On
Preparing a Salad of Several Greens
(from
de Honesta Voluptate)
<snip
of salad recipe - see salads-msg>
-
---------------
I
picked these dishes because they were relatively quick and easy to
prepare
at a busy event, yet authentic. I was actually done cooking
before
the others who cooked on site. (i mention this because i'm
usually
still cooking when everyone is already eating)
Anahita
al-shazhiyya
Date:
Sun, 7 May 2000 07:31:21 -0500
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
RE: An Test was Re: SC - Truck Crops
>
Bear wrote:
>
>BTW, Root also says, "...fagioli refers specifically to the
New World bean."
>
>Fagioli also refers to the black-eyed pea, which is definitely
Old World in
>
>origin.
>
>
When were black eyed peas introduced, if ever, to Europe? Were they
>
eaten in North Africa in Medieval times, i.e., would they have been
>
eaten in North Africa after 600 and before 1600? I've got this bag of
>
'em in the freezer...
The
term "phaseolus" from which from which "fagioli"
is derived appears in
Roman
writings. From context it appears to refer to kidney shaped beans
which
are distinct from "faba" or fava beans (Vicia faba).
While this does
not
preclude some variety of fava being the bean referenced, it does
demonstrate
that the Romans acknowledged a difference. The term appears in
Roman
writings after the beginning of major trade with Africa which
increases
the probability that they were writing about some form of the
black-eyed
pea.
The
black-eyed pea (Vigna unguiculata var. sinensis (IIRC)) is a bean of
Asian
origin with several major varieties, including the yard-long bean (V.
unguiculata
var. sesquipedalis). Phaseolus likely refers to any of these
related
plants.
For
visual evidence of their use at the end of the 16th Century, take a
look
at
Annibale Carracci's The Bean Eater (Il Mangafagiolo).
It
should be noted that while the black-eyed pea was eaten in Italy
within
period,
and probably before, there is no evidence I have encountered to show
it
being used elsewhere in Europe.
>
Anahita al-shazhiyya
Bear
Date:
Mon, 8 May 2000 09:30:34 -0500
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject:
SC - Phaseolus recipes
Platina
7.14
On
the Kidney Bean
There
is the kidney bean, phaseolus or phasellus, which Virgil calls lowly.
Apuleius
writes that this name comes from the island of Phasellus, not far
from
Mt. Olympus. Kidney beans have warm and damp force. Their use
lubricates
the bowels and is fattening, moves the urine, and is good for
chest
and lungs but fills the head with gross and bad humors and brings on
dreams,
and indeed bad ones. Its cold and harmfulness can be reduced to
some
degree by sprinkling with majoram, pepper, and mustard. After
[eating]
kidney
beans, it is necessary to drink pure wine.
Platina
7.33
Dish
Made from Peas
Let
peas come to a boil with carob. When they are taken from the water,
put
in
a frying pan with bits of salt meat, especially that balanced between
lean
and fat. I would wish, however, that the bits had been fried a
little
beforehand.
Then add a bit of verjuice, a bit of must, or some sugar and
cinnamon.
Cook broad beans in the same way.
Recipe
7.33 is problematical. The Latin text in Milham states, "Hoc
item
modo
et phaseolos coquito." Milham translates this as "cook
broad beans in
the
same way." Elsewhere in the text, broad beans appear as "fabam"
and
kidney
beans appear as "phaseolus." The pattern of translation
suggests
that
the "broad beans" of this recipe should be translated as
"kidney
beans."
As the two preceding recipes are for broad beans, it is possible
that
this apparent translation error is a printer's typographical error.
According
to a footnote, the recipe is taken from Martino and was entitled
in
his work, "Per fava li piselli fritti nella fava menata."
Said title
suggests
that broad beans are meant rather than kidney beans.
Bon
Chance
Bear
Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003
00:21:08 -0600
To:
sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
From:
James Prescott <prescotj at telusplanet.net>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Translation issue
At
22:57 -0400 2003-04-07, Patrick Levesque wrote:
>
This is a very basic question: I'm wondering about the exact meaning
of
>
'grams'. (The french-english dictionnaries I have here are not of
much
>
help, unfortunately, being stuck on the metrical measurement).
>
>
Do they only refer to pulses and legumes in general, or does the term
>
indicate a narrower selection therein? Webster's definition is 'any
of
>
several beans' which quite frankly doesn't lead one very far...
>
>
It seems safe to assume that chickpeas would be included, but I want
to
>
verify this before I adapt a new recipe.
If
you are referring to Indian cuisine, then 'gram' generally
refers
only to the chick pea and very close relatives, such as
'channa'
which is like a small chick pea with its skin removed,
and
with the pea split. 'Gram' flour is made from 'channa'.
Nevertheless,
for our greater confusion, 'gram' is occasionally
used
to refer to some other legumes, such as moong beans and
horse
gram.
Thorvald
From:
"Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
To:
"'sca-cooks at ansteorra.org'" <sca-cooks at
ansteorra.org>
Subject:
[Sca-cooks] Translation issue
Date:
Tue, 8 Apr 2003 08:57:50 -0500
Gram
refers to a number of plants including chickpea (Bengal gram) whose
seeds
are used for food in Asia. It derives through Portuguese from the
Latin
"granum" (grain), suggesting a 16th Century origin for the
usage.
The
mung bean (Vigna radiata, green gram or golden gram) and the urd
(Vigna
mungo,
black gram) are also among the grams. Cowpeas, black-eyed peas, and
yard-long
beans (V. unguiculata), pigeon pea (Cajanus cajan), soybeans
(Glycine
max) and lentils (Lens culinarius) are sometimes included in
the
grain legumes.
Gram
also refers 1/1000 of a kilogram (standard metric measure). From
The
French "gramme" (small weight) derived from the Latin
"gramma" (small
weight)
derived from Greek.
And
one must not forget Gram, the sword of Sigmund, broken by Odin,
Repaired
by Regin, and used by Sigurd to kill Fafnir.
Bear
Date:
Tue, 29 Jul 2003 02:23:25 -0400
From:
"Christine Seelye-King" <kingstaste at mindspring.com>
Subject:
[Sca-cooks] Duh
To:
"SCAFoodandFeasts" <SCAFoodandFeasts at
yahoogroups.com>, "SCA Cooks"
<Sca-cooks
at ansteorra.org>
Ok,
if I'd just scrolled down the page, I would have seen them. My bad.
Here
is the recipe for anyone who's curiosity I've peaked:
Counterfeit
(Vegetarian) Isfî riyâ of Garbanzos
Andalusian
p. A-1
Pound
some garbanzos, take out the skins and grind them into flour. And
take
some
of the flour and put into a bowl with a bit of sourdough and some
egg,
and
beat with spices until it's all mixed. Fry it as before in thin
cakes,
and
make a sauce for them.
chickpea
flour: 1 c
sourdough:
1/2 c
eggs:
4
spices:
2
t pepper
2
t coriander
16
threads saffron
2
t cumin
4t
cinnamon
1/4
c Cilantro, chopped
Garlic
Sauce:
3
cloves garlic
2
T oil
2T
vinegar
Chickpea
flour can be made in a mortar and pestle or a spice grinder (a food
processor
would probably work too). Pound or process until the dried
chickpeas
are broken, then remove the loose skins and reduce what is left to
a
powder. An easier approach is to buy the flour in a health food
store; a
middle
eastern grocery store might also have it. Use untoasted chickpea
flour
if you can get it.
Crush
the garlic in a garlic press, conbine with vinegar and oil, beat
together.
Combine
the flour, sourdough, eggs, spices and beat with a fork to a unform
batter.
Fry in about 1/4 c oil in a 9" frying pan at medium high
temperature
until
brown on both sides, turning once. Add more oil as necessary. Drain
on
a
paper towel.
note:
The ingredients for the sauce are from "A Type of Ahrash [Isfî
riyâ
]". What is done with them is pure conjecture.
Date:
Tue, 29 Jul 2003 09:07:23 +0200
From:
Ana Vald?s <agora at algonet.se>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Duh
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Another
variation of an old recipe from Ligurien, i Italy, eaten today
in
the north of Italy and in Nice, where is known as "socca".
In Italy
is
known as "faina", in a dialectal word. (Outside Europe you
can eat it
in
Rio de la Platas capital cities, Buenos Aires and Montevideo, where
the
Italian inmigrants took the dish in the beginning of the century).
Pound
garbanzos and make flour of them (or alternative buy the chickpeas
flour)
Put
the flour in a bowl and add olive oil enough to make a very thin
dough,
similar in consistence to the dough to make pancakes.
Add
salt and black pepper.
Lay
the dough in a flat oven pan and heat the oven to a very high
temperature.
Let
it bake in the oven until the thin cake have a brown and crusty
cover.
Eat
very warm powdered with blackpepper.
Ana
Christine
Seelye-King wrote:
<<<
Ok, if I'd just
scrolled down the page, I would have seen them. My bad.
Here is the recipe for
anyone who's curiosity I've peaked:
Counterfeit
(Vegetarian) Isfî riyâ of Garbanzos
Andalusian p. A-1
>>>
Date:
Tue, 29 Jul 2003 07:34:48 -0400
From:
"Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius" <adamantius at
verizon.net>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Duh
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Also
sprach Ana Valdés:
<<<
Another variation of
an old recipe from Ligurien, i Italy, eaten
today in the north of
Italy and in Nice, where is known as "socca".
In Italy is known as
"faina", in a dialectal word. (Outside Europe
you can eat it in Rio
de la Platas capital cities, Buenos Aires and
Montevideo, where the
Italian inmigrants took the dish in the
beginning of the
century).
Pound garbanzos and
make flour of them (or alternative buy the
chickpeas flour)
Put the flour in a
bowl and add olive oil enough to make a very thin
dough, similar in
consistence to the dough to make pancakes.
Add salt and black
pepper.
Lay the dough in a
flat oven pan and heat the oven to a very high temperature.
Let it bake in the
oven until the thin cake have a brown and crusty cover.
Eat very warm powdered
with blackpepper.
>>>
The
socca recipes I've seen also call for water, along with the olive
oil.
Authorities seem to differ on whether it should be paper thin or
slightly
thicker. Usually the cooking method is like that of a pizza,
except
the dough would be referred to in English as a batter. If you
can
pour it, and cannot pick it up in your hands without tools,
that's
a batter. With a couple of exceptions, but generally...
On
an only marginally related note, the other big Provencale
chick-pea-based
street food (you generally don't see these on
restaurant
menus) would be panisse, which is a thick boiled porridge
of
ground chick peas, which is spread on a plate to cool and
solidify,
after which it is cut into strips and fried like French
fries,
in olive oil...
Adamantius
Date:
Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:40:00 -0400
From:
Tara Sersen Boroson <tara at kolaviv.com>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] garbanzos/chickpeas
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
jenne
at fiedlerfamily.net wrote:
>
Does one soak garbanzo beans/chickpeas prior to cooking, or not?
>
>
-- Pani Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, Knowledge Pika jenne at fiedlerfamily.net
I
assume you mean dried ones - yes, you need to soak them. They are
too
big
to cook down like lentils.
-Magdalena
Date:
Mon, 15 Nov 2004 15:02:07 -0600
From:
"Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Gunthar Updates
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
>
Really! Black-eyed peas? I always thought they were of African
origin.
>
Not that I doubt your extensive knowledge, but do you have references
>
on hand? I imagine I may have to defend this one if I use them! :)
>
>
Aoghann
Consider
the Latin "phaseolus" which is distinct from "faba".
Phaseolus is
the
term for kidney bean. It's Italian derivative is fasoli. Both
phaseolus
and fasoli predate Columbus and the arrival of the New World
kidney
beans in genus Phaseolus. While it is not certain that phaseolus
referred
to the black-eyed pea, it is a generally accepted opinion. Fasoli
still
includes the black-eyed pea in modern usage.
Apicius
has a recipe for "Faseoli" and Platina has recipes for
"phaseolus"
(IIRC)
translating from Martino's Italian. Modern confusion occurs because
of
the work of taxonomists in the 16th and 17th Centuries using
Phaseolus as
the
genus name for the New World string-beans.
There
are a number of members of genus Vigna, which are of Asian and
African
origin,
and commonly referred to a black-eyed peas, cowpeas, asparagus
beans,
yard long beans, etc. These are found in long pods which resemble
the
string-beans. It was this resemblence which caused Columbus to
identify
some
of the New World beans as "faxones."
I've
got no hard and fast dates on when the Vigna arrived in Europe, but
it
was
certainly no later that the 1st Century CE and it may have been
brought
to
Europe during the prehistoric migrations. I tend to think it may
come
from Asia with Alexander's armies.
The
best evidence of black-eyed peas being eaten is Europe is fairly
late.
It
is a 16th Century painting by Annibale Carracci, The Bean Eater,
which
shows
a peasant eating a bowl of black-eyed peas.
Bear
Date:
Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:43:07 -0700
From:
lilinah at earthlink.net
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Beans, beans...
To:
sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
I
wrote:
>
Also in the 14th C. Tuscan cookbook are recipes for "fasoli",
which
>
is "beans", but since most of what we call "beans"
are New World, and
>
favas have their own name, what does "fasoli" mean?
In
response to several posts:
Fasoli
are not fava beans. Favas have their own *sections*, one for
fresh
and one for dried.
Fasoli
are not chick peas. Chickpeas have their own section.
Fasoli
are not red beans. Those are New World and the 14th C. is way
prior
to Columbus...
Could
they be black-eyed peas or a relative? Field peas (which are
grey)
or are these the peas? Something else?
In
the order in which they appear:
7
Chickpea [ceci] recipes
5
Pea [pesi] recipes
5
Fresh Fava [fave sane] recipes
-
- "fave sane" means "whole favas" but it's clear
from the recipes
that
they are fresh.
2
Dried Fava [fave infrante] recipes
-
- "fave infrante" means "split favas" but it's
clear from the
recipes
that they are dried.
2
Lentil [lenti] recipes
3
Fasoli recipes - it's entirely not clear from the recipes if they
are
fresh or dried, although i lean toward dried, since they are
boiled
first before adding them to the recipes.
Here
are the originals and Vittoria's translations:
[57]
De'
fasoli. Fasoli bene lavati e bulliti, metti a cocere con oglio e
cipolle,
con sopradette spezie, cascio grattato, et ova dibattute.
Beans
well cleaned and boiled, set them to cook with oil and onions,
with
aforementioned spices, grated cheese, and beaten eggs.
[58]
Altramente
al modo trivisano. Metti fasoli bulliti, descaccati, a
cocere
con carne insalata, e con pepe, e zaffarano. E possonsi dare
soffritti
con oglio, postovi dentro un poco d'aceto, amido e sale.
Another
preparation in the style of Treviso. Put boiled beans,
shelled,
to cook with salted meat, and with pepper and saffron. And
this
can be served fried in oil, put in a bit of vinegar, starch, and
salt.
[59]
Altramente.
Tolli i fasoli bulliti, e gittatane via l'acqua, mettili
a
cocere con carne di castrone, di porco, o di bue, o qualunche
vuoli,
e molto pesta, e un poco di zaffarano e sale, e da' mangiare.
Another
preparation. Take boiled beans, and throw away the water,
set
them to cook with mutton, pork, or beef, or whatever you like,
and
grind it well, and a bit of saffron and salt, and serve it.
--
Urtatim
(that's err-tah-TEEM)
the
persona formerly known as Anahita
Date:
Fri, 12 Aug 2005 22:54:39 -0400
From:
Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Beans, beans...
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
>
lilinah at earthlink.net wrote:
>
Also in the 14th C. Tuscan cookbook are recipes for "fasoli",
which
>
is "beans", but since most of what we call "beans"
are New World, and
>
favas have their own name, what does "fasoli" mean?
>
--
>
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
The
Medieval Kitchen by Redon, Sabban & Serventi
talks
about "fasole or faseole. This was an African legume
belonging
to the family Vigna and was very similar to the New
World
Phaseolus vulgaris. The fasole has more or less
disappeared,
but you can easily find its descendant: the black-eyed
pea."
page 94
Johnnae
Date:
Fri, 12 Aug 2005 22:14:45 -0500
From:
"Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Beans, beans...
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Fasoli
(phaseolus) refers to kidney beans. Any bean that looks like a
kidney,
not just the red ones. The word appears in Pliny, so it obviously
applied
to a type of legume before the New World beans arrived. Most of the
authorities
I've checked believe that phaseolus refers to members of genus
Vigna
although some suggest that it may have originally been some form of
fava
bean.
If
you look up the painting "The Bean Eater," you'll find the
poor fellow
eating
black-eyed peas.
Bear
Date:
Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:34:26 -0500 (GMT-05:00)
From:
Christiane <christianetrue at earthlink.net>
Subject:
[Sca-cooks] Re: Sca-cooks Digest, Vol 27, Issue 41
To:
sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
I
honestly believe that "fasoli" is a variant of fava, from
the Roman
Phaseoli
mentioned by Pliny.
Today,
"fasoli" is the Greek word for fava, and the popular bean
stew
of
Southern Italian origin — which gets slurred into pastafazool —
initially
was pasta fasoli in some Southern dialects, notably
Sicilian
and Neapolitan, the strongly Greek-influenced regions of the
country
(where also today "fasoli" means beans, but it seems to
mean
beans
in general; however, I believe that which bean "fasoli"
referred
to would vary by region to region and village to village).
There
were "white" favas and "black" favas; undoubtedly
there were
other
varieties, heirloom types that no longer exist today. Fasoli
could
very well refer to one of these specific fava variants.
Considering
how many different types of favas were cultivated in 18th
century
Williamsburg, I have no doubt there were just as many
varieties
being cultivated in medieval Tuscany.
Gianotta
Date:
Sun, 4 Dec 2005 20:32:10 -0800
From:
David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Uses for fava beans....
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
I
don't think so. One of them has a name that refers to
pistachios--because
the green favas look like pistachios.
But
I haven't tried it.
>
Would using reconstituted (soaked) dried ones work in the fresh-beans
>
recipes?
>
--Maire
Date:
Thu, 7 Sep 2006 06:27:31 -0700 (PDT)
From:
Louise Smithson <helewyse at yahoo.com>
Subject:
[Sca-cooks] Green beans was My Next Feast
To:
sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Actually
there are period (prior to 1600) recipes for Green beans
and
a whole host of other new world foods. You just have to look.
Here
are some of the ones I found from Italian sources either in or
post
period (this is taken from the class I gave at Pennsic).
Recipes
from Scappi [5], Messisbugo [6] and Castelvetro [7]
This
is where it gets tricky. How do you tell the difference
between
an old bean recipe and a new bean recipe when the same name
is
used for each? This is the one situation where the appellation
"of
India" or "of Turkey" was not added to the name of the
plant to
distinguish
it from what came before the one exception to this is a
description
from Castelvetro [7]. Capatti & Montanari [8] indicate
that
both Scappi and Messisbugo have recipes for green beans, however
this
is the one occasion where no end note is given. Judging from
the
recipes themselves however, these are the ones calling for "fresh
beans"
which are replacing black eyed peas or cow peas as a fresh
bean
type vegetable.
Per
far minestra di piselli, & fave fresche con brodo di carne Cap
CLXXXVIII
secondo libro, Scappi
Piglinosi
li piselli freschi nella sua stastione, laqual comincia
in
Roma dal fin di Marzo, & dura per tutto Giugno, come sanno ancho
le
fave fresche, sgraninosi li detti piselli, & ponganosi in un vaso
di
terra, o di rame con brodo grasso, & gola di porco salata,
tagliata
in fette, et faccianosi bollire fin'a tanto che siano quasi
cotti,
& pongavisi una brancata d'aneci, & petrosemolo battuto, &
facciano
si finir di cuocere; et volendo fare piu spesso il brodo,
pestisi
un poco di essi piselli cotti, & passinosi per lo setaccio, &
mescolinsi
con li piselli intieri giungendovi pepe, & cannella, &
servanosi
con le tagliature della gola di porco. Si potrebbeno
cuocere
con li detti piselli teste de capretti pelate, &
pollastrelli,
piccioni, paparini, & anatrine ripiene. Si pu? fare
ancho
in un'altro modo, cio? cotto che sar? il pisello con il brodo,
si
potr? maritare con uova, cascio, e spetierie. In tutti li sudetti
modi
si possono cuocere le fave fresche.
To
make a dish of peas and fresh beans with meat broth, Chapter
188,
2nd book Scappi.
Take
fresh peas in their season, which starts in Rome at the end
of
March and lasts through all of June, which is also that of fresh
beans.
Shell the said peas and put them into an earthenware pot or
copper
pot with fat broth and salted pork jowls cut into slices let
them
boil until they are almost cooked. Then add a handful of dill
and
parsley chopped and let it finish cooking. And if you want to
make
the broth more dense grind a few of the cooked peas, pass them
through
a strainer and mix them with the intact peas, adding pepper
and
cinnamon. Serve them with the cut pieces of pork jowl. One can
also
cook the said peas with skinned goat heads, and pullets,
pigeons,
doves and ducks stuffed. One can also make it in another
way,
that is when the peas are cooked with the broth one can enrich
it
with eggs, cheese and spices. In all these described ways one can
also
cook fresh beans.
Per
fare minestra di Piselli, & Fave fresche Cap CCXLIX, terzo
libro,
Scappi.
Piglinosi
i piselli o baccelli, sgraninosi, & ponganosi in un vaso
con
oglio d'olive, sale, & pepe, & faccianosi soffriggere pian
piano,
aggiungendovi
tanta acqua tinta di zafferano, che stiano coperti di
due
dita, & come saranno poco men che cotti, pestisene una parte nel
mortaro,
e stemperisi con il medesimo brodo, & mettasi nel vaso con
una
branchata d'herbuccie battute, e faccianosi levare il bollo, e
servanosi
caldi. In questo medesimo modo si pu? accommodare il cece
fresco,
havendolo prima fatto perlessare, & fatto stare per un quarto
d'hora
nell'acqua fresca. In questo modo ancho si cuoce il fagiolo
frescho.
To
make a dish of peas and fresh beans, chapter 249, 3rd book,
Scappi.
Take
the peas or beans, pod them and put them in a pot with olive
oil,
salt and pepper, and let them fry very slowly. Then add enough
water,
which has been colored with saffron, that the beans are
covered
by two fingers. When they are a little bit less than fully
cooked,
grind a few and mix them with the same broth, and put them
back
into the pot with a handful of chopped herbs and bring back to
the
boil and serve hot. In this same way one can cook fresh chick
peas,
having first parboiled them and let them soak for a quarter of
an
hour in fresh water. In this same way one can also cook fresh beans.
A
fare fasoletti freschi in tegola. Page 113 Messisbugo
Pigliarai
le tegole de fasoletti quando sono tenerini, e tagliarai
il
picollo, poi le porrai a cuocere in'acqua bogliente, e subito si
cuoceranno,
& cotte che seranno le porrai a scolare col sale sopra,
poi
le frigerai in olio overo butiro, e frigendole nella patella, li
porrai
un poco di Aceto, e Pevere, e poi li imbandirai.
To
cook fresh beans in the pod, page 113 Messisbugo
Take
the pod of beans when they are tender, and cut them into
little
pieces, then put them to cook in boiling water, and they will
be
cooked almost immediately. And when they are cooked drain them
and
sprinkle them with salt, then fry them in olive oil or butter in
a
frying pan. Add a little bit of vinegar and pepper before serving
them.
De?
fagiuoli turcheschi, Castelvetro
Nella
passata stagione ho a pieno ragionato della fava fresca e
secca;
or qui mi convien ragionare de? fagiuoli, frutto o legume
molto
simigliante a quelle di gusto; e di due spezie ne abbiam noi,
n?
di niuna crudi mangiamo. L?una ? de? men communi e pi? grossi, li
quali
son tutti o bianchi over macchiati di rosso e di nero. L?altra
spezie
? de? pi? minuti e tutti bianchi con un occhio nero nel
ventre.
I primi si nominano turcheschi, li quali ascendono molto in
alto;
per? chi non gli pianta vicino alle siepi conviene, volendone
aver
molto frutto, piantarvi a canto de? rami di fronde secchi, a?
quali
appiccandosi possano in alto montare; e perch? portano una
bella
foglia verde, le donne in Italia e spezialmente in Vinezia, ove
son
molto vaghe dell?ombra e della verdura e ancora per poter dalle
finestre
loro vagheggiare i viandanti senza da coloro esser esse
vedute,
usano di porre su le finestre delle camere loro alcune
cassette
di legno lunghe quanto ? larga la finestra,
n?
pi? larga d?una buona spanna e piene d?ottima terra; in quella
piantano
dieci o dodici di que? fagiuoli a luna crescente di febraio
o
di marzo o d?aprile, e poi con bastoncin bianchi vi formano una
vaga
grata alla quale essi s?attaccano, s? che d?una piacevole ombra
tutta
la finestra adombrano. Gli ortolani ancora ne? colti loro fanno
siepi
di canne o di bastoni bianchi della canape, a canto alle quali
piantano
quantit? di simile legume, e cos? vengono alla vista a
rendere
i loro orti pi? vaghi e maggior coppia di fagiuoli
raccolgono.
I baccelli adunque di questo legume, mentre son verdi e
teneri,
n? alla lor perfetta grandezza pervenuti, cocendoli tutti
intieri
e acconciandoli come de? lupuli ho mostrato, son molto buoni.
Secchi
poi se ne fanno buone minestre, cocendogli in ottimo brodo.
On
turkish beans.
In
the past season I have given full account of the fava been
fresh
or dried, now I shall give an account of the fagioli (bean)
fruit
or legume very similar to that tasted, and the two species we
have
no-one eats raw. The one is less common and is larger, it is
all
white or flecked with pink and red. The other species is much
smaller
and is all white with a black eye in the middle. The first
we
call Turkish, it grows very tall, so you should grow them against
a
trellis, or if you want a lot of fruit (a good crop) plant them
against
dried sticks or branches, the which fasten themselves tightly
to
it so they can raise themselves up. Because the they have
beautiful
green leaves, the women in Italy, especially in Venice,
where
there is much longing for shade and of greenery and also to be
able
to have the windows desireable to passers by without color being
lost,
They place around the windows of their rooms several wooden
boxes,
as long as the width of the window, if not
larger
by a good span, and full of good dirt. In this they plant
tent
or twelve of these beans in the new moon of February or March or
April.
Then with white sticks they make a rough trellis to which
these
attach themselves, and this creates a pleasant shade over all
the
windows so adorned. The market gardners still collect canes from
the
hedgrows or white sticks from the hemp, against which they plant
a
number of these same beans. And thus they come to make the view of
their
garden more desirable and also collect more beans. The bean
pod
of this bean, when it is young and tender, is at it's most
perfect
point, cook them all intact and dress them as I have
described
for hop sprouts *, and they are very good. When they dry
one
can make good dishes (minestre), cooking them in the best broth.
*
- ben bene sgocciolata in un piatto netto posta, con sale, con
assai
olio, con poco aceto, od in suo luogo succo di limone, e un
poco
di pepe franto e non polverizzato l?acconciamo - very well
drained
in a clean plate with salt, enough oil and a little vinegar,
or
in place of that lemon juice, and a little cracked but not
powdered
pepper we dress them.
<<<
--Anne-Marie:..if you want a period veggie instead of the new world
haricots, I highly
>
recommend the "new peas in the pod", <> you can often
find frozen sugar
>
snap peas (much tastier than the snow
>
peas) in the frozen veggie section.<
Yeah,
sounds better too! I happened to find "enough" bags of
green beans on
sale
{2 lbs./$1.00} at a store going out of business. And have been
worrying
myself about their quality ever since. Since the seating capacity
of
the hall is being limited to 60 diners, I am willing to keep the
green
beans
for myself. Shoot, I should open a bag tonight . . . . Caointiarn
>>>
Date: Mon, 12 May 2008
14:04:36 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway
<johnnae at mac.com>
Subject: Re:
[Sca-cooks] Vegetables and are you all still there?
To: Cooks within the
SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
And here we can once
more tell everyone that the award winning
BEANS A History by Ken
Albala is well worth the price. Old world beans
versus new world ...
it's all in there.
Johnnae
Date:
Mon, 12 May 2008 13:35:00 -0500
From:
"Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Vegetables and are you all still there?
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at
lists.ansteorra.org>
<<<
While
it appears that some New World beans were adopted by Europeans in
the
16th C. (i'm not sure which ones... Bear? Adamantius? Anyone
else?)...
--
Urtatim
(that's err-tah-TEEM)
the
persona formerly known as Anahita >>>
This
research paper at the Colonial Williamsburg website is worth looking
over
http://www.history.org/history/CWLand/resrch2.cfm . It's in the
Gardening
> Research area of the site. There are a number of other plants
covered
in other papers.
You
might also find Bermejo and Leon's "Neglected Crops from 1492 a
different
perspective" of interest.
http://www.fao.org/docrep/t0646e/T0646E00.HTM
Bear
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008
12:59:07 -0400
From: euriol <euriol
at ptd.net>
Subject: Re:
[Sca-cooks] Wanted: Bean Recipes
To: Cooks within the
SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Here are three recipes
from Marx Rumpolt (courtesy of
http://clem.mscd.edu/~grasse/GK_veggie1.htm):
19. Beans cooked with
beef broth and bacon/ that is cut small
also with green
welltasting herbs/ that are chopped small.
20. Roman beans [fava
beans] you can prepare on a meat day/ shells [skins]
included with a beef
broth/ ginger and butter. But if it is on a fast day/
so cook it with
peabroth/ pepper and butter
so they become lovely
and good.
21. You can also fry
beans with bacon/ so they become good and welltasting.
I have cooked recipe
21 a couple of times. I cook 1 pound of bacon until
crispy leaving the
drippings in the pan and draining the bacon on a towel.
I then add 3 cans of
garbanzo beans (chickpeas) which have been rinsed and
drained to the bacon
fat, until the chickpeas get slightly browned. This
was very popular mixed
with the roasted onion salad I prepared for a feast
3 years ago. The
reason I choose chickpeas was one of my friends asked me
not to use fava beans.
Euriol
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008
11:26:10 -0400
From: "Nick
Sasso" <grizly at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re:
[Sca-cooks] Wanted: Bean Recipes
To: "Cooks within
the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
#41 Fasoli
Coce li fasoli in aqua
pura ho in bono brood; he quando serano cotti, tole
cipolle tagliate
suttile he frigele in patella [f? 15r} cum bono olio he
mette de sopra queste
cipolle fritte cum pipero he canella he zaffrano; poi
lassali reposare sopra
las cinere calda uno peza; et poi fa le menestre cum
specie bone de sopra.
Kidney Beans (#41)
Cook the kidney beans
in pure water or good broth; wheny they are cooked,
get finely sliced
onions and fry them in a pan with good oil and put these
fried onions on top
[of the beans] along with pepper, cinnamon and saffron;
then let this sit a
while on the hot coals; dish it up with good spices on
top.
ORIGINAL TEXT &
TRANSLATION
Scully, T. (2000).
Cuoco Napoletano - The Neapolitan Recipe
Collection: a
critical edition and English translation.
Ann Arbor:
University of Michigan Press.)
Niccolo's Recipe
Serves 6 to 8
1 pound fields peas,
crowder peas, black-eyed peas, or similar
1 medium onion, sliced
thin
1 tsp black pepper
1 1/2 tsp cinnamon
10 strands saffron
crushed steeped in 1/4 cup very warm broth
Cook Kidney beans in
water or broth until just tender (or use high quality
canned). Fry sliced
onions in a pan with oil; add saffron and remove from
heat immediately. Put
the beans in single layer in a shallow casserole; on
top of the beans
sprinkle with black pepper, cinnamon and then
onions/saffron spread
evenly on top. for larger quantities, layer beans and
onions alternately.
Bake at 350F for about 30 minutes.
Date:
Thu, 14 Aug 2008 13:18:13 -0400
From:
"Sharon R. Saroff" <sindara at pobox.com>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] Pinto bean recipe
To:
Christiane <christianetrue at earthlink.net>, Cooks within the
SCA
<sca-cooks
at lists.ansteorra.org>
Traditional
Jewish Sabbath stew known as Cholent, Hamim, and Dafina
(and
other names) is a dish of basically meat and beans with some
kind
of grain. Ashkanzi Jews (Eastern Europe) usually use meat,
barley,
beans and some root veggies, while Sephardic uses chickpeas,
lamb,
rice or bulger, pumpkin and later sweet potato. There is a
recipe
in A Drizzle of Honey. I have found several others.
Sindara
Date:
Thu, 26 Feb 2009 22:58:00 -0500
From:
Robin Carroll-Mann <rcarrollmann at gmail.com>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] A Question of Dried Beans
To: Cooks within the
SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
On Thu, Feb 26, 2009
at 10:49 PM, Mairi Ceilidh <jjterlouw at earthlink.net> wrote:
<<< Can
someone point me toward period sources that discuss or describe
soaking dried beans or
peas prior to cooking? >>>
Here's one.
From the Menagier de
Paris:
"OLD BEANS which
are to be cooked with their pods must be soaked and
put on the fire in a
pot the evening before and all night; then throw
out that water,
and put to cook in another water..."
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Medieval/Cookbooks/Menagier/Menagier.html
--
Brighid
ni Chiarain
My
NEW email is rcarrollmann at gmail.com
Date:
Tue, 12 Apr 2011 13:35:59 -0500
From:
Sayyeda al-Kaslaania <samia at idlelion.net>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
[Sca-cooks] converting to gluten free
I
wonder if someone more experienced with gluten free cooking can talk
about
how best to make this gluten free? Could I substitute xanthan gum
and
water for the sourdough? I figure I need to play with it, but I'm
hoping
not to re-invent a wheel. :)
Sayyeda
al-Kaslaania
*******************
Counterfeit
(Vegetarian) Isf?riy? of Garbanzos
Andalusian
p. A-1
Pound
some garbanzos, take out the skins and grind them into flour. And
take
some of the flour and put into a bowl with a bit of sourdough and
some
egg, and beat with spices until it's all mixed. Fry it as before in
thin
cakes, and make a sauce for them.
1
c chickpea flour
4
t cinnamon
?
c sourdough
?
c cilantro, chopped
4
eggs
?
t salt
2
t pepper
garlic
sauce:
2
t coriander
3
cloves garlic
16
threads saffron
2
T oil
2
t cumin
2
T vinegar
[snipped]
Crush the garlic in a garlic press, combine with vinegar and
oil,
beat together to make sauce. Combine the flour, sourdough, eggs,
spices
and beat with a fork to a uniform batter. Fry in about ? c oil in
a
9? frying pan at medium high temperature until brown on both sides,
turning
once. Add more oil as necessary. Drain on a paper towel. Serve
with
sauce. Note: The ingredients for the sauce are from ?A Type of
Ahrash
[Isf?riy?]? (p. 96) which is from the same cookbook. What is done
with
them is pure conjecture.
How
to Milk an Almond Stuff an Egg And Armor a Turnip: A Thousand Years
of
Recipes
By
David Friedman and Elizabeth Cook ISBN: 978-1-460-92498-3
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Medieval/To_Milk_an_Almond.pdf
Date:
Tue, 12 Apr 2011 18:40:05 +0000
From:
yaini0625 at yahoo.com
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at
lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] converting to gluten free
Does
this recipe require a sourdough starter or actual sourdough bread?
If
it calls for sourdough bread and you don't want to make a loaf of
gluten free bread try Udi's brand bread- not Rudi's.
For
sourdough starter we have experimented with rice flour, xanthum gum,
yeast and water. It doesn't have the same traditional "sour"
taste as sourdough bread but it was good.
Aelina
the Saami
Date:
Sat, 8 Oct 2011 22:07:19 -0400
From:
Sharon Palmer <ranvaig at columbus.rr.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] cannellini beans
<<<
Anyone know if these [cannellini beans] are period and what a good
substitute may be?
Thank
you, De >>>
Like
all Phaseolus vulgaris, cannellini beans are New World and not
period.
I
don't think there really is a substitute, a recipe that calls for
them
would be out of period too.
Better
to look for a recipe with garbanzos, black eyed peas, favas or
one
of the other old world beans
Ranvaig
Date:
Sat, 08 Oct 2011 23:12:00 -0400
From:
Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] cannellini beans
Actually
in the case of the beans, the New World post Columbus Voyages
of
Discovery beans were adopted
into
European cuisine and gardens in the 16th century. (Period extends
to
1600, doesn't it?)
One
of the problems with the beans in various European countries is
that
new beans
often
just supplanted the old and kept the same name as the old.
Here
again I recommend Ken Albala's award winning book Beans A History.
We've
mentioned Professor Janick's work at Purdue before with regard
to
his work at the Villa Farnesina in Italy and the New World plants
that
are depicted there.
Albala
mentions that the Phaseolus beans can be found in the festoons
and
swags of various paintings in the villa.
Perhaps
Baroness Helewyse's paper below will help you with suitable
16th
century recipes.
A
time for change : new world foods in old world menus. This was the
class
I did for Pennsic 35 in 2006, discussing the spread and use of
various
new world foods (squash, beans, turkey, corn) and the lack of
spread
of the tomato into 16th century Italy.
http://www.medievalcookery.com/helewyse/
Johnnae
Date:
Sun, 9 Oct 2011 18:09:18 -0700 (PDT)
From:
Honour Horne-Jaruk <jarukcomp at yahoo.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] cannellini beans
Respected friends:
--- On Sat, 10/8/11,
Sharon Palmer <ranvaig at columbus.rr.com> wrote:
<<< Like all
Phaseolus vulgaris, cannellini beans are New World
and not period.
I don't think there
really is a substitute, a recipe that
calls for them would
be out of period too.
Better to look for a
recipe with garbanzos, black eyed
peas, favas or one of
the other old world beans
Ranvaig >>>
If it's the flavor
that matters, the closest match is going to be _peeled_ garbanzo
beans- tedious, but do-able. All the old world true beans except
Favas
went extinct through non-cultivation when Phaseolus vulgaris came in,
so there are a fair number of period bean recipes for which such
substitution is your only option. You can't use favas both because of
their very strong, earthy taste and because of a nasty little
biological trick we played on ourselves, called favism, where a
dangerous reaction to undercooked or raw favas developed as a
protection against malaria and then went way overboard.
Yours
in service to both the Societies of which I am a member-
(Friend)
Honour Horne-Jaruk, R.S.F.
Alizaundre
de Brebeuf, C.O.L. S.C.A.- AKA Una the wisewoman, or That Pict
Date:
Mon, 10 Oct 2011 00:58:21 -0500
From:
"otsisto" <otsisto at socket.net>
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at
lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] cannellini beans
Thank
you for some directions. Cannellini is a white bean and some sources
that
I have found say the great northern and navy are substitutes. The
recipe
is a cannellini torta which one source has the bean as far back as
Roman
times but most others pretty much have it in Peru and making it's way
to
the Italian states around late 1400s and into the 1500s. The original
recipe
that got me curious has no claims of historic origins but when I
looked
in other sources of a similar recipe, they claimed to be adaptations
of
a renaissance recipe. Of coarse, no citations.
I
figured that it is modern but I wanted to see if by chance it could
have
been
in SCA period. The original recipe that started my quest has cocoa
and
vanilla,
the "renaissance ones have cinnamon and almonds instead but
everything
else is the same.
As
weirdness would have it, I received my "La Cucina Italiana
magazine
today.
It has an article on beans and bean recipes. Their cannellini torta
is
called "Flan dolce di cannellini con ricotta e cacao" :)
Thank
you again for the help. I will be making both recipes one day just to
see
what they taste like.
De
Date:
Mon, 10 Oct 2011 14:34:29 -0400
From:
Sharon Palmer <ranvaig at columbus.rr.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re:
[Sca-cooks] cannellini beans
<<< Thank you
for some directions. Cannellini is a white bean and some sources
that I have found say
the great northern and navy are substitutes. >>>
Navy and great
northern are also New World beans, which are (as
Johnna corrected me)
only period in a few places, late in period, as
novelties. Certainly
not Roman.
I've never seen any
history for the various varieties of new world
beans or how old they
are. I suspect that they date to before the
beans came to Europe.
I don't think anyone knows what variety the
earliest beans in
Europe were, and doubt there is any reason to
consider one New World
bean as more period than another.
<<< The
recipe is a cannellini
torta which one source has the bean as far back as
Roman times but most
others pretty much have it in Peru and making it's way
to the Italian states
around late 1400s and into the 1500s. >>>
The new beans were
given the same name as the old ones, and used in
the same recipes. It
is *possible* that your recipe is old and was
was originally made
with one of the Old world beans.
I
checked the index of Apicus for "bean" and "torta"
and don't see
anything
like this. The notes say that one word now
associated
with
beans, actually meant peas then. Apicus isn't the only Roman
cookbook,
and it would help to know the exact title of the original
recipe.
Ranvaig
Date:
Thu, 13 Oct 2011 01:36:49 -0400
From:
Sharon Palmer <ranvaig at columbus.rr.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] peas vs. beans
Ranvaig commented:
<<< I checked
the index of Apicus for "bean" and "torta" and
don't see
anything like this.
The notes say that one word now associated
with beans, actually
meant peas then. >>>
So what determines
whether something is considered a bean and when
it is considered a
pea? Now and in period?
===================
I found a couple of
modern answers:
Beans are of the genus
Phaseolus.
Peas are of the genus
Pisum.
peas have tendrils and
beans do not
peas have a hollow
stem and beans have a solid stem.
In general peas have
slick vines and beans have hairy vines that enable
them to cling.
Bean is used for a lot
of different
things and usually
tagged by shape.
In period, it will
depend on the language too. Or are you only
asking about English?
Ranvaig
Date:
Fri, 21 Oct 2011 18:05:00 -0500
From:
"Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>
To:
"Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at
lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] peas vs. beans
Ranvaig commented:
<<< I checked
the index of Apicus for "bean" and "torta" and
don't see
anything like this.
The notes say that one word now associated
with beans, actually
meant peas then. >>>
So what determines
whether something is considered a bean and when it is
considered a pea? Now
and in period?
Stefan
============
I'm
far removed from my references at the moment, but I would suggest
taking
a
look in Pliny's Natural Histories for a basic take on beans and peas
in
Antiquity.
That being said, the terms "pea" and "bean"
are not
scientifically
precise and may through usage apply to various seeds that are
not
taxonomically peas or beans. The black-eyed pea, for example,
is called
a
pea in English, but is placed with beans in Italian, and being a
member of
genus
Vigna is truly neither a pea nor a bean but is related to both.
For
differentiation in most of period, I believe you will find that most
of
the
peas available were of the sort that divide in two producing split
peas,
while
the beans retained their unity.
If
you want to duck the entire issue, divide the collection of messages
by
age
and label them "legumes-1-msg", "legumes-2-msg",
etc.
Bear
Date:
Tue, 25 Oct 2011 00:09:22 -0400
From:
Sharon Palmer <ranvaig at columbus.rr.com>
To:
Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject:
Re: [Sca-cooks] peas vs. beans
<<< The
black-eyed pea, for example, is called a pea in English, but is
placed with beans in
Italian, and being a member of genus Vigna is
truly neither a pea
nor a bean but is related to both. >>>
Old world Aduki and
mung "beans" are also Vigna.
<<< For
differentiation in most of period, I believe you will find that
most of the peas
available were of the sort that divide in two
producing split peas,
while the beans retained their unity. >>>
I'm
not sure this is a valid distinction. Split peas are the result
of
a milling operation, but beans can be split too. I'm not sure
how
common
it was to have peas milled in period
Rumpolt
has numerous recipes for peas, all of them for unmilled peas,
because
it tells you to remove the hull. Sometimes by soaking in lye
and
washing the hulls off, some by cooking with the hull and pressing
through
a sieve, leaving the hull behind. I tried this once, and
it
looked
and tasted exactly like common split peas.
There
is a bean recipe that tells you to remove the hull too.
Rumpolt's
"Bonen" is likely black eyed peas.
Ranvaig
<the
end>