cppr-utn-care-msg - 8/21/09 Care and cleaning of utensils made of copper. NOTE: See also the files: bone-utn-care-msg, horn-utn-care-msg, iron-pot-care-msg, lea-cook-uten-msg, pottery-cookng-msg, wood-utn-care-msg, potry-utn-care-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ Date: Thu, 04 Sep 2008 12:18:04 -0700 From: Dragon Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Speaking of tinned, copper cookware To: Cooks within the SCA Jennifer Carlson did speak thusly: <<< DOES anyone know a tinker? Or a company that does such work? I have a beautiful little Danish saucepan on 6-inch legs that I would love to use, but the tin lining has oxidized and flaked in spots. >>> ---------------- End original message. --------------------- The melting point of tin is only 450F so it is also not extremely difficult to do. (And this is also the reason why you NEVER want a tinned copper pot to go dry, it can easily exceed that 450F in a very short span of time. The basic process is not overly difficult. Do this outside with proper fire protection. So... first you need to thoroughly clean the inside of the pot until it is shiny. You don't have to remove all of the tin that is there but all flaky stuff and any organic matter must be gone. Use fine steel wool to smooth it out and give it a satin finish. Then you want to thoroughly degrease it because oils can prevent the tin from adhering. Use naphtha to do that and then do not touch the surface to be tinned with your bare skin again. (Use gloves when handling the naphtha and remember it is VERY flammable). Next you must melt the tin, use an old aluminum pot you don't care about. Heat the pot to be tinned to 450F. Use an infrared thermometer to check it or do it in the oven if you know your oven to be accurate. Heating the pot gives you more working time as the tin won't solidify quite as fast. Once the pot is heated and the tin is melted, you must work quickly. Apply flux to the entire inside of the pot to be tinned. Use a brush with natural bristles that won't melt. The type of brush-on flux used for plumbing joints on copper pipe is perfectly adequate for this. Use a clean putty knife or spoon to remove the dross (the crud that forms on top of the tin). Just quickly scrape it away and remove it. Quickly pour some of the tin into the pot to be coated and swirl it around to coat the entire inside and then pour out the excess. You should now have a nicely tinned pot. If any spots did not get properly coated, you can usually fix them without having to redo the entire pot. Use your steel wool to buff out the pot, degrease as before. Heat just the problem area with a propane torch, apply flux and then some tin with a small spoon. Dragon Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 16:08:29 -0400 From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Speaking of tinned, copper cookware To: "Cooks within the SCA" I have no experience at tinning pots, but you may be interested to read some period advice on using newly tinned cookware. This is from the recipe for blancmange in the _Libro de Guisados_ by Ruperto de Nola, 1529. "...then put all this in the pot, but it should not be of copper or newly tinned, because it will absorb the flavor of the tin, although commonly it is made by most cooks in very bright saucepans without tin, but if it has been recently tinned, boil a lot of bread in it, and sweat it very well, because all the flavor will come out of the tin..." (translation mine) Blancmange being a delicately-flavored dish of chicken breast and rice, I suppose it would be more susceptible to picking up metallic overtones than other, more heavily spiced dishes. -- Brighid ni Chiarain My NEW email is rcarrollmann at gmail.com Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 13:32:20 -0500 From: Judith Epstein Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA Copper pots can be cleaned by dipping a lemon in salt and rubbing. If there are little bits that you can't get rid of that way, use a cleaning toothbrush and more lemon juice; the salt is mostly there for abrasion rather than its chemical properties anyway. On Aug 13, 2009, at 1:31 PM, Cheri or Anne wrote: <<< I have just bought a 'lot' of old kitchen items (very cool). One is an old copper pot, it's round and has the hook still attached on the handle for hanging over a fire. The handle is rusted and upon opening the box I discover that while the pot is in good shape there is the green of neglected copper inside the pot. Now I know this is poisonous to ingest so what would I have to have done to the pot in order to make it usable for cooking? Anne >>> Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 12:32:58 -0600 From: Susan Lin Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA You can clean it with a mixture of salt, lemon juice and bicarbonate of soda for a start. Just make a paste and work it in. Shoshanna Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 14:00:18 -0600 From: Georgia Foster Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA I use white vinegar and salt ... same thing as the lemon and salt but a LOT cheaper. Malkin Otherhill Artemisia Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 16:10:12 -0400 From: Saint Phlip Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA Regardless of which acid you use, the pot will be safe to eat out of as long as there's no visible green. You're not talking an immediate, deadly poison here, that a microgram of which will drop you deader than a doornail in seconds, but a mild poison that would require a fair amount to make you ill, let alone dead, barring an unusual allergy that would require that you not use copperware in the first place. If a copper pot looks clean, it's safe to eat out of. -- Saint Phlip Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 17:13:54 -0400 From: Saint Phlip Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA If there's THAT much verdigris, rather than scrubbing, let it soak in heated vinegar for a while, and spend an afternoon doing other chores, and giving it an occasional scrubbing until it comes clean. Elbow grease is wondrous stuff, and can't be beaten for some applications, but lazy blacksmiths have long learned the uses of heat for stimulating various chemical reactions ;-) On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 4:21 PM, Cheri or Anne wrote: <<< It's going to take a lot to clean it to where there is not visible green :) Isn't what vinegar will do amazing? Anne >>> -- Saint Phlip Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 14:20:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Cheri or Anne Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: Cooks within the SCA Yes, there was that much :). But oh! the vinegar/salt is doing wonders. It's all out except the really bad spots in the inside curves and I've tilted the pot and am letting it soak now. If it's still being stubborn, I'll heat it up a bit....I'll show it who's boss around here! Anne From: Saint Phlip <<< If there's THAT much verdigris, rather than scrubbing, let it soak in heated vinegar for a while, and spend an afternoon doing other chores, and giving it an occasional scrubbing until it comes clean. Elbow grease is wondrous stuff, and can't be beaten for some applications, but lazy blacksmiths have long learned the uses of heat for stimulating various chemical reactions ;-) >>> Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 17:52:23 -0500 From: Betsy Marshall Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Old copper pot needs TLC To: 'Cooks within the SCA' <<< If there's THAT much verdigris, rather than scrubbing, let it soak in heated vinegar for a while, and spend an afternoon doing other chores, and giving it an occasional scrubbing until it comes clean. Elbow grease is wondrous stuff, and can't be beaten for some applications, but lazy blacksmiths have long learned the uses of heat for stimulating various chemical reactions ;-) >>> And if that doesn't work- sand paper (400-1200 grit available at hardware-auto stores)) or steel wool will remove almost any raised area of corrosion, I also have one of the industrial kitchen scrubbers that looks like a big snarl of metal foil strips- works a treat on stubborn gunk. Be sure to wash and rinse copiously afterwards! HTH, Betsy Edited by Mark S. Harris cppr-utn-care-msg Page 5 of 5