sotelties-msg - 3/29/05 Sotelties and Warners - decorated food.Medieval food presented in an ornamental way. Disguised food. Food sculptures. NOTE: See also these files: sugar-paste-msg, Warners-art, gingerbread-msg, sugar-msg, Sugarplums-art, Roses-a-Sugar-art, marzipan-msg, pig-heads-msg, Chastlete-art, endoring-msg, Sugar-Icing-art, molded-foods-msg. (Warners are disguised food. Sotelties are sculptures made from edible ingredients but not always intended to be eaten or even safe to eat) ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ From: caradoc at enet.net (John Groseclose) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Edible stained glass Date: Sun, 13 Nov 1994 20:43:53 -0700 mscholte at nyx10.cs.du.EDU (marion scholten) wrote: > A member of my Shire remembers a recipe for edible stained glass. If anyone has it could you please email it to me. Thanks > > M'Lord Marion Lang Boogschutter - Seneshal > Shire of Border Vale Keep > Kingdom of Atlantia If you've any experience making hard candies, it's easy. All you need to do is melt a lot of sugar with a little corn syrup and boil it until it reaches "hard crack" (IE: when you drip it into cold water, it IMMEDIATELY gets hard and brittle. I make a Scottish candy called "gundy" from molasses and honey, flavoring it with aniseed or horehound, depending on my taste at the time. As soon as I can find my recipe, I'll post it for you. To make the "stained glass" effect, simply mix coloring into the candy before pouring it into a buttered pan, or carefully fold it into the candy immediately after pouring. In the local Barony (Sundragon, K. of Atenveldt) my lady has become reknowned for her baklava (middle Eastern pastry of thin dough, nuts, and honey.) Between the two of us, several households seem to be needing longer belts. :) She also makes *astounding* cheesecakes. -- John D. Groseclose From: mchance at crl.com (Michael A. Chance) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Edible stained glass Date: 13 Nov 1994 20:15:25 -0800 caradoc at enet.net (John Groseclose) writes: >If you've any experience making hard candies, it's easy. All you need to >do is melt a lot of sugar with a little corn syrup and boil it until it >reaches "hard crack" (IE: when you drip it into cold water, it IMMEDIATELY >gets hard and brittle. >To make the "stained glass" effect, simply mix coloring into the candy >before pouring it into a buttered pan, or carefully fold it into the candy >immediately after pouring. John is essentially correct, and this is the basic recipe that my lady has used for many years. I would only add a very important warning: BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL WHEN MAKING GLASS CANDY! The temperature of boiling sugar is extremely high, and will cause serious burns if it comes in contact with skin. Worse, it will stick to your skin worse than napalm, causing even more severe burning until removed or it cools. Even with extra precautions, my lady inevitably gets at least a couple of spot burns from the candy boiling and spitting every time she makes it. She puts up with it because it gets such rave reviews every time she creates subtleties that make use of glass candy. Of course, she not only colors the candy, she flavors it as well. By all means, make glass candy. Just be careful when you do. Mikjal Annarbjorn -- Michael A. Chance St. Louis, Missouri, USA "At play in the fields Work: mc307a at sw1stc.sbc.com of St. Vidicon" Play: mchance at crl.com From: meadhbhni at aol.com (Meadhbhni) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Edible stained glass Date: 14 Nov 1994 09:40:08 -0500 I remember that the meridian A & S newsletter had an article about edible stained glass a few years ago. you might see if they have that article on file. unfortunately, i don't remember which issue of seasons it was in. meadhbh ni ruaidh o chonnemara OL, Stargate, Ansteorra From: mugjf at uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Gwyndlyn J Ferguson) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Edible stained glass Date: 14 Nov 1994 15:22:47 GMT Question about edible stained glass in previous posting: A non-period (or is it?) method that I have used for Christmas cookies is to get hard candies in various colors (sour balls work well) and smash them up. The I use them with sugar cookies or gingerbread. You cut holes in the rolled cookie dough where you want the "glass" to go. Then you sprinkle in the color of candy that you want and bake as usual. **It is important to use foil under the cookies, and watch the cookies closely to avoid burning the "glass". Stained glass cookies have been one of my favorites for a long time. :) Gwyndlyn (ne: Rhiannon) Caer Vyrddin Lochmorrow-Middle Gwyn Ferguson Western Illinois University mugjf at bgu.edu From: ddfr at aol.com (DDFr) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Gingerbread Castle Help Date: 25 Dec 1995 01:02:32 -0500 1. Elaborate food sculptures, called subtleties, are in period, including ones that are castles. 2. What we call gingerbread is, I believe, period but not medieval. I think it comes in in the sixteenth century, although I do not know sixteenth century cooking well enough to be sure of that. 3. The 14th and 15th century English cookbooks have something called gingerbread. It is easy to make, tasty, and could be used to construct a castle. But it is utterly unlike what we call gingerbread--the texture is more like a fudge. It is made of honey, breadcrumbs, ginger, pepper, and saunders (at least, those are the ingredients in the recipe I use). Hope this helps. If you can find my Miscellany on the Web (I don't know the URL--someone else webbed it) it has a recipe for medieval gingerbread. David/Cariadoc From: alysk at ix.netcom.com(Elise Fleming ) Newsgroups: rec.food.historic,rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Pickled Lemons Date: 21 Jan 1997 01:14:34 GMT L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt writes: >I am searching for a source (unredacted) that will have directions for >making Pickled Lemons and the other sorts of things that might be >strewn upon a grand Elizabethan Salad. Robert May, _The Accomplisht Cook, 4th edition, 1678, has "To pickle Lemons" and says simply "Boil them in water and salt, and put them up with white-wine." May also includes a number of things for "sallats" which would include the grand sallat. You may want to search out a copy. Ditto for Gervase Markham's _The English Housewife_, 1615, as edited by Michael Best. This you might find in a library. He includes a number of salad ideas including carving carrots into fantastic shapes and making "strange sallats" with flowers composed of parts of vegetables. May would be an excellent resource. Elise/Alys From: Mark Schuldenfrei To: sca-cooks at eden.com Subject: sca-cooks Re: New member to the list Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 09:01:30 -0400 (EDT) What's a solteltie? Rita Food that is decorated, or which is made to resemble that which it is not. For example: a castle made of sugar paste: or a gilded pig. A model of a deer with an arrow in it's side, which pours wine out of the hole when the arrow is removed. Stuff like that. Brigdet Henisch wrote "Fast and Feast" (which I reviewed for _Serve_It_Forth_) and which has a whole wonderful chapter on sotelties. In fact, let me quote the first paragraph of my review... So, should a Society cook read a book that doesn't have recipes? Yes, it seems we should. "Fast and Feast" is well researched and indexed book covering everything about food and foodways customs from late period, except the details of redactions. It is also fun to read (I laughed out loud several times), well indexed and copiously footnoted, and reasonably priced (I paid $14.95) My wife has made a number of sotelties, including figurines especially: models of the Crown of the East granting a Laurel to our friend Master Aquel, the Baron and Baroness of our group leading a dance procession of three other couples, and so forth. She has also made someone's arms in colored sugar plate in the form of stained glass, a marzipan scroll, and so forth. I particularly treasure the sugar paste box she made to celebrate one award that I received. Tibor From: Beth Morris To: sca-cooks at eden.com Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:19:28 -0400 Subject: Re: sca-cooks - subtleties Angelina Capozello wrote: > I would love to see some recipes for subtilities! I've seen them > mentioned in novels, and know they often involve marzipan, but i've never > actually seen one. Any help or recipes you have would be great! There are descriptions of many of them in the front "menu" sections of many of the surviving cookbooks. They aren't so much things that require "recipes" as creations that require 'design'. Many (although not all by a long shot) of them are sweets, precursors (in a bizarre way) of the interestingly shaped novelty cakes of the modern era. Most subtleties (there are at least ten spellings of the word too) are simply food presented in an ornamental way. Once for a feast I was cooking, a friend made a reasonably accurate replica of the Crac' de Chevalier (the crusader castle) out of shortbread. It was fantastic. Many of the ones described in period are of famous people or religious scenes: the Spirit of God Descending as A Dove or whatever. There's a great one that's easy to do with a small roast (pig is good) with a chicken "riding" on it with little armor (usually a helm and shield) on and a lance. You can make it into a local figure or use an allegorical historical figure through heraldry, etc. A subcategory of this idea is that of illusion foods: foods designed to look like other foods. Another friend makes great illusion eggs by blowing out the real egg, rinsing the shell thoroughly, waxing over the hole in the bottom and filling the shell with an almond milk concoction that sets up a la Jello into a translucent jiggly texture just like hard boiled egg white. Only sweet and almond flavored. They're great! Marzipan is often associated with subtletie construction because it is the "play doh" of desserts and can be molded into anything (and will even go through a Play Doh pumper!). Another regular one is the candy glass Tibor mentioned, and the sugar paste that can be made into glasses, dishes, boxes, etc. Keilyn From: Mark Schuldenfrei To: sca-cooks at eden.com Subject: Re: sca-cooks Subtlety Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 11:06:54 -0400 (EDT) Please don't add to the impression many folk have that subtleties are *only* desserts! One of the most impressive subtleties I ever was served was boneless chicken wrapped in pastry strips (with scalloped edges to look like scales) and baked. Then there is the period recipe, where you remove the skin whole, and stuff the thing with ground meat, and bake. Make for a very easy to carve dinner. And it's a lot of fun to "inflate" the chicken to get the skin off. Subtleties can be made of anything, and served in any course! Yup! One of my favorites was by Mistress Peridot and Baroness Johanna, where they made a salad, and arranged it as a very long "tail" to a peacock, and carved the body of the peacock from some vegetable or another. It was beautiful, impressive, and snazzy. And, tasty. Tibor From: Annejke at prodigy.com (MS MARTHA L WALLENHORST) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 10:40:31, -0500 Subject: SC - subtilties Someone a while back ask me to post some of the subtilites I have done to give people some ideas. I am sorry I haven't gotten to it before but I had a CA to get out and have been very sick this last week. So here goes, this is not all of them, just the one I remember because i either have pictures or I won something or I thought it was really memorable. If you want more info on any of these just ask. I also want to make sure that people understand that some of these were co-projects with my Laurel, but I'm the one that talked her into them (I'm the crazy one of the two). 1977 Crapes with frogs (plastic wind up frogs and one sparking Godzilla monster in the middle of the tray - not period but fun, and the king kept the Godzila windup). 1978 Winter Sleigh (Fantasy Snow Queen Style for a Jan. event in Mich), Made from Short Bread Cookie and icing. about 12" x 4" 1980 Peacock in full Pride (real bird) The serving tray we used was 4' x 3.5' and the tail didn't quiet fit. Pie of frogs (lift the lid and the the little plastic baggers took off across the table) Candied Flower bouquets for the head table so the queen could award them as favors. 1981 Sugar Cube Castle w/ marzipane people (castle form and ingredients were not period but it was served with a sour current pie and meant for people to take a piece and hand grind over the pie if it was too sour for them - it was a great hit!) 2'x 2' x 8" 1982 A Yule log made of Marzipane and Nuget. 14" long 1983 1st Norse church (cake and Icing confection) Birthday Cake done as a piece of music parchment for our Madrigal Directors birthday. Swan (Cake body, cookie wings and tale, marzipane neck with a candied rose in it's gilded beak 1' x 1.5' 1984 Peacock in full pride Dragon (Sweet bread body, neck breast and forelegs were marzipan, decorated with period icing and small hard candies 2' x 1' x 3' tall Doll of Eilzabeth I (body of Marzipane, dress cake, decorated with period icing 12" tall Doll of Mary Queen of Scots (body of Marzipan, dress cake, decorated with period icing 12" tall Cathederal with stainglass windows (Gingerbread with hard crack candy in the windows and a candle inside to light the windows) 2' x 1' x 3' Knight Effigy of the Black Prince (carved Marzipane with period ediable food colorings) 18" long 1985 Lion (carved marzipan on a large tart) 8" long 1986 Spanish flower pots (red clay pots filled with chicken and stuffing with real candied flowers and fruit peel) Stave church (ginger bread) 4' x 3' x 5' 1987 Sugar plate cupes and plates (dinner size) 1988 Sugar plate paltes and clear hard crack goblets Joust (marzipan action figures) 12" tall Dragon (similar as the other but with a pastry body filled with candy for the children) 1989 Norweign Windmill holding the Twelve days of Christmas (gingerbread with marzipan figures and sugar plate cupplings for the rotating stages and gum balls for ball bearings) 4.5' x 3' with each of five blades 18" long 1993 Winged Helmet (Cake and sugar plate) life size 1994 Doll seated in chair (Marzipan body, sugar plate dress, gilded baked marzipan for the chair with hard crack candies set as jewels) 23" tall 1995 Bulls in the castle (Marzipan bulls building a castle out of carmel blocks) 1996 Rialto Bridge (scots fruit cake, carmel blocks, Marzipan) 12" x 2' I hope this helps. Annejke From: Philip & Susan Troy Date: Fri, 06 Jun 1997 09:43:04 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - SC--Forget the Philosophy and COOK, Dammit :) Aoife, busy getting ready for Aethelmarc Crown (cooking, that is, not fighting), wrote: > I once read an MS that gave instuctions to "carve a radish in manner of a > rose" or some wording remarkably similar. I can't find it now, but seem to > remember it was French. Anyone remember this? Anyone else come across > directions to carve vegetables to look like other things? I'm wondering how > old the garnishing art is. I'm not talking about sweets and sotelties here, > just veggies and fruits. The specific reference you mention is one I haven't run across in period. I do know that the idea of a sallet as a showpiece, with the ingredients kept separate and arranged by color, in specific cuts and shapes, goes at least as far back as 16th century England. You'll find such references in Dawson (e.g. Hippes in five partes like an Oken leafe, sliced carrots laid out as a fleur-de-lys), and though 17th century, Markham as well, I believe. The edible garnish goes considerably further back than those sources, with the various sugared seed, fried onion/almond, pomegranite kernel, and flower garnishes for pottages. Then, of course, you have your ubiquitous Saracen's Head done in pistacchio nuts ; ). Then you have actual subtleties, which often contained, or consisted of, an edible garnish. I SUSPECT that the carved veg idea, at least in the West, may date from somebody like Careme (c. 1800). He had been an architecture student before apprenticing to a pastry cook, and used to spend his copious (ha!) free time at the library where the architecture books were kept, and used to bring back sketches for the boss to translate into cakes. When he eventually became a chef de cuisine, he carried the art form into his new medium. Adamantius From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 15:52:54 -0500 (CDT) Subject: SC - Carved Vegetables Greetings! Someone asked about documentation for carved vegetables. Gervase Markham, _The English Housewife_, 1615 has "Sallats for show only." It says, "Now for sallats for show only, and the adorning and setting out of a table with numbers of dishes, they be those which are made of carrot roots of sundry colours wel boiled, and cut out into many shapes and proportions, as some into knots, some in the manner of scutcheons and arms, some like birds, and some like wild beasts, according to the art and cunning of the workman; and these for the most part are seasoned with vinegar, oil, and a little pepper..." Hope this helps! Alys Katharine From: Philip & Susan Troy Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 19:14:02 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - Carved Vegetables Elise Fleming wrote: > Greetings! Someone asked about documentation for carved vegetables. > Gervase Markham, _The English Housewife_, 1615 has "Sallats for show > only." It says, "Now for sallats for show only, and the adorning and > setting out of a table with numbers of dishes, they be those which are > made of carrot roots of sundry colours wel boiled, and cut out into > many shapes and proportions, as some into knots, some in the manner of > scutcheons and arms, some like birds, and some like wild beasts, > according to the art and cunning of the workman; and these for the most > part are seasoned with vinegar, oil, and a little pepper..." Hope this > helps! > > Alys Katharine Hey! That's interesting...Why, if they are "for show only", are they seasoned with the things that are used for salads meant to be eaten? Is there another possible interpretation of the expression, "for show only" that I'm not considering? I suppose some sharp-eyed types might be able to look at a "show" sallat and say, "Yo! There's no vinegar and pepper on this puppy! What kind of a banquet is this, anyway?" Display foods through the centuries have often been of an inedible nature, which is why they were for show only. These could include the lacquered leftovers sometimes used to pad the menu at Imperial Chinese banquets (and kept well out of reach of the guests), wax fruit, wax or plastic tempura in the windows of some Japanese restaurants, and the modern repertoire of the food stylist (e.g. instant mashed potatoes and Elmer's glue for vanilla ice cream). Does the expression mean they are only for special, "showy" occasions? What do people think about this? Adamantius From: "Sharon L. Harrett" Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 15:07:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - Carved Vegetables On Tue, 10 Jun 1997, Mark Schuldenfrei wrote: > Hey! That's interesting...Why, if they are "for show only", are they > seasoned with the things that are used for salads meant to be eaten? > > So they look like food... > > You must have seen the many loaves of bread in restaurants, carved and > baked into fantastic shapes, that are not for consumption... so that the > next person can see them.... Or, how cruise ships take some of their > chocolate sculptures for the midnight buffets, and keep them in the freezer > for re-use each week? > > Surely, if cared for well, those carved carrots could be reused for several > days in a row, of maybe longer. Maybe he meant just what he said: make it > look like food, but don't eat it: because you could use it for the next > batch of guests, tomorrow. > > Tibor Hi folks! Found a bit more on the garnisher's art....the Book of Kerving (Wynken de Worde, 1509) is the earliest I've been able to discover,, but unfortunately, have only quotes in recent books from it, so I don't know if it included fruits and veggies. In L'Escole Parfaites des Officiers de Bouche (1662there were pages of designs for whittling fruits into fanciful designs, as well as explicit diagrams for carving and serving meats and other dishes at the table. I have been able to find two illustrations from this book, detailing 12 designs for pears and two for oranges. If anyone knows where I might be able to find copies of either of these books, I'd love to know. Ceridwen From: Emily Epstein Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:38:34 -0600 (MDT) Subject: Re: SC - Carved Vegetables Greetings from Alix Mont de fer. I can't help with L'ecole Parfait at the moment, but both the 1508 and 1513 editions of the Boke of Kervynge are on reel I-4 (reel 4 of the first shipment) of UMI's Early English Books, discussed in this forum earlier. Reel numbering at the beginning of the series is a little odd, so you might get the wrong reel 4 the first time you try. I believe UMI also published a series of early French imprints, but I'm not really familiar with it. Alix Mont de fer, m.k.a. Emily Epstein epsteine at spot.colorado.edu From: Mark Schuldenfrei Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 13:22:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - Feast Themes I am wondering if anyone has done a feast where the sotelties are edible and made to look like games or period toys (for xmas or 12th nite!). If I recall correctly, Lady Emilia Mazzo di Novella made chess boards and pieces out of shortbread for "Ein Festag en Nurenberg", and many strange chess games were played, feature an excessive taking and consuming of pieces... (:-) Tibor From: brighid at sojourn.com (Tina Carney) Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 13:37:18 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - Feast Themes > I am wondering if anyone has done a feast where the sotelties are >edible >and made to look like games or period toys (for xmas or >12th nite!). A few years ago I won a dessert competition with a gingerbread chess board with chocolate pieces. Great fun! Brighid the Ageless occasional saint living in the canton of Rimsholt in the glorious Middle Kingdom From: kathe1 at juno.com (Kathleen M Everitt) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 23:04:51 EDT Subject: Re: SC - Feast Themes-Feast of Illusion On Tue, 17 Jun 1997 08:47:54 -0500 (CDT) L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt writes: >I'd like to hear more about Mistress Sincgiefu's (sorry if I mangled >that) Feast of Illusion. That sounds lovely. > >Aoife I hope Mistress Sincgiefu answers this and gives you more details, but just in case she's busy I'll tell you what I remember. My younger son was 10 days old when I attended the feast she did in Hartshorn-dale, so sleep deprevation blurred the evening! :-) Some of the high points that I remember (I hope I'm remembering them correctly!): They had acorns, hollowed out then filled with salt and pepper, and put holes in the tops for salt and pepper shakers. I think the chicken skins were stuffed with a pork mixture and cooked to resemble chickens. The chicken meat was then put into hollowed out bread loaves. They blew eggs from the shells then filled the shells with custard. There were "oysters with pearls" but I can't remember what they were made from. Anyway, nothing was what it looked like. Luckily, we had a squire with us, so he tasted everything and let us know what it was really. If he could figure it out. He at least let us know if there were any allergens (onions or garlic) in it for several of us who couldn't eat those. There were several dishes he never did figure out. Great event! That feast is probably the highlight of any that I have attended in over 19 years in the SCA! Not only was the food period and delicious, it was so entertaining! We had a great time speculating on the dishes as they came out and marvelling at the work that went into the feast. And I understand that it was a lot of work. Julleran From: Mark Schuldenfrei Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 10:01:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: SC - Feast Themes-Feast of Illusion Great event! That feast is probably the highlight of any that I have attended in over 19 years in the SCA! Not only was the food period and delicious, it was so entertaining! We had a great time speculating on the dishes as they came out and marvelling at the work that went into the feast. And I understand that it was a lot of work. It probably was. Our local cooks guild tried the "skin removal" trick for the farcd chickens as it was written (using a straw to inflate the skin off the bird). It was difficult, and almost painful. I found it easier to use a knife to remove the carcass from the bird and leave the skin whole. (Next time I try it, I may use a bicycle pump with a basketball needle, instead.) Tibor (So there we were, me and my Baroness, blowing up chickens...) From: Philip & Susan Troy Date: Mon, 07 Jul 1997 13:15:07 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - Re: Shaped Bread Elise Fleming wrote: > It was unclear if this meant "period sources" or modern sources. I'm > not certain of period references, and they are unlikely to be in > cookery books but rather in discussions of what was presented at a > feast. > > Alys Katharine If I remember correctly, Taillevent speaks of some of the subtleties in the Viandier as being made, at least in part, of dough. Precisely what type of dough that would be, it's hard to say... Adamantius Date: Fri, 1 Aug 1997 07:08:16 -0500 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Re: sca-cooks V1 #224 >Margaret writes: >I'm teaching a class at Pennsic called Heraldry at the Dinnertable, >which is a survey of where you might find heraldic type things displayed >at dinner in period. > >I'd like to include an "SCA use" section in the class, so I've got three >questions: > >1. How have you used/seen heraldry used in serving dinners at an SCA feast? >2. If you were the cook/planner, how did you choose the display you did? >3. If you documented it, can you give me the rundown/citations? > >toodles, margaret Things I've done with heraldry: 1. All desserts were to be Principality colors (red and white) 2. All desserts were to have an Escarbuncle (8-pointed star) 3. Cookies in the shape of the device. 4. Cake with device (NOT medieval, I'm afraid, at all). 5. Meat pies (coffin type) whose decorations included heraldic type stuff. 6. Meat pies in the shape of towers, flying the flags of the nobles present (Taillevant---he's got some other good things in there!). 7. Gingerbread in the shape of a critter. 7a. Gingerbread shield, with the device painted on it. 8. Sugar-paste helm (in red and white), with marzipan Torse, filled with red and white peppermint candy. 9. Tree (really a honeysuckle branch in a pot) scattered with paper Escarbuncles in red or white, and the "fruits" laying under the tree: desserts (the above mentioned red and white and escarbuncle desserts), marzipan, etc.... 10. Ham, in crust (Apecius) with fig sauce. The crust decorations included heraldic stuff....dough is like clay that way! 12. Garnishing in colors. Therefore, Red and White can take the form of radishes carved in various ways, Red Apple Swans, Red-leaf lettuce (bib), red sauce with cream poured in a pattern...... Will look for your class. Sounds interesting! Aoife--in too big a hurry to trot out recipes. See you there! Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:16:49 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - A Mixed Bag (So to Speak) Kathleen M Everitt wrote: > So, why don't you start one? > > Okay, I will. I saw a science program for kids called Beakman's World and > he gave a recipe for making sugar "glass" like they use in movies. It > used Karo syrup. How did they make it in period? I saw a documentary on > Lorenzo Medici and they said that he had a lot of things made from candy > glass at his wedding. I've always wondered how it was done. > > Julleran Any sugar cooked to the hard crack stage can be worked like glass. I even have a gizmo that is for "glass-blowing" sugar syrups, but I haven't developed any skill with it yet. Check out the "Goud Kokery" volume of "Curye on Inglysche" for fifteenth-century sugar plate recipes resembling sugar glass, as opposed to the later ones which call for making a paste with gum tragacanth, etc. Adamantius Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:34:42 -0500 (CDT) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Subject: SC - Julleran's Sugar/Candy Glass Julleran wrote: > I saw a science program for kids called Beakman's World and he gave a >recipe for making sugar "glass" like they use in movies. It used Karo >syrup. How did they make it in period? I saw a documentary on Lorenzo >Medici and they said that he had a lot of things made from candy glass >at his wedding. I've always wondered how it was done. The Manuscrito Anonimo in Cariadoc's Collection tells about melting sugar and making all things with which to furnish a castle (also made of sugar). I can print out the reference if it's wanted. Curye on Inglysch, Book V: Goud Kokery, #13, has "To make suger plate." Sugar is melted to a specific temperature and removed from the fire and stirred until it turns from its brown color to yellow. (The sugar must not have been pure white to start with...probably "cooking" sugar would have been of a less-fine quality than what would have been served "upstairs". It is then turned out onto a marble stone with rice flour shaken on it. You pour the sugar out as thin as you want, the thinner the better for plates. In traditional after-the-fact style it is noted that you can add any kinds of leaves (petals) cut small when you first remove the syrup from the fire and begin to stir it. Presumably this will color the syrup somewhat and may also add a slight flavor. It is also noted that you can add rosewater. If you want it red you can use clean, washed turnsole at the first boiling. I have discovered that working with sugar syrup takes a lot of practice. One might "luck out" the first time trying this but subsequent repetitions might lead to "failures." I would be extremely supportive of anyone who would like to go into sugar sculpture and cookery as a specialty! FYI, recipe 15 tells about making "images in sugar" and gives colors to _paint_ on. A good place to start playing with melted sugar is to get a good candy book from the library. I found an excellent one in a used book store, put out by Time-Life books. It has detailed instructions, step-by-step pictures, and information on why or how something might go wrong. (I can't tell you how many batches of fruit pastes have refused to set until I "messed" with them!) Someone from Ansteorra taught a class at Pennsic around Pennsic 17, 18, or 19 on making stained glass from melted sugar. While a stained glass window wouldn't be "period", the melting of the sugar, pouring it into a mold to make an image, or pouring it into a square shape to make a trencher, would. I saw a reference to one of the English coronations (Henry V or VI? The child one, I believe) where there were crowns with jewels that shone like enamels. My guess is that these might have been poured from melted sugar (the jewels, at least). Can we get some tinsmiths to make some simple molds that sugarworkers can use for flat forms?? Alys Katharine Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 20:40:56 -0700 (PDT) From: rousseau at scn.org (Anne-Marie Rousseau) Subject: RE: SC - gum arabic We are asked:> >Where would one find gum tragacanth? (I've just come across it in a = >materials list for an enameling project, so having it come up here is = >quite a coincidence.) I've seen gum arabic in art supply stores, but = >since I now hear you say they are different things... You can find gum tragacanth (food grade) as well as food grade edible gold, about six different wafer irons, cake pans of every shape and size, frosting pens, etc etc etc from Maid of Scandanavia. I posted the address for their catalog on this list a few months back. Great catelog!! - --Anne-Marie +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Anne-Marie Rousseau rousseau at scn.org Seattle, Washington Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 10:32:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Schuldenfrei Subject: Re: SC - Julleran's Sugar/Candy Glass Alys Katherine wrote: I have discovered that working with sugar syrup takes a lot of practice. One might "luck out" the first time trying this but subsequent repetitions might lead to "failures." I would be extremely supportive of anyone who would like to go into sugar sculpture and cookery as a specialty! FYI, recipe 15 tells about making "images in sugar" and gives colors to _paint_ on. Hmmm. Would my lady wife's Laurel for soteltie making be a good start? (Well, she also cooks first rate feasts.) Alys, I know you've seen pictures of her work. She and I, together, have made stained glass renditions of arms. We made marzipan for the "lead", and poured colored hard crack (technical term in candymaking) sugar into the various pockets to form the arms. It's messy, but it seems to work adequately well. Humidity can play hell with hazing, though. You can use food paste to make "food paint" with. We mix it, or powder colors with vodka for paint. Julleran wrote: Would candy molds that you can buy at art stores work, or are they just for chocolates which I imagine would have lower temperatures than melted sugar? Sugar does have a higher temperature than melted chocolate. I don't think those molds could withstand it: but I'd ask at the store. Tibor Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 14:26:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Schuldenfrei Subject: Re: SC - Stained Glass Questions 1. I have made Christmas candy in this way many of times, but the problem I always had was that I needed to pour it out onto powdered sugar so that it would not stick. is there a good substitute that will allow it to harden and not stick? We grease a marble board, with PAM. 2. What flavors would have been period, if any? I usually use wintergreen, anise, cinnamon and peppermint oils for my candies. I know rosewater is one. Violets another. I will leave good answers to Alys Katherine. Tibor Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 16:43:57 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - Stained Glass Questions Christi Redeker wrote: > I have been researching sotelties and read through the stained glass articles on the Rialto. I now have a couple of questions. > > 1. I have made Christmas candy in this way many of times, but the problem I always had was that I needed to pour it out onto powdered sugar so that it would not stick. is there a good substitute that will allow it to harden and not stick? Oiling a marble stone with almond oil is one period solution. Another is a bag of rice flour, made like a baseball pitcher's rosin bag, which is used to dust surfaces with the flour. > 2. What flavors would have been period, if any? I usually use wintergreen, anise, cinnamon and peppermint oils for my candies. Apart from the odd flower petal, there are generally no additional flavorings used in the recipes I've seen. Adamantius Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:19:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Uduido at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Stained Glass Questions-not period << s there a good substitute that will allow it to harden and not stick? >> Although it is not period, cornstarch works great. Lord Ras Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 17:26:17 -0500 (CDT) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Subject: SC - Re: Stained Glass Questions Murkial af Maun asked: >2. What flavors would have been period, if any? I usually use >wintergreen, anise, cinnamon and peppermint oils for my candies. I haven't seen any refereence to flavors for a hardened sugar syrup. I would wonder if those oils had come into existence. Sugar _was_ flavored with rose and violet, the two most popular flavors, this was not in a melted sugar state. I would seriously doubt that the English flavored the "stained glass". Keep in mind that re-creating a stained glass object may well be an anachronism. Reference is to re-creating objects such as fruits, statues, flowers, plates, etc. While a castle is referred to, and I think that the jewels in the coronation subtlety might be melted sugar, I have seen no reference to recreating a stained glass window. Alys Katharine Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 10:54:36 -0500 From: "Jack Hubbard" Subject: SC - Re: Stained Glass Questions > Murkial af Maun asked: > >2. What flavors would have been period, if any? I usually use > >wintergreen, anise, cinnamon and peppermint oils for my candies. While not seen in hard sugar candies, these flavors I have for Sirrup's: Violets, Gilleflowers, Cowslip, Rose, Damask Roses, Barberries, Mulberries,Rasps (rasberies), Leamons, Poumcitrons, Pippins (that is apples), Purslane, Liquorish, Wood Sorrell, and Hyssope. I suspect that Saunders( red sandlewood) wood work well too. As for coloring agents the rose and sandlewood would make red, liquorish for black?, blackberries for purple.... Yours, Eoian (who thinks he may go home and destroy the kitchen tonight with all these ideas) Date: Sat, 20 Sep 1997 01:52:56 -0400 From: marilyn traber Subject: Re: SC - thanks Russell Gilman-Hunt wrote: > Thanks to everyone for the recipes! > > Because I just re-read the event copy, and found that they want > *finger* food (for samhain? Interesting choice of words), the > shortbread and the Jusselle Dates are what I am thinking about... How about jordan almonds-sugar coated almonds small marzipan tidbits made into discs and pressed with a tandy leather picture stamp and painted with food coloring[did it once with household device in color as decoration around a sotltie-looked great, less filling lol] margali Date: Wed, 8 Oct 1997 15:46:45 -700 MST From: "Jeanne Stapleton" Subject: SC - Subtlety Quest Okay, cooks, it occurred to me today that I might be able to finally get a question answered that has occasionally surfaced in my mind for a couple of years now: At the Eastern royalty dinner at Pennsic in 1994, a subtlety was brought in that I found absolutely staggering: it was a kneeling stag, about 1/2 life size (maybe 3/4--that sucker was *big*). It was carried to the table on a litter on the shoulders of bearers. The exterior's key ingredient, I was told, was cream cheese. When pierced to the heart with an arrow, it "bled" warm mulled wine. This thing was awesome. I've wanted to attempt it myself ever since. Now that I live in the Outlands...:-) Anybody know who the creator was? Berengaria Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 12:19:27 EDT From: melc2newton at juno.com (Michael P Newton) Subject: SC - Re: below the salt) On Fri, 10 Oct 1997 14:13:54 -0700 kat writes: >Basically, I'm looking for dishes with major "OOOHHH!" factor... any >and all suggestions would be welcome. If you don't mind illusion food, I have a doozy which I been keeping back for just such an occasion. Looking through my church cookbooks, I actually found a jello recipe that did not contain pineapple {which I am allergic to}! You peel a melon, a cantaloupe or one of it's cousins, slice off about 2 inches one of the ends, and scope out the seeds. fill the cavity with jello [before it gels] and replace the lid. Let the jello set. Frost the melon with a combination of cream cheese and powdered sugar[beated together first]Roc's Eggs, anyone? Lady Beatrix of Tanet Date: Sun, 12 Oct 1997 10:01:38 -0500 (CDT) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Subject: SC - Illusion Foods Challenge (Was: Below the Salt) Greetings! Lady Beatrix of Tanet suggested: >If you don't mind illusion food, I have a doozy which I been keeping >back for just such an occasion. (snip...) You peel a melon, a >cantaloupe or one of it's cousins, slice off about 2 inches one of the >ends, and scope out the seeds. fill the cavity with jello [before it >gels] and replace the lid. Let the jello set. Frost the melon with a >combination of cream cheese and powdered sugar[beated together >first]Roc's Eggs, anyone? Might I suggest transposing this into something more medieval or Renaissance? From what I have seen, illusion foods recreated real foods with a surprise. You really _might_ stuff an egg shell with custard and cook it to set. You could take marzipan or sugar paste and make it look like a hard-boiled egg or even bacon. But, I haven't seen any evidence that something mythological such as a roc's egg would have been mimicked. Statues of gods and goddesses, yes; made of sugar, or marzipan, or sugar paste, yes. To me, roc's eggs would belong to our modern version of what was done in the Middle Ages. Now, if one wanted to do a roc's egg then one should look at what foodstuffs were available to make it from. I would think that cantalopes, jello, and cream cheese would be "right out." But... the concept is interesting. What illusion foods can you "invent" that would fit into the medieval or Renaissance world and would avoid modern ingredients or forays into our modern fantasy world? You already probably know of "apples" made from meatballs; hollow walnuts made of sugar paste with trinkets inside; and the above-mentioned bacon and hard-boiled eggs of marzipan or sugar paste. Can we invent something similar? Alys Katharine Date: Sun, 12 Oct 1997 11:24:36 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - Illusion Foods Challenge (Was: Below the Salt) Elise Fleming wrote: > Might I suggest transposing this into something more medieval or > Renaissance? From what I have seen, illusion foods recreated real > foods with a surprise. You really _might_ stuff an egg shell with > custard and cook it to set. You could take marzipan or sugar paste and > make it look like a hard-boiled egg or even bacon. But, I haven't seen > any evidence that something mythological such as a roc's egg would have > been mimicked. Statues of gods and goddesses, yes; made of sugar, or > marzipan, or sugar paste, yes. To me, roc's eggs would belong to our > modern version of what was done in the Middle Ages. > > Alys Katharine There actually is a late-period source with a recipe for a gargantuan egg, made from about a dozen hen's eggs. I will try to locate the source; it's one of the ones about three feet away from me as I thump da keyboard. Essentially it calls for the raw eggs to be separated, and the yolks to be boiled inside a clean bladder, with the boiling water being constantly stirred in one direction until there is a little whirlpool depression in the surface. This is intended to keep the yolks round as they cook and set. This is then unwrapped and put inside another, larger, bladder, with the raw whites, and boiled in the same way. This time the stirring is not only supposed to make the egg roundish, but also supposedly causes the yolk to settle in the center of the mass. This is supposed to be peeled and eaten in slices, presumably so that any minor imperfections, like wrinkles in the surface, won't be immediately visible. Adamantius Date: Sun, 12 Oct 1997 17:02:39 -0500 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Re: Illusion food >You already probably know of "apples" made from meatballs; hollow >walnuts made of sugar paste with trinkets inside; and the >above-mentioned bacon and hard-boiled eggs of marzipan or sugar paste. >Can we invent something similar? > >Alys Katharine Wasn't it Taillevant who suggested filling a pre-baked pie shell with live frogs? The idea is that you get a pretty volunteer maiden or three to "open" the pie, and then clap out the lights and watch the panic ensue. Sigh. Those were the good old days. Today, you'd have to answer to animal welfare. But wind-up toys are cheap and they work. Try the leaping variety (the kind that do somersaults, etc....). Another Taillevant suggestion is to have a warship complete with working cannon, which are fired from a distance at another warship. That's a little complicated. I have a friend (the mysterious Master Dyfan) who made a stained-glass cathedral from gingerbread and melted hard candy. It was lovely. He used the same recipe to make a carved wedding chest which was astounding. It had leaping stags, IIRC, and foliage. The only reason I think I beat him out at Ice Dragon in that catagory was that the chest was so amazing the judges probably assumed that it was a wooden chest, and thus in the wrong room :^( . I made preserved oranges (which had been preserved quite a while), a rather compicated almond butter, and period flaky pastry. It was yummy, but I didn't do the work he did, and mine wasn't as complicated. My brother once made a dragon from loaves of french bread artfully cut. It was more of a crocodile, but effective none the less. He filled the bread with bread pudding. I used to make (back when Dawnfield in the East Kingdom existed) bread swans to hold butter or soft cheeses. They are similar to the puff pastry swans, less elegant but more durable (more inportantly, freezable), and they get completely eaten, so there's no dishes to wash! That's so much nicer than putting out a stick or blob of butter on a plate. I've also been known to mold butter into another form, harden, unmold, and press fresh herbs, edible flowers, and thinly sliced pieces of vegetables cut to fancy shapes onto the surface of the butter. You wrap it up, chill it again, and simply unwrap to serve. Letting it stand a while will make it soft enough spread. I want to do a gaming theme: Cheeses arranged in a checkerboard and picks of vegetables for chessmen. Or a feast where Every dish served looks like something it isn't. Sounds really fun! I read an account of a feast where the cook made an army of drumsticks. Each had a red grape helmet, carried a breadstick spear and had a shield of sliced turnip. They were mounted on a covered board with rows of non-galvanized nails. That's an army that really was chicken! <> Just a few ideas off the top of my head. Aoife Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 06:31:55 -0500 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Re:Bread swans >I like that idea. How does one make bread swans? Does it take artistic >ability? Does it involve using a sharp object? Maybe I ought to get my >Laurel husband to do something like that while I just cook. Lots safer, >I'll bet. > >Julleran You need an oval shaped piece of bread dough, and a thin S shaped piece of bread dough. Bake them. Slice the top of the oval loaf. Slice that in half to form wings. Scoop out the innards of the loaf. Fill with butter or soft cheese. Insert your s-shaped neck. Put the wings in at an angle. Voila, a swan! Aoife Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 10:26:26 SAST-2 From: "Ian van Tets" Subject: SC - Re: sca-cooks V1 #355 Wasn't the giant egg recipe in Hannah Glasse? If it features earlier than that, I'd like to know. Had a feeling that the ship and frog and deer subtelties mentioned came from May, but my book with both May and Taillevent stuff is in storage, so will trust your judgement. At a Tewlfth-Night about 4 years ago saw a wonderful marzipan subtelty which was the boar's head. Meant the vegetarians could have some too. Cairistiona ***************************************************** Dr. Ian van Tets Dept. of Zoology University of Cape Town Rondebosch 7701 RSA Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 10:28:35 -0400 (EDT) From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: SC - piping bag << I saw a late-period or mid-1600s reference to paper tube with a hole in one end. Of course, I have no idea now where I saw it. Alys Katharine >> Simply take a clean sheet of paper or baker's parchment, form into a cone, fill and fold down the long edge. Snip the pointed end off and use as any other piping bag. Works great and it's throwaway. :-) Ras Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 11:22:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Tyrca at aol.com Subject: Re: Freaking them out (was: SC - Re- Illusion food)) All these people dreaming of large subtleties in Marzipan . . . (sigh) That's a lot of almonds!! I have seen subtleties in bread, covered with icing, and with detailed features in Marzipan. I also was privileged to witness a particularly spectacular subtlety in Drachenwald. At Visby week in 1989, Master Confecticus came out with a Dragon and presented it to the Baron, with an elaborate story of its hunt and capture, but sadly, the dragon was not quite dead. He asked the Baron to humanely kill it as it was suffering. The Baron immediately pulled out his sword, and severed the head, at which point "blood" flowed from its veins. The dragon was 12 layers of cake with coffee buttercreme frosting, and the "blood" was grape jelly, melted. It was delicious. We do not always have to rely on marzipan! Tyrca Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 14:36:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Schuldenfrei Subject: Re: SC - Subtlety Quest At the Eastern royalty dinner at Pennsic in 1994, a subtlety was brought in that I found absolutely staggering: it was a kneeling stag, about 1/2 life size (maybe 3/4--that sucker was *big*). It was carried to the table on a litter on the shoulders of bearers. The exterior's key ingredient, I was told, was cream cheese. When pierced to the heart with an arrow, it "bled" warm mulled wine. Dyffen ap Iago, member of the Laurel, and a damned fine cook. (IIRC... I can check with my wife, who is a soteltie expert, and who would recall instantly.) It was not, however, made of food. It was made of plastic, and inside it was a sack of wine taken from "box wine". If I recall, it is based upon a surviving description of a period sotelty. This thing was awesome. I've wanted to attempt it myself ever since. Now that Ilive in the Outlands...:-) It travelled around to a number of events after that, and was always very popular. I first saw it "in the flesh" at a Coronation some years later. Tibor Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 07:33:36 -0500 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Stag that Bleeds Red Wine Soteltie Hello folks! I just talked to Master Dyfan ap Iago last night, and got the "scoop" about the bleeding stag soteltie. Here it is: He did a paper mache casting of a life-sized deer target (his father had one to practice archery on). He built an internal framework with the help of his friend Seppo. This held the bag from a "red wine in a box". There was a metal tube in the breast (internally) which guided the arrow. The arrow was implanted in the breast in the mid-region of the plastic bag of wine, and left there. When it was pulled out, gravity kicked in and the wine flowed out the tube. The paper mache was covered in candy (sugar)paste, which was rather more liquid than usual due to a shortage of gum tragacanth, so that it was essentially the consistency of cream cheese. He had a real set of antlers attached, and attached to those was a crown, since this was the Prince of the Forest, come to offer himself so that the Kings of the East and Middle would stop fighting. Since The Prince was a magical being, the wound was not fatal. It appears that he managed to survive three such attacks before his swan song at pennsic, after which he mysteriously went up in a puff of flame at a campfire. Apparently, burned sugar paste smells like roasting marshmallows. And that's the story, true, unembelished, and devillishly clever. Dyfan will be online soon, and we hope he will join us in this religous community. He must be somewhere in the hierarchy of the Church. He probably ranks around Arch Bishop! Aoife Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 12:21:16 -0600 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Sotelties I vaguely remeber seeing an independant reference (in Taillevant, perhaps?) of a radish carved in the manner of a rose. So, here is my version of a peacock, which we determined yesterday does indeed work well as an individual table-pretty: Tip five short skewers with gum paste (sugar paste) colored either green or blue, to look like a hat-pin. Splay out the gum paste to resemble the tip of a peacock's feather (drop-shaped, thin and flat). Let dry. Carve a large red apple to resemble a swan, minus the tail: Stand the apple on it's side and slice off an inch thick slice of the side of the apple. Sit the apple down with the sliced side down, giving you a stable object to carve. Make a small wedge shaped slit in the stem end, vertically, to put the neck into. Carve the head/neck from the one-inch slice. Use a piece of the stem to poke through the head for eyes. Reserve in a bowl of lemon-juice and water. On each side make the wings: Cut off center to the left straight down to form a vertical cut on the outer left edge of the apple, cutting only halfway. Make a perpendicular cut so that you have a small neat horizontal wedge.Dip the wedge in the lemon-water. Replace the wedge. Right next to, but closer to the center, make ANOTHER horizontal cut and vertical cut to make another wedge, which contains the first, smaller wedge. Repeat this until you feel you have as many wedges as you need (you don't want any core--3 to 4 wedges max.). Do the same operation to the right side of the apple. Put the whole thing into the lemon water (Note: To make a swan, you repeat the wedge process in the tail area). When ready to present, put three or four grapes of various colors, and cranberries at the end for stability (yes, we know they didn't eat them in period, but they knew what they were), on to the skewers to make the tail feathers. I assume berries (blue-, small straw-, boysen-) would work well, too, or small melon balls. Insert the neck into the neckhole with the aid of a toothpick. Fan out the wings towards the back (the wedges make a three-dimensional feather effect). Insert one Skewer with fruit in the center back. Fan out the remaining four skewers on each side to make a "Displayed" tail. Or, if desired, insert the skewers so that the tail is dragging behind (not displayed). There you have it. A peacock. Serve immediately. If you have very large apples, you could use more skewers. Aoife Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:57:08 -0600 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Aoife's Bull > Gee... Sugar paste makes great "concrete" and pillars! Roll out some > slabs, let them dry, fasten together and paint on it with food paste > colors so it looks just the way the columns would have... And you can > break them after serving them! > >Alys-Katherine ARGH! Too late! I only have 4 days, during which I have to go to work, and also care for 3 unruly young'uns with colds (and one grumpy old man but that's another story...). No time left for major construction. Drat! Can I count on some personal instruction some time in the future? I seem to be getting insane with this soteltie thing lately. Somebody stop me! If anyone cares to, they may view the originals, which I modelled the Bull after, at: asmar.uchicago.edu/OI/HIGH/OIM_A24065_72dpi.html or www.nelson-atkins.org/collections/ancient/detail/capital.htm or www.hartford-hwp.com/image_archive/achaemenid/carving03.gif As the original bulls from the 100-columned Persepolis Throne Hall were most likely painted, I am choosing to interpret the looped bead-work on the statues as colorful types of (?????what is that word?) that horses wear, in mid-east style, and am making a felt table-runner type thingy to cover from the center forehead to below the tail (which will handily disguise the trap door on it's way). I wish I had time to embroider it, but I'm awful at that, so I am relying on gaudy gems, etc. on black felt. Read on to find out why I needed a trap door: The bull, wearing his last coat of paint, is now finished and looking quite spiffy. I used glass globules for eyes and put a scrap of gold cloth underneath. I made him out of paper mache', modelled on a chicken-wire form, and molded eye-sockets with heavy brows around the 'eyes'. The frame was made from 12" chicken wire: 2 pieces side-by-side for the body, about 3' around (not closed on the bottom since he is laying down). These were tied together with twine. The head was a 4 or so foot piece, rolled into a U shape and the top third bent down upon itself to make the neck and head. This was also attached with baling twine. A piece of twine running from the back of the head to the center of the back held it steady until the paper mache dried enough to give it independent strength. A piece of wire mesh was used down the front and back. The legs were molded out of tubes of mesh, folded upon themselves, and the join where they attached to the body clipped open and attached to the body to form the thighs. The whole frame was twined together for stability and then pressed into a more natural shape. I then clipped the trap door and twined the top of it to the body. Last, a small piece of mesh formed the tail, twined to the body. i know none of this is really edible, but a great many Sotelties weren't edible, being made of linnen, paper, brass, lead, wood, glass, wire, etc..... To add the mache: boil a very thin paste of flour and water (a thick, unboiled paste works but spoils quickly). You can add glue or oil of wintergreen (preservative) but I did not. I attached large sheets of newsprint at first, to cover. This took two weeks to dry in the garage, so I brought him inside, where he dried in a few hours. I then applied 2 more coats of paper mache in strips. Next came a good coat of spackle (2 cans of ready mix)applied with the fingers, which was left fairly rough for texture. A coat of black spray paint was put on for primer. My husband preferred this look, but I put on a coat of faux "granite" paint, and I really like the way it's shaping up. Now, about the tricky bits, which I have yet to complete: Borrowing from Master Dyfan's Stag that Bled red wine, I am making a similar contraption myself, based on his instructions---it's a gravity feed through a small piece of siphon hose, blocked by the arrow stump acting as a cork at the chest. A wine bag from wine-in-a-box on a pedestal (yes, bleck! but it's a sturdy bag, and red) is the blood, attached to the other end of the siphon hose. It resides inside the chest area. Are you grossed out yet? There's more. My bull has a trap door. I have made 5 dozen crinkle-surfaced, center-moist, lumpy chocolate cookies to simulate Bull-Dookey. They will be delivered as soon as someone lifts up of the tail, because i installed a slanted tray inside the rear of the bull----gravity feed again. And before anyone cringes at the symbolism, I am trying to demostrate that even with the most horrible of political stuff going on in the group, even the worst BS we can produce is, well, worth it. Besides, I want to see my brother the Baron-elect's face when I offer him a plate of bull-pucks! You're all sworn to secrecy, tho. I can't keep a secret to save my life, so you folks are in charge of my secret now. I don't care who knows.....just nobody tell Tigranes! Aoife---wishing she'd thought of incorporating a pillar in the design now, like one of the originals has. Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 09:31:13 -0600 From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt Subject: SC - Aoife's Bull---Update Hallo! I am recovering from the First Endless Hills Baronial Investiture, and would like to re-hash it here for you. About the Sotelties: First let me prepare the way with two statements: 1: The feast had a bird theme, which some of the sotelties carried through. 2: The event had a Bull theme, due to our Baron's device and persona's religeon. When invested, we all donned felt horns among the kitchen crew (except for Valerie, who made a huge set of real steer horn affixed to a head band that looked hysterical), and Moo'd our new Baron into office! There were five. First was my Persian Miniature, made on a square slab of shortbread, executed in fruit leathers gummmed down and sealed with simple syrup. It was really cute, and I enjoyed doing it. All in all, about an hour's work and about $5.00 in materials. Not bad, and my kids ate the scraps of fruit leathers, keeping them busy while I worked. I bought three different kinds, and had enough color variations in them to do some neat things. Second to be served was the lantern. Ragnar and Rowan made this, and it was from gingerbread (cookie type), cut-work held together with royal icing. The damaged side was held towards the presentor, and I don't think anyone noticed. It was quite dramatic when paraded around the hall, with a lit candle inside. Simply beautiful! Third was a set of gold keys on a gold key-ring to honor the new Chatelaine, dear friend of all the cooks. Again, Rowan made this from gingerbread pressed into molds and baked. She found some sort of gold powder which, when mixed with orange extract, made a paint. This was brushed on, and some greenery painted with food colors. The keys were attached to the ring with golden threads. Again, simply beautiful. Fourth was an enormous egg. We had a sort of bird theme to the feast (phoenix tail salad, apricot chicken, apple peacocks, etc.) so Ragnar and Rowan made an enormous, perfectly smooth white egg, presented in a nest-like basket, symbol of the birth of our barony, from cake. When sliced, it looked like a real egg inside. I have no idea how it was done, but it knocked them cold. They gasped when it was broken open. I am hoping Ragnar will read this and enlighten us about the process. It was devoured, and folks were asking for more. Last came the bull, at the end of the feast. I was unaware of a fortuitous legend from the Zaroestrian religion, wherein the God Mithras wounds a celestial bull, and the blood spilled became all of creation. This made the soteltie more appropriate than I could have hoped, given that our new Baron's (my brother) device was a Bull. Two stalwort fellows carried out the table bearing the bull. Khasar announced the last soteltie which "wasn't subtle at all. In fact, it could be downright offensive". Naturally that got them all crowding around. I explained the originals the bull was based on, and had the good Baron Tigranes recieve the first cup of wine when the corking arrowhead was removed. And then I began to explain about how we had, like all groups going barony, gone through some rough times, with a lot of BS. I was leading up to opening the trap door in the rear so that the chocolate cookies could fall out. But my 8-year old (who had been keeping the secret for 2 weeks) joyously shouted "And he POOPS cookies". So I simply explained that even the BS in Endless Hills was delightful and let the cookies fly. Gratifyingly, the first cookie went flying out and rolled across the floor. I had to "help" the rest, a substantial paylod, but no one seemed to mind. It was a big hit, got lots of laughs, and folks really enjoyed their "bulls blood and BS for dessert." I had to donate the wine, since the SCA money cannot buy alcohol for drinking purposes, which I was happy to do. So all in all, that's it. I got home at midnight, and now the next day I'm still exhausted. I think I'll take a breather for a few months before I do this again. We have lots of cooks in our group now, so a temporary retirement is perfectly feasible. My crew were troopers, and I hope they realize how wonderfully well they did. I was told the feast was excellent. A cook can't wish for better than that. Aoife Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 16:05:43 -0600 (CST) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming) Subject: SC - Re: Brandy Greetings! Crystal of the Westermark wrote: >There are instructions for distilling in Curye on Inglysch, I think >some cooks would have made brandy to produce the famous fire breathing >subitiles. I haven't seen brandy listed as needed for making things flame. Camphor is what the period cookery books call for. Cotton or other flammable things are soaked in camphor and then set alight to produce a dragon's flame (St. George's dragon, not SCA fantasy), etc. Alys Katharine Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 19:15:58 -0400 From: Ceridwen Subject: SC - Carving books? In my 10 years in the SCA I have occasionally seen references to books on carving and garnishing. I am preparing to do a Feast for a small collegium, and would love to be able to include some examples of those methods taught in these books. The list of books` : 1. 1423 Arte de Cisoria by the Marquess of Villena 2. 1508 Book of Kervynge - Wynken de Worde (sp?) 3. 1604 Il Trinciante - Vincenzo Cervio 4. 1676 L'Escole Parfait des Officiers de Bouche (author?) At least two of these are much more than carving manuals. If anyone on the list has a clue where to find any of these (in any form) please let me know (public or private). I am reasonably sure I cannot afford anything like originals, but if I can copy from microfilm, etc? Ceridwen Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 11:36:34 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - Carving books? > In my 10 years in the SCA I have occasionally seen references to >books on carving and garnishing. I am preparing to do a Feast for a >small collegium, and would love to be able to include some examples of >those methods taught in these books. The list of books : > > 1. 1423 Arte de Cisoria by the Marquess of Villena > 2. 1508 Book of Kervynge - Wynken de Worde (sp?) > 3. 1604 Il Trinciante - Vincenzo Cervio > 4. 1676 L'Escole Parfait des Officiers de Bouche (author?) > >At least two of these are much more than carving manuals. If anyone on >the list has a clue where to find any of these (in any form) please let >me know (public or private). I am reasonably sure I cannot afford >anything like originals, but if I can copy from microfilm, etc? > >Ceridwen Hello! Visit http://www.library.upenn.edu/special/gallery/aresty/aresty1.html An Exhibition from the Esther B. Aresty Collection of Rare Books in the Culinary Arts. I know Esther Aresty had a copy of Il Trinciante in her collection. >1676 L'Escole Parfait des Officiers de Bouche (author?) This may be " A Perfect School of Instructions for the Officers of the Mouth" by Giles Rose, one of the Master Cooks to Charles II. 1682. Cindy Renfrow renfrow at skylands.net Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 18:17:55 -0500 From: vjarmstrong at aristotle.net (Valoise Armstrong) Subject: Re: SC - Carving books? > In my 10 years in the SCA I have occasionally seen references to >books on carving and garnishing. I am preparing to do a Feast for a >small collegium, and would love to be able to include some examples of >those methods taught in these books. Several years ago I got a great German book on carving through interlibrary loan. The title says that it's about table customs to the end of the Middle Ages, but as I recall there was quite a lot about carvers and the art of carving. It's a good secondary source and if you can handle the German worth looking up. There are also some great photographs of dishes and eating utensils. Schiedlausky, Gunther. Essen und trinken: Tafelsitten bis zum Ausgang des Mittelalters. Munich: Prestel Verlag, 1956. Valoise Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:52:55 +0100 From: "Yeldham, Caroline S" Subject: RE: SC - Carving books? I don't know about the others, but Wynken de Worde's book was republished in FURNIVAL, Frederick J. (Editor). Manners and Meals in Olden Time. The Babees Book, The Bokes of Nurture of Hugh Rhodes and John Russell, Wykyn de Worde's Boke of Keruynge, The Booke of Demeanor, etc. etc. 1973. Reprint of the 1868 edition. ie originally in 1868, and the whole book was republished in 1973. You might have better luck searching under this title in a decent library. BTW from memory its more about serving than carving, although it does include the terminology, its rather short on techniques! Caroline Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 10:02:04 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: SC - SC sotelties - cockatrice >Does anybody know of documentation for the practice of sewing different >bits of animals together, or is it just folklore? > >Charles Ragnar Hello! Harleian MS 279, Leche Vyaundez, recipe #28 for Cokyntryce, and Douce Ms.55, #3 Cokentrice. Both sew the fore part of a capon to the hind part of a pig, & vice versa, to produce 2 beasties. (Recipes can be found on pages 573-4 of V.2, Take 1000 Eggs or More.) Cindy Renfrow renfrow at skylands.net Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:00:55 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: SC - RE: SC sotelties - cockatrice > Does anybody know of documentation for the practice of sewing different > bits of animals together, or is it just folklore? > > Charles Ragnar See "Cokagrys" in The Forme of Cury, #183 or thereabouts, and "For to make two pecys of flessh to fasten togyder.", #198, q.v. Actual recipe numbers may vary from edition to edition, but they're there. I'd say the practice is pretty well documented. Adamantius Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:18:40 -0400 From: mermayde at juno.com (Christine A Seelye-King) Subject: Re: SC - SC sotelties - cockatrice >Does anybody know of documentation for the practice of sewing different >bits of animals together, or is it just folklore? > >Charles Ragnar There is also a kid's book called "A Medieval Feast" by Aliki, that I got at Pennsic many years ago. It is all about a manor house that is expecting the King and Queen for a visit. They go into detail as to the animals hunted, the preparations for the feast, and the service of the feast as well. There is a couple of pages in there where they are sewing the back and front half of a suckling pig and a chicken together to make two cockentrices. Way back when I was just a lowly apprentice chef, I was entered in a student's food show. I did a competant hors d'oerve platter, and I also did a cockentrice. The pig we got was larger than a suckling pig, so I ended up having to use a turkey instead of a chicken. I cut out a'loaf' from the center of the forcemeat stuffing the body, and sliced it, layed it back into the hole it came out of, decorated it with choid-froid and truffles, covered the whole thing with aspic, and displayed it with carved vegetables. I thought (and still do think) that it looked wonderful. Unfortunately, by the time I got everything to the hall, I had been up working on it for 36 hours straight, and neglected to put anything down on the form except "Cockyntrice" and left. Needless to say, the judges had no idea what to make of my entry, and made absolutely no comments on it at all! (My other platter got an honorable mention.) Since then, I have learned the value of good documentation (especially when dealing with judges who may not know what you are going for) and look back and sigh for what could have been. We also did some cockyntrices at an event once, where we tookrabbits and chickens and did the Frankenstein thing to them. We also endored them, boy, were those some weird looking critters! Unlike my food show entry however, these were edible. (For displaying an entry on a mirror for three days, the forcemeat had about 4 pounds of cornstarch mixed into it, and then the whole thing was aspic'd to within an inch of it's life). I took lots of pictures of both processes, and have used them to show folks what is entailed. Lots of fun, I might even do it again some day, for an appreciative audience! Mistress Christianna MacGrain, OP, Meridies Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:44:06 -0500 (CDT) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming) Subject: SC - Re: sotelties - cockatrice Charles wrote: >Does anybody know of documentation for the practice of sewing >different bits of animals together, or is it just folklore? It it is written up in, I believe, Chiquart's book. Alys K. Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 11:22:59 -0700 From: david friedman Subject: SC - Re: SC sotelties - cockatrice Charles Ragnar asked: >> Does anybody know of documentation for the practice of sewing different >> bits of animals together, or is it just folklore? and Adamantius answered: >See "Cokagrys" in The Forme of Cury, #183 or thereabouts, and "For to >make two pecys of flessh to fasten togyder.", #198, q.v. Actual recipe >numbers may vary from edition to edition, but they're there. I'd say the >practice is pretty well documented. Cokagrys. Take and make (th)e self fars, but do (th)erto pynes and sugar.Take an hold rostr cok; pulle hym and hylde hym al togyder saue (th)elegges. Take a pigg and hilde hym fro (th)e myddes dounward; fulle him fulof (th)e fars, & sowe hym fast togeder. Do hym in a panne & see(th) hymwel, and whan (th)ei bene isode: do hem on a spyt & rost it wele. Colourit with yolkes of ayren and safroun. Lay (th)eron foyles of gold and ofsilver, and serue hit forth.Translation/spelling modernization: Cockatrice. Take and make the samestuffing [this is the preceeding recipe: ground raw pork, eggs, powderfort, saffron, salt, currents], but do thereto pine nuts and sugar. Take awhole roast cock; pull him and skin him altogether except for the legs.Take a pig and skin him from the middle downward; fill him full of thestuffing, & sew him fast together. Do him in a pan & boil him well, andwhen they be boiled: do him on a spit & roast it well. Colour it withyolkes of eggs and saffron. Lay thereon gold and silver leaf, and serve itforth. Madeleine des Milles Roses did pair of cocketrices for a Middle Kingdom Coronation several years back; one of them had colored shortbread armor resembling the new king's, and the other wore a ruff of the general stylethe new queen was accustomed to wear. All tables but high table got stuffed roast pork that course. Elizabeth/Betty Cook Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 19:14:01 +1000 From: Robyn Probert Subject: SC - Marchpane Revisited There are certainly references to 14th centure recipies for marchpanes, but I just cannot find the example I know I have (somewhere). By way of cross reference, the Time Life Good Cooks series (wonderful books) gives a range of recipies in the Confectionary volume. It is remarkable how similar the recipies from Persia, Germany, France, Italy, etc really are and how little they have changed over the centuries! Elinor Fettiplace gives A Receit to Make a Marchpane (1604): Take a pound & a half of almonds, blanch them & bruise them in a martar by themselves, then take a pound & a half of sugar & pound it smal, search out as much of it as you think will servie to ice your marchpanee, & to mould it up in, Take the rest of your sugar & mingle it with your almonds, & beat them in a morter till they come to paste, not putting too much at once in your morter for fear of oyling, you must have gum dragon steep it in rose water all night, & in your pownding put some of your gumdragon upon your pestills end, when you have pounded it all mould it upon a bottome made with marchpane bread, make your conceits as you think fit, set your marchpane in the oven not being too hot, & when it is reasonable well hardened take it out & ice it, & set on your conceits, then put it in the oven againe, untill yor iceing bee hardned, then take it out, & stick on your comfits, & when it is cold gild it, your iceing is made with nothing but rosewater & sugar beaten together, it must bee somewhat thick, I think some 3 greate spoonfulls of sugar will serve for the iceing of it. I hope I can find my earlier recipie and will post it if I do. Rowan Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 08:47:56 PDT From: "Michael Clifford" Subject: Re: SC - SC sotelties - cockatrice A few years ago Master Ian did a cockentrice he has a page on it at http://www.labs.net/dmccormick/cocken.htm it has the sources along with some pictures. Guy Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 01:06:53 -0700 From: "James L. Matterer" Subject: SC - Cockentrice In regards to recent questions about cockentrice, I prepared one for the Pennsic A & S Competition at Pennsic 24 and have detailed instructions and recipe, along with photographs at http://www.labs.net/dmccormick/cocken.htm Master Huen Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 10:49:21 -0400 From: "marilyn traber" Subject: Fw: SC - Pine-nut Confection Here's a blast from the past, not a hazlenut recipe, but one still sort of close to the discussion at hand... margali - -----Original Message----- From: Elise Fleming To: sca-cooks at Ansteorra.ORG Date: Monday, December 29, 1997 10:50 Subject: SC - Pine-nut Confection >Greetings. Here is the recipe from the Nostradamus book. I will be >sojourning in the snowy climes of Minnesota until next Sunday. While I >may be able to access my e-mail I probably won't be able to respond. > >Alys Katharine - Recipe follows > >"How to Make a Confection from Pine-Nut Kernels". > >"Take as many well-cleaned and carefully shelled pine-nut kernels as >you will, dry them or toast them a little. Or take them whole with >their skins and shells and put them in a basket. Hang this over the >hearth near the fire and leave it there for three days. Tus the heat >from the fire will slowly penetrate them and dry them. Then take them >out and clean them thoroughly. Next take two and a half pounds of >nuts, being careful to keep them close at hand. Then take some of the >most beautiful and best Madeira sugar, dissolve sufficient of it in >rose-water and boil it until it attains the consistency of a jelly. If >it is winter or a time when there is a lot of moisture in the air, boil >it a bit longer, but if it is summer, then let it just simmer. this is >when it does not boil over or bubble when it boils, which is a sign >that the moisture had been evaporated; but to be brief, when it has >boiled to the consistency of a jelly, as I have said, thake the >preserving pan off th efire and put it somewhere where th eliquid can >dry off and become firm. Then give it a good stir with a piece of wood >and beat it continuously until it turns white. When it begins to cool >down a little, add the white of a whole or half an egg and beat it well >again. Next place it over the coals, in order to allow the moisture >from the egg-white to stiffen, and when you see that it is properly >white and like the first lot you boiled, take the dried, well-cleaned >pine-nut kernels and put them into the sugar. Stir them with the wood >so that they are thoroughly mixed with the sugar - this should still be >done over the coal fire, so that the mixture does not cool too quickly. > > Then take a wide wooden knife, like the ones used by the shoemakers, >and cut the mixture into pieces, each weighing about ana ounce and a >half, but not more than two, which would not be good, and spread them >carefully on to some paper until they have properly cooked, at which >stage put a little gold leaf on to them and your confection is ready. >If, however, it is not possible to obtain pine-nut kernels anywhere, >use peeled almonds instead, dividing them either into two parts or >three and mixing them with the sugar to make this confection. And if >there are too few pine-nut kernels, you can replace them with pieces of >almonds, for the latter are not dissimilar to the former in taste and >potency. You can also use fennel which is flowering or in seed, which >is kept in houses and used during the wine harvest. When your sugar >has almost completely boiled and is hot and white with everything mixed >in it or scattered over it, it looks like manna or or snow and is so >beautiful and lovely." Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 18:30:41 -0700 From: Susan Fox-Davis Subject: Re: SC - What to do with the head This reminds me of a cook's jape I committed upon a royal personage some years past. The concept was not original with me, I heard of a similar incident long ago and far away, and decided to commit it anew. Knowing the timid tastes of our populace, instead of an actual Boar's Head we served pies of mincemeat to the populace and a paste replica of a Boar's Head to the High Table with mincemeat inside. The head was capped with a gilded Crown, so I bore the Boar to the King Guy, exhorting him to de-crown the pretender and begin the sweet course. The king graciously did so. Being a good little herald-cook, I announced it to the crowd. "The King has the brains of a Pig!" King Guy looks at me. I look at him. "I have an amendment to the previous announcement. The King does NOT have the brains of a Pig!" King Guy looks at me. I look at him. "I'm leaving while I still have MY head," quoth I, and did so with all speed. Selene cook, herald and unemployed jester Date: Sun, 30 Aug 1998 08:22:45 -0700 From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" Subject: Re: SC - The British Museum Cookbook Hey all from Anne-Marie > Also, we are hosting Crown Tourney in Oct. and I have someone who wants to > do an edible castle for the head table. I would LOVE to hear > suggestions/comments on this. I would appreciate any alternative ideas to > present to this lady. She really wants to make a special contribution > food-wise to Their Majesties feast but she is new at this and I would like > to give her more than one option to try before hand. Theres a recipe in Taillevent (14th century French) for something called a "parma tart". There's one in Chiquart too, but where Chiquart focuses on the filling, Taillevent says "you can put in chopped spice meat, or boiled or roasted meat or...". The neat part of the recipe is how he describes creating a pastry casing for the food, with high sides and crennallations. Then, you make little banners for the lords present, and stick them in the food in the dish. when we did "parma tarts" for a banquet, what we did was use a very sturdy pie dough and shape crennellated walls around regular pie pans. We baked them and decorated them with little banners showing the heraldry of various notables there present. Then we filled the pie dish with a dish of chicken quarters and sauce. To do it "right", we should have put a layer of spiced meatballs or patties, and then the chicken. Few people ate the "castle" part (though they could have), but it was flashy, not too hard, and oh-so-period. If you decide to use real pie dough, be careful as it tends to slump in the oven. here's the primary source quote... Parma Tarts (Taillevent #180): Take mutton, veal or pork meat, cook it, chop it appropriately, spice it extremely reasonably with fine powder, and fry it in lard. Afterwards, have large uncovered pies the size of little platters, with pastry sides higher than for other pies, and made in the manner of crenellations. The pastry should be strong so that it can hold the meat. If you wish, mix some pine nut paste and currants with the meat, and crumble some sugar on top. Take some boiled and quartered chicken, and in each pie put three or four chicken quarters in which to fix the banners of France and of the lords who will be in the [royal] presence. Gild them with sprinkled saffron to be more attractive. If you do not want to depend so much on chicken, you need only make some flat pieces of roasted or boiled pork or mutton. When the pies are full of their meat, glaze the top of the meat with a little egg yolk and egg white beaten together, so that the meat will more hold together more firmly for inserting the banners. Have some gold, silver, or tin leaf for gilding the pies in front of the banners. - --AM Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1998 10:22:00 -0500 From: mfgunter at fnc.fujitsu.com (Michael F. Gunter) Subject: SC - Crown feast > Also, we are hosting Crown Tourney in Oct. and I have someone who wants to > do an edible castle for the head table. I would LOVE to hear > suggestions/comments on this. > > Gwenyth As for the castle. Have you thought of making it from cakes? You can bake a cake in coffee cans for the towers and make sheet cakes, slice them and stack the slices for the walls. Make sugarcube crenallations and gingerbread or cardboard turrets. You can fill the cake with candies, flowers or make a donjon from more cake. You could also try hard salt pastry. It is inedible but you could build walls and towers and then fill the towers with a course and place something in the center. I did this once and fille the towers with fettuccini in one, rice in another and eggs in another. The center had rice topped with beef stew and covered with an edible pastry looking like the center house. Gunthar Date: Mon, 31 Aug 1998 12:39:59 -0500 From: maddie teller-kook Subject: Re: SC - Crown feast Clarissa and I did a castle for the high table at Bryn Gwlad Baronial last year. We used the recipe from "Savoring the Past". It looked pretty good! The only thing I would recommend is to add more seasoning to the meat filling and make sure you get some of the broth into the pie.... otherwise the meat is a little dry. All in all a fun project! Meadhbh Date: Tue, 1 Sep 1998 13:37:53 -0600 (MDT) From: Linda Peterson Subject: Re: SC - Crown feast On Tue, 1 Sep 1998 Seton1355 at aol.com wrote: > > melted life saver technique.> > Huh? If you take the 5 Fruit flavors (or any of the clear candy types) of Lifesavers, crush them a bit and put inside cutout parts of sugar cookies, or in the castle's case gingerbread, then bake the cookies, the candy will melt leaving when cooled a resolidified candy sheet inside the frame of the cookie. When backlit, it looks just like stained glass. Mirhaxa Date: Wed, 2 Sep 1998 14:00:09 +1000 (EST) From: The Cheshire Cat Subject: SC - castles of cake and other such stuff. Other memorable illusion foods were for Hrolf's last feast as Baron of Ynys Fawr there was a man lying on his face made out of cake, iced to look like it was wearing the barons gamberson and a knife sticking out of the back with a note. "He who pulls this sword from the bone shall be the true Baron of Ynys Fawr", and for an Assasin's feast a severed head made from sugar plate was presented to the Head table complete on the ceremonial spiked board (One of my wooden sashimi boards with a long nail driven through the middle. The things we do for our art...*sigh*). The top of the head was removed and the 'brains' were made of turkish delight. Grotesque, but very well done. It recieved the screams of horror that we were hoping for at any rate. => - -Sianan Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 16:02:43 +0100 From: Robyn Probert Subject: SC - Lebkuchen recipie Here is the lebkuchen recipie. I used it as the covers for a subteltie I made of a book - it had 50 pages made of phyllo, glued together at the spine with eggwhite, then with sugar, cinnamon, ground almond and lemon zest sprinkled between each page, then I illuminated the open pages with edible colouring and gold leaf and baked the lot. I also used lebkuchen as the basis for another subteltie, where I made it into shields, baked on a curved surface, then covered in moulded marzipan and painted on the devices. I made the straps from fruit leather and real buckles, rivetted through the shields (I put in holes before I baked the shields). Both looked and tasted great! It makes great castles too... On with the recipie (this makes a LOT - about 200 or so biscuits) DOUGH 4 eggs 400 g brown sugar 450 g white flour 450 g whole wheat flour 150 g honey 1 pkt Oetker baking powder (or 10 g bicarb and 1/4 tsp baking powder) 125 g mixed peel (ie preserved orange and lemon peel), very finely minced 125 g walnuts, ground 1 tsp each cinnamon, cloves, cardamom grated rind of 1/2 lemon Mix the eggs, sugar and honey and sit overnight. Add everything else and mix to a firm dough. Rest 2 hours in a cool place. Roll out thinly (2-3 mm) and cut out shapes (we use a bunch of trad animal shapes). Cook at 350 F/180 C for 10 mins. Cool on racks, then ice. ICING White - Beat 3 egg whites to soft peak, then beat in about 400 g icing sugar and a good squeeze of lemon juice. Yellow - Beat 3 yolks, then beat in enough icing sugar to form a smooth icing. We also make pink from the white (add red colour) and brown from the yellow (add melted chocolate - not period I know!). Apply one thin coat of icing (using a butter knife), dry, then pipe features in a contrasting colour. Each shape we use has trad colours and patterns, but I don't know how old these are. Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 00:48:25 -0800 From: david friedman Subject: Re: SC - Lebkuchen recipie At 4:02 PM +0100 9/18/98, Robyn Probert wrote: Anyway, here is the lebkuchen recipie. I ... >On with the recipie (this makes a LOT - about 200 or so biscuits) > >DOUGH >4 eggs >400 g brown sugar >450 g white flour >450 g whole wheat flour >150 g honey >1 pkt Oetker baking powder (or 10 g bicarb and 1/4 tsp baking powder) >125 g mixed peel (ie preserved orange and lemon peel), very finely minced >125 g walnuts, ground >1 tsp each cinnamon, cloves, cardamom >grated rind of 1/2 lemon > >Mix the eggs, sugar and honey and sit overnight. Add everything else and mix >to a firm dough. Rest 2 hours in a cool place. Roll out thinly (2-3 mm) and >cut out shapes (we use a bunch of trad animal shapes). Cook at 350 F/180 C >for 10 mins. Cool on racks, then ice. this has very little similarity to the period lebkuchen recipe that Valoise posted earlier. Are you basing it on a different period recipe, or is it simply a modern recipe (as the use of baking powder suggests) for something with the same name as something that existed in period? In my experience, it is risky to assume that the names of dishes keep their meaning over long periods of time--consider syllabub, for example, or harisa, or blancmange. David/Cariadoc Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 15:42:51 -0400 From: "Gedney, Jeff" Subject: Re: SC - Subtlety Question Idea 1 How about making a two sided wooden cookie die with the coin design cut into the die in reverse on the striking surfaces? Then take the marzipan, roll it into small balls and press them into rough circles. Lay a leaf of edible gold on the lower die, and place a flattened ball in the center of the lower die. Lay another sheet on top of that and press it firmly together. A sharp tap should be sufficient. That should make a gold marzipan coin. Idea 2 Take the dies from Idea 1 and oil them lightly. Make a batch of drawn or plate sugar, and press it into the dies, and press the dies together. After the sugar cools completely (that will be quick, but you'll want to keep the candy stock in a pot set in very warm water, to keep it flexible), remove the candy coin, and set aside. After the coins are made, you can get edible silver and gold foil, and coat the coins thusly: First take a coin and LIGHTLY coat with egg white, lay the foil on top of the coin, and using a dry sable brush, push the leaf into the surfaces of the coin. Just some thoughts... Brandu Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 01:15:51 -0800 From: david friedman Subject: Re: SC - marzipan coins At 1:03 PM -0400 9/23/98, Marilyn Traber wrote: >Why not make your own marzipan coins? There is actually a pasta recipe in Ibn al Mubarrad which tells you to strike the individual bits of pasta between your fingers like coins. Not gold--but period. It's in the _Miscellany_. David/Cariadoc http://www.best.com/~ddfr/ Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:23:57 -0400 From: Phil & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - Pastry Castles! Jessica Tiffin wrote: > There was a discussion a couple of weeks back about recipes in Taillevent > and Form of Curye for a subtlety with a pasty castle filled with various > fillings. I had a go at an extrapolation from this idea > - the effect was rather fun. > > The major problem I had, though, was in the texture of the pastry. It was > basically just a paste of flour and water, but there was no way I could get > it into a cylinder while it was still raw - it was too soft, and would not > stand up at all. I didn't have anything of the right size to use as a > "roller", as the Form of Curye recipe specified; I ended up parcooking the > pastry flat on a baking tray, and then bending it into shape when it had > hardened slightly - not ideal, as it then tended to crack, and it was very > difficult to join the cylinder (more toothpicks...) > > Does anyone have any ideas on making a more robust pastry, or cunning plans > for shaping the stuff raw? I'd like to try this again, it was fun to do and > went down well with the Shire Well, the recipe, if I remember it correctly, does tell us to make it stiff! The simplest solution might be to make a really really really stiff flour-and-water dough, or flour-and-egg-yolk dough. Draft the nearest 300-lb fighter for kneading! This appears likely to have been the period solution to this problem. Another might be to rethink the proportions of a castle as seen through the eyes of people who actually lived in, or spent time in them. Most aren't in the proportions of the castle in Disneyland. Is there any chance you were a bit too ambitious on your proportions? (No need to answer this, it was just a point I thought might need addressing.) The recipe also says to dry it in the sun or bake it, so maybe a really low oven might be effective at stiffening the dough without causing it to lose structural integrity. I'm talking about a temperature of 100 degrees Celsius or less. As for modernish alternatives, one might be a hot water and lard pastry, such as is used for various meat pies in the U.K. I generally use Hillary Spurling's recipe found in her edition of "Elinor Fettiplace's Receipt Book", my copy of which seems to have mysteriously vanished. I vaguely recall it calls for a pound of plain or AP flour, five ounces of lard, nine ounces of water, and some salt, I forget how much. Bear, Aoife, how far off am I here? You bring the lard and the water to a boil in a saucepan, pour it into a well in your flour, in a mixing bowl, and stir until mixed. As soon as it's cool enough to handle you knead it until it's a smooth, homogeneous pastry dough. While it's still warm, it is pliable, but when it cools, it stiffens up somewhat, so it's good for free-standing pies, baked outside of pie pans. However, it also works best when it has some added support, such as a filling inside, when it bakes. Some might even go far enough to wrap a belly-band of foil or parchment around it while it bakes. Finally, the other thing you can do is use any pastry you want, just about, baked "blind" in something like a coffee can with the top and bottom removed, on a cookie sheet, with the can lined with pastry, the pastry lined with foil or parchment, and filled with something like rice, dried beans, or metal "pie beans". Bake, allow it to cool, remove the beans, whatever you've used, the foil or parchment liner, and very carefully lift the can off the pastry. Ridges in the can shouldn't be a problem; your pastry is likely to shrink somewhat in baking. Flat walls can be baked on another cookie sheet, and everything can be attached together with something like Royal Icing (which, BTW, occurs at least as far back as the 17th century) for sweet pies, and something like softened meat glaze for savory ones. Not to mention the occasonal toothpick... . Adamantius Østgardr, East Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 12:59:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen M Beck Subject: Re: SC - Feline Suprise {Tasteless Idea?} (OOP) Excerpts from internet.listserv.sca-cooks: 16-Oct-98 SC - Feline Suprise {Tastel.. by Ann & Les Shelton at conter > This discussion lead to a split over whether one person's idea for a > suprise at feast was incredibly humorous or the most tasteless thing > we'd ever heard of {this coming from someone who had a large "pig > cooker" set up on site with a plastic arm dangling out of it}. His idea > is to carry a big pot of soup/stew to a table, reach in with a ladle and > plunk down a cat collar into someone's bowl! Personally, I can see how > under the right circumstances this could be funny as a personal joke; > however, at an event you'd most likely offend/gross out more people than > you'd amuse. Speaking of feline surprises, I had a friend once serve a Blatancy (cause you couldn't call it subtle) at a potluck: Mix together equal parts of brown and white sugar, add such spices as you will. Mix together chopped dates, raisins, figs (you know, the kind of stuff that goes into peascods), roll into "logs" about 1/4 inch around ad 2-5 inches long. Place sugar in a long flat pan with 2 inch sides (a new cat litter box works well, as does a lasagna pan), mix "logs" with your sugar, place slotted spoon (or litter pan scooper) in the pan so folks can server themselves, and serve hit forth. He had people running up to him all day, munching on these things saying "you know, that looks like...." to which he replied "yes, I know. It's a blatancy." ;-) toodles, margaret Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1998 18:15:50 EST From: kathleen.hogan at juno.com (Kathleen M Hogan) Subject: Re: SC - Soteltie??? writes: >What is a soteltie? A dish showing off your skill? Any examples? A soteltie (or subtlety)is a dish that creates a pictoral scene. It can be a sweet or a savoury. They are often decorated with herbs, candied flowers, bits of dried fruit, etc. Some examples that I have read about... 1. a wedding feast, England (IIRC about 1400's). A sculpture of sweet bread in the shape of the wedding party before the door of the church. Specific details include the bride's blonde hair and dress done in candied flower petals. Pieces baked separately and then assembled with marchpane and something that sounds like spun sugar. 2. a wedding feast (German)(no date given). A savoury bread sculpture of a rampant goat (one of the figures on the groom's arms) and a doe dormant (the bride's family). Specific details include the eyes of the goat and doe made of dried fruit. Both books were borrowed from a library in California years ago. I think one of them was by a Rodney? MacKinnon. The other one was something unpronounceable in German. One of these days I will start taking notes when I find a good book and keep them! Caitlin Nicfhionghuin House Oak and Thistle Shire of Bordervale Keep, Atlantia Augusta, GA Date: Wed, 21 Oct 1998 09:11:22 +0100 From: Robyn Probert Subject: Re: SC - marchpane holly leaves At 15:09 20/10/1998 -0500, Helen wrote: >I am sorry, but what are marchpane holly leaves? Make marchpane and colour it green with spinach juice (blanch the spinach, crush it in a mortar and pestle and squeeze out through cheesecloth), roll and cut out holly leave shapes, draw on the veins and let them dry. If you have more time, make little red berry balls and stick them on with eggwhite. These, with the gilded walnuts (spray gold is quick) and red cherries in flat baskets with pine sprigs looks great and shelling the walnuts gives people something to occupy themselves with until the real food starts... Rowan Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1998 11:51:07 +0000 From: Robyn Probert Subject: Re: SC - Sotelty question-Pirates! At 16:16 19/11/1998 -0800, Kat wrote: >Someone here was telling about the making of an edible "book" made with leaves of phyllo... is that person still on the list, and if so would he or she be so kind as to outline the procedure? I'd love to try something like that... maybe as a ship's log? That was me! I made the boards (covers) out of sweet biscout (cookie) dough (sweet shortcrust would work too), then partially baked them and gilded the edges using an eggwhite glair. The pages were 1/2 sheets of phyllo - a whole box worth - 'bound' with eggwhite and separated with a dusting of ground almond, cinnamon, sugar and lemon zest. The top pages were strengthened by sticking 2 pages together with eggwhite, then I calligraphed and illuminated them using professional food colouring (fabulous vivid colours!) and gold leaf, assembled the pages into the boards (more eggwhite) and baked the lot until golden. It looked great and tasted good too. Certainly adaptable to a ships log... You could even illuminate a nice map showing compass bearings, the four winds and 'here be dragons'... Rowan Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 07:14:19 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - Hedgehogs We're asked for hedgehog recipes; there's one in the Forme of Cury, which is part of a long series of several recipes using the same meat mixture, shaped and cooked variously: "182 Farsur to make pomme dorryse and o(th)ere (th)ynges. Take (th)e lire of pork rawe, and grynde it smale. Medle it vp wi(th) eyren & powdre fort, safroun and salt; and do (th)erto raisouns of courance. Make balles (th)erof, and wete it wele in white of ayren, & do it to see(th) in boillyng water. Take hem vp and put hem on a spyt. Rost hem wel, and take persel ygrounde and wryng it vp with ayren & a perty of flour, and let erne aboute (th)e spyt. And if (th)ou wilt, take for persel, safroun; and serue it forth." Later, we get: "184 Hirchones. Take (th)e mawe of (th)e grete swyne, and fyfe o(th)er sex of pigges mawes. Fyll hem full of (th) self fars, & sowe hem fast. Perboile hem; take hem vp, & make smale prikkes of gode past, and frye hem. Take (th)ese prickes yfryed & set hem (th)icke in (th)e mawes on (th) fars, made after an vrchoun withoute legges. Put hem on a spyt & roost hem, & colour hem with safroun, & messe hem forth." The Harleian MS 279 recipe (found in the Two Fifteenth-Century Cookery Books) used in "Pleyn Delit" calls for spicery, and, specifically, ginger. I'd go a bit closer to the earlier FoC notion of powder forte, probably a mixture of pepper, cinnamon, cloves, and maybe galingale. I'd go with 1/2 teaspoon of the first three for Pleyn Delit's recommended two pounds of ground pork, plus 1/4 teaspoon galingale. I think I'd go with 1 teaspoon salt. I like the idea of the almond spines or prikkes over the fried pastry ones, although that's a cool idea too. The Harleian MS 279 / Pleyn Delit recipe also omits the currants. I think a really essential point is to use the right cut of pork, especially if you're doing little ones without the natural organ casings. You need to have a sufficiently fatty cut to ensure moistness of the finished product. Probably shoulder (blade or "Boston" rather than picnic) is marbled enough without going overboard. If you just buy generic "ground pork" you might be okay, unless the supermarket butcher is on a health kick. Bulk sausage meat might not be such a bad idea -- it's usually seasoned with pepper and salt only, and is plenty moist enough. Adamantius Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 07:36:59 -0800 From: Anne-Marie Rousseau Subject: Re: SC - Hedgehogs Hi all from Anne-Marie Here's my version. Adamantius is right...your generic UNSEASONED ground pork works great and has enough fat that they stick together nicely. I like mine pretty spicey and slightly sweet, so tend to at least double the spices. Mix it up and fry a bit then taste test. Adjust the seasonings as you like. Also, please note that the originals do indeed call for sausage casings. In SCA tradition, we often will omit this and just do them like little sausage meatballs. I've done it with the sausage casings, and they were very good (Though getting the almonds to stay was a pain). These are a big hit at demos and with kids, being cute as all get out. Its also a good illustration of the concept of a sobteltie. enjoy! as always, all rights reserved, blah blah blah. - --AM YRCHOUNS: Take Piggis mayws and skalde them wel; take groundyn Pork and knede it with Spicerye, with pouder Gyngere, and Salt and Sugre; do it on the mawe, but fille it nowt to fulle, then sewe them with a fayre threde and putte them in a Spete and men don piggys. Take blaunchid Almoundys and kerf them long, smal and scharpe, and frye them in grece and sugre. Take a ltytle prycke and pryckke the yrchons. An putte in the holes the Almoundys, every hole half, and lech fro sometimes. Ley them then to the fryre; when they be rostid, dore them, sum with Whete Flowre and mylke of Almoundys, sum grene, sume blake with Blode, and lat them nowt browne to moche; and serve forth. (Harleian MS 279, c. 1420) a handful slivered almonds, lightly fried in butter and sprinkled with sugar 2 lbs ground pork 2 tsp ginger 1 tsp each salt and sugar 1/2 tsp cinnamon 1/4 tsp clove currants for eyes and nose Fry the almonds in melted butter over gentle heat. Don't over cook! They like to burn, even after you take them off the stove. Just before they're done, sprinkle them with a bit of sugar. Try not to eat them all before you use them for the hedgehogs... Mix the pork and spices; form into balls about 2" in diameter, and squish into a vaguely hedgehog shape (kinda ovalesque). Stick them with the slivered almonds, at least 6-8 per hedgehog, angled backwards, like quills. Place a snippet of current for each eye and a nose. Bake on a cookie sheet in a 350o oven for 30 min, taking care not to burn them, until medium brown. Drain on paper towels for a couple of minutes before serving. Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 15:37:39 EST From: RuddR at aol.com Subject: SC - Re: Hedgehog Diana asks: <> YRCHOUNS Pork Loaf Hedgehog Take Piggis mawys, & skalde hem wel: take groundyn Porke, & knede it with Spicerye, with pouder Gyngre, & Salt & Sugre; do it on (th)e mawe, but fille it nowt to fulle; (th)en sewe hem with a fayre (th)rede & putte hem in a Spete as men don piggys; take blaunchid Almaundys, & kerf hem long, smal, & scharpe, & frye hem in grece & sugre; take a litel prycke, & prykke (th)e yrchons, An putte in (th)e holes (th)e Almaundys, every hole half, & eche fro o(th)er; ley hem (th)en to (th)e fyre; when (th)ey ben rostid, dore hem sum wyth Whete Flowre, & mylke of Almaundys, sum grene, sum blake with Blode, & lat hem nowt browne to moche, & serue forth. Harleian MS 279 (In the original recipe the purpose of the pig's maw, apart from holding the meat loaf in shape, seems to be to roast it in a bag of fat. Modern tender, fatty pork makes this unnecessary. Also, roasted pig's maw is inedible, and must be peeled from the yrchoun, and scraped of the almond spines and "frosting" before being discarded. I also have not colored the frosting green or black.) 2 pounds ground pork or other meat 1 tsp powdered ginger 1 tsp pepper or other strong spice 1 tsp sugar 1/2 tsp salt or to taste 1/8 tsp cloves Butter for sautéing 1 C blanched, slivered almonds Frosting 1/4 C almond milk 1 T flour 1. Preheat oven to 350°. 2. In a bowl, mix spices, salt, and half a teaspoon of sugar thoroughly into the ground pork. Mound the meat into a hemisphere and place in a greased roasting pan. Cover it with foil, and bake at 350º for forty-five minutes. 3. In a frying pan, over low heat, melt butter and add remaining sugar. Add almonds and brown them, stirring frequently. Take care not to brown them too much, or they will burn later on. 4. When meat is done, drain fat from pan, and let it cool. Remove foil, and stick the fried almonds into the yrchoun, about half-way, about half an inch apart, over the entire surface, like hedgehog quills. 5. In a bowl, combine flour and almond milk, and stir it into a "batter". Carefully and slowly pour this directly over the top of the yrchoun. It should run down evenly over the sides, leaving the almond quills exposed. Carefully spoon run-off onto any areas left uncovered. 6. Return the yrchoun to a 300º oven for about five minutes until the batter frosting browns slightly. Be careful not to let the almond tips burn. Remove from the oven and allow to cool for a while. Then, with a large spatula, transfer it to a serving plate. Garnish the plate with leafy greens to simulate "natural habitat". Serves six to eight. Rudd Rayfield Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 17:21:40 EST From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Hedgehogs mfgunter at fnc.fujitsu.com writes: << I do have a question. I understand that "mawe" is the intestine casing but am I mistaken in the use of the term "lire" in meaning liver? >> Yes, liver is meant. While it is standard practice to leave these organ meats out of this mixture, their addition improves the flavor of the final product greatly. In my venison sausage I made recently I ground up the liver and heart in the meat mixture and a person who swore they would never eat liver scarfed down a half dozen sausages before asking me why I was so amused. :-) I would suspect that many SCA redactors avoid the organ meats simply because of a misguided notion that 'people' don't like them. The fact that organ meats disappear quickly from the store shelves shows this to be untrue. Ras Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 00:26:20 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - Visions of Sugar Plums? snowfire at mail.snet.net wrote: > I just received a late Christmas gift of a small basket of Marzipan > Fruits. Miniature oranges, apples, lemons, strawberries, plums, > pears... (Made by "Past Times, Oxford, England). :-) > On the bottom of the label is written, > > "Wealth was often flaunted at Renaissance Courts in the form of > splendid sugar and Marzipan sculptures". > > This sparked my curiosity. Was this a big thing in Period then? Yep. Not necessarily marzipan fruits per se, but sculpted illusion foods in a variety of shapes and sizes. The first period instructions that come to mind (although far from the earliest that exist, I'm sure) are the sixteenth-century recipes compiled from various manuscript sources in Book V of "Curye On Inglysch" (Oxford University Press, 1985), a.k.a. 'Goud Kokery', specifically the recipes for "ymages in sugar" in which various shapes are cast, molded, or cut from warm sugar candy. Almost period is Sir Hugh Plat's "Delites for Ladies and Gentlewomen", 1609, which tells how to make a compound for casting fruits, nuts, and other stuff into molds, which can then be half-filled with hot sugar candy and rolled around until the mold is lined with the stuff, giving you a hollow sugar fruit, walnut, etc. The hollowness is emphasized as something you might want, but no mention is made of filling it up with anything, if I remember correctly. Since the recipes date from a time when sugar is beginning to become _fairly_ commonplace, I'm not sure if being cheaper than solid sugar fruits might be an issue or not. BTW, when you go and make the compound as Plat instructs, what you end up with is chemically identical to Plaster of Paris ; ), or so I'm assured by a chemist friend. Adamantius Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 17:31:08 -0600 (CST) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming) Subject: SC - Re: Vegetable Warners Meliora wrote: >Alys Katherine, Thanks for the pointer to the salads with boiled >veges. We will definately be trying to track down some "recipes" >regarding this. Can you remember which source you found this in? I >have Markham but not May .... It's in Markham's _The English Housewife_. If you have Best's edition it is on p. 66. It's in the cookery section, #18 "The making of strange sallats" and #19, "Sallats for show only". #18 describes making flowers from vegetables and flower parts. #19 includes "carrot roots of sundry colours well boiled, and cut out into many shapes and proportions, as some into knots, some in the manner of scutcheons and arms, some like birds, and some like wild beasts, according to the art and cunning of the workman..." These are seasoned with "vinegar, oil, and a little pepper." Alys Katharine Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:19:58 -0500 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: SC - four and twenty blackbirds Hello! I'm in the middle of attempting Epulario's "To make Pies that the Birds may be alive in them, and flie out when it is cut up", viz: "Make the coffin of a great pie or pastry, in the bottome thereof make a hole as big as your fist, or bigger if you will, let the sides of the coffin bee somewhat higher then ordinary pies, which done put it full of flower and bake it, and being baked, open the hole in the bottome, and take out the flower. Then having a pie of the bigness of the hole in the bottome of the coffin aforesaid, you shal put it into the coffin, withall put into the said coffin round about the aforesaid pie as many small live birds as the empty coffin will hold, besides the pie aforesaid. And this is to be done at such time as you send the pie to the table, and set before the guests: where uncovering or cutting up the lid of the great pie, all the birds will flie out, which is to delight and pleasure shew to the company. And because they shall not bee altogether mocked, you shall cut open the small pie, and in this sort you may make many others, the like you may do with a tart." I took it out of the oven (50 min. at 400F, 30 min at 350), let it cool for about 10 minutes, & tried to get it out of the mold (a large foil-lined cookie tin). The top came off in one piece. But that's not a problem, it can be easily re-attached with toothpicks, & will actually make service easier. The problem is that the flour used to fill the coffin hardened into a chalky mass. I've chipped away at it, & finally managed to remove it all without breaking the bottom crust. (The bottom crust was not stiff enough, so I've popped it back in the oven at 400F.) My question is, can my 6 lbs. of baked flour be re-used for another recipe? Cindy (now to convince the neighbor to let me borrow her birds... ;-) ) Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:10:11 -0600 From: Heitman Subject: Re: SC - four and twenty blackbirds > My question is, can my 6 lbs. of baked flour be re-used for another recipe? >Cindy That would depend on what you plan on using it for. The same thing? why not? A roux? Possibly, depending on how hot the flour got during the baking. try a little of it and see what you get. If it forms a decent roux blanc, then you should be able to use it for almost anything you wish. suggestion- next time, try using rice instead of flour. Franz Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 08:36:42 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." Subject: RE: SC - four and twenty blackbirds > My question is, can > my 6 lbs. of baked flour be re-used for another recipe? > > Cindy The baking has probably coagulated the gluten, so your flour is no good for leavened bread. If the flour isn't schorched, it can be used in a number of other things. There is an Elizabethean recipe for Fine Cakes, which uses roasted flour. The recipe and commentary should be in Stefan's Florilegium by now. You might try Apicius' Fried Wheat Polenta with Honey. Roasting the flour should improve the flavor. The flour may work in unleavened breads (this is one I keep thinking about trying, but never seem to do). It will certainly work as a thickener and to dust cake tins and surfaces. Bear Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 07:22:07 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy Subject: Re: SC - need a wow! dish Nanna Rögnvaldardóttir wrote: > >Also, does anyone remember the source for a recipe that makes one huge egg > >out of a bunch of small eggs? It involves swirling the water... > > Other than the one in the Basel manuscript that involves pig bladders? > > Nanna "The Second Part of The Good Hus-Wives Jewell" (1597?) has a recipe called 'A made dish of the proportion of an Egge, for flesh daies'. It also calls for bladders as a shaping medium, and uses a prepared stuffing instead of yolks (although I believe yolks are in the stuffing), which then gets encased in the whites. No mention is made in that text about swirling water, but I recall seeing that somewhere else. Just not sure where. I also recall seeing such a recipe wherein the yolk of the giant egg is simply made from egg yolks. I'll look for it. It may also be the one with the swirling water, although I may be confused with something else: I know there's a recipe somewhere that produces a spherical fried egg, made by stirring the deep-frying fat into a whirlpool of sorts and dropping the egg in the middle. Adamantius Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 18:13:54 +0100 From: Thomas Gloning Subject: SC - huge egg -- oblats -- germ. _gar_ I have a recipe for a huge egg from a 15th century Basel Mscr. on my homepage: http://www.uni-giessen.de/~g909 (chose ALTE KOCHBUECHER) There are two parallel recipes, one in a Salzburg manuscript (ed. in Jourdan/ Mueller, I believe), the other one in the "Mittelniederdt. Kochbuch", published by Wiswe. Thomas Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 19:32:02 +0100 (CET) From: mefistofeles at DeathsDoor.com Subject: Re: SC - need a wow! dish-What about a castle? Towards the very end on the 2nd millenium a being known as Tollhase1 at aol.com wrote: > I have a dish I usually put on the head table. Its a pastry in the shape of a > castle. One fills each tower with different type of dish. Such as chicken in > one, pork in another, perhaps almond milk in the moat. Become even fancier > and add a pump for the moat. Saw a wonderful Period fountain for feast in the > Cleveland museum of art. With our shire being 3 towers, I like to use three > towers. > Have fun with it. I will send the recipe, etc., if you wish. In the Calendarium Oeconomicum (early 16th c) there is a manu describing castles, tree and animals, baked. That would be quite a sight. M. Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 19:00:54 -0700 From: kat Subject: SC - re: gilded food Isabella/Dee asks about edible goldleaf. I got mine from an art supply store, who had to special-order it for me. The cashier was on the phone for ten minutes with the company (can't remember which one), insisting that she wanted the 24-karat gold leaf in the catalog and them telling her they didn't have it in stock, couldn't she accept the lesser-quality stuff. Finally she says, in kind of a shocked whisper, "It has to be 24-karat because, well, they say they're going to, um... EAT it." And the guy on the phone says, "Oh, CULINARY gold leafing, why didn't you say so?" and I had it 24 hours later. It comes in a book of 25 extreeeeeeemely fragile sheets about 4 in. to a side, and costs about 80 bucks. Exhaling while manipulating a sheet can cause it to shatter into tiny tiny pieces. Practice a little with it; don't ever touch it with your hands, and try using static to get it to adhere to your food. Work in a room with all the doors and windows shut, and lock them so nobody "drops in." Turn off all the fans, heat and air vents, and think of Margaret Hamilton in the Wizard of Oz: "These things must be handled deeeeelicately....." :-) - kat Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:23:14 GMT From: kerric at pobox.alaska.net (Kerri Canepa) Subject: Re: SC - mock eggs (Lenten) >I've been reading, although rathr randomly, "Fast and Feast" by >Bridget Ann Henisch. > >In there, on page 45, is a description of the Lenten egg soteltie >which I believe has been discussed here before. >Has anyone made these? Yes, and they're kind of fun. Messy, but fun. >This sounds interesting. My question is what keeps these two colored >egg mixtures from mixing? I would think you would get a swirl of >yellow and white, not something that looked like a hardboiled egg. The resulting almond something like paste is actually rather stiff. The hard part is actually trying to insert any of the paste back in the shell without creating a really big hole. It's stiff but not enough to build a recessed area to put the yellow colored part in. I think the best we were able to do was to make a yellow layer. However, if the paste is ground fine enough and you have some sort of syringe like thing, you might be able to create a roundish "yolk" by injection. I haven't the faintest idea if there was a medieval kitchen tool like a syringe for such a task and we didn't try to do it that way ourselves. >Also, I assume in a modern kitchen you would bake these. Any guess at >what a good temperature and time would be? 125 degrees? 350 degrees? >You want the almond paste to solidify, but not so fast you burst the >egg shell. We used a 350 degree oven. We started with cooking for 15 minutes but eventually allowed it to cook for 30 minutes before the project got sidelined. There wasn't much expansion during cooking although it did bubble in the shell. The high sugar content is what causes it to solidify. Given that, consider using a candy thermometer to check the consistency at the various stages (soft ball, hard ball, etc). My guess is that there's a point where it reaches a semi solid state to resemble a hard boiled egg. However, the paste is a dark tan so it's a bit of stretch to say it looks like a hard boiled egg but it is a soteltie and the fact that you had to break an egg shell to get to it might be enough of a resemblance. One of these days we'll try it again using a more scientific approach . Cedrin Etainnighean, OL Principality of Oertha Kingdom of the West Kerri Canepa -- Anchorage, AK Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 16:51:07 -0500 From: Rayne and Richard Subject: Re: SC - Real feasts? Stefan li Rous wrote: > Rayne said: > > or "for the High Table we are serving the traditional live birds in a > > crust, everyone take care when the pie is opened and they begin flying > > about", etc. > > Have you actually served such a dish? Or is this simply an example. :-( > -- > Lord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra > Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas stefan at texas.net This was merely an example in a humorous "period" or OPP context, BUT I have served such a dish at a private dinner party many years ago in Germany. To clarify: As a birthday party "surprise" we baked an empty pie shell (filled with beans to keep shape) and a separate "lid". The owner of the home (where the party was held) had two white "lovebirds" who's wings were NOT clipped. We allowed the crust to cool completely. Then, right before we brought in the Pie, we gently placed the birds inside the crust. We had previously cut four large "airhole" X's in the lid. We set lid on the pie and carried it in. While singing "...blackbirds baked in a pie" we pretended to cut the lid around the pie (knife never entered the pie!). We then lifted the lid, the birds flew out to their regular roost (top of the curtains) and we all exclaimed that the birds were a few 20 short and had changed color. Everyone loved it. As the birds were regular taken to the Vet for check ups in a shoe box (filled with holes) they did not seem to mind the closed area for the whole 1 minute they were in it. Now luckily the birds were very well trained and the owner did magic tricks with them all the time at children shows. I would probably NOT try this at an event. The birds could be upset at a great deal of noise, an unfamiliar place, being confined for any length of time, etc. Plus the crowd might not like birds flying about while they try to eat. Rayne Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 12:15:01 EDT From: DianaFiona at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Real feasts? PRIDEelectric at centuryinter.net writes: << I would probably NOT try this at an event. The birds could be upset at a great deal of noise, an unfamiliar place, being confined for any length of time, etc. Plus the crowd might not like birds flying about while they try to eat. Rayne >> True---but the "Ferret Pie" served to the Baroness at a Thor's Mountain (Meridies) event a few years back was quite a hit! The ferret in question ended up spending the rest of the meal being petted and fed by the Baroness and her tablemates, I was told........ ;-) Ldy Diana Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 01:11:24 EDT From: DianaFiona at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - live animal sotelties stefan at texas.net writes: << How do you keep a ferret, of all things, from eating his way out of the pie? I guess this is a concern with any live creature. >> I didn't actually see this occur, since my table was too far away, but--if memory serves--the shell was baked with the lid attached (Filled with beans or such, I presume), and then a hole was cut in the bottom. The filler was removed and the beastie inserted, along with a suitable tidbit to keep him busy. They managed to get the timing about right, so that the ferret didn't finish until the presentation was done, at which time he broke through the crust and ran about the table with great glee, to the vast amusement of the feasters. ;-) I did see him in the Baroness' arms later, and I'm not sure who was enjoying the situation more, her or the ferret! Ldy Diana Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 18:55:57 -0400 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: Re: