whale-meat-msg – 6/26/05
Use of whale meat in period. Recipes. Substitutions.
NOTE: See also the files: whales-msg, fish-msg, salmon-msg, horse-recipes-msg, pickled-meats-msg, fish-pies-msg, exotic-meats-msg, eels-msg, frogs-msg, blood-dishes-msg.
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Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 11:38:47 -0600
From: "ysabeau" <ysabeau at mail.ev1.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks]Whale/Porpoise meat
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
I work for a Japanese company so I just turned around and asked a
couple of co-workers. They said whale meat is really tough and
stringy. They likened it to brisket as far as texture and
toughness. I'm not sure how that correlates to the description
below. They said it is usually served in thin strips because it is
so tough. One of them said it has more of a "sweetish/sour" taste
than beef. They both said they didn't like it and that it needs to
be cooked for a long time in a sauce.
Ysabeau
Barony of Bryn Gwlad
Ansteorra
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Jeff Elder <scholari at verizon.net>
Reply-To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 11:32:29 -0600
> Another Article about whale meat:
> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/foodmonthly/story/0,9950,547250,00.html
>
> and an excerpt on flavor from same article:
> Syotaro Akiyama, a photographer from south Japan, is a vocal
advocate of eating whales since he first tried it in the 1960s in
a sushi restaurant. He wrote: 'I placed it in my mouth, chewed it
three times and it just melted and spread through my whole mouth
flavouring the rice. As I swallowed it, the taste was better than
the richest cut of blue fin tuna. I still remember thinking how
could anything taste this delicious? Heated through, it tastes
like meat; uncooked it is like fish.' But the powerful flavour is
not to everyone's taste. 'I hated it at school - we always used to
have it with lots of ginger to hide the taste and make it
palatable. I wouldn't go near it now,' said my Japanese guide.
>
> Simon Hondy
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 14:01:19 -0500
From: Jadwiga Zajaczkowa / Jenne Heise <jenne at fiedlerfamily.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks]
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
> Anyone have any idea of what to replace Porpoise with? I have no personal
> desire to cook that particular animal. Redoing one of the Henry`s wedding
> feast in April and its on the menu.
Venison. Someone from period writes that you use porpoise on fast days
to replace venison... so the reverse would also be true, I expect.
--
-- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, Knowledge Pika jenne at fiedlerfamily.net
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 13:58:14 -0700
From: James Prescott <prescotj at telusplanet.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks]
To: jenne at fiedlerfamily.net, Cooks within the SCA
<sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
At 14:01 -0500 2004-12-06, Jadwiga Zajaczkowa / Jenne Heise wrote:
>> Anyone have any idea of what to replace Porpoise with? I have no
>> personal desire to cook that particular animal. Redoing one of the Henry`s
>> wedding feast in April and its on the menu.
>
> Venison. Someone from period writes that you use porpoise on fast days
> to replace venison... so the reverse would also be true, I expect.
Viandier has an indirect reference to this. In recipe 144 Porpoise
we have "Split it along the back, cook it in water, and slice it into
strips like venison." This does not prove that venison was a suitable
alternative, but does suggest that the possibility was in the mind of
the author.
On the other hand, the venison recipes in Viandier are not particularly
similar to the porpoise recipe.
In Chiquart Scully says in a footnote "The Venison of Dolphin is a
dish made simply by preparing this fish according to the standard
recipe for large game meat"; and there is a recipe for Fresh Dolphin
and a recipe for Salted Dolphin. In the latter recipe we have the
explicit "It is served, in place of venison, with rice."
Thorvald
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 20:49:37 -0600
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.at.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks]
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
> Anyone have any idea ofwhat to replace Porpoise with? I have no personal
> desire to cook that particular animal. Redoing one of the Henry`s wedding
> feast in April and its on the menu.
> Da
Does the menu specifically call for porpoise or dolphin? Corypheana
hippurus is found worldwide and has been referred to as dolphin for a long
time (along with porpoises and other critters). You may know it better by
its Hawaiian name, mahi-mahi.
Bear
Date: Tue, 07 De 2004 09:08:47 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Porpoise recipes
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
The 15th century Beinecke recipe collection at Yale
which was published as An Ordinance of Pottage by Hieatt contains
porpoise recipes. Number 26 is Numbelys of purpas or of
other fish; number 27 is Purpays yn galenteyn and number
28is Purpays or venyson in broth.
So even in the actual English texts you have in recipe 26 subsituting
"venison," "codlying, congir, and of other gode fyssh also."
Number 28 says: "make venyson in broth in the same manner."
Thorvald already noted that this was the practice in
some of the French manuscripts, so substitution was apparently
commonly done. Hieatt again suggests that they ate
porpoise in Lent and venison or beef in the recipe
otherwise.
Johnnae llyn Lewis
<the end>