stockfish-msg – 4/18/08
Period preserved fish. Stockfish. Salted, dried and smoked fish. Lutefisk. Gravlax.
NOTE: See also the files: fish-msg, seafood-msg, meat-smoked-msg, salt-msg, salt-comm-art, drying-foods-msg, pickled-foods-msg, vinegar-msg, salmon-msg, fish-pies-msg, Shrympes-art.
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This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
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Thank you,
Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
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Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: destry at netcom.com (Fellwalker)
Subject: Re: Period Vegetarian Cooking - help
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 06:59:55 GMT
Mark S. Harris (markh at risc.sps.mot.com) wrote:
: wmarquand at aol.com (WMarquand) wrote:
: > Im my not so humble opinion, fish is the food of the gods. I gladly eat
: > it with dee-light. Maybe I could go to the market and get some kippered
: > herrings (how period is that?).
: I've wondered about this myself. I know that salted herring and other
: fish were staples at least in some cultures and times in the Middle
: Ages. Just how close are the kippered herrings you can buy off the
: grocery store shelf today to medieval preserved fish?
: I know they didn't have the can, but perhaps they did something close
: using other containers. What exactly is "kippering"? The can doesn't
: tell you much. Would they have preserved fish in oil?
: Can you get dried fish today? Where? Oriental markets?
: Fish is not served at feasts in this kingdom. But I Like fish. I'd
: like to try some medieval versions on my own. I've not done much
: cooking of fish mundanely and since I'd like to find a way to do
: fish at an outdoor event, maybe someone can give some ideas on
: preserving/treating it for such events.
Smoked fish, especially salmon, goes over big at our Viking events (and
smoking fish is period). Vikings dried a lot of fish for storage (but they
had very dry cold wind to help them out with that) thus was born lutefisk
- which is dried cod rehydrated by soaking in a lye solution. Gravalax is
salmon preserved in a dill/brine solution...herring can be preserved in a
number of ways and pickled herring you can get in the store may be
suitable. Try some good Scandinavian cookbooks for ideas
--Morgan (Max)
--
Sleepy Cat Graphis http://emporium.turnpike.net/Z/zen/index.html
P.O. Box 608048 - The Church of Zen Fatalism -
San Diego, CA 92160 Artful Things Gallery
From: mjbr at tdk.dk (Michael Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Period Vegetarian Cooking - help
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 07:37:20 GMT
Organization: Tele Denmark
It was written:
>> Fish is not served at feasts in this kingdom. But I Like fish. I'd
>> like to try some medieval versions on my own. I've not done much
>> cooking of fish mundanely and since I'd like to find a way to do
>> fish at an outdoor event, maybe someone can give some ideas on
>> preserving/treating it for such events.
> If you can't find it anywhere else, New England certainly
>still sells wood-boxed Salt Cod. It even shows up as far south as
>Pittsburg... (Ooh, is some hapless Ansteorran pennsicer going to
>hate me now...)
We discovered a medieval recipe for salt cod whilst doing a revel
based on the medieval rules of Lent (details available on request)
which went down very well with those who attended.
Take the salt cod and place in water for about 24 hours (we changed
the water about every 8 hours). Place in a fresh saucepan/cauldron of
water and boil to soften. Take chopped walnuts, garlic, and
breadcrumbs, mix with a little of the water from the cooking fish and
heat. This sauce adds an interesting counter point to the fish.
I believe that medieval man was vegetarian only by necessity. The
upper classes and nobility (which most medievalists are, even when
portraying those of lowlier origins) certainly used meat whenever they
could.
We, as modern medieval cooks, must take account for the mundanely
vegetarian folk who share our interests. It just takes thought to
produce a feast that they can eat and enjoy (i.e. not producing boring
dishes for them), while not creating extra work in the kitchen. It can
be a real challenge :)
Michael Bradford
Viking Group Wunjo
Aarhus
Denmark
formerly Master in the Cooks Guild, Principality of the Far Isles
mjbr at tdk.dk
From: mjbr at tdk.dk (Michael Bradford)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Period Vegetarian Cooking - help
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 1997 07:37:15 GMT
Organization: Tele Denmark
DDFr at Best.com (David Friedman) wrote:
> mjbr at tdk.dk (Michael Bradford) wrote:
>> We discovered a medieval recipe for salt cod whilst doing a revel
>> based on the medieval rules of Lent (details available on request)
>> which went down very well with those who attended.
>Source? Sounds like an interesting recipe. I've been wanting to find a good
>stockfish recipe to add to my collection of "Pennsic without a cooler"
>recipes.
First the recipe (translated into modern english as I havent got the
source, which I borrowed from a friend) and then the source.
Sauce for stokfysshe in an-other maner
Take walnuts and cloves of garlic and pepper, bread and salt and grind
in a mortar. Temper it with broth and serve it.
The source document is Ashmole MS 1439, which can be found in "Two
Fifteenth Century Cookery Books" edited by Thomas Austin. It is
published by Oxford University Press for the Early English Text
Society. It came out in the early 60's (1964?).
Note: the publishers also printed "Curye on Inglysh" edited by
Constance B. Hieatt and Sharon Bulter (1981?) which contains five
cookbooks from the 14th century.
Michael Bradford
Viking Group Wunjo
Denmark
From: Mark Schuldenfrei <schuldy at abel.MATH.HARVARD.EDU>
To: sca-cooks at eden.com
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 11:21:33 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: sca-cooks fish
>Anyone have any good recipes using salted fish? I've never had any and
> since that was a staple in parts of medieval europe, I'd like to try
> some.
Alianor Llanfres (of Newfoundland) had done some wonderful research into
this area. I wonder what happened to her? Would anyone here know?
Tibor
From: ateno at panix.com (Eric A. Rhude)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: lutefisk
Date: 30 Apr 1997 17:37:31 -0400
Organization: PANIX Public Access Internet and Unix, NYC
morphis at niuhep.physics.niu.edu writes:
>rmorrisson at aol.com (RMorrisson) writes:
>>Greetings from Myfanwy,When I was on the Debateable Lands, we used to have
>>a baron who ate anything resembling food put in front of him. Baron Len
>>apparently requested blood sausage once, and not even pig's feet grossed
>>him out. (The Culinary Guild tried repeatedly!).
>>Len's persona is Viking and I always wanted to find a recipe for
>>lutefisk....
>Can't be too difficult, take some ?Cod? soak it in lye for 6 months....
Well not exactaly, when you soak lutefisk in lye and dry it
It is for preservation, not taste enhancement.
It is Cod, but when you preserve it, you take it and store it in
the rafters until some cold february night, when there is
no fish cause the river has 10'of ice on it. and it is
twice soaked in fresh water to eliminate all the lye,
then boiled and served with salt, pepper and butter (and various
other spices) or rolled in lefsa.
I have had it many times and enjoy it, but, I eat blood sasuage
and pigs feet too....
Eric Rhude
Ld Ateno of Annun Ridge, OM, Seahorse
Panix.com staff
From: "Mark Harris" <mark_harris at quickmail.sps.mot.com>
Date: 1 May 1997 16:47:13 -0500
Subject: SC - lutefish
This message was on the Rialto recently:
>>>Len's persona is Viking and I always wanted to find a recipe for
>>>lutefisk....
>>Can't be too difficult, take some ?Cod? soak it in lye for 6 months....
>Well not exactaly, when you soak lutefisk in lye and dry it
>Its is for preservation, not taste enhancement.
>It is Cod, but when you preserve it, you take it and store it in
>the rafters until some cold february night, when there is
>no fish cause the river has 10'of ice on it. and it is
>twice soaked in fresh water to eliminate all the lye,
>then boiled and served with salt, pepper and butter (and various
>other spices) or rolled in lefsa.
>I have had it many times and enjoy it, but, I eat blood sasuage
>and pigs feet too....
>Eric Rhude
>Ld Ateno of Annun Ridge, OM, Seahorse
Ok. So does anyone have any recipes for lutefish? Or more details on
lutefish?
What's "lefsa"?
Thanks.
Stefan li Rous
markh at risc.sps.mot.com
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 23:19:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: SC - lutefish
At 4:47 PM -0500 5/1/97, Mark Harris wrote:
>What's "lefsa"?
Flex Mazoh. Eaten with butter and sugar.
David/Cariadoc
David Friedman
Professor of Law
Santa Clara University
ddfr at best.com
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 17:19:17 -0400
Subject: Re: SC - lutefish
gypsy1 wrote:
Lefse is an unleavened pancake made from a soft dough, rather than from
a batter. Depending on what grain or other starch they are made from
(nowadays they are sometimes made from potatoes, which makes them more
properly lompe rather than lefse) they are either eaten fresh, and quite
flexible they are, too, or dried to a matzoh-like consistency, and then
reconstituted by wrapping in a damp towel for a couple of hours before
eating (HINT, HINT: are you getting this, Joshua?)
>
> Ok...but what's Flex Mazoh???
> Rita the Ignorant 8-) (=large goofy grin)
>
> On Thu, 1 May 1997, david friedman wrote:
>
> > At 4:47 PM -0500 5/1/97, Mark Harris wrote:
> >
> > >What's "lefsa"?
> >
> > Flex Mazoh. Eaten with butter and sugar.
> >
> > David/Cariadoc
Also eaten with butter and cloudberry or lingonberry jam. Some eat them
with butter and cranberry sauce, in a pinch.
Adamantius
From: Uduido at aol.com
Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 20:36:44 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: SC - Salted meat
<< Other possibilities include beating the meat with a mallet to tease some
of the fibers apart, which would not only tenderize but serve to
increase the exposed surface area and make the desalting easier. >>
Egads! Reminds me of those dried stockfish that you can find in Jewish
markets in N.Y. I have one (or rather half a one) hanging in my kitchen that
is at least 13 years old. I just cut off a piece whenever I am in need of
emergency fish stock. Pound it to death. Soak it. Pound it some more, Soak
it. etc. Makes great stock but I wish I could justify getting a new one. :-0
Lord Ras
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 16:40:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt)
Subject: Re: SC - lutefisk
The late Master Ragnar hosted a lutefisk party at one of Lyonnesse one
year. It was truly a feast. He invited all his friends who had never
tried this delicacy from his home country and we all gethered around and
tried it. It isn't bad when prepared well so perhaps those who don't like
it didn't get it prepared correctly. More closely one of the older stores
near my house has a strong Scandinavian populace since every once in while
they get huge quantities of lutefisk (an entire freezer full, the funny
cheese (whose name escapes me) and wheels of flatbread. Considering we have
a normally small Scand. population, I'm not sure where it goes.
Clare St. John
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 1997 08:58:28 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - re: lutefisk!
kat wrote:
> First of all, is lutefisk period?
Lutefisk, in its primal form, is as period as all get-out.
Or...well...yes, it's period. It is air-dried (as opposed to salt) cod,
a.k.a. (m.k.a.?) stockfish, probably the single most common medieval
food staple for Lent, if you go by the recipes. We really don't know how
period Scandinavians would have eaten it, though. As with many bland
foods (my favorite example being bean curd) it needs to be seasoned when
cooked. For those cultures whose only seasonings extend to salt and
pepper, that shouldn't be a problem. (I made a batch of haggis some
months ago which brought tears to the eyes. The only spices in it were
salt and pepper, but we seasoned them every step of the way, figuring
they were sausages, for Heaven's sake, and could NOT, as Jerry Seinfeld
says, not be spicy.)
I'm reasonably familiar with Lutefisk being served with melted butter
(sometimes drawn butter, but not always) and potato-dough pancakes that
the Norse call lefse, but the Swedes lompe. Hot dogs are also eaten in
lefse/lompe, BTW. Makes 'em almost tolerable.
> Seriously, now; I'm truly interested. It would make one heckuva interesting feast....
Hmmmm. It would, wouldn't it? Welcome to Lars' Viking Buffet!
I suspect that the long lines would form for the mutton prosciutto
(fennlaer, IIRC), but there would likely be some diehard Scandamaniacs
(a non-derogatory technical term describing people like my friend Ateno)
who would feel quite at home with lutefisk and lefse, which, in this
case, would be made with barley, rye, and whole wheat flour. It's kind
of expensive and not always easy to find real torsk, though. Might have
to make do with really well soaked salt cod or fresh cod. Don't forget
the lingonberries and cloudberries!
Adamantius
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 1997 10:18:04 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - re: lutefisk!
Griff41520 at aol.com wrote:
> What is lutefisk? I understand the dried cod part, but what is it cooked
> in/served with........I am familiar with the Italian Bakala-salted dried cod
> fish and the traditions surrounding it but know next to nothing about
> lutefisk or Scandinavian foods. It looks interesting tho.
>
> Ivy~
Lutefisk is air-dried cod that is, as part of the reconstituting
process, soaked in a powerful alkalai solution like potash or lye, which
changes the texture of the fish.
When properly prepared, it is rich, a little bland (copious melted
butter, salt and pepper come in REALLY handy) and so tender it is almost
quivery. You either love it or you hate it.
Adamantius
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 1997 20:06:10 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - re: lutefisk!
Uduido at aol.com wrote:
> By the way, is a 'stockfish' the nsame as a 'lutefisk'? I have a
> 'stockfich' which I bought in N.Y. City at a wonderful Jewish place that is
> half used and still hanging around in the kitchen after 10 yrs. (perfectly
> edible yet!).
>
> Lord Ras
Stockfish is the English term for air-dried cod, which would have been
reconstituted in period with repeated and lengthy soaking, after having
first beaten it for a long time with a wooden mallet, to tease the
fibers apart, and make them more receptive to water penetration.
Scandinavian terms for this that I'm familar with are Stokfisk and/or
Torsk(i).
Torski becomes lutefisk only when it is soaked in running water for a
while, further soaked in potash or lye solution, and then soaked again
to remove the alkalai. I wonder if the term "lute" means lye?
Some people cheat, by the way, and poach fresh cod fillets, calling it
lutefisk. Can you remember the name of the store you bought the
stockfish in? Wasn't by any chance Russ and Daughters, was it? Still the
best smoked fish place in Manhattan. The best in the city is in
Williamsburg, Brooklyn. I'm not even certain there's a sign above the
place, so while I could take you there, I don't know its name.
Adamantius
Date: Mon, 22 Sep 1997 07:07:03 +0200 (METDST)
From: Par Leijonhufvud <parlei at ki.se>
Subject: Sw. 'lut' == Eng. 'lye' (was: SC - re: lutefisk!)
On Sat, 20 Sep 1997, Philip & Susan Troy wrote:
> Torski becomes lutefisk only when it is soaked in running water for a
> while, further soaked in potash or lye solution, and then soaked again
> to remove the alkalai. I wonder if the term "lute" means lye?
At least in modern Swedish 'lut' means lye. I would presume that the term