liver-msg - 3/6/12

Medieval cooking of liver. Recipes.

NOTE: See also the files: organ-meats-msg, exotic-meats-msg, food-sources-msg, haggis-msg, sauces-msg, sausages-msg, blood-dishes-msg, butchering-msg.

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    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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Date: Sun, 3 May 1998 02:31:52 -0700
From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Chopped Liver/ Pate

> Speaking of liver, can anyone help me with documentation & recipe for Pate?
>
> ~~Minna Gantz <KALLYR at aol.com>

There's a liver recipe in Chiquart, but its not very pate like (boo hoo).
More like scrambled eggs, the way I read it.

- --Anne-Marie


Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 21:47:17 -0500 (CDT)
From: jeffrey stewart heilveil <heilveil at students.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Re: SC - Chopped Liver/ Pate

Salut!
To escape forever being branded by Lord Ras as a spoon tease, I am going
to do my best to fix the situation.  Therefore, Here is my recipe,
followed by the one in Alia Atas' Translation of Ein Buch von Guter
Speise...  If you leave out the wine/claret out of Alia's that's a pate.
If you go to her website you can get the documentation information you
will probably want.

If e'er I can do anything else...

Your servant,
Bogdan din Brasov

- ---
1/2 lb Liver (chicken.  It does make a difference)
1 onion.
1 hardboiled egg
Salt and pepper to taste
1 T margarine

Use the margarine and onion to saute onion.  Cook under a lid until it is
carmelized (1/2 hourish)
Add liver to onions. Cover. Saute this until when part of the liver is cut
open it is almost all brown.
Lake off the lid and cook off the liquid.
Blend with the egg, add salt and pepper to taste, and serve it forth...
- ---
Courtesy of Alia Atlas:

http://www.cs.bu.edu/students/grads/akatlas/Buch/recipes.html#recipe16

16. Von einem gerihte von lebern (Of a dish of liver)
     Man sol nemen ein lebern und herte eyer. die sol man stozzen in eime
mrser. und daz sol man mengen mit luterm
     tranke oder mit wine oder mit ezzige und sol ez malen in einer
senfmlen und nem zwiboln. die solt du syden mit
     smaltze oder mit le. daz sol man giezzen ber vische oder ber
wiltpret. Noch dirre wise mahtu vil anders dingez
     machen.
     One should take a liver (presumably cooked) and hard eggs. One should
pound them in a mortar. And one should mix
     that with claret or with wine or with vinegar and should grind it in
a mustard mill and take onions, which you should cook
     with fat or with oil. One should pour that over fish or over wild
meat. In this same way, you may make many other things.


Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 19:14:22 EDT
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: SC - Will's- more recipes

Here are the few recipes my co-feastocrat at Will's Revenge, His Lordship
Thorstein,  was willing to share. :-) Sorry for the lack of documentation but
this isn't my work. Enjoy. They are wonderful. :-)

Leverpostej
2 tablespoons butter
2 tablespoons flour
1 cup milk
1 cup heavy cream
1 pound fresh pork liver
* pound fresh pork fat
1 onion, coarsely chopped (* cup)
3 flat anchovy fillets, drained
2 eggs
1* teaspoons salt
* teaspoon white pepper
* teaspoon ground allspice
* teaspoon cloves
* pound fresh pork fat, sliced into long, 1/8 inch thick strips or sheets

Melt the butter in a saucepan, remove from the heat, and stir in the flour.
Add milk and cream and bring to a boil, beating constantly with a whisk until
the sauce is smooth and thick.  Let it simmer for a minute, then set aside to
cool,  Cut the liver into chunks.  Roughly chop the port fat and mix both with
the onion and achieves.  Divide the mixture into thirds.  PurÈe each batch in
an electric blender at high speed, adding enough sauce to keep the mixture
from clogging the blender.  Transfer each completed batch to a large bowl
and beat in any remaining cream sauce.  (To make by hand, put the liver,
pork fat, onion and anchovies through the finest blade of a meat grinder
twice, then combine with the cream sauce,  beating them together
thoroughly.)  Beat the eggs with the salt, pepper, allspice and cloves and
mix thoroughly into the mixture.  The blender mixture will be considerably
more fluid than the one made by hand.

Preheat the oven to 350?.  Line a 1 quart loaf pan or mold with the strips of
pork fat.  Arrange the strips lengthwise or crosswise; they should overlap
slightly and cover the bottom of the pan.  If long enough, let them hang over
the sides;  otherwise, save enough strips to cover the top.  Spoon the liver
mixture into the loaf pan and fold the overhanging strips (or extra strips) of
fat over the top.  Cover with a double sheet of aluminum foil, sealing the
edges tightly,  and place in a large baking pan.  Pour into the baking pan
enough boiling water to reach at least halfway up the side of the loaf pan
and bake in the center of the oven for 2 hours.  Remove from the oven and
lift off the foil.  When cool, recover with the foil and chill thoroughly.
Liver
paste may be served in * inch thick slices as a first course, as a luncheon
dish or on bread as sm¯rrebr¯d.

<snip of other recipes>


Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 01:09:20 EDT
From: Mordonna22 at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - making liver nips

troy at asan.com writes:
<<
 There are also numerous dishes varying from the basic theme of livering
 puddings, which are made similarly to black or white puddings, but with
 the addition of boiled, ground, crushed, pulverized, what have you,
 liver added to the breadcrumbs, cream, etc. >>

The lady of whom i have spoken before taught me to make liver nips:

        3 lbs. fatty beef roast (or add a bit of tallow)
        2 quarts water
        1 tsp. salt
        1 tsp. ground peppercorns
        1 large onion
        1 beef liver
        1 1/2 cups plain flour

        Boil the roast and tallow with the spices and onions until very tender, 2 to 3 hours.  Remove from the boiler, reserving the stock, and place in a roasting pan and place under a broiler to brown.  While the roast is browning, make a dough of the liver and flour.  Scrape the liver and work into the flour.  Form dumplings from the dough by "nipping" bits about the size of large peanuts
from the mass of the dough and drop into the rapidly boiling stock.  Serve as
a side dish with the nicely browned roast.

Very High Cholesterolly Yours
Mordonna


Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 11:47:07 EDT
From: Mordonna22 at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - making liver nips

troy at asan.com writes:
<<
 Okay, so these are liver gnocchi. Kewl! By any chance is it part of the
 Celestial Design of the Creator of the First, Proto-Liver-Nip to include
 any of the fat floating on the surface of the cooking liquid, or is that
 just to help the roast brown and stay moist? Also, does the recipe
 really call for 1 beef liver? A beef liver is _big_! Maybe a pound or
 so?

 Sorry to bug you with these questions, but I'd realy like to actually do
 this at some point, and I wanted to be sure I'd be doing it right.

 Adamantius >>

Well, as to the fat, it was not incorporated into the dumplings, they are
supposed to be "tight."  The idea of the fat for those German farmers was a
source of energy for 20 hour days on the farm.

The livers we used were always from young steers we had killed.  I was amazed
the first time I saw a cows liver in the butcher's case at a supermarket.  I
didn't know they grew that big.  I would recommend about a pound of calves
liver, if you don't happen to be lucky enough to butcher your own.

Mordonna


Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 13:43:02 EDT
From: THLRenata at aol.com
Subject: Re:  SC - Organ Meats

While perusing my brand-new copy of The Medieval Kitchen I noticed a number of
recipes where the sauce was thickened with liver.

Has anyone tried this? How pervasive is the liver flavor? (Other organ meats
are great, but I just don't like liver.) Is there any way to omit the liver
and still get a reasonable result?

Renata


Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 15:59:12 -0400
From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow)
Subject: Re:  SC - Organ Meats

>While perusing my brand-new copy of The Medieval Kitchen I noticed a number of
>recipes where the sauce was thickened with liver.
>
>Has anyone tried this? How pervasive is the liver flavor? (Other organ meats
>are great, but I just don't like liver.) Is there any way to omit the liver
>and still get a reasonable result?
>
>Renata

Hello!  The flavor depends on what kind of liver you use & the proportion
to other ingredients.  Another period method of thickening sauces is using
boiled blood:  boil it till it coagulates, and (sometimes you then fry it,
and then) pass it through a strainer.  Then add the blood to your sauce.

Cindy/Sincgiefu
renfrow at skylands.net


Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 16:45:24 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Organ Meats

THLRenata at aol.com wrote:
> While perusing my brand-new copy of The Medieval Kitchen I noticed a number of
> recipes where the sauce was thickened with liver.
>
> Has anyone tried this? How pervasive is the liver flavor? (Other organ meats
> are great, but I just don't like liver.) Is there any way to omit the liver
> and still get a reasonable result?

I'm going to go out on a limb here and answer what I anticipate your
next couple of questoins will be. I do this not out of disrespect, but
because I've looked into this a good deal and I have sort of followed a
specific logical path and come to a definite conclusion about this whole
liver-thickened sauce thing.

Now that you're really confused...here's the situation as I see it.
Others' mileage may vary. Sauces thickened with liver tend to involve
livers (poultry, rabbit or hare, usually but not always raw) pureed in a
fine hair sieve, and added to thicken the sauce with the warning that
the sauce should be heated until thick but not boiled. This would seem
to me to make them a close relative of similar recipes for chawdoun and
various civies ancient and modern, thickened with blood.

Obviously the less liver you use, the less like liver the dish will
taste. You could use blood, which would then make the dish taste like
blood, which some people don't mind and others would rather die than
eat. It's your call. In general, blood tastes rich and slightly gamey
but without the trace sweet bitterness of liver.

Now, as a substitute for livers and/or blood, sources like Taillevent
would recommend toast slowly roasted on a gridiron until deep, deep
mahagony brown, but not burnt black (the rack on a 250-300 degree oven
works great for this), crumbled and steeped in vinegar and/or verjuice
until soft enough to push through a sieve. Red wine vinegar helps with
the color illusion. It really isn't the same, but it seems to have been
done when livers were not available for one reason or another.

Still, you might experiment and possibly find that you can make a nice,
rich, velvety sauce that doesn't just taste much like liver at all, if
you don't overdo it on the liver puree. Just as a benchmark, liverwurst
is much milder than pure liver because it's maybe a third liver and two
thirds fat and muscle meat. You may find that a sauce thickened with
liver might take less still to do the job, and Not Offend. I have no
statistics available on this, but generally it's a good idea to have
some firsthand experience with something like this before abandoning it.
You will probably live a richer life as a result.

After that, of course, you always have the option of the dark toast ; ).

Adamantius


Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 02:57:43 -0500
From: allilyn at juno.com (LYN M PARKINSON)
Subject: Re: SC - Organ Meats

I find that if I cut up a chicken liver in small bits and then stir fry
it very quickly in a bit of butter, it does not have the slightly musty
quality that liver sometimes gets when simmered.  Broiling keeps a
cleaner taste, too, I think.  Try this, before you puree it, and see if
it helps.  I also like the taste when it is cooked in the fat from bacon,
if you don't go bananas about cholesterol.

Allison


Date: Sun, 07 Feb 1999 06:35:51 -0800
From: Anne-Marie Rousseau <acrouss at gte.net>
Subject: SC- period liver recipes was Re: SC - Finger foods

hi all from Anne-Marie

One of my FAVORITE recipes from Epilario is a pasty filled with chicken
livers, hearts and gizzards plus sour cherries. Yum! Sorry, its not my
recipe, so I dont have a reconstruction (Maestro Eduardo made it for a
party once)

The sour cherries do a number on the dusty taste of the liver. Yum! (oh, I
said that already, didnt I?)

There's a recipe in Chiquart as well, but that's more of a scrambled eggs
and liver dish, not very suited to your setup, it sounds.

- --AM


Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 21:14:58 +1000
From: "Lee-Gwen Booth" <piglet006 at globalfreeway.com.au>
Subject: Re: SC - Was Ravioli, dumplings, and excoriation - now cooking Liver

From Gwynydd of Culloden unto the Gathered Cooks of the List, Greetings:

From: Sieggy der Omnivore
>     (and besides, less than 3 people out of a thousand know how to prepare
> liver properly, I'd wager . . .)

Well, if my Lady is any judge, I am one of those 3.  I made her a dish of
organ meats from "Pleyn Delit" for her work lunches and she thought that it
was wonderful (it was far too strongly flavoured for my tastes - but then, I
am not much of an offal eater).  I do, however, have some questions about
the recipe which one of the more experienced cooks can probably answer.
First, the recipe (wouldn't want to be accused of being a "spoon-tease"!).

Noumbles

Take noumbles of Deer oper or oper beest; paboile hem; kerf hem to dyce.
Take the self broth or better; take brede and grynde with the broth, and
temper it up with a gode quantite of vynegar and wyne.  Take the oynons and
parboyle hem, and mynce hem small and do per=to.  Color it with blode and do
pre=to powder fort and salt, and boyle it wele, and serue it forth.


Pleyn Delit redaction
2 beef kidneys (ca 11/2 - 2 lbs)
3/4c beef broth or stock
1/4c breadcrumbs
2tb vinegar
2-3 onions. peeled
1/4tsp each ginger, mace, and pepper
1/2tsp salt (or to taste)

Cover the kidneys with cold, salted water and bring to a boil; then pour off
the water (or  save it for broth, if you have no beef stock).  Chop kidneys
into pieces about 1 inch square, or a little more.  Beat the breadcrumbs
into the broth (start by moistening it with just a tablespoon or two)and
stir in the wine and vinegar.

Meanwhile, parboil onions in salted water for about five minutes.  Drain,
and chop the onions.  Add them along with seasoning and chopped kidneys to
the sauce and bring to a simmer; cover and cook gently for 25 to 30 minutes.

NOTE:
In the notes, the authors say that "noumbles" is probably best translated as
various organ meats, that being so, I used (lamb) kidney and (ox) liver
together.
I boiled the onion in the same water as the meat and then used the resultant
liquid for the stew.  As well, the organ meats exuded quite an amount of
blood which I poured back into the stew.

Okay, that is the recipe, now the questions;
1) How are stews of this nature served?  That is, are they served alone in a
bowl or over something like rice?
2) I added cloves and galingale to the spices - just because they seemed
"right" somehow.  According to my Lady, the cloves really "made" the dish,
but I don't know how accurate period-wise it was to add these extras.  As
well, I increased the ginger to 1/2tsp, which she thought was about right.
3) The original says that the meat should be minced small - why then do the
authors have them as 1 inch pieces?  My feeling was that this was too big.

Many Thanks
Gwynydd


Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 11:29:21 -0400
From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <harper at idt.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Was Ravioli, dumplings, and excoriation - now cooking Liver

And it came to pass on 23 Apr 00,, that Lee-Gwen Booth wrote:
> From Gwynydd of Culloden unto the Gathered Cooks of the List, Greetings:
> Noumbles
> 
> Take noumbles of Deer oper or oper beest; paboile hem; kerf hem to dyce.
> Take the self broth or better; take brede and grynde with the broth, and
> temper it up with a gode quantite of vynegar and wyne.  Take the oynons
> and parboyle hem, and mynce hem small and do per=to.  Color it with blode
> and do pre=to powder fort and salt, and boyle it wele, and serue it forth.
[snip]
> Okay, that is the recipe, now the questions;

> 2) I added cloves and galingale to the spices - just because they seemed
> "right" somehow.  According to my Lady, the cloves really "made" the
> dish, but I don't know how accurate period-wise it was to add these
> extras.  As well, I increased the ginger to 1/2tsp, which she thought
> was about right. 

"Powder fort" was a spice mixture of strong-tasting spices.  As with a 
modern curry powder, garam masala, or apple-pie spice, there was 
probably more than one valid way to make it.  None of your spices 
above look inappropriate to me.

> 3) The original says that the meat should be minced small - why then do
> the authors have them as 1 inch pieces?  My feeling was that this was
> too big. 

If you look again at the original, you'll see that it's the onions that are to 
be minced small; the numbles are to be carved "to dyce", which I 
*think* means into pieces the size and shape of playing dice.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)


Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2000 22:57:41 -0400
From: harper at idt.net
Subject: Re: SC - liver (was  rare foods at feasts-rant)

And it came to pass on 27 Sep 00, , that Decker, Terry D. wrote:
> Of course, liver is very much a matter of personal taste, so perhaps some
> others will share their recipes and opinions.
> 
> Bear

Personally, the only kind of liver I can tolerate is Jewish-style 
chopped (chicken) liver.  But my lord husband loves it fried with 
onions, and orders it in restaurants now and then.  Anyway, for 
those who do like the stuff, here's a period recipe:

Source: Ruperto de Nola, _Libro de Guisados_ (Spanish, 1529)
Translation: Lady Brighid ni Chiarain (Robin Carroll-Mann)

Vinegar Which is Marinated Liver
VINAGRE QUE ES HIGADO ADOBADO

Take onions, and cut them very small, like fingers, and fry them gently 
with fatty bacon; and then take the liver of a kid or a lamb or a goat and 
cut them into slices the size of a half walnut, and fry it gently with the 
onion until the liver loses its color; then take a crustless piece of toasted 
bread soaked in white vinegar, and grind it well, and dissolve it with 
sweet white wine; and then strain it through a woolen cloth; and then 
cast it over the onion and the liver, all together in the casserole; and cast 
in ground cinnamon; and cook until it is well thickened and when it is 
cooked, prepare dishes.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)


Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 09:32:42 -0500
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: Historic Liver recipes (was SC - liver )

I was perusing Sabina Welserin last night and thinking about liver.  How was
it prepared?  Were any types of liver avoided?  What was the medical
philosophy concerning liver?  With Brighid's post from de Nola, I thought a
thread on historic liver recipes and documentation might be fun.

Not being into liverwurst, I'm thinking of trying the liver dish and the
liver tart from Welser.  The recipes given below are from Valois Armstrong's
translation of Das Kochbuch von Sabina Welserin.

Bear


21 A liver dish  
 
Then take a liver from a lamb and cut it into little pieces the size of a calf's 
sweetbreads and wrap around each piece a small lamb's caul and stick it onto
a spit and roast it like small spitted birds on a grill.  
 

26 If you would make good liverwurst  
 
First take a quarter of a pig's liver, also a quarter of a pig's lungs, chop them small, after that chop bacon into small cubes and put salt and caraway seeds into it. The liver and lungs must first be cooked, before they are chopped, and afterwards pour as much of this broth on the chopped meat as you feel is enough. Then take the intestines from the slaughterhouse and fill them full, then you have good sausage.  
 

77 A liver tart  
 
Take liver from a calf or a lamb, cook it until it becomes soft, take rich meat 
broth, chop the liver small and put salt, ginger and pepper in it and let it
bake.


Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 20:38:12 -0400
From: harper at idt.net
Subject: Re: Historic Liver recipes (was SC - liver )

And it came to pass on 28 Sep 00, , that Decker, Terry D. wrote:
> I was perusing Sabina Welserin last night and thinking about liver.  How was
> it prepared?  Were any types of liver avoided?  What was the medical
> philosophy concerning liver?  With Brighid's post from de Nola, I thought a
> thread on historic liver recipes and documentation might be fun.

You've seen Vincente's post with his translated recipe, which uses 
sheep, kid, or goat liver.  As far as I can tell, the Spanish corpus 
uses the livers of most edible creatures.  There are a lot of recipes 
for roast fowl which use the bird's liver in a sauce.  There are also 
some Lenten recipes for sauces using fish liver (tunny and dentex), 
and the _Arte Cisoria_ (1423 carving manual) mentions that hog's 
liver is often chopped into a pate-type dish.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)


Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 20:19:49 GMT
From: "Vincent Cuenca" <bootkiller at hotmail.com>
Subject: SC - Re: New to the list (also historic liver)

>The House of Aragon controlled both Sicily and Naples from 1442 to 1504,
>when control of both was cede to Spain.  Sicily and Naples were
>inter-related more ofthen than not from the 11th Century on.

Aaaand not one, but TWO people on the list are translating a cookbook 
written for the King of Naples, Ferrante (or Fernando, for those of us  who 
speak God's good Spanish).  Lady Brighid is planning on making her version 
available on the Web; I plan to publish mine as a book.

By the way, here's a liver recipe from it:

Vinagre, Which Is Liver In Sauce

Take onions, and cut them very fine like dice, and sweat them with fat 
bacon; then take liver of kid or lamb or goat and cut it into slices the 
size of half a nut and fry it gently it with the onion until it loses its 
color; then take a large piece of bread toasted and soaked in vinegar; and 
grind it well; then thin it with sweet white wine; then put it through a 
strainer; then add it to the onions and liver, all together in the 
casserole; and add ground cinnamon; and cook it until it is very thick and 
when it is done prepare the dishes.

Vicente
(not too fond of liver unless disguised in pate)


Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 07:14:24 -0500
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: RE: Historic Liver recipes (was SC - liver )

Anthimus gives the following advice about liver:

"Fried pig's liver is not at all suitable for either healthy or sick people.
But if those in health wish, they may eat it as follows:  when it has been
cut up well and placed on a metal gridiron with broad rods, it is coated
with oil or fat, and when grilled gently over burning charcoal.  When it is
hot, but still underdone, it can be eaten sprinkled with oil, salt and
coriander."

The notes concerning this passage are:

"Apicius used to stuff sows with dried figs and when they were full, he gave
them honeyed wine to drink before slaughtering them (Pliny, Natural History
8.209).  Their livers were cooked in herbs and wine, sometimes wrapped  in
sausage casings (Apicius On the Art of Cooking 7.3.1-2, Atheneaus
Deipnosophists 3.106e).  Ancient cooks often specified the degree of heat to
be used for a recipe, although quantities of ingredients are omitted (cf.
Apicius On the Art of Cooking 7.3.2 for liver cooked over a gentle flame).

"Gridirons were a standard piece of equipment in the ancient kitchen
(Maritial Epigrams 14.221, Petronius Satyricon 31.11, Apicius On the Art of
Cooking 7.2.1, 7.4.2).  Fat was sometimes used in cooking instead of olive
oil, especially when deep frying (e.g. Cato On Agriculture 79: 'pour fat
into a hated bronze pot.')"

Grant, Mark, Anthimus On the Observance of Foods; Prospect Books, Devon,
England, 1996.

Bear


Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 17:29:23 EDT
From: ChannonM at aol.com
Subject: > RE: Historic Liver recipes (was SC - liver ) 

 I found this recipe while reviewing the Arundel MS- Ancient Cookery, 1390 
English

Chowettes on Flesshe Day
Take the lyvere of a fwyn and of hennes and capons and cut hom fmal as to a 
pye and frye hom in grefe; then make fmale cofyns and do hit therin and do 
therto harde zolkes of egges and pounder of gynger; then kover hit and grie 
hit or bake hit, and ferve hit forthe.

Sounds like a winner to me. 

Hauviette


Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 23:40:35 -0400
From: harper at idt.net
Subject: Re: SC - Fascinating etymological study / too much free time???

Grenon sounds something like gra“ones -- the Spanish word for 
groats.  Nola has a recipe for a kind of frumenty made with wheat groats 
and almond milk.  It seems to me that the minced-liver dish might look 
something like boiled groats, but would taste *VERY* different, hence 
"faux".  I looked in a couple of online French dictionaries.  The word for 
groats is "gruau", but "grenon" may have been a borrowing or an 
archaic usage.  Just some wild-blue-yonder speculations...

Brighid (who was actually a French major, would you believe?)

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)


Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2000 20:40:39 -0700
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: Historic Liver recipes (was SC - liver )

At 9:32 AM -0500 9/28/00, Decker, Terry D. wrote:
>I was perusing Sabina Welserin last night and thinking about liver.  How was
>it prepared?  Were any types of liver avoided?  What was the medical
>philosophy concerning liver?  With Brighid's post from de Nola, I thought a
>thread on historic liver recipes and documentation might be fun.

I'm a while behind on the list, but no one mentioned my favorite 
period liver recipe:

Mufarraka
al-Baghdadi p. 201/11

Take chickens' livers and crops, wash, and boil in water with a 
little salt: then take out, and cut up small. Mix with yolks of eggs, 
adding the usual seasonings as required: then fry in a frying-pan in 
sesame-oil, stirring all the time. If desired sour, sprinkle with a 
little pure lemon-juice. If desired plain, use neither lemon nor egg. 
[end of original]

14 oz chicken livers
14 oz chicken gizzards
1/2 t salt
8 egg yolks
1 1/2 t coriander
1 1/2 t cumin
3/4 t pepper
1 1/2 t cinnamon
2 T sesame oil for frying
1/4 c lemon juice

Bring 3 c water to a boil with 1/8 t salt, add gizzards and simmer 50 
minutes. Near the end of this time, bring another 3 c of water and 
1/8 t salt to a boil and cook livers in it 3 minutes. Drain both, cut 
up small (1/2"x 1/2" pieces), put in a bowl and mix with egg yolks and 
spices. Heat oil and fry mixture about 4 minutes, sprinkle with lemon 
juice. Serve. The spices chosen are the combination Al-Bagdadi most 
commonly uses.

Unfortunately, it's very high on cholesterol, so it is a while since 
I've made it.

Elizabeth/Betty Cook


Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 16:46:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: Morgan Cain <morgancain at earthlink.net>
Subject: SC - Livyre Puddings (chicken liver pate)

> Livyre Puddings (chicken liver pate) - chicken liver, crumbs, fat, currants,
> nutmeg [Good Hous-wives Treasurie, 1588] (NOTE: may inadvertently
> contain crumbs of almonds)

>>>> Would you have this recipe handy? I know someone that
>>>> is looking for this exact thing just now.

I used the one in "To The Queen's Taste," but substituting chicken for pork where appropriate:

"How to make Livering Puddinges.  Take the Liver of a Hogge, and give it three or fower warmes over the fier.  Then either grate or choppe it verye small, and take a little grated bread adn two egges well beaten, whites and all, and Currans, Nutmegges, Pepper, and Salte, and Hogges suet."

(From "The Good Hous-Wives Treasurie", on p.40 of TTQT)

My version (from the redaction):  Boil 7-8 pounds of chicken livers in salted water until cooked.  Drain and puree in a food processor.  Mix with two matzohs, crushed into crumbs, one half-cup fat (margarine or schmaltz), about 5-6 tsp. of nutmeg, 1-2 tsp. ground black pepper, and a cup of currants.  Chill until serving.  (NOTE:  It is fluffier if you prepare while the livers are hot, but this can make it harder to stir.  HOT!!  Also, I left out the eggs, being twitchy about raw eggs.)

                          ---= Morgan


Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 18:06:15 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Livyre Puddings (chicken liver pate)

Morgan Cain wrote:
> My version (from the redaction):  Boil 7-8 pounds of chicken livers in salted water until cooked.  Drain and puree in a food processor.  Mix with two matzohs, crushed into crumbs, one half-cup fat (margarine or schmaltz), about 5-6 tsp. of nutmeg, 1-2 tsp. ground black pepper, and a cup of currants.  Chill until serving.  (NOTE:  It is fluffier if you prepare while the livers are hot, but this can make it harder to stir.  HOT!!  Also, I left out the eggs, being twitchy about raw eggs.)
> 
>                           ---= Morgan

FWIW, not having immediate access to either source you mention, I'd bet
money the eggs aren't raw by the time this mixture is put into sausage
casings and boiled...

Adamantius


Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2001 20:02:59 -0500
From: "Morgan Cain" <morgancain at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Livyre Puddings (chicken liver pate)

> FWIW, not having immediate access to either source you mention, I'd bet
> money the eggs aren't raw by the time this mixture is put into sausage
> casings and boiled...

Good thought, Adamantius, but I didn't see such a step in the recipe.  You
just make the paste, no further cooking once the items are smushed together,
and I didn't think the hot chicken livers alone would be sufficient to cook
the eggs.  Overall, except for being "sweet" instead of "savoury," the
recipe sounds a lot more like chopped chicken livers.  That's why I worried
about the eggs, but there doesn't seem to be any ill effect from leaving
them out.

                                ---= Morgan (who spent FAR too long
                                          standing in checkout lines today!)


Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2001 22:00:00 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Livyre Puddings (chicken liver pate)

Morgan Cain wrote:
> > FWIW, not having immediate access to either source you mention, I'd bet
> > money the eggs aren't raw by the time this mixture is put into sausage
> > casings and boiled...
> 
> Good thought, Adamantius, but I didn't see such a step in the recipe.  You
> just make the paste, no further cooking once the items are smushed together,
> and I didn't think the hot chicken livers alone would be sufficient to cook
> the eggs.  Overall, except for being "sweet" instead of "savoury," the
> recipe sounds a lot more like chopped chicken livers.  That's why I worried
> about the eggs, but there doesn't seem to be any ill effect from leaving
> them out.
> 
>                                 ---= Morgan (who spent FAR too long
>                                           standing in checkout lines today!)

No, no ill effects, but given that there is also (presumably) raw hog
suet (i.e. unrendered lard, possibly ground or chopped), for which you
have substituted rendered chicken fat, IIRC, I'd strongly suspect that
instructions to stuff this mixture into casings and simmer until firm to
be sort of implicit. At least one other cookery source somewhere on my
shelves has a whole slew of such recipes, and only the first in the
series actually bothers to describe the process of putting the stuff
into casings and boiling: for that time and place, the fact that the
term "pudding" is used implies the process. A modern example of this
kind of thing might involve, say, a meatloaf recipe that doesn't
actually specify to form the mixture into a loaf and bake it until done
to your taste... it's pretty much accepted that that's what you'll do.  

On the other hand, there are the various baked puddings from late- and
early-post-period, but those recipes tend not to include suspiciously
raw ingredients, generally.

Given the limitations built into your Lent/Passover scenario, it makes a
fair amount of sense to do as you've done, even if I might not do it
that way myself every time. 

Adamantius


From: "Michael Newton" <melcnewt at netins.net>
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] what is your project?
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 01:40:26 -0500

Since I have just been gifted with 4 to 5 lbs. of  beef liver, I'd thought
now would be a good time to experment (esp. as no-one else in my family
really likes liver).
I'm going to start out with Sabina Welserin's recipe for a liver tart (no. 77)
"Take liver from a calf or lamb, cook it until it becomes soft, take rich
meat broth, chop the liver small and put salt, ginger, and pepper in it and
let it bake."
I haven't decided on which pie crust recipe to use yet, although W has a
"pastry dough for all shaped pies" (no. 61)

Take flour, the best that you can get, about two handfuls, depending on how
large or small you would have the pie. Put it on the table and with a knife
stir in two eggs and a little salt. Put water in a small pan and a piece of
fat the size of two good eggs, let it all dissolve together and boil.
Afterwards pour it on the flour on the table and make a strong dough and
work it well, however you feel is right. If it is summer, one must take meat
broth instead of water and in the place of  fat the skimmings from the
broth. When the dough is kneaded, then make of it a round ball and draw it
out well on the sides with the fingers or with a rolling pin, so that in the
middle a raised are remains, then let it chill in the cold. Afterwards shape
the dough as I pointed out to you. Also reserve dough for the cover and roll
it out into a cover and take water and spread it over the top of the ccover
and the top of the formed pastry shell and join it together well with the
fingers. Leave a small hole. And see that it is pressed together well, so
that it does not come open. Blow in the small hole which you have left, then
the cover will lift itself up. Then quickly press the hole closed.
Afterwards put it in the oven. Sprinkle flour in the dish beforehand. Take
care that the oven is properly heated, then it will be a pretty pastry. The
dough for all shaped pastries is made in this manner.

The kneading of the pastry dough is opposite of what I've been taught in
making pie crusts, but I figure it may have to do with the crust being able
to stand on its own, hence "shaped pies" On the other hand, I could be
completely wrong. Why we're suppose to use meat broth in the summer rather
than water, I have no Idea. (any clues?)

I'll let you all know what happened.

Beatrix of Tanet


Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 04:48:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Louise Smithson <helewyse at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Rumpolt on Foie Gras
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Petru wrote:
Apparently there is a part in Rumpolt's cookbook about a 3-pound fattened
goose liver being roasted and served. Could anybody please (please?) supply
me with the exact reference and rough translation?
While we're on the topic, what else do we have on Foie Gras in period
sources after the Greek and Roman eras?

Well Scappi talks about it in his book, here is the bit on cooking  
livers I translated from Scappi for my Offal class (for full class  
notes see http://www.geocities.com/helewyse/Offal.html).   
Interestingly he talks about the 2 and 3 pound geese livers as coming  
from Jewish breeders.

Helewyse

Per cuocere in piu modi i fegati d?oche, di papari, d?anatre, di pavoni,
di galli d?India, di capponi, di galline, & di ogni altra sorte de volatili.
Cap CL, secondo libro

Tragli altri fegati quello del cappone, & della gallina nostrale ?
il piu perfetto, poi quello dell?oca, & del paparo, e tutti per esser
buoni, vogliono esser cavati, & cocinati subito morto il volatile.
Delli piu grossi si potranno far fegatelli in rete di capretto, o di castrato,
o di porco, & cuocersi nello spedo tramezati con alcune fetoline di lardo,
& di foglie di lauro o di salvia. Si possono ancho friggere in strutto
dapoi che saranno infarinati, & senza essere infarinati con fettoline
di presciutto. Gli altri piu piccioli si potranno soffriggere con grasso
di cappone, & di tutti li sudetti fegati si potranno fare diverse fricassee
con uva spina, overo agresto intiero, & in qualunque modo siano cotti,
vogliano rimaner piu tosto un poco verdi, che troppo cotti, ma il fegato
dell?oche domestiche che allevano i Giudei ? d?estrema grossezza,
& pesa due, & tre libre; Et subito morto il volatile si cava, &
si fa stare in latte di vacca tepido per un giorno, mutandogli il latte fresco
due volte. Cresce il detto fegato nel latte, & nel cuocere si fa piu
tenero, & vuole essere involto nella rete, & cuocersi nello spedo
intiero, benche con gran difficulta si fa star fermo.  Cotto che sar?
vuol?esser servito caldo, & non volendolo nello spedo s?infariner?,
& si far? cuocere in una padella dove sia strutto liquefatto,
rivolgendolo alcune volte, overo si cuocer? nella detta padella con
la rete medesima, & si servir? caldo con sugo di melangole, &
zuccaro sopra, si potr? ancho tagliare in fette, et infarinare, et
friggere con lo strutto.  Delli detti fegati si potranno ancho far  
tommacelle come ? detto di quello del porco nel Cap 107.

To cook in many ways the liver of: geese, doves, ducks, peahens, turkeys,
capons, hens and every other sort of bird. Chapter 150 2nd book.

Among other livers those from the capon and from the native hen are the most
perfect, then that of the goose and gosling, and all the others to be good
should be taken and cooked as soon as the bird is dead.  Of the largest
ones one can make faggots in the caul of goat or whether or pig and cook
them on the spit interleaved with several slices of ?lardo? and leaves of
bay or of sage.  One can also fry them (faggots) in grease after they
have been floured, and without flouring with slices of ham.  The other
smaller (livers) one can fry in capon fat, and with all these said livers
one can make varied fricasees with gooseberries or whole sour grapes, and
in whatever way they are cooked they should stay more than a little green
(raw) rather than over cooked.  But the liver of the domestic goose
that the Jews bread is of extreme size, weighing two or three pounds.
As soon as the animal is dead one pulls the liver and puts it to marinate
in tepid cows milk for a day, changing the milk for fresh twice.  Pull
the said liver from the milk and in the cooking it will be much more tender,
and one needs to wrap it in caul fat, and cook it whole in the spit, because
it is with great difficulty that it stays firm.  When it is cooked it
should be served hot, and if you don?t want to cook it on the spit flour
it and put it to cook in a pan where there is liquid lard, turning it several
times.  Or cook it in a frying pan with the same caul on it and one
serves it hot with sour orange juice and sugar above.  One can also
cut it into slices, flour it and fry it in lard.  Of the said livers
one can also make tommacelle (liver sausage) like that said for pork  
in chapter 107.

Per far tommacelle di fegato di porco.  Cap CVII Secondo libro

Il fegato come sar? netto di quella pellicina, & delli suoi nervetti
facciasi bollire in acqua senza sale fin?a tanto che il sangue sia bene stramortito, & dapoi cavisi, & pongasi in acqua fredda, & lascisi stare fin?a
tanto che sia sodo, & dapoi cavisi, & grattisi leggiermente con la
grattacascio, et per ogni libra di tal fegato grattato ponanosi due oncie
d?uva passa di Corinto ben netta, & altretanto zuccaro, & sei oncie
di midolla di boue cruda, tagliata in bocconcini, & tre oncie di songia
del detto porco, che ne sia levata la pelle, e tagliata a dadi, quattro oncie
di cascio Parmeggiano grattato, tre quarti di cannella pesta, meza oncia
tra zengevero, et noci moscate, un quarto di garofani, un?ottava di zafferano,
quattro rossi d?uove crude, et un poco di sale, et fatta che sar?
la compositione, habbiasi una rete di porco netta di peli, et d?ogni altra
immonditia, mollificata con acqua calda, tinta di zafferano, et di tal compositione faccianosi le tommacelle di grossezza d?una palla Fiorentina, et fatte che saranno ongasi la detta rete di rossi d?uove battute, et lascinosi riposare per un giorno prima che si cocinino, et cuocanosi nello spedo, o su la graticola, o nella padella con lo strutto liquefatto, et servanosi calde con  
sugo di melangole, et zuccaro sopra.

To make "tomacelle" (liver pudding) of pork liver. Chapter 107 second
book

The liver when it is cleaned of the skin and of it?s veins put it to boil
in water without salt until the blood is faint and then pull it out and put
it into cold water.  Leave it there until it becomes firm then take
it out and grate it gently with the cheese grater.  And for every pound
of this grated liver add two ounces of Corinth raisins well cleaned, and
as much sugar, six ounces of beef marrow, raw cut into bite sized pieces,
and three ounces of lard from the said pig, that has been taken from the
skin and cut into dice, four ounces of grated parmesan cheese, three quarters
(of an ounce) of ground cinnamon, half an ounce between ginger and nutmeg,
a quarter (of an ounce) of cloves, an eighth (of an ounce) of saffron, four
raw egg yolks and a little salt.  When the mixture is made have ready
a caul of pork, cleaned of skin and any other contaminant, softened in warm
water tinted with saffron, and with the mixture make the liver puddings as
large as a Florentine ball.  When they are made wash the caul with beaten
egg yolk, and let them rest for a day before cooking them.  Cook them
on the spit or on the grill or in a frying pan with melted lard, and  
serve them hot with sour orange juice and sugar on top.


Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 09:34:51 -0800 (PST)
From: "Cat ." <tgrcat2001 at yahoo.com>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Rumpolt on Foie Gras or at least goose liver
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

Greetings Petru

What you are referring to seems to be recipe #5 in the
section on page LXXII on 'From a native (domestic the
previous chapter is on wild goose) goose are nine and
twenty recipes...'  Following is my on the fly
translation keeping to the old German word order as
much as possible.  If you use it please give credit
for the translation.

Fried (or roasted ? the word is the same) goose liver
with a calves cawl (the cawl fat from around the
kidneys) wrapped / and nicely clean roasted (or fried)
/ when you serve it / so give a green broth
thereunder/ or a brown broth/ that is not sour.  And I
have the livers from a goose that the Jews in Bohemia
fattened / roasted (fried) / that three pounds and
many lot (not sure how heavy a lot is...) weighed.
One can also make a 'muss'  (like a mousse? It implies
mushed together, perhaps pate-like NO IM NOT SAYING
pate') from it / as was indicated previously.

No, none of the prior 4 recipes give instructions on
how to make a goose mouse.

Gwen Cat


Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 22:30:46 +0000 (GMT)
From: emilio szabo <emilio_szabo at yahoo.it>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Rumpolt on Foie Gras or at least goose liver
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

> One can also make a 'muss'  (like a mousse? It implies
> mushed together, perhaps pate-like NO IM NOT SAYING
> pate') from it / as was indicated previously.
>
> No, none of the prior 4 recipes give instructions on

In the section about the wild goose Rumpolt says: "9. Du kanst au? der Leber
auch ein Mu? machen." However, there is no description, how to make it.

Another possibility would be that he refers to this section of the  
preceding recipe:

" ... nimb ein saubers Wasser, setz die Pettersilgen zu mit etlichen G?n?lebern,
Hastu aber so viel Rindtfleischbr?h, die nit versaltzen, so ists desto besser,
da? du es damit zusetzest, thu die Pettersilgen au? der Br?h, mit einem Fauml?ffel,
thu es in einen M?rsel mit der G?n?leber, thu gebehte  Schnitten von einem
Weck darein, vnd sto? es durcheinander, vnnd  wenn du das miteinander
gestossen hast, so streich es durch mit der Br?h,  darinnen die  
Pettersilgen gesotten ist."

(boil parsley in broth of neat, take the parsley out, pound together  
with goose liver and slices of roasted rolls, press through a sieve/ 
riddle)

I am not sure whether the result of this procedure would be a "Br?h"  
or a "Mu?" (certainly not a mousse). It depends on how much of the broth you take.

> how to make a goose mouse.

Which makes me think. I have seen recipes for birds made from fishes and the like, but no mice prepared from goose liver so far. Might be an interesting  
subtlety, though...

E.


Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 10:34:31 -0500
From: Sam Wallace <guillaumedep at gmail.com>
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] some liver and other offal recipes

I particularly enjoy the fried calf liver from Lancelot de Casteau's
Ouverture de cuisine.

Fried calf liver.
Cut the liver into slices, & coat them with white flour, & fry them in
black butter, & put therein pepper & orange juice.

Given the audience and location, I use sour orange juice when making
this, but it sweetens up when it hits the hot pan. I put enough pepper
in to brighten the orange juice, but not really to be tasted as a
particularly strong pepper taste. Obviously, the liver should be
tender, not over-cooked. There are two liver recipes which also use
orange juice, but with otherwise different ingredients, on the
Florilegium.

Guillaume


Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 13:27:59 -0800 (PST)
From: Donna Green <donnaegreen at yahoo.com>
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Subject: [Sca-cooks] some liver and other offal recipes

I made lamb stew with liver sauce (See Brighid's translation below) from Nola for the potluck at the Crosston Ball yesterday. It was well received. It also finally used up the lamb liver that has been sitting in my freezer for a while.

Juana Isabella
West

22. Pottage Of Marinated Kid Which Is Called Janete Of Kid
Potaje De Cabrito Adobado Que Se Dice Janete De Cabrito
Take a forequarter of kid and cook it in a pot, and after it is cooked take it out, and cut it into pieces as big as a walnut; and take fatty bacon, and gently fry [the kid] with it and with a little bit of onion; then take toasted almonds and grind them in a mortar with a piece of kid's liver roasted on the coals and with a crustless piece of bread soaked in white vinegar; and all of this should be ground together with a pair of egg yolks for each dish; and after it is all well-ground, blend it with good broth. And then strain it through a woolen cloth; and when it has been strained, put it in the pot where it must cook. And cast in all fine spices; and put the kid in the pot together with the sauce. And cook it, and when it is cooked, cast a little cut-up parsley in the pot, and sugar, and make it in such a manner that it tastes a little of vinegar; and cast on it the pot-grease from the first cooking of the kid, and cast on enough.

<the end>
Edited by Mark S. Harris	liver-msg	20 of 20