exotic-meats-msg

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exotic-meats-msg – 4/18/08

Period and SCA Exotic meats. Swans, ostrich, crawfish, dormice, cat, hedgehog, frog, turtle.

KEYWORDS: exotic meat swan peacock eel crawfish cat hedgehog dormice

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NOTICE -

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that

I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some

messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium.

These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with

separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes

extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were

removed to save space and remove clutter.

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I

make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the

individual authors.

Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these

messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this

time. If information is published from these messages, please give

credit to the originator(s).

Thank you,

Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous

Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: Uduido at aol.com

Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 09:39:24 -0400 (EDT)

Subject: SC - Ostrich

<< Has anybody else seen the ostrich meat that is beginning to be for sale?

It is HIGH priced, or I'd have tried some. It was all packed in cryovac,

in a special refrigerated case, with posters all over the place telling

about it. I think I saw it in my son's fancy Giant Eagle in Pittsburgh,

but it might have been here in Ohio. I wondered if it would be as tough

and gamey as the peacocks and swans are said to be. >>

Ostrich is farm-raised. It has the texture and flavor of beef and is cooked

in the same way as beef. It is NOT a game animal and bears no resemblance to

game, taste or otherwise. I have not come across any period recipes using

this wonderful new addition to the butcher's case. (Yet! :-))

Lord Ras

From: "Philip W. Troy" <troy at asan.com>

Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 10:33:06 -0400

Subject: Re: SC - Ostrich

Uduido at aol.com wrote:

> Ostrich is farm-raised. It has the texture and flavor of beef and is cooked

> in the same way as beef. It is NOT a game animal and bears no resemblance to

> game, taste or otherwise. I have not come across any period recipes using

> this wonderful new addition to the butcher's case. (Yet! :-))

> Lord Ras

I think Apicius has a sauce for boiled ostrich, if I'm not mistaken. You

could argue that the time of authorship isn't in period (although the

SCA really has no early cut-off, apparently) but the recipes were

apparently used well into period.

Adamantius, barely period himself

From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>

Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 23:43:53 -0700 (PDT)

Subject: SC - Various

At 10:38 PM -0500 4/24/97, Mark Harris wrote:

>PS: Someone mentioned a period crawfish recipe. That might be interesting, too.

>I saw a bag of frozen crawfish tails in the grocery the other day.

Elizabeth points out that there is a crayfish recipe in _Le Menagier de Paris_.

>And there is no lack of people

>around here who need someone to get those "damn" pidgeons out of the attic.

Elizabeth likes to say that you can tell that not many poor people in

American are literally starving by how tame the pigeons are.

Annejke lists, among her subtleties:

>1980 Peacock in full Pride (real bird)

Master Chiquart (1420) advises his readers to cheat by cooking a goose and

dressing it in a peacock's skin; he says peacock doesn't taste as good. Is

that consistent with your experience?

David/Cariadoc

http://www.best.com/~ddfr/

From: "Philip W. Troy" <troy at asan.com>

Date: Sun, 27 Apr 1997 23:22:01 -0400

Subject: Re: SC - Crayfish

Uduido at aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 97-04-25 01:05:04 EDT, Stefan wrote:

> << Someone mentioned a period crawfish recipe. That might be interesting, too.

> I saw a bag of frozen crawfish tails in the grocery the other day.>>

> As far as I know the period recipes that I am aware of call for saltwater

> crayfish. If anyone has a reference intimating that freshwater crayfish were

> used would they be so kind as to e-mail me this information so I can fill

> another hole in my research? Thanks in advance.

> Lord Ras

Taillevent mentions ecrevisses and ecrevisses de mer, which would

presumably be sea crayfish, a.k.a. squillfish, essentially a variant on

the slipper or the spiny lobster. I can't think of any reason why the

unqualified word "ecrevisses" would refer to anything else than what it

does today, which is your garden-variety mudbug.

Re lobster, while we're on this: Homardus Americanus would have been

unknown in medieval Europe. The lopisters referred to would have been

spiny lobsters or langoustes, native to the Mediterranean and the oceans

of the Southern Hemisphere (hence frozen South African lobster tails).

Adamantius

Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 02:13:26 -0500

From: gfrose at cotton.vislab.olemiss.edu (Terry Nutter)

Subject: Re: SC - Pears and Jalapenos

Hi, Katerine here. Stefan li Rous asks:

>Are there any period recipe for squirrel? There are European squirrels,

>right?

The only one I'm aware of is that it is one of the alternatives for the

meat in Brewet Sarsyn (incorrectly rendered "Farsyn" in the Society of

Antiquaries edition, error reproduced in Warner) in B.L. MS Arundel 334.

It's a very nice brewet indeed, at least when made with chicken.

- -- Katerine/Terry

Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 02:17:47 -0400 (EDT)

From: "Sharon L. Harrett" <afn24101 at afn.org>

Subject: Re: SC - Squirrel

On Thu, 31 Jul 1997 Uduido at aol.com wrote:

> << There are European squirrels, right? >>

> Yes, indeed. And , joy of joys, you can procure the European variety of

> squirrel right here in the US of A. :-)

> The red squirrel was introduced from Europe. Even tho' it is smaller and

> kills and eats more birds (about 200 per year per squirrel) than our native

> grey squirrel, it is edible. And the more of them people kill...er, I mean

> eat the sooner this vicious little pest will be gone!

>> Lord Ras

Greetings from Ceridwen,

May I quote from Le Menagier? "Squirrels are singed, gutted, trussed

like rabbits,roasted or put in pastry; eat with cameline sauce or in pastry

with wild duck sauce." Let's see what we can do with this one folks!

*grin*

Date: Sat, 27 Sep 1997 18:37:02 -0400

From: Aine of Wyvernwood <sybella at gte.net>

Subject: Re: SC - Is there a Turtle in the house?

Aldyth at aol.com wrote:

> I have been offered a 25 pound snapping turtle as a donated feast item for

> our December 6th Hunters feast. The beast is on the hoof (flipper) at the 25

> pound weight. Does anyone have an idea what to do with it? How much usable

> meat will it provide?

> Aldyth

Well to begin with, find out if it is legal to kill....some turtles are

endangered species. Here in Trimaris I grew up eating Softshell turtle, now it

is illegal...

kill it by cutting off it's head, and hang upside down....to drain blood...

then you cut it out of its shell....and it is like any four legged critter....

tastes like chicken - sort of....you can boil or fry it...

if it is old I might be a tad bit gamy...

best bet is to ask around the old timers in the area, they will more than likely

be happy to show you how to dress it out and give you recipes to boot.

aine

Date: Sat, 27 Sep 1997 22:25:26 -0400 (EDT)

From: Uduido at aol.com

Subject: Re: SC - Is there a Turtle in the house?

<< I have been offered a 25 pound snapping turtle as a donated feast item for

our December 6th Hunters feast. The beast is on the hoof (flipper) at the 25

pound weight. Does anyone have an idea what to do with it? How much usable

meat will it provide?

Aldyth >>

You should be able to get enough meat off it to do a soup or stew. Be sure

and behead it and let it hang to bleed well for at least 48 hours in a very

cool place before dressing it..

Lord Ras

Date: Sun, 5 Oct 1997 07:42:25 -0500

From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>

Subject: RE: SC - honey dormice recipe

>Back on Thursday, Sept. 25, Aine said:

>>not to mention taste testing all those honey dormice.....

>Recipe, please! And where did you get the dormice?

>Stefan li Rous

Stuffed Dormice

Recipe By : Apicius

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

NOTES : Glires: Isicio pocino, item pulpis ex omin membro glirium

trito, cum pipere, nucleis, lasere, liquamine farcies glires et sutos in

tegula positos mittes in furnum aut farsos in cilbano coques.

Dormice: Stuffed dormice with pork filling, and with the meat of whole

dormice ground with pepper, pine nuts, silphium, and garum. Sew up and

place on a baking tile, and put them in the oven; or cook the stuffed

[dormice] in a pan.

Translation from Giacosa, Ilaria Gozzini; A Taste of Ancient Rome,

University of Chicago Press, 1992.

Stuffed Dormouse: Is stuffed with forcemeat of pork and small pieces of

dormouse meat trimmings, all pounded with pepper, nuts, laser, broth.

Put the dormouse thus stuffed in an earthen casserole, roast it in the

oven, or boil it in the stock pot.

Translation from Vehling, Joseph Dommers; APICIUS Cookery and Dining in

Imperial Rome,dover Publications, 1977.

Vehling notes that the Soouther European dormouse is an arboreal rodent

the size of a rat (one of my six new things before breakfast).

He goes on to state "Dormouse, as an article of diet, should not

astonish Americans who relish squirrel, opossum, muskrat, "coon," etc."

Giacosa shows this recipe as Apicius 397. Vehling shows it as Apicius

396.

Bear

Date: Sun, 05 Oct 1997 09:49:58 -0400

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>

Subject: Re: SC - honey dormice recipe

Decker, Terry D. wrote:

<snip>

> Recipe By : Apicius

> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

> NOTES : Glires: Isicio pocino, item pulpis ex omin membro glirium

> trito, cum pipere, nucleis, lasere, liquamine farcies glires et sutos in

> tegula positos mittes in furnum aut farsos in cilbano coques.

> Dormice: Stuffed dormice with pork filling, and with the meat of whole

> dormice ground with pepper, pine nuts, silphium, and garum. Sew up and

> place on a baking tile, and put them in the oven; or cook the stuffed

> [dormice] in a pan.

> Translation from Giacosa, Ilaria Gozzini; A Taste of Ancient Rome,

> University of Chicago Press, 1992.

> Stuffed Dormouse: Is stuffed with forcemeat of pork and small pieces of

> dormouse meat trimmings, all pounded with pepper, nuts, laser, broth.

> Put the dormouse thus stuffed in an earthen casserole, roast it in the

> oven, or boil it in the stock pot.

Just thought I'd throw a small note in here: laser and silphium are not

the same thing. IIRC (which is as close as you're going to get on a

Sunday morning before I've had my tea) silphium was a more or less

unidentified (at least to us) plant resin which appears to have gone

extinct or otherwise unavailable between the lifetime of Marcus Gavinus

Apicius, and the time at which the earliest Apicius manuscript (7th

century?) is dated. Laser appears to be the more readily available

substitute for silphium, and is believed to be asafeotida gum,

presumably ground to a powder. This is available as an extract in some

herb or health-food stores, and as the genuine article, powdered resin,

in Indian markets under the name "hing powder".

G. Tacitus Adamantius, always interested in Soul Food ; )

Date: Sun, 12 Oct 1997 16:59:09 -0400 (EDT)

From: LrdRas at aol.com

Subject: SC - Roc recipe-sort of

<< what is your recipe for Roast of Roc >>

Well.....I didn't really write it down. Basically, I thought I could serve

ostrich (period for my persona almost) instead of emu but the ostriches

weren't ready for slaughter. :-)

So I bought 2 emus instead (Serves 150) and borrowed a pig roaster. I cut off

the hind quarters leaving them whole and attached together. The rib cage and

neck were reserved for stock.

The emu's have several lbs. of fat internally between the legs so I trimmed

the fat from the carcass and rendered it. The resulting grease was used in

making pasrtry dough for another feast dish. The emu farmer slaughtered the

birds and skinned them for me. He thew in the livers and the fat for free

The liver was reserved for the Guild cooks and a few hand-picked liver

gourmands that were known to be on site, as well as a couple of event goers

who had expressed interest in this rare and delightful gourmet treat. It was

lightly sauted in butter and shallots and sliced for serving.

Four strips of meat located inside underneath the was also reserved

specifically for the 4 volunteers who spent there entire day doing grunt work

and maintaining the sanity of the kitchen. These were carefully removed after

the rosted birds went to be carved.

The birds were placed in the roaster at 10:30 am and basted every half hour

until feast began. The basting sauce consisted of 1/2 gallon Italian

dressing; 1 quart of raspberry syrup; 3 tblsp each of ground cubebs, galengal

and grains of paradise; 1 cup Dijon style mustard and 1 cup honey.

When tender at around 8 pm at the last course of the feast , each was

carefully removed to a 2 man platter which were paraded through the feast

hall and into the kitchen where they were immediately carved and served.

There you have. :-)

Ras

Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 11:15:51 -0400

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>

Subject: Re: SC - mustard and hiney saulce

Robert Beaulieu wrote:

> Does any one have a period recipe for a honey and mustard sauce to go

> with a roasted faisan?

While I don't have a period recipe for honey mustard, I can tell you a

couple of things that may interest you. The first is that Taillevent

recommends serving roast pheasant with fine salt only, and the second is

that the addition of honey to mustard in the Middle Ages was a signature

of Lombardy. Lombardy mustard appears to have been fairly coarse, almost

like whole grain mustard, and slightly sweet from the added honey.

I suspect that the coarse variety of Grey Poupon, with a little honey

added to taste, and some white wine and/or white wine vinegar added to

thin it down to a sauce, rather than a spreadable consistency, would be

a good approximation of Lombard mustard sauce.

You could, of course, make your own in more or less the same way.

Adamantius

Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 00:06:08 +0000

From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <harper at idt.net>

Subject: Re: SC - AAAARRRRGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And it came to pass on 3 Dec 97, that margali wrote:

> Philip & Susan Troy wrote:

> > Aaaah, you must have the 1956 English edition with the recipe for rat

> > bordelaise, I see.

> >

> > Adamantius

> the 30's paris edition, cat anyone?

> margali

The "Libro de Cozina" has a recipe for roast cat.

Lady Brighid ni Chiarain of Tethba

Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom

mka Robin Carroll-Mann *** harper at idt.net

Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 08:04:33 -0600 (CST)

From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming)

Subject: SC - Re: Worm Recipe (plus a "new" book)

In response to my comment that I had submitted a recipe using worms to

Petit Propos Culinaires, Stefan wrote:

>Was this worm recipe medieval?

Medieval, no. Extremely late period, depending on one's view of

"period". It was from either _The Complete Cook_ or _The Queen's

Delight_ by "W.M." from 1655. I don't recall the source now, but I

found one for pregnant women which included horse dung.

Alys Katharine

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:00:31 -0500

From: Christi Redeker <Christi.Redeker at digital.com>

Subject: SC - Specialty meats

I didn't find an answer to the "What exactly is a game hen" question, but remember goay? I found a place to buy them and any other speciatly meats... Including musk ox. They mention game hens, but I haven't found the exact reference as of yet.

http://www.hillsfoods.com/recipes.html

You guys will love this site!!!

Murkial

Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 18:20:23 -0500

From: dangilsp at intrepid.net (Dan Gillespie)

Subject: SC - bustard

Hello from Sylvan Glen:

There is a recipe in the 1607 Arte de Cozina cookbook that I've been