corned-beef-msg – 9/3/06
Corned and salted beef.
NOTE: See also the files: Preservng-CMA-art, pickled-foods-msg, spice-use-art, meat-smoked-msg, pickled-meats-msg, stockfish-msg, salt-msg, Lrds-Salt-Exp-art.
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Date: Mon, 1 Dec 1997 19:32:55 -0600 (CST)
From: L Herr-Gelatt and J R Gelatt <liontamr at ptd.net>
Subject: SC - Beef Recipes
Hello folks! I hope you had a happy Turkey Day.
I am wondering if anyone can solve a mystery for me. Our recent discussion
about Corned Beef lead me to search for preserved beef recipes (corned in
particular, but I'm not fussy). I have a recipe from Apecius for preserved
beef that includes pickling, which I have used, but is not terribly similar
to corned beef. I have recipes for potted beef (a beef paste made w/butter).
Pressed beef is slightly out of period. I have a recipe for Collered Beef
which looks fairly close but is also just out of period. No where can I seem
to find a recipe for Corned beef, Salt Beef, Pickled beef, etc. in my
sources, unless they are out of period----mostly way out.
I ran across a referance to corned beef (allegorically) in a description of
a long winded 12th century Irish poem in a reference on the net. It seems
Corned Beef was the lure to tempt the demons of gluttony from the King's
stomach. It was called salt beef then. It seems the handle "corned" was
picked up around the time of the potato famine, when most of the beef in
Ireland was exported packed in kernels of salt the size of corn.
So here is my quandry: Are there any preserved beef recipes from mid to
later period Europe or British Isles? My sources do not provide any, but my
library is by no means complete. I want to "corn" my own brisket as a
surprise for my mom, but I have an eye towards doing this for an event in
quantity. I have a site where the primary cooking aparatus are range-tops.
That makes it perfect for boiled beef.
It occurs to me that salt beef may have been one of those "so simple you
can't mess it up" recipes that were understood intuitively by period cooks.
Or possibly, an item supplied by somene who made it professionally and sold
it to many households. Or, quite possibly, preserving it was the job of
someone who did not write cookbooks or recipes! Or else, I've been looking
in the wrong places. I just don't know.
Aoife
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:59:18 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Spices and the Irish Common folk
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
The best books now on Irish foods are Brid Mahon's Land of Milk and Honey and
Cowan and Sexton's Ireland's Traditional Foods which came out in 1997
as part of the Euroterroirs project to identify regional foods.
The latter book says that the traditional ingredients are beef, salt,
and saltpetre. Modern additions include sodium ascorbate.
History wise, the dish goes back to the 11th century where it is
mentioned in the Aislinge meic Conglinne. Mahon also relates this,
calling the work The Vision of Mac Conglinne.
There is a spiced beef which is a corned beef with additional spices dates back to at least the 14th century. [Cowan and Sexton say that spices
were imported to Ireland in greater quanities following the Anglo-Norman
invasions of the 12th century.] This is something traditionally made at
home and served at Christmas. http://www.irelandforvisitors.com/recipes/blbeef.htm
Corned Beef was a major product in the 18th and later centuries where any beef not consumed fresh was salted down for later consumption. Cork for several centuries was a source of corned beef and ships bound for the Americas and Europe carried the product from Ireland. Cork also produced the corned beef that fed the British Armies during the Napoleonic Wars.
Among the best recipes for home corning that I have found are those
found in Grace Firth's Stillroom Cookery.
Johnnae llyn Lewis
Helen Schultz wrote:
> I've been having a discussion with my father (a self-proclaimed
> authority on almost anything <grin>) about the types of spices the
> common Irish folk might have had. This was sparked by a neighbor
> taking him to dinner for St. Patrick's Day and he felt the corned
> beef & cabbage wasn't fixed correctly <sigh>.
>
> I did find him a fairly good recipe for it on Martha Stewart.com,
> but he has come back to me with the idea that the common Irish folk
> who invented this dish (?? did they, I don't know that, myself)
> just didn't have the spices necessary for making corned beef. I
> told him I could show him 14th century recipes in England that used
> most of these spices, but he countered that the common folk
> wouldn't have had them.
>
> Anyway, what I need is some help finding out the real story behind
> not only the way corned beef came about, but also some info on the
> spices normally used to make corned beef. Martha Stewart corned
> her beef with water, pickling salt, dry mustard, pickling spices,
> garlic, and ground pepper. Now, pickling salt would be just good
> old sea salt, I'm sure. Mustard is no problem, neither is
> garlic... but what about pickling spices? I don't pickle, so I
> don't know what they are a mixture of. Pepper might have been a
> slight problem for a common Irishman, but was it totally un-used by
> them??
>
> Any help would be welcome.
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Meisterin Katarina Helene von Schšnborn, OL
> Shire of Narrental (Peru, Indiana) http://narrental.home.comcast.net
> Middle Kingdom
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 21:48:09 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Corning as a term-- OEDwise
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Corn-- selected definitions from the OED--- Johnnae
c. Kind or size of `grain'. Obs.
* 1674-91 Ray N.C. Words 206 The Ale serves to harden the Corn of
the Salt.
* 1679 Plot Staffordsh. (1686) 94 If they intend a large Corne [of
salt] they put into it [the brine] about..a quart of the
strongest
and stalest Ale.
2. intr. To take the form of grains, to become granular. Obs.
* 1560 Whitehorne Ord. Souldiours (1588) 28 Into the which Seeue
the
pouder must be put while it is dancke, and also a little bowle,
that when you sifte, it may roule vp and doune vpon the clots of
pouder, to breake them, that it may corne, and runne through the
hooles of the Seeue.
* 1674-91 Ray Making Salt Coll. 206 After one hour's boiling the
Brine will begin to corn.
* 1679 Plot Staffordsh. (1686) 94 They boile it [the brine] again
gently till it begin to Corne.
3. trans. To sprinkle with salt in grains; to season, pickle, or
preserve with salt; to salt.
* 1565-73 Cooper Thesaurus, Aspergere salem carnibus, to corne with
salt.
* 1573 Tusser Husb. (1878) 167 Some corneth, some brineth, some
will
not be taught, where meate is attainted, there cookrie is naught.
* 1634 R. H. Salernes Regim. 86 The foresaid fishes be better,
beeing a little corned with Salt, then fresh, or utterly salt.
* 1748 Richardson Clarissa (1811) V. 266 The beef was woundily
corned.
* 1801 Chron. in Ann. Reg. 1800, 110 Herrings sprinkled (or, as it
is termed, `roused or corned') with a moderate quantity of salt.
* 1882 Sat. Rev. LIV. 642 Obliged to corn a great part of the meat
as the only way of preserving it for use.
Phil Troy / G. Tacitus Adamantius wrote: snipped
> It's been alleged by various sources that "corning" is a reference
> either to A) coarse salt resembling "corns" of gunpowder, or possibly
> B) actually containing some of that gunpowder (for its saltpeter
> content). Spices are sort of incidental, it appears.
> I've never encountered a period or near-period reference to corned
> beef, myself: salt beef, yes, and later, powdered beef.
Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2006 18:59:52 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Spices and the Irish Common folk
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Mistress Kiri forgot to mention that Peter Brear's All The King's Cooks
has material in it on salt beef. He mentions Andrew Boorde
and Tusser as sources among others. Two recipes for Dry
Salt or Corned Beef and Wet Salt Beef are included. See
pages 56-57.
Johnnae
Elaine Koogler wrote:
===
Except, according to Peter Brears ("10,000 Years
of British Cooking", "All the King's Cooks") and Madge Lorwin ("Dining
with William Shakespeare") at the Yule season, when pork brawn was
served as a celebratory dish for the Christmas feast. Brears even has
pictures of the cooks at Hampton Court recreating the dish at the
Christmas celebrations there. It's a wonderful dish...I've served it at
a couple of late period feasts and it was consumed with great glee by
the attendees.
Kiri
Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:10:56 -0500
From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] recipes for salted beef was Spices and the
Irish Common folk
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Another source for actual recipes plus excellent commentary
on the topic of salt beef, the use of saltpeter, and the kinds of salt
may be found in the Tudor-Jacobean manuscripts that make
up Martha Washington's Booke of Cookery with commentary
by Karen Hess. See recipes 196 and 197.
Johnnae
<the end>