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chopped-meat-msg - 10/11/04

 

Period chopped meat. Differences between chopped and ground meat.

 

NOTE: See also the files: meat-rolled-msg, meatloaf-msg, minced-meat-art, roast-meats-msg, pickled-meats-msg, steaks-msg, whole-pig-msg, Braised-Beef-art.

 

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NOTICE -

 

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I  have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

 

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

 

I have done  a limited amount  of  editing. Messages having to do  with separate topics  were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the  message IDs  were removed to save space and remove clutter.

 

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make  no claims  as  to the accuracy  of  the information  given  by the individual authors.

 

Please respect the time  and  efforts of  those who have written  these messages. The copyright status  of these messages  is  unclear  at this time. If information  is  published  from  these  messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

 

Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org

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Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 07:26:01 -0400

From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Subject: Re: Steak Tartar (Was Re: [Sca-cooks] Capers caper)

 

Stefan li Rous wrote:

> We have had discussions here previously about how close hamburger or

> ground meats approximate the similar period meat treatment, which

> would be finely chopping it with a knife, which you seem to have

> actually done.

>

> How would you compare the textures? How much time does it take you

> to finely chop it enough?

 

The main areas of difference are these, as far as I'm concerned. Others

may have other issues. In ground meat, the connective tissue (which of

course is rather low in a beef tenderloin for the tartare example) is

sort of pulled apart, often separated from the meat, and sometimes

gathered together by the grinder, sometimes not. Essentially, when you

do get gristle, it tends to be... impressive. When you chop the meat,

everything gets chopped. Same for fat. The fat is often obliterated to a

greasy smear by a grinder; chopped fat is merely chopped, mixed with the

meat, and does its job to keep the whole thing moist. (Recall that

sausage recipes generally call for hard back or kidney fat, sometimes

even cubed by hand, rather than soft or, G-d help us, rendered fat, as a

rule. The logic is the same.)

 

In short, chopped meat, while perhaps being more granular in texture

than ground meat, is also somehow more homogeneous, overall. Yes, it is

a paradox, but true nonetheless. And the little granules feel different

in the mouth than the semi-crushed, semi-extruded threads from a grinder do.

 

Adamantius

 

 

Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 14:22:12 -0400

From: margali <margali at 99main.com>

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Re: Steak Tartar + Chocolate mousse recipe

 

I favor the chinese 2 cleaver method on a very solid butchers

block. Place meat on block, clear the area of enquiring toddlers

and nosy roommates and holding the cleavers in paralell, start

chopping, and periodically scrape the pile of meat back into the

center to get the bigger bits. My wrists are going, but Rob can

total out a sizeable hunk of meat in fairly short order.

Especially great if you are at a camping event and want to make

anything with any sort of finely minced meat. The size of the

meat fragments is actually fairly controlable with practice.

 

margali

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2004 14:27:44 +0000

From: nickiandme at att.net

Subject: [Sca-cooks] RE: Meep! - Needing quick beef pastry recipe!

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org (Group-SCACooks)

 

<deleted>

Filling:

        1 lb. ground mutton or beef

<more deleted>

 

I find it interesting that they say ground mutton or beef.  I prefer to  

use the medieval shredded meats.  It gives the end product a totally  

different texture and even flavor.  The flavor seems to be more intense  

in shredded meats with the same amount of spices as does that of  

commercially ground meats.

 

Kateryn de Devleyn

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2004 10:37:19 -0400

From: "Jeff Gedney" <gedney1 at iconn.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Meep! - Needing quick beef pastry recipe!

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

 

I have found a HUGE difference in both texture and flavor between  

using preground raw meats and boiling then grinding/shreading chunk or

whole meats.

When the recipe calls for boiling meat and "smyting" it "small" to be  

mixed with other ingredients, like eggs etc, I think that if they are

boiled then shredded the meat is superior.

Especially if you are boiling in a good broth...

 

If you take the time to boil chunks of beef in a beef broth, then  

fishing them out and cutting them in 1/4 inch slices across the grain,

they fairly come apart completely, and will mix really well into a nice  

pastry filling.

 

Capt Elias

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2004 11:40:09 -0400

From: Daniel Myers <edouard at medievalcookery.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] RE: Meep! - Needing quick beef pastry recipe!

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

 

On Jul 27, 2004, at 10:27 AM, nickiandme at att.net wrote:

> <deleted>

> Filling:

>      1 lb. ground mutton or beef

> <more deleted>

>

> I find it interesting that they say ground mutton or beef.  I prefer

> to use the medieval shredded meats.  It gives the end product a

> totally different texture and even flavor.  The flavor seems to be

> more intense in shredded meats with the same amount of spices as does

> that of commercially ground meats.

 

Being the "they" in question, I originally made this recipe with time

and ease of preparation in mind.  Modernly, it is far quicker and

easier to work with ground beef than it is to mince the same quantity

of meat.  All that being said, there *is* a notable difference in

flavor and texture.  I have made this recipe both ways (and with both

beef and mutton) and I also prefer the minced beef to the ground - but

it's still quite tasty the other way.

 

I'll be updating the recipe to reflect all this - thanks for pointing

it out!

 

- Doc

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

   Edouard Halidai  (Daniel Myers)

   http://www.medievalcookery.com/

 

<the end>



Formatting copyright © Mark S. Harris (THLord Stefan li Rous).
All other copyrights are property of the original article and message authors.

Comments to the Editor: stefan at florilegium.org