fruit-apples-msg - 9/8/02
Period apples and apple recipes.
NOTE: See also these files: fruit-msg, fruit-citrus-msg, fruit-melons-msg,
fruit-pears-msg, fruit-quinces-msg, vegetables-msg, desserts-msg.
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From: storm at hlafdig.stonemarche.ORG (Arastorm the Golden)
Date: 23 Oct 91 16:01:04 GMT
We planted a "period apple tree" several years ago in a flush
of agrarian authenticity. It is producing now. In my opinion the
Gilliflour (which can be traced back to 1600, and was brought to
this country by T. Jefferson) is no where near as good as...
We live in apple country. A local farm grows 52 variety of
apples and I have tasted more than half of them. My favorite apples
(depending on use) include Cortlands, Northern Spys, McCoons,
Granny Smiths and Red Delicious. It does not include Gillyflours.
The flavor is mild, too sweet, and the pulp is mushy.
Sometimes paintings show period fruits. Oranges used to be
half white membrane. According to National Geographic, beets were
solely a leaf crop until the last century. Carrots were also small
enough so that we should really not serve anything but "baby carrots"
at events.
Remember, the reason that venison was prized was because the
herds were protected, and beef cattle were worked. Food ain't what it once
was, and for this we should be intensley grateful for the hard work
and dilligence of our ancestors.
By the Way- has anyone got a source for the appropriate pine bark
to grind up and put in one's pease bread? Arastorm
From: David.Calafrancesco at drakkar.mhv.net (David Calafrancesco)
Date: 22 Apr 97 23:30:58 -0500
Title: Appulmoy
Categories: 14th cent., Fruit
Yield: 50 servings
30 c Apples 1 1/2 c Flour, rice
24 c Water 1 1/2 c Honey
4 c Almond milk 3 ts Salt
18 ea Saffron, threads
- --------------------------------POWDER FORT--------------------------------
3/4 ts Pepper 3 ts Cinnamon
3 ts Ginger 3 ts Cloves
"Curye on Inglysch," edited by Constance B. Hieatt and Sharon Butler.
Oxford University Press, 1985. pg.116 #81, from "Forme of Cury."
Appulmoy. Take apples and seep hem in water; drawe hem thurgh a
straynour. Take almaunde mylke and hony and flour of rys, safroun and
powdour fort and salt, seep it stondyng.
Redaction by Oksana Goncharova:
Appulmoy. Take apples and boil them in water; draw them through a
strainer. Take almond milk and honey and flour of rice, saffron and powder
fort and salt, and boil it standing.
Redaction instructions:
Peel and chop apples. Cook the apples in water until tender. Drain the
excess water. Add almond milk ( to make almond milk ; take blanched
almonds and chop them up in a mini chopper or food processor. Take the
chopped almonds and put them in a blender, using liquify,
and mix water in a little at a time. I use a ratio of about 1/8 th cup of
almond to about 1 cup of water.) Add crushed saffron (take some of the
almond milk and crush the threads of saffron in a morter and pestle, with
the milk.) Add rice flour, honey, salt and powder fort. Simmer over low
heat, stirring frequently, until mixture has thickened.
This recipe can be made more spicy by adding more of the powder fort, if
you like, my husband enjoys that, I have weaker tongue tolerance.
This recipe takes about 15 min. to make a 3 cup batch (8) servings.
- -----
Haraldr Bassi, Frosted Hills, East
haraldr at drakkar.mhv.net
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 11:39:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - apples
<< Anyone have any period apple treats that I can make up for the fighters
>to take to "Not Necessarily Pointless War" this weekend? >>
How about Apple Moyle? It is basically a type of rice pudding with apples in
it. The recipe is in "Two Fifteenth Century Cookery Books".
Ras
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 01:37:16 -0400
From: marilyn traber <margali at 99main.com>
Subject: Re: SC - apples
LrdRas at aol.com wrote:
> << or, depending on ingredient proportion and emphasis, applesauce
> thickened with rice flour, and sometimes eggs. >>
>
> This is in fact the version I use. Basically it's a baked custard with
> lots of apple sauce
>
> Ras
Take a large can of pears in syrup, drain and reserve the heavy syrup.
Give the pears a whirl in a blender, adding just enough juice to make it
pearsauce. Use in place of the pumpkin in a pie recipe. Pour a puddle of
whole cream on the surface when it is about half done.
margali
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 16:07:06 -0400 (EDT)
From: Philip E Cutone <flip+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: SC - Honey Apples
Steve Geppert <emster at alaska.net> writes:
> Looking for something to do with a bag of "older" apples I had on the
...
> I couldn't seem to find anything similar. Is this something that could
> be period? It would be a great traveling dish as it can be served
Well, The Domestroi has a listing for "Kirzamin apples" (not sure of
the first word) which was simply apples (whole) put in a container with
honey on them until the apples became soft (i think... i'm going from
memory here) There were almost certainly some acetic fermentaion that
went on inside the apples before th osmatic pressure of the honey made
a preserved fruit.... so we have apples, honey, and most likely
vineger... but no cooking... There were several other recipies for
cooking fruit with the addition of honey... i'll try to remember and
look to see if vinegar was used in any of them..
In Service to the People of the Society,
Filip of the Marche
Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:49:46 EST
From: melc2newton at juno.com (Michael P Newton)
Subject: Re: SC - Honey Apples
On Wed, 22 Oct 1997 10:00:44 -0800 Steve Geppert <emster at alaska.net> writes:
>Looking for something to do with a bag of "older" apples I had on the
>counter, I stumbled on a Honey Apple recipe in my Joy of Cooking. The
>recipe is simply honey, vinegar brought to a boil. The apples are pared
>and thinly sliced and dropped into the mixture and removed when
>transparent. As my medieval cooking library is in its birthing stages,
>I couldn't seem to find anything similar. Is this something that could
>be period? It would be a great traveling dish as it can be served
>chilled or hot. It was also a hit with my children, none left on the
>table after dinner!
>
>Lady Clare
>(settling in for the long Alaskan winter, snow on the ground already!)
I know I'm answering an old message, but I was clearing out my inbox and
this reminded me of a couple of recipes I came across in _The Domostroi_.
Kuzmin apples. Take whole apples, not bruised, nor wormeated. Place them
on racks, one layer per rack. Pile the racks on top of one another, then
pour three measures of honey syrup over all.
Ripe Apples and quinces. Put ripe apples and quinces which are clean and
unbruised in crates inside small buckets, five quinces per apple. arrange
them with your hands. Pour four measures of honey syrup over them. When
you cover the bucket, leave space for a funnel so that air can escape as
the mixture ferments.
I have no idea if this is anywhere close to what Lady Clare was looking
for, but there it is.
Lady Beatrix of Tanet
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 11:15:16 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Grape juice inquiry
>Now, would somebody give me a comercial source for apples that are a period
>type, grown without pesticides or commercial fertilizer.
There is a firm called AppleSource--I don't know if they are on the web
yet. They sell a wide variety of apples, including, I am fairly sure, some
of the period ones, by mail.
Alternatively you can get trees from quite a lot of nurseries--you will
find an article on that subject in the _Miscellany_. My problem is that I
keep moving, and leaving my trees behind. Hopefully, since things grow fast
here, I will at least get to enjoy the greengage plum I planted when we
moved.
David/Cariadoc
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:04:12 EST
From: LrdRas <LrdRas at aol.com>
Subject: SC - Apples
liontamr at ptd.net writes:
<< Small, round, red and hard (not to mention hardy). Less sweet (see large
amounts of sugar added to them for preservation). As for substitutes, I'd go
for the bags of cooking macs, ida reds or some such, which are smaller, have
better flavor than the enormous ones, and more closely mimic a period sized
apple. >>
Pippins are the fruit grown from an apple tree grown from an apple seed as
opposed to those grown from sports or other grafted stock. They are, indeed,
smaller and less sweet than most currently available commercial so-called
apples.
I would suggest adding to your list of varieties that might be tried
Northern Spyes or, if possible, crab apples specifically grown for juice if you want to come closest to a period-like flavor. Almost all commercial varieties of apple have been bred to make the taste less complex, less acidic, sweeter
and unobjectionable to the majority of people, thereby producing insipid,
flavorless ghosts of good tasting apples. And there are varieties of apples
still grown now that were grown during the middle ages. These would of course
be the best to use and though not generally found for sale commercially are
readily available as saplings from some specialty plant growers.
If buying commercially, most reputable supermarkets will allow you to taste
test your apple before buying it. Look for a balance between acid and sweet,
tangy, pineapple, strawberry, clove taste with a complex variety of flavors
underneath, crispness, refreshing and lingering finish.
If you have a piece of land and web access, a search engine of apple should
get you started in your search for period apple trees. :-)
Ras
Date: 16 Jan 1998 08:35:01 -0800
From: "Marisa Herzog" <marisa_herzog at macmail.ucsc.edu>
Subject: Re: SC - Fruits
<snip>- I read or was told by someone (wish I could remember) that Pippins
referred to a specific type of apple which is no longer available. Anyone
know if this is true? If so, what is the best <snip>
I am not sure about the rest, but Pippins are still sometimes available in the
grocery store, tho they seem to be being pushed out by Fujis and Braeburns
that are bigger.
- -brid
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:15:04 -0500
From: Margritte <margritt at mindspring.com>
Subject: SC - A Paste of Pippins
Consider the following two recipes:
To make Paste of Pippins, the Geneva fashion, some with leaves, some like
Plums, with stalks and stones in them.
Take your Pippins, and pare them and cut them in quarters: then boil them
in faire water till they be tender; then straine them and dry the pulp upon
a chafindish of coales: then weigh it, and take as much sugar as it
weigheth, and boile it to Manus Christi, and put them together: then
fashion them upon a Pieplate and put it into an Oven being very sleightly
heat: the next Morning you may turne it, and put them off the plates upon
sheets of Paper upon a hurdle, and so put them in an Oven of like heat, and
there let them remain foure or five dayes, puting every day a Chafindish of
coales into the Oven: and when they be thorow dry you may box them, and
keepe them all the yeare.
A Closet for Ladies and Gentlewomen or The Art of preserving, conserving
and candying, printed for Arthur Johnson, 1608.
To make Paste of Pippins like leaves, and some like Plums, with their
stones, and Stalks in them.
Take Pippins pared and cored, and cut in pieces, and boiled tender, so
strain them, and take as much Sugar as the Pulp doth weigh, and boil it to
a Candy height with as much Rose-water and fair water as will melt it, then
put the pulp into the hot sugar, and let it boil until it be as thick as
Marmalet, then fashion it on a Pyeplate, like Oaken leaves, and some like
half Plums, the next day close the half Plums together; and if you please
you may put the stones and stalks in them, and dry them in an Oven, and if
you will have them look green, make the paste with Pippins are green, and
if you would have them look red, put a little Conserves of Barberries in
the Paste, and if you will keep any of it all the year, you must make it as
thin as Tart stuff, and put it into Gallipots.
A Queen's Delight or The Art of Preserving, Conserving and Candying,
printed for Nathaniel Brook, 1654. Both of these books are available on
microfilm, in the "English Books: 1641-1700" series.
OK, here come the questions :-)
- - Do I use cheesecloth to strain the apples?
- - Should they fall apart (applesauce consistency)?
- - The first recipe calls for drying the pulp before weighing it. How dry
should it be? Surely not completely...
- - I could understand if it was oak leaves and acorns, but _plums_!?? Why
plums?
- - When the half plums are put together, are you using real stalks and
stones from plums, or ones made of marzipan, or what?
- - Just how thin is tart stuff?
- - What were gallipots usually made of?
- - Has anyone seen recipes elsewhere for similar confections (especially
ones mentioning oak leaves)?
Thanks for any help you can give.
- -Margritte
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 17:48:51 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Fruits
At 8:35 AM -0800 1/16/98, Marisa Herzog wrote:
>I am not sure about the rest, but Pippins are still sometimes available in the
>grocery store, tho they seem to be being pushed out by Fujis and Braeburns
>that are bigger.
>-brid
There are several varieties known as "pippen": Cox's Orange Pippen is a
famous variety from (I think) the 18th century. Newtown Pippen is a
variety they sell around here, sometimes under its full name and sometimes
just as Pippen. It is a hard medium-sized green apple, a little tart, good
both for pies and for eating out of hand. How close it is to a period
pippen I don't know.
Southmeadow Fruit Gardens, 2363 Tilbury Place, Birmingham, Michigan 48009,
as of several years ago, had an enormous collection of old fruit varieties,
with a catalogue which cost $5 or $10 and was very much worth it as
information about old varieties.
Elizabeth/Betty Cook
Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 16:02:24 -0800
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - A Paste of Pippins
Margritte quoted a couple of recipes for Paste of Pippens:
>To make Paste of Pippins like leaves, and some like Plums, with their
>stones, and Stalks in them.
>Take Pippins pared and cored, and cut in pieces, and boiled tender, so
>strain them, and take as much Sugar as the Pulp doth weigh, and boil it to
>a Candy height with as much Rose-water and fair water as will melt it, then
>put the pulp into the hot sugar, and let it boil until it be as thick as
>Marmalet, ...
I am fairly sure that marmelade (which, I believe, comes from a Portugese
word meaning quince) meant at this time not the citrus jam we now use the
word for but instead meant quince paste. My sister Johanna used to make
quince paste out of a modern recipe in a book by (I think) Elizabeth David;
it came out as a stiff brown paste of a similar consistancy to fudge or to
medieval gingerbread, if you have made that. I think there is a recipe for
marmelade or quince paste in Hugh Platt's _Delights for Ladies_ (160?) that
would give you another recipe to compare, quinces being closely related to
apples; I can hunt up the recipe and type it in if you would like.
Elizabeth of Dendermonde/Betty Cook
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 07:53:22 -0600 (CST)
From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming)
Subject: SC - Re: A Paste of Pippins
Greetings. One line of Elizabeth's post drew my attention:
>I am fairly sure that marmelade (which, I believe, comes from a
>Portugese word meaning quince) meant at this time not the citrus jam
>we now use the word for but instead meant quince paste.
I went hunting through a few cookery books and found that, indeed, most
of the pre-1600 ones, when titled "marmelat" or some spelling variant,
used only quinces. What was bothering me was that only yesterday I had
run across a number of marmelades made with fruit _other_ than quinces,
though those were in the late 1600s. So, somewhere along the way, the
main ingredient changed. I did find, however, in Thomas Dawson's 1597
_The Second Part of the Good Hus-wives Jewell_, "To make drie Marmelet
of Peches". So, the transformation from quince-only to other fruit was
apparantly already underway. From the recipe, however, this is a
fruit-leathery-paste type of thing that can be "printed" with a mould,
not the gloppy consistency of marmalade that we are used to.
Alys Katharine
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:09:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Berry <nexus at panix.com>
Subject: SC - Between two dishes ...
A short while ago I did a small feast here in Whyt Whey
and one of the recipes I used was "To Stew Apples" from
Digbie. Though the recipe was pretty straightforward, the
penultimate line was less so.
"You stew these between two dishes."
I am not quite certain what to make of this. On the one hand,
might it be a bain-Marie or double boiler? On the other, could
it be simply a covered pot?
At any rate, the whole recipe is included below.
TO STEW APPLES
"Pare them and cut them into slices. Stew them with Wine and Water
as the Pears, and season them in like manner with Spice. Towards the
end sweeten them with Sugar, breaking them into Pap by stirring them. When
you are ready to take them off, put in good store of fresh-butter and
incorporate it well with them, by stirring them together. You stew
these between two dishes. The quickest Apples are the best."
Alexandre Lerot d'Avigne
PS. For those who are interested, the entire menu as well as the article
series related to it are on my cooking site at
http://www.panix.com/~nexus/cooking - and yes, that is a more or less
blatant plug:-)
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:29:48 -0500
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Between two dishes ...
> a short while ago I did a small feast here in Whyt Whey
> and one of the recipes I used was "To Stew Apples" from
> Digbie. Though the recipe was pretty straightforward, the
> penultimate line was less so.
> "You stew these between two dishes."
>
> I am not quite certain what to make of this. On the one hand,
> might it be a bain-Marie or double boiler? On the other, could
> it be simply a covered pot?
That sounds like a reference to a chawfer or chafing dish, which is
essentially a small brazier of charcoal, in which sits a roughly
similarly-sized inner cooking plate, which can be used covered or
uncovered. Cooking between two dishes would most likely be using this
type of setup.
Adamantius
> Alexandre Lerot d'Avigne
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:27:59 -0700
From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <acrouss at gte.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Between two dishes ...
I would interpret this to mean a covered dish, as a bain marie is not
between two dishes, but on top of two dishes :). The results would be very
different, as the former would conserve moisture and the later would not.
good luck!
- --Anne-Marie
Date: Sat, 13 Jun 1998 22:51:05 -0500
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: RE: SC - Apple Butter Update
> Can anyone out there spare me the time to tell me anything about the
> history of Apple Butter?
>
> Micaylah
There is a recipe for Appulmoy in The Forme of Cury, which I have seen
adapted as applesauce. It uses honey as sweetener rather than the sugar
called for in modern recipes.
Since the chief difference between modern applesauce and modern apple butter
is the amount of sugar used, being heavy handed with the honey might get you
apple butter.
I haven't tried either recipe, so I can't tell you what will happen.
Bear
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 98 07:49:38 -0600
From: upsxdls at okway.okstate.edu
Subject: Re[2]: SC - Apple Butter Question
My recipe for any fruit butter - apple, pear, peach, apricot, etc.
Apple (I use Red Delicious or Winesap, they mush easier) Butter,
Peel and core apples. Place in a heavy pan with just enough water to cover
the bottom of the pan. Cover and simmer until fruit softens. Mash with
potato masher. Measure mashed fruit. Add an equal amount of sugar. Cook
over low heat, stirring occasionally. If I want to add spices, I usually
use whole cinnamon sticks and cloves wrapped in a cheesecloth bag. If you
use ground spices, it will turn the mixture dark.
Pear is done the same way, but ginger is the usual spice. Peaches &
apricots do not have to be peeled, but should be run through a food mill to
remove the skins before measuring. I don't add spices to the peach or
apricot butters. They're too wonderful all by themselves!
Leanna McLaren of Sparrowhaven
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 1998 02:17:18 EDT
From: Kallyr at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - cider apples
Golden Russet is a period cider apple which is still grown and highly
regarded. Another is Ashmead's Kernel (also russeted) which was introduced in
the 1700's as a cider apple. (Russets are brownish gold rough spots on the
skin of apples.)
Various modern pippins are descendants of pippins highly regarded as cider
apples, such as the Ribston Pippin (also know as Essex Pippin, Glory of York)
considered to have originated in Yorkshire, England around 1700.
Information from Fruit, Nut and Berry Inventory, Second Edition by Kent Whealy
(Decorah, Iowa: Seed Saver Publications, 1993).
~~Minna Gantz/ Sherry <KALLYR at AOL.COM>
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 22:47:15 -0700
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: RE: SC - cider apples
At 2:27 PM +0100 6/29/98, Yeldham, Caroline S wrote:
>There is a place that 'stores' all the old apple varieties it can, but I
>don't have details; I would suggest contacting someone like Kew Gardens
>(which has a seed library) or the Royal Horticultural Society. The
>Henry Doubleday Research Society (?) might be able to help too.
In the USA, Southmeadow Fruit Gardens (2363 Tilbury Place, Birmingham,
Michigan 48009) sells a huge variety of old apples and other fruits, and
has a very knowlegable and informative catalogue which cost $10 as of a few
years ago. Clearly one of the people who runs the place is an enthusiast.
Elizabeth/Betty Cook (gradually catching up on the list)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 20:48:37 EDT
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - sc-pears and rambling
uther at lcc.net writes:
<< What kind of apples and pears should I use to get the kind of results the
medieval cook would have gotten? Hopefully something I can find at a supermarket in East Texas? >>
Apples are problematical since every individual seed produces a new variety of
apple. The best thing to use , IMO, would be an apple that has FLAVOR. Most
modern apples sold at the supermarket and specifically bred with Everyman in
mind. This means that they are almost exclusively tasteless odorless and
without distinctive character. :-(
Avoid apples that have the word 'Delicious' in their varietal name. They are,
without a single exception, NOT delicious and have all the characteristics
that the apple industry says Everyman desires. They are also mealy and
oftentimes bitter or coyingly sweet.
There are apple varieties that are period, such as Pippins, but they are
rarely available on the commercial level. For great taste and complexity of
lavor I wold personally recommend Northern Spys or Granny Smiths. Northern
Spys have a flavor that is reminiscent of tangy pineapple, strawberries and
citrus. They are nicely balanced between sweet and sour and hold up there
shape during the baking process. They are crisp and juicy when raw if they
have not been stored for a lengthy period of time.
Granny Smiths are the second variety I would choose if period varieties or
Spys are unavailable. They also have some complexity in flavor although not
nearly as much as Spys ro the period varieties. They also have a nice balance
between sweet and sour, are not mealy and have a crisp texture when eaten raw
and a refreshing finish when eaten raw or cooked.
Pears, for the most part have been little disturbed by the hand of modern man.
The best cooking varieties are hard and crisp. These qualities endear them to
commercial shippers so a good portion of the pears available in the supermarket
are varieties which were also grown in period. Look for pears that are hard
when selecting cooking pears. The name may contain terms like 'winter' or
'fall' pears. Or ask your grocer which pear is ideal for cooking.
Ras
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 14:18:58 +1000 (EST)
From: The Cheshire Cat <sianan at geocities.com>
Subject: SC - Apple Mousse
Hannah Thomas wrote:
> Does anyone have any good recipes for apples? There are a thousand on
> our trees, and I can only make so much apple sauce! These appear to be
> baking apples (they don't taste that good when you eat them plain).
Try this:
Apple Mousse:
'A Prpoer Newe Book of Cokerye'
To make Apple Moyse: Take a dozen apples and ether roaste or boyle them
and drawe them thorowe a streyner, and the yolkes of three or foure egges
withal, and, as ye stryne them, temper them wyth three or foure sponefull
of damaske water yf ye wyll, than take and season it wyth suger and halfe a
dysche of swete butter, and boyle them upon a chaffyngdysche in a platter,
and caste byskettes or synamon and gynger upon them and so serve them forth.
My Redaction:
700g apples
45ml water
2 egg yolks
30ml rosewater
2 Tbs sugar
25g butter
ground ginger and cinnamon to finish
Peel, core and slice the apples, and stew them with the water until soft in
a heavy, covered saucepan. Make the apples into a smooth puree by pressing
it through a sieve or using a blender. Return the puree to the saucepan,
stir in the egg yolk beaten with the rosewater, then the sugar and the
butter and slowly heat to boiling point stirring continuously. Pour the
puree into a dish and allow to cool. To finish, sprinkle with a little
ground ginger and cinnamon.
- -Sianan
Marina Denton
Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 12:37:04 PDT
From: "pat fee" <lcatherinemc at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Period Scottish Dessert
>From: "Brian L. Rygg or Laura Barbee-Rygg" <rygbee at montana.com>
> > Yes I have recipes for Scotts shortbread(cookie like) a fruit puding,
> > and apples baked with honey, currents and wiskey(possibly oop)
> > Lady Katherine McGuire
>
>Recipes, please.
>
>Raoghnailt
>Stan Wyrm, Artemisia
>rygbee at montana.com
This is the "modern " version, in modern english. If you want the
original, I can get it but not this week. I expect my cook book back
sometime next week.
Apples baked in Scotch
four to six good sized apples.
1 large hand-full currents (1 cup aprox.)
1/2 cup good honey (I use wild flower)
Enough Scotch to cover the currents when placed in a small bowl.
1/2 cup of chopped nuts of your choice. Hazelnuts, toasted work well.
Soak the currents in the Scotch for at least 12 hours. Drain the currents
and set aside. Warm the honey and add the remaining Scotch from the
currents. Gently simmer the honey and scotch until it thickens to a heavy
syrup consistency.
Cut small slice off the top of the apples, core.
Mix 1/2 the nuts and the currents. Stuff the apples with this mixture
Place in an iron baking dish (this is what the original calles for) just
large enough to hold the apples touching each other. Pour the syrup over
the apples, making sure that some goes over the stuffing and wetting it.
Bake for one hour at 350 degrees. The first part of the hour cover the
apples. After this, remove the cover and sprinkle the apples with the
remaining nuts.
This can be served on rounds of pound cake or sweet biscuits.
Lady Katherine McGuire
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 17:28:17 -0700
From: Catherine Keegan <keegan at mcn.org>
Subject: Re: SC - Period Kinds of apples/Pears
> Just wondering what kind of apples we find in the grocery store
>would be closest to a period apple.
> And while I am asking, what about pears too?
Funny you should ask... We are planting an orchard and are including a few
varieties that date back to the SCA period!
For Apples, all of the grocery-store varieties are modern. The variety
"Court Pendu Plat" (or "Corps Pendu") is supposed to date from at least
the 1590's and may actually be derived from the old Roman variety called
Sementinum... according to one of the catalogs. I think at least one
reference claimed that "White Winter Pearmain" was originally a 13th
century variety. And Frank Browning mentions in his book "Apples," that
the rootstock variety now know as "M9" is actually derived from the
"Paradise" apple that was popular from the 13th century; it was supposed to
be a small yellow apple.
To approximate medieval culinary apples, you would need to find an orchard
growing the old vintage varieties. Or, you could use crabapples - I
recommend the Whitney Crab; small yellow fruit with red stripes, sweet and
tangy fresh. About the closest thing in the grocery store, if they have a
really good selection, would be a Pippin.
For pears, it's a little easier: The variety known as Bartlett in America
is called "Williams Bon Chretien" in England and "Bon Chretien" in France,
and it supposedly is very ancient, possibly late medieval or Early Modern.
(It was brought to England in about 1700 by a guy named WiIliams, but it
had apparently been growing in France for a very long time.)
"Apples, the story of the fruit of temptation" by Frank Browning, North
Point Press, 1998. ISBN 0-86547-579-2. Has a great discussion of the
origin and history of apples.
Get the Sonoma Antique Apple Nursery catalog for descriptions of vintage
varieties: www.applenursery.com
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 15:52:19 -0500
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Period Kinds of apples/Pears
At 1:45 PM -0700 10/27/99, Schumacher, Deborah (AZ15) wrote:
> Just wondering what kind of apples we find in the grocery store
>would be closest to a period apple.
> And while I am asking, what about pears too?
You can find what I was able to discover on this subject many years
ago webbed at:
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cariadoc/trees.html
David Friedman
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 20:36:25 -0500
From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Period Kinds of apples/Pears
At 5:28 PM -0700 10/27/99, Catherine Keegan wrote:
>For Apples, all of the grocery-store varieties are modern.
Depends on the grocery store. It used to be the case that stores
around Pennsic cometimes carried Summer Rambo (Rambeau d'ete), which
is a period or perhaps early 17th c. variety. And lady apples, which
are supposed to be period, occasionally show up in grocery stores.
>The variety
>"Court Pendu Plat" (or "Corps Pendu") is supposed to date from at least
>the 1590's and may actually be derived from the old Roman variety called
>Sementinum... according to one of the catalogs. I think at least one
>reference claimed that "White Winter Pearmain" was originally a 13th
>century variety. And Frank Browning mentions in his book "Apples," that
>the rootstock variety now know as "M9" is actually derived from the
>"Paradise" apple that was popular from the 13th century; it was supposed to
>be a small yellow apple.
My list from the Miscellany article:
Calville Blanc D'Hiver (1627) Grosse Mignonne (1667)
Court Pendu Plat (16th century-possibly Roman)
Devonshire Quarendon (1690) Nectarine
Drap d'Or (=Coe's Golden Drop?) Early Violet (1659)
Lady Apple (1628)
Old Nonpareil Pears
Pomme Royale Buerre Gris (1608)
Reinette Franche Rousselet de Reims (1688)
Roxbury Russett (Early 17th century) Bartlett (Williams Bon Chretien)
Scarlet Crofton "of ancient origin"-may or may
Sops of Wine
not be pre-1600.
Summer Rambo (16th century)
Winter Pearmain Plums
Fenouilette Gris Green Gage (Reine Claude)
Golden Reinette Prune d'Agen
>To approximate medieval culinary apples, you would need to find an orchard
>growing the old vintage varieties.
Or grow your own--there are a number of nurseries that sell the old varieties.
David Friedman
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 09:35:06 -0700
From: Catherine Keegan <keegan at mcn.org>
Subject: Re: SC - Period Kinds of apples/Pears
Most of Cariadoc's list appear to be 17th century. Winter Pearmain might
be a medieval variety, or a descendant of one, according to some research
I have read. Lady is dated to 1600 and therefore might squeak under the
wire. Corps Pendu is in. I think I remember seeing a reference to
Fenouillette Gris, or something similar, being medieval.
But some of these are dated much later in the Sonoma Antique Apple
catalog:
Coe's Golden Drop - 1842
Sops of Wine - 1832
I do not, unfortunately, have much information about the French
varieties... and am looking for references to same. Summer Rambo
(Rambour Franc) is listed in the SAA catalog as dating to "17??",
whatever THAT means.
If you can actually get the Lady apple, that is perhaps your best bet.
It is a small fruit, very pretty, not too sweet, somewhat acid, and
reportedly keeps all winter. I have tasted it, but not cooked with it,
but suspect it would do well.
If you can wait about three years, you can order trees on dwarf rootstock
and grow your own:
www.applenursery.com
bearcreeknursery.com (not up yet but you can email them for a catalog)
Colin
p.s. On a slightly different tack, Raintree nursery has Medlars, another
period fruit that does not appear in groceries out here. (360) 496-6400
for catalog.
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 17:21:31 EST
From: LrdRas at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Marmalade
tori at panix.com writes:
<< Also
lady apples, which, if I recall, is a reasonable facsimile of medieval
apples, neh? >>
Actually it is not a reasonable facsimile. Lady Apples are a medieval variety
that has survived. Every apple seed grows into a new variety of apple, only
by grafting stock from known varieties can a particular variety continue on.
Technically, every Lady Apple is a piece of the original Lady Apple. :-)
Ras
Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 22:00:10 -0800
From: Catherine Keegan <keegan at mcn.org>
Subject: Re: SC - Lady apples source
The only Spitzenberg I can find information for is the variety "Esopus
Spitzenberg." Thomas Jefferson's favorite. "USA; arose with the "low
Dutch" at Esopus, Ulster Co, New York. Known before 1790." Morgan &
Richards, "The Book of Apples," 1993. Their material is heavily slanted to
English & American varieties, however, so if this was derived from an
earlier Dutch or German variety it might not be covered in their
descriptions.
Morgan & Richards also has the following to say about the other varieties:
Summer Rambo - "Rambo d'Ete" - synonym of Rambour Franc. "Believed this
arose near the village of Rambure, near Abbeville, Picardy." [Remember
"The Advocate?" ;-> ] " 'De Rambure' recorded 1535 by botanist Jean de la
Ruelle; known in England 1665."
Sops in Wine - "UK; many varieties of this name in literature. [fruit in
Brogdale collection] does not match descriptions of variety recorded
1831..." Do you have an earlier attribution for this cultivar?
Fameuse - "Canada (prob). Seed poss brought from France, planted c1730 at
Chimney Point nr Lake Champlain between Vermont and New York State. Syns
many." This doesn't sound like a period variety!
Api - synonym Lady Apple - "France; found in ancient Forest of Api,
Brittany, according to French botanist Merlet. Recorded 1628 by Le
Lectier. Recorded England 1676 by Worlidge. Syns numerous. Lady Apple of
North America. Not the reputedly Roman Appia of c16th, according to French
and Italian authorities."
The best-documented "period" apple would appear to be Court Pendu Plat:
"described 1613 by Bauhin, but believed older. Known Court Pendu Rouge in
France. History much confused with Court Pendu Gris. Syns numerous;
include Wise Apple because flowers late and escapes spring frosts. Claimed
Roman origin, but Lery considered Court Pendu Gris had ancient
associations. 'Capendu,' syn Court Pendu Gris appeared in accounts of
Normany abbeys in C15th and in 1420 was on sale Rouen market. By c16th
grown all over France, also Italy, Switzerland. Some claimed it was Roman
and Cestiana of Pliny. Estienne named it Court Pendu in 1540, because it
was 'short hanged' ie short stalk. 'Capenda' known to Parkinson in 1629;
Court Pendu Plat known England by c18th."
There is also the original Old Pearmain, which may or may not be the
variety mentioned in both England and France ca. 1200. You would probably
have to get scion wood from the Brogdale Trust for this one.
Also there is 'Blanc Dur,' which again may or may not be the same as the
'Blandurel' introduced to England by Queen Eleanor in 1280. I would love
to get a couple of these...
Colin
Date: Sun, 02 Jan 2000 09:45:10 -0800
From: Catherine Keegan <keegan at mcn.org>
Subject: Re: SC - OT: Did anyone save the posts about apple varieties?
>Silly me accidentally deleted the posts from about a month ago
>that discussed period or almost period varieties of apples. We
>are looking to start an orchard this coming growing season, and I
>didn't want to be stuck with the mealy "Red Delicious" or bland
>"Golden Delicious" that the local nursery has for sale.
Since the last round of discussion, I have done a little more reading on
this subject. Turns out that the Paradise apple, frequently referenced in
medieval gardens, can still be grown today. It is used as a dwarfing
rootstock, called "M.9" or Malling 9. You can get it as a rootstock
(cheap!) for grafting purposes from several mail-order nurseries. Try
Cummins Nursery, http://www.dabney.com/cumminsnursery
Jim Cummins can give you information about the Paradise apple and how to
grow it.
Note that there is also a modern variety called "Paradise" that is not the
same as the medieval apple.
You certainly don't have to be stuck with the wretched modern Delicious -
even the Home Despot stores out here (CA) carry many other cultivars. I
just got Whitney Crab and Gravenstein from there. You should consider
planting a couple of crabs; they will be similar to the "wild" apple-crabs
that were also used in the MA.
Have fun!
Colin
Date: Sun, 2 Jan 2000 18:52:54 -0500
From: "STRAIGHT " <STRAIGHT at infoblvd.net>
Subject: Re: SC - OT: Did anyone save the posts about apple varieties?
I live in apple country. If you're getting mealy Red Delicious, they're
overripe. Those that have been stored too long may also look really
wonderfully dark red, and be rotten in the center.
Bland Golden Delicious are also overripe. When reasonably fresh they
have a good strong flavor.
Growing location may also make a difference. Apples need so many days
of properly cold temperature to set fruit properly, specific to each
variety. A tree growing on the fringe of it's range will not have as good
fruit. Apples can be grown a long ways south if they're an adapted variety,
and only certain varieties will bear good fruit in the colder areas.
I suggest doing some research first. The NYS Agricultural Experiment
Station at Geneva, NY has considerable information, and so do many nursery
catalogs. Miller Nurseries in Canandaigua, NY, specializes in antique
varieties, and there is quite a bit of information just in their free
catalog.
There is also an old set of books entitled "The Apples of New York",
rich in historical information and storage charactistics of apples, which
was written when people kept their own in cellars.
Diane S.
Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 12:22:03 -0500
From: Magdalena <magdlena at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Apples for Cider
CBlackwill at aol.com wrote:
> Does
> anyone have any information of which particular family of apples would be
> most appropriate for a "period style" cider?
Well, one of my cider books says "In England, the most esteemed cider apple in
the seventeenth century was the Red Streak, which gave 'the richest and most
vinous liquor.' Other favorites were the Bromesbury Crab, the Red & White Must
apples, the Harvey, the Pearmain, the Foxwhelp, and the Gennet-Moyle."
_Cider: Making, Using & Enjoying Sweet & Hard Cider_ by Annie Proulx & Lew
Nichols; 2nd ed. p 92.
(the first edition is slightly better than the 2nd)
If you can get your hands on them, Kingston Black is a good one-apple cider
apple, but otherwise I suggest you use a blend of apple types. Definitely throw
in a few crab apples for tannins if what you have available is mostly dessert
apples. Red Delicious makes a good blending base, with lots of aromatics, but
requires plenty of more flavorful varieties to give the cider character. I'm
told that Golden Russet is an excellent cider apple, both sweet and tart with a
nice aroma. The Roxbury Russet was developed in Massachusetts in 1649, and is
listed as a superior cider apple. Winesaps are good blended with dessert apples
such as the delicious.
I have lots more info on apple varieties if you are interested, but sadly not
much on which ones were developed when.
- -Magdalena
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 14:47:08 EDT
From: allilyn at juno.com
Subject: Re: SC - an interesting challenge...and its even about medieval food! :)
Chiquart's almond applesauce--vegan
73. Again, emplumeus of apples: to give understanding to him who will
make it, take good barberine apples according to the quantity of it which
one wants to make and then pare them well and properly and cut them into
fair gold or silver dishes; and let him have a fair, good, and clean
earthen pot, and let him put in fair clean water and put to boil over
fair and clear coals and put his apples to boil therein. And let him
arrange that he has a great quantity of good sweet almonds according to
the quantity of apples which he has put to cook, and let him blanch,
clean, and wash them very well and put them to be brayed in a mortar
which does not smell at all of garlic, and let him bray them very well
and moisten them with the broth in which the said apples are cooking; and
when the said apples are cooked enough draw them out onto fair and clean
boards, and let him strain the almonds with this water and make milk
which is good and thick, and put it back to boil on clear and clean coals
without smoke, and a very little salt. And while it boils let him chop
his said apples very small with a little clean knife and then, being
chopped, let him put them into his milk, and put in a great deal of sugar
according to the amount that there is of the said emplumeus of apples;
and then, when the doctor asks for it, put it in fair bowls or pans of
gold or silver.
Regards,
Allison, allilyn at juno.com
Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 09:28:37 EDT
From: Seton1355 at aol.com
Subject: SC - OOP about apples
I got this information from Tip=World and thought I would pass it along.
Phillipa
Although we now have over 300 varieties of apple in the world, only about 30
of them are well known, and not even all of these are available in the United
States. In the next few tips, you will find a helpful description (in
alphabetical order) of the 15 most popular
varieties, followed by suggestions of the most suitable ways for using them.
If you are buying apples to be eaten within a week, look for those with
unbruised and unbroken flesh and with no sign of insect damage. They don't
need special storage--the fruit bowl on the counter will do just fine,
providing you with your own real-life still life. If you prefer a chilled
apple, store them in the refrigerator in a plastic bag.
The Braeburn apple is a beautiful red dessert apple from New Zealand.
Sometimes in grocery stores, the stickers on them will simply say "New
Zealand," but be sure to distinguish it from the New Zealand Fuji apple,
which is slightly more acidic.
The Cortland is a cross between the McIntosh and the Ben Davis apples. It was
developed around 1915 in upstate New York. It, too, is a crisp, red-skinned
apple, yet it works for just about everything--fresh, cooked, baked, or
frozen.
The Egremont Russet, often called simply "Russet," is named for its golden
russetted skin. Its scent is nutty, and its flesh has a fine, hard texture.
It is one of the best eating apples, but it's also excellent in pies and
tarts.
The Empire is a light-textured and juicy American red dessert apple. Its
flesh is crisp and pale green.
The Fuji is also from New Zealand, but its flesh is crisper, juicier, and
more aromatic than that of the Braeburn. It makes a wonderful snacking or
dessert apple. Its skin is red with patches of yellow.
The Golden Delicious has been the best all-purpose apple since its discovery
in West Virginia in 1914. It is sometimes called simply the Yellow Delicious.
The Granny Smith has long been considered a dessert apple, because its hard,
crisp flesh retains its shape during cooking, making it ideal for main
dishes. The skin is tough, and it is the brightest green of all apples.
The Greening was developed in Green's End, Rhode Island, at the turn of the
18th century. It is a tart, yellow-green skinned apple used mainly for pies
and cooking.
The Ida-red is one you see everywhere in the fall. Why? Probably because it
is easy to grow. But to tell the truth, it's a dull apple--dull for munching
into, dull for cooking with. Keep shopping.
The Jonathan is another good all-round variety. It has bright red skin
streaked with orange and a creamy white flesh, sometimes with little bits of
red in it. It is juicy, slightly tart, and suitable for both snacking and
baking.
The McIntosh, another highly popular apple, was developed in Canada. With
its flavorful, aromatic white, juicy, and crispy flesh, it is good both on
its own or in desserts.
The Opalescent, which arrives on the market in mid-September, is another
bright red apple with a few small green spots. It is crisp and juicy, and
good all by itself.
The Red Delicious generally looks better than it tastes. While it does have a
refreshing tartness, its skin is tough, and its flesh is crumbly, and
sometimes it makes you say, "I can't swallow this." But if you come across a
batch of Red Delicious apples that aren't too mealy, snag 'em up!
The Rome Beauty is without a doubt America's favorite baking apple. It's a
large, round, red apple that's not at all good fresh but keeps its shape and
flavor when cooked. In addition, it absorbs flavors like a sponge and so is
especially good in spicy pies and cakes.
The Winesap lives up to its excellent name. It has a shiny, deep red skin,
tinged with yellow. It's juicy and both sweet and tart, making it equally
good as a munching apple and a baking apple.
Apples not only provided a vital source of food and drink, they were also an
invaluable preservative for our pioneer ancestors' food and supplies. Apples
were even used medicinally as anesthetics, antiseptics, sedatives, and
stimulants.
Below are a few tips for using apples that our ancestors knew well:
An apple in your bag of potatoes will help keep the potatoes from sprouting.
An apple in your brown sugar container will help to keep the sugar moist.
An apple in your cookie jar will help to keep the cookies moist.
Add lemon juice to an apple recipe if the apples you are using lack tartness
or need flavor.
If you cannot brush your teeth after a meal, eat an apple. Eating a raw apple
will cleanse your mouth of more than 95 percent of bacteria that cause tooth
decay.
Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 11:05:49 -0400
From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <harper at idt.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Apple butter
The Neapolitan recipe collection has a recipe for applesauce: cooked,
ground apples are mixed with almond milk, rosewater, and sugar, and
cooked until thick. Scully says it is a parallel recipe to one in the
Catalan sources. I looked at the recipe for "Pomada" in Nola, and it is
similar, except that the sauce is cooked with whole cinnamon, cloves,
and peeled gingerroot which have been soaked in rosewater, and the
almond milk is made with chicken broth. (you could make a Lenten
version with water, if you preferred). Since the sauce is apparently
cooked without applepeels, and the dominant spice is ginger, not
cinnamon, I am not sure how much it would taste like modern apple
butter.
Source: Ruperto de Nola, _Libro de Guisados_ (Spanish, 1529)
Translation: Lady Brighid ni Chiarain (Robin Carroll-Mann)
POMADA -- Applesauce
Take apples which are sour and sweet; and quarter each of them; and
prepare them; and remove the core and then put them in cold water and if they
are very sour give them a boil and then take peeled almonds and grind them
well; and put the apples in the mortar and grind them together with the
almonds very vigorously and when they are well ground dissolve it all with
good chicken broth and strain it all through a woolen cloth ; and put it all in
the pot in which it must cook; and take ginger which is fine; peel off the skin
until it is white and make of it little pieces the size of half a finger; and put them to soak overnight in good rosewater until the morning; then take whole
cinnamon; and tie it with a thread jointly with cloves and scald them with hot
broth and when the cloves and the cinnamon are scalded put the pot on the
fire with the apples; and put a good quantity of sugar in it and when it is more
than half cooked take the soaked ginger and the cloves; and the cinnamon;
and put them all in the pot and if it does not taste enough of ginger put in a
little which is ground and when it is cooked you will cast the rosewater in the
pot and prepare dishes; on top of them cast sugar and cinnamon if you wish.
Note: "Tie it with a thread" is the standard direction in Nola for cooking with
whole spices that are then to be removed. Since the thought of tying threads
to individual cloves is daunting to me, I think I'd make up a cheesecloth
bundle and scoop it out afterwards with a slotted spoon.
Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)
Date: Sat, 02 Sep 2000 22:01:59 -0400
From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Apple butter
Sue Clemenger wrote:
> Hmm, don't know who sent the first part of this message, but I've made
> both sauce and butter, and would say, rather, that the chief difference
> lies more in the relative amounts of time alloted for cooking them.
> As far as ingredients go, I'm sure there are a number of local variants,
> and of course, the taste of the finished product would also depend on
> the type(s) of apples being used.
> Hmm, it's almost apple time here....I just may have to trot down to the
> farmers' market for ingredients....yum...
> --Maire
It was my understanding that at least some versions of apple butter are
made with no added sugar, just apples cooked in apple juice until more
or less homogeneous, and that a mix of apple varieties, including both
sweet and tart types, compensated for the lack of cane sugar. I dunno, I
think I read all this off an apple butter jar label.
I also think a key difference would be in the usage. Apple butter is
sufficiently rich that I would serve it pretty much only as a spread for
bread and such, _maybe_ between cake layers, while I would do neither
with applesauce, which I tend to see either as a stand-alone dish or as
an accompaniment for things like meats, black puddings (yum!) and
perhaps various frittery units such as latkes.
Adamantius
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 17:57:38 GMT
From: "Vincent Cuenca" <bootkiller at hotmail.com>
Subject: SC - Re: cider
>Does anyone on this list happen to know whether Italians drank cider in
>period?
Italians I don't know about. Hard-cider production in the Asturias and
Cantabria regions of Spain, IIRC, goes back to the Roman era, and cider is
still a popular beverage in northern Spain. (Neat party trick: hold a glass
by your waist, and a bottle of cider above your head. Pour the cider into
the glass without spilling. This is the traditional method of pouring cider
in Asturias; this supposedly aerates the beverage.) I don't know if the
Italians would have considered cider to be an appropriate beverage,
particularly if it soured quickly. You could try a couple of apple recipes
from De Nola, who cooked for the King of Naples:
Pomada (Sauce with Apples)
Take apples that are tart and sweet; and cut each one into fourths, and peel
them; and remove the cores and then put them in cold water and if they are
very tart give them a boil and then take blanched almonds and grind them
well; and put the apples in the water and grind them with the almonds very
vigorously; and when this is all ground together thin it with good chicken
stock and force it through a strainer, and put it all in the pot you will
cook with; and take fine white ginger and peel it so that it is all white;
and cut it into little pieces about half the size of dice; and let them soak
overnight in rosewater that should be fine; then take whole cinnamon and tie
it with a thread along with cloves and scald them in hot broth, and when
they are scalded set the pot with the apples on the fire; and add a good
amount of sugar; and when it is more than half cooked take the ginger and
the cloves and the soaked cinnamon and put it all in the pot, and if it does
not taste enough like ginger add a little ground ginger until it does taste
of ginger; and when it is cooked add rosewater to the pot and prepare the
serving dishes; sprinkle sugar and cinnamon on them if you wish.
Mirrauste of Apples
Take the sweetest apples and peel off their skins, and cut them into
fourths; and remove the cores and the seeds, and then bring a pot to boil
with as much water as you know is needed, and when the water boils add the
apples and then take well toasted almonds; and grind them in a mortar, thin
them with the broth from the apples, and force them through a strainer with
a large piece of bread soaked in the broth from the apples; and all this
should come out very thick: and once it is forced through add a good amount
of ground cinnamon and sugar; and then set it on the fire to cook and when
the sauce boils remove it from the fire; and add the apples that should be
well drained of their broth, but watch that the apples are not scalded, so
that you can prepare serving dishes of them; and once they are prepared
scatter sugar and cinnamon over them.
Let us know how it all turns out!
Vicente
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 23:53:28 -0400
From: Ann & Les Shelton <sheltons at conterra.com>
Subject: SC - Re: Cider
<<Does anyone on this list happen to know whether Italians drank cider
in period? >>
<< I seem to recall that the first "cider house" in England was
established in fairly late period, but, again, this is a fair bit
distant from Italy. Perhaps someone could enlighten us as to whether
apples were prevailant in Italy during period, and from there we could
conduct a little research. My uneducated guess would be that wine would
have been preferred over cider, perhaps to such an extent that it's
commercial production would have been very limited. This is, of course,
only a guess. Balthazar of Blackmoor >>
Platina (1468) distinguished between sweet apples which should be eaten
in the first course and sour/astringent apples which were more safely
eaten after meals. There were varieties that were early ripening,
summer ripening, and those that kept in the winter, although he doesn't
name them. His only comment re apple juice is that it easily turns to
vinegar when pressed.
Castelvetro (1614), writing for an English patron, wrote: "Here should
have been the place to describe the enormous quantity of apples and
pears we have in such profusion, but since to do so would take up more
space than I have room for, I shall limit myself to describing only
those varieties which you do not have in England." The only variety he
describes is the Paradise Apple. He doesn't mention the general uses of
apples in Italy; several pages later, he goes into great depth re the
different types and uses of grapes, specifically wine-making.
So, it looks like apples were commonly available as a food, but I don't
have anything that says they were turned into something like cider in
period.
John
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 08:07:24 -0400
From: harper at idt.net
Subject: Re: SC - Apples?
And it came to pass on 18 Oct 00, , that Hoon, Twila wrote:
> Additionally, does anybody have a period reference to baked whole or
> quartered apples that remain "apple shaped" as opposed to apple sauce /
> apple moy (sp?)?
Vincente recently posted his translation of Mirraust of Apples from
Nola. That's quartered apples cooked in almond milk with sugar
and cinnamon. I think Granado has a baked quince recipe, and at
the end says "and you can do the same with apples". I'll check
later.
Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 16:25:32 -0600 (MDT)
From: grasse at mscd.edu (Martina Grasse)
Subject: SC - many digests and German things...
The Kuchen recipe... I did check Baufeld, and the reference would indeed
translate as a bundle of straw, and I have no clue what purpose that would
have served. I would love to hear what re-creation you come up with.
Apples in shape: Rumpolt (1581 German) has several fried/roasted apple type
recipes.
#39. take apples/ and hollow them out/ or push the core out with a hollow
iron/ and make with wine a dough/ and cover the apples therein/ toss them in
hot butter/ and bake (remember in German this still can mean fry) them out/
so the dough becomes crisp (or could mean quick - as in fry quickly) (the
word is rech - don't have Baufeld to hand) / give it warm to the table/ and
sprinkle it with sugar, so it is good and welltasting.
#40. take apples/ hollow them out / and toss them in hot butter/ roast them/
till they are nicely brown/ take them out into a fish kettle/ put anis/
crushed cinnamon and sugar/ thereover/ pour wine thereover/ and let it
therewith make a juice/ that it makes a short broth/ but do not let the
apples overcook/ that you can lift them out whole in a bowl/ sprinkle it with
sugar/ and give it warm/ to the table so it is good and lovely
On a semi related note.. I just spotted a recipe (#37) for "Erdtepffel'"
apples of the earth (related to pomme de terre? Potato? (has it been
discussed here before?
Sorry if Im duplicating:
#37 "Earthapples" peel and cut them nicely small/ soak (or poach) them in
water/ and press them well out through a closewoven cloth/ chop them small
and roast them in bacon that is cut small/ take a little milk thereunder/ and
let it simmer therewith/ so it will be good and welltasting.
Gwen Catrin von Berlin
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 00:09:28 -0500
From: harper at idt.net
Subject: SC - Recipe: cider sauce
For many of us, apple cider is widely available right now, so here's
a period recipe that uses it. It has the texture of honey, and a
wonderful sweet-tart flavor. Note to non-U.S. cooks: sweet apple
cider is a non-alcoholic unfiltered apple juice.
I do not know what this sauce was intended to be served with. It
can be spread like jelly on bread. I suspect it would go well with
pork or duck. I also suspect that it would be a good candidate for
canning, though I have no practical experience in that area.
Refrigerated, it keeps for at least a month, probably longer.
CIDER SAUCE
Source: Diego Granado, Libro del Arte de Cozina, 1599
Translation & Redaction: Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Para hacer salsa de zumo de manzanas
To make sauce of the juice of apples
Take the apples, and without peeling them, grate them and extract the
juice from them, as we said of the quinces; adding a little vinegar, and
white wine, and take the clearest part, and for each pound of juice, put
eight ounces of sugar, and cook it like the juice of the quinces, with the
same spices.
And two related recipes:
Para hazer salsa real
To make royal sauce
Take three pounds of fine sugar, and two quarts of white vinegar without
roses, and a quart of white wine, a little whole cinnamon, and make it boil
all together in a new glazed pot until it is cooked, and have the pot
covered, so that it cannot exhale, and to know if it is cooked, the sign will
be that, in falling, a drop will congeal, so that touching it with your hand
does not make it come apart. Serve it cold, and take care that it does not
burn. When you cook it, you can add nutmeg, and cloves, and in place
of the pot, you can make it in a casserole.
Para hazer salsa de zumo de membrillos
To make sauce of the juice of quinces
Grate the quince lightly with a grater, without peeling it, and put it inside
the woolen cloth, and press it until it has yielded all the juice, and put it
in a flask until the thickest part goes to the bottom, and take the clearest
part, and put it in a glazed casserole or pot, and for each pound of juice
put eight ounces of sugar, and two ounces of vinegar, and one ounce of
wine of San Martin, and cook it in the manner that the Royal Sauce is
cooked, as described above, with a quarter [ounce] of whole cinnamon,
half a nutmeg, and four cloves.
Apple Cider Sauce
2 cups sweet apple cider
8 ounces sugar
1/4 cup white wine vinegar
2 tablespoons white wine
1/2 ounce cinnamon sticks
1/2 whole nutmeg
4 whole cloves
Combine all ingredients in a saucepan and simmer over medium-low heat
about 45 minutes, until the volume is reduced by half and a candy
thermometer reads 220F (105C). Strain through cheesecloth. Pour into a
clean glass jar. Refrigerate. Makes about 1 cup.
Lady Brighid ni Chiarain
Settmour Swamp, East (NJ)
Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 14:33:00 -0500
From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>
Subject: RE: SC - RE: German Feast
> > >Apple pillows (an apple quarter, battered and fried)
> Ooh... I'd love to see the recipe for this!
>
> Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise
From Sabina Welserin:
140 Apple pillows
Take good apples, peel them and cut them into four pieces. Take flour, eggs
and water and salt, make a batter, not too thin , pour the apples into it
and put fat in a deep pan. When it is hot, put the pieces into the fat,
until the cake rises, let it fry slowly. Turn it, let it also fry on the
other side, then it is good.
Bear
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 19:06:01 +0100
From: UlfR <parlei at algonet.se>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Was: ReApple Computers,Now:Back On topic
DeeWolff at aol.com <DeeWolff at aol.com> [2001.12.12] wrote:
> Anybody got any good period apple recipes other that applemuse?
Appulmoy, but that perhaps counts as close enought to make no
difference? Anyone tried the ones from Sabrina Welsherin. I'm thinking
in particular of:
75 Another apple tart
Peel the apples, slice them and roast them, cut the cores cleanly out.
Chop them small beforehand and put beef marrow thereon and grated bread
crumbs. Stir it together well, stir into it also cinnamon, sugar and
raisins and let it bake.
--
UlfR parlei at algonet.se
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 13:17:23 -0500
From: johnna holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Apples
I have used the bombard apples from Mrs. Blencowe.
Nanna submitted it on the web to a site, so I have
copied that here to save the re-typing.
BOMBARD APPLES
Recipe taken from the Recipe Book
of Anne Blencowe, written in 1694
1 large apple for each person
2 or 3 crystallized apricots or some good apricot jam
puff pastry (allow 2 oz. for each apple to be enclosed)
white of eggs (allow 1 to every 2 apples)
about 6 oz caster sugar
2 teaspoons orange juice
Peel and core the apples and fill with the cut-up
apricots or apricot jam. Roll the puff pastry very
thin, cut in large squares, one
for each apple, and enrobe them. Bake for 10 minutes
at 450 F, then reduce the heat to 350 F. Cook a further
15 minutes.
Meanwhile, beat the egg whites with the orange juice
and sugar until they hold a peak. As soon as you take
out the apples, pile
this meringue over them, so that it runs down
the sides. They should look like snowballs. Pull them
in the warming drawer of
your cooker, to set the meringue without colouring,
and after about 2 hours, take them out and let them get quite cold
before
serving. They should be eaten with cream.
"They make a very pretty side dish", says Mrs. Blencowe.
Bibliography - Historical Receipts C-2
Recipe submitted by Nanna R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir
Fettiplace discusses tarts and pies. There are also
a variety of things like apple jellies, creams, pastes, pancakes
and comfits that can be done with apples.
Johnnae llyn Lewis Johnna Holloway
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:37:56 -0800
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
From: lilinah at earthlink.net
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Dissolving Saunders
>It'll be fun experimenting with it....Anyone got some favored recipes
>that have saunders as an ingredient?
Anahita's Apple Moys/Moyle for 80
Based on a survey of five recipes
in "Two Fifteenth Century English Cookbooks"
24 apples - peel, core, cut up
4 cups ground blanched almonds
1 gallon plus 1 quart warm water
1-1/2 cups granulated white sugar
1 tsp. saffron
1 tsp. powdered red sanders
1/2 salt
"Good Powder"
1-1/2 tsp. powdered ginger
1-1/2 tsp. powdered cinnamon
1-1/2 tsp. powdered cloves
1-1/2 tsp. powdered mace
3/4 tsp. powdered pepper
3/4 tsp. powdered grains of paradise
1. Make almond milk with ground almonds and warm water.
2. Simmer prepared apples in almond milk until tender on a medium fire.
3. Puree cooked apples and almond milk in food processor
(we actually used a potato masher right in the cooking pot at the Boar Hunt).
4. Add remaining ingredients and simmer until thick on a low fire,
stirring often to prevent burning on the bottom.
5. Taste and adjust seasonings.
NOTES:
OK, so i cheated and used both saunders =and= good powder.
In order to serve this to vegetarians, i made it with almond milk, not broth.
There were just a couple servings left over. I took 'em home and ate 'em.
ORIGINAL RECIPES
Harleian Ms. 279 (c. 1430) (3 recipes)
Lxxix. Apple Muse.
Take Appelys an sethe hem, and Serge hem thorwe a Sefe in-to a potte;
thanne take Almaunde Mylke & Hony, an caste ther-to, an gratid Brede,
Safroun, Saunderys, & Salt a lytil, & caste all in the potte & lete
hem sethe; & loke that thou stere it wyl, & serue it forth.
[this is the only one of the five that uses saunders]
Cxxxiiij. Apple Moyle.
Nym Rys, an bray hem wyl, & temper hem with Almaunde mylke, & boyle
it' & take Applys, & pare hem, an small screde hem in mossellys;
throw on sugre y-now, & coloure it with safroun, & caste ther-to gode
pouder, & serue f[orth].
Cxxxv. Applade Ryalle.
Take Applys, & sethe hem tylle they ben tendyr, & than let hem kele;
then draw hem throw a straynour; & on flesshe day caste ther-to gode
fatte brothe of freysshe beef, an whyte grece, & Sugre, & Safroun, &
gode pouder; & in a Fysshe day, take Almaunde mylke, & oyle of Olyff,
& draw ther-vppe with-al a gode pouder, & serue forth. An for nede,
draw it vppe with Wyne, & a lytil hony put ther-to for to make it
than dowcet; and serue it forth.
Laud Ms. 553 (Bodleian Library) (2 recipes)
Pommesmoille.
Nym rys & bray hem in a morter, tempre hem vp with almande milke,
boille hem: nym appelis & kerue hem as small as douste, cast hem yn
after ye boillyng, & sugur: colour hit with safron, cast therto goud
poudre, & 3if hit forth.
Apply moys.
Nym appeles, seth hem, let hem kele, frete hem throwe an her syue;
cast it on a pot / & on a fless day cast thereto goud fat broth of
bef, & white grese sugur & safron, & on fissh days almand mylke, &
oille de oliue, & sugur, & safron: boille hit, messe hit, cast aboue
good poudre, & 3if it forth.
From: "Barbara Benson" <vox8 at mindspring.com>
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 23:01:18 -0400
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Finding "period" Apples
I believe that the good gentle that originally replied to this post was
confusing the Pink Lady Apple with the Lady Apple. The Lady Apple is most
likely within our period of study and is most definitely French.
If you are interested in Planting an apple tree that will produce period
apples you should check the following link:
They have at least 4 varietys that should be acceptable.
In one of my Gardening Books "The Medieval Garden" there is a reference to
documentation that shows that there were at least sixteen varieties of
apples and pears grown in England during the thirteenth century. A specific
reference is sited of Eleanor of Castile sending to Paris for grafts of the
"Blancdurel" apple to be grown in the royal garden at King's Langley in
1280. (She also sent for cherry wine and brie - the lady had good taste).
This had to be done because apples (and pears) do not reproduce true to form
from seed. Each seed in every apple is genetically different, and if you
were to plant 10 seeds all from the same apple - once they matured and if
they bore fruit, all of trees would give very different fruits. And most of
them would be inedible, fit only for cider and not for eating.
This was known early on in history and the art of grafting is an ancient
one. The good thing for us in all of this, is if we can actually find trees
that claim a specific date they should bear fruit identical (giving
allowance for dirt and climate) to the original tree that was deemed worthy
to "clone" by grafting. The bad thing for us is the fact that in the quest
for sweetness, predictability and conformity we (ie: the american corporate
farmer) have created mealy, characterless apples.
Serena da Riva
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 10:49:47 -0700
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
From: david friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Finding "period" Apples
>This was known early on in history and the art of grafting is an ancient
>one. The good thing for us in all of this, is if we can actually find trees
>that claim a specific date they should bear fruit identical (giving
>allowance for dirt and climate) to the original tree that was deemed worthy
>to "clone" by grafting. The bad thing for us is the fact that in the quest
>for sweetness, predictability and conformity we (ie: the american corporate
>farmer) have created mealy, characterless apples.
The problem is that we are too mobile. I abandoned my first orchard
containing period varieties in Philadelphia more than twenty-five
years ago, three more orchards (I don't remember if the one in New
Orleans had any period varieties of fruit or not) since. No idea if
any of the trees are still there.
The green gage plum in my latest orchard, however, has gotten to the
point of producing fruit. I have hopes for the lady apple in another
few years. If I can just stay put a while ... .
Incidentally, Summer Rambos, which are period or very close, are
still grown commercially. A store near Pennsic used to carry them--at
the right time of the year. But I haven't seen them in recent years.
There is a firm called "Applesource" that will mail you boxes of
apples of any of a very large number of varieties, including some
period ones. Useful if you like to taste before you plant.
--
David/Cariadoc
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/
From: "Sharon Gordon" <gordonse at one.net>
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 20:20:49 -0400
Subject: [Sca-cooks] A trick for growing period apples & note for person who has healthy tree but not preferred variety
One neat thing about apples is that you can graft many different kinds on to
the same tree. A three year old tree has room for about 5 different grafts.
Over time you could have 40+ different kinds on the same tree. It's really
neat when it blooms as the flowers look different on various branches and
then again as the fruit ripens. An advantage is that the fruit can ripen
over several months instead of all at once.
For the person who was thinking of cutting down some healthy neglected old
trees and planting period ones instead. Please don't! ...For two
reasons...
1) One is that a healthy old neglected tree is a good source of grafting
stock for other people who would like to grow organic apples.
2) The other is that you can remove grafting stock for others and then graft
on period scion wood for yourself.
You will then usually have some apples from that new graft the very next
year rather than having to wait 3-5 for a new tree to grow up and produce.
Most local extension services will have a spring saturday morning grafting
workshop if you would like to learn how. It's not hard, and you can also
learn from drawings in books. If you live within driving distance of
Decorah, Iowa there is an apple orchard with several hundred heirloom apple
varieties and a couple hundred heirloom grapes. You can arrange to get
scion wood from them.
It's at the Seed Savers Exchange farm. If you can go
the 3rd(or so) weekend in July for their big meeting, you can also meet the
guy who is researching heirloom apples and has a huge database of
information on old varieties of apples. I think it's at 8,000+ varieties
now.
Sharon
<the end>