fd-Poland-msg – 4/28/18

Food of period Poland. References.

NOTE: See also the files: East-Eur-msg, Russia-msg, fd-Russia-msg, fd-Germany-msg, Poland-msg, Hungary-msg, Russia-bib, fd-East-Eur-msg.

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Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 19:21:38 -0400
From: Jeff Botkins <jbotkins at ime.net>
Subject: Re: SC - A good gentles persona

> Several days ago we were discussing a gentles persona and their leaning
> towards Polish. Given that I have probably 0% memory retention, was there a
> discussion on this book and if so can we reiterate? I got this reference
> from a friend who had the book in her hot little hands but was in the
> process of sending it back to the University library that it came from.
>
> Old Polish Traditions in the Kitchen and at the Table
> By Maria Lemnis and Henryk Vitry
> Translated by Eliza Lewandowska
> ISBN 183-223-1783-2
> Interpress Publishers Warsaw
>
> Micaylah

As an additional note, I found this book on Amazon.com....$10...
But, the ISBN is Different then the one given below.
Here's what the ISBN is now (per Amazon.com):  078-180-488-4

Jeff


Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 11:04:27 EDT
From: Jgoldsp at aol.com
Subject: Re: SC - Different ISBN

>Hardcover and softcover editions of the same book have different ISBNs.
>That is probably the difference.  Bear

Yes second printing "Old polish traditions"


Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 12:17:19
From: <cmccraw at comp.uark.edu>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: new book on food

I just saw this advertised in a catalog for the University of Pennsylvania
Press. Before I describe the book, please note the following:  The expected
date of publication is JUNE 1999. Don't look for it until then!!

Food and Drink in Medieval Poland, Rediscovering a Cuisine of the Past
authors: Maria Dembinska with William Woys Weaver
isbn: 0-8122-3224-0  expected price: $29.95

This book is the result of a twenty year collobaration betwen the two food
historians and includes 35 recipes.

I'm excited. I went to a Polish-inspired feast about 10 years ago and loved
the food.

Fionna


Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 16:26:02 -0600 (CST)
From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming)
Subject: SC - Period (?) Polish Cookbook Coming

Greetings!  This was just on the Middle Kingdom LaurelNet and I thought
you all might be interested... Especially those of you from whom I buy
books!  :-)

The "Congress" mentioned is the Medieval Congress held in Kalamazoo
each spring.

Alys Katharine

Subject: MIDLAUREL: New Period Polish cookbook comin' soon!
Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 11:28:42 -0500

The book is due out in June, according to my Congress program.
It's from the University of Pennsylvania Press

Title: Food and drink in Medieval Poland: rediscovering a cuisine of
the past
Author: Maria Dembinska, translated by Magdalena Thomas, edited and
adapted by William Wos Weaver

"This book is the first of its kind in English to explore the
fascinating culinary history of medieval Poland, and includes
thirty-five carefully reconstructed recipes."

200 pages, 39 illustrations $29.95 clothbound
No ISBN given :(

Univ of Penn Press: 1-800-445-9880
www.upenn.edu/pennpress


Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 17:42:32 -0800 (PST)
From: Huette von <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Period (?) Polish Cookbook Coming

According to the Library of Congress, the ISBN
for this book is:

0812232240

And for those in the Boston area, The Harvard general
library has got this book on order already.

I have just visited Amazon.com and they already have
this book in their data base. And at a discount!
For $20.95!  And if you haven't guessed already,
I have just ordered it for myself.

Huette


Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1999 14:39:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Polish food from 1682

- --- "ana l. valdes" <agora at algonet.se> wrote:
> Is somebody who knows something about Compendium
> Ferculorum, written by Stanislaw Czerniecki, published in Cracow 1682?
> According to my Swedish sources (Sweden and Polen was the same kingdom
> during several years), this book is divided between one chapter with
> meatdishes, one with fishdishes and the last one med cakes, pies and
> bread.

I don't know about this cookbook, but there is a book
soon to be published called, "Food and drink in
Medieval Poland : rediscovering a cuisine of the
past", written by Maria Dembinska and translated
into English by Magdelena Thomas.  It is will be
published by the University of Pennsylvania Press.
ISBN 0812232240.

I don't know if this will cover the cookbook that
you are interested in.  I also don't know the
quality of the book I have mentioned as it has
not been published yet.  Hopefully, it will be a
good book.

I am also purchasing [blindly unfortunately] a
book called, "Old Polish Traditions in the Kitchen
and at the Table", bu Maria Lemnis, Henryk Vitry,
and Davidovic Mladen.  Published by Hippocrene Books.
ISBN 0781804884.  The review on Amazon.com says,
"The author(s) describe a period in Polish history,
... and then give you recipes for the foods that
were prominent at that time."  I will let you know
if this is worth purchasing when I get my copy from
Amazon.

Huette


Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 17:39:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: H B <nn3_shay at yahoo.com>
Subject: SC - Fwd: [SCA-U] Food and Drink in Medieval Poland [Long REVIEW]

This was posted to the Universitas list -- I thought some of you would
be interested!
- --Harriet

- --- Jenne Heise <jenne at TULGEY.BROWSER.NET> wrote:
> Date:         Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:18:02 -0400
> Reply-to:     SCA Forum for Research in Medieval and Renaissance
> Re-enactment
>               <SCA-UNIVERSITAS at LIST.UVM.EDU>
> From:         Jenne Heise <jenne at TULGEY.BROWSER.NET>
> Subject:      [SCA-U] Food and Drink in Medieval Poland [Long REVIEW]
> To:           SCA-UNIVERSITAS at LIST.UVM.EDU
>
> The long-awaited book _Food and Drink in Medieval Poland: Rediscovering a
> Cuisine of the Past_, which is an adaptation by William Woys Weaver of a
> 1963 volume by Maria Dembinska, is finally available. I know, because our
> university bookstore just delivered my copy into my little hot hands
> today.
>
> First, the bad news. It's an adaptation of a translation, so a lot of the
> extensive annotations that Weaver says were in the main text were omitted.
> It includes a section of recipes, but all of them are RECREATIONS, not
> redactions or original recipes. The first cookbook in Polish was not
> published until 1532, thus putting it outside the scope of the academic
> definition of medievalism. (But wouldn't I love to get my hands on a
> translation of that!) As a result, the author(s) derive their data from
> archaelogy/ethnography, economic history, household accounts, and period
> cookbooks that might/would have been available to the Polish nobility,
> among other sources.
>
> That's the bad news. The good news: this is by far the most comprehensive
> book on the subject, and the most historical, I have come across in my
> reading. The original author was a recognized academic expert, and the
> adaptor is a food historian. Not only is the book excellently written, but
> it is jammed with not only food history, but food historiography,
> ethnography, archaelogy, and domestic and political history. The recipes
> are excellent, though some of them will require ingredients only
> available to the diligent gardener. The cook wishing to present a period
> table will find the comments on cooking and serving in the period manner
> invaluable. The illustrations-- drool, drool-- include not only a few of
> the usual woodcut reproductions and coats of arms, but 21 drawings of
> actual medieval cooking utensils, and illustrations of various vegetables.
> The author(s) in analysis are careful to note where assumptions are being
> made or theories advanced, and to point out holes in the documentation
> and/or history.
>
> Chapter 1, "Toward a definition of Polish National Cookery", is actually a
> essay on cookbooks, food history, and general comments on 'Polish' cuisine
> as a style. In a way, it is also a review of the records available for
> researching Medieval Polish cooking.
> Chapter 2, "Poland in the Middle Ages" is meant to be a backdrop, a review
> of the history of Poland as it affects food and food history, for those
> not familiar with the history. But it is also about domestic history.
> Pages 42 and 43 show two excellent illustrations of medieval forks and
> information about the few records of forks outside the Byzantine empire in
> the middle ages. Of special interest is the section on the Cracow congress
> of 1364.
> Chapter 3, "The Dramatis Personae of the Old Polish Table", not only gives
> a exhaustive list of staff associated with the Royal court and associated
> with food -- with descriptions of their duties and their Latin and Polish
> titles-- but also describes the style of serving and approximate
> quantities. It also gives a descriptive list of the furnishings of the
> medieval Polish kitchen and units of measure.
> Chapter 4, "Food and Drink in Medieval Poland", covers drink (types
> of wine, beer, mead, and even a nod to vodka), meat (beef, pork [including
> sausages], organ meats and veal, poultry, game and fish), grains, breads
> and baked goods, kitchen produce, and fruits and nuts.
>
> The second section of the book, "Medieval Recipes in the Polish style",
> includes recipes for:
> - Gruel of Mixed Grains
> - Courtier's Pottage
> - Compositium of Cabbage, Chard, Dill and Mushrooms
> - Stew of Parsnips, Leeks and Alexanders
> - Cheese Dumplings
> - Pears stewed with cucumbers and figs
> - Chicken Baked with Prunes
> - Green Mustard Sauce
> - Lentils and Skirrets with Bacon
> - Beer Soup with Cheese and Eggs
> - Millet Flour Soup
> - Oat Flour Soup
> - Polish Hydromel
> - Fermented Barley Soup
> - Fish Aspic
> - Prepared Fish stock
> - Lavender Vinegar
> - Game Stewed with Sauerkraut
> - Hashmeat in the Cypriot Style
> - Saffron Wafers
> - Pike in Polish Sauce
> - Fast Day Pancakes
> - Ham stewed with cucumbers
> - Wroclaw Trencher Bread
> - Thick Beer or Sourdough Starter
> - Turnip Kugel
> - Tripe in Sauerkraut
> - Polish Sauce for Fast days and Tripe
> - Court Dish of Baked Fruit
> - Skirrets Stewed with Fish
> - Stewed Pig Tails with Buckwheat Gruel
> - Pomeranian Trojniak
> - Hungarian Style Spit-Roasted Shoulder of Venison
> - Cubeb Vinegar
> - Turnip Gruel
>
> Of special interest will be the comments on Trenchers, their creation and
> use in the Trencher Bread recipe, and the comments on spit-roasting in the
> venison recipe.
>
> The book includes an extensive bibliography and a very nice index. (Just
> reading the notes is an education).
>
> Full citation in case I've convinced you you need this book (You do, trust
> me, you do!):
>
> Food and Drink in Medieval Poland : Rediscovering a Cuisine of the Past
> by Maria Dembinska, Magdalena Thomas (Translator), William Woys Weaver
> (Editor) (Philadephia: University of Pennsylvania Press, 1999); ISBN:
> 0812232240. List price is $29.95.
>
> Jadwiga Zajaczkowa (Shire of Eisental), mka Jennifer Heise
> jenne at tulgey.browser.net


Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:49:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Huette von Ahrens <ahrenshav at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: SC - Book on Polish Cooking

- --- Hank <steinfeld at tqci.net> wrote:
> Unto all a good day to you.  I have happened upon a
> book on Polish Traditional cooking which includes
> some historical points to the 11th Century. 
> Available from Amazon it is called "Old Polish
> Traditions in the Kitchen and at the Table" by
> Lemnis and Vitry.
> 
> Might be of interest to those like myself preparing
> an Eastern European Feast.
> 
> Muirghen

I have a copy of this book.  It has absolutely no
documentation as to where they get their facts,
recipes, and information.  Many of the recipes are
modern.  The rest are questionable.  If you want a
better Polish cookbook with period recipes you should
buy instead, "Food and drink in Medieval Poland."

Huette


Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 20:51:53 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jeff Heilveil <heilveil at uiuc.edu>
Subject: SC - Polish medieval cooking

Salut!
Sorry for those of you who get this twice, but as this has come up VERY
recently on both lists, I thought that I would let you all know about this
one.  

Dembinska, Maria.  1999.  Food and Drink in Medieval Poland: Rediscovering
a Cuisine of the Past.  University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia.
(Translated by Magdalena Thomas, Revised and adapted by William Woys
Weaver.  ISBN 0-8122-3224-09


The book has NO original recipes, though it does mention a lot of
the exterior influences on Polish cooking.  For example Princess Bona
Sforza (1518-1577) is said to have brought her own cooks from Italy, as
well as introduced many of the New World foods that the cooks so often
discuss (I won't use them personally, but I leave that to the rest of you
to decide for yourselves).  This Brings us to the one thing (other than
the lack of primary sources) that really bothers me.  I have been spoiled
rotten by scientific papers and quite frankly, there isn't enough
citations in the book to make me comfortable.  

If anyone out there is fluent in Polish, there is a saving grace.  The
editor mentions that in order to make this book more useful to the
American reader, he (GRRRRRR) "Streamlined the book."  or as he says
earlier:
"However, it was evident after translation was completed that the book
would not work in its original form for Americal readers.  Part of the
issue was content: what sufficed for a scholarly audience was not
necessarily appropriate for more general readers.  There was also a
problem with redundancy-some of the same material was explained in several
ways-and parts of the text veered away from the food theme into an
economic study of market patterns in the 1380s..."
pg. xiv

So if anyone out here can do the translation on the original, the citation
is: Dembinska, Maria.Konsumpcja Zymnosciowa w Polsce Sredniowiecznej [Food
consumption in Medieval Poland].  Wroclaw: Wydanictwo Polskiej Akademii
Nauk, 1963.

There are recipes, which seem to be gleaned from what Maria (born Countess
Goluchowska) had researched, together with evidence she garnered from
Tallievent, Le Managier and Scully among others, however there is no play
by play source.  In fact, it says in the editor's note a few times that
there are basically no extant medieval cookery books.  However, the book
does mention a poet named Mikolaj Rej who wrote, in 1568, a poem entitled
Zywot Czlowieka Pozciwego (Life of an Honest Man) which mentions at one
point "... all those gilded dishes: golden chickens, eagles, and
glittering hares..."
TranslatiMikolaj Rej, "Zywot czlowieka poczciwego," ed. J. Kryzanowski in
_Biblioteka Narodowa_, series I, no. 152 (Wroclaw, 1956), 206. 
pg. 13

It might be worth trying to contact either the editor or the original
translator to see if you can get a copy of the translation of Dembinska's
version and not have to bother with translating it yourself.

Bogdan
_______________________________________________________________________________
Jeffrey Heilveil M.S.		      Ld. Bogdan de la Brasov, C.W.
Department of Entomology	A Bear's paw and base vert on field argent
University of Illinois	


Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 08:52:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jenne Heise <jenne at tulgey.browser.net>
Subject: SC - Re: [sig] Polish medieval cooking

> It might be worth trying to contact either the editor or the original
> translator to see if you can get a copy of the translation of Dembinska's
> version and not have to bother with translating it yourself.

I've tried. (I'm sure there are plenty of citations in the original: it
was Dembinska's PhD thesis.) The editor/author does not respond. I'm
almost mad enough to go to the NEH, which paid for the translation, and
try and get them to get the translation released. *grr*

I enclose the review I wrote for the Fall 1999 Slovo:

For those who have been ravenously searching for material on medieval
Polish (and Eastern European) foodways, this volume is good news and bad
news. The good news is, it's the best resource on eating habits in Poland
available in English. The bad news is, it has several serious flaws, the
biggest being that the recipes given in the text are neither reproductions
nor redactions of period recipes, but attempts to re-create dishes using
period methods, documentation from menus and purchase records, and foreign
cookbooks of the time.

The original work on which this volume is based was the 1963 thesis of
Maria Dembinska, one of the most well known Polish food historians, who
died in 1996. William Woys Weaver worked with Ms. Dembinska to adapt the
translated work, removing some of the larger sections of tables and
footnotes, and adding appropriate material from her later works, as well
as adding material on Cypriot and other possible influences. Weaver does
an excellent job in the introduction of explaining which parts he added.

The body of the book is in four chapters. The first, "Toward a Definition
of Polish National Cookery", gives a good review of the underlying
assumptions of the book and a description of living conditions and foreign
influences on medieval Polish foodways. But it also exposes the main
methodological weakness of the work: the emphasis on a "national" cuisine.
This work would be even more helpful if Dembinska had simply outlined the
material on cookery of related cultures at her disposal, rather than
trying to squeeze it into a definition of 'Polish' cuisine, and perhaps
relied a little less on modern Polish ethnography as well. Nonetheless, it
is a helpful review of the literature and gives some useful insights, such
as the role of meat in peasant diet, the question of standard of living
rather than social class as a distinguishing feature in diet, and the
Byzantine, Italian, Hungarian, Swedish, Turkish and Russian influences on
Polish cuisine.

The second chapter, "Poland in the Middle Ages", gives a tidy little
history of Poland, but includes some interesting sidelights of economic
history, such as the change to "German law" land tenure, the polyglot
nature of late medieval Polish culture, and the role of the lesser
nobility. Of special interest is the analysis of the congress at Cracow in
1364, though materials on what the assembled royals ate at their feasts
are, sadly, not available. (There's a good discussion of forks, though!)

"Dramatis Personae of the Old Polish Table", the third chapter, is a gold
mine for SCAdians. Not only does it give a detailed listing of the
officials and servants (and their titles) who were involved with food
preparation in the Jagiellonian royal entourage, but it gives vignettes of
specific instances of food consumption. It's fascinating that all but the
very highest at table ate leftovers from the high table; that at least one
academic dinner was just as overpriced and underbudgeted as modern ones,
and that the legendary "highly-spiced" medieval food may have been made
that way to encourage digestion of large, heavy meals. In addition,
Dembinska lists the names and descriptions of a wide variety of kitchen
tools and equipment known in the inventories of the Polish kitchens.

The final chapter, "Food and Drink in Medieval Poland," covers each type
of food and drink in turn. We learn that the two main meals were the
prandium (eaten between 9 and 10 a.m) and coena (eaten between 5 and 7
p.m.), and that they were generally similar; that Wednesdays and Fridays,
and Lent, were meatless days, but special feast days were, well feasts.
The most common drink, Dembinska says, would have been wheat beer and
small beer, followed by wine and mead. Poles ate meat on a daily basis --
bacon and pork the most, followed by beef, poultry, and, on meatless days,
a wide variety of fresh and salt fish. Game was not common, but highly
esteemed and used as gifts and rewards. The majority of the diet was made
up of grains, either in bread or cooked as gruels. Millet was the primary
grain dish either as groats or flour, oats being an 11th century
innovation, and barley a 15th century import. Bread was generally made
with rye and wheat flours, and wheaten rolls were for sale in the streets.
Vegetables were common also: "the daily menu in Poland included at least
one vegetable, either as a side dish or as an ingredient in a one-pot
recipe." Dembinska lists onions, lentils, field peas, cabbage, fava beans
and bean greens (among peasants), kale, white carrots, beets, parsnips,
alexanders, skirrets, turnips, radishes, cucumbers and melons, as well as
mushrooms. Curiously enough, beet soup was not documented, but a
borsht-like soup made from cow parsnips was eaten. Sauerkraut is common,
but pickled cucumbers can only be documented to the 16th century. Neither
modern bigos (game stew) or pirogi (dumplings) can be documented to the
period either. Most fruit was eaten cooked -- apples, pears, plums and
cherries were the most common, with wild strawberries and blueberries
showing up in the records also. Dembinska also highlights many of the
spices used.

The second half of the book, "Medieval Recipes in the Polish Style" by
Weaver, is a fascinating yet frustrating experience. Each recipe includes
wonderful information about the ingredients and techniques, and is
carefully detailed, making the recipes easy to follow. But the sources and
inspirations are not documented. Especially educational are the notes on
"Wroclaw Trencher Bread," giving details on how bread was baked,
regulated, and made into trenchers; the "Thick Beer or Sourdough Starter;"
and the directions for spit-roasting in "Hungarian-Style Spit-Roasted
Shoulder of Venison"; as well as directions for making "Saffron Wafers"
over a charcoal grill! So far, I've only tried the "Pears Stewed with
Cucumbers and Figs" but, documentable or not, they are delicious (though I
keep wanting to add more spices than the recipe calls for; so much for the
overspiced food discussion!).

The multitude of illustrations -- including many of period kitchen
equipment, either from woodcuts or drawn from archaelogical finds --
greatly adds to the value of the book. Though most of the books in the
bibliography are not in Polish, it is still an excellent resource; and the
UPenn Press apparently invested well in a good index to the entire volume.

While it would be lovely to have the excised footnotes, and to have period
recipes and documentation, this work still far outstrips the nearest
competitor, Maria Lemnis's Old Polish Traditions in the Kitchen and at the
Table, which gives tantalizing sections of information on Polish food
habits interspersed with undated recipes, and which has neither
bibliography nor useful references. As a starting point for constructing a
medieval "Polish" meal, or talking about the foodways of Eastern Europe,
it's excellent.

- -- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa

Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise	      jenne at tulgey.browser.net


Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 11:13:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jenne Heise <jenne at tulgey.browser.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Re: [sig] Polish medieval cooking

> Hmmm. I'm curious why you didn't get a response. I believe it was
> someone on this list who did write the author (the translator, not
> Dembinska, as she's dead) asking about wafers I believe. They got
> a reply much quicker than I would have expected one and the author
> seemed quite helpful.

No, they wrote to the editor (William Woys Weaver) rather than the
translator (Magdalena Thomas), and got a response. I'm not sure why I
didn't, as I also wrote to the editor through the University of
Pennsylvania Press. However, if you read the material about the
translation in the introduction, Weaver does sound unwilling to give out
the translation (pointing out that the original is available in multiple
libraries).
 
Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise	      jenne at tulgey.browser.net


Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 10:44:41 -0500
From: "Michael F. Gunter" <michael.gunter at fnc.fujitsu.com>
Subject: SC - Re: [sig] Polish medieval cooking

> << The editor/author does not respond. >>
> That tells you something about the original material for the 'thesis'.
RFLMAO!

Ras is under a misapprehension, I think. Perhaps because he is commenting
on a book he has never seen, and apparently our review comments weren't
clear. Let me try once more to explain to those, like Ras, who haven't
followed the explaination of the this book.

First of all, the editor/author to which I addressed my inquiry was
William Woys Weaver, who was not the author of the original thesis.

Maria Dembinska wrote her thesis in Polish. It was later printed in Polish
as a book. That is the 'original material for the 'thesis''. It is
available in libraries both in other countries and the USA, despite Ras'

apparent conclusion that it does not exist. (Yes, when I first got the
book, I checked to see if any other translations were available, using
OCLC Worldcat, which is a Union Catalog of the holdings of about 10,000
libraries in the US, Canada and parts of Britain.)

William Woys Weaver apparently met with Ms. Dembinska (who is now
deceased) and discussed publishing a translation, and also worked with her
on re-creating recipes based on purchase orders, menus, and other period
recipes.

The translation of the original book was funded by the National Endowment
for the Humanities, and was apparently done by a Magdalena Thomas.

Mr. Weaver (who, by the way, is not an academic, but a popular cookbook
writer) took the translation, removed what he felt was material
inappropriate for his audience, added a preface and some supplementary
material, and attached the recipes. Because he did write part of the
material in the book, I believe that it is only truthful to refer to him
as one of the authors as well as the editor.

Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise        jenne at tulgey.browser.net


Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2000 20:38:38 EST
From: Devra at aol.com
Subject: SC - Re: sca-cooks Polish manuscripts & future title (drool)

After the discussion a while ago on this, I thought people might be 
interested in William Woys Weaver's statement in his article about Maria 
Dembinska in the most recent PPC: "In fact, there are no manuscript recipes 
surviving from medieval Poland...."

This is a great issue, by the way.  It also has a biblography of Danish cook 
books (1616-1800.)

Devra the Baker

Devra Langsam
www.poisonpenpress.com
devra at aol.com


Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 09:56:43 -0500 (EST)
From: Jenne Heise <jenne at mail.browser.net>
Subject: Re: SC - Book Query - Food and Drink in Medieval Poland

> Actually, I think this was discussed a while back.  I do have a copy of the
> book...bought it at Pennsic last year.  It does have recipes, but, IIRC, they are
> not documentably period.  Jadwiga, can you refresh my memory?

Here's the two reviews I've got on the web, one on my page on Food and Drink of Medieval Poland and Rus (also not a good recipe source), and one from the Slavic Interest Group's newsletter:

>From my handout:
"Food and Drink in Medieval Poland: Rediscovering a Cuisine of the Past. Maria Dembinska, rev. and adapted by William Woys Weaver. (Philadelphia: University of Pennsylvania, 1999). This is an excellent overview of Polish foodways between 1350 and 1500, but it has several faults, including the nationalist bias and the fact that the included recipes are re-creations, not redactions. Furthermore, it is an adaptation of a translation of Ms. Dembinska's book, originally published in 1963 as Kosumpcja Zywonsiowa w Polsce Sredniowiecznej (Food consumption in Medieval Poland). Using a translation by Magdalena Thomas, Weaver edited and adapted the text, and included a number of recipes that he and Dembinska had worked on re-creating from mentions in records and known recipes from non-Slavic sources. Unfortunately, many of the notes and charts were removed and the  notes for the recipes do not give sufficient source data."

>From the SIG newsletter:
"Dembinska, Maria. Food and Drink in Medieval Poland. Philadelphia: University of Pennsylvania, 1999.

For those who have been ravenously searching for material on medieval Polish (and Eastern European) foodways, this volume is good news and bad news. The good news is, it's the best resource on eating habits in Poland available in English. The bad news is, it has several serious flaws, the biggest being that the recipes given in the text are neither reproductions nor redactions of period recipes, but attempts to re-create dishes using period methods, documentation from menus and purchase records, and foreign cookbooks of the time.

The original work on which this volume is based was the 1963 thesis of Maria Dembinska, one of the most well known Polish food historians, who died in 1996. William Woys Weaver worked with Ms. Dembinska to adapt the translated work, removing some of the larger sections of tables and footnotes, and adding appropriate material from her later works, as well as adding material on Cypriot and other possible influences. Weaver does an excellent job in the introduction of explaining which parts he added.

The body of the book is in four chapters. The first, "Toward a Definition of Polish National Cookery", gives a good review of the underlying assumptions of the book and a description of living conditions and foreign influences on medieval Polish foodways. But it also exposes the main methodological weakness of the work: the emphasis on a "national" cuisine. This work would be even more helpful if Dembinska had simply outlined the material on cookery of related cultures at her disposal, rather than trying to squeeze it into a definition of 'Polish' cuisine, and perhaps relied a little less on modern Polish ethnography as well. Nonetheless, it is a helpful review of the literature and gives some useful insights, such as the role of meat in peasant diet, the question of standard of living rather than social class as a distinguishing feature in diet, and the Byzantine, Italian, Hungarian, Swedish, Turkish and Russian influences on Polish cuisine.

The second chapter, "Poland in the Middle Ages", gives a tidy little history of Poland, but includes some interesting sidelights of economic history, such as the change to "German law" land tenure, the polyglot nature of late medieval Polish culture, and the role of the lesser nobility. Of special interest is the analysis of the congress at Cracow in 1364, though materials on what the assembled royals ate at their feasts are, sadly, not available. (There's a good discussion of forks, though!)

"Dramatis Personae of the Old Polish Table", the third chapter, is a gold mine for SCAdians. Not only does it give a detailed listing of the officials and servants (and their titles) who were involved with food preparation in the Jagiellonian royal entourage, but it gives vignettes of specific instances of food consumption. It's fascinating that all but the very highest at table ate leftovers from the high table; that at least one academic dinner was just as overpriced and underbudgeted as modern ones, and that the legendary "highly-spiced" medieval food may have been made that way to encourage digestion of large, heavy meals. In addition, Dembinska lists the names and descriptions of a wide variety of kitchen tools and equipment known in the inventories of the Polish kitchens.

The final chapter, "Food and Drink in Medieval Poland," covers each type of food and drink in turn. We learn that the two main meals were the prandium (eaten between 9 and 10 a.m) and coena (eaten between 5 and 7 p.m.), and that they were generally similar; that Wednesdays and Fridays, and Lent, were meatless days, but special feast days were, well feasts. The most common drink, Dembinska says, would have been wheat beer and small beer, followed by wine and mead. Poles ate meat on a daily basis -- bacon and pork the most, followed by beef, poultry, and, on meatless days, a wide variety of fresh and salt fish. Game was not common, but highly esteemed and used as gifts and rewards. The majority of the diet was made up of grains, either in bread or cooked as gruels. Millet was the primary grain dish either as groats or flour, oats being an 11th century innovation, and barley a 15th century import. Bread was generally made with rye and wheat flours, and wheaten rolls were for sale in the streets. Vegetables were common also: "the daily menu in Poland included at least one vegetable, either as a side dish or as an ingredient in a one-pot recipe." Dembinska lists onions, lentils, field peas, cabbage, fava beans and bean greens (among peasants), kale, white carrots, beets, parsnips, alexanders, skirrets, turnips, radishes, cucumbers and melons, as well as mushrooms. Curiously enough, beet soup was not documented, but a borsht-like soup made from cow parsnips was eaten. Sauerkraut is common, but pickled cucumbers can only be documented to the 16th century. Neither modern bigos (game stew) or pirogi (dumplings) can be documented to the period either. Most fruit was eaten cooked -- apples, pears, plums and cherries were the most common, with wild strawberries and blueberries showing up in the records also. Dembinska also highlights many of the spices used.

The second half of the book, "Medieval Recipes in the Polish Style" by Weaver, is a fascinating yet frustrating experience. Each recipe includes wonderful information about the ingredients and techniques, and is carefully detailed, making the recipes easy to follow. But the sources and inspirations are not documented. Especially educational are the notes on "Wroclaw Trencher Bread," giving details on how bread was baked, regulated, and made into trenchers; the "Thick Beer or Sourdough Starter;" and the directions for spit-roasting in "Hungarian-Style Spit-Roasted Shoulder of Venison"; as well as directions for making "Saffron Wafers" over a charcoal grill! So far, I've only tried the "Pears Stewed with Cucumbers and Figs" but, documentable or not, they are delicious (though I keep wanting to add more spices than the recipe calls for; so much for the overspiced food discussion!).

The multitude of illustrations -- including many of period kitchen equipment, either from woodcuts or drawn from archaelogical finds -- greatly adds to the value of the book. Though most of the books in the bibliography are not in Polish, it is still an excellent resource; and the UPenn Press apparently invested well in a good index to the entire volume.

While it would be lovely to have the excised footnotes, and to have period recipes and documentation, this work still far outstrips the nearest competitor, Maria Lemnis's Old Polish Traditions in the Kitchen and at the Table, which gives tantalizing sections of information on Polish food habits interspersed with undated recipes, and which has neither bibliography nor useful references. As a starting point for constructing a medieval "Polish" meal, or talking about the foodways of Eastern Europe, it's excellent."

- -- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa

Stefan, please feel free to put these in the Florilegium. 
- -- 
Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise


From: Sandragood at aol.com
Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 23:30:43 EDT
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] help with Polish/Hungarian name for herb?
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

It is savory.  I was on a Hungarian culinary list not long ago while doing
research for a feast.  Unfortunately I have deleted the message and
unsubscribed from the list.  (Most of the traffic was in Hungarian which I
do not read or speak).

According to the Hungarian / English online dictionary I have used in the
past "csombord" translates to savory in English.  I would think this is the
same since I typed in your spelling and it gave me the above in response.

Elizabeth Donnan


From: jenne at fiedlerfamily.net
Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2001 13:58:02 -0400 (EDT)
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] help with Polish/Hungarian name for herb?

> I gather this wasn't mentioned in Polish Herbs,
> Flowers & Folk Medicine which you reviewed
> sometime back?

Well, it wasn't the first time I looked. When I looked again I found that
I had gotten two pages stuck together, and gone from St. John's Wort
direct to Silverweed. Doh! I feel stupid.
Czombor is, in fact, summer savory.

-- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa


From: "Stephanie Howe" <showe01 at earthlink.net>
To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 11:07:51 -0500
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Polish Cooking: was Question to the group....

Have I got a find for y'all:  _Food and Drink in Medieval Poland:
Rediscovering a Cuisine of the Past_  Maria Dembinska, revised and adapted
by William Woys Weaver
U. of Pennsylvania Press, 1999  ISBN 0-8122-3224-0

I've been grazing through the volume for a couple of months now- flipping
pages, reading a little here, a little there... Lots of referencing of
royal, noble, and manor purchase records, folkways medieval and modern,
careful attention to seasonality, descriptions of how usage patterns changed
over time, both cultivated and foraged foodstuffs, a list of equipment and
utensils mentioned in 14th and 15th C. Polish court sources, discussions of
European influences and introductions both west to east, and east to west...
and recipes.

Among a few quick gleanings pertaining to the week's discussions:

A long discussion of the origins, and possible etymological clues to,
"bigos".  To sum it up, the dish, although not originally of Polish origins
(may have come from Hungary, or Germany) was definitely known in virtually
unlimited variants in medieval Poland.  The biggest key to it's medieval
roots is the layering of the ingredients before braising or slow baking,
rather than chopping and mixing the meats and vegetables.

Cabbage or sauerkraut:  Pickled as whole or halved heads, rather than
shredded, layered with other greens like beet chards and dill.  Several
varieties of cabbages were cultivated, both white and red (or black), kales,
a primitive form of cauliflower, etc.

Pierogi ruskie:  "Russian Pierogi"- filled with buckwheat, didn't enter
Polish cookery until the 19th C.  I haven't really found any references to
other filled dumplings in the book.

Olga


Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 21:17:30 -0500
From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Polish cookbook
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

> Has anyone gotten this book?
> Food and Drink in Medieval Poland.
>
> De

With the little I've done with it (research reference), I've found the book
to be accurate and useful.  The problem I have with the book is the lack of
notes, footnotes and source references that would tie to the bibliography.
The recipes have no sources and appear to be modern recipes done in a
"medieval" manner.  If you want to know something about Polish culinary
history, it's a good read.  It's accuracy for historical Polish  
recipes is a little more questionable.

Bear


Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 10:36:31 -0400
From: "Nick Sasso" <grizly at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Polish cookbook
To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

-----Original Message-----
Has anyone gotten this book?
Food and Drink in Medieval Poland.

De   > > > > >

When I read my copy the year it was published, I remarked that it is a good
resource with lots of information that is new and useful.  Not a source for
primary recipes.  Some of them are adapted from things like well-known
English sources (like Curye on Englysh, if I recall correctly).  Good source
for info . . . very weak source to use for documenting primary "Polish" or
Eastern European recipes.  Best resource we have in USA to date.

pacem et bonum,
niccolo difrancesco


Date: Tue, 4 May 2010 11:15:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Raphaella DiContini <raphaellad at yahoo.com>
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Fw: Polish recipe collection I am looking for

My apprentice sister has a Polish persona and has been trying for a few years to track down a source mention in several of her "traditional Polish food" cookbooks, but hasn't yet found a translation. There is a lovely replica version available, but she currently feels a bit daunted at the prospect of translating the whole source so any translations, partial or whole would be greatly appreciate. 

It's Compendium Ferculorum by Stanislaw Czerniecki, published in 1682. 

I have also passed to her the other source recently mentioned here, Food and Drink in Medieval Poland: Rediscovering a Cuisine of the Past, and she will be looking to that as well, but is really hoping to track down the Compendium Ferculorum. 

In joyous service, 
Raffaella 
P.S. You can find a lovely leather bound copy of this here, but it dosen't seem to be a translation: 
http://www.kurtiak-ley.com/artist_books/compendium_ferculorum/
An online version (still in polish) is also available here: 
http://www.wbc.poznan.pl/dlibra/docmetadata?id=66766


Date: Tue, 04 May 2010 16:08:44 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Fw: Polish recipe collection

Ok, where to start and I'll probably repeat information that your  
apprentice sister
Annaka already has (but maybe Stefan will need it for his files)

There's a 1682 listed as being in Latin. I don't suppose that's much  
more help than the editions in Polish. There are 1999 and 2002 editions titled
Compendium ferculorum albo Zebranie potraw

1999 seems to be:
Title  Compendium ferculorum albo Zebranie potraw
Issue 24 of Biblioteka Tradycji Literackich
AuthorStanis?aw Czerniecki
Compiled byWac?aw Walecki, ?ukasz WinczuraPublisherCollegium  
Columbinum, 1999ISBN8387553131, 9788387553135
96 pages

2002 carries this note:
Uk?ad typograficzny wzorowano na najstarszym wydaniu pierwszej  
polskiej ksi??ki kucharskiej z 1682 r. wg egz. ze zbior?w Muzeum im.  
Przypkowskich w J?drzejowie. Description: [8], 95, [9] s. ; 22 cm +  
Stanis?aw Czerniecki i jego dzie?o "Compendium ferculorum albo  
Zebranie potraw..." / Jan G??wka (22 s.). Other Titles: Zebranie  
potraw Responsibility: [wg projektu i pod kierunkiem El?biety  
Chodkiewicz-Przypkowskiej ; transkr. tekstu dokona? Jan G??wka].

There's also this Polish language book by Maria Dembi?ska that  
mentions this 1682 book.
Szkice z dziej?w materialnego bytowania spo?lecze?stwa polskiego

Author:	Maria Dembi?ska
Publisher:	Wroc?law u.a. Ossolineum 1989
Studia i materia?ly z historii kultury materialnej, 61

It's at a number of libraries including Michigan.

I can't locate any translations other than the Latin one. No PhD  
dissertations either. Sorry.

Johnnae, playing librarian

On May 4, 2010, at 2:15 PM, Raphaella DiContini wrote:
snipped looking for a translation
<<< It's Compendium Ferculorum by Stanislaw Czerniecki, published in 1682.

P.S. You can find a lovely leather bound copy of this here, but it  
dosen't seem to be a translation:
http://www.kurtiak-ley.com/artist_books/compendium_ferculorum/
An online version (still in polish) is also available here:
http://www.wbc.poznan.pl/dlibra/docmetadata?id=66766 >>>


Date: Tue, 04 May 2010 16:29:17 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Fw: Polish recipe collection

The latest edition seems to be

2009: S. Czerniecki, Compendium ferculorum or gather food, ed. i opr.  
and arr. J. Dumanowski i M. Spychaj z przedmow? S. Lubomirskiego,  
?Monumenta Poloniae Culinaria?, t. I, Warszawa 2009 J. and M.  
Dumanowski Spychaj with a foreword by S. Lubomirski, "Monumenta  
Poloniae Culinaria, Vol I, Warsaw 2009

Jaroslaw Dumanowski is engaged in editing old Polish cookbooks for the  
project Monumenta Poloniae Culinaria and one of the pioneers of Polish  
gastronomic history. I wonder if he's aware that there are readers who would like an English edition.

Johnnae


Date: Tue, 04 May 2010 16:47:33 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Fw: Polish recipe collection

A translation of the Slow Food Polska Review is at
http://tinyurl.com/29a6ypr

Johnnae


Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2010 11:09:55 -0400
From: Elise Fleming <alysk at ix.netcom.com>
To: sca-cooks <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Polish Banquets - 16th-18th Centuries

While looking through Jean-Louis Flandrin's book ("Arranging 
the Meal") mentioned in a post I just sent to the list, I found a 
chapter at the end entitled "Polish Banquets in the Sixteenth, 
Seventeenth, and Eighteenth Centuries.  Flandrin writes, "My objective 
is to single out what surprised foreign, and particularly French, 
travelers about these banquets and what struck them as typically Polish 
manners.  The chapter runs from p. 118-125.

Quickly scanning the beginning parts, it was noted by Hauteville that 
much meat and little bread was eaten.  French travelers noted the 
absence of any soup.  Apparently there was soup in the general diet (a 
beer soup in the morning), but no soup with dinner or supper.

Impressing the French was the variety of sauces: sauces with saffron, 
cream, onion, prune juice, all containing "a lot of sugar, pepper, 
cinnamon, ginger, cloves, nutmeg, olives, capers, pine nuts, and 
currants.  These sauces were generally intended for first-course meats - 
presumably boiled - but were interchangeable, not specific to a 
particular meat."

For people with an interest in Polish foods in the 1500s-1600s, you 
might want to see about borrowing this book from a library.

Alys K.


Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 11:34:07 -0400
From: Sam Wallace <guillaumedep at gmail.com>
To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org
Subject: [Sca-cooks] Polish Culinary History Book

I found this book on the Polish National Digital Library web site:

Kuchnia polska dawna : urywki z jej dziej?w od czas?w najdawniejszych
do ko?ca wieku XVII - Peszke, J?zef (1845-1916)
Old Polish cuisine: fragments of its history from the earliest times
to the end of the seventeenth century - Peszke, Joseph (1845-1916)
http://www.polona.pl/dlibra/doccontent2?id=16001&from=&from=metadatasearch&dirids=1&lang=en

This looks to be an academic journal or magazine collected into book
form. It is very interesting considering the dearth of surviving
medieval manuscripts from Poland. There are lots of 18th and 19th
century culinary works listed on the site, too, for those who are
interested.

Guillaume


Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2010 14:15:15 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Polish Banquets - 16th-18th Centuries

The book is up on Google Books for searching and viewing.
I reviewed it several years back and noted at one time it was on sale if you ordered directly from the UC Press.

Even better, Amazon says they have copies ---  25 new from $6.97 which  
would be a great bargain.
For more see http://www.medievalcookery.com/books.html

Johnnae

On Oct 14, 2010, at 1:17 PM, Sam Wallace wrote:
<<< Alys,

Thanks for the mini-review. I will dig up Flandrin's book as soon as I
can. I was wondering about the references it gave for the Polish
Banquet section, particularly those prior to 1600.

Guillaume >>>


Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 14:07:40 -0400
From: Johnna Holloway <johnnae at mac.com>
To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>,
	SCA_Subtleties at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Sca-cooks] New Bibliography

The new Gauntlet (regional newsletter for Pentamere) has been published with the latest installment of my bibliographic series.  The topic this time was
Medieval and Renaissance Cookery, Cookbooks, and Foods from Poland 

Volume 2012 #  A.S. LXVI
http://www.midrealm.org/pentamere/pentamere_gauntlet.html

Johnnae


From the fb "SCA Cooks" section:
Genny Grim 
4/26/18
There's a recently published Polish monograph series on the history of Polish food. [In Polish} Most of it is 17th and 18th century, but the two most recent volumes have transcriptions of SCA-period recipes from previously unpublished manuscripts. As far as I'm aware, the series is still active, so there may well be additional early stuff forthcoming. 
https://sklep.wilanow-palac.pl/seria-monumenta-poloniae-culinaria-c-11.html

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