books-food-msg - 2/21/08 Books about food. Not cookbooks. NOTE: See also the files: cookbooks-msg, cookbooks-bib, cookbooks-SCA-msg, cb-rv-Apicius-msg, cb-novices-msg, merch-books-msg, merch-cookbks-msg, online-ckbks-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ From: ferzocog at ere.umontreal.CA (Ferzoco George) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: A must-read on medieval cuisine Date: 9 Apr 1993 20:02:04 -0400 For all of you interested in the state of the art of research on medieval cookery, get the book Carole Lambert, ed., "Du manuscrit a la table. Essais sur la cuisine au moyen age et repertoire des manuscrits medievaux contenant des recettes culinaires." Montreal and Paris: Presses de l'Universite de Montreal and Champion-Slatkine, 1992. It contains 25 articles in English and French (with abstracts for each in English and French), an incredibly useful (to scholars) list of manuscripts containing culinary recipes, a complete bibliography, and indices of: titles and authors of cookery books Incipits of culinary texts titles of isolated recipes language of the texts place of production of the manuscripts Ciao, George Ferzoco ferzocog at ere.umontreal.ca From: David Schroeder <ds4p+ at andrew.cmu.edu> Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Sweet Thoughts, etc. Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1993 15:04:25 -0400 Organization: Doctoral student, Industrial Administration, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Greetings good gentles -- I have recently been reading an entertaining volume, "Seeds of Change," by Henry Hobhouse (a journalist, not a professional scholar). The book looks at the historical import of five key plants or plant products: quinine, sugar, tea, cotton, and potatoes. [c.1985 ISBN: 0-06-091440-8 (ppbk)]. Some of the more interesting tidbits are worth sharing. For example, here's a chart of the relative cost of 10 pounds of sugar expressed as a percentage of 1 ounce of gold (taken as an average of London, Paris, and Amsterdam)... Period Sugar % Honey % 1350-1400 35.0 3.30 1400-1450 24.5 2.05 1450-1500 19.0 1.50 1500-1550 8.7 1.20 Note that Hobhouse doesn't cite his sources for this table and doesn't mention that the "value" of an ounce of gold may have changed in the last period due to the huge captured troves of the Aztecs and Incas, but it's still an interesting chart, if only to see the relative expense of sugar and honey. Clearly, using refined sugar in a dish would have been an expensive proposition during almost all of the Society's scope. Hobhouse also says: "The sugar industry survived the gradual expulsion of the Moors from the Mediterranean littoral, and was carried on by both Moslems and Christians as a profitable, expanding concern for two hundred years from about 1300. [Production was centered in Syria, Palestine, the Dodecanese, Egypt, Cyprus, Crete, Sicily, North Africa, and Southern Spain. *B*] The trade (as opposed to production) was under the domi- nance of the merchant bankers of Italy, with Venice ultimately con- trolling distribution throughout the then known world. The first sugar reached England in 1319, Denmark in 1374, and Sweden in 1390. It was an expensive novelty and useful in medicine, being unsurpassed for making palatable the odious mixtures of therapeutic herbs, entrails, and other substances of the medieval pharmacopoeia." Apparently, sugar cultivation in the Caribbean basin was substantial in the second half of the 16th century leading to cheaper sugar prices and a shift in leadership in the trade from Venice to Amsterdam. TEA On the matter of tea Hobhouse reports that in 1700 England was importing 50 short tons of tea with a wholesale value of 4,000 pounds sterling or about two pounds of money for one pound of tea. Again, not a cheap item! He further states (in what is probably a typographical error) that: "Tea, coffee, and cocoa all arrive in London in the same year, 1652. [Could it be 1562 or 1552?] The word "tea" occurs in Shakespeare and "cha," the Canton-Macao form, crops up in Lisbon from about 1550." It's hard to understand the Bard's use of a term for something introduced to England years after his death... I'd best sign off now and return to my reading... I found the book remaindered for $1.98 at my local Borders Bookstore, so you may have good luck finding a copy of your own. My best -- Bertram +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ Bertram of Bearington Dave Schroeder Debatable Lands/AEthelmearc/East Carnegie Mellon University INTERNET: ds4p at andrew.cmu.edu 412/731-3230 (Home) +------------------------ PREME * Press On * PREME ---------------------+ Angharad/Terry asks for enough info about that book out of Montreal that I mentioned to order it. The Following might be helpful. Title: _Du Manuscrit a` la Table_ Editor: Carole Lambert Publisher: Les Presses de l'Universite' de Montre'al 2910, boul. E'douard-Montpetit, Montre'al (Qc), Canada H3T 1J7 tel. (514) 343-6929, facs. (514) 343-2232 Distributer (?): gae[umlaut]tan morin e'diteur diffuseur exclusif des Presses de l'Universite' de Montre'al C.P. 180, Boucherville (QC), Canada, J4B 5E6 tel. (514) 449-7886, facs. (514) 343-2232 ISBN: 2-7606-1564-2 and to whet your appetite: TABLE DES MATIE`RES (extraits) Forward (or preface) by Carole LAMBERT _I - ESSAIS SUR LA CUISINE AU MOYEN A^GE_ 1. SOURCES Constance B. HIEATT "Listing and Analyzing the Medieval English Culinary Recipe Collections: a Project and its Problems" Johanna Maria van WINTER "Une livre de cuisine ne'erlandais du XVIe sie`cle" Allen J. GRIECO "From the Cookbook to the Table: a Florentine Table and Italian Recipes of the Fourteenth and Fifteenth Centuries" Bi SKAARUP "Sources of Medieval Cuisine in Denmark" Danie`le ALEXANDRE-BIDON "A` la table des miniaturistes: arche'o- iconographie des gestes et des mets" 2. DIFFUSION DES LIVRES ET DES RECETTES Philip et Mary HYMAN "Les livres de cuisine et le commerce des recettes en France au XVe et XVIe sie`cles" Melitta WEISS-AMER "The Role of Medieval Physicians in the Spread of Culinary Recipes and Cooking Practices" Mary Ella MILHAM "Platina and Papal Politics" 3. CUISINE ET DISTINCTIONS SOCIALES Bruno Laurioux, "Table et hie'rarchie sociale a` la fin du Moyen A^ge" Odile REDON "La re'glementation des banquets par les lois somptuaires dans les villes d'Italie (XIVe - XVe sie`cles) Agathe LAFORTUNE-MARTEL "De l'entremets culinaire aux pie`ces monte'es d'un menu de propogande" 4. PARTICULARITE'S RE'GIONALES Barbara SANTICH "les e'le'ments distinctifs de la cuisine me'die'vale me'diterrane'enne Rudolf GREWE "Hispano-Arabic Cuisine in the Twelfth Century Jeanne ALLARD "Nola: rupture ou continuite'?" Noe[umlaut]l COULET "La cuisine dans la maison aixoise du XVe sie`cle (1400-1450) Jean-Louis FLANDRIN "Structure des menus francais et anglais aux XIVe et XVe sie`cles Michel BALARD "E'pices et condiments dans quelques livres de cuisine allemands (XVe-XVIe sie`cles) 5. CUISINE ET CONTRAINTES Terence SCULLY "Les saisons alimentaires du _Me'nagier de Paris_" Carole LAMBERT "Astuces et flexibilite' des recettes culinaires me'die'vales francaises" Laurier TURGEON et Denis DICKNER "Contraintes et choix alimentaires d'un groupe d'appartenance: les marins-pe^cheurs francais a' Terre- Neuve au XVIe sie`cle" 6. LES DOUCEURS ET LE PLAISIR Liliane PLOUVIER "Le <<letuaire>>, un confiture du bas Moyen A^ge" Lucie BOLENS "Les sorbets andalous (XIe-XIIIe sie`cles) ou conjurer la nostalgie par la douceur" Mary HYMAN "<<Les menues choses qui ne sont pas de ne'cessite'>>: les confitures et la table" Bruno ROY "Trois reagards sur les aphrodisiaques" _II - RE'PERTOIRE DES MANUSCRITS ME'DIE'VAUX CONTENANT DES RECETTES CULINAIRES_ Pre'sentation Re'pertoire Bibliographie Index Now doesn't that make your mouth water! If no enterprising Pennsic merchant offers one for sale, my parents have offered (without too much arm twisting) to get me it for my birthday. Grad student budget or not, I cant miss this one. I've just got to start those French lessons now... Hoping that helped, Thomas/David David Tallan (tallan at flis.utoronto.ca) or David_Tallan at magic-bbs.corp.apple.com snail: 42 Camberwell Rd. Toronto ON M6C 3E8 From: "Philip W. Troy" <troy at asan.com> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:49:23 -0400 Subject: Re: SC - Guinea pigs Christi Redeker wrote: > > Also the same I believe with Guinea Pigs. They have Capybara (sp?) in > most central and south American areas. Which are the largest rodent and > in the same direct family with the Cavy (guinea pig) that we know today. > The guinea pigs they eat in those countries are very large, > comparatively, to what are raised as pet shop $$. They have an average > weight of 2-3 pounds more than the average pet type guinea pig. (Yes > ladies and gentlemen, I raised guinea pigs and rabbits as a child and > actually showed them, there is and an association called the ACBA > (American Cavy Breeders Association) just for those out there who do. Have a great book somewhere. It is called "Unmentionable Cuisine," and concerns all the foods against which taboos exist in various cultures, i.e. in the continental U.S., that means virtually EVERYTHING. Author is Charles Schwabe, if I remember correctly. There's a neat chapter on guinea pigs, among several such. I seem to recall most of the recipes call for the cavy to be scalded and de-haired, but not skinned. Yum! Adamantius, thinking about pies now Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 22:51:40 -0600 From: Bob Angelone <epicurus at epicurus.com> Subject: Epicurus Online Newsgroups: rec.crafts.brewing,rec.food.drink.beer,rec.org.sca,alt.beer,ba.food,alt.food.wine As publisher of 'Epicurus Online', I would like to personally invite all of you to visit our newest issue. This month's focus is on Flowers as Food. Articles by Carol Wilson, Bob Pastorio and others are among the many interesting and recipe filled tidbits you will find in this issue. Please join me in thanking Cindy Renfrow, our Editor-in-Chief for a job well done by visiting the ezine and enjoying it's wonderful, informative articles. And while you're there, please sign our guestbook. Epicurus Online - http://www.epicurus.com/ezine1.htm If you like Epicurus Online, please check out our main site as well: http://www.epicurus.com Thanks and I hope to see you there soon! Bob Angelone Publisher From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 14:21:03 -0500 (CDT) Subject: SC - PPC and Markham Greetings! PPC (Petits Propos Culinaires) is published by Prospect Books and is in English. If you live in the US, one year is $23.50 and two is $45. Your check should be made payable to PPC North America and sent to PPC North America, 45 Lamont Road, London SW10 OHU. One year consists of three issues of a small hand-size treatise. To me it is well worth the price, for if there is something on the Middle Ages or Renaissance you can be sure it is documentable. A recent issue had a brief article on Aphrodisiacs which I meant to send to this list. Ask for it as a gift from relatives! Alys Katharine Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:19:32 -0500 (CDT) From: nweders at mail.utexas.edu (ND Wederstrandt) Subject: Re: SC - Columbus cookbook Here's the info on the Columbus book plus some of the info in it. The name of the book is Columbus Menu, Italian Cuisine after the First Voyage of Christopher Columbus, by Stefano Milioni printed by the Istituto Italiano per il Commercio Estero (Italian Trade Commission) It came out in 1992. One of the more entertaining topics he author talks about is the reason why forks started being used. He states it was the introduction of the tomato to Italian cooking that caused the fork to be noticed. Milioni states that the fork was around but that it was regarded as an oddity. With the use of tomatoes as sauce, Pasta was harder to eat so the fork started being used and quickly caught on. So thanks to spaghetti with marinara sauce, forks became hot stuff. He does have some dates on various food stuffs Tomato - appeared in Spain early in the 16th century where it was a magical or medicinal plant. Someone during this time tried eating it and described the flavor as similar to eggplant but tastless. The book further states that the tomato while known to Italian botanists in the 16th century was not introduced until the 17th century. The book also suggests that it was primarily grown as an ornamental but during a food famine someone succumbed and cooked one and ate it. No recipes listed in period Potato - introduced through Spain when it was brought back by the Conquistadors. Clusius in 1588 described the plant based on tubers he received from the governor of what is now modern Belguim. He ate them and compared them to the turnip. During the 16th century, potatoes were being shipped to the Spanish garrisons in the Flanders area to supplement the rations of the soldiers there.They are also listed as food items in the records of the Sangre Hospital in Seville (1573) These are white or Virginian potatoes. In 1587, Sir Francis Drake sailed into what is now Columbia and loaded provisions, including potatoes, on his ship. He was supposed to take them to feed starving colonists in Virginia. When he got there everyone wanted to go back to England so they and the potatoes went back. That's the reason they were called Virginian potatoes. No period recipes listed. Clare St. John Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:49:49 -0600 (MDT) From: John or Fraya Davis <gameroom at infowest.com> Subject: SC - Food Book! Just picked up what I think is the best book for medieval cooks since the cookbook! It's called "Food" by Waverley Root, Konecky & Konecky, NY ISBN: 1-56852-101-4. It's an authorative and visual history and dictionary of the foods of the world. It includes much documentation of when foods were eaten and some on how they were prepared by different cultures. It's amazing what's in there about the potato! I didn't know that! Gillian Date: Thu, 16 Oct 1997 07:27:27 -0600 (MDT) From: Mary Morman <memorman at oldcolo.com> Subject: Re: SC - Alphabet pretzels On Thu, 16 Oct 1997, Ian van Tets wrote: > doesn't one of the recipes for jumbles recommend cutting them in Ss > if no other letter springs conveniently to mind? > > Cairistiona I have just gotten a nice little food book called The Dutch Table by Gillian Riley. It is mostly 16th and 17th century Dutch paintings of food and kitchens - with some commentary and many undocumented recipes that she says are from an early 17th century source but does not quote in the original. there are numerous paintings of bread dough letters both in homes and in markets and the author talks about them being made for the Feast of St. Nicholas on December 6th. There are also pictures of traditional, twisted pretzels. It's hard to tell if the letters are cookies or plain bread - there are some that look like each. Most of the paintings are slightly out of period, but this is a lovely book. elaina Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 16:31:27 -0500 (EST) From: Mark Schuldenfrei <schuldy at abel.MATH.HARVARD.EDU> Subject: Re: SC - Cookbooks Most of the cookbooks you mention are reviewed in back issues of Serve It Forth (http://oldcolo.com/~memorman/sif_home.html). Tibor Here is my review of Fast and Feast: Fast and Feast: Food in Medieval Society, by Bridget Ann Henisch. Published by Pennsylvania State University Press, Copyright 1976, fifth printing. ISBN 0-271-01230-7 (hardcover) 0-271-00424-X (paperback, reviewed). A book review by Mark Schuldenfrei (Tibor of Rock Valley) So, should a Society cook read a book that doesn't have recipes? Yes, it seems we should. "Fast and Feast" is well researched and indexed book covering everything about food and foodways customs from late period, except the details of redactions. It is also fun to read (I laughed out loud several times), well indexed and copiously footnoted, and reasonably priced (I paid $14.95) It covers everything about food, except the actual recipes. It covers feast service, entertainment, the role of food in daily life and the ecumenical calendar, the role and popular opinion of the professional cook and the housewife, and their everyday tasks. It covers timing of meals, quantities, beverages, the commercial infrastructure of the time. It even covers the tools of cooking, and eating. There are many reproductions of period illustrations, and the illustrations are well used by the supporting text. The text is heavily footnoted, with 930 notes in 236 pages of text. The book does lack a glossary, and it does occasionally use terms that a truly novice cook might not know. However, the index is good enough to compensate. The bibliography is totally insufficient. Again, however, the footnotes provide a wealth of sources. Some of Henisch's citations are in original languages, and are only lightly modernized or translated: but that doesn't prevent the reader from understanding her points. A readersknowledge of some of the generalities of history are quite useful. (For example, page 38 covers the impact of the Reformation on Lenten practices, without an explanation of the Reformation.) Ms. Henisch organizational ability is formidable: I was particularly impressed with her ability to discuss trends in foodways based upon the corpus of surviving recipes. I found myself wondering why I hadn't seen those trends myself. Do be warned: on a purely academic level, she can be slightly suspect. Many is the time I found her drawing broad conclusions on slender evidence, or worse, supporting narrow conclusions with references that span the centuries and nations. Read her footnotes more carefully than you read the text. (I can't say I know enough to doubt her conclusions: I quite agree with them. But the academic rigor is spotty.) She also sometimes compromises by glossing details, in order to keep the flow of her text. (For example, oversimplifying the definitions of caudle or hypocris). Certainly, she has done an admirable degree of homework. Foodways-related quotations come from plays, household manifests, wills, period manuscripts and receipt books, and more besides. She has also obviously studied hundreds of period illustrations, and makes many useful deductions based upon them. She speaks well on Society shibboleths: are forks period, who sits at high table, should feast halls be lit or dark. She is an evocative writer: consider the pain this poor man felt: "For the Hoccleves of this world, their heads throbbing after the reresopers of the night before, such aggressive, all-around virtue was far out of reach. Pale on his pillow, the reveler would murmur instead 'I may noght faste, ne do penauns, ne go to cherch, ne bydde my beddys, for I have a badde heued ... I shal noght ben wel at ese tyl I have drunkyn agen.' Straightaway, an affable devil settled himself on the bed, coaxing the sufferer to eat a morsel just to keep his strength up to serve God all the more vigorously later in the day: [...]" This is the sort of book that begs to be shared. I want to loan it to my friend who does period mumming, another who brews and is interested in viniculture, my wife who makes sotelties, my friends who study period table service. And I want to revisit some old recipes with new eyes. The early student of foodways will find much to benefit them in this book, although they may not spot some of the places where enthusiasm papers over lack of evidence. The experienced Society cook will love how this book completes your knowledge of everything except how many onions to chop. I would recommend this volume heavily, even at twice the price. Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:28:03 -0500 (EST) From: Carol Thomas <scbooks at neca.com> To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu Subject: Re: Pumpkins? I wish I had a copy of "Why We Eat What We Eat" by Sokolov, published by Summit, long out of print. It had good information on topics like this. It should be available by ILL. Lady Carllein Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:49:47 EST From: melc2newton at juno.com (Michael P Newton) Subject: SC - Children's book My lord husband found a children's book at the library the other day I thought that some on this list might find interesting. It's _A Medieval Feast_ written and illustrated by Aliki. If you have young children {or whatch pbs alot.} you may have seen it on Reading Rainbow. Anyways, it goes through what a lord and his manor had to do to get ready and serve a feast for visiting royalty. The pictures are based off of medieval illustrations, and even show several subtleteys and a couple of cockentrice. Being the Shire's MoC, as well as a novice cook, I thought it was a really good find. Lady Beatrix of Tanet Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:03:11 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - Children's book Michael P Newton wrote: > My lord husband found a children's book at the library the other day I > thought that some on this list might find interesting. It's _A Medieval > Feast_ written and illustrated by Aliki. If you have young children {or > whatch pbs alot.} you may have seen it on Reading Rainbow. Anyways, it > goes through what a lord and his manor had to do to get ready and serve a > feast for visiting royalty. The pictures are based off of medieval > illustrations, and even show several subtleteys and a couple of > cockentrice. Being the Shire's MoC, as well as a novice cook,I thought it > was a really good find. > Lady Beatrix of Tanet Yes, that's a pretty good book. I don't recall that Aliki attempts to perpetuate the myth about rotten meat and spices, which is a Good Thing. One aspect he does mention, which is quite important and rarely examined, is the question of cost. For some members of the aristocracy, it could be quite crippling for the family fortune to find yourself on the Royal Progress, with nothing to be done but grin, bear it, and go into hock. You might also check out Piero Ventura's "Food: Its Evolution through the Ages", which is for somewhat older kids (maybe ten or so?). It gives an overview of basic culinary history, from paleolithic man to the present. It includes references to connections between, say, the invention of better plows, which contributed to the Viking raids on Northern Europe, etc. Illustrations aren't as pretty as Aliki's but better detailed and more informative. All in all, very cool. Got a copy of each for my son, and our friends look at the bookshelves and say, "Look, how cuuuute! Brennan's got his own little books of culinary history, just like Daddy!" Adamantius Date: Mon, 1 Dec 1997 16:40:48 -0500 From: "Louise Sugar" <dragonfyr at tycho.com> Subject: SC - Fw: For the Cooks Among Us.... Here is a goodie from a friend of mine on another list - -----Original Message----- From: Henderson, Sharon <Meli at agent.infodata.com> To: dragon at portcullis.maxson.com <dragon at portcullis.maxson.com> Date: Monday, December 01, 1997 10:58 AM Subject: For the Cooks Among Us.... An *extremely* cool book, excellent especially for people doing redactions or trying to understand foreign terminology, is now available in the US again: Hering's Dictionary of Classical and Modern Cookery. 13th English Edition by Walter Bickel. Fachbuchverlag Dr. Pfannenberg & Co. 35390 Giessen, Germany. English - 852 pages and no illustrations or photographs. This hard to find essential dictionary is the comprehensive gastronomic encyclopedia and reference work for chefs, culinary students, food and beverage managers, and other professionals in the food service industry. This precious small red precious volume with three complete indices contains more than 13,000 curtailed recipes; a comprehensive glossary of kitchen terms in English, French, German, Italian, and Spanish; information on table service, wine, dietaries and carving. Available from C.H.I.P.S, 1307 Golden Bear Lane, Kingwood, TX 77339; Tel. U.S.A. + (281) 359-2270; Fax. U.S.A. + (281) 359-2277, or by accessing the internet at http://www.chipsbooks.com Meli Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 16:42:29 -0600 (CST) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming ) Subject: SC - Cookery Myths and a "New" Book (Longish) Greetings! I've been meaning to write about some of the "new" books I found when a recent post "tickled" my memory from one of them. Someone mentioned that Catherine de Medici brought Italian cooks to France, which is apparantly an "old cooks' legend" and not accurate. Elizabeth David, one of the cooking "gods" has a new version of her _Italian Food_ which I was going to tell you all about. (Actually, her estate does. She died a few years ago.) (ISBN 0-7651-9651-4) The book currently appears to be on "mark down" at Borders Bookstores for $5.99! The book is profusely illustrated, mostly with reproductions of _period_ art which depict various aspects of cookery. For the pictures and documentation alone, it's worth the price. The book contains some brief historical information in each of the chapters and she refutes some of the "legends" that she passed on in the earlier versions. The recipes are modern but would be useful when attempting to re-create similar "period" dishes. She refutes the legend of Marco Polo bringing noodles to Italy as well as the Catherine de Medici one that someone repeated in an earlier post. This is what Ms. David writes: "To my original Introduction I have made only one significant revision, and that concerns the paragraph dealing with the influence on French cookery traditionally exercised by Catherine de Medici and the Florentine cooks she is said to have brought with her to France. These cooks, I now find, are part of a myth originating in mid-nineteenth-century France, perhaps in the imagination of one of the popular historical novelists who flourished at that period, and certainly without historical fact. As briefly as possible, what _is_ historical fact is that when Catherine arrived in France in 1533 to marry Henri Duke of Orleans, younger brother of the Dauphin, she was fourteen years old, had barely emerged from the Florentine convent in which she had been brought up, and had already been granted French nationality. All her attendants were French. "Whatever the Italian influence exercised on French cultural life in general and on culinary developments in particular by Catherine's marriage to the boy who was later to become Henri II of France, that transalpine influence had already been active at least since the end of the previous century...." She goes on for another paragraph and a half detailing what influences occurred under Charles VIII and in Catherine's reign as Queen Consort and Queen Dowager. On the topic of "puff pastry", etc, part of another paragraph reads, "One of her pastrycooks is credited with the invention or at any rate with the introduction of flaky pastry, but then so are other personages, among them the much later painter Claude Lorrain, who is said to have learned how to make it in Rome. Many food historians would say that some form of fine-leaved pastry had been known at least since the days of the Romans, and I think they would be right, but equally I have doubts about the claim that Catherine's pastrycooks made their "feuillete' " with butter rather than with oil or lard. One does not hear much about the use of butter in France at this period...." A lovely book! Do you have a Borders Bookstore in your area??? I've bought six books already for use as gifts! Alys Katharine Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 16:34:07 -0500 From: margali <margali at 99main.com> Subject: Re: SC - nasty medieval food was re: pre 1500 cookery There is a fairly good book by Ann Hagen called A Handbook of Anglo-Saxon Food:Processing and Consumption, isbn 0-9516209-8-3,Anglo-Saxon Books, 25 Malpas Dr, Pinner, Middlesex, Eng. that I rather enjoyed and is relatively scholarly, though some of her conclusions are not what I would have drawn given the same data, but those are my personal opinions. I got it from, iirc Poison Pen Press or Small Churl Books at an even several years ago. margali Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 22:58:24 EST From: Seton1355 <Seton1355 at aol.com> Subject: SC - New book - very good!! Greetings to all the good gentles on this list! I just found this wonderful book at Borders Bookstore. Perhaps some of you might be interested. The Food Chronology by James Trager, Henry Holt Publisher, 1995 It's basicly a food timeline and chock full of useful & interesting info. Pax, Phillipa Seton Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:43:30 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - New book - very good!! >I just found this wonderful book at Borders Bookstore. Perhaps some of you >might be interested. > >The Food Chronology by James Trager, Henry Holt Publisher, 1995 > >It's basicly a food timeline and chock full of useful & interesting info. > >Pax, Phillipa Seton I agree, it's a good book. I use it as a starting point for outlining things I want to research. However, I will make a few caveats. Trager, both in his The Food Chronology and his earlier The Foodbook, does not appear to do a great deal of research, depending on the scholarship of others for accuracy. He presents a generally accepted view of food history, but he tends to ignore scholarly disputes. His major sin is not providing source notes of a bibliography. BTW, I think the MS Encyclopedia has incorporated parts of The Food Chronology. A number of the subjects in the Encyclopedia use precisely the same wording as The Food Chronology. Bear Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 08:22:23 -0600 (CST) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming) Subject: SC - Period Dairying, Etc. Greetings. For the person looking for information on period dairy practices and cheesemaking try _The English Housewife_ by Gervase Markham, 1615. There is a good edition out by Michael Best, McGill-Queen's University Press, 1986, ISBN 0-7735-0582-2. He has a chapter on the practices that a good housewife should follow. While I don't believe there are "recipes" per se he does mention certain types of cheeses and what one should do with the whey, curds, etc. There is also another fascinating book, _The Country House Kitchen, 1650-1900_, edited by Sambrook and Brears. While the dates indicate OOP, this book takes some of the manors belonging to England's National Trust and details the architectural plans and layout of the kitchens and related rooms. Tucked in with all the OOP material are references to period practices. There are numerous references to dairies and dairying. I don't know where one might find the book. It is esoteric enough that most public libraries wouldn't have it and expensive enough that most SCAers wouldn't have it. I have a copy, but then, I'm single and a pack rat for books! If there's something specific - dairy layout, items needed for a "perfect" dairy or dairyroom, post me and I will send what I can find, time willing. Publisher is Alan Sutton Publishing Limited (in association with the National Trust). Date is 1996, and ISBN is 0-7509-0884-X. If you have Poison Pen Press's e-mail or address, I believe I got it from her two Pennsics ago. Alys Katharine Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 17:28:09 +0000 From: James and/or Nancy Gilly <KatieMorag at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Re: SC - Period Dairying, Etc. Amazon.com lists it two ways: *The Country House Kitchen*, $21.56 *The Country House Kitchen 1650-1900, Skills and Equipment for Food Provisioning*, $23.77 Alasdair mac Iain Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:12:41 -0200 (GMT) From: Jessica Tiffin <melisant at mweb.co.za> Subject: RE: SC - A Good Book Bear wrote: >For food history, I like Reay Tannehill's Food in History. There is at >least one other translated from the French, but I can not remember the name >at the moment. I've always had a lot of fun with Maguelonne Toussaint-Samat's History of Food - is that the one you mean? A lot of what she says refers to food types and sources in modern France, but she gives wonderful historical overviews and is very entertaining to read. I also picked up a new paperback copy at a ridiculously low price, so I'm somewhat enchanted with it. Mesliant de Huguenin Minister of Arts and Sciences, Shire of Adamastor, Drachenwald Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:17:20 -0500 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - A Good Book > Bear wrote: > >For food history, I like Reay Tannehill's Food in History. There is at > >least one other translated from the French, but I can not remember the name > >at the moment. > > I've always had a lot of fun with Maguelonne Toussaint-Samat's History of > Food - is that the one you mean? > > Mesliant de Huguenin That's the one! I don't own a copy, so I keep forgetting the author and title. Like Tannehill, it has the pleasant attribute of being in print. Bear Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 22:28:56 -0500 From: "Philip W. Troy & Susan Troy" <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - "On Food and Cooking" book Donna Hrynkiw wrote: > On Food and Cooking -- The Science and Lore of the Kitchen > Harold McGee > > Fireside / Simon & Schuster > 1984 > ISBN 0-684-84328-5 > $21.00, very thick trade paperback > > Chapters on grain, meat, plant matter, milk, sugar, etc. Very readable. > > Elizabeth Oh, yeah. That's pretty much been one of my culinary Bibles. Learn how food behaves, and why, and you can predict what it will do under a given set of conditions. Very, very valuable. Adamantius stgardr, East From: alysk at ix.netcom.com(Elise Fleming) Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Elizabethan Dining Question Date: 17 Nov 1998 00:31:21 GMT "DnA" <dna at z95.com> writes: >A friend of mine's daughter is doing a high school report on the type >of food that was eaten during the late 1600's - early 1700's (she's >studying Shakespeare). A good out-of-print book is _Dining With William Shakespeare_ by Madge Lorwin. A library (or interlibrary loan) might find it. She takes quotes from Shakespeare and recipes from cookery books of the late 1500s and the 1600s with modernized versions. She also explains some of the customs of the times. Once you get into the mid-1600s there are quite a few cookery books. You might also try _Martha Washington's Booke of Cookery_ by Karen Hess. The recipes are from the early 1600s up to the end of the century. Alys Katharine Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 08:16:43 -0500 From: Melanie Wilson <MelanieWilson at compuserve.com> To: LIST SCA arts <sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu> Subject: More on Food & Society Books ed C Anne Wilson AS requested further blurb ! Food for the community- Monastic Medieval diets in England, Servants feeding from middle ages to 19th C, Sailors diets 1530-1830. School dinners Louis XIV, Workhouse soup Yorkshire, soldiers food in the 19th C Liquid Nourisment -Possets, cider, pery, hot ale, water of life, pottages & soups, sherbets prehistory to present day Appetite & the eye visual aspects of food, its presentation within their historical context. Waste not want not-hording methods etc from prehistory to present day. Hope that helps ? I have a couple of copies if anyone wants them. Mel Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 09:51:15 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - barley > << I have borrowed a friend's copy of History of Food >> > > Could someone please send the information about this book? Thank you, > Molly Kekilpenny Toussaint-Samat, Maquelonne, The History of Food; Blackwell, ISBN 0631194975, paperback, $29.95. Tannahill, Reay, Food in History; Crown, ISBN 0517884046, paperback, $16.00. Both of these are in print. They are primarily global reviews of the history of food and eating from prehistory to the present. Their scope is such that they tend to be shallow in the particulars of any given foodstuff. They do make good starting points for deeper research. Comments have been made about errors in both books and about Toussaint-Samat's Franco-centric view, but as surveys of the field, they are the best available. Bear Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:59:10 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - Period Chili > << Trager places the introduction of paprika into Hungary as 1529 when the > Turks first took Buda. >> > > What part of the date is open to questions, when the Turks took Buda or > when they introduced paprika? > > Noemi The introduction of paprika is the questionable aspect. This particular entry is from The Food Chronology, which is a useful timelime, but which is not fully indexed, has some errors of fact, does not properly differentiate between the factual and the apocryphal, and provides no bibliography of sources. I use The Food Chronology to locate temporal relationships in food and cooking, but unless I have or can locate other sources, I consider the information I find there questionable. As for the capture of Buda, it was taken by the Turks in 1529, appears to have been lost or ceded following the first siege of Vienna in 1529, and retaken in 1541. It was liberated in 1683 after the second siege of Vienna. Which is about all the information and mis-information I have on the subject. Bear Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:09:56 -0600 (CST) From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming) Subject: SC - Re: Old World/New World Foods Cariadoc/David mentioned that PPC had articles on New World foods and suggested that you look for back issues. Acanthus Books now carries back issues. I'm lousy for URLs, but Amanda haunts this list and might provide it. They are approximately $7.50 per issue (at least from Prospect Books) but worth it. Also, look for Sophie Coe's _America's First Cuisines_, Univ. of Texas Press, 1994, ISBN (paperback) 0-292-71159-x. It contains basically the same material (but greatly expanded) that appeared in the PPC articles mentioned above. She details Aztec, Maya, and Inca foods. What I found so interesting was the influence of Old World foods on the New World, why some New World foods didn't catch on right away, and so forth. This might explain why, even though capsicums were _brought_ to the Old World in period they were not _used_ . (That is, they might have been cooked and presented to royalty, and noted in a report - from which we get historical "proof" - but they weren't incorporated into dishes served at feasts.) A third source would be the older _The Columbian Exchange, Biological and Cultural Consequences of 1492_, by Alfred W. Crosby, Jr., Greenwood Press (Connecticut), 1972, ISBN 0-8371-7228-4 for the paperback. It has had at least four printings. To me, it is a "dryer" read than Coe's book, but I haven't read it for quite a few years now. Alys Katharine, having a second "snow day" following yesterday's free day! Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 09:30:14 -0500 From: renfrow at skylands.net (Cindy Renfrow) Subject: SC - Re: Petits Propos Culinaires, was old world/new world foods >Petits Propos Culinaires is an international journal on food, food history, >cookery and cookery books. Inquiries should be addressed to PPC North >America, c/o Jennifer & Nic Spencer, 5311 42nd St NW, Washington, D.C. >20015. Currently a subscription costs $18 for one year (three issues). > >(from the Miscellany; I don't know if the address and price are still >correct). > >David/Cariadoc>http://www.best.com/~ddfr/ Here is a post from Sept.? by Dame Alys with the current information: To forestall the inevitable posts about where to get this lovely pamphlet/booklet: Cost for 3 issues (1 year): In the UK: 12 pounds; in the USA, $23.50. Cost for 6 issues (2 years): In the UK: 23.50 pounds; in the USA, $45. In the UK: 45 Lamont Road, London SW10 OHU. Make sterling cheques payable to Prospect Books Ltd. In the USA: same address as above. Make dollar cheques payable to PPC North America. In Canada: c/o Ann Semple, 1897 Prince of Wales Drive, Ottawa, Ontario K2C 3J7. Make cheques payable to Ann Semple. In Australia: c/o Barbara Santich, 13 King Street, Brighton 5048. Cheques payable to Barbara Santich. In New Zealand: c/o Helen Phare, PO Box 5775, Wellesley Street, Auckland. Cheques payable to Helen Phare. When PPC comes into my mailbox, my day is automatically brighter and my bathroom stays become longer! Alys Katharine Cindy/Sincgiefu renfrow at skylands.net Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:06:47 EST From: Acanthusbk at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - PPC Cariadoc wrote: > Petits Propos Culinaires is an international journal on food, food history, > cookery and cookery books. Inquiries should be addressed to PPC North > America, c/o Jennifer & Nic Spencer, 5311 42nd St NW, Washington, D.C. > 20015. Currently a subscription costs $18 for one year (three issues). > > (from the Miscellany; I don't know if the address and price are still > correct). > > I wouldn't expect most libraries to carry it. Current details for US PPC subscriptions are: Six issues (2 years) $45, three issues (one year) $23.50 If you would like to subscribe send your US$ check to: PPC (Petits Propos Culinaires) 45 Lamont Road London SW10 0HU ENGLAND tel/fax (from the US) 011-44-171-351-1242 email AEDavidson at compuserve.com Tell them Amanda at Acanthus Books referred you. Also, FYI, Acanthus will shortly have in stock the complete inventory of back issues of PPC. Amanda Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:49:53 EST From: Acanthusbk at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - PPC Alys Katherine wrote: > Cariadoc/David mentioned that PPC had articles on New World foods and > suggested that you look for back issues. Acanthus Books now carries > back issues. I'm lousy for URLs, but Amanda haunts this list and might > provide it. They are approximately $7.50 per issue (at least from > Prospect Books) but worth it. I just received word yesterday the first shipment of back issues is in transit and will arrive within the next couple of weeks. Issues up to the most recent, #60, will be available. PPC's standard retail price for back issues is $7.95. Acanthus' standard retail will be $7, and there will be standard quantity discounts offered, as well as discounts on assembled packages of interest to SCA cooks. I'll be posting more details soon, and pending Alan Davidson's permission will have scans of the table of contents pages available. An online index for PPC issues 46-55 is currently available on Russell Harris' homepage at http://members.tripod.com/~rdeh/index.html and you can download a text file containing the complete index for issues 1-55. Russell's homepage also has an index to the Oxford Symposium proceedings for the years 1981-1994. Acanthus Books has proceedings from the years 1986-current in stock, plus earlier years available as used books. Anyone with questions about PPC (or the Oxford Symposium) can email me at acanthusbk at aol.com. Amanda Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:08:42 -0500 From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd at gate.net> Subject: Re: SC - Salsify-update and useful info My copy of "Larousse Gastronomique the Encyclopedia of Food, Wine and Cookery" in English translation (Prosper Montagne, Crown Publishers, Inc. NY 1961 Library of Congress Cat. # 61-15788) says that what is called Salaify is actually two plants the "...root of the plant of the Compositae family which alone is entitled to it, but also for that of another plant on the same family which botanically is called scorzonera." The entry goes on to say that the flesh of the roots of both plants are very similar in taste and are prepared in exactly the same way. The word Scorzonera comes from Catalan "escorso" or in English viper as it was formerly believed to be a specific against its bite. The entry in my edition provides 11 recipes. Copies of Larousse Gastronomique, at least in West Palm Beach, can often be found in the book secions of charity thrift stores for about $5 or $6 if you keep your eye out for it, about $20 in used book stores and over $75 new. Daniel Raoul Le Vascon du Navarre' Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 11:20:51 -0800 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: SC - Byzantine Sources At 3:00 AM -0800 1/28/99, James L. Matterer wrote: >Several years ago there was in circulation a newsletter entitled EARLY >PERIOD. I know very little about this publication except that it dealt >with mostly pre-1000 recreation, and was produced by people involved >with the SCA. I read it for some time. It was an admirable effort, but not very reliable in terms of historical authenticity, in part because a lot of what they were trying to do was stuff for which period sources were scarce to nonexistent. David Friedman Professor of Law Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 01:14:53 EST From: Vanishwood at aol.com Subject: SC - Question about source "All Manners of Food" Has anyone read "All Manners of Food: Eating and Taste in England and France From the Middle Ages to the Present" It doesn't have recipes but it (through what I've read) appears to be an analysis of eating habits. So far it appears to be a good source for cooks to understand the economic and social factors in cooking during the period the SCA covers..... If you read it, what did you think about it? So far I found it very informative. Ethelwulf Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 07:19:59 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - Question about source "All Manners of Food" > Has anyone read "All Manners of Food: Eating and Taste in England and > France From the Middle Ages to the Present" > > Ethelwulf It is interesting and possibly useful, but it is also the source of an erroneous quote I made about Piers Plowman, so caveat emptor. Bear Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 11:04:46 -0500 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - Shakespeare Cindy Renfrow wrote: > Hello! Does anyone have a listing of food & feasting references in > Shakespeare's plays? You might check out Madge Lorwin's "Dining With William Shakespeare", 1976 Atheneum, New York City, ISBN 0-689-10731-5 . Mostly this is yet another forum for Renaissance and Early Modern English recipes from sources like Plat, Digby, May, Rabisha, etc., but there are quite a few actual food references from Shakespeare's plays and sonnets in there too. Adamantius stgardr, East Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 21:30:06 -0500 From: Bonne <oftraquair at hotmail.com> Subject: SC - Horseflesh, guinea pigs, insects etc. > See James Frazer's "The Golden Bough" for more on this, as well as > Calvin W. Schwabe's "Unmentionable Cuisine"; Funny you should mention this. Last week while rummaging through the Chapel Hill public library for sources for my feast I came across it and spent much too much time reading it instead of more pertinent books. I took some notes to tell the list about it, here it is anyway for the others that hadn't heard about it. Unmentionable Cuisine Calvin W. Schwabe Univ. of Virginia Press 1979 ISBN 0-8139-0811-6 Schwabe was some sort of vetrinary researcher who travelled the world and began collected recipes for portions of animals, or entire animals that are considered inedible in the U.S. This book could be considered the evil twin to "Diet for a Small Planet". While that book argues that feeding animals grain in order to butcher them for meat is an inefficient way to feed the world, this one argues that if we are going to feed the grain to the animals, we might at least eat the animal more efficiently. Being picky about which parts of the animals we eat is silly in his view. Regarding the usual meat animals (cattle, pigs, sheep, goat, chicken) there are recipes for all sorts of organ meats, including stuffed eyeballs. There are also chapters devoted to less often eaten animals like guinea pigs and various game animals and to insects. Bonne Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 01:22:34 -0000 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nanna_R=F6gnvaldard=F3ttir?=" <nannar at isholf.is> Subject: Re: SC - Summertime Cerulean Blue Sauce >Excellent quote. Could you please provide the title of the work? I don't >recognize the author. John Ayto, British, author of many reference works, mostly concerning the origin of words and names, like The Dictionary of Word Origins, The Oxford Dictionary of Slang, some translations from Middle English I believe, and the work Im quoting from, A Gourmets Guide, which is mostly concerned with the origin and development of food terms. A valuable and entertaining work in my opinion, and one Ive made much use of. For some reason it was earlier published as both The Diners Dictionary and The Gluttons Glossary. Nanna Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:59:41 EST From: LrdRas at aol.com Subject: SC - Opinions needed I purchased 'Culinary Cultures of the Middle East; ed. by Sami Zubaida and Richard Trapper " to day. Any opinions on this book? The collection of lectures, papers and essays includes Perry and many others. Since it is definitely written for more academically minded individuals, I was wondering about accuracy, etc. before devoting my time to reading and studying it since it will take much time. Ras Date: Fri, 26 Mar 1999 10:43:09 -0600From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US>Subject: RE: SC - Book opinion wanted > Hey, Amazon came up with this book on my reccomendations page> today, and I was wondering if anyone out there had read it, and> would care to comment? Thanks in advance.> -----Gille MacDhnouill>> All Manners of Food : Eating and Taste in England and> France from the Middle Ages to the Present> by Stephen MennellI would recommend you borrow it from the library first. It deals primarilywith the social history of food, only the first few chapters deal withmedieval food, and there are some errors (i've been bit, using it as areference). The book is not particularly useful in redacting recipes,although the hardbound edition had some recipes on the endpapers (IIRC).This is one to read before you buy.Bear Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 11:59:43 -0700 From: "James L. Matterer" <jlmatterer at labyrinth.net> Subject: Re: SC - What's cooking at the Tabard? You might like to check out my website on Chaucerian Cookery. I've researched Chaucer's writings for references for food and have related them to corresponding period recipes. All of "Chaucer's Foods" are listed there (bread, cheese, ale, wine, bake mete, etc.) with the location in Chaucer's poetry where they might be found. And there are some pretty graphics, too, and other literary/food info. It's at: A Chaucerian Cookery http://www.labs.net/dmccormick/ccookery.htm I received my laurel for researching the food of Chaucer's time and poetry, so this is certainly one of my favorite subjects! Maste Huen/Jim Matterer - -- A Boke of Gode Cookery http://www.labs.net/dmccormick/huen.htm Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 16:13:40 EDT From: THLRenata at aol.com Subject: Re: SC - Book opinions Since Bonne asked: << The Food Chronology : A Food Lover's Compendium of Events and Anecdotes, from Prehistory to the Present ~ James Trager / Henry Holt (Paper) / June 1997 >> This is a fascinating book! I did notice a tendency toward the "medieval food was over-spiced to disguise bad meat" attitude and should point out that more than 50% of the book deals with the 20th Century. Still, I do plan to get my own copy someday. Renata Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 21:36:11 -0400 From: "Jennifer Conrad" <CONRAD3 at prodigy.net> Subject: SC - Shakespeare and Food (web page) http://www.soupsong.com/ibard.html This site lists foods mentioned in Shakespeare's plays and where in the play the mention happens. Luveday Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 21:57:36 +0100 From: Thomas Gloning <Thomas.Gloning at germanistik.uni-giessen.de> Subject: SC - Food in high medieval theology (new book) Philip Lyndon Reynolds just announced his new book about food in medieval theology: <<< Dear Colleagues: (...) I wanted to announce that my book, _Food and the Body: some peculiar questions in high medieval theology_ (Leiden: Brill), is now out. As a result of an experiment with our kitchen scales, I can reveal that it will cost about 3 dollars and 25 cents per ounce. (...) Philip Lyndon Reynolds >>> I must confess that I know something about the role of medicine in medieval nutrition and cookery, but not much about the role of theology. Therefore, I look forward to see this book. Thomas Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:53:38 -0700 From: "Laura C. Minnick" <lcm at efn.org> Subject: Re: SC - Food in high medieval theology (new book) Thomas Gloning wrote: > > Philip Lyndon Reynolds just announced his new book about food in > medieval theology: > > <<< Dear Colleagues: > (...) I wanted to announce that my book, _Food and the Body: some > peculiar questions in high medieval theology_ (Leiden: Brill), is now > out. As a result of an experiment with our kitchen scales, I can reveal > that it will cost about 3 dollars and 25 cents per ounce. (...) > Philip Lyndon Reynolds >>> > > I must confess that I know something about the role of medicine in > medieval nutrition and cookery, but not much about the role of theology. > Therefore, I look forward to see this book. Thomas and all, If you are interested in the theological implications of food, particularly in the practices of the female mystics, Caroline Walker Bynum has several titles on different aspects of the subject. _Holy Feast and Holy Fast_ is probably her best known work on the subject. In the academic community, the subect of female mysticism and related food disorders, etc., has been hot for the past ten years or so. I even wrote a paper on the subject a couple of years back, titled "Bite me: Eucharistic Devotion and the Corporeal Christ". I thought it was awful but I got a good grade on it- ain't academics wonderful? 'Lainie Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 21:20:15 -0700 From: "Laura C. Minnick" <lcm at efn.org> Subject: Re: SC - Book Review Kekilpenny at aol.com wrote: > Is anyone familiar with this book? > > "Medieval Feast, by Aliki. This picture book for ages 7 to 11 details the > elaborate preparations that had to be made whenever a lord and lady had to > prepare to entertain the King. It took them weeks to set up the rooms and > prepare the feast itself. And they really did bake four and twenty blackbirds > into a pie! This is a must-read for those studying medieval history. Cat. > #72, $5.95." > > It is available at Amazon right now. > > Molli Rose > Sol Haven (LMoC) It's a really cute book- one of the better children's books on the subject- useful for demos, working with pages, etc. Roughly set in the reign of one of the Three Edwards. Been a few years since I've seen it, but I remember it- which is a good sign! 'Lainie Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 15:37:14 +0100 From: Christina Nevin <cnevin at caci.co.uk> Subject: RE SC - Recommended Books A book you really do want is Terrence Scully's "The Art of Cookery in the Middle Ages" (1995 Univ of Rochester Press; ISBN: 0851156118). Admittedly there are no recipes (though reading it always inspires me to go cook!), but I learnt a lot from it which affected the way I cooked and thought of medieval cooking and food. Lucretzia ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Lady Lucrezia-Isabella di Freccia | mka Tina Nevin Thamesreach Shire, The Isles, Drachenwald | London, UK Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 08:56:20 -0400 From: Philip & Susan Troy <troy at asan.com> Subject: Re: SC - Book Review Kekilpenny at aol.com wrote: > Is anyone familiar with this book? > > "Medieval Feast, by Aliki. This picture book for ages 7 to 11 details the > elaborate preparations that had to be made whenever a lord and lady had to > prepare to entertain the King. It took them weeks to set up the rooms and > prepare the feast itself. And they really did bake four and twenty blackbirds > into a pie! This is a must-read for those studying medieval history. Cat. > #72, $5.95." Overall, I like it. Not all of the historical information is strictly accurate, but it's pretty close, and it's hard to be both general and accurate on the topic of A Medieval Feast; so much of what is true of one isn't true of another, so you have to be very slective. There's nothing in there about overspicing bad meat or anything like that. The subtlety of a pie of live birds seems to me, based on what I've seen, to be more a renaissance thing, but that's a minor quibble when you consider that the information is given to children in such a way as to portray these people's customs and actions as reasonable and understandable, even if a bit alien to us. For example, the author speaks of the stress on the lord of the Castle who may not be able to afford the financial burden of a Royal Progress visit and series of feasts without spending most of his stores and fortune, and possibly even endangering his serfs as they struggle through the winter to come, all with the risk of Official Displeasure and its various tangible ramifications, should the feast not go well for some reason. It paints with a pretty broad brush, but I think it does its job, which is to educate and entertain children on this topic, and if the kids find out later about the four-and-twenty blackbirds, that won't negate the benefits of the rest of it. Or, to put it another way, my kid liked it, and related it to SCA feasts he's been to, some of which I've cooked, and he had a better sense of all that went into producing such a feast, even now. Then he went around the hall telling people, "See that rice stuff? My Dad cooked that for you! Do you like it?" Adamantius Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 12:20:56 -0500 From: david friedman <ddfr at best.com> Subject: Re: SC - Book Review At 11:52 PM -0400 10/29/99, Kekilpenny at aol.com wrote: >Is anyone familiar with this book? > >"Medieval Feast, by Aliki. I read it some time back and thought it did a pretty accurate job--certainly much better than I expect of children's books. David/Cariadoc http://www.best.com/~ddfr/ Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 22:32:35 PST From: "kylie walker" <kyliewalker at hotmail.com> Subject: SC - witchcraft, food and jesus I hope that got your attention - didn't quite know how to summarise 15 essay titles in one line... The Research Centre for the History of Food & Drink at the University of Adelaide (in Australia) is about to launch a book I thought might interest some of you. "Food, Power and Community: Essays in the History of Food and Drink" is a collection of refereed papers from the research centre's first International Conference, held earlier this year. Some of the essays have an exclusively Australian focus, but there are a couple of much earlier ones: Michael Symons on "Did Jesus Cook", Barbara Santich on "Who were the most temperate and best mannered people in medieval Europe?" and John Cashman on " 'La cuisine diabolique': the functions of food in early modern European witchcraft". If anyone wants further details, let me know. (I have nothing to do with the book. My only connection is that as a member of the centre, I pay my $10 every year, longingly read the list of events and conferences and then admit reluctantly that I can't be in two places at once...) Kylie Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 14:37:52 -0600 From: "Decker, Terry D." <TerryD at Health.State.OK.US> Subject: RE: SC - Re: SC-Olives, and I've got a new book > Funny you should bring this up. I just got a new book (new to me, it is a > used book) it is titled: > Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti trans. by Judith Spencer. It is said > to be a facsimile of I think a 13 or 14th century manuscript. <clipped> > > I was going to write to the list today and ask if anyone else had looked > over the book and what they thought about it. I am, for now, treating it > as a source of information that needs verifying until I can determine it's > accuracy. > > Angeline IIRC, The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti is a decent modern translation of a 14th Century translation and commentary of an 11th Century work by Ibn Butlan, On the Management of Diseases for the Most Part Through Common Foodstuffs and Medicine for the Use of Monks of the Cloister and Whoever is Far From the City. (I had to check a crib sheet for that one.) Ibn Butlan (d. 1066) was a Christian physician originally from Baghdad who travelled widely in the Middle East before settling in Antioch and becoming a monk. He is supposedly the Ellbochasim mentioned in The Four Seasons. I only have a few excerpts from the book, but what I have seen is worthwhile. Bear Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 02:44:05 +0100 From: Thomas Gloning <Thomas.Gloning at germanistik.uni-giessen.de> Subject: SC - Four seasons of the House of Cerruti / Tacuin sanitatis [books] This is about some books and manuscripts. << IIRC, The Four Seasons of the House of Cerruti is a decent modern translation of a 14th Century translation and commentary of an 11th Century work by Ibn Butlan >> The Four seasons of the House of Cerruti (Hausbuch der Cerruti) is a manuscript now asserved in the "Oesterreichische Nationalbibiothek" in Vienna under the shelfmark Cod. ser. nov. 2644. It is from the end of the 14th century. Other manuscripts of this type are asserved in Rome (Bibliotheca Casanatense), in Paris (National Library of France), in Vienna again (Cod. vind. 2396; some pages reproduced in Zotter) and in other libraries. These are not really translations of Ibn-Butlan's text. Rather, they are picture manuscripts with a very much abbreviated text. The original text of Ibn-Butlan has no pictures, but is in the form of _tables_. Of course, the abbreviated picture manuscripts are valuable for their illustrations in other respects. If you want to have the original Ibn-Butlan text, you might want to look at the critical edition prepared by Hossam Elkhadem [with a translation into French]: - -- Elkhadem, H. (d.): Le Taqwim al-Sihha (Tacuini Sanitatis) d'Ibn Butlan: un trait mdical du XIe sicle. Histoire du Texte, dition Critique, Traduction, Commentaire. Louvain (Peeters) 1990. Elkhadem also wrote a short article about the textual history of the tacuin sanitatis: - -- Elkhadem, H.: Le Taqwim al-Sihha (Tacuini Sanitatis): Un Trait de Dittique et d'Hygine du XIe Sicle. In: Jansen-Sieben, R./ Saelemans, F. (rd.): Voeding en Geneeskunde/ Alimentation et Mdecine. Bruxelles 1993, 75-93. There are several Latin manuscripts, but there is no critical edition of the Latin version up to now. In the meantime you can use a printed edition from 1531: - -- Tacuini Sanitatis Elluchasem Elimithar Medici de Baldath, De sex Rebus non naturalibus, earum naturis, operationibus, & rectificationibus (...). Straburg (Joh. Schott) 1531. Based on this edition, there is a German translation prepared by Michael Herr in 1533 (reprinted as a facsimile several times): - -- Herr, M.: Schachtafelen der Gesuntheyt (...) Durch bewarung der Sechs neben Natrlichen ding (...) durch erkantn