yurts-msg - 12/26/09

Round Mongol tents also called gers. References. Construction hints.

NOTE: See also the files: Mongols-msg, fd-Mongols-msg, pavilions-msg, p-tents-art, p-tents-msg, tent-sources-msg, tent-fabrics-msg.

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    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous
                                          Stefan at florilegium.org
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From: Blackwolf
Re: Burning Tents!!
Date: 22 Jan 92 

One advantage yurts have over standard tents .... large "smoke" openings in the roof and skirting on the sides that can be partially raised to provide adequate ventilation .... hot air rises through roof, creates low  pressure that pulls steady supply of air through "vents" in sides ...  sets up a convection flow that carries stale air (including carbon monoxide) out and pulls fresh air in.
  
As for safety ... the yurt is a "sacred" space - the hearth is at the center and as such all who enter are aware of it (all of us mongol types know basic yurt protocol).  when one enters such "sacred space", one does not casually fling ones cloak around .... consider, it was death penalty for any one who stepped on the "threshold" of a yurt (the dividing line between the sacred inner circle and the external consensus reality world).  if the person who suggested this design (and having experience in yurts and amerind tepees in winter, it is an excellent design) is sensible, he'll have an extinguisher out of sight and near to hand - as all SCAdian tent dwellers should.  
 
Basic point here is not to legislate out all possibility of danger ... it is to teach respect and understanding of these areas ... in this case how to live with fire - a skill that is sadly lacking.  anyone who feels they need to have their hands held to that level really needs to get out of the woods and back into their apartments.  it's amazing what stressing personal responsibility and common sense will get you verses trying to push responsibility off on others (concept has ramifications in many areas of SCAdian life as well as munucdane life ....).  

bw


From: corun at access.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: tent space - period pavillions
Date: 25 May 1993 09:59:40 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

doconnor at sedona.intel.com (Dennis O'Connor) writes:
>corun at access.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra) writes:
>] I don't know what the size of the average European style pavilion or
>] tent is, but I bring a yurt (which is the Russian word for it, the
>] Mongolian being ger). My yurt is 15 feet in diameter, stands six feet
>] at the wall and eight at the roof ring, and has no center support poles.
>
>My newly-completed gher (known to Europeans as a "yurt", which really
>means "area of land where you live") is 16' in diameter, and stands
>5' tall at the walls. The roof peaks at 10', and has a 3' diameter
>smoke-hole with a flap to cover it, built around a Mongol-style
>wheel like your. Currently it does have a center-pole attached to the
>"wheel" by a spider of ropes and turnbuckles: I've first built an 
>"easy-up" frame for it, which uses (horrors) tether lines, and as 
>time goes by I'll also build a more authentic wooden framework for it.
>
>Corun, I have to advise you: I've never seen a real gher that had walls
>more than 5' high. Most seem to be abuou 4'6" or so. The advantages
>of a low wall are less fabric, less surface area exposed to the wind,
>less volume to try to heat in the winter, and your enemies have to
>duck coming in the door, making them easy to kill :-). But if you
>happen to have a taller gher than I've seen : I'm sure the height
>of gher walls varied some in the time of the Empire :-).

Thank you for the advice. My yurt is based on an actual one I was 
allowed to climb around in that was brought to the Smithsonian by
the Russians several years ago for the exhibit Nomads of the Eurasian
Steppe. The only difference is that the roof poles on this one were
bent at one end so as to come down vertically to the khana (which was
around six feet already), adding another 18 inches or so to the height
of the wall. The roof ring was 57 inches inside diameter and rose to
about 12 feet or so. The whole yurt was still only 15 feet in diameter,
and the top and bottom pieces of the door frame were 7 inches wide,
allowing for the same need to stoop to get in the door (very effective
form of defense). Yes, there are subtle differences between the
various tribes that inhabit the steppe. I met some Tuvans recently,
and showed them a Mongol hat. They pointed out a difference in theirs
to the Mongol one that was very subtle to me, but glaring to them.
The four flaps that go around the hat on the Mongol one are of the
same size, but on the Tuavns hat, the front and back ones are smaller
than the side ones.

>The 5' walls on our gher work well, since the outer areas of the
>floor of the gher are usually taken up by sitting things (storage
>boxes, coolers, et cetera) disguised by throws, aproximately
>according to traditional Mongol interior design, except the king-size
>air matress. There's plenty of standing room.

On the yurt I researched, a pole was place horizontally across the
khana, acting as a closet pole for hanging things from. This is what
I do in my yurt.

>] Of course, not everyone wants to live as a Mongol. ;-)
>
>They just don't know any better. :-) 

We can fix that. ;-)

I recall you saying in another message that you've only been to Pennsic
once. I hope this changes and we get a chance to compare yurt notes.

In service,
Corun
==============================================================================
    Corun MacAnndra    |     Good morning. Good afternoon. Good evening.
  Dark Horde by birth  |  How difficult to tell what time it is when you're
    Moritu by choice   |    locked in a tiny room with flourescent lights.


From: mjc at telerama.lm.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Date: 12 Apr 1995 10:38:49 -0400
Organization: Telerama Public Access Internet, Pittsburgh, PA USA

Todric (from the Dark Horde) gave me a set of yurt plans for the
asking.  Sir Ogami sells a set for $5 that explains what's going on a
little better. [NOTE - Sir Ogami is no longer selling such plans - 
5/12/01 - Stefan]  (The former assume a little more knowledge on the part
of the reader, as I recall.)  I still had to have someone who knows
something about carpentry explain a little of it to me, even working
from Ogami's plans, but I've never really done wood before so I wasn't
surprised.

One thing I found when we built ours last year was that, at least here
in Pittsburgh, wood prices are weird.  The yurt requires something
like 70 8' lathes -- boards an inch and a half (inch and a quarter?)
wide and a quarter inch thick.  These cost a fortune.  It was actually
cheaper to buy 2x4 and a table saw, cut the 2x4s lengthwise (each one
yielded 8-10 lathes depending on how careful we were being), and then
throw the table saw away.  (We didn't actually do this; we used a
friend's radial arm saw.  But it would have been cheaper to buy the
tool for a single use than to buy the lathes.)  Sure, it took extra
time to do this, but we're talking a price difference of a few hundred
dollars.  And besides, drilling the lathes was easier; we just drilled
the 2x4s before cutting them down, guaranteeing that the holes mostly
lined up in the right places.  (We used a drill press to make sure the
drill was vertical at all times.)

There seem to be at least as many ways to build a yurt as there are
yurts; a tour of Horde camp can be enlightening.

Ellisif


From: todric1 at aol.com (TODRIC1)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Date: 20 Apr 1995 00:06:08 -0400
Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364)

My ears have been burning. It would seem that I have finally found my way
here. (Nya-ha-ha!). For whatever use it is, the following: I recommend the
"drill & rip the 2X4s" method. The original specification of lath moulding
was for the prototype (what did I know then?). An excellent example of an
aluminum yurt showedup last year, who knows what's next? Pultruded
fibreglass? Spun carbon-fibre? 
  There are several approaches to constructing the roof-ring, but the
traditional method depends on which tribe's tradition you want to follow,
and how much you are forced to accomodate modern materials and tools. I
really think that steam-bending provides the strongest ring, but
lamination or fabrication from sections works okay if you plan from the
start to make it stronger than you think it needs to be. 
  It is true that to really know yurts, you must build one and spend some
time living in it. They are dynamic, like the rest of the universe. 
  If requested, I will post the name & # of a friend who will custom build
you a yurt suitable for permanent or temporary habitation. 
  P.S. Thanks to all who expressed their condolences on the death of my
Mother. Father is out of hospital and recuperating from the accident.
Wow! Look at the connect time! Gotta go!
                                                     TTFN, Todric


From: sevant at infinet.com (C. Baum)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Date: 23 Apr 1995 20:00:25 GMT
Organization: InfiNet

My lords and ladies all who share an interest in Mongolian Gers Greetings:

I have read with enthusiasm of the growing interest in Mongolian Gers. I 
offer the following information on the topic of Gers from the perspective of 
someone who has built two 18' Gers, and who is a paid member of the 
Mongol-American Cultural Association, Inc., and a member of the Great 
Dark Horde established in 1972 by Svea Wartooth (m.k.a. John Bailey), his 
fencing student Yang the Nauseating (m.k.a. Robert Asprin, author of the 
MYTH series and Phule's series, editor of The Thieves' World Books with 
Lynn Abbey), Mr. Bailey's first wife [Mary] (deceased), and Aleeia of 
the Two Swords (m.k.a. Jacquline Sapulski) another fencing student of Svea's.

Included herein will be the most complete and current contact information 
for a variety of sources of information on Mongolian Gers, culture, 
traditions and arts past and present available to me.  I offer this 
information to promote greater understanding based on independantly 
verifiable facts.  I strongly encourage interested parties to contact any 
of these sources to get the truth for yourself.  Remeber that ignorance 
is the only real enemy of mankind.  Also feel free to email me directly 
with questions and comments.

"Due to special efforts of MACA board of directors member, Caghanbaatar, 
an internet news forum "Soc.culture.mongolian" has come into existence" 
quoted from Issue 3, August 1994 of the MONGOL TOLBO, national newsletter 
of MACA, Inc.  General Mongolian discussion group.

First a point of clarification.  According to Sanj Altan, current President 
of MACA, Inc., 50 Louis St., New Brunswick, NJ 08901, and a Mongolian 
native who emegrated to the US at the age of 5 during the Second World 
War when Mongolia was invaded and subjugated by the then Communist USSR, 
"yurt" is the Russian word for the Mongolia nomads home called Ger by the 
Mongol natives.  

Mr. Altan has further explained to me that native Mongolians, 
and the Mongolian-American emegrees, find the word "yurt" to be offensive 
to them as it reminds them of the decades of oppression under the 
Communist invaders.  As a courtesy to the real Mongolian peoples, I will 
refer to their wonderful portable architechture by their term "Ger" 
throughout this posting.  I would further like to encourage the use of 
the name "Ger" to be used by everyone following this discussion as a 
token of courtesy and respect for these fine people.

Furthermore, I am happy to report that Sanj has remarked to me on more 
than one occasion his delight to learn that there is a growing interest 
among Americans in the history, culture, traditions and arts of his 
beloved native lands.  He welcomes anyone interested in Mongolian culture 
past and present to become paid members of MACA, Inc.  

Regular membership in MACA is $50 annually which includes a subscription 
to the national "Mongol Tolbo" newsletter.  The annual subscription
rate for the "Mongol Tolbo" newsletter is also available seperately 
for $20 annually.  Full time students and retirees are elegable for a 
membership for $20 annually.  

For a membership application or subscription order form please contact 
MACA, Inc. at the address listed previously.  If you like you may even 
mention my name in your letter of inquiry if you address your letter to 
Mr. Altan directly, indicating me as the source of this information.  

On the subject of Ger information:

For Ger enthusiats everywhere I am pleased to announce the "Mongol 
Renaissance" exhibition which will be touring the US for 12 months, 
opening in July 1995 at the Asian Art Museum in San Francisco, and 
continuing for display at the Denver Art Museum and the National 
Georgraphic's Explorer's Hall in Washington, DC.  Current plans call for 
a multimedia installation to be part of the exhibition along with a ger 
being built for the show by the Ministry of Culture in Ulan Bator.  A CD 
ROM of the multimedia piece may also be produced for sale with the 
exhibition catalog.  Design and production for this work is currently 
being donated by Dynamic Diagrams, for the Asian Art Museum of San 
Francisco, the organizers of the show.

Mr. Paul Kahn, author of the excellent book "The Secret History of the 
Mongols", an adaptation based on Francis Cleaves' translation, is the 
project developer for the "Multimedia Ger Project" being featured in the 
above mentioned "Mongol Renaissance" exhibition.  Mr. Kahn's project 
consists of four parts: 

Part One: History
Part Two: Felt
Part Three: Making a Ger
Part Four: Living in a Ger

Mr. Kahn may be reached for further information as follows:

Paul Kahn
Dynamic Diagrams
12 Bassett St.
Providence RI  02903
Ph: 401.331.2014
Email: Paul_Kahn at brown.edu

My first interest in Gers came from living in the first Ger built by 
Eadred Aelthylstan of the Great Dark Horde, at Pennsic in 1990.  In turn 
Eadred and I wish to give full credit to Todric Koenig, originally of the 
Great Dark Horde and one of the founders of the Moritu (along with Rowan 
Starbear, Bjorn and Cip/Baron Thomas Damien Blackmoor, established in 
September, 1985, at the special khuralitai held at the University of 
Wisconsin, in Madison, WI) for being responsible for inspiring Eadred 
to build a ger of his own.  

Eadred caught "ger fever" after Todric was gracious enough to invite 
Eadred to be a guest in Todric's ger in Moritu camp at Pennsic.  During that 
first and many subsequent visits by Eadred to Todric's ger at the war, he 
discussed the various technical challenges and options available to a 
new ger builder.  Todric's encouragement of Eadred's first effort and his
boundless enthusiasm for the elegant architechture of gers in general were  
invaulable.  While elegant in their simplicity, building a ger is a 
little tricky, especially at first.  Tonos or roof rings are an art all 
by themselves, as you may well discover when you build your first ger.

In traditional Mongolian ger design there are several historically 
documentable conventions that have progressed unchaged to this very day.  
Palgi and Toch Toch Gyamcho (PH: 908-297-1140, leave a message) brought 
their hand-crafted geniune Mongolian ger with them from Mongolia.  The 
brothers Gyamcho erect their ger, complete with all hand-crafted 
Mongolian furnishings of traditional design, in traditional color 
combinations, arranged in the traditional order of alignment, each year 
at the annual Chinggis Qan(their spelling) Ceremony, hosted each fall by 
MACA, Inc.

All aspects of the choices of and use of color, both inside and out, are 
very important to the Mongols.  Both the brothers Gyamcho and Sanj have 
told me that the only "proper" color for a ger covering is white.  Designs 
painted on the white outer covering of a ger are also significant to 
them.  Oiyn or roof poles, the tono, and if used, the tono supports are 
traditionally painted a bright scarlet red accented with black, silver, 
gold and blue or green.  To native Mongols their ger is more than merely 
their home.  It is their place of worship and therefore, to them, these 
color conventions have religious as well as cultural significance.

There are also traditional conventions in the materials used to construct 
and fasten the hana (wall sections) in gers.  Wood strips, fastened at 
each cross-point with oiled leather thong, is the only acceptable 
material used by the Mongols in constructing the hana, from their earliest 
recorded history to the present.  

In discussions I have participated in with Mongols knowledgeable in ger 
building whom I have met through MACA, the topic of alternative materials 
in ger construction has been discussed at length.  And I might add, with 
great passion on the part of the Mongols.  Bottom line in these 
discussions is that gers are made of wood and leather, cloth and felt.  

The habit of "round-eyes" to substitute metal or synthethic materials as 
fastenings for the hana, or using metal or synthetic materials in other 
parts of "true ger" construction is simply unacceptable to some of them.  
One very old native ger builder I met at the Chinggis Qan Ceremony held 
at Cook College in New Brunswick, NJ, in 1992, tried to explain things to 
me this way.  The venerable gentleman told me that Americans, like their 
culture are very young.  He went on to explain that being so young, 
Americans were filled with the enthusiasm and folly of youth. He told me 
that it had been his experience that when Americans were introduced to 
gers their first reaction was to try and "improve" a design that had 
already been "proved" over 800 years of continuous refinement through 
actual use by hundreds of generations of Mongols.  To this gentleman some 
of the sillest "improvements" Americans applied to gers included making 
the outermost coverings in outlandish colors and using "unnatural" or 
"lifeless" materials in their construction.

To them it seems that a ger is more than merely a physical object.  
I do not have the words to convey the reverance with which they describe 
their gers.  The joy and pride that shines forth like fire in their eyes 
when they try to explain to a well-meaning but admittedly ignorant (in 
the literal dictionary definition of that word) round-eye like myself, 
of the "life" of their gers is something which can only be experienced, 
not explained.  But for the true native Mongols who have spoken with me 
at length on this aspect of the nature of their gers this "life" is both 
real, and for them, intuitively understood.  Even the number of slats in 
the hana is based on sacred numerology.  Thirteen or eleven slats, as 
counted from top to bottom are the "natural" numbers of slats in proper 
hana.   

These discussions have inspired me to continue to change my ger designs 
to more closely incorporate as many of these traditions in each new 
generation of ger I design and build.  If I make enough of them, I may 
even get it "right" someday.  Who knows, stranger things have happened.

Fortunately the SCA is not renowned for authenticity in recreating period 
items.  After all Creativity is the SCA's middle name.  This liberty of 
perspective leaves a great deal of room for individual interpretation in 
constructing all sorts of things.  Including gers.  In my travels I have 
seen and visited gers ranging in colors like green with black tops, to 
red, to blue, to orange, even one that is white on the bottom and pink on 
top that always makes me think of a strawberry sundae. The one 
consistancy I have found among all the gers I have visited is a universal 
love for gers by all who have gone to the effort to build one of their 
very own.

There is a great deal of flexibility in several aspects of ger building. 
Especially in choice of materials.  As the Mongolian ger design was 
originated and perfected to work in what is a basically dry ecosystem 
encompasing vast temperature differences, variable insulation concerns 
were more important than waterproofing.  In the US, on the other hand, 
weather conditions like rain (especially at Pennsic >;-}) become a factor 
in ger design.  Therefore, consideration of waterproofing the ger 
covering is important.  

The exact degree of slope for the roof also varies.  I try to get mine to
approximately 22 degrees of slope.  But I have seen shallower and steeper 
pitches.  If it stays up when you put it up that is sure a good sign.

I have seen hana that form true squares when stretched in place and 
others that form diamonds.  It is truly a "forgiving" design within 
reason.

One place to start for basic designs and construction methods is in the 
book written by Mr. Charney, whose title I believe is "How to Build a 
Yurt".  I am sure of the author, but my copy is on loan and I admit I 
don't remember the exact title.  But that is close.  So go to your local 
library, contact some of the sources listed herein, and visit gers 
whenever and whereever you get the chance.  I have not yet met a ger 
builder who didn't like to show off his efforts and discuss in some 
detail the little tricks and triumphs of his own adventure in "home-making".

I can only hope that the effort I have presented here will encourage you 
to take the plunge.  Fair warning, once you have had the pleasure of 
looking at beautiful moonlit and star-filled sky through the "heaven's 
gate" of your own ger, you many never go back to tents again.

Offered in service to the society and to my household, I remain

Sevant


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: bd906 at freenet.buffalo.edu (S. David Lee)
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Organization: Buffalo Free-Net
Date: Wed, 3 May 1995 05:00:00 GMT

Yurts are not difficult to build.  I made mine, all by
myself, in a weekend, and I didn't have a clue.  You can order
the canvas pre-made to the correct dimensions, which means that
you *don't* need an industrial sewing machinfe.  All that you need
is a couple of drills and a saber saw.  You can do it for less
than a grand.  Why pay someone else?	
---Ogami


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: bd906 at freenet.buffalo.edu (S. David Lee)
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Organization: Buffalo Free-Net
Date: Thu, 4 May 1995 05:57:27 GMT

        My yurt is 16' in diameter, which gives you 201 square
feet of floor space.  It is 5'8" at the wall, and the center ring
is 8' high with no support pole.  It takes about 30 minutes to
put up (with two people), and I have transported mine in a
Renault Encore by putting a heavy-duty roof-rack on top.  The
rest of my gear, including armor, camping supplies, food, etc.,
went inside the car.
        The yurt breaks down into these sections:
        two wall sections (khana), 30"X 8' X one inch
        one door frame, 5'8" X 30"
        33 roof poles, 1" X 3" X 8'
        one center ring, 30" X 4"
        top canvas, 21' X 21'
        side canvas, 6' X 50'
        smoke hole cover, 36" X 36"
        door curtain, 6' X 4 '
        floor tarp
 
        As time passes, you add stuff and modify stuff until
it's less like camping, and more like moving to a really
cool apartment for a while.

The cost is $5.00

                        ---Ogami


From: fnklshtn at ACFcluster.nyu.edu
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Date: 9 May 1995 23:40:40 GMT
Organization: New York University, New York, NY

I don't know about Turks as in the same people who have the country called
Turkey, but...
There are many nationalities who may loosely be called Turks (kinda the way you
can lump the western eurhou
Where was I?
My terminal died in mid sentence.
Anyhow, there are many nationaliies that may be collectively called Turks 
(kinda the way youcan call the britts, germans, and french - Franks)
Most, if not all, of them were horse riding, sheep herding, nomads - living in
Yurts (chances are the reason the Russians use this word is because it is from
these people).
Some historical ones are Kuzar, Pecheneg, Guz, Turek.
The Turek are the folks that traded between Rome and China. They are actually
often  called Turk but I have followed Artamanov in modifying the name to
differentiate.
The Kuzar are the folks who settled down, had an empire and became Jewish.
They are reported to have lived in houses for the winter and then go out to the
pastures in the spring. The remains of their houses make it likely that the
design was originally based on a Yurt.
The Guz became Muslims and changed their names to Turkmen.
There is a Turkmen republic in what used to be the soviet union (I'm guessing
it is now an independant nation). 
One bit of reading about them is "The Tales of DEde Korkut". It is their
national hero stories.

If you get info on those Turk Yurts please tell me.
I wanna build one too and have absolutely no time for research
(finishing law school, looking for job, studying for bar)

Peace!
Nahum
(btw: anyone wanna work a trade? I make armor. You'll have to wait a bit though
- see litany of real world crap)


From: corun at access3.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURTS!!!!!
Date: 8 May 1995 07:51:32 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <3ojs5v$cb4 at newsbf02.news.aol.com>, LDulin <ldulin at aol.com> wrote:
>Ok, we've heard about Mongolian gers, but what about the ones the Turks
>used? How are they different? Has anyone researched them?
>Thanks
>Lijsbeth

Yurts (or gers, depending on the language), were of a fairly similar design
throughout most of the nomadic peoples. Variations that occured were in
the density of the khana wall, ie. the number of slats or poles used to make
up the khana, and in the number and shape of the roof poles. The two most
commone forms were straight poles and poles that were bent at the end that
attached to the khana. In the latter, the poles were of necessity, much
longer. The pole was planed flat at that end for about 24" or so, and then
bent, so that the flat end was then lashed to the khana where two pole
came together to form a "v". This added about 18" or so to the overall
height at the khana, so that a tall person could stand easily at the wall.
This also gave the roof a dome shape, and the felt used to cover the roof
was made like a large cap, sometime with "belt loops" attached to allow
a wide strap of woven yarn to be pulled through in order to hold it down
better. Of course, other straps were thrown over the structure as well
so that one didn't rely on only one strap to hold things together.

This sort of yurt is very tall inside, nearly 15' high at the roof ring.
The ring itself was also very wide, nearly 56" in diameter. Needless to
say, this type of yurt would require more than one person to erect.

For the average SCA camper, I'd recommend the simpler construction of
straight roof poles. Most of the yurts in our camp use 1x2s, but I
use 7' by 1 1/2" closet poles. Having 32 of them, I break them into 
three bundles that are more easily carried by me, and stow more easily.
My roof ring is 36" in diameter, and very sturdy. It's made of individual
blocks, one for each roof pole, but one day I'd like to experiment with
bending wood, as this is more traditional. The yurt I researched had
a 56" diameter ring made of three pieces of tree trunk about 3" around,
lap jointed and banded with metal straps at the joins. All of the poles
used for the khana and the roof were 1" diameter arctic willow saplings.
Those used in the khana were not longer than 8' and those for the roof
were about 10' or so. The roof poles were also planed square on the end
that entered the roof ring, and square holes were cut in the ring. This
prevented twisting of the poles. My poles are round and tapered on the
end that enters the roof ring, and I have put a dowel into the pole about
3" from the end to stop it from sliding through the roof ring. With the
entire structure up, I can do chinups from the roof ring, and I weigh in
at about 85 kilos.

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   | This is a little souvenir I picked up on Mangus III.
 Dark Horde by birth | That was setting one. Anyone want to see setting two?
   Moritu by choice  |                                         Guinan


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurt Construction
Date: 15 Jun 1995 06:25:26 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

David Fitzgerald wrote:
>yurts info in Smithsonian magazine.
>There is an article a couple of years ago in the Smithsonian Magazine , 
>detailing their construction . Contact them for issue or copy of article . 
>usually only a couple of bucks.          
>Sir fitz    Aten Dwarve

Are you sure you don't mean National Geographic? I've been getting Smithsonian
for nigh on ten years or more, and I would have remembered an article on
yurt construction. ;-) If you do mean Nat'l Geo, then the article you may
be referring to was in a late '60s issue. I have a copy of this at home, but
can't recall the exact date of publication. There is a page with six photos
showing a yurt being put up. The photos are small, but they form the basis
of the first research done by Todric of the Dark Horde Moritu, who built
the first yurt ever put up by the Horde (possibly the first yurt in the
SCA).

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   |		
 Dark Horde by birth |	 		
   Moritu by choice  | 						


Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
From: Rick Gaigneur <rgaigneu at unb.ca>
Subject: Re: Yurt Construction
Organization: University of New Brunswick
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 1995 12:08:30 GMT

For those of you interested in Yurt Construction, a fairly detailed set 
of instructions were printed recently in SACRED SPACES, the publication 
of the Known World Architect's Guild.  You can get a hold of a copy by 
contacting Count Sir Arloff (Matthew Power); I don't have the address 
handy, but I'll post it when I do.  I believe he occassionally runs ads 
for it in TI, as well.

>Aetheric<


From: ae766 at yfn.ysu.edu (David Sanders)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: tents blowing away was: (those darn )viking tents
Date: 18 Jul 1995 11:53:50 GMT
Organization: St. Elizabeth Hospital, Youngstown, OH

In a previous article, lmarucci at mailer.fsu.edu (Coney Patterson) says:

>What about Yurts for sturdiness against high winds and bad weather? :>

Read an article a few years ago describing the use of yurts along a trail
here in North America.  They had been found to be so resistance to winter
winds and snow that they had been placed along the trails instead of the
usual lean-tos or cabins for overnight hikers.

And over this past weekend I was at a festival with overnight campers and
merchants in pavilions and tents.  After up to 60 mph winds the one yurt
(ger, as the owners insisted on) looked like it hadn't been touched.

Vajk
ae766 at yfn.ysu.edu


From: Francois at mail.farabi.COM (Francois Leclerc)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Looking for Yurt Plans
Date: 20 Nov 1995 12:47:30 -0500
Organization: Farabi Technology Corporation

The Newsletter of the Known World Architectural Guild has an issue 
with complete plans for a Yurt. I forget the exact number but you may 
contact Sir Arlof, Count of Aranmoor, for information on getting htat 
issue.

He may be contacted at tpower at maine.maine.edu.
Francois Leclerc


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: YURT PLANS can be gotten here:
Date: 24 Nov 1995 19:11:03 -0500
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <492758$i8l at ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>,
jim grunst  <dragon21 at ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>Sir Ogami's Yurt plans:
>I picked up a copy at pennsic 22 or so....
>write to him at:
>
>Tom King,  507 Lake St,  Kent, Ohio.  44240....

Just a slight correction. Tom King is not Sir Ogami. He is Todric Koenig,
Kakhan of the Dark Horde Moritu. It is from Todric that Sir Ogami got
his yurt plans, so the address is correct, and Todric will be glad to
to talk to anyone about yurts, as will I or many of the other Moritu
who inhabit the net.

We have had as many as 23 yurts in our camp at Pennsic, and it is all
due to the efforts put forth by Todric. It is for this effort in
research that he was made a Companion of the Order of the Laruel at
Pennsic XXIV by Their Majesties Osis and Valthiona of the Middle, during 
Great Court.

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   | People that are really very weird can get into sensitive
 Dark Horde by birth |    positions and have a tremendous impact on history.
   Moritu by choice  | 				    Vice President Dan Quayle


From: mjc at telerama.lm.com (Monica Cellio)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: 25 Aug 1996 15:29:01 -0400
Organization: Telerama Public Access Internet, Pittsburgh, PA USA

>       As a proud new owner of a yurt, I'd like to ask for clarification. 
>Transport means the bottom 6-10" of our trailer for all the poles, ring &
>khana.  

We use a roof rack, which means we spend as much time tying progressive
layers of diamond hitches as we do actually loading.  Sorry for not 
clarifying; a truck or van would reduce the problem to making sure the
khana doesn't get crushed.

>Setup took 2 people 20 min, and packup takes the same 2 people 10
>minutes.  

Can I come watch next year? :-)

More seriously, let me describe what we do in hopes that you or some other
yurt-users can point out optimizations:

1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces (not 2), so this takes us
a little longer, but spreading out, lining up, and bolting together even
2 sections takes us at least 10 minutes.  Do you transport yours whole?
(I suppose that would work in a van.)

2. Stand khana up in a rough circle -- a couple minutes with 3-4 people,
but the fine-tuning comes later.

3. Assemble and tie in door frame -- a few minutes.

4. Apply tension bands and try to make the whole thing circular.  We always 
seem to spend a lot of time at this -- making sure the walls are of uniform
height, making sure that various diagonals are all approximately the same 
(pacing, not measuring), etc.  If we don't do this we invariably have 
problems in the next step.

5.  Have someone hold up the roof ring and install the first 4-6 rafters,
adjusting walls again as necessary.  This round of fussing seems to take
us a while.

6. Install the rest of the rafters -- maybe 10 minutes.  (We used 24 this
year.)

7. Apply canvas -- maybe another 15 minutes (hanging the walls, dragging th
roof over, centering the flap, hanging the door curtain).

I'd love to be able to get this up in half an hour; what am I doing wrong?

>I'm not sure what maintenance you're speaking of, 

We keep breaking laths.  Individually this isn't a big deal; there's a
lot of redundancy in the design, so you just don't use those ones to support
rafters.  We've now used the yurt for 3 Pennsics and one other event,
and we're getting cracks through some of the holes (particularly the top
ones, which bear the most stress), the occasional broken-off top or bottom
from less-than-perfect handling, and the one or two that we've accidentally
broken while trying to remove a different one for replacement.  This winter
there are 6 or 8 that we *really* ought to replace.

Is there a modern material (I know, I know) of which khana could be made
affordably that would be more durable?  Are we just having more problems
than average because instead of paying 60 cents per linear foot for lath
we bought 2x4s and applied a table saw?  (We did pick out good 2x4s...)

Ellisif
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~mjc/ellisif.html


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: 25 Aug 1996 19:33:44 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <4vq9ht$i5 at asia.lm.com>, Monica Cellio <mjc at telerama.lm.com> wrote:

>1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces (not 2), so this takes us
>a little longer, but spreading out, lining up, and bolting together even
>2 sections takes us at least 10 minutes.  Do you transport yours whole?
>(I suppose that would work in a van.)

My khana is in six section that fold up to pieces 8'x10" I don't bolt the
sections together except at the top. I use rope and tie the rest. This is
a period method for both transport and assembly.

>2. Stand khana up in a rough circle -- a couple minutes with 3-4 people,
>but the fine-tuning comes later.

Fine tuning should come after you have the door frame and all the khana
attached in a rough circle. You then add the girdle cord, a rope that
either weaves in and out of the top cruxes of the khana, or, as I've done
this year, drawn through eyebolts at the top of the khana with two on
the door frame. You use the girdle cord to true up the circle and add
stability before inserting the roof poles.

>3. Assemble and tie in door frame -- a few minutes.

Though my door frame can be dismantled, I've never done so. I put it on
the roof racks assembled except that I remove the doors themselves.

>5.  Have someone hold up the roof ring and install the first 4-6 rafters,
>adjusting walls again as necessary.  This round of fussing seems to take
>us a while.

My roof ring is 36" in diameter. I built a small table the same diameter
and drilled holes into the top and into the four legs of the table. Into
those holes I insert four expanding aluminum tent poles. I have angle
irons on the inside of the roof ring and these have holes in them that
rest onto the tips of the tent poles. I can then raise the roof ring to
the required height and begin inserting roof poles. When all the poles
are in, the tent poles come out and that's it. I then have a nice table
for the yurt.

>7. Apply canvas -- maybe another 15 minutes (hanging the walls, dragging th
>roof over, centering the flap, hanging the door curtain).

Another crucial piece you're missing, which is also period, is the belly
band. I use an 18" wide strip of canvas with grommets at the four corners,
that wraps aroun the entire yurt on the outside, holding down the roof
canvas and acting as an additional stbilizer for the whole yurt. I have
ropes in the for grommets and tie these to the door frame. The band would
normally have been of woven, multicoloured heavy yarn, as would all of the
ties used to hold the yurt together.

>I'd love to be able to get this up in half an hour; what am I doing wrong?

Sounds more like a need of proper pieces and sequence. I've designed my
yurt to be set up by one person, and have in fact set it up by myself
unassisted. It took me two hours from car to livable, and the yurt is 15'
in diameter and 10' high when finished. The roof canvas is 22' in diameter
and is a single round piece. It is the largest and heaviest piece of canvas
in the whole thing.

>We keep breaking laths.  Individually this isn't a big deal; there's a
>lot of redundancy in the design, so you just don't use those ones to support
>rafters.  We've now used the yurt for 3 Pennsics and one other event,
>and we're getting cracks through some of the holes (particularly the top
>ones, which bear the most stress), the occasional broken-off top or bottom
>from less-than-perfect handling, and the one or two that we've accidentally
>broken while trying to remove a different one for replacement.  This winter
>there are 6 or 8 that we *really* ought to replace.

I use outdoor lathe moulding. It's heavier than indoor and is pressure
treated so it never rot. The individual pieces of lathe are approximately
1.5" x 3/8". You can get these at any lumberyard. They're a bit more
expensive than indoor, but they are more substantial. 

>Is there a modern material (I know, I know) of which khana could be made
>affordably that would be more durable?  Are we just having more problems
>than average because instead of paying 60 cents per linear foot for lath
>we bought 2x4s and applied a table saw?  (We did pick out good 2x4s...)

Depends on how thin you sawed the pieces. As I mentioned above, the outdoor
lathe I have is upwards of 3/8" thick. Thin stuff tends to bend more
easily. We had one yurt in camp this year that had khana by Dali. It was
made of very thin indoor lathe and was bending like crazy. Nearly came
down. I've never had a breakage problem with my khana and it's now seven years
old, as is the roof ring. I'll be rebuilding my roof ring this year based
on a variation of my original design that Todric did this year. I'll also
be going from closet pole roof poles (much closer to period and actual
current designs in Mongolia than 1x4s) to 2x2s rounded and tapered for a 
third of the length with a draw knife. This is actually a period design for 
roof poles, and the fact that two thirds of it's length the pole will be 
square, it should be a bit easier to store, stack and pack.

If you have any more questions, or would like to discuss my designs, please
feel free to email me. My yurt design came from a yurt that was brought
to the Smithsonian by the Academy of Sciences in (then) Leningrad. The
Russian scientists let me climb around in it and take extensive measurements
and photos after the exhibit at the Smithsonian closed. I've made a few
modifications that accomdate my available tools and skills, but all in all,
what I have is very close to a period design, and I'll be making many more
adjustments, primarily to the interior decoration, in the coming years.

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   |  You just gotta learn to dance while life is throwing
 Dark Horde by birth |  chainsaws and chickens at you...after the first few 
   Moritu by choice  |  cuts and pecks, it's easy.   ---   jms


From: parkerd at mcmail.cis.McMaster.CA (Diana Parker)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents) (long - sorry)
Date: 27 Aug 1996 03:29:50 -0400
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada.

In article <4vq9ht$i5 at asia.lm.com>, Monica Cellio <mjc at telerama.lm.com> wrote:
>>Setup took 2 people 20 min, and packup takes the same 2 people 10
>>minutes.  
>
>Can I come watch next year? :-)

I have this years set-up on video-tape :), we were more blase by the end 
of Pennsic, so no tape of taking it down.

>More seriously, let me describe what we do in hopes that you or some other
>yurt-users can point out optimizations:
>
>1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces (not 2), so this takes us
>a little longer, but spreading out, lining up, and bolting together even
>2 sections takes us at least 10 minutes.  Do you transport yours whole?
>(I suppose that would work in a van.)

        Ours is all in one piece.  16foot diameter yurt, wall is 5' high
when stretched out - the "baby gate" compresses to a 86" long x 4' wide by
1.5" deep shape that is a pain to carry (it sags because of the
flexibility), but lays flat. 
        We cut the slats from oak.  5/8"x7/8".  Way, Way, Way too much
ripping of 1x6 oak boards (this was a group project, we made 4 yurts all
told), but we have no worries about cracking or replacing the lathes.  The
lathes are screwed together 1" from the top, then at 11" intervals.  The
outer slat was drilled all the way through slightly over-sized, the inner
slat was blind drilled slightly undersized.  We used machine screws
instead of wood screws because they have a slightly greater thread tooth. 
Each screw went through a washer then the outer slat & was screwed into
the inner slat (where they don't show on the inside.) It's not willow tied
with cord, but it's hardwood not softwood and no nuts or bolts showing at
the intersections. 

                  \       \       /       /
                    \       \   /       /
                      \       \       /
                        \       \   /
                          \       \
                         /  \       \
                       /      \       \
                     /      /   \       \       


>2. Stand khana up in a rough circle -- a couple minutes with 3-4 people,
>but the fine-tuning comes later.

        After the khana is carried over to the setup area, one person
starts hauling the end out while the other continues unloading.  By the
time the khana is half streched out, both are needed to pull it to a rough
circle. 

>3. Assemble and tie in door frame -- a few minutes.

        Our doorframe is a sandwich of wood held together with carriage
bolts.  The ends of the khana slip into the side of the frame sandwich with
a carriage bolt slipped through each of the 3 V's on each side.  These 
are not tightened just yet.

>4. Apply tension bands and try to make the whole thing circular.  We always 
>seem to spend a lot of time at this -- making sure the walls are of uniform
>height, making sure that various diagonals are all approximately the same 
>(pacing, not measuring), etc.  If we don't do this we invariably have 
>problems in the next step.

        We pound in a five foot piece of rebar.  One person stands in the 
middle holding the tape measure.  The other one walks about making sure 
the khana is eight feet away all the way around.  The step is getting 
quicker & quicker.  It took three of us about 20 minutes for this alone 
the first time.  Now, 2 people take about 2-3 minutes.  When the khana is 
in place, the carriage bolts on the door are tightened (with the 
speedwrench in the "Yurt-kit".)
        Our tension band attaches to eyebolts on either side of the 
door.  The top of each slat is notched so the cable won't easily slip out 
of place.  We used aircraft cable (with a turnbuckle at either end) but 
have not found we've needed to adjust the turnbuckles.  The small amount 
of slack has easily been divided up by the roof poles.  The cable goes up 
as quickly as it takes one person to walk around the outside.  Usually 
while the other person is tightening the doorframe.

>5.  Have someone hold up the roof ring and install the first 4-6 rafters,
>adjusting walls again as necessary.  This round of fussing seems to take
>us a while.

        We're still working on the best way for this.  So far we've 
tried  1) person 1 sitting on a ladder holding the ring up while person 2 
(& any volunteers) hurredly stick in roof poles.
        2) sticking 2 roof poles in about 60 degrees apart & then 
delicately balancing the ring while the third is lifted in at the opposite 
side, and
        3) 3 people each lifting their quadrant into the air with the 
three initial roof poles.
        #1 only works when you've got a ladder & requires a person with 
strong arms & a lot of patience.  #3 requires 3 co-ordinated people.  #2 
seems to work best for us.

>6. Install the rest of the rafters -- maybe 10 minutes.  (We used 24 this
>year.)

        We use 48 - 7' roof poles (2 into the door frame, the rest hook
onto the cable.  The Mark I roof ring took 24.  It wasn't as sturdy as
we'd like, so we doubled the number.  Our chief builder can do chinups
from our roof ring without shifting it.  Perhaps overkill - perhaps not.
        Our roof poles are pine 2x2's, notched at one end (to slip over 
the cable) and with a 6" rod sunk 3" into the other.  The angle is 30 
degrees (giving us a 30 degree slope to the roof) and the spikes slip 
right into their respective holes in the ring.  The two roof poles that 
slip into the door frame have a spike on each end.

        ----------------------------------------------
        |_                                          /
          |                                 =============
         =                                      /
        |_____________________________________/

>7. Apply canvas -- maybe another 15 minutes (hanging the walls, dragging th
>roof over, centering the flap, hanging the door curtain).

        Person one walks the wall canvas around the outside, person 2 now 
takes the wood for the bed inside & starts bolting it together.  (doesn't 
fit through the door already assembled.)  The wall canvas hangs from the 
cable by the "yurt-ties" I made.  A loop of cord with a large bead at one 
end.  These slip through the grommets on the canvas (at 12" intervals) & 
then slip over the cable & the loop goes over the bead.  I thought about 
sewing ties to the walls, but figured the loops would be quicker.  The 
beads look neat from inside.
        Roof canvas is a 20'x20' square, folded into the middle.  Two
people again, starting on the front, on either side of door.  Throw the
middle up onto the roof poles over the door.  Then each take a leading
corner & walk around to the back.  The canvas drags along behind.  The
smoke hole flap is sewn to the roof already, with ropes from its two free
corners so it can be manipulated from the ground.  Our ring has a 3' 
inner diameter & a 4' outer diameter so there is about 6" of play as we 
tug at the corners of the roof to roughly centre it.
        A 1+1/2" diameter rope is tied around the outside to hold the 
roof on (& for its good looks :)  At this point, the door flap is still 
just that, a canvas flap.  There's talk of doors for the four of them for 
next year.

>I'd love to be able to get this up in half an hour; what am I doing wrong?

        Setting up our wall is dead-fast, but we're measuring not pacing,
& then we don't need to readjust.  Slipping in the roof poles is almost as
quick once the first 3 to 5 are in.  Not sure what you mean about your
khana being in more than one piece, do you have to tie it together? 

>>I'm not sure what maintenance you're speaking of, 
>
>We keep breaking laths.  Individually this isn't a big deal; there's a
  <crunch>
>Is there a modern material (I know, I know) of which khana could be made

        This may be the benefit of the oak we used...  or just may be that
we've only put it up a couple of times this year (usually try-outs at the
farm, once for Pennsic.) Each slat did get the "twist test."  One guy on
each end, twisting in opposite directions until it wouldn't twist anymore. 
If it cracked or broke, it failed.  About 1 in 30 or 40 failed, but we got
the oak cheap because it had sat around a farmers field for a year so.  I
was seriously impressed to see them twisting the slats almost 90 degrees
without breaking.

cheers
Tabitha  (okay, that's setup - arranging furniture can take me hours if 
          not days...)
-- 
 Diana Parker           parkerd at mcmaster.ca     (905) 525-9140 (x24282)
 CUC - 201               Security Services       McMaster University
  Notice --- Due to ongoing cutbacks, the light at the end of the tunnel


From: "Pat Hartley" <deerglen at e-z.net>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents) (long - sorry)
Date: 28 Aug 1996 16:47:36 GMT
Organization: Threshold

couldn't resist adding my two ponies worth:

> >1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces
*snip* 
>       Ours is all in one piece.  16foot diameter yurt, wall is 5' high
> when stretched out - the "baby gate" compresses to a 86" long x 4' wide by
> 1.5" deep shape that is a pain to carry (it sags because of the
> flexibility), but lays flat. 

Ours is all in once piece as well, about the same dimensions.  We find that
you can roll the khana into burrito shape (okay, a big mucking burrito!) by
gently bringing one end in toward the center, then wrapping the other end
around the curl you just made.  We tie it with rope to transport it, and
find that it will allow us to attach it to the top of our vehicle, at which
point we slide all of the rafters into the center, giving us an easy way to
carry them. (you do, of course, have to put a double layer of tarp or cloth
or something over the end of the rafter pieces to fasten them down and keep
them from sliding off of your car and impaling the car in front of you when
you come to a quick stop.)  In this way, you can put the majority of the
yurt on about half of a roof rack on an average sized car.

        We cut the slats from oak.  5/8"x7/8".  
*snip*
ah! We cut ours of pine, actually cutting them with a saw out of 2x4s.  I
don't know if perhaps the oak isn't flexible enough to make the burrito
thing above, but it's worth a try.

> >2. Stand khana up in a rough circle -- a couple minutes with 3-4 people,
> >but the fine-tuning comes later.

Have you tried using a stake in the middle of the area, with a cord the
length of the distance between the center and your khana walls?  We use
this technique, so there is very little fine tuning, and we can pretty much
assure where the center of the yurt will be. The first few times we tried
to set it up without this, and as we adjusted the circumference of the
walls, we ended up moving the yurt right out of our camping space and into
the next folks'!

> >4. Apply tension bands and try to make the whole thing circular.  We always 
> >seem to spend a lot of time at this -- making sure the walls are of uniform
> >height, making sure that various diagonals are all approximately the same 
> >(pacing, not measuring), etc.  

I also walk around the outside, checking the height of the walls (against
my chin, I just happen to be a convenient height :)  ) This gives us a good
indicator if the walls are spread out to approximately the same dimension.
  
> >5.  Have someone hold up the roof ring and install the first 4-6 rafters,
> >adjusting walls again as necessary.  This round of fussing seems to take
> >us a while.

You might try, next time you get the yurt set up, taking a long piece of
rope and running it loosely around the bottom of your khana. Tie a knot to
represent the circumference, so you've now got a loop the same dimension as
your khana should be next time you set it up.  Now, stick a stake in the
center of the yurt, with a piece of twine or cord as long as from the
center to the walls tied to it.  Next time you set up the yurt, stick the
stake where you want the center of the yurt to be.  lay the loop of rope
out in a circle around it, using the rope as a guide to make it a good
round circle. Voila! Now just pull your khana out to how long it needs to
be (you can cut a cord to measure this too, to keep from doing the "is it
long enough, no that's too long" thing.  Set the khana up along the cord on
the ground, and... you should cut alot of the adjustment time off of your
walls.  Plus, you won't have to do the adjustment while one person is
holding up the roof ring! 

*snipped "how to put the roofring and rafters" options*

We are lucky, in that my Lord is 6'7" tall. He has been named the
designated "Atlas" and holds up the roof ring while I scamper around
putting the first three poles in... We chose good heavy rafters, and put
them in about 120 degrees away from each other. These first three will hold
the weight of our ring, although it will look lopsided and wobbly until you
get the other poles in.  We then bisect the remaining spaces, putting a
pole in in the middle between the ones that are up until we've got half of
them in, then just filling in the spaces. We use 48 poles, btw. 7 foot long
pine, about 1 3/4 x 1, with the skinny part going across, when you've got
them in, and the wider part  being vertical? (Gods, I hate trying to
describe something visual with text!)

> >6. Install the rest of the rafters -- maybe 10 minutes.  (We used 24 this
> >year.)
> >I'd love to be able to get this up in half an hour; what am I doing wrong?

Can you transport your door all laced together, and just tighten the laces
when you get on site? We had been taking ours apart for most of the time
we'd used it, but found that when we didn't, it cut some good time off of
our setup. Also, don't be shy about asking for help during the "putting the
rafters in" stage, and assuring folks you don't need help for the "setting
up the wall" stage. We found that our speed decreased in direct proportion
to the number of extra folks we had helping in setting up the walls, and
increased thusly with the number of folks to stick rafters in... :)

> >We keep breaking laths.  

> >Is there a modern material (I know, I know) of which khana could be made

>       This may be the benefit of the oak we used...  or just may be that
> we've only put it up a couple of times this year (usually try-outs at the
> farm, once for Pennsic.) Each slat did get the "twist test."  One guy on
> each end, twisting in opposite directions until it wouldn't twist anymore. 
> If it cracked or broke, it failed.  About 1 in 30 or 40 failed, but we got
> the oak cheap because it had sat around a farmers field for a year so.  I
> was seriously impressed to see them twisting the slats almost 90 degrees
> without breaking.

We've been very lucky, and have not broken a single lathe or rafter
(although the steel pegs have came out of several, and had to be reglued
back in) in the 3 years that we've used the yurt. Again, could this be
something in the nature of the pine vs oak? I don't know, maybe a more
wood-oriented person could say...

> Tabitha  (okay, that's setup - arranging furniture can take me hours if 
>         not days...)
Yes, yes, yes... And I'm looking for more info on what kinds of
furniture/decorations, etc would be appropriate!  I've seen several yurts
done with decorative cloth attached on the inside of the dwelling, hung on
the khana so that the wood itself didn't show. Has anyone any documentation
for this? For any particular kinds of furnishings?

I'm particularly interested in the doll/idol type things described in "The
Secret History of  the Mongols". They mentioned a "Master's brother"
"Mistress's Brother" dolls/idols, as well as another general household one.
 Anyone have any idea what they might have been made out of? How big?
Anything?

Lady Khada'an Nachin
Castellan of Rogue's Haven


From: parkerd at mcmail.cis.McMaster.CA (Diana Parker)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents) (long - sorry)
Date: 28 Aug 1996 22:03:28 -0400
Organization: McMaster University, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada.

Pat Hartley <deerglen at e-z.net> wrote:
>> >1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces
>>      Ours is all in one piece.  16foot diameter yurt, wall is 5' high
>> when stretched out - the "baby gate" compresses to a 86" long x 4' wide
>>by 1.5" deep shape that is a pain to carry (it sags because of the
>>flexibility), but lays flat. 

>Ours is all in once piece as well, about the same dimensions.  We find that
>you can roll the khana into burrito shape (okay, a big mucking burrito!) by
>gently bringing one end in toward the center, then wrapping the other end

We use the "burrito" to carry the khana about, but flat works best for us
because of the trailer.  The flat shape just nicely covers the floor of
the trailer with no awkward curves to fit other flat objects against.  We
on't have a roof rack.  One of our companions puts their yurt in their
mini-van using the "burrito" fold. (I really like that analogy.)

cheers
Tabitha
-- 
 Diana Parker           parkerd at mcmaster.ca     (905) 525-9140 (x24282)
 CUC - 201               Security Services       McMaster University


From: todric at salamander.net
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents) (long - sorry)
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 07:35:35 -0700

Diana Parker wrote:
> Pat Hartley <deerglen at e-z.net> wrote:
> >> >1. Assemble khana.  Ours breaks into 3 pieces
> >>      Ours is all in one piece.  16foot diameter yurt, wall is 5' high
> >> when stretched out - the "baby gate" compresses to a 86" long x 4' wide
> >>by 1.5" deep shape that is a pain to carry (it sags because of the
> >>flexibility), but lays flat.
> 
> >Ours is all in once piece as well, about the same dimensions.  We find that
> >you can roll the khana into burrito shape (okay, a big mucking burrito!) by
> >gently bringing one end in toward the center, then wrapping the other end
> 
> We use the "burrito" to carry the khana about, but flat works best for us
> because of the trailer.  The flat shape just nicely covers the floor of
> the trailer with no awkward curves to fit other flat objects against.  We
> on't have a roof rack.  One of our companions puts their yurt in their
> mini-van using the "burrito" fold. (I really like that analogy.)
> 
> cheers
> Tabitha

        Just my $.02; If you were building your first yurt, or for some 
reason (severe burrito damage?) rebuilding your walls, I recommend making 
it in several smaller sections; After Corun's research on one at the 
Smithsonian (and his work on his own excellent ger) I became convinced. 
Our new ger is 16 feet diameter and uses 4 khana (wall sections).
This makes for easier transport, and the sections simply overlap and are 
tied together during setup. It's just as strong as a single-section wall, 
and easier to manipulate during setup.
        It passed the "2 weeks at Pennsic" test with flying colors!

        Todric, OL, OP


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: More on Period Tents
Date: 25 Aug 1996 19:07:24 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <4vq9cp$ts at mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>,
Paul & Melissa Ondercin <Ondercin.moochie at worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>       I've been following the thread on Period accomodations, and while I've
>heard yurts being discussed, I haven't seen any information on where
>you can find information on them.  
>
>       Where can you look for information on yurts?

You can get hold of my yurt plans at:

         ftp.access.digex.net/ftp/corun/public_html/yurt.zip

Beyond that you should check out the local library for an article in the March
1962 issue of National Geographic.

In service,
Corun


From: Ekaterina and Temur <Ekaterina at gnn.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: Mon, 02 Sep 1996 14:04:17
Organization: TKS Network Services, Inc.

In article <4vqnso$2l3 at access4.digex.net> Corun MacAnndra wrote:

>Another crucial piece you're missing, which is also period, is the 
>belly band. I use an 18" wide strip of canvas with grommets at the 
>four corners, that wraps aroun the entire yurt on the outside, 
>holding down the roof canvas and acting as an additional stbilizer 
>for the whole yurt. I have ropes in the for grommets and tie these 
>to the door frame. The band would normally have been of woven, 
>multicoloured heavy yarn, as would all of the ties used to hold 
>the yurt together.

Corun,

I saw two examples of Yurts that had one other helpful item that 
the people at the Kazakistan (sp) Embassy say is period.  The roof 
has belt loops sewed around the edge.  This keeps the roof edge 
from slipping out in wet windy weather.

Hope this is good news.

Temur
KaKhan of Clan White Wing
Coming soon to a Kingdom Near You

Ekaterina at gnn.com


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: 2 Sep 1996 14:56:17 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <50f7l7$7gd at news-e2c.gnn.com>,
Ekaterina and Temur  <Ekaterina at gnn.com> wrote:
>
>I saw two examples of Yurts that had one other helpful item that 
>the people at the Kazakistan (sp) Embassy say is period.  The roof 
>has belt loops sewed around the edge.  This keeps the roof edge 
>from slipping out in wet windy weather.

I've seen examples of this, but the roofs were of the bentwood variety, and
not the typical Mongolian straight pole type. The yurt I researched had the
former variety and the belt loops you mention, but the roof lays differently
than on the straight poles, and the loops helps keep this tight over the
bent roof poles. The bent poles also add about eighteen inches to the height
at the khana, making very a very high (nearly 12-15 feet) ceiling. Next time
you and Temur are over, remind me to pull out the photos from that exhibit
and show you.

It would be very nice to have the bentwood variety of roof pole, but I don't
really have the facilities to do steam bending.

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   |  You just gotta learn to dance while life is throwing
 Dark Horde by birth |  chainsaws and chickens at you...after the first few 
   Moritu by choice  |  cuts and pecks, it's easy.   ---   jms


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Yurt plans
Date: 9 Sep 1996 08:17:26 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

Greetings,

During the recent thread on yurts I posted an anonymous ftp addres
where folks could obtain my yurt plans. Unfortunately I got the
address wrong, so I'm posting this correction. The correct address
is:
        ftp.access.digex.net/pub/access/corun/public_html

The file is called yurts.zip, and contains gif files of the drawings
and text files that explain them. I will be updating these files at
some point in the near future, so if you get them now, check back in
a month or so for the update. As always, feel free to write me with
any questions or concerns.

In service,
Corun


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: 5 Sep 1996 06:23:57 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

In article <markh-0409962330350001 at slip-53-3.ots.utexas.edu>,
Mark S. Harris <markh at risc.sps.mot.com> wrote:
>Greetings unto Corun,
>
>> It would be very nice to have the bentwood variety of roof pole, but I don't
>> really have the facilities to do steam bending.
>
>Hmm. How did the Mongols do it? As a nomadic people, they probably had a
>limited amount of facilities themselves.

Again, referring to the one I saw, both the roof poles and the khana seemed
to be made of arctic willow saplings. These were all about one inch in
diameter, the khana pieces being eight feet long, and the roof poles upwards
of ten. The roof poles were shaved flat for about 24" of the length and 
this was bent, the flat side then being laid against the outside of the
khana and tied in place with yarn cords. The other ends were made square
and fitted into square holes in the roof ring. I *suspect* (strong use of
that word here since none of the Russian scientists who came along with the
tour had first hand knowledge of construction methods) that green wood was
used, thus making the bending after the flattening much easier to accomplish
without breaking. I would also suspect a jig of some sort was used to bend 
the wood in large quantities until it dried.

Now arctic willow will be hard to come by in this country, especially in
large quantities of narrow, long saplings. Since, however, it is similar
to the Aspen, anyone living in the Colorado/Wyoming areas of the Outlands
could probably find sufficient quatities of this.

In service,
Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   |  You just gotta learn to dance while life is throwing
 Dark Horde by birth |  chainsaws and chickens at you...after the first few 
   Moritu by choice  |  cuts and pecks, it's easy.   ---   jms


From: todric at salamander.net
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Yurts (was: More on Period Tents)
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 1996 21:21:49 -0700
Organization: Zippo

Corun MacAnndra wrote:
> 
> Again, referring to the one I saw, both the roof poles and the khana seemed
> to be made of arctic willow saplings. These were all about one inch in
> diameter, the khana pieces being eight feet long, and the roof poles upwards
> of ten. The roof poles were shaved flat for about 24" of the length and
> this was bent, the flat side then being laid against the outside of the
> khana and tied in place with yarn cords. The other ends were made square
> and fitted into square holes in the roof ring. I *suspect* (strong use of
> that word here since none of the Russian scientists who came along with the
> tour had first hand knowledge of construction methods) that green wood was
> used, thus making the bending after the flattening much easier to accomplish
> without breaking. I would also suspect a jig of some sort was used to bend
> the wood in large quantities until it dried.
> 
> Corun

If it helps to know, there are National Geographic photos showing 
how these green sticks are bent; a tree or tree trunk is cut to provide a 
 large "Y" which is well set into the ground. A medium sized fire is 
built next to it. The green saplings (barked and shaped) are heated at 
the bend-area in the fire, and set into the "Y". Sideways pulling bends 
the wood at that point without breaking it. It's sort of like 
steam-bending, but uses the green wood's own sap as the water.  
        Todric


From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: yurts-setting up?
Date: 6 Sep 1996 09:54:25 -0400
Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA

T Randall  <randallt at skycell.com> wrote:
>melissa ervay wrote:
>> 
>> Can a yurt be set up with only one person... i might be switching to a
>> yurt... and if so how easy is it to set up , and how windproof/sturdy is a
>> yurt since there are no stakes
>
>Yes, they can.  I believe Corun has gotten his assembly down to 
>45 minutes (Correct me if I'm wrong Corun, It was kind of loud 
>that day in the house) 

Well, I have stated here that the one time I've done this solo I got the
yurt from car to livable in around 2 hours, but that means all my gear and
bedding were also set up and in their proper places and I was ready to move
in (and have a long nap). For just the assembly of the yurt itself, I'd
guess between 45 minutes and an hour. Of course, this first attempt took me
a little longer as I had some initial trouble getting the roof poles to stay
in place, then discovered that in my eargerness to get set up I'd forgotten
to attach the girdle cord that keeps the khana round. Needless to say, once
that was done, the roof poles went in without any trouble at all and stayed
there. (hey, you learn from experience)

>As for windproof,  as Corun has pointed out, yurts have been 
>used for ages in an environment that can get pretty windy.  I do 
>know that the yurt I helped assemble this past Pennsic stayed up 
>durring the rainstorm we had. The only problem we had was the 
>covering to the roof ring wasn't secured, and so the occupant 
>got a little rain on his bed.  The yurt stayed put.  no stakes, 
>no weather lines.

My Lady has been doing some research at the Library of Congress recently,
and found the conference proceedings from the Fifth Meeting of the
Permanent International Altaistic Conference held at Indiana University
June 4-9, 1962. In it there are some rather nice diagrams showing the
airflow around a yurt. The design is very naturally aerodynamic, as one
would expect from a building made by a people who live in a place as
open to the elements as the Eurasian steppe and the Gobi desert.

Anyway, I quote the paragraph from the proceedings;

"B. Shape. The rounded structure is most practical for severe climate
conditions, as it conserves heat within, and in the wildest winds the
curved sides lead the sind current over or around them, presenting no
flat, resistant surface to the gales."

Corun
===============================================================================
   Corun MacAnndra   |  You just gotta learn to dance while life is throwing
 Dark Horde by birth |  chainsaws and chickens at you...after the first few 
   Moritu by choice  |  cuts and pecks, it's easy.   ---   jms


From: Brett and Karen Williams <brettwi at ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: yurts
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 1997 09:04:02 -0700

Frank C Morgan wrote:
> I was wondering where I could get some plans to built a medium sized yurt
>                                  .
>              Emyrs

For what it's worth, I ran across mention of this book in a Lark Books
catalog yesterday-- I haven't looked any further at it, so I can't tell
you in what level of detail it goes into on constructing a yurt.
However, it's:

_Tipis and Yurts, Authentic Designs for Circular Shelters_ author: Blue
Evening Star, Lark Books. 128 pp., 75 color plates. "...sprinkled with
absorbing historical tidbits, the clean-lined text tells you how to
construct an updated Plains Indian tipi and a yurt inspired by
traditional Mongolian designs."

A quick question at a good book store or library will generate the ISBN.
Hope this helps.

ciorstan


From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: yurts
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 1997 18:33:46 -0400

Brett and Karen Williams wrote:
> For what it's worth, I ran across mention of this book in a Lark Books
> catalog yesterday-- I haven't looked any further at it, so I can't tell
> you in what level of detail it goes into on constructing a yurt.
> However, it's:
> 
> _Tipis and Yurts, Authentic Designs for Circular Shelters_ author: Blue
> Evening Star, Lark Books. 128 pp., 75 color plates. "...sprinkled with
> absorbing historical tidbits, the clean-lined text tells you how to
> construct an updated Plains Indian tipi and a yurt inspired by
> traditional Mongolian designs."
> 
> ciorstan

I bought it through the mail and definitely would NOT recommend it 
to anyone as a source for real yurt plans. Bought it, seen it, :=(.
There are however, pictures of real yurts in it.

See Shelter I and Shelter II for better plans and articles.
Feb. 1962 National Geographic for the prettiest pictures. 
See also many Geographics under Mongolia in the NG Index book.
National Geographic has a searchable database index online. You
can also buy the magazines from their store back to 1940.
The Dec.96 and Feb.97 NGs had articles on the Khans and Mongols.
Tents by Hatton, out of print.
Tents: Architecture of the Nomads, by Torvald Faegre, OOP too.
Shelter I & II may still be had. Shelter books are amazing.
See Great Dark Horde sites and articles page. There is also a 
Yurt FAQ and many articles, suppliers, out there. Do a search.
See Tents of off SCA A&S page. Baron Corun MacAndru of Storvik,
Atlantia has a plan on his web page and pictures.
Tour the Horde camps. Ask first.

Be of use.

                         M. Magnus Malleus
                         Dark Horde and Atlantia


Subject: Felt Making and History Book, includes Yurtmaking
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:36:17 -0400
From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
Organization: Windmaster's Hill, Atlantia, and the GDH
To: stefan at texas.net, ddfr at best.com, sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

There is a new book on feltmaking on the market since 1996.

FELT ~ New Directions for an Ancient Craft, by Gunilla Paetau Sjoberg,

translated by Patricia Spark. Interweave Press, 201 East Fourth Street,
Loveland, CO 80537 USA. Translation of: Tova. ISBN: 1-883010-17-9. Mine
was $25 plus tax. 152 pages, many illus- trations, including diagrams
and color and b&w photos.

 This is a fairly comprehensive book on felt and not one of the New Age
yuppie craft modern art waste your money type books. This author went
to some length to research her material. The result is a great overview
of history from multiple cultures (including mongolian) and techniques.

Historical felt discoveries are included from the norse to the Scythians
in S.W.Siberia. Techniques are fairly complete.

 Includes clothing, hats and caps, socks and boots, slippers and
mittens, purses, childrens' goods, and feltmaking and embroidery of
the asian nomads (about 10 very detailed pages). The feltmaking for
yurts section answered some of the questions I had been seeking
answers for such as how well the wool is cleaned before felting. This
is the best set of illustrations of feltmaking I think is in print.
Actually shows more than one technique. There are several I know of.

 It also shows techniques for bending the hana pieces and drilling them
and explains how the red color for the wood is obtained. I've been
researching yurts and have seen this no where else. While the
construction techniques for the door and crown (sky door) are not
explained there are some good illustrations. This person did her
homework. Attended a feltmaking party. Illustrates some of the rope
tie making technique. Does not show the weaving of the decorative bands.
Does show the stitching of door mat and rugs. Excellent bibliography,
some in other languages unfortunately.

M. Magnus Malleus, Atlantia and the GDHorde


Subject: Yurt Construction
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 98 08:16:45 MST
From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
To: cordanjr at jmu.edu

Efenwealt Wystle and his inlaws put up a modern yurt near Charlotte,
N.C. Photos on site.
http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Alley/2032/yurt.html

Local yokel to us. And if you have heard of Efen, yes that is the one
who is the bard.

Magnus


From: rkymtntrls at aol.com (RkyMtnTrls)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Seeking maker of a Yurt-style pavilion!
Date: 1 Nov 1998 14:08:47 GMT

Thanks - I just got their catalog in.  They don't have one listed, but are
willing to do custom work if supplied with a detailed drawing.  I have the
"Gobi Home Companion", in it is such a detailed sketches - right down to the
split willow latched walls, and the roof disk.  The only problem is, for custom
work, it is likely to rocket out of my budget.  I may have to (sigh) go for the
#2 choice of a standard made pavilion (like a Belled Wedge or Regent) that
Panther carries - those are pretty affordable at $500 - $700 avg.


From: "Maggie" <maggie5 at home.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
References: <19981031202805.06477.00002169 at ng97.aol.com>
Subject: Re: Seeking maker of a Yurt-style pavilion!
Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 15:28:33 GMT

RkyMtnTrls wrote in message <19981031202805.06477.00002169 at ng97.aol.com>...
>Let's try this again -- does anyone know of a reliable, quality pavilion
>maker who can make a mongolian yurt?
>
>Sher / Lady Gegu in Colorado

I know of 2 commercial yurt makers.

http://www.yurts.com -- Pacific Yurts, in Oregon
http://www.nbyurts.com -- Nesting Bird Yurts, Colorado .. Wyoming,
something.


From: corun at access5.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Seeking maker of a Yurt-style pavilion!
Date: 2 Nov 1998 11:30:34 -0500

Maggie <maggie5 at home.com> wrote:
>I know of 2 commercial yurt makers.
>
>http://www.yurts.com -- Pacific Yurts, in Oregon
>http://www.nbyurts.com -- Nesting Bird Yurts, Colorado .. Wyoming,
>something.

I have never seen Pacific Yurts making portable yurts. Theirs are 
permanent dwellings. I don't know about Nesting Bird.

Corun


From: saradwen at my-dejanews.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Seeking maker of a Yurt-style pavilion!
Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 04:32:12 GMT

RkyMtnTrls wrote in message <19981031202805.06477.00002169 at ng97.aol.com>...
>Let's try this again -- does anyone know of a reliable, quality pavilion
>maker who can make a mongolian yurt?
>
>Sher / Lady Gegu in Colorado

You might get a hold of Master Todric Koenig, a Laurel in Yurt Building here
in the Midrealm. He can be reached at todric at raex.com. He is currently going
into the yurt building business and makes quality yurts. I have watched him
work on them and he knows what he is doing. He also happens to be a neighbor
of mine, living a few blocks from here!

Lady Saradwen Ariandalen
Marche of Gwyntarian (Akron/Kent, OH)
Midrealm


From: Peter Torlind <petert at cad.luth.se>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Seeking maker of a Yurt-style pavilion!
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 12:14:50 +0100
Organization: Division of CAD, Lulea University

RkyMtnTrls wrote:
> Let's try this again -- does anyone know of a reliable, quality pavilion maker
> who can make a mongolian yurt?
> 
> Sher / Lady Gegu in Colorado

I have a friend that does some nice jurts, he have done them in 4m and
6m size (huge).

You can look at this webpage for an interior view of the jurt.

http://www.mt.luth.se/~petert/personal/mtv98/jurta.html

Karl Alrune, Frostheim, Nordmark


Subject: Re: ANST - yurt/gher resources ....
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 98 20:46:30 MST
From: Pug Bainter <pug at pug.net>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

j'lynn yeates (jyeates at realtime.net) said something that sounded like:
> Well personally, I've grown rather fond of Yurts/Ghers.
> Would you have the relevent links for the online references handy

A couple examples are:

http://www.access.digex.net/~corun/mongpage.html
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/articles/yurt/
http://user.aol.com/VirtualMu/YurtQuest/links.html#oplans
--
Phelim "Pug" Gervase 
Barony of Bryn Gwlad
House Flaming Dog
pug at pug.net


Subject: ANST - Yurt/Ger Joints
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 98 23:37:32 MST
From: Margo Lynn Hablutzel <Hablutzel at compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG" <ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG>

One observation if you are making a yurt/ger.  Many people rivet or bolt or
similarly fasten together the lathing.  This is a BAD idea!  As shown as
Lillies War earlier this year, the siffer joints lead to turnovers in a
stiff wind.  If you tie the joints with sinew or leather lacing, it takes a
bit longer but they have the flexibility to withstand high winds.

I checked this with some yurt-makers in Meridies, and they say it is so.

                                        ---= Morgan


Subject: Re: ANST - Yurt/Ger Joints
Date: Mon, 09 Nov 98 11:43:22 MST
From: eric mauer <eric.mauer-next at attws.com>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

Morgan writes
>>>>One observation if you are making a yurt/ger.  Many people rivet or bolt
or similarly fasten together the lathing.  This is a BAD idea!  As shown as
Lillies War earlier this year, the stiffer joints lead to turnovers in a
stiff wind.  If you tie the joints with sinew or leather lacing, it takes a
bit longer but they have the flexibility to withstand high winds.<<<

The sinew/leather/nylon lacing is certainly closer to period
practice (the Mongols used rawhide thongs). The disadvantage
is that it's much more vulnerable to wear. My experience is
that if the wind is high enough to turn over a properly
secured and staked down yurt, it will be strong enough to
crack the lathe. The round shape of the yurts tends to spill
wind, and the rigidity is based on the interlacing of the
lath, not on the joint used. It shouldn't make a difference,
unless the yurt actually blows down, at which point the
laced joint may result in less damage to the structure.

Your milage may, however, vary.

TuhTahl


Subject: New Mongolian Armor Book is out.
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 99 10:56:31 MST
From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
To: cordanjr at jmu.edu

Our friend John Cordani / Pao Hu Tso of the House Sain Noyan informed
me that the publication on Mongolian Armour is now available.:
..............................

The publication in the Mongolian Society is in print and
available. It was in galley print when I was at Indiana
University in the fall.

The Mongolian paper is available, probably at $8.00 plus
handling from

The Mongolian Society, Inc.
322 Goodbody Hall
Indiana University
Bloomington, IN 47405-2401

phone 812 855 4078
fac   812 855 7500
email monsoc at indiana.edu

Title: MONGOLIAN SURVEY Issue Five, 1998.
...........................
Talked to the lady this morning and ordered mine. $8 is correct plus
your choice of shipping and handling. A book on felt tents by Andrews
is expected in a month or two. Didn't know for sure if it was the
same expensive one that he produced in Europe a year or so back.
That one is $175 and can be found off a page off the SCA Arts page
on Medieval Pavillion Resources. Hopefully this one will be a damn
sight cheaper.

They also have a range of other Mongolian publications by the Society
available.

Also she has a Mongolian made yurt model in a box at $75 (one only).
And ten (only) mongolian hats - Description Blue with a red knot on
top, yellow trim and a flower design in the fabric. $25 & shipping.

They are VERY aware of who Master Todric is and his yurts. <VBEG>
If you want a medieval yurt contact todric at raex.com, customs done.
I am not affiliated with the business.

Master Magnus Malleus, Atlantia, GDHorde


Subject: Yurts / Gers - if of interest
Date: Mon, 08 Feb 99 20:16:20 MST
From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
To: stefan at texas.net

[gdh] Additional email address
   Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 17:58:51 -0500
   From: "Thomas R. King" <todric at raex.com>

Gaffer and I have setup a seperate email address just for the Yurt
Business; please feel free to forward it to interested parties.  :-)

        Thanks! :-) Todric ++

        Singing Horse Designs
        PO Box 1915
        Kent, OH 44240
        yurts at raex.com
..................................
This would be Gaffer Bear, GDH Shaman and
Master Todric Koenig, OL, OP who is very well experienced and
researched in yurt design. He has some 20 years in Mongol Arts.

M. Magnus Malleus, Atlantia, GDHorde, fiscally unaffiliated.


Subject: Re: ANST - yurt construction
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 99 14:08:21 MST
From: eric mauer <eric.mauer-next at attws.com>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

'wolf writes:

>>>>on yurt construction ...
<snip>
the author uses nut's / washers / bolts to secure the lathes ...
anyone out there use pop-rivets & washers ???<<<<

In period, the kana was attached with rawhide strips. I've seen that
used with some success, as well as braided nylon cord and (my choice)
1/4" bolts. My experience has been that the kana we use (1/4" pine
lattice) tends to get damaged in transit, so you end up replacing slats
periodically. Unless you're fond of drilling rivets, I wouldn't advise
them for general use. However, if you're doing a
semi-permanent structure, they'd work great.

Tuhtahl
tuhtahl at moritu.net


Subject: ANST - More Yurt info...
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 99 10:36:59 MST
From: Pug Bainter <pug at pug.net>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG
CC: bryn-gwlad at Ansteorra.ORG

==== Forwarded from another list ====
anyone else get this..... takes forever to load but worth a look at least
for ideas
        ...to take a look at:
        http://web.raex.com/~yurts

        Todric
---
       SINGING HORSE DESIGNS
     http://web.raex.com/~yurts
     ______yurts at raex.com______
           (330)-678-0011
 P.O. Box 1915    Kent, OH     44240


Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 14:04:37 -0500
From: "j'lynn yeates" <jyeates at realtime.net>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: yurt resource

was working through the current issue of Fine Homebuilding and came across
something that may be of interest:

_Nomad Tent Types of the Middle East_
by: Peter Alford Andrews

pub: Dr. Ludwig Reichert Verlag, Tauernstr. 11, 65199 Wiesbaden, Germany ... US
agent, Professor Paul Kriess, The Rug Book Shop, 2603 Talbot Road, Baltimore,
MD 21216-1621, (410) 367-8194; 1997, $155 softcover (2 volumes; 667 pp.

"Professor Peter Andrews, after 20 years of meticulous study and extensive
field research, has produced the definitive work on the native yurts of the
Middle East" ...

"woodworkers will probably take special interest in the discussions of
techniques for shaping and bending the roof struts and the complex skylight
rims ..."

"although pricey, it still costs a bit less than a purebred dromedary"
(traditional price of a yurt frame)

'wolf


Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 20:53:37 -0400
From: rmhowe <magnusm at ncsu.edu>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Cc: todric at raex.com
Subject: Re: yurt resource

j'lynn yeates wrote:
> was working through the current issue of Fine Homebuilding and came across
> something that may be of interest:
>
> _Nomad Tent Types of the Middle East_
> by: Peter Alford Andrews
>
> pub: Dr. Ludwig Reichert Verlag, Tauernstr. 11, 65199 Wiesbaden, Germany ...US
> agent, Professor Paul Kriess, The Rug Book Shop, 2603 Talbot Road, Baltimore,
> MD 21216-1621, (410) 367-8194; 1997, $155 softcover (2 volumes; 667 pp.
>
> "Professor Peter Andrews, after 20 years of meticulous study and extensive
> field research, has produced teh definitive work on the native yurts of the
> Middle East" ...
>
> "woodworkers will probably take special interest in the discussions of
> techniques for shaping and bending the roof struts and the complex skylight
> rims ..."
>
> "although pricey, it still costs a bit less than a purebred dromedary"
> (traditional price of a yurt frame)
>
> 'wolf

If you want reasonably priced, well made frames by someone who
has done a LOT of research and built quite a few, taught classes, etc.
I'd suggest you contact Master Todric Koenig at Todric at raex.com
or yurts at raex.com  http://web.raex.com/~yurts/
They aren't using 2X4s for the roof poles, and they cost a fraction
of what some greedy companies are charging for non-period yurts.

Todric is OL, OP and helps run Pennsic every year. Site token #5.
You can find him in the Dark Horde Camp when he's not busy.

I've read Andrew's doctoral thesis btw. Or at least viewed it.
I had only two weeks, and it was 1400 pages microfilmed legal size
from the College of London. Most of it was on Princely Tents from
the western asia and India area, a smaller part was on yurts and
siberian tents. At the time he hadn't actually examined that many
yurts of the eastern styles, and most of his illustrations were
xeroxes from cyrillic books and persian and indian illuminations.
He concentrated on the princely tents, not yurts, with great
scholarship, but little magic.

I have not seen his current book, but I sure would want to before
I spent that kind of money on it. And I've done a bunch of research
on yurts. I collect quite a bit on tents. (Amongst a lot of other
stuff). I'm under the impression he spends most of his time in
the middle east. However - he is about the only one actively chronicling
a vanishing way of life's architecture. So lets' give him credit due
there. He's deperately trying to do it before it disappears.
I suspect for Middle Eastern types it might be the ticket.
But yurt styles stretch from Turkey to Siberia over a band
a thousand miles wide. And they vary a great deal in some respects.
His timeline that was suggested in the thesis doesn't agree with
the suggestions from archaeology books I've seen, including a drawing
of a rock carving of one well back in the BC's. If he hasn't
changed his mind I seem to remember he thought they evolved in the
800's AD. The thesis was an attempt to chart the evolution of various
styles in asia based largely on construction types, as if they all
devolved from one another in a more or less simple pattern. Something
I find rather improbable, but then I don't have a PhD. :)
All materials in one are biodegradable. Mongols bury almost nothing.
I think I'll wait til it comes down (a lot).

There _are_ GOOD books for those looking to build one themselves.
First among the lot I'd place Torvald Faegre's _Tents: Architecture
of the Nomads_, 1979 PB. It shows up on Bibliofind from time to time.
There were two available two weeks ago. It's simply explained and
well drawn and has a number of varieties according to culture.
He should have written others. He was a carpenter with a whole
lot of common sense, and did the job very adequately. He also did
a fair amount of building on the shoulders of others who were good.
This is one middle eastern types seeking tent styles should have.
And it covers Mongolian yurts as well.

Hatton's _Tents_ is another very good source. Also OP. Probably the
bible of tent history. Well illustrated.

_Shelter I_ and _Shelter II_ by Shelter Associates are also fine books.
Shelter I may still be in print (reprint). Shelter II is a bit harder
to find. These are amazing vernacular architecture books.

There is a book called _Yurts and Tipis_ (Teepees) that is okay for
the latter but the plans for the yurt are simply awful, although
there are some nice shots of real ones. This one is current, but I
wouldn't buy it again if I had seen it beforehand.

There is an excellent series of photos, and explanation of building
one in a book on _Felt_ by Sjoberg. She should have done a book on
yurts. Her observations are very good. Much better than the above.

I'd suggest looking under Mongolia and western / northern areas
of China in National Geographics. Tibetan shaman tents are striking.
The February 1962 has the best Yurt pictures, and the Dec 96 and
Feb 97 issues were on the Mongols with the Dec having a large foldout.
All are still available from the NGS online, or your local charity
from time to time. There are a number of other relevant issues however.
Check a NG Index at the library. It's a great resource.

I own all but Andrews. These opinions are mine.

Magnus Malleus, OL, Windmaster's Hill, Atlantia, GDHorde


From: Tanya Guptill <tguptill at teleport.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Yurt Pimples
Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 23:10:24 -0700

Effingham wrote:
> BTW; I saw something very interesting at the war; a lot of people with yurts
> had umbrellas popping out of the vent hole to defend against rain. It looked
> like yurts with colored pimples. <G>

I have to admit I have a personal prejudice about those things.  Why would anyone who has taken the time, effort and money to make/buy a yurt put an obviously nylon mundane item at the most visible spot?  You don't need to use bentwood for the smokehole.  I cheated and used a handle I ripped off a rattan basket, and it pops right into the holes on the ring.  My smoke hole cover is made from a large scrap of the roof canvas, and has four (purchased) woven cords on its corners, which tuck inside the roof, so you can adjust your smoke hole cover from the inside when it is raining.

I hadn't seen the umbrella thing until I got to Pennsic.

Mira


From: rmhowe <mmagnusm at bellsouth.net>
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 21:33:04 -0400
Subject: [MedEnc] Yurts

http://www.cnn.com/2000/TRAVEL/PURSUITS/OUTDOORS/10/16/wilderness.huts.ap/index.html


From: "David W. James" <unend at aolDAMNSPAM.com>
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Anyone here live in a yurt?
Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2006 09:36:35 -0400

We spent most of a week in a Pacific Yurts' (http://www.yurts.com/) one 
in Northern California in early August.  It was quite comfortable, with 
a few potential exceptions.  There wasn't any real insulation, so it got 
warm during the day and cold at night. Since this one was part of a 
guest ranch, it had A/C and heat, and both got used.  The lack of 
insulation also includes sound insulation; while the river running 50 
yards away was nice, the sound of the cars on the highway 250 yards away 
was not.

Other than that it quite nice.  And we accidently drove past the 
manufacturer while driving back north through Oregon afterwards.  The 
electric and water were brought in under the deck/floor.  This one used 
a composting toilet, which worked just fine.  All in all, no complaints 
about it, other than the road noise.

David (no garb, so Kwellend wasn't seen.)


From: pritchard_da at hotmail.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Anyone here live in a yurt?
Date: 28 Sep 2006 02:40:44 -0700

On a visit to Kyrgyzstan in 1993 I tried to purchase a yurta but I found
that a real yurta with red painted wooden latice and thick white wool
felt would cost an enourmous sum to ship back to the US. They were not
cheap, around $800 to $1000 in Bishkek, plus shipping, along with the
traditionally woven band that holds the roof over the top of the  walls
and the extra piece of wool felt that covers the opening for the camp
fire smoke. In my own opinion the Kyrgyz yurtas are the most attractive
and then the Uzbek desgn. I think that the Mongolians have the plainest
yurtas.

anti_scrappy wrote:
> I don't know anyone personally that lives in a yurt year-round, but
> these folks sell them and their FAQ covers things like plumbing and
> electrical installation.
> 
> http://www.rainieryurts.com/


From: pritchard_da at hotmail.com
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Anyone here live in a yurt?
Date: 28 Sep 2006 10:21:11 -0700

The interior of a Tuvan yurta:
http://www.skitalets.ru/trips/2003/tuva_sankov/yurta.jpg
Tuva is an Autonomous Republic of  the Russian Federation in
southwestern Siberia along the Mongolian border in the Altai Mountains.

An illustration of a Kyrgyz yurta:
http://www.stamp.elcat.kg/images/big/009.jpg

A photograph of a Buriyat yurta:
http://travel.in-russia.com/sysdoc/725/yurt.jpg
Buryiatia is an Autonomous Republic of  the Russian Federation to the
south of Lake Baikal .

pritchard_da at hotmail.com wrote:
> On a visit to Kyrgyzstan in 1993 I tried to purchse a yurta but I found
> that a real yurta with red painted wooden latice and thick white wool
> felt would cost an enourmous sum to ship back to the US. They were not
> cheap, around $800 to $1000 in Bishkek, plus shipping, along with the
> traditionally woven band that holds the roof over the top of the  walls
> and the extra piece of wool felt that covers the opening for the camp
> fire smoke. In my own opinion the Kyrgyz yurtas are the most attractive
> and then the Uzbek design. I think that the Mongolians have the plainest
> yurtas.

<the end>
Edited by Mark S. Harris	yurts-msg	Page 38 of 38