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disabilities-msg - 11/12/14


Disabilities in the SCA and period, hiding wheelchairs, SCA sign language.


NOTE: See also the files: SCA-SL-art, eyeglasses-msg, sign-lang-msg, 15C-Eyeglsses-art, carts-msg, Dog-Carts-art, SCA-transport-msg, sedan-chairs-msg.





This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.


This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org


I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.


The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.


Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).


Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: hwt at bcarh11a.bnr.ca (Henry Troup)

Subject: Re: Period wheelchairs

Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd., Ottawa, Canada

Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1993 12:28:55 GMT


I remember that Graf Sir Shadan, sometime Marshall of the Society, spent one Pennsic being wheeled around in a wheelbarrow...


Henry Troup - H.Troup at BNR.CA (Canada) - BNR owns but does not share my opinions



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: tbarnes at silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes)

Subject: Re: Period Wheelchairs! How?

Organization: Indiana University

Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1993 17:41:47 GMT


        A couple of years ago Mistress Gwynnis Mooncat disguised her PMV

as a yak, by hanging lots and lots of yarn, bells and other Mongolian

danglies from it.  

        I personally see no particular need for period looking

wheelchairs (esp. since a lot of period furniture tended to be bulky).

If we can selectively ignore glasses, orthodontia and othopedic braces,

we can learn to selectively ignore wheelchairs and other such devices.

To do otherwise sounds to me like a form of prejudice because most foot

mobile folks aren't familiar with people in wheelchairs.


        Lothar \|/




From: djheydt at uclink.berkeley.edu (Dorothy J Heydt)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period Wheelchairs! How?

Date: 27 Aug 1993 18:42:15 GMT

Organization: University of California, Berkeley


thomas wrentmore barnes <tbarnes at silver.ucs.indiana.edu> wrote:

>      A couple of years ago Mistress Gwynnis Mooncat disguised her PMV

>as a yak, by hanging lots and lots of yarn, bells and other Mongolian

>danglies from it.  

>      I personally see no particular need for period looking

>wheelchairs ....

>If we can selectively ignore glasses, orthodontia and othopedic braces,

>we can learn to selectively ignore wheelchairs and other such devices.


Seems to me an acceptable middle ground would be, not to try to disguise

your wheelchair as a {yak,horse,donkey,pushcart}, but to decorate it

as you would your period {yak,horse,donkey,pushcart}.  Yarn and bells

and Mongolian danglies sound just great to me--always assuming it's

Mongolian that you want to be.  Otherwise, I suggest--with the vision

in my mind of the beautiful, elaborately decorated slipcovers for

directors' chairs that I've seen sometimes in the West--


wait for it, wait for it...


WHEELCHAIR BARDING.  Research the barding, horseblankets, etc. appropriate

to your time and place, and adapt as necessary to fit the physique of

your steed.


Dorothea of Caer-Myrddin          Dorothy J. Heydt

Mists/Mists/West                   UC Berkeley

Argent, a cross forme'e sable           djheydt at uclink.berkeley.edu



From: ilaine at panix.com (Liz Stokes)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period Wheelchairs! How?

Date: 2 Sep 1993 19:30:28 -0400

Organization: PANIX Public Access Internet and Unix, NYC


In article <CCFIHn.1Ly at usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>,

>      I personally see no particular need for period looking

>wheelchairs (esp. since a lot of period furniture tended to be bulky).

>If we can selectively ignore glasses, orthodontia and othopedic braces,

>we can learn to selectively ignore wheelchairs and other such devices.

>To do otherwise sounds to me like a form of prejudice because most foot

>mobile folks aren't familiar with people in wheelchairs.


        Well no there is no *need* for it any more than for period

glasses on the part of everyone else. However the occupant of the chair

might himself be an authenticity maven and wish to have all period

accoutrements. I have seen pictures of Italian Renn wheeled invalid chairs.

They have small wheels so they are only good for being pushed about on a

smooth surface, but it's somewhere to start.




Liz Stokes         | Ilaine's E-Z Garb Workshop ...  Okay, now take the fabric

Ilaine de Cameron  | off the loom (or away from the kittens). It needs to be

                  | finished. Just find some fullers' earth, a convenient

ilaine at panix.com   | stream, and some husky peasants to pound it with rocks.



From: ck290 at cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Chandra L. Morgan-Henley)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Rickshaws and golf carts

Date: 30 Nov 1993 21:51:49 GMT

Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)


Ok, I did some checking around.


For those who, like myself, have difficulty walking, 3-wheeled

electric "scooters" (like the ones you're probably starting to

see in your neighborhood supermarket/Kmart/WalMart) can be

rented for around $200/month (they are not available on a weekly



I own one, and it's a wonderful thing to have -- I'm really

looking forward to using it at Pennsic!  :-)


The advantages:

        - you always have a place to sit

        - you don't have to struggle _one_more_step_ up the hill

        - they are electric (no gas or diesel fumes)

        - they go about as fast as a person walking quickly


The drawbacks:

        - they have to be recharged every night

        - they are not as fast as golf carts

        - they only hold 1 person at a time

        - cost (of course)


If anyone is interested in renting one for use at pennsic, e-mail

me and we'll correspond.


Chandra (Cara knows nothing about scooters)



Chandra L. Morgan-Henley

ck290 at Cleveland.Freenet.edu



From: gray at cs.umass.edu (Lyle Gray)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Fighting on a wheelchair

Date: 13 Dec 93 13:47:43

Organization: Dept of Comp and Info Sci, Univ of Mass (Amherst)


>>>>> On 12 Dec 1993 23:40:08 GMT, ga_tewes at postoffice.utas.edu.au (Alex Tewes) said:

>> NNTP-Posting-Host: tasuniunio96h43.tuu.utas.edu.au


>> Greetings All!

>> The following message is forwarded for your considered attention:



>> *******msg starts*******

>> From: NICHOLASM at Underdale.UniSA.edu.au

>> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1993 09:57:49 +0930

>> Subject: Fighting in a wheel chair

>> To: sca-lochac at dialix.oz.au


>> Greetings to the Known World from Ingerith Ryzka


>> Lord James Ericsson sends warmest greetings to all and requests the

>> following

>> information:


>> Does anyone know of any heavy fighter who fights or who has fought from a

>> wheelchair?


>> May I ask someone (perhaps Silfren) to forward this to Sca-West and the

>> Rialto

>> as my mail to Sca-West is bouncing at present and I do not have access to

>> the Rialto.


>> Many thanks in advance,


>> Regards


>> Ingerith Ryzka

>> Barony of Innilgard

>> Principality of Lochac

>> Kingdom of the West


>> *******msg ends********


I heard tell just this past weekend that there was a member of the Tuchux who

fought in the field battle one year while in a wheelchair.  His bodyguard was

overrun, and one member of the opposing forces purposefully dove on top of him

to protect him when his wheelchair was accidentally dumped over in the press.


Single combat, I can see it.


Lyle FitzWilliam


Lyle H. Gray                       Internet (personal): gray at cs.umass.edu

Quodata Corporation            Phone: (203) 728-6777, FAX: (203) 247-0249



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: wklosky at nitro.mines.colorado.edu

Subject: Re: Fighting on a wheelchair

Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1993 19:20:16 GMT


ga_tewes at postoffice.utas.edu.au (Alex Tewes) writes:

8< snipped question on fighting from a wheelchair


Someone in Storvik help me out; I seem to recall stories of one of the

Atlantian greats (could it have been Stryker?) fighting from a chair at

a Tourney of the Tower many many years ago due to having some problem with

his legs? Or is this a myth?


There is, of course, Sir Kief in Ansteorra, who doesn't fight from a chair,

but from crutches (and his single sword is deadly!).


branwynn ottersby



From: cosc19ut at menudo.uh.edu (E. d'Yverdon)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Fighting on a wheelchair

Date: 13 Dec 1993 16:20:19 -0600

Organization: University of Houston


wklosky at nitro.mines.colorado.edu writes:

>There is, of course, Sir Kief in Ansteorra, who doesn't fight from a

>chair, but from crutches (and his single sword is deadly!).

>branwynn ottersby


For those who don't know Kief, he has only one leg. Quite often he doesn't

use his "war crutch" in battle. Fighters around here are warned early on

not to take Kief's leg, because he is one of the dealiest fighters from

the ground.


Etienne d'Yverdon



From: Elwyn.Halfmoon at f555.n387.z1.fidonet.org (Elwyn Halfmoon)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Fighting on a wheelchair

Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1993 11:45:00 -0500


> Does anyone know of any heavy fighter who fights or who has fought from

> a wheelchair?


No, but here in Ansteorra, Baron Sir Keif, who has only one leg, does pretty

damn good with single sword and crutch.  You should see what kind of mobility he

has with that crutch.  I've personally seen him get to the semi-finals of Crown

Tourney. I also hear he fights double sword using the second sword as a crutch

until he's into the melee.



Organization: Penn State University

Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1993 17:43:53 EST

From: Therion <HZS at psuvm.psu.edu>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Fighting on a wheelchair


In article <GRAY.93Dec13134743 at ibis.cs.umass.edu>, gray at cs.umass.edu (Lyle Gray)



>I heard tell just this past weekend that there was a member of the Tuchux who

>fought in the field battle one year while in a wheelchair.  His bodyguard was

>overrun, and one member of the opposing forces purposefully dove on top of him

>to protect him when his wheelchair was accidentally dumped over in the press.


Zenon, of the Bear Clan. He was a fully mobile fighter for years before

flipping his pickup truck one Halloween night, 3 or 4 years ago.  He still

attends Tuchux and SCA events, and fights semi-regularly.




From: amethysta at eric.stonemarche.org (Amethysta of Kensingto)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: SCA Sign Language

Date: Sun, 06 Feb 94 13:24:54 EST


Karen Larsdatter writes:


> Greetings, ye Rialto-Cruisers!


> Does anyone out there have a copy of a booklet/pamphlet distributed around

> the eastern part of the Known World (probably Eastrealm, Atlantia, et al)

> with the "official" signs for oft-used SCA words?  I'm going to be doing

> some sign-language interp work at Estrella War and would like to not have

> to "fudge" some last-minute signs for things like "Herald," "Laurel,"

> "Master/Mistress," "Lord/Lady," "Caid," "Outlands," and (ugh!) "Atenveldt"...



       Any one interested in SCA sign language should contact the

following person:


Lady Cedar

P.O. Box 5904

Parsipppany, NJ


Tel. (201)-887-1779


This is the lady that did the signing at Pennsic this year for Great

Court, as well as many other places. I believe she also does classes on

this subject at Pennsic.


Amethysta of Kensington



From: haslock at oleum.zso.dec.com (Nigel Haslock)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period citation for color-blindness?

Date: 14 Feb 1994 22:58:45 GMT

Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation


Greetings from Fiacha,


As someone who with deficient color vision, I find this report not at all



In article <0097A00B22F56120.2022DF84 at vnunet.UUCP>, asamplaski at vnunet.UUCP writes:


|> I just yesterday picked up the 2d edition of Thomas Kuhn's book on the nature

|> of scientific revolutions, and while thumbing through it came across a note

|> where he claims that "color-blindness was not noticed until Thomas Dalton

|> described it in 1794."


|> -Vlad the Purple, Myrkfaelinn


My deficiency was noted in school when I demanded a purple crayon instead of

the blue one I had been given. Without standardised colors and a teacher

who intrigued enough to push the issue, the deficiency would have been merely

another wierdness to be mocked or overlooked.


Painters may have noticed cases among their apprentices but wierd color choices

would fail to win them patrons. Dyers are about the only other trade where

precise color vision is relevant. Red/green types would also do badly as smiths

because of the significance of the red rediation from hot iron.


In general though, color coding would not seem to be significant to the

medieval. My own deficiency does not means that I cannot see colors, it means

that that some shades are less distinct for me that they are for others. I also

means that I will not decribe things by color, other than as a last resort.


        Fiacha, AnTir

        haslock at zso.dec.com


p.s. The deal with purple is that I can see purple with a large red component,

especially if the red is one of the lighter shades. Use a dark red and I see

a blue grey of some description.



From: alex0008 at gold.tc.umn.EDU (Rednaxela)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Period Color Blindness

Date: 15 Feb 1994 09:49:44 -0500


Good m'lord Vladisloc the Purple, and those attending his converse,

Lord Rednaxela sends unto thee greetings, and would with the lack of

humility which is his stock in trade, beg leave to offer his own

observations to this learned discussion,


Your question on colorblindness is most intreguing, and seems to be the

source of great intellectual amusement.  I commend thee.


Amongst my friends are artists of the most severe colorblindness, their

lack of color sense goes beyond the inablity to distinquish orange from

purple, they do not see in colors at all, lacking the cones (rods? my

biology is aged, I do fear) of the eye altogather.  And yet, as artists,

their ability to distinguish shades of grey is so intense that, as long as

they use natural colors (and not mixed paint palets), they can produce as

perfect an imitation of nature as you please, and with training they learn

to duplicate the natural hues with mixed palets, by nature of their

sensitivity to the greys.


This phenomenon would interfere with the detection of color-blindness,

especially in a culture where afflictions were frowned upon.  Thus, color

blindness might simply have been thought of as a "local" phenomenon, no

more remarkable than the unusual patterns on Farmer Theodorick's cow.


With this I close, please bear my feelings of good will to the goodly souls

of Myrkfaelinn whom might remember me.


- Rednaxela


Michael S. Alexander

(A.K.A.) Rednaxela

(612) 296-2304 (Work)

(612) 644-4817 (Home)

alex0008 at gold.tc.umn.edu



From: corliss at hal.PHysics.wayne.EDU (David J. Corliss)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Color blindness

Date: 14 Feb 1994 23:14:15 -0500


Fiacha, from An Tir, writes on color-blindness:


> My own deficiency does not mean that I can not see colors, it means that

> some shades are less distinct .....than others.


Earlier, he writes:


> Red/green types would also do badly as smiths because of the significance

> of the red radiation from hot iron.


But smiths are not in the business of distinguishing red iron from blue or

green or purple iron. The master will say to the apprentice: "When it looks

like this (holding up glowing metal), then do this (wielding a hammer). The

fact that the color value in the brain of the master differs from the value in

the brain of the apprentice does not invalidate this lesson. As you yourself

point out, the smith with a deficiency can still see color. Thus, he can

function as a smith.


All this is from logical construction, not experience: I can forge weld but

I am not color blind. Are there any color blind smiths out there who can

confirm this deduction?





From: ghesmiz at bach.udel.edu (Michael Macchione)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Color blindness

Date: 16 Feb 1994 16:41:33 -0500

Organization: University of Delaware


David J. Corliss <corliss at hal.PHysics.wayne.EDU> wrote:

>Fiacha, from An Tir, writes on color-blindness:

> > My own deficiency does not mean that I can not see colors, it means that

> > some shades are less distinct .....than others.

>Earlier, he writes:

> > Red/green types would also do badly as smiths because of the significance

> > of the red radiation from hot iron.

>But smiths are not in the business of distinguishing red iron from blue or

>green or purple iron. The master will say to the apprentice: "When it looks

>like this (holding up glowing metal), then do this (wielding a hammer). The

>fact that the color value in the brain of the master differs from the value in

>the brain of the apprentice does not invalidate this lesson. As you yourself

>point out, the smith with a deficiency can still see color. Thus, he can

>function as a smith.

>All this is from logical construction, not experience: I can forge weld but

>I am not color blind. Are there any color blind smiths out there who can

>confirm this deduction?


It may be logical, but it may not be correct.  Now I am not a smith so I

can't help you there, but I am color blind.  Like Fiacha, I am red/green

color blind.  This does not mean that red = green, only that I can have

trouble seeing shades of red and green.  For example,  I have often looked

at two objects which to me look the same color but to someone else look

two different colors.  And vice versa!  I have looked at two colors which

look radically different to me which other "normal" people say are

practically the same.  My main problem is seeing colors just off from

gray, like light greens, light pinks, off whites, etc.  I have a tunic

that I swear is gray, but all of my friends say is sea mist green.


Now to agree with what you say above, if I see the same color twice I

envision it as the same color.  Thus if I see iron glowing at a particular

temperature (say 800 F {I don't know what a realistic temperature should

be, nor does it matter}), I should recognize the color.  But that same

piece of iron may look exactly the same to me at 600F or 1000F or

possibly at every temperature in between.  If I had to rely on color to

determine when to do something to the metal, there is a good chance that I

would do it at the wrong time.  I did have this problem doing titrations

in a Chemistry class in college.  I was supposed to stop titrating when

the solution reached a particular color, (just off pink towards amber) and

I could never get it at the correct time.  It drove my professor nuts.


In actuallity, my eyes are not that bad in the range of colors that metals

tend to glow, but most people who are color blind will have different

problems, so someone might.





Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: wklosky

Subject: Re: Color blindness

Date: Thu, 17 Feb 1994 01:05:04 GMT

Organization: rec.org.sca


In article <9402150413.AA05261 at hal.physics.wayne.edu> corliss at hal.PHysics.wayne.EDU (David J. Corliss) writes:

>Fiacha, from An Tir, writes on color-blindness:

> > My own deficiency does not mean that I can not see colors, it means that

> > some shades are less distinct .....than others.

>Earlier, he writes:

> > Red/green types would also do badly as smiths because of the significance

> > of the red radiation from hot iron.

>But smiths are not in the business of distinguishing red iron from blue or

>green or purple iron. The master will say to the apprentice: "When it looks

>like this (holding up glowing metal), then do this (wielding a hammer). The

>fact that the color value in the brain of the master differs from the value in

>the brain of the apprentice does not invalidate this lesson. As you yourself

>point out, the smith with a deficiency can still see color. Thus, he can

>function as a smith.

>All this is from logical construction, not experience: I can forge weld but

>I am not color blind. Are there any color blind smiths out there who can

>confirm this deduction?

>                                              Beorthwine                



My lord is as color blind as you get, but he does fine in the smithy.

There has been little to suggest that he cannot tell when the metal is

red-hot. I think a significant point here also is radiation; hot iron

radiates not only light (and it is not a pure red, exactly) but also

a significant amount of heat, eh? :)


His main difficulties come when driving at night in a streetlight- and

stoplight-infested city. (Well, OK, if you overlook the occasional

odd-clothing combination as not being a difficulty -- after all, he's

not out for the cover of fashion magazines...) The green lights look

like white streetlights, and are hard to see.


branwynn ottersby

caer galen, the outlands



From: jeffs at math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: color blindness

Date: 17 Feb 1994 14:20:20 -0500

Organization: The Internet


>I just yesterday picked up the 2d edition of Thomas Kuhn's book on

>the nature of scientific revolutions, and while thumbing through it

>came across a note where he claims that "color-blindness was not

>noticed until Thomas Dalton described it in 1794." I'm having a bit

>of trouble swallowing this; surely SOMEONE would have noted the

>existence of this condition and written it down


Oh boy!  A non-BoD topic I can talk about!


Thomas Dalton suffered from COMPLETE color blindness, a.k.a. Daltonism

(because he was the first person to describe it scientifically).  This

worked to his advantage; one day he had to accept an honor from the

King, which entailed wearing a purple baldric.  Dalton was a Quaker,

though, and the purple baldric was classified as frippery and thus

forbidden unto him.  No problem; Dalton claimed to the Church Elders

that _he_ thought the baldric was gray....


If anyone wrote it down before Dalton, it would have to have been one

of the Arabs (they wrote quote a bit on ophthalmological anomalies),

but no one comes to mind.


However, let's think about it.  There's color blindness, and then

there's Daltonism.  The basic color blind cannot distinguish between,

say, blue and green (my problem) or red and green (other people).

This does not mean, contrary to common notion, they see things as gray

(God knows how many times I've explained this to people who ask me

about it).  What it means is that if you show me a piece of paper that

is light blue, and a piece of paper that is light green, about half

the time I can't tell the difference between them.


What about the other half?  Ah, here's the catch: even though I might

perceive the two colors as the same, there are still other cues,

brightness being but one of many.  (For example, if you're red green

color blind, and you see the bottom light of a traffic light is on,

you know it's green, even though you can't tell the color of that

light from the color of the top light) So in practice, it's rather

more difficult to tell if someone is color blind.  There are _modern_

tests that will determine it immediately, but they don't date back

beyond the 19th century.


Also, color is cultural.  I recently read that one group of American

Indians (Navajo, I think) do not distinguish between yellow and green.

It may be that Medievals paid less attention to color distinctions

than we do.  


Tio dell'abaco



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: tbarnes at silver.ucs.indiana.edu (thomas wrentmore barnes)

Subject: Re: color blindness

Organization: Indiana University

Date: Fri, 18 Feb 1994 12:39:10 GMT


In article <9402171918.AA09545 at math.bu.edu> jeffs at math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki) writes:

>What about the other half?  Ah, here's the catch: even though I might

>perceive the two colors as the same, there are still other cues,

>brightness being but one of many.  (For example, if you're red green

>color blind, and you see the bottom light of a traffic light is on,

>you know it's green, even though you can't tell the color of that

>light from the color of the top light) So in practice, it's rather

>more difficult to tell if someone is color blind.  There are _modern_

>tests that will determine it immediately, but they don't date back

>beyond the 19th century.

        Greetings from Lothar,


        Hmmm. I'm allegedly pretty color blind, because I can't

immediately identify the numbers hidden in the Ishihara color-blindness

test. However, I CAN trace the numbers slowly with my finger. I can also

distinguish very light shades of green and red from each other, unless

the light is very low or has a strong non-white component to it (like

lots of yellow from an incandescent bulb). I'm allegedly mildly

red-green color blind, but I don't buy it. I mostly seem to be

insensitive to the intensity of certain reds and greens.


>Also, color is cultural.  I recently read that one group of American

>Indians (Navajo, I think) do not distinguish between yellow and green.

>It may be that Medievals paid less attention to color distinctions

>than we do.  


        Definately. The Irish didn't distinguish between certain shades

of grey, and certain shades of light blue. Hence the Irish "blue" horse.

The norse didn't seem to distinguish between certain shades of dark blue

and black. Hence, Harald "Blue Tooth". How people divide up colors is

very definately a cultural thing. Don't think that the Western ROYGBIV

split of the visible spectrum is universal throughout human culture.



>Tio dell'abaco



From: hrjones at uclink.berkeley.edu (Heather Rose Jones)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: color blindness

Date: 18 Feb 1994 17:12:26 GMT

Organization: University of California, Berkeley


In article <CLF75A.3JC at usenet.ucs.indiana.edu>,

thomas wrentmore barnes <tbarnes at silver.ucs.indiana.edu> wrote:

>In article <9402171918.AA09545 at math.bu.edu> jeffs at math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki) writes:


>>Also, color is cultural.  I recently read that one group of American

>>Indians (Navajo, I think) do not distinguish between yellow and green.

>>It may be that Medievals paid less attention to color distinctions

>>than we do.  

>      Definately. The Irish didn't distinguish between certain shades

>of grey, and certain shades of light blue. Hence the Irish "blue" horse.

>The norse didn't seem to distinguish between certain shades of dark blue

>and black. Hence, Harald "Blue Tooth". How people divide up colors is

>very definately a cultural thing. Don't think that the Western ROYGBIV

>split of the visible spectrum is universal throughout human culture.


Let's make a clear distinction between two different things being discussed

here: the ability to distinguish between particular colors and having

different names for those colors. This subject provided some very important

evidence to the (fairly fledgeling) field of cognitive science (i.e., how

the human mind works) as reported in papers such as "Basic Color Terms" by

Brent Berlin and Paul Kay (1969). Here's the brief synopsis:


Different cultures group colors differently and draw the lines between

those groups in different places. Within any given "color" (as culturally

defined) there will be a particular focal shade that is considered the

"best example" of that color, and this "focal color" will be extremely

consistant throughout that culture. Comparing between cultures, we find

that "focal colors" (as defined by wavelength or a standard set of color chips)

are cross-cultural, i.e., if a culture has a word/concept for "red", their

"focal red" will be the same as that of other cultures that have a "red".

These "focal" colors correspond to particular wavelengths involved in the

physiology of human vision, which helps explain their cross-cultural



Now getting back to the original subject -- one of the cultures described

in the above study has only two color words/concepts: "black" and "white".

Every hue of the rainbow is classified as one or the other. But this doesn't

mean that the people in that culture don't _see_ colors as we do, just that

they don't _name_ them in the same way. Insular Celtic languages have a word

"glas" that covers what in English would be called blue, green, grey and certain

types of brown. But that doesn't mean that if you could question an ancient

Irishman and showed him a "blue" object and a "green" object that he wouldn't

be able to distinguish between them on the basis of color, just that he would

call them by the same color name. Similarly, most people would identify as

"green" an object of a dark "spruce green" and also a "chartreuse" one, but

that doesn't mean that we see no difference between them!


This is a very different question than that of color-blindness, in which

two objects that to "normal" people are distinguishable by color are

_seen_ as indistinguishable on that basis.


Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn (who tries very hard no to giggle when

listening to her two red-green color blind brothers try to blazon heraldry)



From: meg at tinhat.stonemarche.org (meg)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Sites and Autocrats

Date: Thu, 31 Mar 94 03:01:02 EST

Organization: Stonemarche Network Co-op


pjb4288 at ultb.isc.rit.edu (Pete - Toonatic - Boulay) writes:


> Greetings gentles...


>   Even though I reside in the East, I wish to make a request of all Autocrats

> that will benefit not only myself but other SCAdians I am sure.


> As a person with a disability, I have to look long and hard for events that

> are accessible to my magical steed.  It is not easy but I have been able to

> attend a few events.


> When you Autocrats begin the task of setting up sites, please remember that

> electronic steeds don't climb stairs and try to take that into mind.


> Thank you ever so kindly...


> In service...


> Lorin Francis Renaud

> Thescorre

> --

> Peter J. Boulay --17 Split Rock Road-Pittsford, NY 14534-The ToonAddict!

> Email should be sent only to PJB4288 at ritvax.isc.rit.edu


Milord, here in the Barony of Stonemarche, we try to have all our events

in accessable sites. And where stairs hinder, squires assist.  We can

also appoint a volunteer PCA who can act the part of a period attendant

to enhance your fun. We can also offer sign language translation. Many of

our subjects work at a local rehab center, so we have professional


BTW, I have Muscular Dystrophy, as do 3 others in this Barony.  It hasn't

stopped me from being active. Thanks for your post. Much needed.




my Companion Dog was given an Award of Paws in Royal Court.  She is

dipicted on my badge: checky argent and gules, a Talbot hound sable

harnessed azure sejeant.

(for the heraldically challenged, it's a black retriever in a blue

harness against a Purina dog food bag. Yeah!



In 1994: Linda Anfuso

In the Current Middle Ages: Megan ni Laine de Belle Rive  

In the SCA, Inc: sustaining member # 33644


                               YYY     YYY

meg at tinhat.stonemarche.org      |  YYYYY  |





From: salley at niktow.canisius.edu (David Salley)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: In chairs (was Re: Pennsic on Discovery)

Date: 27 Nov 94 13:04:33 GMT

Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208


Guiliam (Zach) writes:

>(Lewis Tanzos) writes:

>>(Suze Hammond) writes:


>>>(Who is the valiant fellow who fights from a chair? Intrepid!)


>I saw that at the War. After which about 4 of us were doing our best

>to Convince Baroness Megan of Stonemarche that for her to try it

>would be a *bad* idea. (Archery Yes, Fighting no)


If you're talking about the Tuchux, I've been in a field battle against

him once.  I have no objection to him being out there, but I would have

preferred some foreknowledge that he was there, rather than breaking

through their ranks and coming across a wheelchair in the process of flipping



Archery *is* possible from a wheelchair.  Ioseph Pecheur (Joseph Archer)

won the title of Baronial Archer last year, he's been in a wheelchair since

he was 17.  He's also a member of the Order of the Golden Alce (AEthelmearc

martial award for fighting, fencing, and archery).  When he was inducted,

the gorilla sized fighters lifted him into the air wheelchair and all and

carried him out of court that way! ;-)

                                                      - Dagonell


SCA Persona : Lord Dagonell Collingwood of Emerald Lake, CSC, CK, CTr

Habitat          : East Kingdom, AEthelmearc Principality, Rhydderich Hael Barony

Internet    : salley at niktow.cs.canisius.edu

USnail-net : David P. Salley, 136 Shepard Street, Buffalo, New York 14212-2029



From: UDSD073 at DSIBM.OKLADOT.STATE.OK.US (Mike Andrews)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Golf-Carts

Date: Fri, 02 Dec 1994 10:03

Organization: The University of Oklahoma (USA)


In article <9411301557.aa25783 at mc.lcs.mit.edu>,

WISH at uriacc.uri.EDU (Peter Rose) writes:


>>"Golf carts don't leave smelly piles in their wake. Maybe we could

>>dress the golf carts up like dragons?" (Alison)


>>But medieval people did not have dragons wandering around their camp





> Maybe we could dress the golf-carts up to look mule-teams, or oxen?


Funny you should menttion that!  Frater Ursus, our Founding

Baron (once known as Master Bjo:rn), has begun using an electric

3-wheeler for transport, owing to some medical problems. Lady

Alix Tiberga put a papier-mache' mule's head on it for Namron

Protectorate, and all thought it very fitting and proper.



udsd007 at ibm.okladot.state.ok.us    (

Michael Fenwick of Fotheringhay, O.L. (Mike Andrews)  Namron, Ansteorra



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: one eyed fighting

From: trelaine at beacon.sci.org (Larry McCoy)

Date: Fri, 23 Dec 94 13:38:32 PST

Organization: Beacon BBS


I also am blind in one eye, but I've been that way since I was eight years

old, and learned how to compensate. Most fighters and others that know me are

surprised to learn that this is so.  I've been fighting for over 15 years,

and only on a few occasions have I been "blindsided" or at least figured that

if I'd had both eyes I mighta seen that shot coming.., course there have been

times when two eyes might have been an impairment,, like depending on them

for the perifreal(sp) (I can read , but not spell,,) vision rather than

keeping the ocularies moving at high speed in a melee situation,,


                               Master Sir Anluan Trelaine




From: Suze.Hammond at f56.n105.z1.fidonet.org (Suze Hammond)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: wheelchairs

Date: Sun, 19 Mar 1995 20:34:00 -0800


MM> From: michael.mccollum at dazed.charleston.sc.us (Katie)

Ti> The comment that a wheelchair bound individual should

Ti> "stay at home",


MM> Doesn't deserve a response because it is utterly assinine. It's

MM> another bigot who's prejudices are showing. I hope this individual

MM> doesn't hold any titles in the SCA, because they're a pretty low form

MM> of organism.

MM> Katie (not Michael)

MM> aka Arianne


MM> A lady with a disease that may someday require that she show up at an

MM> event in a wheelchair of her own!  And WILL!!!


This reminds me of two things...


First, did they have anything like wheelchairs in period? Since people got

limbs lopped off all the time, they must have had to be moved sometime,

especially since some households moved in a circuit between several houses.


The other is that we have in our kingdom a merchant who merchants from a

chair, and I have seen him tear down his tent, booth, and entire camp

completely by himself, and seem to enjoy doing it. (I asked if he needed

anything and he said "oh no, I like doing it myself!" and proceeded to

roll around on the dusty ground (I mean sans chair) piling things into

loads for his van, pulling down the tent, rolling up the carpet, etc.,

then hiked himself back into the chair to get into the van to move it into

place and to reach the van floor and load up. Truly a wonder to behold!

(And faster than a lot of us "ordinarily-abled" folk.)


He was so impressive I'd have cheered, but it would have embarrassed him...


... Moreach



From: lmartin at utic (Lee Martindale)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: wheelchairs

Date: 22 Mar 1995 05:57:28 GMT

Organization: UniComp Technologies International Corp -- Internet Service


BECKUM (beckum at aol.com) wrote:

: Trying to keep people who are in wheel chairs away from events is

: censorship and I would rather not see the SCA get into that.


With respect, m'lady....trying to keep people who are in wheelchairs away

from events is IMPOSSIBLE.


There are several of us in Ansteorra, myself included, who would, if there

was need, *crawl* up whatever obstacles stood in our way, and then

remark on the need in poem, tune or tale.  (Hell hath no fury like a

ticked-off bard.)


I didn't see the original post that started this, but the tone of the

responses puts me in mind of my first outdoor SCA event - Steppes

Warlord XIX.  I was making my way to the showerhouse on my magical

sedan chair when a lady (whom I had never seen before and have not seen

since), put herself in my way and proceeded to lecture me on how

un-period the aforementioned mode of mobility was and how I had simply

*destroyed* her sense of ambiance.  I listened as patiently as my

bladder would permit, then thanked her for her counsel.  I promised

to abandon my unseemly form of conveyance the very minute she could

secure for me a period sedan chair and 6 likely lads to be at my beck

and call to carry.  (6 in that I am a lady of generous proportions).

She was aghast, and probably worse, as I then excused myself and made

a necessarily hasty exit - right over her toes.


Unseemly tho that woman may have found it, my sedan chair has "earned

its keep" in the years since.  Last year the Warlord site lay in the

path of a tornadic storm, with a swift, camp-wide warning essential.

It was me to whom the autocrats came to make that particular round -

at 5.5 miles per hour.


And this year I have the honor to be co-autocrating Steppes Warlord

XXII with my household.


Keep the "wheelies" away?  I think not!  And it pleases me to read

that others think it ridiculous as well.  Thank you....


Ly. Llereth



From: jeffs at math.bu.EDU (Jeff Suzuki)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: wheelchairs

Date: 28 Mar 1995 14:09:05 -0500

Organization: The Internet


Moreach writes:


>First, did they have anything like wheelchairs in period? Since

>people got limbs lopped off all the time, they must have had to be

>moved sometime, especially since some households moved in a circuit

>between several houses.


There's a painting by...Breughel?  That shows a bunch of beggars

without various limbs.  They're using various devices (crutches, yes,

but artificial legs as well) to get around.  IMSC, one of them was on

something that looked very much like one of those "Radio Flyer"

wagons, using crutches to propel himself.  


Any good book on medical history will talk about the history of

prosthetic devices.  (Unfortunately, none of mine are on this coast)


William the Alchymist



Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Pennsic: am I reading this right?

From: nancy.frankel at canrem.com (Nancy Frankel)

Date: Sun, 14 May 95 11:28:00 -0500

Organization: CRS Online  (Toronto, Ontario)


At the risk of having someone land on my head with both feet (or at

least a couple of wheels!) I would like to respond to all of those

people who seem a bit perplexed as to why wheelchairs are disallowed

from melee combat.  It has been the experience of my entire household

last year, as well as the people fighting with them, that a certain

person in a wheelchair was being used as a human battering ram, causing

a fair bit of unwarranted physical injury (in illegal areas- below

the knee etc) to the people he was smashed into.  The concerns do not

end there (with the people being hit by him). Questions were also

raised about the extent of injuries he himself could face by being

toppled over & trod upon. Whereas that is an eventuality that all melee

fighters face, at least those with full functioning ability in their

legs can pull them selves up under their shields (turtling up) to avoid

further injury. If a gentle is in a wheelchair, presumably he or she is

not capable of using their legs either at all or somewhat, and in this

case, they cannot get away to safety.


I too know of physically challenged people who have won the belt or

baldric through fighting prowess ... no-one in charge of the War rules

this year can gainsay their rights or abilities to play in

single/tournament combat. However, in a mass melee situation, it is

considered an unnecessary risk, and perhaps it is just a case of that

one guy whose group used him as a siege engine ruining the opportunity

for the rest of the people in a similar situation.

Furthermore, lest anyone out there think that this is a prejudicial

situation, let all who read this know that when I ruled the MidRealm

many (many) years ago, the person I chose as my Champion only had one

leg. His enthusiasm for and enjoyment of the sport, despite his physical

challenges were the attributes which made him an augmentation to my



   If I have said anything here that could possibly be misconstrued as

an insult, please believe that I have no intention of doing so. I just

did not want anyone out there to think that the Kings & Queens who set

up the War rules this year had any prejudices or biases or bad feelings

towards physically challenged people. They, as all wise & pure thinking

individuals, are merely concerned for the safety of all.


Thank you for listening

Countess Mistress Caitlin Stuart



From: alysk at ix.netcom.com (Elise Fleming )

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: YKYITSDAW

Date: 21 Jul 1995 17:06:23 GMT

Organization: Netcom


In <3uojv9$pt at ns.mcs.kent.edu> jhusvar at nimitz.mcs.kent.edu (John

Husvar) writes:


>Trying to figure out a way to make a wheelchair seem less mundane is a

>real puzzlement.


>The chair will just have to take its chances with whatever "Period

>Police" happen to fall upon it out of the bushes. :)


Hm-m-m. How about making the chair into a Chair of Estate?  Can you

affix some rods to the back sides and rig up a lovely brocade fabric to

make your chair into one for a High Lord?  It would give you a sun

shade. I'm not sure how better to describe it than being similar to a

canopy bed...you're putting a canopy over the chair.  You could put a

little of the fabric down from the arms, fastening it to avoid getting

into the wheels.


Alys K.



From: rudi3964 at utdallas.edu

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: YKYITSDAW

Date: 21 Jul 1995 15:01:59 -0500

Organization: The University of Texas at Dallas


No problem -- people usually ignore wheelchairs as much as they do

eyeglasses and duct tape.


The only time I have ever taken public notice of a wheel-chair was when I

was drawn in a fencing list against Baron Lyelf the Lame, who fights from

his chair.  I took my tourney chair out there and met him in equal combat.


Robin of Gilwell/Jay Rudin



From: corun at access4.digex.net (Corun MacAnndra)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: SCA in whellchairs. Was Re: YKYITSDAW

Date: 21 Jul 1995 13:31:22 -0400

Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA


In article <3uojv9$pt at ns.mcs.kent.edu>,

John Husvar <jhusvar at nimitz.mcs.kent.edu> wrote:

>In article <3umq93$g5v at metroux.metrobbs.com> nutmeg at clubmet.metrobbs.com writes:

>>You try to cover your excessively mundane wheelchair backpack with a

>>length of Buchanan tartan.  Then you are quietly taken aside by a good gentle

>>who explains at length that the tartan is more obtrusive than the

>>original luggage.

>And No Kidding There I Am, too!

>Trying to figure out a way to make a wheelchair seem less mundane is a

>real puzzlement.

>Here it be a few weeks from Pennsic and I, too, can't quite decide what

>to do with this thing.

>I'm at the point where I'm ready to just bite the blade and let the thing

>hang out in all it's radiant glory and concentrate on making _me_ as

>un-mundane as possible.

>The chair will just have to take its chances with whatever "Period

>Police" happen to fall upon it out of the bushes. :)


Milord and Milady,


Two things present themselves to this addled head of mine.


Primus: The easiest and most convenient thing for you is to simply leave

the chairs alone. People should just adopt the same concept the Japanese

have adopted wrt living in houses with paper walls. You don't see or hear

what you aren't supposed to see or hear. At this point, the chair simply

ceases to exist. You become treated as anyone else, with all the dignity

and honour you deserve. This is something that chairless people can then

learn to practice outside the SCA.


Secundus: You could attach something very like a horse or a portion of

a horse to the front of your chair, and voila, you're in a horse drawn

cart. There is a fellow who rides a bicycle around Pennsic that has the

front and hind quarters attache to the bike, disguising it as much as

possible. I once attended a Ren Faire to babysit the small boy of a dear

friend of mine while she worked one of the booths. She had decorated his

stroller up with someting resembling a Unicorn. <side note to all single

men: walking around a Ren Faire with a baby boy in a stroller disguised

as a unicorn is a big hit with the ladies>


Now this latter solution, while cute, may be inconvenient for you if the

horse (or yak or camel or whatever) has to be removed expiditously, say

when you need to use the euphemism. But a clever craftsperson could easily

fix it so it snaps into place with a few easily manipulated buckles or

some such device.


And if you don't like the horse idea, you could try the Viking longchair

disguise. There is nothing so terrifying as the sight of a fierce Viking

attacking in his or her longchair. (Hey, it worked for the bus and Morgana's

golf cart)


These are just some ideas. Take them for what they are worth to you.


In service,

Corun (too many years in theatre, too long in front of a computer)


   Corun MacAnndra   |            The first rule of intelligent tinkering

Dark Horde by birth |                  is to save all the pieces.

   Moritu by choice  |                                               A. Leopold



From: cjcannon at ucdavis.EDU (Carol Cannon)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: RE:  Wheelchairs

Date: 27 Jul 1995 19:27:14 -0400

Organization: The Internet


I know it's a little out of period, but I found an  illustration of

'Louis XIV veillissant promene dans le parc de Versailles' on p. 41 of

"Montesquieu" / Jean Starobinski.  Paris : Seuil, 1994.  


It shows the king seated on what looks like the floorboard of a chariot

[i.e. flat and u-shaped in front], the floorboard being mounted on 1

small wheel, which is turned by the passenger's moving a steering lever

like those on a modern hand-scooter.  The two back wheels are much

larger. The king's throne/chair is royally upholstered, of course.  The

contraption is being pushed by not less than three good-sized footmen.


Those of you who have wheelchairs may not wish to trade them in, but

perhaps they could be 'guised by the use of a little lightweight plyboard

or ? to look more like what the king was using, esp. if you could 'hire'

yourself some good healthy-looking footmen and put them in your livery.  


Good luck, in any case.  -- Grannia



From: salley at niktow.canisius.edu (David Salley)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca


Summary: Disabled Guild

Date: 22 Apr 95 10:05:10 GMT

Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo NY. 14208


Maureen S. O'Brien writes:

> In a previous article, rebel at horde.com (Mark R. Kiel) says:

> >Great, now do something about it. The SCA prides itself on being a volunteer

> >orginization, so volunteer to be the 'handicap autocrat'.

> Why don't we _all_ volunteer for it?  :)

> I propose, in fact, a guild of sorts.  Why don't concerned Scadians like

> ourselves, including the disabled ones whom life forces to be concerned,

> volunteer our services to the autocrats to look over sites for problems

> and do something to correct them?  Perhaps one could also provide training

> for folks on what it is like to be disabled and how one can do little

> things that make the event more liveable for everyone.


Said guild has already formed!  Contact the guildmaster(s) at:

        Guilliame and Kylara du Blumont

        c/o Randall and Kathy Gradl

        11624 Bolton Road

        Springville, NY 14141

BTW, Randall is blind and has served as part of our site selection crew.

It may be mean, but it's fun watching site owners realize that they're

"disabled accessable site" statement *IS* going to be put to the test. ;-)


In addition to site checking, the guild does plan to teach disabled awareness

at upcoming A&S workshops.  Currently, they're working with teaching

disabled new members the unique problems of the SCA.  Parnell, Randall's

dog, who's been taught to keep Randall from harm, would pull him away from

a list field as soon as he heard the clashing start.

> Disability was not always ignored or despised in period; the people who

> were disabled were as much a contributing part of their world as they

> are of ours.  Consider Odin's little proverb in the Elder Edda about how

> even the blind and the lame were useful to the community.  If the Norse,

> living in their harsh world, could think of ways to let the disabled

> participate as equals, surely it would be uncourteous, unchivalrous,

> and downright stupid for us not to do at least as well.


Ever take a hand-spinning lesson from someone blind?  I have.  Her fingers

were so deft and sure and fast, it was hard to believe she couldn't see

what she was doing.


> [If you wanted to name it after someone, I suppose you could call it after

> Margaret of Castello, who though born with blindness, dwarfism, lameness,

> and a hunchback to contend with, ministered to the poor with whom she lived.

> Or St. Germain.  Or Tyr.  Whoever we like.]


The guild is still in it's early stages of forming.  I don't know if they've

picked a name yet.  Suggest it to them.


> If anyone is interested in learning about things they can do, I suggest

> they contact Samanda Jeude (I've got her address;e-mail me for it), one

> of the founders of the science fiction fandom handicapped access group,

> Electrical Eggs. She'd be used to issues like weird clothes and you

> probably won't have to explain who we are....


Give me her USnail address and I'll pass it on to them.  They'd probably

love to her from her.

> Maureen S. O'Brien              We are like the roses ---

> ad451 at dayton.wright.edu            We are forced to grow.


                                                      - Dagonell


SCA Persona : Lord Dagonell Collingwood of Emerald Lake, CSC, CK, CTr

Habitat          : East Kingdom, AEthelmearc Principality, Rhydderich Hael Barony

Internet    : salley at cs.canisius.edu  (Please use this, reply may not work.)

USnail-net : David P. Salley, 136 Shepard Street, Buffalo, New York 14212-2029



From: just Kate <ez010263 at peseta.ucdavis.edu>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Epilepsy and Fighting

Date: 3 Jan 1996 09:43:51 GMT

Organization: University of California, Davis


cerosenberg at usa.pipeline.com(Carl Rosenberg) wrote:

refore, this

> person with epilepsy can avoid this unnecessary medical intervention by

> letting others know of his condition.  A medical bracelet is insufficient

> as it is likely to be lost in the armor.

> Carl Rosenberg


I have to agree that a medic alert can be overlooked, as Carl

noted. It's not a bad idea to warn folks of a problem regardless

(like the marshal and/or chirurgeon and/or someone you trust).

I'm not really comfortable telling a total stranger, however,

the paticulars of my medical make-up; so I have a medic alert

attached to my breastplate in addition to the one that lives

permanently around my neck.  A friend of mine put two spaced

holes along the front rim of his helm for his spare medic alert

(I originally stole the idea from him).  Both places are up

front in noticable spots.  It's not a bad way to approach the



ttfn, Twcs



From: kellogg at rohan.sdsu.edu (C. Kevin Kellogg)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: I would like to join; BUT

Date: 20 Feb 1996 18:49:23 GMT

Organization: San Diego State University


BriThyla (brithyla at aol.com) wrote:

: As many have said, don't allow your disability to stop you. At Pennsic,

: there is a young man that actually fights in armor from a wheel chair. His

: friends lashed wooden poles to the sides and one of them pushes him around

: the battlefield so that he can fight too.


        I missed the original while at Estrella, but let me add to the

many encouraging words already spoken.  I have the marvelous privilege

of being in the same household as two fine gentlemen that just happen

to be in wheel chairs.  Baron Talaque reigned as Baron of Calafia from

his, and is still a very active and important member of the Barony in

his retirement.  He serves as Faculty Advisor for the College of

St. Isisdore.  Lord Mark de Bueaumenoire (sorry, Mark, I know I butchered

the spelling) has served as the communications officer at the last several

Potrero wars, monitoring a collection of CB's, Ham radios, and cell phones,

as well as generally keeping Autocrat's Camp organized.  He also edited

the most recent Calafian Directory.  Both men have done good service to

our Household, and are valued members of Calafia.


               Avenel Kellough



From: salley at niktow.canisius.edu (David Salley)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Sign Language in Court???

Date: 3 Nov 1996 01:07:00 GMT

Organization: Canisius College, Buffalo, NY  14208


DeeWolff (deewolff at aol.com) wrote:

: I have the privilege of residing in the East, where there is a wonderful

: herald who signed just about every court I have attended. I unfortunately

: do not know her name, but I sure the current royals do......


She's Lady Cedar.  Pennsic Court was wonderful this year.  The herald called

*her* into court to accept a service award.  She was in full "In the ears, out

the fingers" mode when she suddenly realized she was signing her own name!

She stopped cold, stared at her hands for a few seconds, then turned to the

herald. The entire court was grinning at her.  The applause for her was



                                                      - Dagonell


SCA Persona : Lord Dagonell Collingwood of Emerald Lake, CSC, CK, CTr

Habitat          : East Kingdom, AEthelmearc Principality, Rhydderich Hael Barony

Internet    : salley at cs.canisius.edu  (Please use this, reply may not work.)

USnail-net : David P. Salley, 136 Shepard Street, Buffalo, NY 14212-2029



From: srankin at op.net (Susan Rankin)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Disabled in the SCA

Date: 15 Sep 1997 15:31:44 GMT

Organization: OpNet -- Greater Philadelphia Internet Service



>What would make a site not "accessible" in your view?  Is a

>site accessible if you can get to the toilets and feast

>without help? If, without aid, you can get to over half the

>activities you want to participate in? If you can get to



         Speaking as one with visual difficulties... Good things to look for are roomy indoor facilities.  Will the room be big enough for everyone coming and still allow for the passage of wheelchairs or persons with various types of canes (Support canes as well as those used by the blind.)  Is there a ramp leading into the Feast Hall?  Is there at least one handicap toilet facility?   Bonuses, though not expected as this can be difficult to find, a flat paved surface near the list field.  At past Michaelmas events,  we are fortunate enough to have such a setup, but none in wheelchairs have attended.


>In how much detail? What sorts of things would you want in the

>newsletter? What if the environment changed due to weather

>between the time the announcement was printed (or submitted

>for printing) and the day of the event?


      Hmmm, things for the newsletter... Well definitely the existance of the ramp into the feast hall, the appropriate toilet facilities, and what the conditions near the list field are like.


      Somethings that we ourselves can do are:

        1   Ask for the event site phone number (if there is one) from the autocrat and call to ask those in charge of the site itself about facilities, ramps, and the allowance of guide dogs.

        2    A few days ahead of the event, call someone in the area for a weather report.  This will give you a clue as to what the ground conditions will be like so that you can take appropriate precautions.  i.e. Perhaps bringing some sheets of wood to make a path for the wheel chair to travel and be seated upon at the list field.  These weather reports can even be found online.


        The autocrats job is a big one, a nerve wracking one.  There are a few things we can do to make it a bit easier by doing some of our own checking.  We will be searching out a new site for Michaelmas soon and I intend to give the place a look-see with the afor mentioned concerns in mind before we decide.





Subject: Re: ANST - Court Herald Style

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 98 21:35:57 MST

From: Lee Martindale <lmartin at airmail.net>

To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG


Kateryn R Heathryge wrote:

> Actually, to be heard, one should stand with hips, shoulders and ears in

> line so that the air column is straight, and your face should be pointed

> at the audience.


If I may interject a note to potential heralds from the ranks of

my fellow "wheelies", the aforementioned posture can be successfully

assumed from a sitting position.


Lee Martindale / Llereth Wyddffa an Myrddin / The Copper Bard

email: lmartin at airmail.net




From: "Ld Tristan de Rochebrune" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Fwd: SCA-Disabilities

Organization: Calontir

Date: Wed, 22 Dec 1999 06:14:14 -0600


After the discussion of epilepsy I though it may a good idea to repost this.


Ld. Tristan



----- Original Message -----

From: "Chris Denny" <Keidale at webtv.net>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Sent: Monday, August 30, 1999 7:01 AM

Subject: SCA-Disibilities



Greetings to the poulace of the Known World,

After a debate that took place on the Middlebridge sometime back

concerning kids and adults with disabilities in the SCA I have started a

mailing list for just that.It is called SCA-Disabilities. There is so

many in our organization who fall into this catagory that we have set up

a place where your concerns can be heard.

If you would like to be apart of his, please go to the following,


Those already subscribed look foward to hearing from you.

Thank you






From: Ted Eisenstein <alban at socket.net>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Epilepsy, diabetes, and other conditions

Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 16:27:16 -0600


Talan said

>>A good friend of mine was a diabetic who was subject to severe

hypoglycemic episodes and grand mal seizures.  The first time I spent

much time with her in person she managed to have both in the space of a

few hours.  As I, with no experience of either, was the only other

person available, I was *extremely* grateful for the brief

information/instruction sheet that she carried prominently in her

purse. She didn't *like* carrying it - I think that she felt that it

compromised her independence - but she (reluctantly!) admitted that it

was the sensible and courteous thing to do.<<


and, later in the same post

>>As for the original issue of fighting, I see no particular need to

inform your opponent of your condition as long as you've informed

*someone* appropriate, perhaps a senior marshal or two and a

chirurgeon. (I'm assuming here that your doctor approves.  If you

haven't asked, please do that first.)<<


Two words:


Medic Alert.


They keep a list of what medical conditions you have (all the way from

drug allergies to asthma to heart conditions to epilepsy to diabetes to

_anything_ that may be of concern to anyone treating you on an

emergency basis.) The list is confidential. Medic Alert is a Good Thing

to know about.

They also sell (more or less at cost) a bracelet/neck chain engraved

with information you ask to be put on it.






MedicAlert Foundation

2323 Colorado Avenue

Turlock, California 95382-2018

Telephone 1-800-IDALERT (1-800-432-5378)

Fax 209-669-2495


Alban, who really ought to update his information



Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 00:54:16 -0500

From: "JRMapes" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


From: "Stefan li Rous" <stefan at texas.net>

> Tristan commented:

> > From: "Rovena" <rovena at softdisk.com>

> > > You stated that every person should have the option of participating


> > > everything.  Is that realistic?  How would a wheelchair  person fight

in a

> > > melee?

> >

> > Actually Quite well thank you :-) Even won some tounrey's.

> Thanks Tristan for giving us a first-hand example. I've seen folks in

> wheelchairs in SCA battles. Apparently in some situations being in a

> wheelchair can be an advantage. I seem to remember a combat rule for

> either Pennsic or Gulf Wars that you were not allowed to use your

> wheelchair bound comrades as battering rams against your opponents.


YEs, which  was ok by me. I didnt appreciate the though of being used as a

battering ram lol. Wheelchair fighin has a huge advantage if you are good at

sword and board. the only target available to hit is 3" of Helm and sword

arm when throwing a shot.


> Similarly, down here in Ansteorra, we have Sir Kief. Sir Kief, currently

> Earl Marshal for Ansteorra, has one leg amputated above the knee. He

> fights in both tournaments and melees. Crutch and sword, anyone? The

> last thing you want to do with Kief is take his leg. He's a tough

> competitor on one leg. He's much, much worse on the ground.


I owe a lot to Sir Kief. It was the butt chewing i took from him that

convienced me to put away my bow and pull the light archer tape markers from

my helm to return to the melee with a big stik. It wouldnt have been so bad

that chewing out but it was at Northern Regional Tribute in front of

eveyone, hehe. called out in front of royals...hehe try being called down

on the carpet in front of TRM's and court and the whole bleeding northern

Anst army!


Yes it was Ansteorra where i relearned to fight from a wheelchair in many of

the northern region tournies including a couple NR Warlords.


> If after reading this, particularly if you have comments from personal

> or professional experience, please feel free to send me a message for

> possible inclusion in this file.


BTW I sent you off list an old email from my fighting days. called

Wheelchair Combat: Limits and Precautions.  If anyone else would care to get

it jsut give me a yell. its basically soe observations and helpfull hints i

learned along the way of adjusting to fighting in a wheelchair from being a

stand up kinda guy er i mean fighter :-)





Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 00:40:12 -0600

From: "R. Del Boccio" <serian at qwest.net>

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


there is a list for people with disabilities in SCA called

medievaldisableds, on yahoogroups.com.  There are

interesting discussions on a variety of topics regarding SCA

and access, including things like camp cooking, archery,

etc. If any of you are interested in this list but are

having trouble finding it, just let me know.





Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2001 23:58:44 -0700

From: lilinah at earthlink.net

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


Rovena wrote:

>Our shire birthday is held in a horse pasture.  The only toilets are

>portalets. There is no way we could alter the accomodations.


Out here we can rent wheel-chair accessible port-a-potties. These are

useful for all sorts of disabilities, not only wheelchairs, being

lower to the ground, having a wide doorway, and hand rails inside, as

well as a lot more interior space. I'm sure they must cost more than

a regular single, but if you have other people in your shire with

physical problems besides your husband, it might be worth seeing if

they can fit into a budget.





Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 02:59:07 -0500

From: "JRMapes" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


From: <LrdRas at aol.com>

> Ageed. There is no reason to expect the SCA fighters to provide for the

> needs of a wheelchair bound person


If they did i would for one be offended. They dont make special stuff up for

anyone else then why should i be different. If i win a tourney i dont want a

bloody asterisk in the book beside my name. Either ya make it within the given rules or ya dont. Be it Fighting, Arts and Science Competitions, or Arching.


Considerations can be made for necessity if and when possible, ie ports

johns, temp ramps, even leaving the mushrooms out of the stew if severe

allergies abound.


Considerations can be made for non-necessity if and when possible but its

not mandatory nor should it be. The gesture wil be greatly appreciated by

all those on the receiving end im sure. But to expect it each and everytime

is as absurd as thinking just because I’m in a wheelchair. I also have brain

damage and must be spoken to very loud and very slow.


For me in the SCA its more rewarding to know i did something without

exceptions being made because of my four wheels.





From: "JRMapes" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

To: <stefan at texas.net>

Subject: Wheelchair Combat: Limits and Precautions

Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 00:46:44 -0500


Here is a copy of an old email i sent in a chit chat about wheelchair fighting.

Feel freee to use it if you want. its a bit old as i said and for the record

i no longer hold my Auth. for fighting or Marshalling in Ansteorra not my

auth. for fighting in Calontir.




----- Original Message -----

From: "Tristan" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

Sent: Wednesday, 22 December, 1998 1:49 PM

Subject: Fighting limits and precautions


The rules that I worked out for combat in Calon were very simple.

First no changes needed to be made as far as armor and weapon requirements.

If the person like myself fights from a chair they start out as "legged" and

cannot move  except for a few feet at a time or with assistance. this is very close to the standing rules of movement after being legged in Calon. Especially

since when holding weapons and or a shield and wearing gauntlets it is darn

ahrd to move more than a little at a time to begin with.


All shots to the legs or the chair from the waist down count as leg shots

against already taken legs... non-shots.


All shots to the backrest of the chair count as clean shots and a kill.

Unless the wheels protrude high above the seat which most dont, a wheel shot

is same as leg shot. Therefore a non-shot since you start out legged.


For safety sake, upon death, there is no "falling" out of chair. Sword arm

goes over head with sword tip pointing down to ground, and you "yell like

hell" that you're dead.


Its not a perfect system but everyone i have fought and many that has only

seen me fight approve of it in Calon as well as Ansteorra (where I am also

a warrented fighter and marshall).


My only limits personnaly are weapon types, for instance Greatsword and

Bastard sword and Polearm (halberd/spear) have been a pain due to being

thrown off balance when using them. But it varies greatly on the Kingdom

fighting style of such weapons. I can effectively use Halberd or spear in

Anst. where movement does not play as large a factor in the style. Unlike

Calon, where if you cant move very fast, you die quickly using such weapons.


Weapon systems really are not something I feel should be limited, if you can

use  a weapon safely then use it otherwise dont. Like i said above though, this varies depending on the style used to fightthe weapon.


Melees are a whole breed unto themselves. I have had mixed reviews on if I

should fight in melees.  But no one has said a final "no". It has to do a

lot with how I was taught to fight long ago.

1)Give no quarter, take no quarter.

2)The final authority on my personal safety and my opponents safety is me.


kind of odd I know but that is how we have always policed ourselves,

marshall's notwithstanding. of course this can be abused but then its a

fighters honor thing.


Since we do not use a counted blow system in Anst or Calon that I am aware

of I can not say how well or not it would work in my case.


One major problem that faces a para when fighting IS how honorable or

dishonarable an oponnent is. It is easy to corkscrew a man on his knees or

in the chair or setting on the ground into the ground. Hence rules against it in the rules of the list for everyone.


A spearman/ polearm or great weapn fighter can stand back and snipe, its

annoying as heck but legal to do. Honarable? IMHO...No. especially in one on one combat.  In melees, its part of the game and everyone is vulnarable to a

spearman coming at you  down the line on an angle.


Luckily for me I have a great bunch of guys I fight with in the Calon and

Anst. armies and to a man have never had one just set back and snipe me in

1-on-1 combat.


My only changes I have made thus far to any rules is trying to mandate

maximum  leg armor such as a 3/4 steel leg harness with extra padding at

thigh for a wheelchair fightrs legs. since  the thigh is perpendicular to the fight, a great or mass weapon coming down  solidly on the leg  has a good chance of snapping the thigh bone. I realized this after going  1-on-4 in a melee  at

Northern Regional Warlord in Anst. , The 4 men I was taking on were all using greatswords.


I also have suggested that they mandate shoulder and collar bone protection

for the same reasoning.


Ld. Tristan de Rochebrune

Bois d'Arc




Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 11:21:40 EDT

From: Bronwynmgn at aol.com

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


rovena at softdisk.com writes:

> You stated that every person should have the option of participating in

> everything.  Is that realistic?  How would a wheelchair person fight in a

> melee?  


There is a Tuchuk who uses a wheelchair who fights regularly in the field

battle at Pennsic.  He has a special "battle chair" which his friends

maneuver for him, and he fights from his knees.  If you have the footage from

the Today show or Amazing America (I forget which) which was shot at Pennsic

about 5 years ago, there is a picture of him in the chair before battle and

being wheeled into the fray as it starts.  At least in the Pennsic rules, and

I believe in the EK rules as well, there is a new one that states

"Wheelchairs may not be used as battering rams"...  There is also, of course,

Sir Keif of Ansteorra, who is missing a leg and fights on two crutches and

one foot.  It is my understanding that he joined the SCA, and was knighted,

after losing his leg.


I am a physical therapist in the mundane world.  You would be amazed (I

constantly am, even after a dozen years in the field) at the things that

people in wheelchairs and with disabilities constantly figure out ways to do.


I think the correct way to word this is that we shouldn't totally exclude the

possibility of someone being able to participate in something just because

a)we don't think he can or b) the current rules don't cover the adaptations

needed. We should have open minds and try to think of ways to include as

many people as possible, without putting anyone at a level of unacceptable

risk. It is still likely that some people will not be able to participate in

some activities other than as a knowledgable spectator (and sometimes not

even then), but at least we will have considered the options instead of

dismissing them out of hand.


Brangwayna Morgan



Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2001 08:38:47 +1000

From: "Gwynydd of Culloden" <gwynydd_of_culloden at yahoo.com.au>

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


I am reminded of a close friend dancing with his blind girlfriend - it

was one of the simpler dances (or so I am told - I don't dance; my two

left feet are a major handicap!) and, in the bits where she had to go

back and forth, he clapped his hands so that she could find him easily.  

It seemed to work well and she enjoyed herself mightily!





Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 02:31:26 -0500

From: "JRMapes" <jrmapes at ckt.net>

Subject: Re: SC - special needs


From: "Stefan li Rous" <stefan at texas.net>

> Tristan commented:

> > Now if i could just find a way to overcome the height of those commercial

> > stoves in many of the kitchens i work in when cooking and helping cook

> > feasts ( that wouldnt be in the way of others in the kitchen).

> What do you do at home? Is it just the height of the stove that is the

> problem? Or that you can't reach to pots on the back burners.


I have no problems at home (non-commercial at home) the stove sets low

enough i can manage ok.


But it seems most commercial stuff is about 3 inches to 4 inches taller than

the average home appliance since there needs to be more floor clearance.


> What about something like the high bar stools? Could something like

> that be adapted for this? I think some have wheels if the problem is

> needing some mobility. And at the ones I've seen without wheels

> generally have seats that swivel.


Well without any use of my leg anything with wheels becomes a problem since

i have to grab and pull myself around and there is no contro of keeping it

steady. Taller things or chairs that raise on a 4 pt or 5pt caster system

scare me silly since i have absolutely no control whatsoever of where it

goes unless i grab hold of  something. And the swivel seats , i end up

fighting to keeo them in the corect direction or fighing them to stop when i

need the rotation to stop. its comical im sure seing me in one of those


If my foot is off the ground im free to move oposite of where im reachhing

or exerting force and if my foot is on the ground if i lean forward the

pressure my foot exerts onthe floor pushes me away lol.


> I don't know your limitations or skills, so I may be way off base

> here, but this is what I can think of, right now.


If someone had limited usage of their feet but couldnt stand for any length

of time then I think these may work well. But without feet or the lack of

use in both or one then its a fight vs forces to be where ya want to be when

you want to be there.


I was in one kitchen where the reg cook must have been a short person cause

what they had done was install a modified "behind the bar" floor. Basically

a drain thru floor.

luckily it was ran from one bank of stoves over about 6 feet to the sinks

and counters.

It stood about an extra 4 inches in height just below the kick boards on the

cabnets so the doors werent interfered with. It was a slight pain getting up

on it and going donw off it but once up there i had perfect access as at

home to stoves sinks and counter tops.

I priced these overlay floors in a supply catalog i receive and they were no

cheap by any means and to get enough so that i could manuver around withpout

fear of dropping off an edge while turning around or backing up was up into

the several hundreds of dollars. Then of course would come the packing them

from site to site. it would take a pull behind utility wagon on my car to do

it cause it would be like carrying 12-15 freight pallets around. Not very

convienient. but it would give me the room to bring all my extra cooking

gear i would like to have with me :-) Plus i suppose if i had enough i

wouldnt ever have to worry about wet floors again in my gp small tent with

or without the floor tarp lol (at camping events when they wouldn't be used

in the kitchen facilities).

But its a bit too much money to invest at the moment. I suppose temp

flooring could be built out of freight pallets but thenyou have the same

problem of hauling them and moving them around.




> Actually some chairs like these might be of use/interest to other

> cooks here who have trouble standing for long periods.

> --

> THLord  Stefan li Rous    Barony of Bryn Gwlad    Kingdom of Ansteorra

> Mark S. Harris             Austin, Texas         stefan at texas.net



From: "Jeff Gedney" <Gedney1 at iconn.net>

To: <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Subject: RE: [Sca-cooks] OT, OOP: Looking for a power source

Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2002 11:22:44 -0400


>    Phillip (my S.O., for those of you who don't know) has been

>    using a CPAP machine to help him sleep for the past 9 months

>    or so...and it has proved VERY beneficial, not only for him

>    but for me (he doesn't snore anymore!!!).  He would like to be

>    able to use it at Pennsic, but needs to find some kind of

>    battery pack to plug it in to as we don't have electricity in

>    our camp.  Any suggestions?  It would need to be 110V and run

>    for 8 - 10 hours before needing a recharge.  It would also be

>    helpful if it could recharge fully during the day...we would

>    ask the folks at Chirurgeon's Point to charge it for us.

>    If you have any ideas/thoughts, please let me know.


This problem is not that uncommon.

I have exactly the same thing myself.

The main thing you will have to consider is the pressure used...

CPAS machines with very low partial pressures like 5 mm h20 can go two nights

on one of those jumpstart battery packs with a built in 115 v plug...

My wife has a CPAP that uses such a low pressure. That is how I know.

I have a very high pressure (19 mm) and that same pack lasts me no more than

4-5 hours. It is very frustrating.


A lot of the people who have this problem use a car battery and a

power inverter ( you can get an inverter for about 30 dollars from

Harborfreight.com ) to turn the 12 volt DC power to a household type 115v AC

plug. The Chirurgeons point does have a power supply to charge it up (I don't know about battery chargers but I think they have one... Send a message to the

Chirurgeon in charge of the war) and they are completely familiar with the

problem. But you need to be considerate, as there will be a number of people doing the same thing, and demands for that resource are high.


I plan on making a battery pack using three gel-type or agm type (no-spill)

marine batteries, an inverter and plug, and a marine-type three-level

charger with charge indicator, all built into a sturdy wooden chest with

handles. It will cost me a lot of money about 500-600 dollars, but it should last the both of us all War. If I keep it properly maintained, it should work for many campouts to come. I view it as an investment.





From: Elaine Ragland <er37 at columbia.edu>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Mobility Assist at Pennsic

Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 13:11:19 -0500

Organization: Columbia University


On Wed, 17 Dec 2003, James Koch wrote:

> I realize this is slightly off topic, but this makes me wonder how

> people with disabilities got around in the middle ages.  I believe I

> have seen a woodcut somewhere of a man in a wheelbarrow, and I have

> seen plenty of depictions of people on crutches, but that's about it.

> In Roman times of course the well to do invalids had litters.


> Jim Koch (Gladius The Alchemist)


Dog cart or goat cart come to mind. Think of "Porgy and Bess".  Plus,

there's nothing to say that they had to "get around."  A skilled craftsman

could easily live in the back of his shop and send his servant or

apprentice on errands.


The extreme poor were, of course, dependent on charity.  I think there's

an archaeological dig in London working in the cemetary of a medieval

charity hospital.  They've found several skeletons of people who hobbled

around on their knees (possibly victims of polio).  But they didn't have

to go far--they were pretty much fixtures at the hospital.


Elaine Ragland

aka Lady Melanie de la Tour



From: clevin at ripco.com (Craig Levin)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Mobility Assist at Pennsic

Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:59:41 +0000 (UTC)


James Koch <alchem at en.com> wrote:

>I realize this is slightly off topic, but this makes me wonder how

>people with disabilities got around in the middle ages.  I believe I

>have seen a woodcut somewhere of a man in a wheelbarrow, and I have

>seen plenty of depictions of people on crutches, but that's about it.

>In Roman times of course the well to do invalids had litters.


Brueghel's Battle Between Lent and Carnival shows various

disabled guys-one on crutches, one dragging himself along the

ground by means of things that look like tiny sawhorses that he's

gripping in his hands, and yet another who's stuck on a sheet.

It's at:






clevin at ripco.com

Craig Levin                         Librarians Rule: Oook!



From: alchem at en.com (James Koch)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Mobility Assist at Pennsic

Date: 18 Dec 2003 21:23:14 -0800


> Brueghel's Battle Between Lent and Carnival shows various

> disabled guys-one on crutches, one dragging himself along the

> ground by means of things that look like tiny sawhorses that he's

> gripping in his hands, and yet another who's stuck on a sheet.

> It's at:

> http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/b/bruegel/pieter_y/carnival.html


> Pedro




Many thanks!  You actually missed describing the most important detail

of all.  If you look again at the painting you will clearly see a renaissance golf cart

"http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/b/bruegel/pieter_y/carnival.html";. So

you have actually provided documentaation.  It is in the center near

the well surrounded by fish mongers. Just up and to the right is an

emaciated individual being pulled along in a four wheeled wooden box.


Jim Koch (Gladius The Alchemist)



From: Chass Brown <chass at allegiance.tv>

Date: July 15, 2005 11:32:11 AM CDT

To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Re: Ansteorra Digest, Vol 26, Issue 50


     Since being placed in a wheelchair I am very vocal about this very

issue. To point out, I was very vocal with the Event stewards about

Gulfwars and how bad that site is for handicapped people. I wanted to

be able to bring my little golfcart, because it recharges alot faster

than my powerchair and wont get stuck like my powerchair. The response

from them was no, only powercairs, scooters or manual chairs, if I

didnt like it I could stay at home. It went before the BOD they decided

since their attnys backed up what I said they would blame owners of the

property after they had already admitted it was the Groups Decree not

the owners. So I mark Meridies and Gulf off my list. Since the site

rents to groups it alls under the federal guidelines that the site has

to meet min requirements. Example designated paths that are raised and

non slip. I refuse to do anything more than I already have but some day

someone will sue them and win.


   Any autocrat wants to know if a site is handicapped accessable. Get

a elcheapo wheelchair. Sit in it. If you as a healthy person can not

wheel yourself around the site and into all the bldgs and etc, then

what makes you think someone who is disabeled can? Ramps are a good

idea, but make sure they can handle the weight and are wide enough.

Another thing that urks me. I do not wish to have to depend upon others

for assistance. I want to be as independent as I can, telling me I have

to ask other to push me or wait on a "Taxi Service" to get me where my

powerchair can not. Also most need to know Scooters and powerchairs get

stuck SOOOOOO easy. They tend to loose traction and also the batteries

go dead quite quickly. It takes over 8 hours to charge the batteries in

my powerchair. Where as I can charge a golf carts batteries in 2 hours

and have a backup set of batteries since they use Car Batteries.


   I have been... Blackballed over my fight for my rights at gulf

wars. I care not if people hate me as long as I can make it a tad

better for someone else.


In Service of what the dream is for those in wheelchairs;

Chass aka Charinthalis Del Sans

Muddeler of Mead


----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert and Tara Brinsfield"

<trbrins at fullnet.net>

To: <ansteorra at ansteorra.org>

Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:29 AM

Subject: [Ansteorra] Re: Ansteorra Digest, Vol 26, Issue 50


> Dearest Baron Bors,

> Thank you so much for reminding our Kingdom populace of what can be done to

> accomodate ALL paticipants. I am of the opinion that it is a most valid

> point.


> As for the ADA legalities. You are so right about all of that. We should

> take ALL of our glorious membership into consideration. THe problem is that

> most of those that are disabled are forgotten about due to no one speaking

> up. Another event I went to, there was a gentleman that had to get around by

> means of a motorized scooter. His cabin reservations left him way down at

> the bottom of a steep hill that was almost impassible with his motorized

> scooter. He was in the cabin next to us. He was extremely courteous and very

> kind in all of his interactions with all of us from our cabin. It was a

> shame that better accomodations was not made for him and those that were

> there with him. It is a simple matter of common courtesy. It shouldn't even

> concern legality, if we just show one of the three basic traits that I feel

> the SCA should personify. As members of the SCA, we should ALL personify

> Chivalry, Courtesy, and Honor. If we aren't doing that to our full

> capability then we delineate on the dream that our game is based off of.

> Courtesy is so important. Not just in the SCA, but in mundane life as well.

> Courtesy is the key to all of the threads that have been talked about on

> this board of late. A little common courtesy can relieve a multitude of

> problematic situations. I think we all could do well with remembering

> that, myself included, ocassionally.

> Anyway, that is just my opinion. I figured that since everyone else was

> sharing one, I might as well toss my two cents in too.

> Lady Margeurite le Chanvrierre



From: MCothren <alyxthemia at earthlink.net>

Date: February 28, 2006 5:38:46 AM CST

To: undisclosed-recipients: ;

Subject: [Ansteorra] SCA:MULTIKINGDOM: Support list for those with illnesses/physical challenges / pain...Please pass along [members from every SCA Kingdom]


Please Share This Information with Those in Your Area. Thank You!


The group [guild] this message refers to is a peer support group for SCA

folk worldwide who live with Chronic Physical Illness and Chronic Pain

Syndromes, it is also for those who love/ care for them. [ friends and



There are scores of list members with conditions from A to Z [ illnesses

like Auto immune / Connective tissue disorders/ Fibromyalgia/ Crohn's

disease /Rheumatic disorders/ Arthritis [all types]/ Collagen Vascular

disorders/ RSD/ MS/ Carpal tunnel/ minimal brain injuries/

diabetes/Heart diseases / breathing disorders/blood disorders/ physical

infirmities/ epilepsy /  and any others not listed here ] Again, all

chronic, intractable physical illnesses / limitations and Chronic Pain

Syndromes are welcome and supported here.


The list  is a place to share tips and tricks for getting through the

day. It's also a place to get support [ hard to come by in the everyday

world and, sadly sometimes in our various "societies" too.] as well as a

place to learn more  about these various conditions from others who live

with them and from links to national associations for these disorders.


While this group is here for those with the disorders,  remember it is

also here for the loved ones, friends and family of people with these

disorders as well. In my humble experience, those who support us suffer

less anxiety and frustration with more information... and I wish it to

be a place that will allow them to share their burdens as well,

hopefully helping to reduce "caregiver burnout" , and thereby aiding

them to continue aiding us down our sometimes rocky paths to a "happily

ever after".


Group Page Address:



Group Email Addresses

Post message:AI_s at yahoogroups.com

Subscribe: AI_s-subscribe at yahoogroups.com

Unsubscribe: AI_s-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

List owner: AI_s-owner at yahoogroups.com


** There is also a "sister" group for those not active in the SCA [in

case of "mixed" marriages or family who is not conversant in "knowne

world speak"]. If you are interested in that list it can be contacted

through < owner-AIS at yahoogroups.com >



Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 08:13:10 -0400

From: Johnna Holloway <johnna at sitka.engin.umich.edu>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] On-line Pennsic Pity Party

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


> I have to wonder though, if camping as we do it will change significantly

> as our population ages. I already know a few folk who will get a  

> motel room near site and day-trip from there.

> 'Lainie, who really ought to be packing for Egils...


All it takes is an injury at a relatively young age and

moteling it becomes a necessity and not a luxury.

I can't imagine how many painkillers it would take

24/7 in order for me to be able to camp again. As it is,

I am the one who needs the handicapped parking spot at the

outdoor event. Even that tends to be a struggle, as most

autocrats never think about handicapped parking at an

outdoor event. Pennsic is an exception with a full crew devoted

to handling such things.





Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 12:20:28 -0400

From: chawkswrth at aol.com

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Jules/Catalina's Book, good bye

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org


> What was the URL for that SCA Autism e-list again?


Here you go;



It is not only for Autism. It is a list for folks who have certain  

special needs, who live with us in these Middle ages.

We have members who are speech impaired, visually impaired, hearing  

impaired, as well as with mobility problems.


Autism is a diagnosis that has exploded in recent years. In many  

cases, these are intelligent human beings who have problems  

functioning in and coping with the outside world the way normal  

people would. They have problems with sensory overload, and coping  

with the normal give and take of human life. The level of functioning  

can go from literally beating their heads against the wall, to the  

highest level of functioning, known as Aspberger's, where they are  

quite capable of holding good jobs, as long as they are highly  

structured. One I know is my age (50s), and a Librarian.  She was  

only diagnosed about 5 years ago. The pain and anguish she went  

through.... Many times, they are thought to be several bricks short  

of a load, extraordinarly self-centered, and so on. There is a  

medication regimen that will help. It is helping her. SHe did think  

of leaving, becuase of Certain People and their treatment. It would  

have been a shame, for she does AMAZING Byzantine needlework, with  




Soapbox? What soapbox?



From: Pug Bainter <pug at pug.net>

Date: March 25, 2007 8:41:24 AM CDT

To: "'Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.'" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] SCA, the ADA, and all of us


I'm gonna try to keep my dander under control again this time.


Here is a post I made on this two years ago about this topic, which some try

to get others to provide them service under a law that many laymen don't

understand. This is followed by the corporate policy from the governing

documents on accessibility which arose from what I think were unreasonable

requests for GulfWar 2 years ago.


This policy explicitly sites "while preserving the fundamental nature of the

SCA event". If the SCA were to deny you a generator while allowing others,

that would be against the ADA, but keeping an isolated environment from the

outside world to immerse people in the "mood" is completely reasonable. This

is just like allowing people the use of scooters at GulfWar without allowing

them their own personal golf cart as being reasonable.


As well, something to keep in mind when looking at sites is another item

from the FAQ:


The ADA is all about reasonable access and not *total* access. For example:


- not all parts of a restaurant have to be accessible


- not all bathrooms/stalls have to be accessible


- not all floors of a building have to be accessible


As well, the section that covers what we are talking about falls under the

ADA FAQ section at:


What are public accommodations?


A. A public accommodation is a private entity that owns, operates,

   leases, or leases to, a place of public accommodation. Places of public

   accommodation include a wide range of entities, such as restaurants,

   hotels, theaters, doctors' offices, pharmacies, retail stores, museums,

   libraries, parks, private schools, and day care centers. Private clubs

   and religious organizations are exempt from the ADA's title III

   requirements for public accommodations.


Please note that many of the private areas we rent, including religious

organizations, are explicitly exempt. There are restrictions on *new*

constructions to try to ensure they are compliant but not retrofit old sites

unless required by law. Some businesses and churches will try to make

reasonable accommodations under the ADA in order to be more diverse even

when they are not required to.


As for events such as Gulf War and Pennsic, there are services provided by

the staff to accommodate people who need assistance such as mobility

services. The ADA is *not* about making sure that a person can do everything

themself, but that there are measures in place *if* required by the ADA. It

is also *not* about giving them the easiest choice but a reasonable choice.




The SCA, Inc. will not discriminate against any member or participant on the

basis of race, sex, religion,


national origin, age or disability. The SCA, Inc. will comply with all laws

of the nation in which the meeting or


event is held. For any meeting or event held in the United States, the SCA,

Inc. will comply with the


Americans with Disabilities Act. The SCA, Inc. will provide reasonable

accommodations to qualified


individuals with disabilities to enable all participants to fully enjoy the

events whenever it is possible to do so.


The SCA, Inc. will at all times attempt to provide reasonable

accommodations, while preserving the fundamental nature of the SCA event.





From: Pug Bainter <pug at pug.net>

Date: March 25, 2007 8:54:20 AM CDT

To: "'Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.'" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] SCA, the ADA, and all of us


Sorry. This got sent a tad early. The section of the FAQ is:


Q. Are there any limitations on the ADA's auxiliary aids requirements?


A. Yes. The ADA does not require the provision of any auxiliary aid that

would result in an undue burden or in a fundamental alteration in the nature

of the goods or services provided by a public accommodation.


This means increased financial burden is a very reasonable exclusion to a

site within the context of the SCA. A small amount may not seem like much to

many people, but we have enough problems getting people to pay the increased

site costs because of the inflation of site costs, but every hundred dollars

a site costs could increase the fee people pay by $1 and lower attendance to

the point that the group doesn't make money.





From: Lisa <ladyemp at sbcglobal.net>

Date: March 25, 2007 9:56:20 PM CDT

To: StefanliRous at austin.rr.com

Subject: Re: link to ADA requirements for Parks and Recreation areas


This is the list of requirements for campgrounds also.




This first link concerns mostly buildings, but does cover any and all

buildings at all sites, including parks and recreation.




This second link covers everything regarding ADA accessibility.  There is a

section, I beleive in Title 2 that covers parks and Recreation.  If I find a

specific link, I'll forward it to you.


Elizabeta of Rundel



Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:38:20 -0700

From: "Anne-Marie Rousseau" <dailleurs at liripipe.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] How was Pennsic?

To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


On the runabouts...


One of my campmates got run over by one. No, really. Sounds funnier than it is....it put him out of commission for a bit.


If you use a motorized scooter, PLEASE be careful with it....same as a car.




-----Original Message-----

On Behalf Of Susan Lin


I believe there were a lot more of those "runabouts" this year than in past

and there are places to recharge batteries (right new Outland Royal/Your

Inner Vagabon).  People seem to get around quite nicely with those although

I didn't see any of them try to go through one of the mud pits.  As long as

you stay on the main roads that would work and she wouldn't be at the mercy

of the buses or disability services.





Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 14:09:20 -0500

From: "Chass Brown" <charinthalis at sbcglobal.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Service Animal

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


Helena that is not true any establishment or place of public accomidation

(yes the sca is a place of public accomidation) are entitled to ask 3



1) Are you disabled (note not able to ask the reason your disabled)?

2) Is that a service Animal?

3) What tasks does he perform to mitigate your disability? (also note doesnt

give them right to decide if task is good enough sample answers guide

animal, seizure alert animal, mobility assist, hearing alert animal, but if

you hear things like he helps me with my depression or he calms me down

those are emotional support animals and not covered by the ADA which is

where service animals are allowed).


I would honestly ask about the service cat. There is not honest proof of

service animals, well over 90% are owner trained. They do not have to have

certification (is against the law to actually ask for that). Service animals

are viewed as durable medical equipment. also falsly claiming an animal as a

service animal is against the law and is a fineable offense.


Chass who is Wheelchair bound but not bound to give up


----- Original Message -----

From: "Martha Sieting" <osermart at msu.edu>

<<< However, I think I remember seeing in the Pennsic rules somewhere that

horses are specifically prohibited (Though my memory may be faulty, and I'm

sure someone will issue a correction if necessary.)


-Helena >>>



Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009 21:20:27 -0500

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Pensic Mobility Options

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


Bjorn Magnusson Esping, Baron Namron, had burro's head on the front of his

mobility scooter.  He referred to his iron beast as Donkey Oatey.




<<< you will not be alone at Pennsic - I saw a woman with a horse on the front

of her chair this year. >>>


On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 12:32 PM, Chass Brown

<charinthalis at sbcglobal.net>wrote:


I decided I must .... fancy up my powerchair... so I am decking it out to

look like a chariot.. including hobby horses in the front. Since I am

roman by personna lol...





Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 14:56:58 -0600

From: Deborah Hammons <mistressaldyth at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Service Animal

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


<<< So how does one prove the claim is false if one is not allowed to ask why

the animal is needed or for proof of service?


-Helena >>>


One of our usual sites for events admits service animals only.  I called and

asked how they verify it.  Our wonderful site owner said they first look for

the working service animal vest.  They also notice whether the owner is

visibly disabled, and if the animal stays either leashed or close to the

owner. No puppies or kittens or birds.  This is indoors, and by and large

they prefer the service animals not go into the kitchen.





Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 17:44:58 -0500

From: "Chass Brown" <charinthalis at sbcglobal.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Service Animal

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


Diabetic alert animals are still not recognized by SCOTUS (Supreme Court of

the United States) as service animals yet but we are not giving up :). It

was a year and a half ago they finally realized Siezure alert animals should

be covered. Also be careful how you try to represent a dog... if you claim

its a service animal and you get challenged and the cops called and it

doesn't fit the criteria they can fine the heck out of you and drag you

before court. I am one who thinks ESA (emotional Support animals) should be

covered by the ADA I feel they provide a valid service. Scotus does not yet






Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 17:50:20 -0500

From: "Chass Brown" <charinthalis at sbcglobal.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Service Animal

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


Another area you don't have to dress your animal.. I do when he is out

working due to the fact he has greater protections under state law.

Interfering with a service animal is a major offense. As to how one judges

from another post.. its a judgment call to be frank. One could always look

up the proper skills for a service animal... and when in doubt pass the buck

up the chain for them to decide. We have a lady here with a Chi dog... this

dog wears a service dog vest.. and rides on her shoulder everywhere... when

you ask her what he does.. he helps her husband with depression (note this

dog is a ESA not a service animal) but I have never ever seen her husband

around or him with this dog. Tis just an excuse for her to bring her pet to

events. My Pyr is trained to unstick my chair.. go for help.. provide

transfer assistance and quite a few other tasks. Love my bear dog :). When

someone submits the answer he helps with depression, or any feeling you know

its not covered.




<<< One of our usual sites for events admits service animals only.  I called and

asked how they verify it.  Our wonderful site owner said they first look for

the working service animal vest.  They also notice whether the owner is

visibly disabled, and if the animal stays either leashed or close to the

owner. No puppies or kittens or birds.  This is indoors, and by and large

they prefer the service animals not go into the kitchen.

Aldyth >>>



Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 18:42:34 -0500

From: "Lisa" <ladyemp at sbcglobal.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Service Animal

To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>


<<< So how does one prove the claim is false if one is not allowed to ask why

the animal is needed or for proof of service?


-Helena >>>


There's the crux.... Most of it is attributable to common sense, something

that seems to be very lacking in this day and age *sigh*  Legally, service

animals do not have to be dressed or otherwise identified as service animals

by a vest or patch.  Having said that, most people who use service animals

will typically dress or somehow identify their animal as a service animal to

minimize confrontations.  Unfortunately, the fakes also prefer to

dress/patch their animals for the same reason.  Most times, the disability

is obvious, or the gear the animal wears gives it away, for example, the

harness with a handle used on guide dogs.  The best way to identify a

service animal is to observe it for a period of time.  A true service animal

will be observing and attending to their handler and ignoring everything

around it, unless it's duties require it to be alert to the environment

around it (guide dog or hearing dog).  Also, a handler of a service animal

who knows that they are legally entitled to a service animal will fight

being turned away the majority of the time, a fake who is trying to pass off

a pet as a service animal will not risk confrontation if turned away,

because they know that they are not legally entitled to what they are

claiming. Another good sign of a service animal is training.  A service

animal typically has exceptional behavior, and makes itself as unobtrusive

as possible.  It's rare to see a service animal act out, bark (unless it's

alerting to something and that's it's trained response) or have an accident

in a public place.  Any service animal that growls or snaps at anyone would

be retired by a responsible handler and can be removed from the premises

legally due to aggressive behavior.  





From: Amanda <artof9lives at yahoo.com>

Date: March 23, 2010 3:01:54 PM CDT

To: Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>

Subject: Re: Gulf Wars


Hello Stephan,

I am sorry I was not able to meet you.  Perhaps we will meet at another event in due time.  The manual wheelchair did just fine, i roamed a lot actually on my own.  Couldn't find a lot of the people i had met.  Now when it rained it did get very muddy and i dared not attempt to try it in the dark.  It is very difficult to see where the best land is located or if there is a twig or hole ahead in the dark.  Fortunately it was the end of my venture and i had some very nice men drive me to my car after the rain had died.   As for the manual wheelchair...it is doable.  Didn't try the land wet so i cannot give you information. I have been in a wheelchair a good while so i know how to handle one, I also am fairly strong in my upper body....so although i say the manual wheelchair is okay to use we must resist putting everyone in the same category. Each disability is different, each person is different.

Suggestions of site:

-All restroom doors should open outwardly (once the wheelchair is in you cant close a door)

-Dark areas stake some solar lights (during the day they charge, helps see the ground of possible obsticles, allowing people to use facilities in the middle of the night if needed)

-Troll building or any service building, provide a clear phone number or have people watching for people who cant use steps. Upon troll I couldnt get in the door or tell anyone i was out there.

tips of getting wheelchair through the sight:

The main reason wheelchairs sink is because of the small caster wheels in the front....it has nothing to do with the big wheels.  During the war you could see my popping wheelies in areas...i was lifting the smaller wheels out of the sand in order to get through.  When in assistance sometimes it is better to wheel a person in a wheelchair backwards to avoid the small wheels.  I reccomend wheelie bars on rough terrian or hills helps catch someone from falling backwards.  If there is a problem getting up a step these can be removed.  If someone lifts a chair do not hold the wheels.  Take one hand on the handle on the back the other on the frame where the feet are.  Holding the wheel causes the wheel to move.  Most peopl do not like being wheeled forward out of a step.  It feels like your falling out.  

I probably could help suggest more things that wouldnt be hard to tweak.  But my break is over, getting back to work.  I may write again if any of this information is helpful let me know.  I want people like me not to feel like they cant do.  




From: Anne <kosmikbubbles at gmail.com>

Date: June 16, 2010 2:30:10 PM CDT

To: Elaine Manyoki <emanyoki at yahoo.com>, trimaris-temp at yahoogroups.com

Subject: Re: [tri-temp] OT question...


<<< I have a question and thought I would ask if anyone here on Tri-temp would have an answer. I need to do some traveling in the fall, starting around Oct. 1, and am having a difficult time getting things co-ordinated with airlines, transport, and hotels, because the travel agent I contacted has zero experience setting up travel arrangements for a person with a motorized wheelchair. Apparently, the issue is with the batteries my chair uses, which are called gel batteries. I don't see the problem, and could really use the name or phone number of someone who is experienced in setting up travel for the handicapped. I traveled last year to Minneapolis, but did not take my motorized chair, I used a manual one. I have plans to go to Philly, Kansas City, MO, Denver, Minneapolis, and then come back home, and find some kind

of transport to Melbourne for a concert. In fact, most of the cities listed are concert stops. I am not allowed to drive because I have

seizures, so renting a van is kind of useless, since I no longer have a

drivers license. Can anyone help? I can tell you that the manual chair is not an option, because of rotator cuff repairs having been done on one shoulder, and waiting for repairs on the other. You can see my problem.


Thanks in advance if you can help,

Katya >>>


Why homeland security, it has nothing to do with airline travel..that is the venue of TSA.

I spent 45 minutes with them this morning.. they are a dud... my best

suggestion is for you to consider renting a w/c or scooter at each


See further down...better news..

ANYTHING to do with flying and what you can put on a plane, you need to

contact TSA.

The TSA rules are online.

but if you really must check... 877.266.2837  press 4 then do not press

anything you just have to wait thru the bs press this and that..you will get a live person who will not understand what you want and will put you on hold endlessly.. believe me, just did that this morning..


This company will rent you a motorized wheelchair in many cities..



http://www.disabledtravelers.com/travel_agents.htm   will help you find a travel agent for the disabled.


From the AIR-TRAN website

"For battery-powered wheelchairs and carts, we ask you to check in at the ticket counter at least one (1) hour prior to departure, so we can prepare the chair for loading. Some batteries are subject to dangerous goods handling. To help ensure the proper handling of your wheelchair and its components, we always appreciate written instructions and any special tools we may need that you wish to provide."


This page will give you ALL airline pages pertaining to disabled




From the Delta brochure on disabled travelers..


DOT Special Permit (more info on delta.com) allows some power

wheelchairs to be stowed in the cargo department without disconnecting the battery. To qualify, your wheelchair must have a dry cell battery, no defects or damage, stow in upright position and two methods to prevent accidental chair activation.

None of this was that hard to find... in fact much of it can be found via www.disabledtravelers.com


the delta brochure..



I just called Delta to find out about motorized wheelchairs...

888.750.3282,  options 2, 1  ---- oh good lord, I got pakistan... (rolls eyes)... and of course they have NO effing idea what a "motorized wheelchair"... I am asking if there is an extra charge for checking it as baggage..

good god, his accent is soooo bad I cannot understand him..hang on, I will find out more though..

ah... a supervisor who, is yet another pakistani who has no clue.. they can blow up a building, grow terrorists but they cannot run a call center with any vague sense of the word, competent.

So I ask for a supervisor... aha an American, who speaks english who

understands what I want..


NO charge for chair, must have 2 ways to disable.. need to know type of


wet cell they have to order a special box to put it in while flying.. Gell is fine...you can use your chair up to door of plane... attendents help you to your see via their 'chair' .. your w/c is last in., first out.. and you do it in reverse  when deplaning....  that is Delta.. I would suspect the other major carriers are the same..


I was going to post this to Katya back channel..but it seems worth putting out there..





From: jim at ryley.com

Date: December 22, 2010 7:18:27 PM CST

To: stefan at florilegium.org

Subject: Suggestion


I saw your page at http://www.florilegium.org/?http%3A//www.florilegium.org/files/DISABILITIES/Diabetes-SCA-art.html and thought this new site might be useful to you:



The site has PubMed/MedLine documents plus additional journals and a database of theses and dissertations, making it more comprehensive than any other free search site -- a great diabetes resource.


Documents can be found using a regular keyword search, but documents are also organized into clusters.  For example, if you want to review all the diabetes articles, you can check out the related categories here:



A link would be great if you have a spot on your site.





From: Lady Merl <marlowpeck at gmail.com>

Date: December 29, 2010 9:02:42 AM CST

To: The Triskele Tavern <the-triskele-tavern at googlegroups.com>

Subject: {TheTriskeleTavern} Re: Advice for First Timers to Gulf Wars?


If you have a disability and use a wheelchair or any other adaptive

equipment, bring an extra. My chair busted the first day at Gulf Wars

5, but I had my old chair on hand and didn’t miss a minute. Never get

rid of your old chair when you get a new one, my old chairs have saved

me several times in the past. Now that I am in a power chair, I take

my manual with me to every event.


If your vehicle has the spare tire in the well on the bottom, take it

out, pack other stuff there, load your gear and put the spare tire on

top. I went to Pennsic with my spare on the roof of my old Camry.


Lady Merl



Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 18:23:48 +1000

From: Yseult de Lacy / Chris Robertson

        <yseult_de_lacy at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] sedan chair or similar

To: The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list <lochac at lochac.sca.org>


On 13/04/2011 5:42 PM, Mathilde Hastings wrote:

<<< I'd like to bring my 96 yr old grandmother to festival for market day (to

show her what we do) the only problem is she can't really walk on grass. She

now uses a walker when outside.


Dose anyone in the Canberra/Sydney/Gosford area have something along those

lines that I could borrow (I'm happy to pick it up). or does anyone have a

really easy design of something I could knock up in an afternoon? (I have

reasonable woodwork skills and tools) >>>


Considering the age of your grandmother, I believe everyone could agree

to Just Not Notice a mundane wheelchair, which I believe can be rented

quite cheaply.  Also, wooden walking frames, complete with wheels at the

front, are quite period, though I've only seen'em for little children,

not the elderly.


(Or you could consider a simple calico cover for her modern frame, which

would then look like a director's chair with wheels.)





Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 19:43:50 +1000

From: "Sideshow Mel" <melinahall at optusnet.com.au>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] sedan chair or similar

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>


If she's keen to come, everyone will say Huzzah regardless. I reckon a sedan

chair or wheel chair or walker would be difficult in the crowded market in

the tavern tent, let alone over the uneven ground. I reckon a far better

idea is to find her a host of burly knights & blokes, to give her great

amounts of support on each arm, & take it turns.


I can think of a bunch of blokes who'd be keen to help escort a lovely lady,

such as Sir Gregory, Lord Jonathon, any burly bloke from Des Cartes, & a

host of others - names omitted don't mean they're any less willing or able!


So, large lovely lads, who would care to escort a lovely lady on market day

who's a little unsteady on her feet?


I reckon the best way to do it would be ask the stewards if you can drive

Gran right up to the tavern tent, & show her round then put her back in the

car there.


No-one can complain as the cars transporting kayakers trundle through all

the time anyway.





Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 22:18:14 +1000

From: Mathilde Hastings <mathilde.hastings at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Lochac] sedan chair or similar

To: "The Shambles: the SCA Lochac mailing list"

        <lochac at lochac.sca.org>


Thanks for peoples responses. Wheelchairs and walker aren't really good on

grass as small wheels don't go over grass easily (walker has wheels and the

front wheels of wheel chairs catch easily) otherwise I would go with that



Asa it is kind of you to offer Des Cartes, knowing the household fairly well

I know they'd be willing but picking her up and carrying her without a chair

is more likely to hurt her.


Previous years there has been disabled parking next to the troll behind the

tavern, I'm assuming this will be the case again (if anyone knows

differently let me know). My mother is going to bring my Grandmother down

and mum uses crutches to get around so the both have cripple parking



I'm thinking Thant Grandma might be best walked by Gabrielle and myself to a

chair where she can sit and watch the goings on, I'll play grandma by ear -

previous years she's said no to coming but this time my mum is staying at

her place and  coming so i figure we've go more chance.


Mathilde Hastings (AKA Kat)



To: SCA Newcomers list <scanewcomers at yahoogroups.com>

Subject: Re: Children

Posted by: "christopher chastain" ckchastain at hotmail.com draqq0nis

Date: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:59 am ((PDT))


<<< As I said before I am a single mom to a very imaginative ADHD five year old boy. When I attend events it will be alone with Richard (my son) in tow. Any advice?


Angie >>>


As far as children and the SCA go let me tell you about my son Liam, he has ADHD and Aspbergers. Everyone in our shire knows Liam and his issues and so do most folks at the kingdom level. He has been accepted with open arms, issues and all. The group I'm with has the philosophy of it takes a village and is something we cherish and do everything we can, not to abuse.


Yours in Humble Service,

Pomestnik Dmitrii Ivanov



Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 19:36:15 -0400

From: JR <novothule at gmail.com>

To: atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org

Subject: Re: [MR] People banned from SCA events


I have seen what Dughall-Eoghann is talking about. There is a guy in my

canton that we were worrying about for the same reasons, but we did as

Dughall-Eoghann is now suggesting and it worked for us in that

situation. After a few months of doing that, the guy in my canton

returned to his doctor and with the help we had given him he had grown

socially. His doctor then realized that things he thought were symptoms

of a mental problem were only social issues this guy had never been

taught. So this canton member I was referring to was rediagnosed as not

having the 3 problems he was receiving medicine for. It turns out he has

Asperger syndrome instead, and the other medicines he was receiving were

only making things worst. Now that he is no longer over medicated, and

we know what he is dealing with, this canton member is on his way to

becoming an archer. In other words to make a long story short; I think

Dughall-Eoghann is right and that as long as we know what this guys

problems are, we can work around them.


JR's 3 C's: Courtesy, Chivalry, and Cheesecake


On 6/29/2011 6:32 PM, Douglas Grant wrote:

<<< I was present at Storvik Novice and spent a great deal of time in the person's company that is under discussion...apparently he found my willingness to listen to him and talk about things totally OoP a pleasant activity.  And I found that he was willing to help, if given simple and concise directions, and more than anything was seeking acceptance into a culture where he felt needed.


I think that if he were to be taken under the wing of a patient and understanding Waterbearer or A&S enthusiast (something both active and interactive), he could become a productive member of our community.


Dughall-Eoghann LeGrannd >>>



Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 10:24:28 -0400

From: Rick Allison <threeallisons at hotmail.com>

To: Merry Rose <atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org>

Subject: Re: [MR] Thanks for the responses, banned people--RE:

        Atlantia Digest, Vol 101, Issue 95


Apparently there were some extenuating circumstances that made it appear that this individual was a "safety" issue to himself and others.

No actual laws or rules were broken.  People at the event and other events were concerned for him and so after discussing among themselves and with Kingdom level officers, they decided to ban him from events for his own safety.


I understand the "concern" issue, and do not in any way suggest any wrong-doing or intolerance.


As an experienced scoutmaster (with some special needs training) and long time SCA participant, I have encountered these types of special people as adults and as children.

In fact currently in our Kingdom there are many such special folks and children with the same or very similar symptoms as the individual who is being "Banned".  


Yes, these types of gentles can be very un-schooled and distracting, time intenive and perhaps boorish or even scary.

But who has not met "normal" SCA folks who are the same and have just as much disregard for customs, courtesies, and SCA mores.

I have seen many extremely bad examples in the SCA from food scavengers at feasts and events, to fast motorcycle drivers and dangerous car use, to outright physical issues.

Yet unless these actions or activities break a mundane law or seriously and actively endanger the safety of others they are not banned.


Special folks are the same, the main difference is the time and energy needed to teach them, with many repetitions and constant reminders.

Physical activities within their focus works, as do single or small teams that are familiar to teach and train them.


As given in an example of a case on this list, profound advancements can be made due to our stylized mores and customs.

We offer a true safe environment for the different, the disenfranchised, the over-achievers, those who don't fit quite comfortably in mundane society.

We have customs of high courtesy, ritualized activities for chivalric prowess and honors for study, arts, sciences, and service.

We reward the adherance to our rules and customs with awards and recognition.

This is something those who have special needs desire and seek.  


As a believer in the dream and chivalric duty I stand as the first to offer myself as a named mentor for these special folks.

This is not a purely single group activity as can be seen by the case which opened this discussion, many good gentles outside the barony he resided in had concerns.

Thus I propose a standing group of mentors and guides not just for special members but for anyone who needs extra attention and assistance to play the dream and enhance our own play.  A contact list to be provided with members in every group of the Kingdom these gentles can contact when they travel to any event or group.

This is ours and theirs safety net.  Perhaps this list and the named mentors could be managed under the Chirugeon or the A&S or even the Seneschals.


Please dear Peers, Royalty, Lords and ladies, and populace, consider my plea and consider being part of the solution.


In service to the dream and the Ideals;


Laird Seanne Alansyn, squire to Viscount Raym Y Hyndyll,

Member of the Silver Guard of Drachenwald, Holder of the Queens sigil for chilvalry,

Holder of the Princes gauntlet, incipiant marshal Free shire of Roxburymill



Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2011 22:54:51 -0400

From: Dexter Guptill <3fgburner at gmail.com>

To: Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>, Merry Rose

        <atlantia at atlantia.sca.org>

Subject: Re: [MR] Eyeglasses!


On Mon, Jul 4, 2011 at 9:21 PM, Stefan li Rous

<StefanliRous at austin.rr.com> wrote:

<<< What did they know about cataracts in period? Did they even know it had to

do with the eye lens? Even if they did, there probably wasn't anything they

could do about it.


Stefan >>>


Actually, they did know it was a clouded lens.  Surgery involved

sticking a needle into the eyeball to shove the lens out  of the way.

It didn't let people actually see again, but did let them perceive

light, dark, and shadows.



is an illustration of Western European and Middle Eastern procedures.

The source website is a bit sensationalist (take with multiple buckets

of salt) but the pictures themselves are period.


If you're at Pennsic, take Master Michael Graham's class on the

Medieval Barber-Surgeon.


Erich von Kleinfeld, mka






Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:35:34 -0700 (PDT)

From: koldune <koldune at yahoo.com>

To: atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org

Subject: Re: [MR] People banned from SCA events


As someone who has an Asperger's Syndrome diagnosis personally, I can testify to

just about everything said below. Human psychology and its identifying

mannerisms are largely a mystery to me. I could pass an academic exam on

psychology if I studied it, but apply what I've learned to dealing actual

people? No way! The methods never work for me the ways the theories describe.

I'm better off than most people with the same diagnosis, though, possibly

because I'm older than many others with it (55), so I've dealt with it longer.

My mismatch with others has never been a huge problem in the SCA, as far as I

know, and I've been active off and on since 1975.


Mostly, I've had to tell myself that some misunderstandings are simply going to

happen around me. I've gotten used to dealing periodically with someone reacting

badly or strangely (to me) to something I've said or done, because they've read

something into it that I didn't realize might even be there. People wonder why I

don't simply "get" social cues and the like, as they think everyone should.

(Compared to the military, the SCA people who don't understand are tame. In

uniform, when I was there years ago, if you weren't communicating with those

around you, you were considered deliberately negligent. I believe that my

military colleagues wouldn't have believed that a disability, instead of an

attitude problem, there was possible.)  Social miscues and blindnesses have

become simple fact of life that I resolve as needed. I don't really understand

having one's feelings hurt, either, beyond that most of the rest of humanity

works that way, so it's something I need to factor in around others.  I've also

learned that I do better keeping my mouth shut, unless someone asks me

something, because I rarely manage to sync well?beyond small talk, which I find

boring?with most conversations that anyone else considers worthwhile. My wife

can testify, too, that I'm usually not aware of what my voice tone sounds like

to her. I don't remember verbal instructions well, either, but I do very well

with detailed, written ones.


Perhaps the most positive way I have to look at all this is that my point of

view is different from the average, and that can sometimes be useful. I try to

see my viewpoint as a sort of musical "harmony" with those around me, rather

than a perfect match. Having singers do harmonies, instead of all of them

sounding the same note together, often adds nice dimension to the end result. I

think of myself as doing the same for those around me. And, like someone else

recently on this thread, I don't really care who knows about me.


Darri Kveldulffson, Seneschal, Abhainn Iarthair



Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2011 08:41:32 -0400

From: Andrew Ragland <andrew.ragland at gmail.com>

To: atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org

Subject: Re: [MR] Asperger's Syndrome


I've avoided this entire thread thus far, but here's a link that might

be of interest. Essentially, there's a prototype device that interprets

facial expressions and gives you a red or green light in the frame of

your glasses based on how well things are going. For the record, I'm

borderline Asperger's myself, with a few other issues on board for the

ride. I'd be delighted to have this device.





From: Beth Alexander <bealexan at gmail.com>

Date: July 15, 2011 9:49:06 AM CDT

To: the-triskele-tavern at googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: {TheTriskeleTavern} CPAP help at camping events


On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 10:11 AM, Rurik <rurikps at cox.net> wrote:

<<< This article, by Master Phillip the Pilgrim, came across one of the Facebook groups I'm on and I thought it would be helpful to people who use CPAPs and other medical devices at events.


http://www.moyen.org/CPAPatPennsic.pdf >>>


I am also a CPAP user and there are now units available that have battery adapters for the device. I spoke to my supplier and when my device comes up for replacement next year my insurance company will replace it with the battery enabled one (The battery is only attached when needed) because it is considered to be an emergency support item.

So don't forget to check with your insurance company and your medical equipment dealer. New models are being developed all the time.




From: Bonnie Booker <aspasia1 at gmail.com>

Date: July 18, 2011 5:57:54 PM CDT

To: the-triskele-tavern at googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: {TheTriskeleTavern} CPAP help at camping events


I have been told there is a new CPAP out that is battery operated, 2 C or D batteries. It is about the size of a shaving kit. I'm allowed a new one every 5 years. It can also run on electricity. This is what I'm hoping for next time.


Maistresse Aspasia

Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2011 11:28:58 +1000

From: Raymond Wickham <insidious565 at hotmail.com>

Subject: [Lochac] two books on disability in medieval times and its


To: lochac <lochac at sca.org.au>


Metzler, Irina.  "Disability in Medieval Europe: Thinking about

Physical Impairment during the High Middle Ages, c. 1100-1400".

London and New York: Routledge, 2006.  Pp. viii, 355.  $39.95.  ISBN



Eyler, Joshua R., ed. "Disability in the Middle Ages:

Reconsiderations and Reverberations".  Farnham, Surrey and

Burlington, VT: Ashgate, 2010.  Pp. xi, 235.  $99.95. ISBN 978-0-7546-




Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2012 03:19:55 -0500

From: "Terri Morgan" <online2much at cox.net>

To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] [Bulk] Re:  I'm Teaching at Pennsic 2012 !!!


<<< On the day you get there go to Handicap Services and register with them.

You can then make a reservation for someone to show up at your camp

with a golf cart the morning of your class and carry you and your gear

up to the class area. >>>


Unfortunately, this is no longer something that we can afford to do. There

will be carts travelling the bus routes (Pennsic's version of a city's

"Handicap assistance buses") but pick -ups and drop-offs at individual camp

won't be happening. It wasn't supposed to be happening last year but things

got confused. We won't even be picking up/dropping off people who need to

get their batteries up to the charging station unless they are waiting on

the bus route. The carts is ONLY* be travelling the bus route.


I know this because I'm this year's Mobility Assistance coordinator.


The best advice I could give is to see if there is someone who is brawny and

would like to be your experimental food taster, who'd be willing to pull a

wheeled cart to the bus route area or to the University classroom for you

and back again. Heck - *I* have a cart I would be happy to bring to you to

use - I can schedule my own store runs around your schedule! (For you to be

teaching, I'd give up my strong cart, yes I would.)



*capitalized merely because others might skim over what I just wrote and I'd

really like for it to not be a surprise to anyone at Pennsic-tide.



Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 02:30:12 -0500

From: "Terri Morgan" <online2much at cox.net>

To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] handicapped services carts at Pennsic


<<< At the risk of kicking a hornet's nest, can you tell us why this change?


Is it literally a monetary concern? Complaints about the overuse of

non-medieval carts? Not enough volunteers to man the carts for such

pick-ups? Has the number of handicapped folks at Pennsic taken a

sudden leap upward? Complaints about joy-riding royals finally

causing some changes?


The use of carts has been controversial since I joined the SCA 20+ years

ago, so I'm curious what has changed?


Thanks,    Stefan >>>


I cannot speak for the Mayor, or the policy makers, of course. But this is

my understanding as an individual:


It's supposed to have been the policy since the hay wagons went away but

most staff members are soft-hearted "we're here to help you" folks so

observation of the rule has been hit or miss. And every once in a while, we

did try to find a way within the rules that would let us expand services.


Mainly, yes, it is financial.  Golf carts are NOT inexpensive, and the

two-seaters are more expensive than the single-bench ones. Also, we already

do use an incredible number of carts, and are tapping out the local

resources for them - not too many golf cart rental places are thrilled about

renting to us, given the length of our use and the way that we use them.

We're not riding around on a nice manicured lawn only in daylight!


Since the inception of the busses, we've been in the same sort of situation

as a city with bus service would be in - there are a few folks who simply

cannot get into/out of a standard bus who need some form of auxiliary

transportation. By federal regulation, if we provide service to 'the general

population', then we must also do so for those who are handicapped. However

- and this is a big however - we are only required to provide equal service,

not "over and above the general population" service.


Each time we transport someone outside of the bus routes, we are,

essentially, using SCA funds to benefit an individual since we are using gas

and our 'rental time' to their advantage over those of the rest of the

event-goers. It is not really fair to give on-demand rides to one person,

for whatever personal reason they have presented, and to deny the same

service to someone else. And logistically (and this has been a huge

complaint, and a valid one) if we only have two carts travelling the bus

routes to provide handicap rides, but they are instead travelling

willy-nilly all over the grounds giving on-demand trips to people, then

those folks who are patiently waiting at bus-stops, following the rules, are

left ignored - and without the federally-mandated service we are required to

provide. And they often end up angry and exhausted. And - because this

happens - once they learn that other folks have been 'signing up' for

special ride service, then in self-protection they begin to do the same, and

our resources become stretched to the breaking point. And still we have

unhappy people wanting what has essentially become free taxi service.


People forget that in our ability to form a fairly well-run small town,

however temporary it is, that we are still just campers in a primitive

camping area. It is camping. Even when we have a downtown, two (or is it

three?) theatres, a market district and a University. We're still on a

campground, living in tents.


And here's my hard-nosed view, as someone who does have difficulty with

mobility and who even needs a crew to set up her camp nowadays (this is

totally a personal opinion): Problem-solving needs to be the purview of the

individual who has the problem. Most members of the SCA are smart, creative,

and able to think through walls. Give any of them enough time to be aware

that they have a need or situation that needs solving, and they will solve

it. So it is sort of my mission, this year while I have this particular job,

to get the word out as soon as I am allowed* that there are situations folks

need to address and that the resources of the event will not be responsible

for solving. We will offer special transportation to those who are unable to

ride on the busses. But that service will be in the same category as the

service we offer every other camper on the grounds. And I know that with

sufficient time to think about it, folks will find solutions that will

address their own needs.


I solved my own problems in ways that may not suit others. When things are

beyond my husband and my abilities,  I have a crew of folks who I 'hire' to

set up/take down our camp and reimburse them through means that are in my

reach. (Often this means cooking for them, or sewing garb. or buying cases

of beer). I no longer, for example, travel into the camping areas that are

far beyond my own grounds. I just plain don't have the ability to walk that

far and be able to count on walking back without collapsing on the side of

the road. But I have learned the bus routes. J  And I now have a sturdy

fold-down wagon (the one I offered to lend) which can carry 200 pounds of

cargo and has big enough wheels to deal with the rough terrain. It can carry

my folding chair, which I can set up on my own. Were I less heavy, I'd be

investing in one of those cool canes that convert into a seat so I'd know

that if I had to wait at a bus stop for however long it takes, I'd be able

to do so without becoming too exhausted. (I did have one, and loved it, but

ended up giving it to a friend who was in greater need and lesser in girth

than myself.) Now, I do what I do because I'm fiercely independent and cavil

at asking for help. I imagine that most folks reading this are of the same

sort of mind. "Do for me!" is NOT the mindset of a cook!




*had to wait for the official rules to be finished being written.



Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 03:20:49 -0500

From: "Terri Morgan" <online2much at cox.net>

To: "'Cooks within the SCA'" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] handicapped services carts at Pennsic


I forgot to address this

<<< Has the number of handicapped folks at Pennsic taken a sudden leap upward? >>>


Oh yes. Majorly. And often, now, it's not so much someone with mobility

issues as it can frequently be someone who expects a ride for themselves and

their battery (for a CPAP machine) to and from the charging station. I

cannot even estimate how many folks are now using one of those. Our

electrical needs at the charging station has (I believe, going from memory

of last year) doubled and even that wasn't enough.


As a Society, we're aging. And yet we all still love Pennsic enough to

continue attending. But how many of us, now, out of the SCA population have

no problems walking long distances over uneven ground? And in the way of

things, the campground itself has gotten larger, while our instructors for

University (for example) are older than they once were and at the same time,

are able to offer classes that require more than a sheet of paper and paying



If I were able to, which I assure you I am not, I'd see about renting one of

those tram-things specifically for the University - and schedule trips to

pick up (pre-signed up) instructors every two or three hours, each day until

the last class time. Specifically for instructors only, controlled by the

University chancellor, and rented *only* for the days when it is open. And

if I could even come close to arranging such a thing, I'd work on some sort

of fundraising effort so its funds would not be dependent on the event






To: scanewcomers at yahoogroups.com

Subject: Re: SCA with a child on the Autism Spectrum?

Posted by: "i_love_latin" restuart at bellsouth.net

Date: Thu Apr 5, 2012 8:30 am ((PDT))


Everyone's given you really good advice so far, but I thought you might want to hear the perspective of someone who has SPD. :)


I would imagine that it probably helps that I spend most of the louder events wearing a large metal hat stuffed with foam...helmets tend to block out sound. Which makes it difficult enough to understand what people are saying even if you don't have issues filtering sounds through your brain. I think it also has probably helped that as a fighter, I had to get used to the sound of my helm getting hit, which can be very loud, and which I still tend to overprocess if I don't see it coming; nevertheless, you learn to anticipate things (like loud sounds), which, for me at least, makes all the difference in the world.


SCA events are loud, but the ones without tournaments going on aren't so bad at all. There are Academy sorts of events in which the Great Hall may be loud-ish, but you can go to a nice, quiet classroom whenever you want and learn about something fascinating that goes on in the SCA. As for tournament events, I'm not sure how I'd be able to deal with them if I weren't fighting. The outside ones are usually better because you don't get the sounds echoing through a giant hall, and often there will be an indoor part of the event for classes or merchants or the feast that you can sit in if it gets too loud outside. But I think it helps me knowing what's going on and being interested in watching because the sounds mean something specific and I can see where they're coming from. I'm not sure how old your son is, but if you think he'd be up to it, you might see if he wants to try youth fighting.


Let's see, what have I forgotten?.... Court is interesting but can get boring if it goes on too long or if you don't know anyone getting awards, so people tend to start getting fidgety as time goes on, which can be really distracting visually and aurally. Often, though, there will be a few people who aren't at court, or who are moving in and out making the feast or whatever, and you'd be fine to step out for a bit if it got to be too much. Feasts are loud; I'm not sure how universal this is for SPD, but I at least tend to be able to tune out loud noises when they are coming from everywhere because they just sort of mush into really loud white noise. The problems I run into at feasts are not being able to hear the people across the table over said white noise (which I think is just a problem generally) and sitting next to someone who eats loudly. Since the general noise tends to drown out most things, you pretty much only hear the people next to you, so if the way they eat doesn't bother you, you're mostly fine. And feasts are pretty relaxed, so you can definitely step outside if you need a break, and there won't really be much of anyone wandering around elsewhere making noise.


I hope that helps! Let me know if you have any more questions :)




Alana Goodewyn



Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2014 04:38:56 -0500

From: Garth Groff via Atlantia <atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org>

To: Merry Rose <atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org>

Subject: [MR] New Book on Disability in Period


Just received at the UVA Fine Arts Library: SOCIAL DEMINSIONS OF

MEDIEVAL DISEASE AND DISABILITY, edited by Sally Crawford and Christina

Lee (ISBN 9781407313108; our call number R141 .S63 2014). Now normally

we don't do plagues and such in the SCA, but they are a legitimate area

for study. This book is a compilation of short articles which explore

various social aspects of disease in several medieval cultures. The

articles are: Social Dimensions of Medieval Disease and Disability; The

Unhal and the Semantics of Anglo Saxon Disability;  Invisible Enemies:

The Role of Epidemics in the Shaping of Historical Events in the Early

Medieval Period; The Madness of King Sigur?r: Narrating Insanity in an

Old Norse Kings' Saga; 'He was not an idiota from birth, nor is he now':

False, Temporary, and Overturned Charges of Mental Incapacity in

14th-century England; Disabling Masculinity: Manhood and Infertility in

the High Middle Ages; Speechless: Speech and Hearing Impairments as

Problem of Medieval Normative Texts - Theological,

Natural-Philosophical, Legal; Leprosy, Lepers and Leper-houses: Between

Human Law and God's Law (6th-15th centuries).


I had time to skim part of the chapter on temporary insanity, and found

the case histories fascinating. At that time in England, if someone was

insane, their property came into the hands of the king or his appointed

agents as guardians. Officials were sent to examine the person suspected

of insanity. If the alleged insane person was found competent, their

property and all profits from it during the guardianship were returned.

These are interesting facts, the sort of small-time history that is

nearly always overlooked in books that only focus on battles and royal



Most of the articles are accompanied by extensive bibliographies. Sadly,

there are no illustrations. For background, and general cultural

history, this book would be of great interest to many Scadians. This is

part of the BRITISH ARCHAEOLOGICAL REVIEW, and won't be available

through most bookshops. I suggest having your local library borrow it

for you through interlibrary loan.


Lord Mungo Napier, The Shire of Isenfir's Unofficial Librarian


<the end>

Formatting copyright © Mark S. Harris (THLord Stefan li Rous).
All other copyrights are property of the original article and message authors.

Comments to the Editor: stefan at florilegium.org