lea-bladders-msg - 8/3/98
Tanning animal bladders. dressing and cleaning them.
NOTE: See also the files: bagpipes-msg, lea-tanning-msg, leather-msg, butchering-msg, instruments-msg.
KEYWORDS: medieval instruments bladders tanning cleaning leather period
************************************************************************
NOTICE -
This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.
This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.
The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.
Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).
Thank you,
Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous
Stefan at florilegium.org
************************************************************************
From: shawnjoh at uoguelph.ca (Shawn Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Using Cow's Bladder
Date: 14 May 1998 19:13:20 GMT
Organization: University of Guelph
I went to the Abbatiore today and asked for some cow's bladders. I
recieved 6 fresh off the press and dripping (yuck).
I need them for a couple of medieval instruments I am developing. One of
them involves inflating the bladder.
My sources say that the bladder must be dressed or cleaned. Does anyone
have any idea how to do this?
I have wrapped the fresh bladders in many layers of plastic bags and
placed them in the fridge. I need an answer soon! :)
Also, what else were animal bladders used for in the middle
ages/renaissance? Just curious :)
Thanks for any help you can give!!
-Robyn Whystler...
From: mclean1382 at aol.com (McLean1382)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Using Cow's Bladder
Date: 14 May 1998 22:37:34 GMT
I don't think the lime method is right for a bladder. Lye or lime are used to
get the hair to come off of a skin. This is not necessary for a bladder.
I think a buckskin recipe would probably be better since buckskin comes out
softer and more pliable that other treated hides.
First, get all of the little veins and other icky bits removed without tearing
the bladder.
My source says to use the animal's brain to treat the buckskin. I assume it
didn't occur to you to grab a few brains while you were there, so you could use
"soft soap" instead. If you don't happen to be an avid soap maker, you can
make do with a bar of yellow laundry soap shaved into bits and dissolved in
water. My source says to use 1 bar of laundry soap to 2.5 - 3 gallons of hot
water. Soak the skin for 4 or 5 days. I suppose a bladder would need less
time. Rinse well.
If you _are_ using brains, you make a paste of brains and warm water. Slather
the bladder on both sides with the paste. Roll it up and store in a cool place
for two days. Rinse well and wring as dry as possible.
Next, you have to work the bladder continuously while it is drying. The idea
is "somehow to pull, twist and strtch that hide in every possible direction to
loosen the fibers of the grain". Some suggestions are to pull it back and
forth other a beam or stump, scrape with shells or stones, or it it is small,
work it by hand.
If you used the soap method, grease it with animal fat, dunk it in soap
solution, rinse again, work again. "By now it should be possible to squeeze
water easily right through the skin. If it isn't sof or if you have hard spots
moisten and work while drying agin until you are satisfied."
Buckskin is then smoked to improve its durability and appearance. Green
hardwood is the preferred smoking source. A buckskin takes 1 or 2 days to
smoke. I am not sure that it would be necessary or desirable to smoke the
bladder if the point is for it to be elastic. Since you have 6, you could try
different recipes to see if any of them work.
My source for this is "Carla Emory's Old Fashioned Recipe Book". Obviously not
medieval, but the best I could do. Good luck.
Wendy McLean
From: shawnjoh at uoguelph.ca (Shawn Johnson)
Newsgroups: rec.org.sca
Subject: Re: Using Cow's Bladder
Date: 18 May 1998 01:15:22 GMT
Organization: University of Guelph
Here's an update on my dealings with cow bladders:
I took one of the bladders, which was very fleshy, over to the laundry
utility sink, and started to play with it (having donned rubber gloves)
to see what I could do. I could feel a membrane with a little more
solidity deeper inside the mass, so I figured this was the bladder.
Having located the orifice, I stretched it over the mouth of the tap and
filled it with water. It got to be about the size of a balloon but
certainly no bigger. It was much easier to separate the fatty connective
tissue and blood vessels from the bladder within this way. I began using
a cheap exacto style knife, much like a scalpel in dissection class, and
it worked quite well to separate the connective tissue, until i tore the
bladder. The whole operation was much like separating the skin from a
chicken breast. Eventually I was able to separate most of it from the
damaged bladder.
Despite the damage, it was still useful in size to make rommelpots (a
type of friction drum ... clay or wooden vessel, with a bladder or skin
head into which is affixed a stick. Rubbing the stick causes the
membrane to vibrate and get delightful sounds (snicker) as well as peals
of laughter from the crowd.
Unfortunately my experiments with the bladders so far have no been
entirely successful. The bladder becomes quite dry, and very much like a
thin celophane in appearance and texture. First glance and touch it's
hard to think it's anything but synthetic. I affixed the bladder in two
pieces to two different pots when it was still wet, and the pieces dried
on the pots. The interesting thing is that the bladders stuck like glue
to the pots, and while I tied them onto the rims, this wasn't necessary
when everything was dry. THe bladder became quite fragile .. and with
some use throughout the next day, both split. Perhaps some oily before
or after drying is necessary. It could be that rommelpots made with
bladders were only a temporary carnival instrument, and those made with
skins were more permanent.
Because of this exiperiemnt, I find it hard to understand how bladders
were used on bladder pipes. I would think they constructed like many
folk bagpipes, by using leather ... but perhaps the inner membrane was
bladder for waterproofing. They are extremely water and air tight. And,
they are quite strong when wet.
For my next project (not a bladder pipe), I will need to inflate the
bladder to make what is called a "bladder bow". Basically it's a kind of
spike violin, whereby the bladder acts as a resonator wedged between a
stick and the string.
I have only one period (before 1600) picture at my disposal .. I have
seen quite a few 17th and 18th century examples recently. I'm sure,
however, in my more distant pictorial wanderings, I've seen bladder bows
pre-1600. Any help on this, or the whole process would be appreciated :)
-Robyn Whystler
Date: Sat, 20 Jun 1998 07:24:36 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Par Leijonhufvud <parlei at algonet.se>
Subject: Re: SC - Help on an Adventure (slightly OT)
On Fri, 19 Jun 1998, Michael P Newton wrote:
> (since I don't know where else to ask) is how does one tan/cure a pig's
> bladder? Getting the bladders shouldn't be a problem since our shire
> seems to be in a pig roast mood lately.
ISTR seeing a bladder (from a sheep or deer) that was tanned with bark.
Here's my stab at the procedure.
1. Rinse and inflate the bladder, and hang up to dry. I suppose you
might get away with just rinsing if you plonk it in the tanning solution
straight off.
2. Place in a tanning solution made from any tannin containing plant
matter. Simply boil or steep the material at hand until it is as strong
as tea that has been left to draw _way_ too long, and is undrinkable.
Let the solution cool to body temperature before putting your bladder in
it. Possible materials: bark from oaks, salix (willow, etc), or even
plain tea (finally, a use for Liptons Yellow Label Crud^H^H^HTea!).
Tannins are in lots of plants, and you can't really mistake the taste.
Some plants add a color to the skin, but that might not be an issue in
this case.
3. The bladder needs to be in there (possibly with some changes of
solution) for anything from a week to months, but most likely a week or
two would be quite sufficient, thinking of how thin it is.
4. In order for it to dry soft you need to work it while it dries.
Either work outdoors, or spread a towel over your lap and do it while
watching TV. Just roll, stretch gently, and bend until it is thoroughly
dry. If you need to take a break place in a plastic bag in the fridge,
or freeze if it is more than a couple of hours involved.
/UlfR
- --
Par Leijonhufvud parlei(at)algonet.se
Subject: Re: SC - bladder tanning (long)
Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 17:00:28 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Par Leijonhufvud <parlei at algonet.se>
To: Stefan li Rous <stefan at texas.net>
> I think a buckskin recipe would probably be better since buckskin comes out
> softer and more pliable that other treated hides.
I would recommend the tannic acid based methods: when you buckskin tan
hides one of the tests for "doneness" is that they let air throught
readilly!
> Next, you have to work the bladder continuously while it is drying. The idea
> is "somehow to pull, twist and strtch that hide in every possible direction to
Don't twist, at least not with real hides.
> hardwood is the preferred smoking source. A buckskin takes 1 or 2 days to
> smoke. I am not sure that it would be necessary or desirable to smoke the
Last time I smoked a deerhide it only took a few hours...
Aprt from this I'm not sure buckskin is documentable to the middle ages.
/UlfR
--
Par Leijonhufvud parlei(at)algonet.se
<the end>