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lapidary-msg - 6/9/09

 

Period and SCA gemstone cutting.

 

NOTE: See also the files: A-Lapidary-art, gem-sources-msg, amber-msg, jewelry-msg, pearls-msg, beads-msg, beadwork-msg, coronets-msg, PW-Jewelry-Box-art.

 

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NOTICE -

 

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

 

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

 

I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.

 

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.

 

Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

 

Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: jjohns at tc3net.com

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Period lapidary techniques

Date: 19 Aug 1996 17:24:05 -0700

 

Does anyone know of sources for period lapidary techniques besides

Theophilus? His info is ok, but I'd like some alternatives to prepping rock crystal by warming it in goat's blood - you get the idea.  Any more practical info would be most welcome.   Thank you

 

Alasdair MacRaibert a'dun Alasdair

(Tom Johnson)

jjohns at tc3net.com

 

 

From: ddfr at aol.com (DDFr)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period lapidary techniques

Date: 20 Aug 1996 14:23:03 -0400

 

Alasdair asks:

"Does anyone know of sources for period lapidary techniques besides

Theophilus? His info is ok, but I'd like some alternatives to prepping

rock crystal by warming it in goat's blood - you get the idea.  Any more

practical info would be most welcome.   Thank you"

 

1. You are unfair to Theophilus. He also describes practical techniques

for shaping and polishing stones, including the use of powdered emery,

attaching the stone to a dop stick with something rather like modern

dopping cement, etc.

 

2. Take a look also at Cellini's _Art of Goldsmithing and Sculpture_ or

something close to that title. He certainly discusses "improving" stones

by making colored foils to put behind them; I don't remember if there is

anything on actually cutting the stones.

 

David/Cariadoc

 

 

From: Alasdair MacRaibert

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period lapidary techniques

Date: 21 Aug 1996 19:18:58 -0700

 

In article , ddfr at aol.com says...

>1. You are unfair to Theophilus. He also describes practical techniques

>for shaping and polishing stones, including the use of powdered emery,

>attaching the stone to a dop stick with something rather like modern

>dopping cement, etc.

 

Your Grace Cariadoc,  The reference to Theophilus was made as a poor joke.

When I read 'On Divers Arts', I made a joke with my lady on how they would

accept carving of rock crystal by his methods at a kingdom A&S competition

and whether it would be considered a science or a performing art. :-}

I do intend to try his recipe for chaser's pitch and his grinding techniques.

 

>2. Take a look also at Cellini's _Art of Goldsmithing and Sculpture_

 

Thank you for the reference and I will take a look at it the first chance I get.

 

I have two other possible references if you're interested. The first comes from a Dover edition book called ' The Book Of Trades' which shows a series of wood

cuts published in 1568. One of the pictures is of a gem cutter using a treadle

powered rock grinder, but has no text description of methods.

 

The other reference is more empirical. In the July 1990 edition of National

Geographic, they have an article on emeralds. In that article they show a scene

from modern day India and a row of bow driven rock grinders in use. I would

assume that this design might be a predecessor to a treadle powered machine.

 

There seems to be very little research or period reference on the subject of

lapidary. If you should come across any other information, I would appreciate

the information.

 

Thank you,  Alasdair MacRaibert/Tom Johnson

 

 

From: ddfr at aol.com (DDFr)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period lapidary techniques

Date: 22 Aug 1996 22:13:42 -0400

 

On the subject of period lapidary techniques. All of the following is from

memory; I am travelling and my library is not.

 

1. I believe water driven wheels are recorded at Idar-Oberstein a little

before 1600.

 

2. Traditional Persian technology (not necessarily period) used a bow

driven lathe. So does modern Indian; I have one, although I have not used

it. So did classical technology, at least for gemstone carving. So I think

a bow driven lathe is a fair guess for period Islamic technology.

 

3. One question I do not know the answer to is whether the bow driven

lathe turned in one direction, with the operator raising or lowering the

bow to release the tension for strokes in the opposite direction (which

seems the obvious way to me), or whether it was reciprocating, which seems

to be the way that the somewhat similar spring lathe works.

 

4. Traditional Persian technique also uses a pump drill; I have seen it

done in Isfahan. I suspect that is period also, although I can't prove it.

It could be used for drilling and, perhaps, engraving gemstones.

 

5. You might want to look at my old article on gemstones, published long

ago in T.I. but also in the Miscellany that Elizabeth and I publish, which

is also accessible (minus the figures) on the web.

 

David/Cariadoc

 

 

From: zarazena at io.com (Vicki Marsh)

To: ansteorra at eden.com

Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:00:56 -0600 (CST)

Subject: Re: Good Enough? (Was Using

 

Sigrid Eiriksdottir wrote:

>I will do what I can for documentation at Laurel's prize tourney. Maybe

>someone there can point me to a reference or two.

 

Sigrid, do you have a public or university library nearby?  When I live in

Austin, I know there were quite a few books in their libraries about

lapidary and jewelry, as I often did a lot of the research on jewelry-making

for my ex-husband.  Also, some of the jewelry and lapidary shops will have

some books (like Dyers in Austin).

 

Sometimes, the How-to books are a place to start, as they often have some

history of the craft in the introduction.  If so, look at their

bibliography/references, for the next place to look.  

 

Keep looking

Zara Zina

 

 

From: afn03234 at freenet2.afn.org (Ronald L. Charlotte)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Period Lapidary Sources...

Date: 2 Nov 1996 06:01:02 GMT

 

susankford at aol.com (SusanKFord) wrote:

> Does anyone have any books or other sources on period lapidary. I can do

> it with modern tools, but would like to know how it was done B>E>

> (before electricity...)

 

The one with the most useful information is _On Divers Arts_ by

Theophilus (ISBN 0 486 23784 2).  It's widely available in Dover

reprint. Others include a smattering of info in _The Treatises of

Benvenuto Cellini on Goldsmithing and Sculpture_ (ISBN 0 486 21568 7).  

There are a few others with small bits and pieces, and there is supposed

to be a Renaissance treatise on lapidary, but I've not found it yet.

--

    al Thaalibi ---- An Crosaire, Trimaris

    Ron Charlotte -- Gainesville, FL

    afn03234 at afn.org

 

 

From: william thomas powers <powers at cis.ohio-state.edu>

Subject: Re: Estrella Dust

To: markh at risc.sps.mot.com (Mark S. Harris)

Date: Sat, 22 Mar 1997 09:56:47 -0500 (EST)

 

> What's a "cab"? I'm assuming it is a cap of some type. I thought at

> first this was a mis-spelling but you wrote it this way several times.

 

Sorry, a bit of jargon there---"Cab" is short for "Cabochon" which is a

style of gem cutting.  Instead of having flat facets the stone has a smooth

dome shape---much more a pre-renaissance cut for stones.  In this case

the smooth domed quartz crystal provides a "window" to protect the item

in the reliquery but allow it to be seen.  (There are several ways of mounting

them everything from soldering in a bezel to using an engraver to raise an

edge.

 

wilelm the smith

 

 

Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 10:37:54 -0600

From: Kathleen Keeler <kkeeler at unlinfo.unl.edu>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Re: most usual semi-precious gems?

 

Anna Troy wrote:

> Well I've started to work on my circlet and I was planning on adding som

> small semi-precious carbochons. Which stones are no-no's for the 14th

> century? Were any more popular than the other or was it still the mish-mash

> that I've seen in earlier medieval work. I was planning on blue, red and

> maybe green stones depending on weither it will be 4 or more.

>

> Anna de Byxe

 

Modern stones are separated by chemistry--since in Period they didn't

have that tool, they mixed up some stones we distinguish:  rubies and ruby-like

garnets were not separable, for example.  Likewise, some

of the natural glasses and quartzes, when colored like emeralds (or other

stones) were mistaken.  If there was faceting (ie if the precious gem had a

different number to faces than quartz) or hardness differences--they didn't

make mistakes.

 

  See Cariadoc's Miscellany (online see SCA home page).

 

  Avoid jade (not mentioned in Period lapidaries)

 

The Early English Text Society has a volume (#190, 1933) which reprints 7

Medieval English lapidaries.  They are all based on Continental lapidaries,

are derivative and repetitious.  Green stones mentioned in addition to

malachite include jasper, phrase, selenite, red include heliotrope, hyacinth,

sard. I'd characterize it as  "lore of precious stones" but

it gives some sense of what stones they knew and used.

 

I did a composite translation of the information in the lapidaries- not so

much scholarly as entertaining, I understand a scholarly translation is in

progress -- from the very difficult English of the originals to modern

English. If you  would like I can email you the text

(its maybe 10 typed pages.)  The original is better, but much more difficult

to read and not very easily available (big university libraries and ILL).

 

Agnes deLanvallei, Mag Mor, Calontir

 

 

Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 21:34:50 -0700

From: Twcs <no1home at encompass.net>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Re: Sunstone/Iceland Spar/Andalucite

 

<snip of modern mineral and gem info>

 

When is comes to equating a classical or medieval name of a rock

to a modern mineral, one needs to tread carefully.  Nowadays, we

usually associate one mineral name to one distinct crystalline form

of an inorganic compound.  For example, rhombahedral calcium

carbonate is calcite, whereas orthorhombic calcium carbonate is

aragonite. Aragonite is what pearls are made of, by the way.

 

In the middle ages, however, rock names were assigned on the

basis of physical properties, usually color and/or chemical action.

For example, both colorless topaz (Al2SiO4(F,OH)2) and diamond

would be called adamant.  Similarly, the common hydrous sulfates

of iron, zinc and copper could all be used to make sulfuric acid,

and therefore were called green, white and blue vitriol respectively.

Alum is the worst, actually.  Medievally, practically every white

hydroxenated or hydrous aluminum sulfate which occured naturally

and made a sweet-sour astingent solution  when dissolved was

called and used as alum.  There are over 20 modern minerals which

medievally were used as alum.  (So if you've ever been confused

by medieval shipping records which differentiate between Egytpian

or Tuscan alum, know you know why...)

 

Unfortunately, threre's a great deal of confusion still concerning

the use of gem names.  Yellow topaz is also called citrine, but so

is yellow quartz.  Occasionally, yellow quartz is passed off as

topaz. Cat's eye, a variety of crysoberyl is often confused with

tiger's eye, a quartz replacement of fibrous crocidolite. There are

many more examples.  The ones that really get me fired up are when

someone tells me about a "red sapphire" or a "blue emerald,"

especially in context of buying gems or jewellry.  Sapphires are

by definition the blue variety of corundum, and emeralds are

the green variety of beryl.  Red sapphires, blue emeralds and their

like are often either marketting ploys or cases of outright fraud.

 

Basically, correctly identifying a medieval rock name with a modern

mineral is a mess.  I find it frustrating, and I do min id professionally.

I can't imagine what it must be like for folks who aren't rock geeks.

I'll give those who are interested a foot up, however: if you can find

a seventh or EARLIER edition of Dana's Manual of Mineralogy, you

will find that each mineral entry contains a history of what is was

named and by whom, including classical and medieval sources.  The

early editions of Dana, however, are all nineteenth century, so they're

hard to find (try a university library - that's where the copy I use is

located). The Hoover and Hoover commentary to Argicola's De Re

Metallica is also helpful (it's included as part of their translation of

Agricola, and is available from Dover books).

ttfn, Twcs

 

 

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:57:45 -0400

From: Warren & Meredith Harmon <ravenleaf at juno.com>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Caro's List of Gem Books

 

Here is my recommended list of books - your mileage, of course, will

vary. Opinions expressed are only my own.  I hope they help....

 

The Audubon Society Field Guide to North American Rocks and Minerals,

Charles W Chersterman, is a good field guide for those like me who like

to go digging in the field.  The pictures are excellent, definitions,

locations, etc.  It was my first rock/mineral book, and I consider it my

best book.

 

For a specification in gems, even though it's a little on the easy

side...Eyewiness Handbooks' Gemstones: The Visual Guide to More Than 130

Gemstone Varieties, by Cally Hall.  ISBN 1-56458-498-4.  This is the book

I carry when selling gems, because it can explain to almost everyone what

they are looking at...or what they may want.  It's arranged by color

*and* composition, which is quite handy!  Unfortunately, some of the

remarks are a bit generalistic for Scadians...I keep asking myself,

"yeah, I know the Egyptians used fluorite to carve scarabs, but how, why,

and what location did they get it from?!?"  But *excellent* pictures of

faceted and carved and cabbed gems, with pics of some famous gems through

history.

 

For pictures alone, most of them period...Gemstones, published by

Streling Publishing Co, New York.  Excellent shots of some of the more

exquisite jewelry pieces through history (one of these days I *will*

duplicate that Sumerian crown!!!).  ISBN 0-8069-6834-6.

 

For those with a more chemical mind...Minerals and Gemstones of the

World, by G Brocardo.  It's a Naturetrek Guide, ISBN 0-7153-0197-7.  Each

mineral has a chemical analysis, but it's written with the layman in mind

(which I appreciate, even though I have a chemical background.)The charts

at the bottom of each page give a quick visual of the chemical properties

of each item...including clevage, hardness, color, mineral class,

specific gravity, fusibility, occurrence, luster, solubility, use,

preservation (which is great for display cases!) powder color, flame

color, toxicity, etc.  Each overleaf can be folded so you can have a

side-by-side comparison with the page you're interested in.  Excellent

stuff!

 

Now for those who are more interested in the metaphysical

properties...Love is in the Earth: A Kaleidoscope of Crystals Updated by

Melody. ISBN 0-9628190-3-4.   Almost every rock, gem, and mineral known

to mankind is in here, but I have some caveats: 1) It's written as if you

actually know a little about mineralology, 2) You have to take one

person's word for what's written - it's difficult to corroborate

metaphysical info, 3) It doesn't use standardized names...black agate

from one location is given a different name than black agate from another

location. Of course, this ticks me off royally, but they at least

attempt to use location prefixes to the names...well, sometimes....  4)

Some of these rocks you won't find outside someone's imagination.

 

And, here's my general caveat: whether or not you believe in the

metaphysical properties of rocks and minerals, please treat them as you

would any other medical item.  Some people *will* have allergies, and

some people will *not* react as the book says.  Please keep that in mind,

and treat people and rocks alike with respect and caution.  Okay, my

lecture's over.

 

Also, for those thinking about getting into collecting or just want more

info: if yo uhave a Border's or a Barnes & Noble or a Feed & Read

Bookstore or...well, okay, you get the point - go and browse through

their rock & mineral section.  You may find one that suits you quite

well, and you get to thumb through them yourself.  That's what I did, and

I came up with these "gems" (heh!) on my own.  But, good luck, and happy

hunting!

 

-Caro (herkimer hunting in four weeks!!!!)

 

 

Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:04:41 -0700 (PDT)

From: H B <nn3_shay at yahoo.com>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Arab Roots of Gemology

 

In the current issue of _Gems & Gemology_, there is a book review of a

new English translation of _Best Thoughts on the Best of Stones_ by

Ahmad ibn Yusuf al Tifaschi (1184-1254), translated with comments by

Samar Najm Abul Huda, Scarecrow Press, Lanham, MD, 1998 US$45.00.

Review is excerpted here.

 

-- Harriet

 

"One important aspect of gemology is the history of gemstones.

Unfortunately, a wealth of early works have been lost to modern

gemologists, as evidenced by the number of gem references sited in

Pliny's first-century encyclopedia that have disappeared without a

trace. Although much of the knowledge possessed by ancient Greece and

Rome was preserved by Arabic writers, for the most part such works

remain inaccessible to all but the few western scholars who have

learned Arabic.

 

"This compilation offers a fascinating glimpse at ancient gemology,

according to the book _Best Thoughts on the Best of Stones_, by Ahmad

ibn Yusuf al Tifaschi (1184-1254).  Its translation marks the first

time that early Arab gemological literature has been studied by a

modern Arab gemologist.  Mrs. Huda is a competent translator who has

endeavored to make the contents of this pioneering work easily

accessible to English-speaking readers.  She aimed the book at 'all

readers interested in gemology, mineralogy, jewelry, history, Arab

heritage, Islamic art, and the history of science.'  In the reviewers'

opinion, she has accomplished her goals with great success...."

 

"...includes a glossary of gem names in English with their ancient and

modern Arabic names...places al Tifaschi's work in context by

describing the era in which he wrote and the nature of the Arabic

literature on gems from the eighth to the 13th centuries....explains

the monetary terms, weights, and measures employed at that time...."

 

"For each gemstone, al Tifaschi briefly describes how the gem is

formed; its localities, qualities, characteristics, benefits (mostly

medicinal and talismanic), and prices; and, in some cases, its lapidary

treatment...."

 

reviewed by Si and Ann Frazier, Lapidary Journal Correspondents

 

 

Date: Mon, 19 Jul 1999 02:35:58 -0400

From: Warren & Meredith Harmon <ravenleaf at juno.com>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Re: Rose-Cut Garnets

 

As far as my research shows, the only cuts used in period were cabbing

(for any gem they could get their hands on) and some tabling of diamond

crystals around mid to late 15th cent.  From what I've been told, and

seen in museums, the rose cut is just a smidge OOP.  I haven't gotten my

mitts on good pics of the Crown Jewels, though, and my bet is that if

anyone has it, it's them - England had quite a nice pipeline to India for

good gems for awhile.  Also, let me check a Natl Geographic mag from a

while ago - they actually got some Shahs to open up the coffers, so I'll

see if anything's visible there.

 

Cameos, intaglios, beads, cabs...hmm, no faceting besides tabling...

 

(.....)

 

Okay, just checked: *Some* of the emeralds in the Iran Crown Jewels

**may** have been tabled, with a few side factes thrown in for effect.  A

rough emerald cut, if you will.  There is *one* good picture from the

Zucker Ring Collection (he collects "antique" rings) that shows what

looks to be a ruby, and it's **roughly** emerald cut (tabled, then four

rough angles that go below the bezel).  I'm pretty sure the ring in the

middle shows a diamond crystal mounted as is, and there's a ring at the

bottom of the pic that shows 7 cabbed garnets or amethysts.  Another

shows a rough-set opal, and another a cabbed lapis, and another is carved

straight from lapis and sports a seated ram - Etruscan, IMO. One ring may

*possibly* show a heart-shaped garnet set in a gold hand, but that ring

looks to be Victorian in age.  Most of the Zucker Collection is Arabic,

Jewish, and Middle East rings...except for the hand ring, and the carved

carnelian ring it's resting on, the rings in the pic don't look to be any

later than the 1400's.  If you want to see this pic (great ref), check

out Smithsonian Magazine, July 1997, Vol 28 No 4, page 73.  And, if

ANYBODY gets their hands on some of those orange pearls, GET ME

ONE!!!!!!!!

 

-Caro

 

 

Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 22:30:35 -0500 (CDT)

From: <timbeck at ix.netcom.com>

To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu

Subject: Rose Cut Garnets

 

Rose cut is documentable to the 16th cen.  But from what, I have seen, only diamonds were rose cut.  There is plenty of documentation for faceting of stones from at least the 13th cen.  But the facets are not the same.  They are more based on shaping the stone [rather] than creating reflected light. Square or rectangular stones typically have four "facet" faces and a flat back.  Stones were carved for millenia and they were rubbed into shape and polished for the majority of our period.

 

Diamonds were cleaved and polished by the 15th cen.  Rose cuts diamonds were in late period.  Facets as we know them today really developed well after our period. If I had a book around I could be fill in a bit more detail.

 

Timothy

 

 

From: Lissa McCollum <lissamc at primenet.com>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: 15th c. jewelry/gems question

Date: Mon, 03 Jan 2000 00:51:55 -0700

Organization: Forest Moon Creations

 

Mary Osmanski wrote:

> A novelist friend of mine asked me the following question:

>

> I need some suggestions of what the main stone that would have been in

> a necklace made in the mid to late 15th century. It would have been

> created, perhaps in Spain during that period. Also the estimated worth

> now would be in the two to three million dollar range. Where and when

> it was made is open to change. The one thing that isn't is the name of

> the stone The Eye of Dawn.

>

> My suggestion to him were ruby or emerald.  Does anyone here have any

> more authoritative suggestions?

 

I know that there was at least one pendant of 3 rubies that was named.

That was 'Three Brothers', captured by Carles the Bold from the Swiss

in 1476. That pendant also had a diamond and pearls in it. Another stone

that was popular in that time period is the sapphire, which would go

nicely with the name chosen. Yet another possibility is the red spinel,

known as balas rubies. The 14th century 'Black Prince's Ruby' was one

of those. Lets see...amethyst, coral, rock crystal, amber, emerald,

turquoise, and garnet were all used. Stones would have probably been

table cut, or polished as cabochons, though there is evidence of

diamond faceting as early as the mid 15th century. I have no idea

which stones would be worth that much nowadays, unless they were

intact in a famous piece like the 'Three Brothers' pendant.

 

Gwen

 

(reading from 'The Necklace' by Daniela Mascetti, and 'Jewelry' by

Clare Phillips)

 

 

Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 00:52:11 -0500

From: "RANDALL DIAMOND" <ringofkings at mindspring.com>

Subject: SC - SC- Semi Precious Stones and Pearls

 

>>>I have put a small bibliography on lapidaries and their history online:

  http://staff-www.uni-marburg.de/~gloning/steinbib.htm

PLEASE, email me your additions and corrections!<<<<

 

Quite an admirable biliogaphy, Thomas!   I would hardly

call it small though.  You might add the following:

 

Leonardi, Camilli , Speculum Lapidium, Venetia, 1502.

Cardani, "De subtilitate," Basileae, 1560.

Baccii, Andreae, "Da gemmis et lapidibus pretiosis," Latin trans.

        by Wolfgang Gabellhover, Francofurti, 1603.

Boyle, Roberto, "Specimen de Gemmarum, Origine & Virtutibus,"

        Cologne, 1680.

But most especially:

Kunz, G.F. & Stevenson, C.H.. The Book of the Pearl: the History,

         Art, Science and Industry of the Queen of Gems, Century

        Company, NY, 1908,  Reprinted by Dover, NY, 1993.

 

George Kunz has several more books, I don't have at hand

for biblio information, but I believe one was titled,

Shakespeare and Precious Stones (1916)

Also check out John Sinkankas for more technical

data on stones.   Kunz and Sinkankas are fairly

acknowledged as the two leading authorities on

gemstones of the twentieth century.

 

Akim Yaroslavich

 

 

Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2000 14:22:23 -0400 (EDT)

From: Jenne Heise <jenne at mail.browser.net>

Subject: Re: SC - Gemstonesy

 

> >>>  A further consideration is that something labelled "synthetic X" may

> >>>  actually be "synthetic Y in a color that looks like X." Many

> >>>  synthetic gemstones are either corundum or spinel, colored to match

> >>>  whatever they are supposed to be.

 

Part of that is because a proportion of gemstones ARE corundum (rubies,

sapphires etc)  classified by the color they are. :) Furthermore, the

situation in period was even more murky: Red spinel would in fact be a

period 'ruby' as they didn't have the same sophisticated classification

schemes and tests we do: hence 'The Black Prince's Ruby', which is a

spinel.

 

I would suspect that for our purposes, if the synthetic process resembles

the process by which the gem is created in nature, it is probably a

reasonable substitute: cultured pearls for pearls, etc. Since we aren't

practicing the same kind of symbolic magick based on value the original

users did, having the same chemical make-up ought to be enough.

 

An excellent period work on gemstones available in translation from

Scarecrow Press is:

_Arab Roots of Gemology: Ahmad ibn Yusuf Al Tifaschi's Best Thoughts on

the Best of Stones_ Samir Najm Abul Huda. Scarecrow Press, 1997. $45.00.

ISBN:0-8108-3294-1

It's available directly from Scarecrow at:

http://www.scarecrowpress.com/Catalog/

 

Jadwiga, who doesn't know all that much but a) has a friend who is an

amateur lapidary and b) knowns where to look it up.

- --

Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise       jenne at tulgey.browser.net

 

 

From: "William Black" <william.black at hotmail.co.uk>

Newsgroups: soc.history.medieval

Subject: Re: Small Things

Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 08:14:02 +0100

 

"celia" <c_a_blay at hotmail.com> wrote in message

> It's not difficult to think of Anglo Saxon gold work with fine

> sharp engraving on it, what the tools were made of is

> impossible to tell, but they could do the job.

>   I'm sure you've engraved metal, there's a knack to it,

> but a sharp tool is essential

 

It's actually easier to get a sharp edge on a softer material,  but it

doesn't last as long.

 

Modern gravers and scorpers are usually made of a good quality steel with a

ground edge.  You have to grind your own edge as the tools are far too long

when you get them.  Some of the new Swiss scorpers are made from a much

harder 'tool steel' and hold their edge for much longer, but they're much

more difficult to grind down and sharpen.

 

When I was doing my diamond setting training I was told not to use the

harder scorpers because a diamond setter's scorpers need a very precisely

positioned cutting edge and the harder tools are very difficult to sharpen

properly unless you're very experienced.

--

William Black

 

 

From: "William Black" <william.black at hotmail.co.uk>

Newsgroups: soc.history.medieval

Subject: Re: Small Things

Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 12:09:56 +0100

 

"celia" <c_a_blay at hotmail.com> wrote

> This is true and they are more user friendly  but there is

> no way that even modern hard tool steel could engrave

> hard gemstones so is this a case of the notorious

> secretiveness of lapidaries ?

 

There's a picture of St Eligious in the British Museum book called 'Medieval

Goldsmiths' and he's using a scorper exactly like one of mine,  complete

with mushroom shaped handle with brass ferule.

 

Not sure how fine they could make them and they're obviously not as

consistant as the modern ones but medieval tool making was pretty good if

you were paying serious money...

 

Also a goldsmith should be able to make their own tools,  but making gravers

and scorpers is pretty tedious stuff,  you have to shorten,  mount,  grind

and sharpen them yourself even these days, and that's not fun either...

 

There are a couple of ways to engrave gemstones.  One is to mount another

harder gemstone on the end of a dop stick and use that as a graver,  but I

am informed it's dead eay to slip.  The other is to put a mask over the bits

you want to keep and use a rubbing technique to remove the stuff you don't.

Obviously today people use a sand blaster or a tumbler with an assortment of

media loaded into it.

--

William Black

 

 

From: "celia" <c_a_blay at hotmail.com>

Newsgroups: soc.history.medieval

Subject: Re: Small Things

Date: 17 Jul 2006 04:25:10 -0700

 

William Black wrote:

> "celia" <c_a_blay at hotmail.com> wrote in message

>

> > This is true and they are more user friendly  but there is

> > no way that even modern hard tool steel could engrave

> > hard gemstones so is this a case of the notorious

> > secretiveness of lapidaries ?

>

> There's a picture of St Eligious in the British Museum book called 'Medieval

> Goldsmiths' and he's using a scorper exactly like one of mine,  complete

> with mushroom shaped handle with brass ferule.

 

This one ?

http://www.wga.hu/art/m/manuel/eligius.jpg

St Eligius is the one with the hammer.

The halo is a dead giveaway.

 

> Not sure how fine they could make them and they're obviously not as

> consistant as the modern ones but medieval tool making was pretty good if

> you were paying serious money...

>

> Also a goldsmith should be able to make their own tools,  but making gravers

> and scorpers is pretty tedious stuff,  you have to shorten,  mount,  grind

> and sharpen them yourself even these days, and that's not fun either...

>

> There are a couple of ways to engrave gemstones.  One is to mount another

> harder gemstone on the end of a dop stick and use that as a graver,  but I

> am informed it's dead eay to slip.  The other is to put a mask over the bits

> you want to keep and use a rubbing technique to remove the stuff you don't.

> Obviously today people use a sand blaster or a tumbler with an assortment of

> media loaded into it.

 

I'll go with the dopping method, the other would only work on

soft stones with shallow engraving.

The trouble with dopping wax is that it gets brittle in cold

temperatures. A point of stone set in a wooden handle

even if then reinforced with dopping wax to keep it steady

would be better. No problem, it's only a finer version of

an agate burnisher and they were used from a very early date

for setting stones and smoothing leather, I've made one in the

past and it beats metal for burnishing.

Celia

 

 

Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 23:40:41 -0500

From: chawkswrth at aol.com

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] OT OOP Diamonds  was tedious process

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

Diamonds have been found all through the ages, dating back to the  

Pharaohs. Basic diamond cutting was available even earlier then the  

16th century, just not the many facets you see today.

I apologize-I do not have my books handy, or I could give you a  

clearer history.

 

Helen

Old dryed up Jewelry Sales Manager-type (Thankfully retired and more  

steadly employed)

 

THLord Stefan li Rous asked:

<<< Do we know what areas diamonds were found in, in period? Since  faceting of

jewels was a late period invention, did diamonds even  rank high on the scale of

precious gems in period? >>>

 

 

Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:14:11 -0600

From: "Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps" <dephelps at embarqmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] OT OOP tedious process

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

Regards diamonds, they were know to the arabs in period and are mentioned in

at least one period book I can recall in translation.  If I recall correctly

diamonds in the US's northeastern and northern part of the midwest have been

found as the result of glacial float out of Canada from the last ice age.  A

small number have turned up in North Carolina over the years but as to where

those came from no one knows.  Arkansas has a diamond "pipe" that is

accessable to the public.  Periodically gems of several carats turn up

there. What with global warming there have been diamond "strikes" in  

Canada and Greenland relatively recently.

 

Daniel

mka Daniel C. Phelps, P.G.

 

 

Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:50:37 -0600

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] OT OOP Diamonds was tedious process

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

Diamonds appear to have been found originally in India and Borneo.  They

were known in Antiquity and the original finds are probably prehistoric.  I

suspect the original finds were alluvial diamonds (washed out of the matrix

rock and found in river sand).  Later finds are more diverse geographically

and are usually associated with the erosion of igneous rocks to expose

deposits of Kimberlite, a type of peridotite.  In 1970/71, I was in a

prospecting class taught by Leo Mark Anthony, one of the best mining

engineers in Alaska, when he showed slides of a series of Kimberlite pipes

he had found in British Columbia while prospecting for tungsten.  I

occasionally wonder if he wasn't the person who started the Canadian diamond

industry.

 

In the 1st Century CE, Pliny associates diamond mining with Ethiopia,

Macedonia, India, Arabia, and Cyprus.

 

Diamonds were considered valuable because of their rarity and their

hardness. A stone that can cut metal and other stones has amazing value.

To quote Pliny, "The diamond, known for a long time only to kings and then

to very few of them, has greater value than any other human possession, and

not merely than any other gemstone." and "When a diamond is successfully

broken, it disintegrates into splinters so small as to be scarcely visible.

These fragments are greatly sought after by engravers and are inserted by

them into their iron tools because the cut into the hardest surfaces with

little effort."  There is archeological evidence of diamond bit drills being

used in Yemen in the 4th Century BCE.

 

Diamonds have a square crystalline structure that in high quality stones

translates into a rather flashy natural octahedral crystal.  A natural

octahedral catches the eye quite nicely without facetting.  Since high

quality natural stones are rare, diamond cutting produces an appealing

gemstone from a more plebian diamond.  Diamond cutting in Europe probably

starts in 14th Century Venice.  Faceting enhances the natural reflectivity

of the stone.

 

For more on diamonds, let me recommend the American Museum of Natural

History:

 

http://www.amnh.org/exhibitions/diamonds/

 

Bear

 

 

Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 23:15:44 -0500

From: Gretchen Beck <grm at andrew.cmu.edu>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

--On Monday, November 26, 2007 10:45 PM -0600 Daniel & Elizabeth Phelps

<dephelps at embarqmail.com> wrote:

> I suggest that diamonds would have been of less value as a gem stone in

> period compaired to stones more easily worked and of more vivid hues.

> Its  value would have been that it would scratch all other stones and

> metal as  well.

 

I'm not sure I agree -- rarer and harder to work tend to make a stone more

valueable, not less. Note too that what the ancient's called diamond (or

adamas/adamant) may not necessarily be what we identify as diamond...

 

> The only direct "period" reference I have would be to a translation of a

> period Arab book of gems and my notes on that are on a hard drive  

> that I cannot access presently.

 

Pliny the Elder's Natural History has a chapter on the properties of

precious stones. An English translation is online at

<http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?doc=Perseus%3Atext%

3A1999.02.0137&query=toc:head%3D%232562>

 

toodles, margaret

 

 

Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 20:33:55 -0800

From: David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

I think there are some prehistoric jade finds in Europe.

 

Ogden's book on jewelry in classical antiquity goes through the

question of European jades in considerable detail; as best I

remember, he concludes that every case is a misidentification. It

seems to have been regarded as a new gemstone when the Spanish

brought it back from the New World, hence the Spanish name.

 

> A rumored little jade Buda found in an early Norse grave not withstanding it

> is my understanding that jade was relatively unknow in Europe through out

> all but late period as it was a gem of the orient and the new world.

>

> I suggest that diamonds would have been of less value as a gem stone in

> period compaired to stones more easily worked and of more vivid hues.  Its

> value would have been that it would scratch all other stones and  

> metal as well.

 

As best I recall, Cellini includes diamond among the precious stones.

 

> It is my conjecture that a persona of 15th century Christian Spain would

> intersect with Moslem and Jewish traditions but would not yet have  

> direct access to the orient or the new world.

 

Yes.

 

> The only direct "period" reference I have would be to a translation of a

> period Arab book of gems and my notes on that are on a hard drive  

> that I cannot access presently.

 

Pliny discusses the properties of gemstones in some detail. But he's

generally sceptical.

 

One of my favorite bits is where he mentions that if you put a

certain stone beneath your pillow, in your dreams you will see the

future.

 

Or at least, he adds, you will see it as well as the soothsayers do

 

I think Albertus Magnus discussed stones too--that should be fairly

easy to find. _De Lapidibus_? There are a number of medieval European

lapidaries with such information.

 

> Daniel

--

David Friedman

www.daviddfriedman.com

daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 00:22:26 -0600

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

> A rumored little jade Buda found in an early Norse grave not withstanding

> it is my understanding that jade was relatively unknow in Europe through out

> all but late period as it was a gem of the orient and the new world.

>

> I suggest that diamonds would have been of less value as a gem stone in

> period compaired to stones more easily worked and of more vivid hues.  Its

> value would have been that it would scratch all other stones and  

> metal as well.

>

<clipped>

>

> Daniel

 

Pliny on the otherhand suggests that they are the most valuable of gems and

from his description of their shape it is fairly obvious he is referring to

the rare diamonds that naturally display their crystalline structure.

 

There is a break between Antiquity and the High Middle Ages where diamonds

seem to be relatively unknown in Europe.  Some time in the 14th Century,

Venice became the diamond cutting center of Europe, probably as an adjunct

to the spice trade.

 

Bear

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 07:03:25 -0500

From: "Elaine Koogler" <kiridono at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

I have done some research on jade, particularly as I wanted to use it

as part of my heraldic title.  Jade appears to have been encountered

first by the Spanish in the Americas in the 15th century, where it was

used as a specific against kidney disease.  Because of this, the

Spanish called the stone "ijada de piedra" or "stone of the kidney."

The French began use of the stone in jewelry after that and

transliterated the name into French...can't remember the French

equivalent. It then passed over the Channel into English as "jade."

This would have been the semi-precious jade, nephrite, which is what

is mined in the Americas including central and South America as well

as Alaska.  I don't know of any instance, even close to period, of

precious jade, jadeite, in Europe. This stone is found in China and in

southeast Asia.  All of the ceremonial jade implements in China were

nephrite jade...and it was referred to as the "Stone of Heaven."  The

character/kanji for Emperor is, interestingly enough, the same as jade

(a single vertical stroke with three horizontal strokes) with a single

dot added on the bottom crosswise stroke.

 

Kiri

 

 

Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 09:15:06 -0500

From: "Sharon R. Saroff" <sindara at pobox.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

A number of years ago I did a research paper on bead lore.  I

compiled information on every stone I could think of.  Only part of

my research went into the paper.  I remember that blue stones

protected against the evil eye.  Lapis was the favorite in the Middle

East. Blue eye beads were also a favorite.  

 

HL Sindara

 

 

Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:23:50 +0000 (GMT)

From: emilio szabo <emilio_szabo at yahoo.it>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

There are many books on precious stones. Some of them are online.

 

http://juliusruska.digilibrary.de/q069/q069.html

 

http://www.uni-giessen.de/gloning/lap/lap_zett.htm

 

http://edocs.ub.uni-frankfurt.de/volltexte/2007/3947/

 

I am sure there are more of this kind out there.

 

As for Spanish sources:

 

Alfonso X, Rey de Castilla: Lapidario. Texto ?ntegro en versi?n de  

Mar?a Brey Marin~o. Madrid: Editorial Castalia 1968.

 

Alfonso X: ?Lapidario? (seg?n el manuscrito escurialense H.I.15).  

Introducci?n, edici?n, notas y vocabulario de Sagrario Rodr?guez M.  

Montalvo. Pr?logo de Rafael Lapesa. Madrid 1981.

 

Faraudo de Saint-Germain, L.: Noticia de un lapidario valenciano del  

siglo XV. In: Bolet?n de la Real Academia de Buenas Letras de  

Barcelona 18 (1945) 192-216.

 

Nunemaker, J.H.: The lapidary of Marbode and a Spanish adaptation.  

In: Speculum 13 (1938) 62-67.

 

Nunemaker, J.H.: In pursuit of the sources of the Alfonsine  

lapidaries. In: Speculum 14 (1939).

 

Isidor might be a good source as well (known as Isidor of Sevilla,  

Isidorus Hispalensis). The text is online as well:

 

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/L/Roman/Texts/Isidore/16*.html

 

Emilio

 

 

Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:58:41 -0600

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

>    While we are at it Daniel sent a website concerning precious stones

> in the Roman Empire. Obviously according to this Romans were not wearing

> precious stones in rings while eating to protect oneself against poison,

> which is the topic at hand. After reading the entire essay. I found a

> important sentence: the "method of polishing diamonds was first

> discovered in 1456, by Louis Berquen, a citizen of Bruges ."  Fascinating

> cause such inventions travel slowly so probably when one of you said

> diamonds were cheaper than other precious stones you are totally correct

> because of the lack of polish. This points to a logic error on the part

> of Spanish historians claiming diamonds were used in 1434 to ward of

> poison.

 

High quality, natural octahedral diamonds are rare and are therefore very

costly. Pliny's comment is "The diamond, known for a long time only to

kings and then to very few of them, has a greater value than any other human

possession, and not merely than any other gemstone."  From this, I assume

Romans did not generally wear diamonds because they could not afford them

and the idea that diamonds are cheaper than other stones because they lack

polish is false.

 

Diamond cutting increased the supply of available diamonds.  European

diamond cutting appears to begin in Venice between 1330 and 1350.  The

earliest representation of a facetting machine is by Zwolle in 1439.  The

1456 date for Berquen is open to question as some sources list his birth as

1450. Berquen was the first cutter to grind off the upper and lower points

of the octahedral, the claim that he was the person who introduced diamond

cutting to Europe is false.  Giacomo Tagliacarne is definitely contemporary

to Berquen and very likely predates him.

 

Since diamond cutting in Europe was 80-100 years old in 1434, I wouldn't

write off the claims that they were used then to ward off poison without

quite a bit more research.

 

Bear

 

 

Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 15:13:46 -0800

From: David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

> I have done some research on jade, particularly as I wanted to use it

> as part of my heraldic title.  Jade appears to have been encountered

> first by the Spanish in the Americas in the 15th century, where it was

> used as a specific against kidney disease.  Because of this, the

> Spanish called the stone "ijada de piedra" or "stone of the kidney."

 

I think the reason is that botryoidal jade looks

like kidneys. I don't know if the name is

directly from that, or indirectly along the lines

you suggest.

 

> The French began use of the stone in jewelry after that and

> transliterated the name into French...can't remember the French

> equivalent.  It then passed over the Channel into English as "jade."

> This would have been the semi-precious jade, nephrite, which is what

> is mined in the Americas including central and South America as well

> as Alaska.  I don't know of any instance, even close to period, of

> precious jade, jadeite, in Europe.

 

I'm not sure why you regard Jadeite as "precious"

and nephrite as "semi-precious." I can't speak to

Chinese usage, but in western terminology both

are semi-precious stones.

 

My conjecture, incidentally, is that because jade

was greatly valued in China, rough jade found

between China and the west, for instance in

Burma,, would get exported east rather than west.

Hence the stone was unknown in medieval Europe,

unlike some other stones that also had to be

brought considerable distances.

 

> This stone is found in China and in

> southeast Asia.  All of the ceremonial jade implements in China were

> nephrite jade...and it was referred to as the "Stone of Heaven."  The

> character/kanji for Emperor is, interestingly enough, the same as jade

> (a single vertical stroke with three horizontal strokes) with a single

> dot added on the bottom crosswise stroke.

>

> Kiri

 

 

Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 22:11:19 -0500

From: "Elaine Koogler" <kiridono at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

On Nov 30, 2007 6:13 PM, David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com> wrote:

> I think the reason is that botryoidal jade looks

> like kidneys. I don't know if the name is

> directly from that, or indirectly along the lines

> you suggest.

 

This was not conjecture on my part, but information that I gleaned from Web

sites (not Wikipedia, by the bye), but sites from an international jem

organization. Of course they could be wrong, but I think it's likely that

they knew what they were talking about, especially as I found the same

information on several sites.  I don't remember which sites they were at the

moment, but I can probably do some reconstruction if necessary.

 

> I'm not sure why you regard Jadeite as "precious"

> and nephrite as "semi-precious." I can't speak to

> Chinese usage, but in western terminology both

> are semi-precious stones.

 

I guess this comes from the fact that I worked with Chinese jewelers in Hong

Kong and Thailand...and in Hawaii...and this is what I was told.  I also

found the information while doing independent research for my Masters degree

at the Freer Gallery of the

Smithsonian Institution in Washington, D. C.  Also, as a shopkeeper selling

both types of jewelry, I can tell you that the prices of the two types of

jade, at least in my experience were quite different.  Sometime, go into a

jewelry store that specializes in jade and price a piece of Imperial jade,

one type of jadeite.  Imperial jade is a vibrant green jade that is so

translucent that a newspaper can be read through a 1/8" piece of the stone.

 

> My conjecture, incidentally, is that because jade

> was greatly valued in China, rough jade found

> between China and the west, for instance in

> Burma,, would get exported east rather than west.

> Hence the stone was unknown in medieval Europe,

> unlike some other stones that also had to be

> brought considerable distances.

 

A very plausible explanation.   Your Grace, I don't mean to sound

argumentative...I just wanted you, and the rest of the list, to know that my

statements were made based on some fairly extensive research that I have

done.

 

Kiri

 

 

Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 20:41:18 -0300

From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

Reviewing the precious stones the only ones I have [seen] worn in rings to ward

off evil in medieval Spain are: agatha, crisopraza, coral, diamond,

emerald, garnet, jacinth or hyacinth, mannera? (unidentified precious

stone), L. /manus/, hand + arium (ario [relating to the hand]), mustika

bezoar pearls, quartz, ruby, serpentine and sard or carnelian. Funny

there are 12. What were the 12 stones Apocalipsis 21:20? Most of mine

come from Villena who generalizes saying they annul poison in foods and

polluted air. That does not satisfy me. There is more to it. There are

cold stones for evils in warm foods and warm stones for those in cold  

foods.

 

Suey

 

 

Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2007 12:55:23 +1300

From: Adele de Maisieres <ladyadele at paradise.net.nz>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

Suey wrote:

> Reviewing the precious stones the only ones I have worn in rings to ward

> off evil in medieval Spain are: agatha, crisopraza, coral, diamond,

> emerald, garnet, jacinth or hyacinth, mannera? (unidentified precious

> stone), L. /manus/, hand + arium (ario [relating to the hand]), mustika

> bezoar pearls, quartz, ruby, serpentine and sard or carnelian. Funny

> there are 12. What were the 12 stones Apocalipsis 21:20?

 

19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all

manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second,

sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;

 

20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolyte; the

eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the

eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

--

Adele de Maisieres

 

 

Date: Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:20:57 -0500

From: Gretchen Beck <grm at andrew.cmu.edu>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

--On Sunday, December 02, 2007 6:14 PM -0600 Terry Decker

<t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> The quick ref I'm looking at translates "ijada" as flank and "piedra de

> ijada" as flank stone.  It derives from the Latin "ilia" and  

> becomes jade from the French "l'ejade."

 

FWIW, here's what the Oxford English Dictionary says about the  

etymology of the word "jade"

 

[= F. le jade (1667 in Hatz.-Darm.), for l'ejade (Voiture, 1633) =  It. iada

(Florio, 1598), ad. Sp. ijada in piedra de ijada or yjada (Monardes, 1569),

lit. ?colic stone?, f. ijada, yjada, ?the small ribs, the collike, the

flanke? (Minsheu); cf. the synonym NEPHRITE, f. Gr.  kidneys, reins.

  The transformation of F. l'ejade fem. into le jade masc. was an error

made when the word was as yet unfamiliar: see Athen?um, 20 Oct. 1900.]

 

toodles, margaret

 

 

Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 18:26:35 -0600

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

Twelve. Twelve months, twelve signs of the Zodiac.  The stones Suey listed

are a mix of ancient and modern birthstones.  The ones listed by Adele are

the ancient birthstones, if I'm not mistaken.  This suggest to me that these

stones are believed to be related to the signs of the Zodiac and that their

assumed powers may derive from the virtues of the sign to which they are

related. Just a thought.

 

Bear

 

 

Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 02:17:48 +0000 (GMT)

From: emilio szabo <emilio_szabo at yahoo.it>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

> Twelve.  Twelve months, twelve signs of the Zodiac.

 

The Middle English "Boke of Stones", edited by Keiser in 1984, starts  

off with biblical references, among others to 2 Mose (Exodus) 28,17,  

which deals with the priest Aaron. The twelve precious stones are  

connected to the twelve sons of Israel (the Vulgata says:  

"habebuntque nomina filiorum Israhel").

 

"And wyse men shulde not doute that god ne hath put vertu In stones &  

herbes & wordes.

& who-so beleueth hit not, but ayeinseith hit, he ne is but a synner.  

The bible witnesseth hit that god commaunded be his mouth to moyses the prophete that he shulde put the twelue stones, the whech he had myde [of] many maneres in a moos clene & fine, quarre of foure handbrede of lencth & brede in foure corners, in euery corner thre stones (...) & hanged vppon the breste of aaron that was the first preest of the Iewys. The names of the twelue stones that god

hath named to moyses the prophete be his mouth ben thise: The firste stone ...".

 

Similarly, the "Lapidaire de Philippe" says: "... Et doit on sauoir que par le commendement nostre seignor furent mises .Xii. pierres preciouses en .i. pairement que fust mis sor le pis Aaron, le premier prestre des iuis. ...".

 

Emilio

 

 

Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2007 22:16:01 -0800

From: David Friedman <ddfr at daviddfriedman.com>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Precious stones to ward off evils

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

 

> Reviewing the precious stones the only ones I have worn in rings to  

> ward off evil in medieval Spain are: agatha, crisopraza,

 

Chrysoprase?

 

> coral, diamond,

> emerald, garnet, jacinth or hyacinth, mannera? (unidentified precious

> stone), L. /manus/, hand + arium (ario [relating to the hand]), mustika

> bezoar pearls, quartz, ruby, serpentine and sard or carnelian. Funny

> there are 12. What were the 12 stones Apocalipsis 21:20? Most of mine

> come from Villena who generalizes saying they annul poison in foods and

> polluted air. That does not satisfy me. There is more to it. There are

> cold stones for evils in warm foods and warm stones for those in  

> cold foods.

> Suey

 

I think a number of sources claim that amethyst defends against  

drunkenness.

--

David/Cariadoc

www.daviddfriedman.com

 

 

Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:36:59 -0300

From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Gems preventing poisoning

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

My reference to this subject comes from Luis Alonso Luengo's speech

on the Suero de Quinones jousting tournament in 1434, who unkindly does

not give his source here but quotes that the stones worn on the fingers

which were the 'ruby, diamond, jacinth or hyacinth, coral and sard or

carnelian plus lapidary.' He goes on to the cold stone: diamond; hot:

"mannera"; and "galacio," 'which attracts clouds'??? Why do we want to

attract clouds?

 

    Curious the diamond, mentioned twice, after what you said Emilio,

that they were not properly polished until the latter part of the 15th

C. On the other hand, I find Alonso Luengo the most faithful to

documents concerning what was said in this conference on Spanish Leonese

cooking, the speeches of which were published in 1994. Alonso is right

on with Villena and Sanchez Albornoz quotes.

 

    I really would appreciate any specific info on the qualities of the

stones mentioned above to prevent poisoning, hot or cold, relations to

the four humors etc. This is fascinating to me.

 

Suey

 

 

Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 19:13:51 -0300

From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Gems preventing poisoning

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

    On diamonds, Emilio wrote that as they were not polished properly

until the 1450's he believes them an error but the original source turns

out to be Juan de Encina who wrote this between 1439-1440 and mentions

them twice in the text on Suero de Qui?ones jousting tournament.

 

    Got a gem of a gem today - "galicio". There was an area in Turkey

today called Galicia and there is that of Spain. I find no scientific

name for this. It comes from Encina as well. Does anyone have any idea

what this could be? I cannot even fathom a color for it. 'It freed

eaters of poisonous foods and other misfortunes that could occur while

eating.'

 

Suey

 

 

Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 23:27:40 +0000 (GMT)

From: emilio szabo <emilio_szabo at yahoo.it>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Gems preventing poisoning

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org

 

> ... I have a little problem with your

> citations in Italian, German and Middle English...If you prefer  

> modern English: Many articles on the following site mention old  

> sources

in modern English paraphrase:

 

http://www.jjkent.com/articles/precious-stones-guide-vol9/index.htm

 

E.g.: http://www.jjkent.com/articles/medicinal-virtues-emeralds.htm

("... The emerald was employed as an antidote

for poisons and for poisoned wounds, as well as against demoniacal

possession. (Lapidario del Rey D. Alfonso X, Codice Original, Madrid,

1881, f. xv.)")

 

This passage in question was translated into Castilian by Maria Brey  

Marino as follows:

 

46. De la piedra que tiene nombre "zamorat".

Del d?cimosexto grado del signo de Tauro es la piedra a

que dicen en ar?bigo "zamorat" y en latin "esmeralda". Esta piedra

es verde, de muy hermosa verdura, y cuanto m?s lo es, tanto es

mejor. Mezclada es de naturaleza de tierra y de piedra; y

es, de su naturaleza, fr?a y seca. H?cese mucha en las minas

de oro y h?llanla en tierra de Occidente m?s que en otro lugar.

 

Su virtud es tal que sirve contra todos los t?sigos mortales

y heridas o mordeduras de bestias venenosas; si tomaren de ella

peso de una dracma, la molieren, la cernieren y la dieren a beber

con vino o con agua al hombre envenenado, sana, que no muere ...

 

There are other places where it is said that you have to wear the  

gemstone around your neck, on the left hand etc.

 

Here is C.W. King's "Antique gems"; it includes a translation of Marbod's

Liber de lapidibus seu de gemmis, which was probably the most important

text during the Middle Ages.

http://books.google.com/books?

id=PRgGAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=intitle:gems&lr=&num=100&as_brr=1

 

Marbod starts here:

http://books.google.com/books?

id=PRgGAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=intitle:gems&lr=&num=100&as_brr=1

#PPA389,M1

(John Riddle, in his edition of Marbod, suggests alternative  

translations now and then but still reprints King's translation.)

 

Could you please quote, what Alfonso Luengo wrote?

 

Another valuable article is Urban Tigner Holmes's "Mediaeval gem  

stones", published in Speculum, vol. 9, 1934, pages 195-204. Among  

other things, he used inventories of kings in order to see what kinds  

of gems they really had.

 

There is also a 15th century spanisch adaption of Marbode, on which  

see Nunemaker in a short article in Speculum, vol. 13, 1938, page 62-67.

 

Of course, reading the old texts in the original language opens a field

which is much wider. E.g., there is a transcription of

the "Lapidaire" attributed to Jean de Mandeville:

 

http://www.univ-provence.fr/Local/cuerma/dir/user-1086/Gontero-

lapidaireFV.pdf

 

A printed "lapidaire en francoys compose par messire Jehan des  

mandeuille cheualier"

is online at http://gallica.bnf.fr

This text, e.g., says in the chapter about "Le dyamant" that it "fuit

venin" (makes poison flee);

This echos a passage in Marbod's "De adamante": "Atra venena fugat"  

'it chases away black poisions' (John Riddle, improving on King's  

translation).

 

Emilio

 

 

Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2007 20:13:19 -0300

From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Gems preventing poisoning

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

My many thanks to Emilio Szabo for your interest in this matter and all

the websites you provided. I think now I can almost complete my own

homework assignment better. The text Emilio requested is as follows:

 

Alonso Luengo, Luis, "La Gastronomia en el passo honroso de Suero de

Qui?ones. _Actas del congreso de gastronom?a popular leonesa_.

Diputaci?n Provincial de Le?n. 1944:44:

 

            Se?alan los lapidarios, que cada piedra preciosa acumula

"/virtud contra determinada ponzo?a e aire infecto: rub?, diamante, e

gigorza, e coral, e olicornio. . ./" Y libran a los comensales de los

diab?licos venenos de los alimentos y otras desgracias que al comer

puedan acontecer. As?, el coral detiene el rayo; el "galacio" atrae a

las nubes; el "granate" recoge el calor; y aquella piedra preciosa del

Gran Chamberlan que cuando alguno dice en su presencia una mentira, muda

el color. Y otras en fin, comenta Villena -- "como la que se face con el

coraz?n de ome muerto con veneno endurecido o lapirificado con fuego

revervante", piedra esta que, puesta sobre las l?as o guantes que ha de

usar el Maestresala, tiene tal poder que enlaza con la r?brica de su

fulgor extraordinarios, todo los fulgores de las dem?s piedras preciosas

-- que est?n en la mano de cada comensal -- y sienta una protecci?n  

general contra todos los maleficios diab?licos.

 

            Dos clases de piedras preciosas se?alan los lapidarios como

esenciales par el comer: las piedras /fr?as /-- a la cabeza el diamante

-- contra los maleficios de los alimentos calientes o de sangre - como  

la carne - ; y las piedras calientes -- el granate y la manera contra

los maleficios de alimentos fr?os -  no de sangre -- como los pescados.

 

Now I see by this that not only can I not find what 'galacio' is but I

am missing citations and the translation of this stone:

 

*gigorza,* *gorgor?a*, 1. an unidentified precious stone. It was valued

as much as a diamond or ruby, thought to annul poison in foods and had

powers to provide happiness, health, success, protection and cures among

other things. 2. a green apple. It was used to raise the spirits,

egoism, tension and stress, prevent nightmares, provide success with new

endeavors and attract friendships. 3. a 13^th   C sculptured amulet. In

it was the image of a bull to fortify the eyes, stop hemorrhaging,

alleviate rheumatism and if a little piece of money was carried with it

at all times, financial success was possible. **

 

   Where I got the above info is beyond me. The only 'gigorza' I have heard of is Emilio di Gigorza, the baritone, second husband of Emma Eames.

 

    I can't find the Latin link between 'Emilio' and a very valuable

green stone I believe, any ideas?

 

Suey

 

 

Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 19:14:24 -0300

From: Suey <lordhunt at gmail.com>

Subject: [Sca-cooks]  Gems preventing poisoning

To: sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org

 

I wrote:

> *gigorza,* *gorgor?a*, 1. an unidentified precious stone. It was valued

> as much as a diamond or ruby, thought to annul poison in foods and had

> powers to provide happiness, health, success, protection and cures  

> among other things. 2. a green apple. ble, ble, ble.

 

    Nay, nay nay. That's a bunch of garbage! Just answered my own

question. Gigorza  is Old Castellan for jacinth, hyacinth, a

reddish-orange gem. As per Villena it prevented death from poisoning if

worn on the right fingers during meals.

 

    Looking for something else I came across Raymond Llull's  (1232-1315)

opinion of the diamond: "it stops and prevents all intruding poisons. .

. "  http://nora.hd.uib.no/non/echt/budapest/Selfrepr/symbol.htm

I think in Aragon, at least, the opinion of the diamond was higher than

Emilio indicates even though it was not properly polished until well

after Llull's death.

 

Suey

 

 

To: EKMetalsmiths at yahoogroups.com

Subj: help with chemical questions

Posted by: "Miriel" miriel.crawford at gmail.com   drgnhlr

Date: Wed Jan 2, 2008 11:15 pm (PST)

 

I am researching period gem manufacturing (lapidary) and have

potentially discovered a way to create Onyx stones, that was done in

period.

This article: http://www.thebeadsite.com/UNI-ONYX.html indicates that

sulphuric acid was used, or rather, can be used to help dye/heat

change regular agate to onyx.

 

I know things like Drain-O have sulphuric acid in them, but it also

has other stuff - what are the pure forms of sulphuric acid, can it be

commercially purchased (yes, I"m going to try and answer that anyway -

no I don't care about government 'watchlists'), and could some other

chemical reaction be used as a substitute?

 

I'd like to document an actual attempt with this. Thanks.

 

Miriel

 

 

Re: help with chemical questions

Posted by: "Michael Bergman" grifarosto at comcast.net   eclecticmagpie

Thu Jan 3, 2008 6:35 am (PST)

 

All that said, what's the procedure that you've read about, and where

did you read about it?

 

Britannica has one here:

http://books.google.com/books?id=TKcMAAAAYAAJ&;pg=PA277&lpg=PA277&dq=converting+agate+to+onyx&source=web&ots=fTD8Ff9yQN&sig=AZogFavsUmPkQEOOjV2VPP_8bl4

 

It sounds like this process is basically one of introducing honey

into the pores of the rock, and then burning it with the sulphuric

acid, leaving carbon deposits. This would require a fairly strong

(and thus dangerous) concentration of sulphuric acid.

 

Harald Longfellow

www.prospecthillforge.com

 

 

Thanks for help and warnings

Posted by: "Miriel" miriel.crawford at gmail.com   drgnhlr

Thu Jan 3, 2008 8:13 am (PST)

 

Ok, I admit that I wrote that on the heels of a moment of "AH HA"

after I'd read about the chemical reaction in the research.

site: http://www.thebeadsite.com/UNI-ONYX.html

paragraph: (sorry, really two) "Pliny's gemstone onyx is a humanly

altered agate. Banded agate can be turned into onyx by soaking it in a

solution of honey or sugar water over a low heat for a couple of

weeks. The duller, slightly porous bands will soak up some of this

liquid, and when the stone is heated, the sugar will caramelize in

them and turn brown. The less porous white bands remain unaffected,

emphasizing the contrast. The result is a brown onyx, deeply and

attractively banded.

 

If the sugar-impregnated stone is put into sulfuric acid, the sugar

will carbonize and become black. An even handsomer black onyx will

result. The Harappans were making brown onyx some 4000 years ago.

Arikamedu (q.v.) is the place where the first black onyx is thus far

recorded, more than 2000 years ago."

 

And I will also admit that my elementary science went out the window

last night (it was 2am! Even though that's my normal schedule...yikes,

what a case of the dumbs) in my enthusiasm.

 

I do know basic lab safety - but since I haven't had to 'use' these

bits stored in my brain, the information didn't immediately surface.

As for confusing Drain-O with Sulphuric Acid, I blame that on

misinterpreting a piece of information: http://tinyurl.com/3x7zej and

specifically down near the bottom of the entry where it indicates

products using this acid: "Instant Power Liquid Drain Opener"...didn't

realize it was a link to an actual product listing (Scotch Corp

manufacture) and just transliterated "Drain Opener" with

"Drain-O"...I'm an idiot, I will be the first to admit.

 

Going to go find lab basics for dummies now...

 

Miriel, the abased.

--

 

<the end>



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