knife-sheaths-msg

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knife-sheaths-msg - 11/5/01

Period knife sheaths. Making knife sheaths.

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This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

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Thank you,

Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous

Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: re: Sheaths

Date: 8 May 1995 09:03:14 -0500

Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway

>There are two methods of making sheaths both period both easy.

>a] take the blade trace it onto a peice of paper then cut three peices of

>heavy leather, insure that the peices are larger then the blade. The cut the

>middle piece to allow the blade to slide in. Then sew them together Sew a

>belt blank to the top and the bottom. Find a buckle you like and place it

>on the blank.

This is not intended as a flame, but I'm not sure I understand this

description well enough to make a sheath based on it.

>b. Take masking tape wrap it around the blade [sticky side out] remove

>and cut down the middle of the blade, stick it to a piece of newspaper.

This one makes a bit more sense.

When I make a sheath, ideally I need a wooden blank the same size and shape

as the knife (or very slightly larger). If I don't have one, I am forced

to use the knife itself, covered in petroleum jelly, then wrapped in saran

wrap and covered in masking tape or duct tape.

For the liner, it is possible to use a thin calf-skin, but I prefer to use

a bit of raw-hide, stretched as little as possible. The seam for this runs

up the backside (not the edge) up the blade. The rawhide gives me both a

certain rigidity that keeps me from cutting through my sheath accidentally,

and the little the rawhide does shrink, keeps a bit of a grip on the knife,

so it doesn't fall out when it hangs at my belt. Then I take bit of glue

(not always necessary) and attach a bit of wet leather (as thin as I want) and

stretch it around the blade, sewing it as close to the rawhide seam as

possible (and even using the rawhide seam when possible). Then I decorate

the wet leather.

To hang it, you can either attach a loop of leather near the top, or just

punch a hole through the leather of the sheath where it meets in the back,

and run a thong through it. Note that knives hung like this tend to

hang sideways, depending on where the *knife's* balance point is. If the

knife is blade heavy, it will hang blade down. If it is pommel heavy it will

hang upside down.

A way to deal with the problem of hanging strangely, although it is useless

for knives with any form of "quillion" is to bring the leather of the

sheath (and when possible the liner as well, up OVER the handle an inch

or two (however much is needed to cope with the imbalance) and hung from

hung from there. I've been told that this is similar to modern "Fishing

knifes", which goes to show that somethings never totally vanish.

"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn

Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep

-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra

(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)

From: ioseph at primenet.com (Joe Bethancourt)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Sheaths

Date: 8 May 1995 16:53:03 GMT

I. Marc Carlson (IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu) wrote:

: <Keith Cunningham <wildgoose at gateway.ecn.com>>

: >There are two methods of making sheaths both period both easy.

: >a] take the blade trace it onto a peice of paper then cut three peices of

: >heavy leather, insure that the peices are larger then the blade. The cut the

: >middle piece to allow the blade to slide in. Then sew them together Sew a

: >belt blank to the top and the bottom. Find a buckle you like and place it

: >on the blank.

: This is not intended as a flame, but I'm not sure I understand this

: description well enough to make a sheath based on it.

Same way as I make mine.....first you cut a piece of leather to fit the

blade, i.e. cutting out a center portion the same size as the blade,

leaving a "rim" of leather about 1/2" all around it. Then you sew leather

coverings to the front and back, trim the whole thing close to the seam,

and you have it. Wet the leather before you sew it.

It's a good idea to sew the belt loop to the back piece before you sew the

center, front and back together. Punch two holes in the belt loop for your

"peace tie", and the whole thing will hang quite well from your belt.

You can even sew two thin pieces over the tip of the sheath to act as a

tip-guard, if you want to.

: When I make a sheath, ideally I need a wooden blank the same size and shape

: as the knife (or very slightly larger). If I don't have one, I am forced

: to use the knife itself, covered in petroleum jelly, then wrapped in saran

: wrap and covered in masking tape or duct tape.

The petroleum jelly should be sufficient to protect the blade against the wet

leather.

BTW, one can use this sandwich technique using wood for the sheath, and then

cover with thin leather, and get a -very- nice sheath indeed.

ioseph at primenet.com PO Box 35190 Locksley Plot Systems

White Tree Productions Phoenix, AZ 85069 CyberMongol Ltd

*song lyrics at ftp.dnaco.net pub/sca/locksley - tapes at 1-510-735-2727*

From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: re: Sheaths

Date: 10 May 1995 14:25:46 -0500

Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway

From: DAVID RAZLER <david.razler at compudata.com>

JB>...You can even sew two thin pieces over the tip of the sheath

JB>to act as a tip-guard, if you want to....

I really wish I could see what they are talking about. I have a feeling

it's fairly simple.

A note. Is there any documentation for sheaths with the seam up

the edge (as opposed to the back side)? In Period, I mean.

JB>The petroleum jelly should be sufficient to protect the

JB>blade against the wet leather.

I wrap it in saran wrap and tape so as not to get petroleum jelly

in my leather. When I stuff my leather with oil, I have other oils

I prefer to use.

>... A cheat for non-eating knives:

>Persian lamb lining. I recently inherited a furrier's comb

>that my grandfather had kept for decades in a lambskin (fur

>in) sheath. Lanolin faded the basic steel comb to a dull

>grey, but no pitting.

Lamb fleece linings are, in fact, period (See? I can be convinced),

although I still maintain that they are predominantly an Anglo Saxon

development.

"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn

Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep

-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra

(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: zjohnsto at scu.edu.au (Zebee Johnstone)

Subject: Re: sheaths

Organization: Southern Cross University

Date: Fri, 12 May 1995 02:49:51 GMT

Keith Cunningham (wildgoose at gateway.ecn.com) wrote:

: There are two methods of making sheaths both period both easy.

: a] take the blade trace it onto a peice of paper then cut three peices of

: heavy leather, insure that the peices are larger then the blade. The cut the

: middle piece to allow the blade to slide in. Then sew them together Sew a

: belt blank to the top and the bottom. Find a buckle you like and place it

: on the blank.

My copy of Knives and Scabbards is many miles away (and only deals

with a small portion of period in both time and place) however...

I remember being surprised that this method was *not* used

for any sheath in that book.

Am I right in that, or am I misremembering?

Are there indications this was used in period in Europe?

It is a pretty common modern method, and especially useful for

blades with quillions, whereas the blades in Knives and Scabbards

were mosly lacking quillions, whihc might explain it...

Silfren

Zebee Johnstone zjohnsto at scu.edu.au

Southern Cross University ph: +61 66 203 280

Lismore NSW 2480

Australia

From: IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu (I. Marc Carlson)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: re: Sheaths

Date: 15 May 1995 11:12:48 -0500

Organization: UTexas Mail-to-News Gateway

<From: Zebee Johnstone <zjohnsto at scu.edu.au>>

>I remember being surprised that this method was *not* used

>for any sheath in that book.

>Am I right in that, or am I misremembering?

>Are there indications this was used in period in Europe?

"This method" of course, being taking the leather, folding it in half

and sewing it up? You are correct, K&S has no examples of this type

of scabbard. To my knowledge, I've never seen any evidence of this

type of scabbard in period, but then I don't know everything yet :)

>It is a pretty common modern method, and especially useful for

>blades with quillions, whereas the blades in Knives and Scabbards

>were mostly lacking quillions, which might explain it...

As a rule, when I make a scabbard for a knife with quillions or a guard,

I just make it a bit shorter, so that it covers the blade, only.

This does have the unpleasant side effect of moving the center of balance

enough that the knife, when hung, often lies on its side (as is sometimes

shown in period illustrations.

Oddly enough, when I use rawhide to form the liner, even after it dries,

it will general shrink a smidgen more, gripping the blade and keeping it

in place.

"Mihi Satis Apparet Propter Diarmuit Ui Dhuinn

Se Ipsum Appetenda Sapientia" University of Northkeep

-- St. Dunstan Northkeepshire, Ansteorra

(I. Marc Carlson/IMC at vax2.utulsa.edu)