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armor-leather-msg - 2/8/08

 

Making leather armor.

 

NOTE: See also the files: armor-msg, p-armor-msg, armor-plastic-msg,

shields-msg, Shield-Balanc-art, gambesons-msg, coat-of-plates-msg,

armor-chklst-msg.

 

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NOTICE -

 

This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.

 

This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org

 

I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.

 

The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.

 

Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).

 

Thank you,

    Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                          Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: ddfr at quads.uchicago.edu (david director friedman)

Date: 15 Dec 91 17:30:06 GMT

Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations

 

          Cost of armor

 

A number of people have posted, commenting on the low cost of plastic

armor relative to steel or leather. One possibility which I have not

tried but which might be worth exploring is to find a free or nearly

free source for small pieces of leather. My current design for

lamellar leather armor uses pieces  2 inches by 3 3/8 inches, and

smaller pieces could be used. Somewhere there must be leather

workers, perhaps shoe repair places, generating pieces about that

size as scrap and throwing them out. Of course, the leather has to be

reasonably thick--12+ ounce vegetable tanned leather is ideal.

 

What I have been using is eight ounce leather, which is available in

fairly substantial pieces, apparently as scrap from making something

else. One local source sells it for $3/lb. Using that, plus beeswax

($1.95/lb + postage), lamellar body protection weighs about six

pounds, costs under $20, and takes perhaps nine hours to make. The

result is much prettier than plastic armor, easier to move in (more

flexible because it is lamellar rather than plate), but not,

I suspect, as good protection. I would rate the 8 ounce hardened

lamellar as minimal legal--suitable for covering places where you do

not expect to get hit hard very often.

 

The next step up, which I am currently experimenting with, is to use

something stronger in the places you are most worried about. I

suspect that 12 ounce lamellae will do it. They weigh half again as

much and cost at least three times as much (at least twice the price

per pound, since I cannot get them as scrap). But I think a klibanion

that is about a quarter 12 ounce (on the sides) and three quarters 8

ounce will do the trick, and that should come to about seven pounds

and $30, which is still pretty light and pretty cheap.

 

An alternative, which I am also experimenting with, is to make some

steel lamellae, and alternate steel and leather in the important

areas.

 

Incidentally, for readers not familiar with leather terminology, "8

ounce" leather means 8 ounces per square foot.

 

Cariadoc

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: ddfr at quads.uchicago.edu (david director friedman)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Organization: University of Chicago

Date: Sat, 3 Jul 1993 03:59:41 GMT

 

Patrick Angus Flynn asks about waxed leather, and Magnus Moorley

responds:

 

"Making it is simple; get a big kettle, melt  some parrafin, dip the

leather, and bend your leather to the  desired shape immediately."

 

I would add:

 

1. Beeswax also works and, unlike paraffin, is period.

 

2. You can also do it in an oven at about 220 degrees, with the

melted wax in a baking pan or something similar.

 

3. While you can bend leather as described, it would be very

difficult to get any shape that involves stretching. My usual

technique involves first soaking the leather in water for many hours,

then shaping and stretching it to the desired shape, then letting it

dry out on some convenient form to keep the shape, then waxing it

when it is thoroughly dry. This way all the forming is being done

with cool, water soaked leather, not with hot, wax soaked leather.

 

4. More more detailed instructions, see my article on the subject in

T.I. a year or so back.

 

David/Cariadoc

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: pmw2c at csissun10.ee.Virginia.EDU (Paul Michael Wayner)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Organization: University of Virginia

Date: Sat, 3 Jul 1993 04:13:49 GMT

 

jeff_witham at mercer.COM writes:

|> Patrick Angus Flynn enquireth:

|>

|> >>What is the opinion of the populace of waxing leather for

|> >>armor? Is it necessary? Is it a good idea? If so, how do I do

|> >>it?

|>    

|> Waxed leather or Cuir bouilli <sp?> is a relatively inexpensive

|> (but effective and authentic) type of armor.  Not only does this

|> make the leather waterproof (and almost sweatproof), but it makes

|> the leather much more rigid.  I'm going to make some this year.  

|> I like it better than regular leather since the leather can

|> protect you better.  Making it is simple; get a big kettle, melt

|> some parrafin, dip the leather, and bend your leather to the

|> desired shape immediately.  I've been told that this can be done

|> in the kitchen.  I wouldn't do it in _my_ kitchen, though. I

|> think I'll go camping to do it, and make a party of the occasion.

 

I have made Coir bouilli in my kitchen (I'm not

real picky :-) and have been very pleased with

the results. Cuir bouilli has the properties of

being light, and fairly rigid but not too rigid.

When armour is too rigid, like steel, you can get

armour bites. Armour bites are much less likely

with Coir bouilli.

 

There are some things you need to be aware of

though.

 

#1 if the wax gets warm the leather gets

soft again. This is more of a problem with beeswax

than parafin, which has a higher melting point.

 

#2 you can use the warming to your advantage. If

your leather gets bent (which it invariably will)

you can heat it and bend it back into shape, no

problem!

 

                        Conrad Hebenstorm

 

 

From: nusbache at epas.utoronto.ca (Aryk Nusbacher)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Date: 3 Jul 93 11:38:46 GMT

Organization: University of Toronto - Wax on ... wax off

 

I had heard that a blend of beeswax (for resilience) and carnuba wax

(for hardness) made for the best hardener.

 

In my experience, the wax always had to go on hot leather, or it would

just sit on the surface.  If the leather is hot (only as hot as an

oven or dryer) vegetable tanned stuff, it will drink the wax right in.

 

Aryk

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: ross at chem.queensu.ca (Ross Dickson)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Summary: Be sure to let it dry first!

Organization: Dept. of Chemistry, Queen's University

Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 18:14:49 GMT

 

David / Cariadoc (ddfr at midway.uchicago.edu) writes:

>               ... first soaking the leather in water for many hours,

>then shaping and stretching it to the desired shape, then letting it

>dry out on some convenient form to keep the shape, then waxing it

>when it is thoroughly dry.

 

I thought I should mention that the bit about waxing it WHEN IT IS

THOROUGHLY DRY is important.  Gaerhun made his first set of waxed

leather armour here a couple of years ago, and we discovered that one

of the pieces was a rather brittle in the center, and had the

appearance of a crystalline nature at the broken spot.  We deduced that

the center of the piece hadn't completely dried before it was waxed.

 

Angus / Ross

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: nusbache at epas.utoronto.ca (Aryk Nusbacher)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Organization: University of Toronto - Wax on, wax off...

Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 20:34:37 GMT

 

Another safe way to melt wax:  microwave oven.

 

Aryk

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 16:47:00 GMT

 

Greetings from Balderik:

Here's some info I posted LOOONNNGGG time ago on making

cuirboulli armour:

 

According to Waterer (Leather Craftmanship, Leather and the

Warrior, etc.), the cuir boulli effect is obtained when

vegetable tanned leather is dried at elevated temperatures.  

It is a chemical reaction which converts the leather    

into something more closely resembling plastic (I forget the

details).  It will only occur with vegetable tanned

leather (the stuff used for tooling leather).

The temperature is critical: too low and no hardening occurs,

too high and the leather becomes brittle.

R. Reid (or was it Reed? in his book Ancient Skins, Parchments,

and Leathers) concurrs, adding that it was also achieved by

briefly (!) dipping the leather in boiling water for between

20 and 120 sec.  I have yet to experiment with this technique.

The application of wax is not necessary, although it enhances

the effect by increasing the density of the leather and

limiting the softening that can occur when the leather

is dampened.

The wax also makes the leather tougher.  I do not recall either

Waterer or Reed making mention of the use of wax for cuir boulli

armour, but I would have to check.

 

I made cuir boulli arm harness' as follows:

1) cut out individual lames from leather

2) select forms on which leather will be dried : 

      -lames were tied onto coffee cans with string

       (don't use tape!!!)

      -vambraces were tied onto newspapers which were rolled

       up into roughly conical shapes    

3) in order to determine the optimum temperature, the scrap

   bits of leather were used to experiment with different

   oven settings (soak piece of leather in water until

   saturated, dry in oven, check result)

4) when the correct setting for the oven in question is

   determined, the individual armour components (not yet

   assembled) are soaked in water until saturated, and

   then tied firmly to their respective forms (note that

   if you are ambitious you can carve positive and negative

   molds in order to impress decorations in relief

   on the armour - see Waterer).

5) place forms in oven and prop door open a crack to let

   the moisture escape.

6) melt some parafin wax (beeswax can be used but it is

   expensive and will smell like honey when your

   armour is in the sun for a while) in a double boiler

   (a bowl sitting in a pot of boiling water works).

7) when the pieces are dry and hardened, remove them from

   the forms (careful of heat) and brush on the molten

   wax with a basting brush or some such implement.

   Pieces can be returned to the oven (placed on a cookie

   sheet or something similar to prevent wax dripping

   onto the heating element, etc.) in order to allow the wax

   to permiate the leather.  The oven should be just hot

   enough to melt the wax, but NOT hot enough to burn it!

   EXERCISE DUE CAUTION!

   WAX IS FLAMMABLE!

8) When the pieces are hardened and waxed, any rivet holes

   needed (unless prepunched) can be drilled.  

   Edges can be filed/sanded.  

 

Hope this helps,

Balderick

 

 

From: sherman at trln.lib.unc.edu (dennis r. sherman)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Date: 6 Jul 1993 18:02:57 GMT

Organization: Triangle Research Libraries Network

 

Greetings to the Rialto from Robyyan.

 

Aryk says (about waxed leather):

 

>I had heard that a blend of beeswax (for resilience) and carnuba wax

>(for hardness) made for the best hardener.

 

Depending on the climate you live in and the conditions you normally

fight under, you may not want to use hardeners in your wax.  If the

temperature is sufficiently cool, the leather impregnated with

hardened wax will crack.

 

I use a mix of 50/50 beeswax/paraffin.  If I never fought in

temperatures under about 50 (F), I'd increase the proportion of

paraffin so the leather would be harder at higher temperatures.

--

  Robyyan Torr d'Elandris  Kapellenberg, Windmaster's Hill Atlantia

  Dennis R. Sherman            Triangle Research Libraries Network

  dennis_sherman at unc.edu       Univ. of North Carolina - Chapel Hill

 

 

From: tracker at wpi.WPI.EDU (The Renegade Ranger)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Date: 7 Jul 1993 12:14:38 GMT

Organization: Worcester Polytechnic Institute

 

Cuir Bollei (atrocious spelling of the second word, I know, but hey,

I just woke up..) is the hardening of leather through boiling.

Technically. However, it is generically hardened leather, and

wax-hardening is one of the primary methods.

 

Whether or not you want to wax-harden your armor (not just wax it,

which would provide a nice smooth surface and some water resistance,

but you shouldn't hold out for the chance that it'll make all blows

glancing due to its low surface friction...) depends on what you plan

to do with the armor. Hardened leather is a) waterproof b) reasonably

light  and c) hard as a chunk of light metal.  I've run over my

leather bottle with my car. It still works fine. Ok, I have a small

car, but still..   Hardened leather is _not_ flexible. It is also

normally a different color than when you started. Light veg. tanned

skins will turn a ruddy brown to dark brown, depending on how much wax

you imbue them with, and how high a temp you cook them at.

 

You would probably want hardened leather if you would like a rigid

form of armor that weighs very little, is easily formed, and not too

tough to make. You can make this armor in pieces (lamellar armor

would work very well with leather plates), or in sections (a tonlet

joined to a 1/4 piece of the chest garniture). Youl will be restricted

in size of the pices by the size of your heat source (oven).

 

To do it, go buy some wax. A lot. Buy some crystals while you're

getting the wax. Crystals, as they're generically called in the candle

shops around here, are small flakes which will make the wax harder.

Melt a bunch of wax over low heat, mixing in crystals as the wax

melts.. but not too many of them. Heat your oven to about 200-250F,

and get out the cut-out piece of leather that you're going to harden.

NOTE: The leather will shrink a little bit. How much depends on the

piece itself, and how much you wax it and such. Put the leather on a

sheet of aluminum foil or a big pan, and pour a good quantity of wax

over the leather, trying to get even coverage. NOTE: Pour the leather

on the 'wrong' side of the leather, _not_ the smooth flesh side. Let

the leather sit in the oven for a few minutes (5-10) so the wax can

soak through. Repeat pouring the wax. Do this until the leather looks

evenly saturated, which will probably take 1-2 times for every sq.ft.

of the piece. Then remove the item and allow to cool, making sure it

cools in whatever shape you want it to remain in. Then, go use it.

 

I'm sure there are other gentles with other varied and more intruiging

methods, and I'd love to see their methods or thoughts posted as

well..

 

-Tracker, always curious..

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 17:06:22 GMT

 

Greetings from Balderik,

 

gleason at scf16.scf.loral.com (Robert Gleason) writes:

|> I've noticed that the comments always say to use vegetable tanned leather.

|> Why not chrome tanned leather? What are the differences between the two

|> processes?

|>

|> Lord Parlan MacGillivray

|> --

|>   Robert Gleason  

|>   >> gleason at scf28.scf.loral.com

 

The short answer is 'It don't work with Chrome tanned leather'.

I don't know the details of the chemistry off by heart. The best source

I've got, Reid's 'Ancient Skins, Parchments, and Leathers' gets into some

of the details, but it's at home.  I'll try to give a 'readers digest' version,

which should be taken with a grain of salt:

Basically, one of the characteristics of Chrome Tanned leather is temperature

stability.  Something about the way the chromium sulphate binds to the pelt

fibres stabilizes them. With veg tanned leather

on the other hand, something about the way the various tannins bind to the

pelt fibres allows a peculiar polymerization reaction to take place above

a certain temperature.  The cuir bouilli is distinctly different structurally,

and chemically (?) from the leather you began with, apart from any wax/hardener

you may have added in the process.  I've hardened vegetable tanned leather

without using wax at all, and only added wax afterwards to enhance the effect

by making the leather denser and more waterproof.

You can bake/wax chrome tanned leather, but it won't undergo any dramatic

increase in rigidity (as far as I know).

 

Although most people don't care, chrome tanning is not period.  Whether or

not modern vegetable tanned leathers resemble their period equivalents is

beyond my knowledge, but I believe there are some distinct differences in the

production methods.

 

Cheers, Balderik

 

 

From: dloyer at zacson4.EBay.Sun.COM (Dennis Loyer)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Waxed Leather

Date: 8 Jul 1993 21:45:09 GMT

Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc.

 

Greetings,

 

     After reading most of the posts on this subject, including the warnings on the flamability of wax, I'm surprised I didn't have an accident this last weekend when I made my leg and arm armor out of waxed leather.  For the original poster on this subject, if he's still interested, I used a recipe I found in the new edition of the  Fighter's Handbook, unfortunately I do not remember who the original author is and  cannot give proper credit where credit is due.  If memory serves, since I don't happen  to have the Handbook handy, the recipe is as follows:

 

     1 lb parrafin

     3/4 lb bee's wax

     1/4 cup Neet's Foot Oil

     1 teaspoon  Alum (check the spice rack at your local grocery store)

 

     (I will check my handbook tonight after work and if the recipe is incorrect, or if there are any other glaringly obvious errors, I will post a follow-up to this, correcting such errors)

 

This are the basic proportions,  I had to increase it by a factor of 4 to do both upper and lowere arms, and both upper and lower legs ( upper legs ar hinged and cover front, back, inside and outside to protect my fair skin from those nasty wraps everyone likes to throw).  The procedure I followed was to take one of those cheap roasting  pans you find in the grocery store, place the wax in the pan, and put it in the oven at 200 degrees.  once the wax has melted competely (about 1/2 and hour) I poured in the oil and the alum, and mixed completely.  I then turned the oven up to about 275.

 

Now comes the fun, and incredibly smelly part.  Once the oven has come up to the  correct heat, take about 8 - 9 scrap pieces of leather about an inch on a side and  place them in the wax,  after 5 minutes remove one piece and place on some newspaper to cool (cover the newspaper with brown wrapping paper, or old paper bags to keep the leather from picking up the print of the newspaper). remove another piece every 2 minutes after that.  This will tell you how long you need to boil your leather. The Handbook's instructions said that you would probably only need to boil your leather for about 8 to 10 minutes, he must have been using a much lighter piece of leather, My leather was 14 oz. and needed to be kept in the wax for about 25 minutes total.

 

Another thing, you may not want to dye your leather first, I started out with my leather undyed, and still it's natural color, when finished, the leather was a warm dark brown color.  Another tip is to cut out your leather pieces first, however you may want to make the pieces slightly oversized by about 1/8 inch a side in case of  shrinking, though I didn't seem to have much problem with this.

 

All in all, other than the odor, it was rather easy to do, and if you're careful, doesn't leave much of a mess, and I personally am very pleased with the results.

 

Denis d'Loyer

 

 

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: v081lu33 at ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu (Ken Mondschein)

Subject: Ciour Bouilli'd armor

Organization: University at Buffalo

Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1993 22:48:00 GMT

 

I've been told that leather should be boiled in paraffin, not

beeswax. It has a higher melting point, for starters. However, it *will* mess

up your oven.

On the other hand, it's cheap-- in period, you had to off a whale. Now,

it comes from petroleum. My armor is all leather, and I love it. No problems.

                                                                              

Tristan

 

 

From: sherman at trln.lib.unc.edu (dennis r. sherman)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Ciour Bouilli'd armor

Date: 6 Oct 1993 12:55:40 GMT

Organization: Triangle Research Libraries Network"

 

Greetings to the Rialto from Robyyan.

 

Tristan writes:

>                                                                              I've been told that leather should be boiled in paraffin, not

>beeswax. It has a higher melting point, for starters. However, it *will* mess

>up your oven.

 

And if you fight outdoors in cold weather, paraffin also has a higher

*cracking* point -- meaning if your leather armor gets hit while cold

enough, it will crack.  And "cold enough" is a warmer temperature for

paraffin than beeswax.  I use a mix, myself -- about half and half

beeswax and paraffin.

 

>                                                                              On the other hand, it's cheap-- in period, you had to off a whale. Now,

>it comes from petroleum. My armor is all leather, and I love it. No problems.

 

I believe this statement is in error.  Not the one about you loving

your armor, the one about the source of paraffin... :-)

 

I haven't got my sources here to check, but while researching candles

and lighting, I got the definite impression that paraffin has always

been a petroleum product, developed in the 19th century.  The wax you

may be thinking of is spermaceti, which is from whales.  But it wasn't

used (at least for candles) until sometime in the 17th century, as I

recall.

--

  Robyyan Torr d'Elandris  Kapellenberg, Windmaster's Hill  Atlantia

  Dennis R. Sherman             Triangle Research Libraries Network

  dennis_sherman at unc.edu       Univ. of North Carolina - Chapel Hill

 

 

From: heide861 at crow.csrv.uidaho.edu (William D. Heideman)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Ciour Bouilli'd armor

Date: 7 Oct 1993 22:09:54 GMT

Organization: University of Idaho, Moscow, Idaho

 

dennis r. sherman (sherman at trln.lib.unc.edu) wrote:

: Greetings to the Rialto from Robyyan.

 

<< lines about parafin, beeswax etc.  deleted >>

 

: I haven't got my sources here to check, but while researching candles

: and lighting, I got the definite impression that paraffin has always

: been a petroleum product, developed in the 19th century.  The wax you

: may be thinking of is spermaceti, which is from whales.  But it wasn't

 

a minor correction: spermaceti is a rather light OIL, not a WAX.  A very

significant viscosity difference there.

 

: used (at least for candles) until sometime in the 17th century, as I

: recall.

: --

:   Robyyan Torr d'Elandris Kapellenberg, Windmaster's Hill  Atlantia

:   Dennis R. Sherman       Triangle Research Libraries Network

:   dennis_sherman at unc.edu     Univ. of North Carolina - Chapel Hill

 

Interjecting a point very much off the subject, but I felt the need to

make this correction

--

William D. Heideman

heide861 at crow.csrv.uidaho.edu

 

 

From: DDF2 at cornell.edu (David Friedman)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Leather Armor

Date: 11 Nov 1993 05:20:02 GMT

Organization: Cornell Law School

 

Johann asks about leather armor. My suggested rules of thumb:

 

Consider the following classification of places you may be hit:

 

A: elbows, knees, and any other equally vulnerable places. These generally

have a requirement of rigid protection.

 

B. Areas you would like well protected, because you are likely to get hit

hard there with some frequency. An example would be the ribs under the arms

for someone fighting bastard or two sword.

 

C. Everywhere else.

 

Armor is usually labelled by ounces per square foot; one ounce corresponds

to 1/64". For A, I think anything less than about 12 ounce hardened leather

is unsafe--although 8 oz might arguably meet the legal requirements. For B,

I would recommend at least 12 ounce hardened leather, but could survive

with 8 ounce. For C I would recommend 8  ounce.

 

> I figure I can purchase shoe sole/cobblers leather, (about a 1/4"

> thick, I can't find anything much thicker), doubled up in some

> places (like the breast and arms) for extra protection. (Extra

> padding in all the appropriate spots) Does this sound

> correct/acceptable?

 

What I usually use is vegetable tanned leather, often sold as "saddle

skirting," available up to about 14 ounce. The Leather Factory, which is a

chain, seems to have it at somewhat better prices than Tandy, especially

during their frequent sales. 1/4" leather, the thickness you mention, would

be 16 ounce. Hardened, that should do for anything short of a helm--and

maybe even unhardened. On the other hand, leather that thick may be hard to

shape. Doubling it seems like more protection than anyone needs.

Incidentally, the breast (for a man) is not a particularly vulnerable spot,

except perhaps if your fighting is mostly spear against spear. Nor, in my

experience, are the arms--they can get hit, but they also move when they

are hit much more than the body, which reduces the damage.

 

Some, perhaps all, sole leather has been compressed, so that 1/4" is even

heavier and harder than ordinary 16 ounce leather.

 

> Also, regarding 'boiling' leather: Do you use water or oil?

> Do you leave it for a while, cooking?

 

You immerse it in liquid beeswax for long enough to saturate it. The

easiest way is in an oven at about 230 degrees. See my T.I. article. The

piece is shaped before it is hardened by soaking in water, shaping, then

drying.

 

David/Cariadoc

DDF2 at Cornell.Edu

 

 

From: Dan Butler-Ehle <dwbutler at mtu.edu>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Leather Armor

Date: 16 Nov 1993 07:29:31 GMT

Organization: CCLI, Michigan Tech University

 

Greetings to all from Ulfin of Wyrmgeard!

 

In article <1993Nov9.220644.26647 at accint.com> Jason R. Pascucci,

jrp at accint.com writes:

>Also, regarding 'boiling' leather: Do you use water or oil?

>Do you leave it for a while, cooking?

 

Water.  Boiling it in oil will scorch it too much. Practice

alot at different temperatures and durations until you get

good results.  Every piece of leather is different, so it's hard

give a recipe for using this method.  You want it hard like

wood, but not so brittle that it will crack and break. Also,

boiling in water will distort the shape and cause it to shrink

a LOT.  The usual material is vegetable-tanned leather.

 

However, I believe that really thick rawhide would be ideal

if you could find it.  It's incredibly lightweight, but you'd

have to coat it to keep it from softening when it gets wet.  

(I'm speaking of real rawhide, not latigo-tanned leather

which is also often called "rawhide".)  

 

The common SCA method is to harden the leather by impreg-

nating it with wax.  There are no examples of period leather

armor that have any wax in them, so it is not believed to

have been a period practice. (I must admit that although I

have heard this several times, I've never seen any docu-

mentation on this--can anyone confirm it?)  It is, however,

a more practical method (at least for SCA purposes).  It is

also heavier, but has a few advantages over water curing:

  *The leather resists cracking

  *You can shape it while it sets

  *It can be reset by heating if it loses its shape

  *It doesn't shrink or deform from the hardening process

   (This also means that it will not destroy the pretty

   designs you tooled into the leather)

 

Many in SCA recommend beeswax, although I find it is way

too soft for hardening leather, costs a fortune, and makes

the armor sticky.  On the other hand, it smells wonderful.

(By the way--I recommend that every medievilist keep a

supply of beeswax on hand.  It's wonderfully useful stuff.)  

Oh yeah, there is more than one kind of beeswax.  Cappings

wax is light colored.  Cell wax can be anywhere from yellow

to dark brown and is generally cheaper than cappings. It's

usually available from apiaries (bee farms).

 

Ideally, you would use a hard wax.  Carnauba wax is a natural

wax that's pretty hard but costs even more than beeswax.  

The color is pretty dark (at least the stuff I tried was). I no

longer have a source for it--anyone know where to get it?

 

What I usually use is regular old parafin and add stearene

(stearic acid) to harden it.  Parafin is available everywhere,

although I have at times found that it's cheaper at the

supermarket (it's with the canning supplies) than at the

craft store.  Parafin is really nice 'cuz it's colorless; this

is important to me because I usually dye my leather.  

  

Stearene is with the candlemaking supplies at the craft

store.  The amount of hardener needed must be determined

by trial; your preferences probably differ from mine.  

Consider where you'll be using it.  If the leather can handle

a swordblow without cracking on a 40 degree day, it would

probably be too soft for fighting in the sun on an 85 degree

day.

  

If you want to dye your leather, use dyes that are much

lighter than your desired finished color. The wax darkens

the leather quite a bit, and any dark colors will come out

almost black.  This may not be so much of a problem if you

use the watercuring method, but I've never used that method

on dyed leather.

 

The only leathers I have found to be acceptable for hardening

by wax impregnation are vegetable-tanned (tooling)

leathers.  (Yes, I have tried chrome-tanned and oil-tanned

leathers -- they just won't harden up enough.) Vegetable-

tanned is the that Tandy and other leathercraft companies

sell for making belts and saddles and key fobs and other

things that have patterns tooled into them.  

 

You don't need the top-quality, unblemished stuff (you want

it for beating on with sticks, remember?).  Get some really

ugly grade C if you can find it.  By the way--leather costs

more than steel.  You should use 8-ounce leather at the very

minimum; it's not cheap.  I prefer 10- to 14-ounce for most

parts.  With a little engineering and a few well-placed rivits,

you can make a rock-solid breastplate using overlapping

sections of 8-ounce leather.  (An "ounce" for leather isn't a

measure of weight; it's a measure of thickness.  One ounce

equals 1/32 of an inch.)  

 

The stiffness of hardened leather seems to increase geo-

metrically with the thickness.  I find that no amount of

hardener can stiffen 6-ounce adequately, and that hardened

10-ounce is about twice as stiff as hardened 8-ounce.

 

If you want compound curves in your leather, you'll have to

curve it before you harden it.  Set it in warm water for a

couple days.  It should become a little bit stretchable.

Pull and push and yank and curse until you get it stretched

over a form.  Secure it with tacks or nails (most metals

will turn leather black, so put the tacks in an area you

plan to cut off).  Allow it to dry completely (this usually

takes days).  When it's done, cut it to the shape you want.

 

Tool and dye (oops...didn't intend the pun) the pieces.  I have

not had any problem with the wax deforming the leather,

so I put my lace and rivit holes in before I harden it. If you

choose to do it afterward, you will probably need to use a

drill.

 

Melt the wax in a double boiler (wax can explode if it gets

too hot).   Do not allow any water in the wax pot; if the

leather touches water droplets in the pot, it will shrivel

up like a potato chip.  For the same reason, your leather

must be completely dry before hardening.  If your pieces

are small enough, just drop them into the wax.  If not,

you can paint the melted wax on with a brush and put

the piece in a warm (not hot) oven; repeat this process

until the piece is saturated.  It usually only takes about

twenty seconds for pieces in the pot to soak up the wax.

If they're still sending up tiny air bubbles, leave them in

a little longer.  It can vary a bit with thickness and also

from one leather specimen to another.

 

Remove the piece from the wax pot or oven.  Bend it into

the desired shape and hold it in a bucket of cold water.

It can help to have something in the water over which

to form the piece.   If you wish to reshape the piece, be

very careful to remove all the water droplets before

putting it back in the hot wax or oven.

 

When the piece is cool, remove excess wax from the

holes and polish it.   If there is too much excess wax on

the surface, a Scotchbrite pad or somesuch may be helpful.

Assemble the armor.  Keep it prettty by trying not to get

hit too much (i.e. avoid taking up arms against the Middle).

 

Gee, I didn't intend for this posting to be a treatise on the

subject.  Hope I didn't give away too many of the secrets

I've been hoarding all these years.

 

    In service to the Dream,

       and enslaved to the Machine,

             Ulfin of Wyrmgeard

 

 

Dan Butler-Ehle               Canton of Mistig Waetru

<dwbutler at mtu.edu>        Kingdom of the Middle

 

 

From: Dan Butler-Ehle <dwbutler at mtu.edu>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Leather Armor

Date: 16 Nov 1993 07:48:45 GMT

Organization: CCLI, Michigan Tech University

 

Greetings from Ulfin-who-doesn't-always-proofread!

 

In article <2c9vgr$j4o at mtu.edu> Dan Butler-Ehle, dwbutler at mtu.edu (me)

writes:

>sections of 8-ounce leather.  (An "ounce" for leather isn't a

>measure of weight; it's a measure of thickness.  One ounce

>equals 1/32 of an inch.)  

        ^^^^

It's 1/64 of an inch.  Sorry.

 

    In service to the Dream,

       and enslaved to the Machine,

             Ulfin of Wyrmgeard

 

 

Dan Butler-Ehle               Canton of Mistig Waetru

<dwbutler at mtu.edu>        Kingdom of the Middle

 

 

From: DDF2 at cornell.edu (David Friedman)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Leather Armor

Date: 16 Nov 1993 14:36:27 GMT

Organization: Cornell Law School

 

In article <2c9vgr$j4o at mtu.edu>, Dan Butler-Ehle <dwbutler at mtu.edu> wrote

(about hardened leather):

 

> However, I believe that really thick rawhide would be ideal

> if you could find it.  It's incredibly lightweight, but you'd

> have to coat it to keep it from softening when it gets wet.

 

Impregnating rawhide with beeswax (as in hardening leather) seems to do it.

 

> The common SCA method is to harden the leather by impreg-

> nating it with wax.  There are no examples of period leather

> armor that have any wax in them, so it is not believed to

> have been a period practice. (I must admit that although I

> have heard this several times, I've never seen any docu-

> mentation on this--can anyone confirm it?)

 

So far as I can make out, nobody really knows how period courbouilli was

made. I gather from your comments that you are simply repeating what others

have told you, and that you (like me) have no real evidence one way or the

other. One person I know has done it by soaking leather in water, tieing it

to suitable forms, then drying it slowly in an oven at a low setting.

 

> Many in SCA recommend beeswax, although I find it is way

> too soft for hardening leather, costs a fortune, and makes

> the armor sticky.  On the other hand, it smells wonderful.  

 

Two to three dollars a pound is a fortune? It takes about half a pound of

beeswax for a pound of leather, so a klibanion requires something between

ten and twenty dollars worth of wax. I have not had any problem with armor

being either sticky or soft. I have been told that armor hardened with wax

gets soft if you fight in very hot weather--but on the basis of my

experience so far, if it is too hot for my armor it is probably too hot for

me.

 

> Consider where you'll be using it.  If the leather can handle

> a swordblow without cracking on a 40 degree day, it would

> probably be too soft for fighting in the sun on an 85 degree

> day.

 

My (beeswax hardened) leather armor manages that temperature range with no

problems.

  

> If you want to dye your leather, use dyes that are much

> lighter than your desired finished color. The wax darkens

> the leather quite a bit, and any dark colors will come out

> almost black.  This may not be so much of a problem if you

> use the watercuring method, but I've never used that method

> on dyed leather.

 

In my experience, any colors come out something between dark brown and

black after hardening--is this a difference between using parafin and using

beeswax? Can you get light colors with your method?

> sections of 8-ounce leather.  (An "ounce" for leather isn't a

> measure of weight; it's a measure of thickness.  One ounce

> equals 1/32 of an inch.)  

 

I believe one ounce is 1/64th of an inch.

--

David/Cariadoc

DDF2 at Cornell.Edu

 

 

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Leather Armor

Date: 16 Nov 1993 15:40:19 GMT

Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

 

Ulfin of Wyrmgeard posted a very comprehensive and informative

missive on cuir bouilli.

 

In an attempt to answer a couple of his questions:

 

Ancient Skins, Parchments, and Leathers by R.Reed (Reid?). THE most

comprehensive book on leather science, tanning etc. that I've ever

come across.  According to Reed, the cuir bouilli effect will only

occur with vegetable tanned leathers (and he give a brief description

as to why, in chemical terms).  He asserts that it was achieved in

period by very briefly dipping the leather in boiling water.  Unfortunately,

it is only a passing mention, so he doesn't get into his sources.

 

Leather and the Warrior by J.W. Waterer

Waterer more or less concurs with Reed.  According to Waterer, the

only piece of Cuir bouilli armour that has survived is the cruper

from a horse armour (this info may be dated).  As I recall, he doesn't

mention whether or not it is waxed.

 

Source of Carnauba wax:

Although I haven't searched for it, so I don't know if there are

other sources, I have seen it in the 'Lee Valley' Tool catalogue (

a Canadian mail order/catalogue store chain that specializes in

woodworking tools).  They will do mailorder to the U.S. Even if

you order nothing, the catalogue is great for leafing thru and

fantasizing on cold lonely nights (and I'm not a woodworker).

All sorts of wonderfully obscure and beautiful tools/supplies.

Someone once posted a cuir bouilli recipe that only required

a small percentage of carnauba (bulk was parafin or beeswax).

 

Cheers, Balderik

 

 

From: David Friedman <ddfr at best.com>

To: markh at risc.sps.mot.com

Date: Wed, 04 Sep 1996 20:28:00 +0000

Subject: Hardening leather

 

I noticed a post of yours on hardening leather, in which you quoted me

describing wax hardening. That is the method I used to use, but my

current opinion is that, although it works well for SCA armor and may

have been used for other purposes, it was probably not how period

cuirbouilli armor was made, since waxed leather cuts fairly easily. If

you check my web page, you will find a preliminary discussion of my

current water hardening method; a longer description is in the new

edition of the Miscellany, which Alban was selling for me at war this

year.

 

David/Cariadoc

 

 

Subject: Re: ANST - Info Request

Date: Thu, 11 Jun 98 14:16:49 MST

From: LannCathal at data-garden.com

To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG

 

> >   I have another request. I could use some information on cuirre boille

> >armor (quite possible mispelled). I am recently back in after a couple

> >of periods in high school and college an increasing number of years ago.

> >I am trying to use the 'boiled' heavy leather to round off my armor, or

> >at least until I can have some metal (a lot!) shaped into the elbows and

> >knees.

> >   I would appreciate your help/advice/pointers.

> >

> >   Valstarr

 

My armor, save for the helm, is made entirely from leather. The elbows, knees and kidney belt are hardened with wax. Here is how I did it. Materials required: Wax(parafin or bee's wax) Leather(obviously) Large towel or other thick cloth aluminum foil An Iron (That thingy you use to make wrinkles in clothes go away) a cover cloth for work area

 

Place the leather to be hardened on the cover cloth over your flat workspace. Cover the leather with a layer of aluminum foil and your cover cloth and iron it until it gets hot enough to melt wax then take your wax( I used a rather large chunk) and rub it over the heated area. When the wax stops melting, replace the foil and cloth and iron some more, then apply more wax. Continue until wax starts to seep though the other side of the leather. Once the leather is entirely impregnated with wax, iron once more to get it soft, then form it to shape and insert rivets or other hardware to connect it all. I was able to make two knees, two elbows and a rather large and overly thick kidney belt in about four hours. I precut the leather to shape, but waited til after waxing to cut holes  for rivets.

 

I would be happy to answer any further questions about this as well as hear alternatives as I am preparing to make myself a new set of all leather armor (save for the helm).

 

Lann Cathal,

House WolfStar,

Barony of Elfsea,

Kingdom of Ansteorra

 

 

Subject: [medieval-leather] Cour Boulli

Date: Sat, 06 Mar 1999 10:04:20 -0800

From: Bob & Tricia Le Pine <bashful at lightspeed.bc.ca>

To: medieval-leather at egroups.com

 

Here Is another point of view for all of you desiring to craft hardened

leather armor.

 

This has been used / play tested now for over 14 years or so in the Kingdom

of An Tir.

 

First cut out all your patterns in such weight leather that you deem

suitable,  (I use sole leather or saddle skirting.) then drill what

stitch holes you need and bevel the edges of the cut out pieces.

 

Then soak your leather pieces in water hot enough to be just able to put

your hands in for seconds with out burning yourself (Approx. 110  to 120

degrees 'F') or use BBQ tongs to fish them out like I do.

 

Let the leather soak till all of it's thickness is saturated ( wet all the

way through )

 

Stitch any seams ( I tend to " abutt ' the edges of the Seam line then

stitch a ' cover plate ' of leather over the stitched seam which adds

strength and can be decorative if you cut out the cover plate in various

shapes. ) then form the wet leather to the shape that is desired...... then

let it completely dry ! ! !

 

NOTE: Add the wet cover plate to a completely dry main piece and drill out

the stitch holes in the cover plate only at first. Place the cover plate at

one end of the dry seam it will cover then drill several holes into the dry

piece using the existing cover plate stitch holes as a guide.

 

Once the one end is locked down with a stitch or two then shape / mold the

plate to the shape of the dry piece, drill several more holes then stitch

them. this cycle continues until the whole thing is sewn down.

 

This method allows for accurate stitching together of two complex shapes

with little fuss or bother.

 

Let the wet cover plate completely dry before waxing.

 

Trying to wax wet leather can cause micro 'steam' explosions that spray

hot wax all over. Having liquid bee's wax on the skin is uncomfortable

enough but having it in your eyes is a big 'not to be desired'.

 

Please be careful with the hot wax.

 

Now drying can be done two ways.

 

One in a warm (not hot) oven set to about 150 degrees, or air dried at

room temperature.

 

I strongly recommend the air drying method personally as I have seen too

many pieces shrivel up or become so brittle from the heat that they are

useless.

 

This is a waste of hours of labor ( I'm lazy :-} ) is extremely

frustrating, and is very costly in cash as this weight of leather is

expensive.

 

The soaking in water leeches out much of the oils that make the leather

flexible and the air dried piece will be quite hard.

 

To wax this I use the following method:

 

1:      Melt a small pot of plain bee's wax( I use an old percolator coffee pot

with a self heating electrical element that has a variable rheostat (A

dial to adjust the temp. in the pot. ) to hold my wax.

 

This is great as it's ready to go in minutes and I can control the heat so

as to keep the wax at a liquid temp. without having to worry about

overheating it to it's ' flash ' point where it will cause  a fire.

 

.......Whatever method you use to melt bee's wax please be careful of this

fire danger!!....

 

2:      Using a natural bristle brush ( Nylon or plastic bristles melt in hot

wax :-} ) paint your air dried piece in this order.  Edges first, then the

back/inside/flesh side and last the front or face of the piece. This is

done so that when you lay the piece down, on layered newspaper, to do another

piece any grit or dust will adhere to the back side of the waxed leather

leaving a pristine face.

 

Oh yes be aware that the waxed piece will look ugly as the hot wax hits

the cool leather it congeals and is lumpy and horrible looking........ this

is normal and will disappear with the next stage of the process.

 

By the way any carving or tooling is done after the air drying process and

also any dyeing.

 

The wax will penetrate LN dyes and only coat COVA or acrylic paints but

will still provide the waterproofing that is desired

 

3:      Next I use a ' paint stripper ' gun held about 4 to 6 inches from the

leather to heat the leather which opens the pores as well as liquify the

wax which is then drawn into the open pores and creates a thin but all

encasing coat of bee's wax about the piece.

 

Be very careful not to over heat the leather or it will fry and shrivel.

Excess wax is 'blotted' off the leather with crumpled paper towel (more

'thin edge' surfaces to absorb the wax ) and then the gun is applied

again until the surface of the leather appears dry.

 

4:      This is the stage where holes are punched / drilled and strapping and

buckles can be installed. Do not wax the straps as they want to be flexible.

 

Tandy style 'two part' rivets are only used to attach the buckle into

the buckle strap. all other strap or plate attachments are done with copper

'belt / harness' rivets As a suit of armor in the middle ages was called

a 'harness' these rivets seem appropriate.

 

NOTE; I have found 5/8 th inch buckles and straps work best in the suits I

build. Make the straps of 6 to 8 oz. leather for that weight / thickness

seems to work the best and needs the least replacement. Use 'cast' 5/8 th

roller buckles even though they are more expensive as they last longer and

break / bend less.

 

The above is, of course, only one persons opinion but it is one that has

worked for many years.

 

I hope that it is of some help / use to the folk on this list. Do feel free

to pass it around to who ever can use it. I happily grant permission for

its use. The more folk in armor on the field the more tar... I mean the

more friends we have to play with.  :-}

 

Yours for safe combat,

 

Aaron

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                 Aaron of the Black Mountains,

                        An avowed member of the

         *Order of the Hospital of Saint John of Jerusalem*

 

 

From: Fiora Soranzo and Mahir al'Asuad <nivisecond at gmail.com>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Mediaeval Things to Do with Old Oil?

Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 04:02:12 GMT

 

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 00:19:55 GMT, "finndo" <finndo at sc.rr.com> wrote:

 

>Wow you learn something new every day...

>

>Pretty Cool

>

>> So far as I can tell, the idea that leather was hardened by heating in

>> oil is a myth. Cuirboulli seems to have been made using water, which is

>> usually available at low cost.

>> --

>> David/Cariadoc

>> www.daviddfriedman.com

 

http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Medieval/Articles/Perfect_Armor_Improved.htm

 

A link I was given on how to make boiled leather. I found it quite

interesting, and I thought maybe you would too. :)

 

Fiora

 

<the end>



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