beverages-NA-msg

beverages-NA-msg – 6/23/05

Non-alcoholic beverages. Tea, fruit drinks.

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From: strata at FENCHURCH.MIT.EDU ("M. Strata Rose")

Date: 17 Feb 90 22:14:44 GMT

Well, at fine Japanese grocery stores everywhere :-) you can get

barley tea, made from roasted whole barley ground and put into tea

bags. I've seen the bags of whole grain as well, pre-roasted. Made

with a little honey and diluted by half, it makes a very refreshing

drink. I have no idea if this is anything like medieval "barley

water". My non-educated guess is that if "teas" were reserved to

"real tea leaves & water" then barley water may approximately equal

barley tea. Caveat: Do not let my speculations assume even a

hundredth of a percent of the weight of actual research!

In Japan, barley tea is a traditional drink, which generally means

it's been around a loooong time. The green chai that we so often

associate with Japan is actually a Chinese import from around the time

of the Khanate. I don't have documentation for it, unfortunately, so

I dont' know if barley was actually grown in Japan during the time

period we're interested in. I've always thought of barley as a

European grain, but what do I know :-)

Me, I just drink it 'cause it tastes good. :-) :-)

_Strata

(PS- I also dilute sekainjabin about double, ie 1 part syrup to about 20

parts water, and find it's very good that way and too sweet/sticky for when

you're overheated when it's at normal strength)

From: ddfr at quads.uchicago.edu (david director friedman)

Date: 5 Oct 90 06:40:57 GMT

Organization: University of Chicago

Conjecture vs Fact

"Root beer made from sasparilla is New World, but brews of various

sorts were made from roots in the Olde World. I have no recipes

except the New World ones, I know that trees of various sorts (such

as willow) were used medicinally and as tonics, I therefore

extrapolate ... In the name of creativity I am willing to use

period ingredients and period methods and make a beverage that could

have been made in period, we will never know if it was or not."

(Awilda)

Several comments.

First, how do you know that brews of various sorts were made from

roots in the Olde World? Are you saying that you have period sources

but they do not happen to have recipes? What are they?

Second, there is a big gap between medicine and ordinary beverages.

If you sat down at a modern restaurant and were served cough syrup or

cod liver oil you would be both surprised and upset. I assume from

what you say that your evidence is only about medical use, which

leaves serving such drinks at a feast still pretty dubious.

Cariadoc

From: ken at valkyrie.ecn.uoknor.edu (Ken Burnside)

Date: 3 Oct 90 22:58:49 GMT

Organization: University of Oklahoma, Norman

I am VERY interested in hearing of non-alcoholic beverages for SCA

(and other functions). If these receipes could be collected, and

put up in some place where they could be mailed out or ftp'd, I'd

be very greatful.

My personal favorite: Norse spiced cider. (Not necessarily period)

1 gallon of fresh-pressed or spring cider. (Spring cider is

mildly alcoholic)

2 cups of white whine vinegar.

2 pounds of honey.

1 lemon, diced into .25" cubes. (unclude the rind!)

2 tbsp of ground cloves.

1 tbsp of ground cinnamon.

1 tbsp of ground ginger. (optional. Sometimes causes a bitter taste)

.25 cup of whichever mint you prefer.

Set the cider to simmering. Dissolve in the honey. let cool for a

bit, add in the vinegar. Simmer on low heat while stirring in the spices.

raise the heat a bit, and serve hot. Each cup should have a sprinkling

of mint o'er the top as it's served.

As this drink sits on the hearth, it grows in potency....be wary of

quaffing the dregs! (Thou, 'tis said that the bottom of the pot will

rid a man of the chills of the deepest of winters with but a sip...)

For a summer drink, I like to mix a quart of apple cider with 1 cup of white

wine vinegar, fill the rest of the bottle with honeywater (water with a

fair bit of honey dissolved into it) and let it steep with commercially

prepped mint teabags in the sun for a day. Good served chilled

around a bardic fire.

Thorfinn Halfblind (Ken Burnside)

Marche of Ered Sul, Atenveldt.

From: bnostrand at lynx.northeastern.EDU

Date: 12 Dec 91 08:00:50 GMT

Organization: The Internet

The main problem with the period development of ice tea is not as was

supposed the lack of ice. In antiquity, runners would be sent to the

mountains to fetch snow for various delicacies. Later, it was

discovered that if large blocks of ice were cut from frozen ponds and

placed in thick walled storage houses (interestingly enough commonly

called ice-houses) and covered with an insulator such as straw or

sawdust that the stuff would actually last well into the the Summer

months. This was the common source of coolant until the popularization

of heat-pump refrigeration.

The main problem with the development of ice tea is the way in which

tea is prepared. As I mentioned in an earlier posting, the earliest

form of tea (called DANCHA if I remember correctly) was prepared

by boiling tea bricks. However, ground tea was developed within

period and it is possible to prepare it with ice water. There is

even an extant form in which ice tea is prepared by beating tea

powder into icewater. However, I am unaware of when this form was

developed. Regretably, I forgot to ask my tea-masters when they

taught the form to me. (SIGH) There may be some mention of it

in a book I have the title of which roughly translates into

Old Tea and New Tea. Unfortunately, my copy of "Historical Cha no Yu"

by Plutchow was destroyed in the flood which destroyed much of my

library. (One googleplex of very loud SIGH's.) It is possible

that the Ice Tea cerimony appears in one of these books but, it

may also be a very recent inovation!

Solveig Throndardottir

From: christer at sue.komunity.se (Christer Romson)

Date: 12 Dec 91 07:44:00 GMT

I think we discussed the posibility of ice in the medieval summer about a

year or two ago on the Rialto. A few readers remembered their parents or

grandparents telling about how they would take big chunks of ice in the

winter and put in a stack of sawdust, and it wouldn't melt until autumn.

This worked as a simple cooler during summer. They could probably have done

this in period, but i don't think we have any evidence they did. (Stacks of

this kind could show up on book illuminations and paintings, and there

could be archeological finds of such stacks, but i haven't seen either).

I don't know how much work it would be to produce the necceary amount of

sawdust to get this to work.

(No, i'm not advocating that we should have iced tea because of this).

Lindorm Eriksson <christer at Sue.KOMunity.Se>

From: duncan at rti.rti.org (Stephen Duncan)

Date: 13 Dec 91 13:53:27 GMT

Organization: Research Triangle Institute, RTP, NC

christer at sue.komunity.se (Christer Romson) writes:

>I think we discussed the posibility of ice in the medieval summer about a

>year or two ago on the Rialto. [...] They could probably have done

>this in period, but i don't think we have any evidence they did.

> Lindorm Eriksson <christer at Sue.KOMunity.Se>

Colonial Williamsburg in Virginia has an ice house on the grounds of

the governor's mansion. It looks something like a round barrow with a

flatter roof (for you archaeologically inclined). Since Williamsburg

is either just in period or just out of it, the style might be worth

looking at. They probably even have documentation about ice houses in

general.

In the 19th century, ice harvesting was a major industry in New England,

where the ice was packed into ships for export to the American south.

It even had specialized ice saws. I don't know how early this began,

though, but note that ice isn't real common in the Williamsburg area,

and even with the Mini-Ice Age in effect, it wouldn't have the ice

fields necessary.

Steve Duncan

duncan at rti.rti.org

Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1993 13:48:01 -0600 (MDT)

From: "Dawn E. Bergacker" <dawnb at CSN.ORG>

Subject: Root Beer Recipe

I checked with the librarian at the Sugar Association (Suzanne Arnold,

(202)/785-1122), and she found two recipes for root beer.

The first is from _Manufacture and analysis of carbonated beverages_ by

Morris B. Jacobs, published by Chemical Pub. Co. of N.Y. (1959). It's a

formula that includes methyl salicylate and gum arabic. I'm fairly sure

that's not what your patron is looking for however (it requires a

homogenizer or a colloid mill to prepare).

The other recipe is from _Beverages: carbonated and noncarbonated_ by

Jasper Guy Woodroof and G. Frank Phillips, published by AVI Pub. Co. of

Westport, Conn. (1974, 1981). It lists a home formula for making

sassafras mead: 3lb. of brown sugar, 1 pint of molasses, 1/4 lb. of

tartaric acid. Mix together, pour 2 qt. of water over the mixture and

stir until dissolved. When cold, add 1/2 oz. essence of sassafras, and

bottle. When you wish to drink it, put 3 Tbls in a tumbler filled 1/2

full with ice water, then add 1/4 tsp. of soda.

I'm not sure if it's still possible to get sassafras oil. Apparently

sassafras contains an oil similar to thujone and safrole, which are both

considered toxic (_On food and cooking_ by Harold McGee).

The _Food Science Sourcebook_, 2nd edition by Herbert W. Ockerman quotes

the AVI _Beverages_ book in a chart on beverage flavors and says, "Root

beer is made from oils of sassafras, sweet birch, wintergreen, cassia,

spice, citrus, vanillin, and other materials."

I hope some of this is useful. I also found a book called _How to

make delicious beer and root beer: secrets of successful brewing the easy

way_ by Paul Kersenbrock [Paul's Publications, 1424 Grove, Crete, Neb.

68333], 1983. It's listed in Melvyl as being held at UCLA College TP 577

K47 1983.

I also know someone who has a recipe that uses yeast (to provide the

carbonation) and a prepared root beer extract (Hires, I think). I can get

that too if you're interested.

Dawn E. Bergacker (dawnb at csn.org)

Manager of Technical Information, Imperial Holly Corporation

5320 Mark Dabling Blvd, Colorado Springs, CO 80918

From: Lhiannan at f42.n280.z1.fidonet.org (Lhiannan)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Root Beer????

Date: Sat, 03 Jul 1993 23:02:00 -0500

-=> Quoting KELLEN to All <=-

KE> I have a patron who is interested in finding a recipe

KE> (from scratch) of root beer. A Mother Earth News article

KE> said it was possible and even gave a few ingrediants, but no

KE> proportions and no directions.

From "The Craft of the Country Cook" by Pat Katz. 1988. ISBN 0-88179-

014-1. p. 44. (quoting "In the Kitchen" by Elizabeth S. Miller. 1875)

'"Take a handful of yellow dock-roots (be sure to get the long and pointed

green leaf without the red streaks), a handful of dandelion roots, and one

of sarsaparilla roots, and a small branch of the spruce tree; tie them in a

bag, and boil half an hour in three quarts of water, and then take out the

bag and pour the liquid in a crock [and cover as described in the WINE

section]; if too strong, add water; sweeten with molasses, and when cool add

a pint of yeast and let it ferment, skimming it occasionally. It will be fit

to use in a day or two, and must then be bottled and securely corked."'

No warranties. :-)

Lhiannan

From: hrjones at uclink.berkeley.edu (Heather Rose Jones)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Grenatas; Henry V

Date: 17 Nov 1993 03:44:29 GMT

Organization: University of California, Berkeley

> using pomegranate juice. Anyone know how many pomegranates

> you need to boil to get the right amount of juice?

> Yaakov

With the caveat that this suggestion is from practical modern experience

rather than period research ... I would suggest that you press, rather

than boil, the pomegranates for juice. Separate the kernals completely

from the rind and other stuff first. Pomegranate rind is incredibly rich

in tannic acid (I made a batch of pomegranate-tanned leather back in my

experimental days) and you want to avoid getting it in your juice.

Keridwen ferch Morgan Glasfryn; West, Mists, Mists

From: cav at bnr.ca (Rick Cavasin)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Grenatas; Henry V

Date: 17 Nov 1993 14:58:22 GMT

Organization: Bell-Northern Research Ltd.

hqdoegtn/G=Harold/S=Feld/O=HQ at mhs.ATtmail.COM writes:

|> Unto all who read these words, greetings from Yaakov.

|> Does anyone know a recipe for granatas that starts with

|> *pomegranates*. They are on sale at the local supermarket.

|> The Miscellany includes a translation of the original

|> recipe, which starts with pomegranates, but then redacts it

|> using pomegranate juice. Anyone know how many pomegranates

|> you need to boil to get the right amount of juice?

|> Yaakov

Greetings Yaakov!

A useful rule of thumb that I've discovered in my brewing

experiments is that using a small press, I can usually extract

about 2/3 of the weight of fruit as juice. This rule has held

true (approximately) for strawberries, pears, blueberries,

cherries, apples, etc. I've never pressed pomegranates (too

expensive up here usually), so I'm not sure how well it will

apply. I suppose you should be able to get the same extraction

using a juicer. If you need 1 litre of juice, use 1.5 kg of

pomegranates. Given how much the size of pomegranates seems

to vary, I wouldn't rely too heavily on recipes that specify

X number of pomegranates.

If you are not juicing the pomegranates first, I think you

can rely on about the same amount of juice being 'leached'

from the crushed kernels when you steep them.

Boil them? (I'm not gonna be able to sleep tonight)

Cheers, Balderik (who wishes he could lay his hands on such

things as pomegranate juice up here in the

frozen north)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: nostrand at bayes.math.yorku.ca (Barbara Nostrand)

Subject: Re: Tea

Organization: York University

Date: Thu, 20 Jan 1994 04:22:12 GMT

Noble Cousins!

Those who have a copy of the Pikestaff A&S issue for AS XXVII please

look up my own rather humble article on tea. I was able to find in

a history book on the subject (an English text in this case) an

early (if not the first) reference to tea by a European. It dates

from the 16th century and rather clearly depicts tea as a novel drink.

I do think that the tannin in wine, etc. must be coming from some

secondary or incidental source such as oaken barrels. This is

especially true as no one has thus far found it mentioned in a

early recepie.

Your Humble Servant

Solveig Throndardottir

Totally Ignorant

From: jacquetta at aol.com (Jacquetta)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: period non-alcoholic drinks and a moderate snit

Date: 13 Apr 1994 19:58:02 -0400

una at bregeuf.stonemarche.org (Honour Horne-Jaruk) writes:

> > I'm curious--I assume that there were some tissanes (is that the right

> > word?) and such made from other, local things. Beers and wines and

> > the like are obvious, but I was thinking of lighter beverages, either

> > for cooling off or for warming the soul on a cold dreary night. What

> > sorts of things might the average European have chosen?

> > Philippa

I Found an interesting mention of a "sage-flavored Liquid" in "A Medieval Home

Companion" translated and edited by Tania Bayard. Its a translation of a 15

cent translation of a 14cent tretise by an elderly parisian merchant to his 15

year old bride on housewifery.

"To make a cask of sage-flavored ligquid, take 2 lbs sage, clip off the stems

and put leaves in the cask...."

"To make sage flavored drinks at table in winter, have a ewer of sage water and

pour it over white wine in a goblet...."

Frankly, I'm not too sure about a sage-water drink...

Jacquetta

From: Robin Carroll-Mann <rcmann at delphi.com>

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: period non-alcoholic drinks and a moderate snit

Date: Thu, 14 Apr 94 01:49:40 -0500

Organization: Delphi (info at delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)

Jacquetta <jacquetta at aol.com> writes:

> una at bregeuf.stonemarche.org (Honour Horne-Jaruk) writes:

>> > I'm curious--I assume that there were some tissanes (is that the right

>> > word?) and such made from other, local things. Beers and wines and

>> > the like are obvious, but I was thinking of lighter beverages, either

>> > for cooling off or for warming the soul on a cold dreary night. What

>> > sorts of things might the average European have chosen?

>> > Philippa

>I Found an interesting mention of a "sage-flavored Liquid" in "A Medieval Home

>Companion" translated and edited by Tania Bayard. Its a translation of a 15

In the "Libro de Guisados" (Spanish, 16th century) there is a recipe for

Clarea, wine spiced with honey, ginger, cinnamon, and cloves. The non-

alcoholic version appears immediately afterwards "Clarea de Aqua" (Clarea from

Water). It contains the same spices and honey mixed into boiling water, then

strained. I haven't gotten the proportions right yet (death by cinnamon!) but

when done properly, I suspect it would resemble mulled cider.

Brighid ni Chiarain

Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom

mka Robin Carroll-Mann (rcmann at delphi.com)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: nostrand at bayes.math.yorku.ca (Barbara Nostrand)

Subject: Re: Period non-alcoholic drinks

Organization: York University

Date: Tue, 26 Apr 1994 01:46:26 GMT

According to a book I am reading at the moment, whey was a common peasant

drink in Germany during the middle ages. The peasantry also drank mead

and very rarely wine. Later, they developed beer which largely surplanted

mead. The peasants also rarely ate bread and instead ate various forms

of gruel (frequently called brot) and sometime fried gruel in pans over

their fires. The book goes on to state that the price for pork was 1/3

higher than the price for beef. And, supposably relatively fatty pork

was prefered over leaner pork or beef.

Your Humble Servant

Solveig Throndardottir

Totally Ignorant

From: jari.james at racer.ESkimo.COM (Jari James)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: beverages

Date: 23 May 1994 22:39:40 -0400

Organization: The Racer's Edge - TRE! * (206) 939-7876

]^1drinks were. I know (or believe at least) that water was not commonly

]^1drunken by the upper classes of medieval society, and have always

]^1heard that alcoholic beverages were used instead. I was wondering

]^1what some non-alcoholic period beverages might be, is there anything

]^1less obvious than milk, fruit juices, and water.

]^1

]^1Thanks to all,

]^1Glenn Berman

One of the 'lower class' drinks was twilsy: plain or flavored vinegars

and water. Sounds nasty but is really quite refressing. [Raspberry

vinegar makes my favorite. Just go easy on the vinegar until you

find the taste you like. :}]

Her Excellency Mistress Rowan O'Callighan

Barony of Blatha an Oir

Kingdom of An Tir <- home of the 30 Year Celebration!!

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

From: ansrb at orion.alaska.edu

Subject: Twilsy was Re: beverages

Organization: University of Alaska

Date: Thu, 26 May 1994 14:26:56 GMT

Her Excellency, Mistress Rowan O'Callighan Writes:

> One of the 'lower class' drinks was twilsy: plain or flavored vinegars

> and water. Sounds nasty but is really quite refressing. [Raspberry

> vinegar makes my favorite. Just go easy on the vinegar until you

> find the taste you like. :}]

Twilsy is not just for refreshment anymore! As students of folk medicine

have known for years, drinking apple cider vinegar and water is very good

for one's health. The main benefit comes from a regulation of the body's

Ph balance. My wife has used it successfully for treating both yeast and

sinus infections, and we both take it regularly to promote the growth of

good bacteria in the intestines. It is important to use apple cider vine-

gar made from *whole* apples. Hain makes a good one. You should be able

to find it in most anywhere nowdays. Our mix is one tablespoon per 8oz of

water, and we not only got used to it, we like it!

Colin Ross MacBeolain

The Hammered Wombat

From: tinne at eskimo.com (Susan Profit)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: beverages

Date: 31 May 94 18:42:41 GMT

Organization: Eskimo North (206) For-Ever

Hi. Its out of Period - but what Mistress Rowan calls twilsey was also

known as switchel and used for harvests in the Colonies and Eastern

Canada in the late seventeenth century.