Eiswein-msg - 10/1/04 Wine made from grapes left on the vine until after the first frost hits. Originally German wines but found elsewhere now. NOTE: See also the files: wine-msg, brewing-msg, beverages-msg, grapes-msg, fd-Germany-msg. ************************************************************************ NOTICE - This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday. This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter. The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors. Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s). Thank you, Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous Stefan at florilegium.org ************************************************************************ Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2000 19:01:31 -0800 (PST) From: Huette von Ahrens Subject: RE: SC - 16th Century recipes a few questions > Could someone sort through the rest and tell me what they are in > particular. I thought icewein was made from frozen grapes, is it > either red or white or both? > > Valoise If I am not mistaken, most German wines are white. I am sure that there are a few exceptions that I am not aware of, but mostly they are white. Kabinet is made from a grapes picked at the regular harvest time. Auslese was picked later, allowing more natural grape sugars to form. Berenauslese means very late harvest, meaning that it is even sweeter. Trockenberenauslese means very very late harvest, meaning that it is still more sweet. It tastes very raisiny. Eiswein is made from grapes that are still one the vine and have just gone thru a cold freeze. This can happen at any time in Germany. The grapes are picked while the frost is still on the grapes and pressed right there in the field to get that special taste frost brings to grapes. The grapes are not allowed to defrost before they are pressed, nor are the grapes frozen after picking. It is rare to find an eiswein and fairly expensive. But I do own several bottles and only drink one at special occasions. This is according to Pieroth, the German winemaker I deal with the most. Maywine is a special occasion wine made only in May in Germany. It is a sweet dessert wine that has been infused with the flavor of woodruff during the fermentation period. Woodruff is a sweet-scented herb, if I am not mistaken, and it creates a different flavored wine. Not everyone likes Maywine. Huette Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:46:11 -0700 From: Lorenz Wieland Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Wine must??? To: Cooks within the SCA Harris Mark.S-rsve60 wrote: > I thought Eiswein was made from late season grapes and not a special > grape. But yes, starting with a more sugary juice would have an effect > after being boiled down. But I've wanted to try Eiswein after the > comments about it here and stayed away from buying a bottle because of > the cost. To pay those prices and then boil it down... Ouch! Eiswein is made from frozen grapes. It can be made from any one of several grape varieties and either normal harvest (auslese) or late harvest (spätlese). -Lorenz Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 17:04:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Huette von Ahrens Subject: Eiswein, was Re: [Sca-cooks] Wine must??? To: Cooks within the SCA > I thought Eiswein was made from late season > grapes and not a special grape. But yes, > starting with a more sugary juice would have an > effect after being boiled down. But I've wanted > to try Eiswein after the comments about it here > and stayed away from buying a bottle because of > the cost. To pay those prices and then boil it > down... Ouch! > > Stefan Eiswein is made from grapes that were frozen on the vine by an unexpected freeze. The growers bring the grape press into the vineyard and press the grapes while they are still frozen. If they defrost before they are pressed, the wine will not be as good. The late harvest wine is Berenauslese. The very very late harvest wine is Trockenberenauslese. Huette Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 01:57:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Huette von Ahrens Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Eiswein To: Cooks within the SCA --- Stefan li Rous StefanliRous at austin.rr.com wrote: >> Eiswein is made from frozen grapes. It can be made from any one of >> several grape varieties and either normal harvest (auslese) or late >> harvest (spätlese). > This is the first time I've heard it mentioned that there might be two > types of Eiswein. I assume the spatlese variety is sweeter because it > has been on the vine longer? Why would you have the earlier type? Just > an early freeze and the growers are making the best of what happened? > > Does the freezing itself actually affect things? Yes. It brings out the sugars more. But it has to be grapes still on the vine. Just taking grapes and freezing them doesn't produce the special quality that freezing on the vine produces. > Or is it just a matter > of the juice being sweeter because the grapes > have been growing longer? No. Not at all. The freeze could come in Sept. during the regular picking season and it would create that special quality that eiswein has. > I assume that the freezing does play a role somehow, since otherwise > there would be no difference between the spatlese and regularly picked > grapes. Or is this just a marketing ploy? No. Not every year produces eiswein. > Is there something special that happens when the grapes freeze on the > vines versus being picked and then frozen, mechanically or otherwise? Yes. Just freezing doesn't do it. It has to be frozen on the vine. To make eiswein, the grapes are left on the vine until after the first frost hits. These grapes are harvested after being frozen in the vineyard and then, while still frozen, they are pressed. They must be picked early - before 10 a.m. During both of these processes the temperature cannot exceed -8 degrees C. At this temperature (-8 degrees C) the berries will freeze as hard as marbles. While the grape is still in its frozen state, it is pressed and the water is driven out as shards of ice. This leaves a highly concentrated juice, very high in acids, sugars and aromatics. > "Eiswein" sounds German. Are there non-German > wines made with frozen grapes? Canada is experimenting in making eiswein. However, just to clarify things. Lorenz has the order of German wines mixed up. Here is the order of German wines by their sweetness and their picking. The earliest are the driest. Taflwein [table wine] Kabinet wein [that which is better and goes into the cabinet.] Spätlese [meaning later than regular harvest] Auslese [meaning even later than regular harvest] Berenauslese [meaning really late harvest] Trockenberenauslese [meaning very, very late harvest] Eiswein is a special wein unto itself, because it requires the frost and doesn't have to be late harvest. Eiswein has a special sweetness that is very different from the above. The trockenberenauslese has a raisiny taste to it, but again is very different from raisin wine. Huette Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 04:02:31 -0500 From: Robert Downie Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Eiswein To: Cooks within the SCA Huette von Ahrens wrote: > Canada is experimenting in making eiswein. I've gotta interject here :-) I believe one could say we're past the experimenting stage, since many of our ice wines are now receiving critical acclaim rivaling some of the German ones. Local production means better prices for me too, so I'm not complaining (hee, hee, nudge nudge, wink, wink). At one of our Coronets, some of the visiting Americans _loaded_ up on Canadian wines (including Ice Wines) and prayed they wouldn't get searched at the border! Faerisa Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 10:20:06 -0700 From: Lorenz Wieland Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Eiswein To: Cooks within the SCA Huette von Ahrens wrote: > However, just to clarify things. Lorenz has the > order of German wines mixed up. Indeed I did. For some reason, "auslese" and "kabinett" got turned around in my head. Thanks for the correction. I was also incorrect in that officially eisweins can only be made from grapes of beerenauslese or trockenbeerenauslese ripeness, although apparently some producers still make eiswein from grapes of lesser ripeness (they just can't call it "eiswein" in Germany; anyone know what term they use instead?). I'll also return the favor and expand a bit on your list, as you missed qualitatswein (QbA), which should have been between tafelwein and kabinett. The wines from kabinett onwards are categorized as "qualitatswein mit pradikat" (QmP). Another weird twist with German wines is that the ripeness over over-ripeness of the grape isn't always a reliable guide to how sweet the resulting wine is, unlike vintages from French or American wineries. Kabinett, spatlese, and auslese wines can all be made dry (trocken or classic) or off-dry (halbtrocken or selection), so it's possible to find auslese wines that are dryer than kabinett wines. -Lorenz Edited by Mark S. Harris Eiswein-msg 5 of 5