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goats-msg - 2/2/14


Period goats and how they were used.


NOTE: See also the files: butch-goat-art, livestock-msg, sheep-lambs-msg, cheese-msg, goat-msg, animal-prices-msg, cattle-msg, rabbits-msg, wool-hist-msg.





This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.


This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org


I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.


The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.


Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).


Thank you,

   Mark S. Harris                  AKA:  THLord Stefan li Rous

                                         Stefan at florilegium.org



Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:22:06 -0400

From: Micheal <dmreid at hfx.eastlink.ca>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Castration WAS Dutch Recipes

To: Cooks within the SCA <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>


  Yes it is still done pretty much the same still. Except Elastics instead of

strings mostly. The crushing tool is called a bardizo (could be wrong on the

spelling). But it looks like a large set of pliers with 4 inch wide jaws.

They do crunch when you squeeze those cords.

  Prarrie Oysters are still collected in the same manner. Open sack remove and

rinse brown in a pan and serve forth.



----- Original Message -----

From: "Robin Carroll-Mann" <rcmann4 at earthlink.net>

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>

Sent: Friday, February 11, 2005 11:23 PM

Subject: [Sca-cooks] Castration WAS Dutch Recipes


> Jadwiga Zajaczkowa / Jenne Heise wrote:

>> I guess I don't know all that much about period methods of neutering rams.

>> Nowadays an elastic band is used around the testicles, so the penis

>> wouldn't be removed until slaughtering.


> Okay, all of you squeamish guys, hit delete now.

> Right.  Don't say I didn't warn you.

> The 1551 edition of the "Book of Agriculture" by Gabriel Alonso de Herrera

> has animal husbandry information. The section on sheep refers the reader

> to the earlier section on goats, since the castration procedure is the

> same.  It's a long passage, so I'm going to summarize and paraphrase what

> I've read, since I really don't want to take the time to transcribe and

> translate.

> http://alfama.sim.ucm.es/dioscorides/consulta_libro.asp?ref=X533701960

> The section on castration begins with image # 319.

> Kid goats should be castrated under the age of one year, and the earlier

> it is done, the better they will tolerate it, and the better the meat will

> be.  Castration should be done when the temperature is moderate; neither

> very hot or very cold.  Kids born in September should be castrated in

> March.  Those born in December should be castrated in April or May, before

> it gets hot.  Those born in March should be castrated at the end of

> September, or in October.

> The animals should not be allowed to eat or drink before castration.

> There are several methods for castration.  The first is to use a cord to

> tie the scrotum.  This, Herrera says, is the least painful method.  [note:

> I gather, from some casual Web research that a similar method is used

> today, though with elastic. Apparently, the scrotum dies from lack of

> blood and falls off in a couple of weeks.]  The second method is to tie

> off the scrotum with a cord, open the scrotum and cut out the testicles.

> This makes better meat, very tender. A nerve is taken out with them.

> This way, you remove all of the lust and aggression.

> Others crush them [ie., the testicles] with something, and this is very

> painful.  And others cut off the scrotum, having first tied it firmly with

> a cord as said before.  It can be cauterized with a hot iron, and anointed

> with cow's butter.

> Castration is best done in the morning, when the animals won't have had

> food or water.  They should not be given food or drink that day.  They

> shouldn't be allowed to walk around much that day, and should be kept in a

> corral or stable.

> --- end paraphrased text --

> Okay, guys.  You can come out now.

> --

> Lady Brighid ni Chiarain

> Barony of Settmour Swamp, East Kingdom



Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 14:32:55 -0600

From: "Terry Decker" <t.d.decker at worldnet.att.net>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goats

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at ansteorra.org>


From: "The Borg" <The_Borg1 at comcast.net>

> Is goat period?


Pliny refers to goats as cattle and comments on the (non-food) uses of

goat's blood.





Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 09:59:50 -0700 (PDT)

From: wheezul at canby.com

To: "Cooks within the SCA" <sca-cooks at lists.ansteorra.org>

Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Goat Cheese (Warning: Long)


I thought I would post this little bit from the 1512 edition of Crescentiis'

"Das Buch von pflanzung der ?cker".  There is more here about the care of

goats including bits about proper penning for their jumping and something

about keeping them away from the garden :-)


Der nutz der gei? in den fellen /milch vnn gei?lin u? iren fellen werden

die besten gezogen leder ho?zen und sattel deckeen rc Ir milch ist

meschlicher natur artzny / und besundern ungeronene und wenig ke? materia

habende ir ke? syn nit als l?blich als der schaffe.  Ir fleisch is z?

drucken und hart dawlich.  Sunder der gei?lin fleisch ist das best und

vierf?ssigen gemeinen / und nemlich am so ge U? der gei?lin fellen werden

subtyl karten und gar lustbarlich sch? den zarten menschen.


The use of goats [is] in the hides/milk from kids out of their hides comes

the best worked leather hosen and saddle blankets (or covers) rc Their

milk is to man's nature medicinal / and especially unrunny [geronnen is

used to describe the curd/whey separation in other contexts] and has

little cheese material Their cheese is not as estimable as the sheep's.

Their meat is to dry and hard lasting.  However the kid's meat is the best

and four-hooved ordinarily / and the same that so go Out of the kid's hide

are [made] thin cards and very desirable shoes for the finer folk.


The bit after the hooves was difficult for me to understand.  I know that

the hooves were used to gelatinize dishes, so I think the author is

telling us that the kid meat is best and that also the hooves are

ordinarily used when called for.  Or he is saying it is ordinarily cooked

with the hooves.  I'd love other interpretations.  Anyway, I thought you

might be interested.





Formatting copyright © Mark S. Harris (THLord Stefan li Rous).
All other copyrights are property of the original article and message authors.

Comments to the Editor: stefan at florilegium.org